Normally Podcast: Friends, Phones & Far-Fetched Theories

Summary

---

Podcast Summary: The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show

Episode: Normally Podcast: Friends, Phones & Far-Fetched Theories
Date: July 2, 2026
Hosts: Mary Katharine Ham & Carol Markowitz

---

Episode Overview

This laid-back, listener-driven episode features Mary Katharine Ham and Carol Markowitz—recording from vacation and unapologetically chill—answering audience questions about their friendship, conspiracy theories, pop culture favorites, and hot-button political issues. With their signature blend of irreverence and insight, the cohosts swap stories, dispel rumors, and reflect on the state of society in 2026, touching on everything from New York City politics to the pros and cons of banning phones in schools.

---

Key Discussion Points

How Mary Katharine & Carol Met

[03:00-05:10]

• They became friends in the early 2000s, post-9/11, connecting through mutual interest in blogging and political events in New York.
  • “I had a blog. Were you at Hot Air when we met?” — Carol Markowitz [03:12]
  • “We saw the 9/11 conspiracy theories start to develop. And we did kind of a prank...wrote pamphlets that said ‘the truth about 9/11’...which was just, the truth.” — Carol Markowitz [04:16]
• Shared skepticism about marriage before each ultimately settled down:
  • “It’s a testament to when you meet the right person...” — Mary Katharine Ham [04:01]

On Podcast Availability & YouTube

[05:17-06:38]

• The podcast is not on YouTube mainly due to technical barriers and limited time:
  • “We don’t know how to do it...we can't learn this new skill that we maybe should be learning.” — Carol Markowitz [05:43]
  • Both tried YouTube and Rumble clips, but found little payoff:
    • “Unless you’re posting like...‘You’ll never believe what happens next!’...that’s not our stuff.” — Carol Markowitz [06:38]

Favorite Political Conspiracy Theories

[06:38-08:20]

• Carol once joked about being a “Sun Truther,” skeptical of sun risk.
• Mary Katharine’s “guilty pleasure” is believing the Clintons are “up to way worse than has been publicly exposed” [07:52]
  • Carol: “I’m not even sure that’s a conspiracy theory.” [08:18]

Dream Casting: Trump Second Administration Biopic

[08:30-11:23]

• The hosts playfully cast their dream actors:
  • “Rubio: Pedro Pascal. Hegseth: Glen Powell. Susie Wiles: Emma Thompson. Gabbard: Gal Gadot.” — Mary Katharine [09:22-09:51]
  • Carol picks Norm MacDonald (if alive) as Donald Trump:
    • “Norm MacDonald would have done a fantastic Trump.” — Carol [08:56]
• Trump is hard to cast, due to his comedic force and “larger-than-life” personality; Alec Baldwin’s approach deemed too satirical.

Entertainment Staples & Comfort Media

[11:23-14:02]

• Mary Katharine cherishes reading classics (e.g., Pride and Prejudice, possibly The Hobbit) aloud to her children.
  • “Reading to my kids... probably pick up some of it as they go.” [11:30]
• Carol enjoys contemporary fiction; recommends Alina Adams’ “Go On Pretending.” [12:40]
• Both admit their kids read far more than they do:
  • “If I read half as much as my children...” — Mary Katharine Ham [13:17]
• For TV, Mary Katharine’s silly comfort is “What We Do in the Shadows.”
  • “Plots are ridiculous... so silly you don’t have to worry about it.” [13:45]
• Carol prefers comedy over tension; finding “The Bear” (TV series) stressful. [14:02]

Most Quotable Movie Lines

[14:24-16:22]

• Carol’s household catchphrase from “The Big Lebowski”:
  • “‘They have us working in shifts.’ We use it when there’s something too difficult or time-consuming.” [14:24]
• Mary Katharine’s family quotes from “Monty Python and the Holy Grail,” Ricky Bobby, Billy Madison, and especially “Friday.”
  • “So many things that are so embedded in cult[ure] from Friday that people don’t even know.” — MK [16:06]
• “By Felicia” and other lines are cited as formative references.

New York City Mayoral Race & Tackling Extremism

[19:34-23:46]

• Discusses Zoran Mamandi, the new Democratic mayoral nominee, and the fear among moderates.
  • Carol urges against efforts to “strip Zoran of citizenship”:
    • “Only if you want to make him super popular and definitely gonna win...” [20:05]
    • Mary Katharine: “Conservatives should not get into that...when someone wins fair and square, you can unelect them at the ballot box.” [20:07]
• Both agree fighting extremists is best done at the ballot box, not through removal or legal maneuvers.
• Endorsement of Eric Adams for moderates to consolidate votes and defeat socialism:
  • “He’s normal enough... He’s not amazing, just good enough... not communist.” — Carol [22:04]
  • “When you compare it to straight-up communism, it’s kind of an easy choice.” — Carol [23:22]
• They briefly weigh Adams’s alleged legal troubles against Mamandi’s far-left stances.

Phones in Schools: Ban, Regulate, or Adapt?

[23:46-26:09]

• Pros and cons of banning phones discussed:
  • Mary Katharine supports bans for better youth behavior and focus:
    • “Their behavior is better, their ability to problem solve is better... when they do not have access all the time.” [25:19]
  • Carol: Without enforcement of any school rule, banning is a blunt policy response:
    • “If you have a school that enforces rules, it won’t matter to ban phones or not.” [24:10]

‘80s and ‘90s School Anecdotes

[26:14-29:16]

• Wild school memories that would shock Gen Z:
  • Carol recalls a fiery teacher who would throw desks out the window.
    • “Those teachers are always a little crazy...he’d get really angry and throw a desk out the window.” — Carol [26:38]
  • Mary Katharine recounts legendary paddles and lack of air conditioning, with heat rules in southern schools:
    • “No one was paddled, but there were paddles, hanging on the wall as an unspoken threat.” [27:09]
    • “If it was 98 degrees for three days in a row, we would get the fourth day off.” — MK [28:25]

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On media and podcasting hustle:
  “We’re always looking to do biggest bang for your buck... this turns out to be the best way to do it for us.” — Mary Katharine Ham [06:04]
• Casting Norm MacDonald as Trump:
  “Norm MacDonald would have done a fantastic Trump.” — Carol Markowitz [08:56]
• Conspiracy Trends:
  “My default assumption is those two [the Clintons] are just up to the pretty good worst.” — Mary Katharine Ham [07:52]
• On ‘80s discipline:
  “No one was paddled...but there were paddles...as an unspoken threat.” — Mary Katharine Ham [27:09]
• On NYC politics:
  “When you compare it to straight up communism, it’s kind of an easy choice.” — Carol Markowitz [23:22]
• On comfort TV:
  “Plots are ridiculous...so silly that you don’t have to worry about it.” — Mary Katharine Ham [13:45]

---

Noteworthy Timestamps

• [03:00] How the hosts met and became friends
• [04:16] The 9/11 conspiracy “prank”
• [05:17] Why the podcast isn’t on YouTube
• [07:52] The Clinton “conspiracy theory” confession
• [08:30] Dreamcasting the Trump administration
• [11:30] Favorite books and reading with kids
• [13:45] Comfort TV picks
• [14:24] Most quotable movie lines
• [19:34] NYC mayoral race and Mamandi’s rise
• [23:46] Debate over banning cell phones in schools
• [26:38] Wild school stories from the ‘80s and ‘90s

---

Conclusion

The episode’s playful, conversational style delivers both laughs and sharp commentary on real-world topics, with Mary Katharine and Carol offering their unique perspective on everything from personal nostalgia to pressing political news. The rapport between the cohosts, sprinkled with quotable lines and candid admissions, makes this a rich, entertaining listen for fans of culture, politics, and relatable parenting.

---

Transcript

[Capella University Announcer]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Guaranteed Human

[Kalpen (Kal Penn)]

hey everyone, it's Kalpen. I'm inviting you to join the best sounding book club you've ever heard with my podcast, Hearsay, The Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club. Every episode I nerd out with amazing guests and dive into the best new audiobooks available on Audible. It's the book club for your ears. Listen to Irsay, the Audible and I Heart Audiobook Club on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Commercial Announcer]

Do you want to find a stress free way to buy your next car? Start at CarMax and shop your way. If you want to browse with confidence, get pre qualified online with no impact on your credit score and shop cars within your budget. From luxury cars to family rides, CarMax has options for almost every price range, including more than 25,000 cars priced under $25,000. So hey, want to get started? Just head to CarMax.com for details and get pre qualified today. Want to drive CarMax?

[Capella University Announcer]

There's a fire inside you you can't ignore. Stand still. Not a chance. You're a lifelong learner who's come this far. Now we're here to help you keep going further. Capella University what can't you do? Visit capella.edu to learn more.

[Glen Washington]

I'm Glen Washington, host of the Snap Judgment storytelling podcast from KQED. Every week, Snap deals a new car. Like the San Francisco girl selling weed brownies after school who uncovers a secret. Or the Oakland man who invented the wave and never got his credit. Or even the actual Lake Merritt monster. What? Pick a card, any card. Snap Judgment with KQED new episodes every Thursday wherever you get your podcast.

[Commercial Announcer]

Introducing Taco Bell's new Jalapeno Citrus Salsa with bright citrus real red jalapenos, guajillo chiles. Usually you add sauce to the but when the sauce is this good, the food is just there to get the sauce to your mouth. That rolled quesadilla. Not a rolled quesadilla anymore. Now it's a sauce shovel. Taco Bell's Jalapeno Citrus Salsa get it with any item on the Cantina Chicken menu while it's here at participating US Taco Bell locations for a limited time only while supplies last contact store for availability.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Hey guys, we are back on normally the show with normalish takes for when the news gets weird. And today we have normalish takes on all your questions because it's a chill week. It's July. There's no news. I'm at the lake as you can tell, because if you see this on video, I'm like, basically a billboard right now with all my gear. I am Mary Kathryn Ham.

[Carol Markowitz]

And I am Carol Markowitz. And I would say these are gonna be our least normalish takes.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Maybe. So shall we get.

[Carol Markowitz]

Let's do it. Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

One listener asks, how did you two meet? It seems like you've been friends for a while. Thanks for the show.

[Carol Markowitz]

We have been friends for a while. Like a really long time. But I would say we met somewhere in the early 2000s. It was post 9 11. I had a blog. Were you at Hot Air when we met?

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Possibly, or even maybe slightly before that. I had sort of done things affiliated with Hot Air but wasn't necessarily employed with them. So a lot of people knew me from that. But yeah, I think it was just the early blogging days. And I noticed your old blog. Alarming news.

[Carol Markowitz]

Alarming news. That's right.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

We would see each other at various events and also hang out sometimes in New York City back when the two of us were just like wild single gals skeptical about the institute of marriage and institution of marriage and whether we would enter into said agreements in the future.

[Carol Markowitz]

Funny, right, that we were kind of like, I don't know about this.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I mean, I think it's a. I think it's a testament to how when you meet the right person.

[Carol Markowitz]

I was going to say that, yeah, yeah, we were dating the wrong people. Let's be real here. They were very nice. They were very nice people, but they were not the right people for us. One of the cool things that we did together was we saw the 911 conspiracy theories start to develop. And we did kind of a prank on one of the anniversaries of 911 where we printed pamphlets that said the truth about 9 11. And then when you open the pamphlet, it was like the story that is the official truth of 9 11. Because that's actually what happened. 19 terrorists boarded planes and crashed them into our buildings. And that's the story of 9 11. So, yeah, but, you know, people would be, like, annoyed and be like, you know, walking by us, and we'd be like, you know, read the truth about 9 11. And then we'd like to read it. Go ahead and read it.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah. And the. And the truthers themselves would be confronted with the truth. Right. They would think we were on their side. Gosh, that is a vintage.

[Carol Markowitz]

That is. There's video of that somewhere. There's definitely video of that exists somewhere in the universe. Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I'm sure I have it, but because of my like probable adhd, I would never be able to find it. It's just somewhere in my many, many files.

[Carol Markowitz]

I mean, it might be on YouTube or something, but. Yeah, well. So somebody actually asks, why is your podcast not on YouTube or listed on YouTube? Podcast search finds nothing. And I will be real with you. We don't know how to do it. Just like the thing is that this pays us that when you download our podcast, we get paid. I, we, I personally and maybe I think mk, you're in the same boat. I just don't know how to get it started on YouTube and elsewhere. Maybe we will in the future, but we're both fairly jammed and have a ton of things going on and we can't kind of learn this new skill that we maybe should be learning.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Sometimes I think back about my old YouTube channel, which I started in like 2007.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah, you could be rich right now.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

If I just stuck with that, I would have many, many, many followers now. Subscribers now. But yeah, I think one of the things about being a working mom who loves to hang out with her kids is Carol and I are always looking to do biggest bang for your buck. Right. So what's the thing that's working? What's the thing that we can do and also do all the rest of the things we're doing and this turns out to be the best way to do it for us.

[Carol Markowitz]

Right? Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

But yes, I'm open to it, as my MKHammer channel from 2007 attests. But.

[Carol Markowitz]

Right. Well, we kind of tried it when we first launched. Normally we did clips on YouTube and on Rumble, but unless you're posting like, you know, kind of like the, the really catchy titles and the, and you get, you know, the cliffhanger episodes, it just, it doesn't quite work. People aren't looking to like, maybe they are, but we just didn't do it right. I don't know. But we just didn't have the. You'll never believe what happens next, you know, so that's not our stuff. No, it's really not. But going back to conspiracy theories, somebody asks of all the political conspiracy theories which are usually the currency of the non normies, from JFK being assassinated by the mafia to chemtrails, which causes you actual pause. I don't know. I used to say I was a Sun Truther. Like I thought, you know, for a long time it was like, sun is very, very bad for you. And I was like, is it though? And I. But I feel like people have that's been kind of. It's caught up. Like, I'm no longer a sun truther. We're all sun truthers now. People know that being out in the sunsh is actually not terrible for you. Yeah. Do you have any.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I would say that the one that I sort of like is my guilty pleasure is that I think the Clintons are up to way worse than has been publicly exposed just all the time. My default assumption is that those two are just up to the pretty good worst. Up to the worst. So I would say that that's the one I could be convinced on. You know, when people bring.

[Carol Markowitz]

For sure. I'm not even sure that's a conspiracy theory.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

No, it might not even be a conspiracy theory, but I have darker thoughts about them than the publicly approved version.

[Glen Washington]

Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Can I. Can I ask this one? Did you see this one? You're in charge of casting a biopic of the Trump second administration. Who do you cast as Trump? Rubio, Hegseth, Wiles, Gabbard Kennedy, et cetera.

[Carol Markowitz]

Man, that's tough. Oh, do you have some good ones?

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I saw this one, and it actually came to me pretty quickly. I don't have a Trump yet, which obviously is very important.

[Carol Markowitz]

Let me give you a Trump. Even though this person's not alive, I just feel like Norm MacDonald would have done a fantastic Trump. I could just see him nailing that role.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Okay, I'm going to give you a couple of my thoughts, and they are not, you know, political ideology does not require to be anything. I'm just looking it up.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah, yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

So Rubio, Pedro Pascal. Hegset's going to be so happy with this. Glen Powell.

[Carol Markowitz]

I don't know who that is.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Glenn Powell is the. The Iceman ish character in Top Maverick.

[Carol Markowitz]

Oh, okay. I didn't see that.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

The Twisters guy.

[Carol Markowitz]

I really have to see that movie.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah, yeah. Glen Powell. Who else do I have? Susie Wiles, Emma Thompson.

[Carol Markowitz]

Hmm.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

That's good.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I mean, and then I think for Gabbard, I had maybe Gal Gadot. That's that bad?

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah, Yeah, I could see that. Kennedy. Anybody for Kennedy?

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I didn't have a Kennedy one.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah, I'm trying to think. I'm just so. I'm. I don't watch movies, but yeah, Kennedy, he's. He's sort of a funky character. I could see, like, I guess I just know comedians more than anybody else, but like a Seinfeld almost. Can you see Jerry playing.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah, my casting. Straight casting. And I like yours. Like, almost like Spaceball's version of Trump for Kennedy. I mean, this is. This is too predictable. But a Clooney could play a Kennedy.

[Carol Markowitz]

Oh, yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

That some same sort of weathered looking older guy feel.

[Carol Markowitz]

Absolutely. Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

But Trump is tricky because Trump is a comedic force. So you.

[Carol Markowitz]

Right. That's the thing. I feel like it has to be somebody who gets that. And I just feel like, yeah, even Alec Baldwin, when he played him, and he gets it, but he doesn't. He kind of is more about making fun of him. He doesn't get the. Trump is funny also.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

He was my first thought, but I thought there's too much of that and there's too much, like, in his heart, he thinks he's so malevolent that he's gonna be. He's gonna be intent on either playing him very stupid or very evil. And I think there's just like a. It'd be hard to find somebody who could do it.

[Carol Markowitz]

What do you watch, listen to, or read that's purely for entertainment purposes? What brings you joy?

[Mary Katharine Ham]

This is a great question. And sometimes I'm like, I wish I had more time for such things. I think the thing that brings me really a lot of joy and I'm gonna sound like such a goody goody two shoes here, is reading to my kids. So I read classics with them. So we'll do children's classics like the Secret Garden or even right now, I'm reading Pride and Prejudice to them, which is a little above their level, but I'm able to talk them through it. And we talk about what the sentences mean and the language, and they'll probably pick up some of it as they go. So I've been reading that to them. I'm told that now might be a good age for the Hobbit. And I've never done Tolkien before, which I know is so terrible on my track record.

[Carol Markowitz]

I've never read it either. Yeah, I'm not a fantasy, but I would give that a shot.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah. So that might be our next one after Pride and Prejudice. We also read, like, more contemporary stuff.

[Carol Markowitz]

That's amazing. That's really cool. I feel like I should do that, but I might have missed my window.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah, well, it ends up being my only fiction reading because I think it falls off for me. I'm trying to read fiction while I'm on vacation this week.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah, I read a lot. Not a lot, but my whole thing is I try to read fiction, and I'm reading right now. Go On Pretending by Alina Adams. She's one of my favorite writers. She just writes really, really beautiful fiction.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I always take recommendations from Carol because I feel like we're on the same wavelength when it comes to fiction.

[Carol Markowitz]

I'm going to. I publish a list at the end of the year where I kind of feel disappointed with how little I read. Or it's not bad. It's more than, I think the average person, but it's still not where I want to be. And then I'll have, let's say, 15 books for the year, and my daughter will be like, oh, here's the 150 I read.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

If I read half as much as my children.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

A much better person.

[Carol Markowitz]

Same. Same. Yeah. But also, it's hard. It's hard.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

It is hard.

[Carol Markowitz]

We go easier on ourselves. Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

The very, very silly thing that I watch that makes me happy every time I turn it on is what we do in the Shadows, which is a, I don't know, vampire based mockumentary.

[Carol Markowitz]

Okay.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Fantastic.

[Carol Markowitz]

All right.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

The comedic actors are fantastic. The plots are ridiculous. It's all just so silly that you don't have to worry about it. Right. It's like, I like that I have trouble sometimes gearing up for very serious TV programs. This I don't have to be in any mood for. Just turn it on.

[Commercial Announcer]

Right.

[Carol Markowitz]

I find it very hard to watch tense shows, especially at night, which is the only time we have time to watch anything. We're watching the Bear right now, but we're only in the first season. It has tension, like, a little bit too much tension. Like, when things go wrong at the restaurant, you're like, why do I. Why am I stressing about their lives? I like comedy. Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah.

[Carol Markowitz]

Same funniest line from any movie. I was thinking about this. I don't know if this is the funniest line, but this is the line that we use the most in our household. It's from Big Lebowski, where he has his car stolen and he has a Clearance Clearwater tape in there. And the police officer is. He asked the police officer, like, do you think you're going to find my car? And the police officer's like, I don't know. And then Lebowski is like, but what about my Credence Clearwater tape? And the cop is like, oh, yeah. They have us working in shifts. So they have us working in shifts is a line that we use around the house when, like, are we going to do blank? Like, something that's just, you know, too difficult and too time consuming. We're like, they have us working in shifts.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I love it. I would say the most quotable movies in my family and my family of origin and my immediate family now are like Monty Python stuff. Probably Monty Python, the Holy Grail was a go to when we were, when we were kids. I feel like my dad really got us into like comedy nerd space. So we watched a lot of Second City TV and all of the, like, Ed Grimley and all the SNL characters from back in the day. Those are very quotable in my house. Ricky Bobby.

[Carol Markowitz]

Oh yeah, Ricky Bobby for sure. Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

The Billy Madison era for me. Still. I quote things that my kids have no idea what I'm talking about, by the way. And Friday might be my most favorite quotable movie of all time.

[Wells Fargo Announcer]

Yeah.

[Carol Markowitz]

Oh, that's really good. I mean by Felicia is from Friday.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Well, there are so many things that are so embedded in cult that are from Friday that people don't even know they're from Friday. But that was really in my formative years. Friday was a go to.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

So those have been just stuck in my brain ever since.

[Carol Markowitz]

We're gonna take a short break and come right back with Normalee.

[Commercial Announcer]

Hey, it's Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. Now, I was looking for fun ways to tell you that Mint's offer of unlimited Premium Wireless for $15 a month is back. So I thought it would be fun if we made $15 bills, but it turns out that's very illegal. So there goes my big idea for the commercial. Give it a [e-mail] Switch upfront payment

[Carol Markowitz]

$45 for three months, $90 for six months, or $180 for a 12 month plan. Required $15 per month. Equivalent taxes and fees. Extra initial plan term only greater than 50 gigabytes. Me slow when network is busy.

[Glen Washington]

See terms.

[Kalpen (Kal Penn)]

Hey everyone, it's Cal Penn. I'm the host of Irsay The Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club. This week on the podcast, I am sitting down with Ray Porter, the narrator of Andy Weir's audiobook project, Hail Mary Massive sci fi adventure about survival and science and what happens when you wake up alone, very far from Earth.

[Wells Fargo Announcer]

I really had to make a decision because I caught myself getting that frog in my throat and starting to get teary as I'm narrating some of these sections. And it's like, okay, yo, yo, yo, is this indulgent? And I really thought about it. I was like, no. At this point it would kind of be betraying the trust the author and the listener have in telling this story if I don't go through it. But there's places in this book that. That deeply, emotionally affected me. And I left it on the mic. That's great because it served the story. People will say like, oh, my God, I cried at the end. It's like, yeah, dude, me too.

[Kalpen (Kal Penn)]

Listen to Irsay, the Audible and I Heart Audiobook Club on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Carol Markowitz]

Wasn't that delicious?

[Capella University Announcer]

So good.

[Wells Fargo Announcer]

Your bill, ladies.

[Capella University Announcer]

I got it.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

No, I got it. Seriously, I insist.

[Carol Markowitz]

I insisted first.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Oh, don't be silly. You don't be silly.

[Wells Fargo Announcer]

People with the Wells Fargo Active Cash credit card prefer to pay because they earn unlimited 2% cash rewards on purchases.

[Capella University Announcer]

Okay. Rock, paper, scissors for it.

[Carol Markowitz]

Rock, paper, scissors.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Shoo, shoo. No.

[Wells Fargo Announcer]

The Wells Fargo ActiveCash credit card. Visit Wells Fargo.comActiveCash terms apply.

[Capella University Announcer]

You've never been one to settle. Stand down or stand still. You're a lifelong learner, energized by excellence. There's a fire inside you you can't ignore. You've got competition to outrun, momentum to build on, and your own high standards to meet. Stop now. Not a chance. At Capella you University, we help you catch what you're chasing because you've always had the drive. Now go earn the degree. Capella University. What can't you do? Visit Capella. Edu to learn more.

[Glen Washington]

I'm Glenn Washington, host of Snap Judgment, the award winning storytelling podcast from kqed. And every week, Snap deals a new card. Like jumping on Rihanna's private plane. Or the accidental bank robbery. Or even the man who was swallowed by a hippo. What? Pick a card, any card. Snap Judgment from kqed. New episodes every Thursday. Wherever you get your podcast.

[Carol Markowitz]

All right, switching gears a little bit to politics, we had got a few questions about the new Democratic nominee for mayor of New York City. I think you know, Zoran Mamandi is. He's frankly, it's scaring people that someone like this can get so close to being the mayor of New York. He's in pole position to win. So somebody asks, should the Trump DOJ make a move to strip Zoran of his citizenship and deport him? Only if you want to make him super popular and definitely going to win the election.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Is this is my thinking.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

This is one of those things that conservatives should not get into that liberals have been into in the past, which is the idea that when someone wins an election fair and square, that you can unelect them.

[Wells Fargo Announcer]

Right.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Like you get a shot at it. You had the shot. Yeah.

[Carol Markowitz]

And you have another shot in November.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

You have another shot later, just as the entire first Trump administration. They were going to get their shot in 2020, but they insisted on trying to unprecedent the president and that's not how democracy works. Even though they want to claim that they're the guardians of democracy. So don't do that. You have to fight on fairground with this guy. It's un American to deport him simply because he's a bad choice for this city. He is a bad choice.

[Carol Markowitz]

He is a bad choice. Right.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

He's like a disastrous one. There's actually a clip floating around now from 2021 where he's like, well, the object is to seize the means of production.

[Carol Markowitz]

Right? Yeah. The thing is, I think people, not

[Mary Katharine Ham]

productivity, modern therapy, speak to the new language.

[Carol Markowitz]

I think what people can take away from that is we should be more careful about who we let into the country. They should align with our values. They shouldn't want to bring down capitalism. All of these things are. It's okay to monitor people's social media or find out what they really, really, you know, care about and want to do here. And it's fine to say, you know, know people like this.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah, no, I, I think it's, it's also just so gross to have this rich kid doing the thing that rich kid revolutionaries always do, which is, let me not let anyone else get rich and demonize anyone who's working hard and moving up and creating products for a bunch of people and getting rich that way. And also, let me take all your money. But you're awful and evil. It's just the whole thing is so gross. Please vote for Eric Adams. I guess.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah, well, that's the follow up question somebody else had was should everyone who's not a socialist in New York City just commit to voting for Eric Adams? Right now there's some controversy around this. You know, people are like, well, why not Curtis Lewa, the Republican? I just think that Eric Adams is the best option here. I think he's got the biggest shot to win. I like Curtis a lot. I just, if I were living in New York, I would want people to put all of their chips behind, behind Eric Adams because I think that he's, he's currently mayor, he has some advantages because of that, and he's normal enough is really what we're going for here. He's not amazing, he's just good enough. He's not communist.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

And the less you coalesce, the more

[Carol Markowitz]

chance, the more likely. Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I would also say I have read through quite a Bit of the indictment of him. Because this is like a vote for the criminal. It's important situation.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

But I will, like, I think you can. You might assuage yourself a bit on that front if you read the indictment, which is a little like, I'm sure there may be more stuff there. Yeah, A little like, oh, he got his flights upgraded. And I'm supposed to be very concerned about that.

[Carol Markowitz]

Right.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I'm not sure how concerned I am about that compared to seize the means of production.

[Carol Markowitz]

That's really the thing that there is. There's questionable stuff around Eric Adams. I wrote out all of his problems in a Washington examiner piece before he was actually indicted, when it was like he was going to be indicted. He's got a lot of shady. He had a lot of shady people around him that he didn't fire. He's pledging to do better. Let's see if he does. But again, when you compare it to straight up communism, it's kind of an easy choice.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

What do you think of banning cell phones in schools? This person notes, which is a great point, I can see why they're doing it, but they're worried that if you take them out, then teachers won't be at all worried about being documented doing the things that have ticked off parents this far left indoctrination over the last couple of years. And of course, a lot of that was brought to light by Zoom. Right. And by having cameras in the classroom.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah, Well, I would say that they still will have cameras in the classroom. These kids are all using Chromebooks now, which is a separate question of whether that should be the case. Right. It's. Should kids be using screens in schools? Pretty much, you know, at every level at this point. My 4th grader doesn't have screens, but my older kids do. And so you'll still have that. You know what the problem is? If you have a school that has enforcement of the rules, then it won't matter to ban phones or not. You could just say you're not allowed to use your phones in class and that's it. But the real issue is that public schools across the country do not enforce any of the rules. They do not suspend anybody. They certainly don't expel anybody. There's no risk to these kids to just not follow the rules at all. So if you have a rule following school, you could have phones that you're just not allowed to use at certain times. That's not what we have, unfortunately.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah, I think. I think. I tend to think the benefits of no phones are probably greater than the downsides of not having them.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Just for instruction. I think, you know, we, we try to keep our kids fairly screen free. Not, you know, not totally crunchy, but.

[Carol Markowitz]

Right.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I find that their behavior is better, their ability to problem solve is better, their desire to read books is better when they do not have access all the time. And so in a school setting, that would obviously help students. But I do think what you're saying, Carol, is what they're doing is when they take the option away entirely, it obviates the need for them to jump in on a case by case basis because they've shown not willing or able to do that. And parents fight them tooth and nail. That's part of it. Right. Parents will fight over this on each adjudication. And so they're just like, nah, we're done.

[Carol Markowitz]

So, yeah, yeah, that's, that's the problem here.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Can I ask one question? Okay, so you went to 1980s, 90s New York public schools.

[Carol Markowitz]

I went, I went to, I went to Jewish schools, but yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Okay, so I went to 80s, 90s public schools in North Carolina. What's the, the wildest old school,'80s anecdote from your schools? Like something that Gen Z would be like, they did what, do you have any.

[Carol Markowitz]

You know, I had a really incredible teacher in high school. I went to a small private high school in Brooklyn and I had this like, really, like one of those teachers straight out of the movies, like, who inspire you and you know, whatever. But those teachers are always a little crazy. And he used to do stuff like he'd get really angry and throw a dick desk out the window. It was just like he, he taught me how to write. But I also feared for my life.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

So, yeah, you know, a little from

[Carol Markowitz]

column a little from column B.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

We've, we've had those. We're like. I remember in my public schools, like, enforcement by teachers was somewhat rougher than would be allowed now. And I would argue that in the cases where I saw that it was warranted, like physically restraining students. But one of two of my favorite ones, one when I first came to my elementary school, which had been mid-80s ish, no one was paddled in our public schools, but there were paddles. So it was like we had just amazing. We had just gotten past that. But a couple of old school teachers, they would hang on the wall and they were sort of legendary as this unspoken threat that something could happen to you if you got out of hand. And the legend I remember was that, like, there were holes drilled in A wooden paddle. And I was like, why would that be? And the rumor was, I don't know if this is true. Older people than I can say is that that makes it more like cuts through the wind so you can go faster.

[Capella University Announcer]

Wow.

[Carol Markowitz]

They needed it to be worse. They needed it to really hurt.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

That makes sense, though. Nothing actually happened, but it was like the threat. And then the other one was my middle school did not have air conditioning in North Carolina.

[Carol Markowitz]

No. None of our schools had air conditioning. Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

And the rule was, I remember that. I don't know who wrote this rule. The rule was if it was 98 degrees for three days in a row, we would get the fourth day off. Even my children, who I think I've toughened up a little more than the average kid this age, if I asked them to be in a school building in 98 degree heat for three days,

[Carol Markowitz]

yeah, I don't think they'd make it.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I don't think they would make it. Yeah, society would lose its mind, Right?

[Carol Markowitz]

We were like in New York like two weeks ago, my 15 year old, my husband and I, and they were having like a heat snap. And I know I live in Florida, so I like heat, I assure you. But the problem was that everywhere in New York felt really under air conditioned compared to Florida. Like Florida. You walk into a restaurant, you're like, brr. You know, in New York it was like, why am I still hot?

[Mary Katharine Ham]

What is this?

[Carol Markowitz]

My 15 year old was like, oh, like this. How do they live like this?

[Mary Katharine Ham]

This is not cutting right.

[Carol Markowitz]

Not at all. This was so much fun. Thanks for joining us on Normally. Normally airs Tuesdays and Thursdays and you can subscribe anywhere you get your podcast. Get in touch with us@ normallythepodmail.com. thanks for listening. And when things get weird, act normally.

[Kalpen (Kal Penn)]

Hey, everyone, it's Kalpen. I'm inviting you to join the best sounding book club you've ever heard with my podcast, Hearsay The Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club. Every episode, I nerd out with amazing guests and dive into the best new audiobooks available on Audible. It's the book club for your ears. Listen to Earsay the Audible and iHeart audiobook club on the iHeartradio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Capella University Announcer]

There's a fire inside you you can't ignore. Stand still. Not a chance. You're a lifelong learner who's come back this far. Now we are here to help you keep going further. Capella University. What can't you do? Visit Capella Edu to learn more.

[Carol Markowitz]

Wasn't that delicious? So good.

[Wells Fargo Announcer]

Your bill, ladies.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I got it. No, I got it. Seriously, I insist.

[Carol Markowitz]

I assisted first.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Oh, don't be silly. You don't be silly.

[Wells Fargo Announcer]

People with the Wells Fargo Active cash credit card prefer to pay because they earn unlimited 2% cash rewards on purchases.

[Capella University Announcer]

Okay. Rock, paper, scissors for it.

[Carol Markowitz]

Rock, paper, scissors.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Shoot.

[Kalpen (Kal Penn)]

No.

[Wells Fargo Announcer]

The Wells Fargo active cash credit card. Visit Wells Fargo.com ActiveCash Terms Applied.

[Commercial Announcer]

All new Sundays at 9, exclusively on AMC and AMC. Plus I am the vampire Le.

[Wells Fargo Announcer]

I'm a rock star now.

[Carol Markowitz]

I'm a little killer. I'm a.

[Commercial Announcer]

From Anne Rice's immortal uniform comes what Vulture calls the most momentous event in fictional rock history.

[Capella University Announcer]

Thousands of fans love you.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I want millions.

[Commercial Announcer]

It's my era. Anne Rice's the Vampireless Dot. All new Sundays at 9, exclusively on AMC and AMC stream.

[Kalpen (Kal Penn)]

Now.

[Commercial Announcer]

Your vehicle doesn't just get you from here to there. It's a bridge to the people and places that matter most. It's how you show up for your family, your community and everyone else that depends on you. That's why for 125 years, Firestone has been building tires with one thing in to deliver products that are as reliable as you are. Firestone, always dependable. Since 1900.