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- [00:00]
Ally
This is an iHeart podcast.
- [00:05]
Buck
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Greg
Bring the boom. Xboom.
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- [02:41]
Buck
Now you can stream Fox News live on the Fox One app. Stay on top of breaking news and the biggest stories live as they happen, all from the Fox voices you trust, bringing you the coverage you won't find anywhere else. Start your 7 day free trial today. Offers are subject to change. Go to Fox one for complete terms and conditions. Fox One, we live for live streaming now.
- [03:07]
Ally
Welcome to the after hours edition of the Clay and Buck show with producer.
- [03:12]
Greg
Ali and producer Greg. Hi, how are you?
- [03:14]
Ally
Good. We haven't done this in a while, Greg. We try to do these about once a month where we jump into the feed and just, you know, surprise everybody with a little Easter egg, telling them about what goes on behind the scenes here on Clay and Buck.
- [03:26]
Greg
Yeah, it's been too long. I think we did this last in June or July, the beginning of the summ. Yeah. So there's been a lot that's happened since that period of time and wanted to take a few minutes and just talk to you about it.
- [03:38]
Ally
Yeah. And just with the recent events, the assassination of Charlie Kirk, we thought there was a few things we wanted to touch on today. But a question we get a lot of times is how do you guys handle things on the show when there's a breaking news event while you're live?
- [03:53]
Greg
Right. This is good because actually we actually haven't talked about this much off air or off mic. So I'd like to get your perspect about how you remember things on that day, on that terrible day.
- [04:08]
Ally
It's actually, let's see, it's Thursday right now. At the time that we're recording this, it was exactly a week ago. But the day before, on Wednesday, we are coming to the end of our show. At that time, Clay and Buck were in their home studios. So none of us were together except you and I, Greg, in the New York studio. And I remember we first started getting some alerts and we were in the middle of a segment and you and I were kind of looking at each other. Is this real? Is this fake? And we didn't want to interrupt Clay and Buck and their flow is what we call it when they're in the middle of a segment. But we definitely, our eyes bulged and we, we both were frantically trying to confirm what we were starting to, the trickle of information that was starting to come out.
- [04:48]
Greg
Yeah, If I can roll back even just a little bit. Before that, I had gotten a call, just taking screening calls. I got a call from a listener who said it was kind of frantic, actually said I was, I Just got a call from my brother. He was at this event in Utah, and Charlie Kirk has been shot. And I misheard it, and I thought it was somebody else. I thought he said, actually, Charlie Hurt. And you know, who's another prominent journalist, Fox News. Right. And so I was like, all right, we're gonna look into this. Cause, you know, people call sometimes and say things, and we always have to.
- [05:20]
Ally
Check them out simultaneously. I was getting emails on the VIP email line saying exactly the same thing. Charlie Kirk.
- [05:28]
Greg
Okay. Cause I. So I got off and I said, I got a call about Charlie. One of the Charlies getting shot. And you blanched because you also also were getting the emails at the same time. You're like, I just got. I have a bunch of emails saying this as well. And for that. Once you said that and I had that, we put it all together, we're like, oh, no, something really bad.
- [05:50]
Ally
Then we actually went to a. We were going to a commercial break at that point, and right away, soon as we went to the commercial break. Cause Clay and Buck, both of their phones, they were getting text messages. And because they're live, they can't really address things sometimes right in that moment. And they don't know either. So they immediately said to both of us, we're getting these reports. You guys, confirm this. Confirm this. We're getting these reports. Get on it. And so we're all over the place trying to find sources, because, as we know, and we've worked in this business long enough, usually the first 24 hours of a breaking news event almost. I would almost wager 75% of the information that news outlets report has some level of inaccuracy. So I always tell people, as a rule, wait for the news cycle to play itself out, especially in the age of social media when things are flying a mile a minute. So we were kind of hoping, this isn't true. This is just a rumor. This isn't true. And then, unfortunately, we realized it was indeed true. And I ran over to the Hannity studio, which is right next to our studio, and I spoke with Hannity's producer, showed me the video.
- [06:58]
Greg
Yeah, I was starting to see. Because I was doing all kinds of checking. I was checking X. I was checking all these different sources as well, other wires, just trying to see what kind of information was out there. Oh, okay, this is in Utah. And all these other. Oh, and, oh, somebody says that they have a video. So I. While you were out there talking to Linda and everybody over there, I thought, all right, I found this video. And I started to watch it and I watched it and it was just.
- [07:27]
Ally
It was jarring.
- [07:28]
Rush Limbaugh (archive clip)
Terrible.
- [07:29]
Greg
Yeah. Jarring is an excellent word for it. You just felt awful.
- [07:33]
Ally
And we both were somewhat in denial, hoping this was some sort of AI trick, that this wasn't real. And then I texted it to Buck and Clay, I showed them, and I was like, could this be fake? And that's when Buck, who does have a lot of firearms experience, and he kind of took a look at it and he's said, I don't. This does not look good. We all, at that point, just immediately went into prayer, hoping that it wasn't what it was.
- [08:00]
Greg
And so things are going along and is he in the hospital? Is he on the way to the hospital? What do we know? And then the show ends suddenly, you know, it was the last 20 minutes of the show. I mean, and it went fast.
- [08:13]
Ally
It's actually the last segment.
- [08:16]
Greg
It was even less than the last 20 minutes. Yeah. So it was really a lot of information that we're trying to convey in a very, very, very short period of time. And it wasn't until an hour or two after the show went off the air before the word came down that he had.
- [08:32]
Ally
It was less than that. It was during Will Cayne's show when it was confirmed, and they actually had immediately booked Buck to come on his show because of his background. And at that point in time, Buck had actually gotten word, but he. It wasn't official, so he was holding that because he, you know, out of respect, and he said it was one of the hardest segments he did because he knew and he just had to, you know, keep it together until that could be officially confirmed for a variety of reasons.
- [09:00]
Greg
So I'm sitting, meanwhile, I've. I go home. I live upstate a little bit, and I get on a train. I walk outta here and I go and I get on my train and I'm listening to WOR on the iHeart app. I'm listening to Sean's show and he's talking to Eric Trump, actually. Yeah, he was talking to Eric Trump and talking about all of this stuff that's going on. And then I lost a signal and I came back and next thing I know, Linda is talking to Jason Chaffetz.
- [09:30]
Ally
And who was there at the event.
- [09:31]
Greg
Who was there at the event. And then they come on and they start talking about John Solomon reporting that it's official that he. And, you know, as soon as she said that John Solomon said it, you knew. Yeah, that was it. It was fact. Basically, John Solomon says It, it's, you know, because he's such a reliable source, 100%.
- [09:50]
Ally
And then I literally sat at my desk just in disbelief for the next 30 minutes. Like, I couldn't move. I was just staring at the TV and that Chiron saying, charlie Kirk dead. I just. Something just hit me in the gut. Like I just felt sadness, sorrow, but also unbelievable anger. Like I just wanted to throw things. I was so, so, so angry, Deeply angry. To the point I probably said some things I, I'm not proud of saying in the moment, in the heat of the moment, because I was just so gutted. But then upon reflection, a few days later, when people were describing or talking about what the punishment will be when they eventually caught the guy, and people are all like, death penalty, death penalty. I actually rolled back some of my initial thoughts and I spoke with my husband about it and I said, you know, I. I don't think the death penalty is the way he should go. I actually think a better thing to do. I talked to you about this solitary confinement, and the only thing he can have access to is Charlie Kirk's speeches, videos, debates, books, TV appearances, just. That's it. That's all he gets. And he has to be forced, day in and day out to consume Charlie Kirk over and over and over again. And then my hope would be he's what, 20? How old?
- [11:08]
Greg
2, 22.
- [11:09]
Ally
My hope would be that the. By the time he's 25, maybe sooner, probably sooner, he would have this major epiphany, a major awakening about just how wrong he was. And then he would come out and say, as a confession, you know what? Over the years in solitary, listening to this, listening to Charlie, I realized how deeply wrong I was and give him a chance to show almost a kind of redemption. Because that to me would be more effective than just death penalty. Because death penalty, the people who agree with him, which, that we'll get to that in a second. The. All the reaction to the assassination, but before that, just in general, like all of the things he learned, for him to come out later and say I was wrong about this, then all the supporters and all the people celebrating, then what are they faced with? Yeah, so I just feel like that would actually be more productive than just taking the guy out. What do you think?
- [12:09]
Greg
I don't know. I don't know. To be honest with you. I haven't. I'm of two minds of the whole thing. It was really, I don't know, it's really hard. Death penalty may be too good for him, but at the same time.
- [12:20]
Ally
I mean, he wanted to commit suicide, they're finding now anyways. So why just give him that and then nothing. There's nothing gained. The left is still gonna think he's a martyr. They're still gonna cheer him. I don't feel like anything is gained. Whereas expose him to Charlie Kirk and force feed him, essentially. There's no way he can't see the error of his ways.
- [12:40]
Greg
Yeah. I mean, if that would pass Fourth Amendment muster. Yeah, that would be an interesting way of approaching it. Nice penalty. But for me, you talked about going home, and I had a similar sort of reaction. I just had a dark cloud. There was a pall over me, and I came home and I talked to my wife and how are you? And I said, I'm not good. I am not good. There was just such a cloud over me and everything. And I hugged her and I held her and I cried a little bit, and it was the same. And then go to bed, eat something, go to bed, come back into the office the next day, and same sort of thing. There was just a cloud over everything. I talked to Linda, I talked to Sean's staff, and it was just. Everybody just was kind of a zombie and walking in a daze and, you know, prepping for that show that day. So I knew that that was really going to be the only thing we were going to be talking about. That was the only thing we were.
- [13:44]
Ally
Going to be talking about the next two days. Right.
- [13:46]
Greg
So it was really trying to. Trying to get ready for that. Those shows was. It was like walking through a haze. I don't remember it very well, but to be honest.
- [13:57]
Ally
Well. But we kept texting, our group chat, and he was like, I still can't believe it. It's almost like we're in disbelief. It took a while. Three days in, and we're still like, did this really happen? Are we in an alternative universe? Like, did this really happen? And now we get to the reaction, the lovely reaction. I unfriended so many people, people that I'm actually saddened and remarkably disappointed in that they had the types of reactions they did. And look, I have. I would say the majority of my friends are on the left. I live in New York City. It's the product of my environment. But some of them, I'm like, you're adults, your parents. I would expect dumb college kids who don't know any better, who are indoctrinated college students. As Rush would say, young skulls full of mush. I would almost expect that from stupid kids.
- [14:44]
Greg
Right.
- [14:45]
Ally
But Some of my peers, I'm in my 50s, that are parents that were like, oh, well, he said this, and oh, one time he said that. And by the way, some of the things that they were posting, like statements fully out of context, clearly had never listened to a word the guy said. Misquoting him. Oh my God. And over and over and over again as a justification that this was okay. I was so revolted over that reaction.
- [15:12]
Greg
Yeah, that was my reaction too. I ran into that a little bit with people close to me and online and in my day to day life as well.
- [15:21]
Ally
Greg, when you think about how we got to this place where something like this could occur, you ask yourself how and why.
- [15:28]
Greg
Well, this has been, this groundwork has been being laid for a long time now. Many, I mean, many, many, many years. You actually had suggested putting together this montage about looking and calling the president a fascist, Hitler and Nazi, all of these things. And this goes back. I mean, this has been part of the liberal Democrat playbook going back to at least George W. Bush. And you could probably find, you know.
- [16:03]
Ally
Even Reagan.
- [16:06]
Greg
Going back beyond there. Sure. So, you know, I just took a little bit from the last couple of years and you know, it's just an endless. And we're gonna play this for you. But my, my last little bit about that is it doesn't seem like they've learned. There have been instances in the last couple of days since we played that montage that I could have add to that montage. And you know, they're leaning in. It would double. It would double the length of it just in the last couple of days, which is absolutely crazy. So why don't we go ahead and play that montage for.
- [16:36]
TiVo Advertiser
Again, it's not a stretch to call Donald Trump a fascist.
- [16:38]
Greg
Do you think Donald Trump is a fascist?
- [16:40]
Ally
Yes, I do. Yes, I do.
- [16:42]
Washable Sofas Advertiser
Donald Trump is a fascist and increasingly obviously fascist person.
- [16:47]
Greg
This fascist pig.
- [16:48]
Rush Limbaugh (archive clip)
No one has ever been more dangerous to this country than Donald Trump, and he is a fascist to his core. Do we want to continue democracy or.
- [16:57]
Greg
Do we want to slip into fascism? So fascist, Nazi. If you keep saying this stuff over and over and over again, that is dehumanizing. And I actually thought Clay and Buck addressed this really, really well this week because they were talking about baby Hitler.
- [17:17]
Ally
And that baby Hitler argument drives me crazy.
- [17:20]
Greg
Talk about that a little bit.
- [17:22]
Ally
Well, because it's like hindsight. Oh, if you could kill baby Hitler. But like a baby is born and then it's environment. I mean, it goes to the. Are people born truly Evil. And I do believe in true ev. But to just. It's like armchair quarterbacking life. Like, you don't know what any baby is going to turn out. You don't know which paths which. Where their circumstances will lead them.
- [17:48]
Greg
Right.
- [17:48]
Ally
So I almost feel like it's a. I don't accept the premise of, okay, let's kill a baby before its life has made any decision. Like, do you see what I'm saying? I just find it a weak argument.
- [17:59]
Greg
Okay. I think the idea of going back in time and, you know, the morality and the ethics of having to confront that situation, it's an interesting mind game or brain teaser, that sort of thing. It's really not a practical thing to have a discussion about because time travel is just science fiction and there's nothing that we can really do. So to really talk about it is just really more of just mental bubble gum.
- [18:29]
Ally
Yeah, exactly. It's like if you could have prevented that accident from happening or if you could go back and prevent, you know, this company falling apart. I don't know. I just find those type of arguments very weak.
- [18:39]
Greg
But that's the whole idea that the left is starting to. Is trying to embrace, you know, oh, well, we have to call Trump Hitler now because we want to make sure that we don't go down the same path that they went down 70, 80 years ago, and they, you know, Germany didn't recognize what Hitler was and all that. We want to make sure that we. And you end up demonizing and dehumanizing the people that you're pointing the finger at and that you're calling those names to. And it's a terrible. And inevitably. I mean, honestly, we should have seen something like this Charlie Kirk coming a long time ago.
- [19:20]
Ally
Clay, actually, he actually thought that something like this was destined to happen.
- [19:25]
Greg
Yeah, I remember him.
- [19:26]
Ally
We had some concerns about that in mentioning that. But again, back to the. To try to say that Charlie Kirk was a baby Trump in the making and a MAGA threat. And that, to me, is the most asinine perspective.
- [19:42]
Greg
Yeah, well, honestly, I really think he was a Rush Limbaugh in the making, and we actually didn't play it.
- [19:47]
Ally
Speaking of.
- [19:48]
Greg
Yes, we had a sound bite today from Glenn Beck, who filled in on Charlie's show and brought the golden EIB microphone.
- [19:56]
Ally
Oh, we have that sound bite, too. Is that on the list today?
- [19:58]
Greg
And it. It was on the list today. We can. We can play that.
- [20:01]
Ally
Yeah. Why don't we throw that in there?
- [20:02]
Greg
Yeah.
- [20:02]
Ally
And that was a nice thing Glenn did.
- [20:05]
Greg
It's It's. He. He says that. That he. He basically implies that Charlie was the next Rush Limbaugh.
- [20:11]
Glenn Beck
I brought something with me today that I thought was appropriate while I did the show that I would sit in front of Charlie's microphone. It was given to me after the death of Rush Limbaugh by his wife. It is Rush's golden microphone. I think it's appropriate that it sits in front of Charlie's microphone. Charlie was a pastor and a priest and listening to the way he could argue and think differently. He was a rabbi as well, and one of the best. He was a political organizer. He was a political think tank himself. He was a compassionate friend. He surpassed Rush Limbaugh by miles.
- [21:03]
Ally
We. Turning Point usa. We found an old archive clip that they posted, and I didn't even find this in our own archives, so I was glad I saw this. It was from January 11th of 2018. And it was Rush describing the first time he met Charlie Kirk. And it actually gave me the shivers when I listened to it. I'm not gonna say anymore. I'm just gonna let you hear it, too.
- [21:30]
Rush Limbaugh (archive clip)
There was a conference. What was it? 3. Turning Point USA. How many kids were there? 3,000 student activists here in. It was actually over in West Palm Beach. And this is a group that has been put together and operates under the auspices of Charlie Kirk. Right. Who is a. You're going to be hearing that name if you haven't. He's a. He's an Up Charlie. Let me just tell you. Let me just tell you. I don't want. I don't want to jinx him, but I'm just going to tell you. They brought Charlie Kirk to the golf course to meet me about a month ago. He was in town to set up this Turning Point thing, and they brought him to the golf course to meet me. It was during. We were getting ready for a 8:45am start. And they brought him out while I was getting ready to go to the range. Loosen up. And I spoke with him for about a half hour, and he told me how he grew up in a home where my program was on all the time. He was just effusively complimentary to me, which. Which I of course, understood and told him he's very wise. His family is very wise. He chuckled. He laughed. This is the kind of guy that you can see really becoming big in politics as he gets older. He just has the kind. The carriage, the personality, the charisma. I. You may think this sounds weird, but I remember when Bill Clinton became president There were all of these stories about Bill Clinton at Oxford and Bill Clinton at Yale and Bill Clinton here, and all these people who went to school with him. There were story after story after story where people were saying that they just knew Bill Clinton was going to be president someday in college. He just had that kind of ambition. And he impressed people in a way that he could. Peggy Noonan even told me this. Peggy Noonan went to one of these. These weekends that Democrats do before we concocted it for ourselves, the restoration weekend that Hurwitz does. The Democrats had one of those long before we did. And Peggy Noonan went to one. And this was before 1992. This is before Clinton got the nomination. She came back extolling this guy's virtues to me, the governor of Arkansas. And of course, I was. I was kind of leery. Cause here's Peggy, a supposed conservative, singing the virtues of this Arkansas Democrat governor. That's the fact. That was the first time I had heard anything significantly positive about Clinton. It was from her. And I'm telling you that people are saying the same things about Charlie Kirk.
- [24:14]
Ally
Rush was always very prescient, and he was right on about Charlie Kirk. I mean, that was from 2018.
- [24:21]
Greg
I know, I know. Seven years ago, almost eight years ago.
- [24:24]
Ally
One thing that really hits is that Charlie Kirk was taken out in the way that they tried to take out Trump at Butler.
- [24:32]
Greg
Absolutely.
- [24:33]
Ally
That lower than. I'll reserve all the words. I want to say. That individual, he succeeded where the Butler assassin did not.
- [24:43]
Greg
Right.
- [24:44]
Ally
And in some way, I don't even know how to articulate the thoughts I have, because we could have been going through this last year, last summer, and you know what? We would have also been going through the reaction, which would have been amplified by so much with. So I don't. I can barely handle this. I can't even imagine how I would have handled that.
- [25:06]
Greg
Yeah. As bad as it was, the reaction from the left on about Charlie Kirk, it would have been tenfold, 100 fold worse if they had succeeded in Butler against President Trump. But nobody's taking shots at Keith Olbermann. Nobody's taking shots at Don Lemon. Nobody's taking shots at Brian Stelter or Jake Tapper or any of that. None of those people. Rachel Maddow. No one is doing that. And all I keep hearing about from the Southern Poverty Law center is Christian nationalism and white supremacy and far right ultra right as the major dangers. It's just not borne out by the fact.
- [25:49]
Ally
We had a couple events coming up that we've had to cancel because just for our own host safety, I'm not gonna take that risk. I'm not gonna take that chance.
- [26:00]
Greg
And I don't know about you, but my head's on a swivel now. Every time I leave the building, every time I'm walking out on the street and heading for the train, and I'm constantly.
- [26:10]
Ally
Yeah, we had a security guard escort us, escort us on Tuesday when we brought Clay to the Stephen A. Smith debate. And we had to walk a few blocks. We're in midtown Manhattan, going through Times Square, hundreds of people, and I mean, I was like the Exorcist. My head was spinning around so much looking at everybody we passed.
- [26:28]
Greg
Yeah, yeah, yeah, Absolutely. I was on record as opposing you guys actually walking.
- [26:35]
Ally
I mean, I had my pepper spray and that was about it. But we did have the guard. But still, nevertheless, this is kind of terrifying at times.
- [26:42]
Greg
It's a scary time that we happen to live in. And that's been the hard part, too, is just going home and then, you know, trying to decompress from all of this stuff. I hope we can get by it quickly. And I, you know, I. That's all I can say is. And I will continue to work to do that. Go ahead.
- [27:00]
Ally
And I will say it has been really heartwarming to read all of your emails that you've been sending in, listening to your talk backs. Our audience has been super supportive. And I gotta tell you, Clay and Buck, that's really meant a lot to them, too, that just knowing they have a huge audience that has their back and that supports them, and we stand strong and we keep speaking our minds and speaking the truth and not being deterred to hear from you, thanking them. That meant the world to them in the past week. So I just want to say thank you to our audience for doing that.
- [27:38]
Greg
Yeah, they're always really grateful when you reach out, when you touch base with them in any manner. And it's been a rough. It's been a rough week.
- [27:46]
Ally
It's been a rough week.
- [27:47]
Greg
It's been a rough week.
- [27:48]
Ally
A good segue right now would be to talk about our sponsor, chalk.
- [27:52]
Greg
Oh, talk to me about chalk.
- [27:54]
Ally
Yeah, I had to lean on our friend Chad this week. Chad as in chad mode from chuck.com? chad mode is a powder supplement that you just pour into your water, mix it up. It looks like the color of one of the Buck's nice cashmere sweaters. He wears a lot and gives you a natural boost.
- [28:16]
Greg
Yeah. And Buck is actually using this, as I recall, daily as Far as with.
- [28:21]
Ally
His workout, well, he's using chalk daily, which is a supplement. Set of other supplements. But when he was writing his book, Chad mode was his mode. He needed that because it not only helps you before a workout, like actually get through physically the workout, but it also helps your mind. So if you just need to stay sharp and focused and you know, you have to write a paper at school or you have to. You're at work and you have to get through expense reports like I do later, you can just say, okay, Chad, you and I just for the next hour, we're gonna be completely focused on whatever project.
- [28:51]
Greg
Well, that's, you know, it's good with your workout, it's good with your helping in the office, that sort of thing. Working in, we'll call it that way. So working out, working in. Try your Chad Mode. Go to chalk chalk.com C H O Q.
- [29:06]
Ally
The Q is important because chalk, I want to spell it like the stuff we wrote on the sidewalk with as kids. But it's actually C H O Q. And if you're at the website and you see some stuff you might like, remember to put in Clay Orbach's name and you'll get a bit of a discount.
- [29:22]
Greg
That's right. That's right. Yeah. It's always a good thing to save a little money that way. So.
- [29:26]
Ally
All right, Greg. Well, until we do another after hours.
- [29:30]
Greg
Hopefully a lot less time will go between this one and the next one.
- [29:34]
Ally
Yeah, we'd like to take any questions you have about what goes on behind the scenes of the show. So this one was kind of focused on how we deal with breaking news. Anything else you'd like to know? How we put together the show or.
- [29:47]
Greg
Any of the other staff Producer Mike who runs the board, or producer Mark and his hockey. If he have any questions for him for that, anything, just send us a talk back.
- [29:59]
Ally
Reach out to us.
- [30:00]
Greg
Yes, go on the Iheart app, send us a talkback. And we always get em and we always listen to em. So.
- [30:07]
Ally
All right, until next time. Thank you, Greg.
- [30:09]
Greg
I'm producer Greg.
- [30:10]
Ally
I'm producer Ally.
- [30:15]
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- [30:46]
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- [31:46]
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- [32:00]
Ally
Learn more at tivo.com America is changing, and so is the world. But what's happening in America isn't just the cause of global upheaval. It's also a symptom of disruption that's happening everywhere. I'm Asma Khalid in Washington, D.C. i'm Tristan Redman in London, and this is THE Global story. Every weekday we'll bring you a story from this intersection where the world and America meet. Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [32:32]
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