Daily Review with Clay and Buck - May 6 2025

Summary

The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show: Daily Review - May 6, 2025

Hosted by Clay Travis and Buck Sexton on iHeartPodcasts

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1. Biden's Cognitive Health Concerns ([02:48] - [15:35])

Clay Travis opens the discussion by delving into the controversial topic of President Joe Biden's mental and physical cognition. Referencing the upcoming book "How Trump Retook the White House and Democrats Lost America," Travis highlights revelations about internal White House debates regarding Biden's cognitive abilities.

• Key Point: In February 2024, White House officials contemplated administering a cognitive test to Biden but feared he might fail. A report characterized Biden as a "sympathetic, well-meaning elderly man with a poor memory," raising concerns about his capability to serve another term.

• Notable Quote:
  Travis ([04:20]): “If this is true, this is a cover-up that I believe would be criminal because if you have a president of the United States and his staff publicly proclaiming that he's sharp as a tack while privately fearing he wouldn't pass a basic cognitive test…”

Buck Sexton elaborates on the implications of such a cover-up, suggesting deep-rooted issues within the Democratic Party and mainstream media outlets. He criticizes organizations like The New York Times and The Washington Post for perceived biases, asserting that even figures like Jeff Bezos doubt their objectivity.

• Notable Quote:
  Sexton ([08:59]): “They could have dragged him to election day. All they had to do was say, Joe refuses to platform an election denier. You have to say it like that because you have to have no testosterone when you say it.”

The hosts discuss how Biden's advisors, including Mike Donilon and David Axelrod, expressed doubts about his fitness for another term, further fueling allegations of a deliberate cover-up to maintain power.

2. Trump's Foreign Policy and Middle East Developments ([23:12] - [44:53])

A significant portion of the episode focuses on former President Donald Trump's recent announcements regarding the Middle East. Clips from Trump reveal a forthcoming major announcement, speculated to involve the expansion of the Abraham Accords to include Saudi Arabia, UAE, Qatar, and possibly other nations.

• Notable Quote:
  Trump ([23:12]): “It’s really, really positive. And that announcement will be made either Thursday or Friday or Monday before we leave. But it'll be one of the most important announcements that have been made in many years about a certain subject.”

Sexton and Travis analyze the potential impact of such agreements, emphasizing the economic and strategic benefits, including significant investments from Saudi Arabia into the U.S. economy.

3. The 51st State Proposal: Canada and Its Implications ([39:08] - [52:12])

Trump's unconventional proposal for Canada to become the 51st state garners a lively debate between Travis and Sexton. Trump envisions a union that includes massive tax cuts, free military support, and substantial investments from Canada into the U.S. economy.

• Notable Exchange:
  Trump ([39:08]): “It's a beautiful formation when it's together. I'm a very artistic person, but when I looked at that beauty, I said, that's the way it was meant to be.”

Sexton critiques the feasibility of this idea, pointing out logistical challenges and the potential political fallout, especially considering the differing political landscapes in Canada.

• Notable Quote:
  Sexton ([42:12]): “It's not going to happen. One, two, if it did happen, the devil are in the details... Kamala might well have won the presidency because you're bringing in 35 million ish new voters, and that new voter registry is about 2 to 1 Democrat in America over Republican.”

A caller from Maine shares firsthand experiences of Canadian pride spurred by Trump's proposal, revealing mixed reactions and the strengthening of national identity among Canadians.

4. Interview with Senator Rand Paul: COVID Origins and Anthony Fauci ([59:28] - [73:05])

Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky joins the show to discuss ongoing investigations into Dr. Anthony Fauci's role in COVID-19 research, specifically regarding gain-of-function experiments at the Wuhan Laboratory.

• Key Point: Paul outlines efforts to uncover who authorized funding for the dangerous research and accuses Fauci of misleading the public about the nature of the experiments.

• Notable Quote:
  Paul ([60:03]): “The committee has documents and in the documents they have EcoHealth Alliance... How do you lift a pause in funding for a project that was never gain-of-function if it was never gain-of-function?”

Senator Paul emphasizes the need for transparency and accountability, expressing hope that Fauci will testify to clarify the murky details surrounding the pandemic's origins.

Sexton and Paul also discuss broader implications of unchecked gain-of-function research, warning of the potential for even deadlier viruses if such research continues without stringent oversight.

• Notable Quote:
  Paul ([64:21]): “Is it a death wish for humanity for someone to try to get avian flu and make it more transmissible among humans? I think we should be shouting this from the rooftops.”

5. Trade Policies: India and Tariffs ([70:03] - [72:48])

The conversation shifts to international trade, specifically the prospect of India eliminating tariffs on American goods. Senator Paul evaluates the benefits and drawbacks of such a move amidst ongoing debates about protectionism versus free trade.

• Key Point: Paul advocates for reciprocal trade agreements that ensure fairness while reducing tariffs to promote economic growth. He criticizes extremist protectionist measures, like the proposed 500% tariff on Russian oil, deeming them economically unsound.

• Notable Quote:
  Paul ([70:57]): “A 500% tariff is an embargo. It's almost like a declaration of war, basically. So it's a really, really, really foolish notion.”

He supports Trump's negotiation tactics to lower tariffs with India, highlighting the potential for accelerated economic growth and improved bilateral relations.

6. Government Spending and Debt ([72:48] - [73:05])

The episode concludes with a brief discussion on government spending cuts and the national debt. Senator Paul expresses skepticism about the effectiveness of current spending reduction efforts, noting that many proposed cuts are minimal and unlikely to make a substantial impact.

• Notable Quote:
  Paul ([73:05]): “We have a rescission package. It can be voted on by a simple majority that's coming back to US of only 9 billion. That's a pittance. That's a rounding error.”

He urges for more substantial fiscal responsibility to prevent a potential economic crisis, emphasizing the need for bipartisan support to enact meaningful budget reforms.

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Conclusion

In this episode, Clay Travis and Buck Sexton offer a rigorous examination of critical political issues, from President Biden's cognitive health to Donald Trump's ambitious foreign policy proposals and trade negotiations. The in-depth interview with Senator Rand Paul provides valuable insights into the ongoing investigations surrounding COVID-19 research and the broader implications for national security and international relations. The hosts maintain their characteristic blend of intelligence and humor, ensuring a comprehensive and engaging discussion for their listeners.

Notable Quotes Summary:

• Travis ([04:20]): Discussing the potential criminality of a cover-up regarding Biden's cognitive test.
• Sexton ([08:59]): Critiquing media narrative control over Biden's public image.
• Trump ([23:12]): Teasing a major positive announcement about the Middle East.
• Trump ([39:08]): Envisioning Canada as the 51st state.
• Sexton ([42:12]): Highlighting the implausibility of the 51st state proposal.
• Paul ([60:03]): Questioning Fauci's honesty about gain-of-function research.
• Paul ([64:21]): Warning against the dangers of unchecked gain-of-function experiments.
• Paul ([70:57]): Dismissing extreme tariff measures as economically disastrous.
• Paul ([73:05]): Criticizing minimal government spending cuts as ineffective.

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This summary captures the essence of the May 6, 2025, episode of "The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show," providing listeners with a comprehensive overview of the key discussions and insights shared by the hosts and their guest, Senator Rand Paul.

Transcript

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Welcome in. Appreciate all of you hanging out with us. We are rolling through the Tuesday edition of the program and there is a lot going on in the world that we will dive into. Our friend Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky will join us at the top of the third hour of the program. He is our only guest today. 800-282-2882 if you want to weigh in on a variety of different topics that we will soon be diving in to. But this story I wanted to dive into got a little bit of attention. But I actually think it is super fascinating. We are in the middle right now of what we all told you would be coming. And it is the Biden's mental and physical cognition. Everybody knew how bad it was. And some of the stories that were not told when Biden was still in office are now being told. And there is a new story out that I think should have gotten more attention than it has so far. And I wanted to talk about this with you new upcoming book that is out about Biden's ongoing mental and physical struggles in the in the White House Sunday New York Times I read it. This is coming from a couple of different reporters. The book how Trump Retook the White House and Democrats Lost America says that in 2024, February, that there was a substantial debate inside of the White House about Joe Biden doing a cognitive test because in February of that year, if you'll remember, they came out with the her report which described the president as a sympathetic, well meaning elderly man with a poor memory. At that point in time, the story was becoming such an issue that they thought about having Biden take a cognition test but they were afraid that he would not be able to pass. Now this is in February of 2024. He still buck had nearly a full year as president of the United States. And they did back channel conversations according to the book. And the physician said, I'm not going to lie if he fails it, basically. And so they didn't believe that Biden would be able to pass the test. This is again, this is the New York Times reporting a book that's going to be out soon. This is one of the things that is in the book if true, if this is true, this is A cover up that I believe would be criminal because if you have a president of the United States and his staff which is publicly proclaiming that he's sharp as attack and that he's going to be able to run for reelection and be president for four more years, but privately, that same staff that's saying that publicly is afraid that if he took a cognition test, and these cognition tests are not, we're not talking about the sat, the act rolled into one. It's not an AP course. It is a very basic test that elderly people sometimes take to see whether or not they have severe dementia or whether their mental and physical capabilities are enough for them to, instance, be able to live at home or drive a car, these kind of things. Buck, this is staggering if this is true, because it would mean, thankfully, we got through it, but that what we were all talking about was likely true and that for a year the White House was trying to cover up the entire last year of his presidency, that many of his top aides didn't even think that he could pass a basic cognition test. And that's the reason they didn't have him do it.

Well, that's because everybody knew that this guy had dementia. But the entire system, the entire apparatus was completely enmeshed in the lie. And they knew. Right. What's going to be interesting here is how do they get past this? And some of you, I will say, have, have been pointing out, look, we're going to talk about the tariffs and the latest, you know, the latest is that Trump knows what he's doing and it's all fine. So everyone needs to calm down a bit. But we'll talk about the news of the day, of course, with respect to that. But why does this story still matter so much? It matters because it shows everybody just how deep the rot was between the Democrat Party and the corporate Democrat media, the old media institutions that still, even until this last election, I think Clay had more of a, more of a claim to, oh, we're, we're trustworthy and neutral than they should have. People had wised up a lot. But now, if you believe the New York Times isn't pushing a left wing agenda, you are just not very smart. Right. If, if you believe that the Washington Post is objective journalism. Even Jeff Bezos doesn't believe the Washington Post. He owns it and he doesn't think it's objective journalism based on what we've seen in the last election cycle alone. He's figured this out. Right. So I think Clay, what's interesting is, you know, there's this reporting about the COVID up and it comes out now. And this is going to be one thing. This will be contentious, especially for anybody who's trying to say, well, look at all the good journalism we're doing now about this. All of this was known and knowable before the election. Real journalism would have been telling us about this before the American people were voting. Right. Because it doesn't just go to Joe Biden. It goes to the credibility of the pro Kamala media and all of the stories around her and all the things that were going on at that time. So, you know, you can't try to rig the game. I watched my beloved New York Knicks last night get a huge win, Clay. Huge win over the Boston Celtics.

They came back from 20 points down. When's the last time you watched it full? Did you watch the whole game or just the end of it?

No, my brothers texted me and said, stop being a communist, they're about to win, there's five minutes left or something. And I said, okay, brothers. My brothers are the normal ones in the family. They were watching. So I turned it on. But you know, imagine if it came out that, that one of those teams had tried to rig the game by paying off the refs. You're not a hero for telling us that after the game is over and.

You'Ve lost a year later, thank.

And a year later, that's not heroic. Ok? That's cleaning up after the parade of elephants and horses, so to speak, has already gone by. And that's what's going on here. It is clean up on aisle journalism. And we're going to have this out, I think in time with anybody who sees it otherwise. Oh, by the way, one more, just one more thing, Clay. If they could have gotten a doctor to lie, they absolutely would have gone forward with it. Because all these people have their jobs riding on whether Biden can pass this cognitive test.

The doctor, that's what I wanted to reference. This is according to the New York Times, this was reporting on this book that's going to come out. Mr. Biden's longtime doctor Kevin O'Connor told aides he would not take the 81 year old president's political standing into consideration when treating him.

Good for him.

Basically. Yeah.

That guy is. That guy is actually a hero in this story. When it mattered, he had integrity.

The Bidens have declined to comment on this story that is coming out in the, in this book.

Can I just throw something out there too? Sorry, you've got me fired up about this story, Clay. Sent me this story. Now I'm fired up about this story. Clay, you know who one of the chief. You know who maybe the chief villain in this whole narrative is going to be? Jill Biden.

Well, I've been arguing that for a while.

You have. But I'm saying in this book, it's going to. It's going to completely align with your Jill Biden is a chief villain take. But I think we're going to get some of those details now. Can you imagine hiding your husband's dementia from the country in a reelection camp we're not even talking about. Can he just get to the end? Right. That would be bad enough. Okay, just six more months, Joe. Just six more months. Clay, they were telling us he should be president for four more years.

There are two other things in this story that are in the book that I think is. Mike Donilon, a senior adviser to Biden, had worked for him since the 80s, told the Harvard Political Review in March, Even when they were worried about this cognitive test, every day I keep seeing him doing the job. I still think he's the best person to be president today. David Axelrod, top adviser to President Obama, called into question in July 2022 whether Biden would be able to serve another four years. He said, the stark reality is the president's gonna be closer to 90 than 80 at the end of the second term. It would be a major issue. That comment, according to the book, prompted an angry call to Axelrod from ron Klain, then Mr. Biden's chief of staff. He said, there's no Obama out there ax who's going to do it if he doesn't do it? That is why they covered. It's not only buck that they were aware and they wanted to maintain power and everything else, it's that I think they realized there was no one else who could do better against Trump than Biden. So they were willing to weekend that Bernie's too Joe Biden as long as they could keep this lie going. And that's because there wasn't somebody in the wings that they thought was better. And they ended up being correct because Kamala couldn't do it either.

I'll also point this out, Clay. I know you're. I know you're with me on this, but I just think we have to keep on reminding everybody because remember the people that went along with this lie, they all still run the Democrat Party. They're all still calling the shots at most of, you know, the non Fox networks. Although I actually, you know, congrats to Newsmax and News Nation for all the gains there. You know, they're making a lot of gains and it's, and they've earned it because they've built their brands at a time when these other brands are just going into the side of the mountain at high speed. But, Clay, if they could have held off on the debate until the election. Yeah, they would have.

Even still the story. That's still the story. I want to know more about. Why did they decide to do it?

And I think it was the biggest blunder in, in political history. Clay. They should, they would have gotten away with this in my mind now, I don't know if they would. He would have beaten Trump. That's a different question. I don't think so. Look at, look at the results in the election. But they would have dragged him to election Day. All they had to do was say, Joe refuses to platform an election denier. You have to say it like that because you have to have no testosterone when you say it. Joe refuses to platform an election denier. The American people will decide at the ballot box. Clay. They could have kept Biden in the seat. And I'll say this, it would have if they had done that, Forget about the debate. It would have been a better showing for them than it did, than it was with Kamala, I think, no question in my mind.

I, I, I think that's still the great untold story. Why did they insist, Remember, it was their call. Why did they insist on the early debate? Because they're lying about his mental and physical cognition already. He'd already locked up the overall nomination. There was nothing they could have done to him. If they had just waited to do a debate until September, October, it would have destroyed his chances, I think, of reelection because everybody would have seen it and it would have been impossible to replace him at that point in time. But why not? Or we said it for a while, we thought that Biden might say, I'm not even going to platform Trump because his ideas are too, too crazy. People have seen us debate already. They know what he thinks. They know what I think. I believe that that might have been the better play because then they could have kept the lie going.

I think if you and I were running the Biden 2024 campaign, talk about a thought experiment. And we had, and we had sold our souls. And the whole point was anything, because if we believe, let's say, that Trump was the end of the republic, which isn't that just even more insane now we look around, we're like, you mean the country is healing and things are going great. Yeah, that's the end of the Republic. We could have gotten by into election day. Look at all this stuff they were able to suppress. They could that I agree with you who pushed forward the early debate because the only there are only two options. The biggest own goal self inflicted wound in modern American politics. Or maybe somebody was like I just can't be a part of this anymore. I think that's less likely. I do. But it's not impossible.

That would have been the House of Cards part. You know, if this the the television show that Netflix did back in the day, the House of Cards version would be we're gonna trot him out there and we're gonna let him go up in flames. But it is crazy to me that they let this guy debate in June of 2027. I just think it's crazy. We'll talk about this. We'll take some of your calls. AI everywhere. If your business isn't using it, you're losing money, productivity and a competitive edge. NetSuite helps you control costs and increase efficiency like our federal government's trying to do. NetSuite number one Cloud business management system out there harnessing the power of AI to give you that competitive edge. Even the best run businesses could use a little optimizing, maybe even streamlining. With netsuite, you'll gain clarity on what actions to take. With technology moving so fast, you're probably wondering where to even begin. NetSuite brings accounting, financial management, inventory, HR into one efficient suite. Instead of paying for multiple systems, begin by going to netsuite.com Clay Netsuite is spelled N E T S U I t e. Netsuite.com Clay brings you to a website where you can Download the free CFOs guide to AI and machine learning. It's fast, it's easy. It's what next. It's what's next. Lead your company into the Future. Get the AI Edge with NetSuite by Oracle. That's netsuite.com/clay saving America One Thought at a time. Clay Travis and Buck Sexton. Find them on the free iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcast.

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Hot off the presses, so to speak. Clips of President Trump from the Oval Office addressing some of the most important news of the day. Let's start with the huge announcement. Probably some people are saying the biggest announcement of all announcements we don't yet know much other than, well, here's the president saying it. Listen to him.

[Donald Trump]

We'll have maybe before we want to, you know, the Middle East, Saudi Arabia, going to UAE and Qatar. And that will be, I guess, Monday night. Some of you are coming with us. I think before then, we're going to have a very, very big announcement to make, like as big as it gets. And I won't tell you on what, but it's going to. And it's very positive. I'd also. I'd tell you if it was negative or positive. I can't keep that out. It is really, really positive. And that announcement will be made either Thursday or Friday or Monday before we leave. But it'll be one of the most important announcements that have been made in many years about a certain subject. Very important subject.

[Buck Sexton]

So you'll all be here, I'm guessing it's got to be the Abraham Accords with Saudi Arabia coming on board.

Yes.

Does that make sense to you?

That makes the most sense to me, too. I don't think it's a breakthrough with Iran. We would have gotten some whispers about that beforehand. And plus, I just don't think Iran's ever going to say, you know what, we're not going to get nukes. So I think the Saudi. It might be an agreement with Saudi that is an extension of the Abraham Accords and also a commitment from Saudi to invest, you know, a trillion dollars in the US over the next 20 years or something. I don't know, whatever. A trillion dollars. A lot of money. Not so much to Saudi. I feel like they'll pay that for a soccer team these days. But, yeah, that's something that I think is a likely possibility. I would love to think that it would be, you know, returning all the hostages from. From Israel, I mean, from Hamas to Israel. But I, I think that that is now going into a different phase of the Israelis are doing the final push in that operation as, as they well should. And that's going to change some dynamics in the Middle east, too.

I also think it has to be someone that you have good relations with in order to be confident that that deal is going to be able to be announced. Does that make sense? Like IR shifting? They may say something on Wednesday that's different than what they said on Monday. You can't really rely on them. Hamas, you can't rely on anything related to what they might say publicly. So I think it would have to be someone that the government would have a good relationship with that you could rely on being reasonable. I don't think you could say, for instance, with Vladimir Putin and Russia that you feel comfortable enough in them to even forecast something like this. So that's why I, I think the idea of the Abraham Accords being expanded, which is hugely important long range in the Middle East. By the way, this is something that is significant that I saw also there's a report that Trump, I don't know if we, if he said this or if this is an official report that India has basically agreed to zero tariffs on American products inside of their country. That could be utterly transformative in the decades ahead because India is now the biggest country in the world and unlike China, which is collapsing in population and I think has already peaked, I think India is going to become the second biggest economy in the world in the next 50 years.

And this then I think is a good moment for us to take a look at what is being said now from some very interesting, very astute places about the Trump tariffs conversation. Glenn Youngkin, one of the, I would say top five, maybe top ten top five governors in America right now in Virginia doing a great job and also a former very senior level executive. I mean he was the CEO of the Carlisle Group Group, which is one of the largest private equity firms in the world. This is the governor of Virginia and like I said, a guy who also understands private industry saying that. Well, I'll let you hear it from him. This is cut three.

I expect that long term we will have an accelerated growth and I'm very optimistic. I think in the near term, as the president resets these imbalanced trade relationships and restores fiscal responsibility into Washington, we're going to see dislocation. It's just a reality. And but what I do firmly expect is investment from companies around the world to accelerate. I expect job growth to accelerate.

I think you're already beginning to see some of that. The jobs numbers. This is Scott Besson. This is cut one in the first hundred days. You need to hear about these jobs. Remember, it's not all government, you know, make believe jobs or at least low show jobs. It's jobs in the actual economy. Play this is from the Treasury Secretary. Play 1.

[Mark Carney]

The core components of the Trump economic agenda are trade tax cuts and deregulation. These are not standalone policies. They are interlocking parts of an engine designed to drive economic growth and domestic manufacturing. Tax cuts and cost savings from deregulation raise real incomes for families and businesses. Tariffs create an incentive for reshoring jobs and fair trade and deregulation complements tariffs by making it easier to invest in energy and manufacturing projects. Already this agenda is bearing fruit. In the first hundred days the new administration, 464,000 new jobs were added to the economy.

[Buck Sexton]

Clay, people just need to give this some time. And I think what you're seeing here is first of all, I just 15 years in conservative media, all we in the beginning of this, when I got into this, we would always hear we need private industry minds in government. We need people who understand how jobs are created in the economy, not by siphoning money from taxpayers to people who don't actually necessarily do anything or add anything. With some of these government, with some of this government bloat. We have this now in a way we not only on the advisors, but Trump himself.

Right.

Somebody who understands the private sector. You look at even Scott Besant, you compare him to Biden's treasury secretary, Janet Yellen. Yellen is an academic economist. Ok. That's who was running the treasury before. Besant is a guy who had to place multibillion dollar bets and be right about the trajectory of economic growth, about what was actually going to happen in the global economy. We have doers and practitioners now, Clay, not theorists and faculty lounge layabouts.

Yeah. And again, I think that's why, you know, the caller from San Diego is fired up. I think people sometimes have unrealistic expectations of what is capable of doing with the ship of states. And I've had this analogy made to me a lot over the years. You know, in the world of sports, the smaller the team, the quicker you can adjust the direction. So if you're a basketball coach, it's like a speedboat. You can change a couple players, you can turn it around. Football teams like an aircraft carrier. The United States is the largest floatable ship on the planet. It's very hard to turn it in any particular direction. Now sometimes that can be good because if people make really poor choices, then the degree to which they can shift the direction of the country is limited. But you've made the argument for years here and it's a pessimistic one, but I think there's some truth to it that the president doesn't largely matter because the apparatus surrounding the president is such that they're going to direct the ship in the way they see best. And you made that argument.

Biden was a test of my theory.

[Hannah Jewell]

Yes.

[Buck Sexton]

Right. Biden was a real world experiment of is it the machinery and not the man? With Trump, that's obviously not the case. But I'm just saying it can be what we just saw.

Well, and this is why I think Elon Musk has been so frustrated. And look, I love that Elon Musk and Scott Besant and Howard Ludnick and all of these guys that are super successful outside of government are in government Trying to do their best. Trump is a great example of that too, but in sports, and I've never seen it applied in politics, but. But I love the concept and it's such an interesting one. There's something called win over replacement value and it's a. I think you can apply it to all of your life. It's such an interesting concept. You know, there's basically a war. You know, win above replacement for every player. And I mentioned Aaron Judge is the best player in baseball right now statistically across the board. His stats in New York, Yankee player are off the charts. He is worth multiple wins compared to someone that might be replacing him at a position. I think you can apply it to politics. How much better is Trump not only than any other Republican, but then Kamala I think massively right, because over every day, every decision, the trajectory of the USS aircraft carrier is very different based on the judgments Trump is making versus what Kamala is making versus what Biden did. But within the constraints, I would argue that it is impossible for any president to move faster and break more things than Trump has done in the first hundred days. And therefore, when you call in and say, and I understand people get frustrated, but I think it's important to understand the larger construct. There are people out there who will tell you, oh, the president can do whatever he wants and he can take 48,000 different actions. And the reality is Trump is moving faster and breaking more things than anything I have ever seen from any president in the history of our country. And if you are out there saying he needs to move faster and he needs to break more things, I respect it. I would just point out that historically no one has moved at the pace that Trump has ever in the history of the United States government. I really think that's true. And they're trying to make government move more like a business. And if you have ever run a business, one of the great things about sitting at the head of the table, if you own the business, is for better or worse, you make a decision and buck. One of the management lessons that I think I've learned is it's better to make a wrong decision than not do anything. And some people think that's crazy, but actually it's important because it's a wrong decision.

One of the things that at the CIA Farm, which is our training facility, that they would always talk about in the context of counter ambush, somebody's trying to take you out. They would just. And I know this military talks about this too, but they would say, get off the X yeah, they would. They drilled into our brain. When you are under threat, the worst thing you can do, Breeze, is nothing. The worst thing you can do is. I don't want to make the wrong decision. So I make no decision.

Yes.

That you can pay with your life for that one. There is a. There's a broader lesson. There's the broader principle there. You got to just do sometimes. Because sitting around with. And especially given the time constraints I think the Trump administration is under with the midterms, as we've discussed, that moving as fast as possible. Moving as fast as possible is its own advantage in a system which we've already seen for all of our adult. For all of our lives, that can always fall back on inaction as its preferred plan. And the Democrats were hoping that there would be inertia even with Trump coming in. The inertia of government would be a protection for what they want, which is the status quo.

Yes.

No, he's smashing that by moving so fast in so many places.

And I would argue, again, this is me being a history nerd. Probably the person who's moved the government the fastest in the lives of anyone out there that is listening to us right now. Certainly the adult lives of anyone that's listening is Lyndon Johnson. And Lyndon Johnson was able to move the government so rapidly in his one term, after one term plus change, when he took over for JFK because he was a genius of Senate procedure. And so he was able to move Congress at a speed in the Senate in particular that it had never moved at before, because he knew the inner workings of procedure in the Senate, having spent time there better than almost anyone.

A corollary to that was Charlie Wilson's war, where I. For Doc. Whatever his name is, I forget now, but the member of Congress who was like on the. On the, you know, the Finance, the Spending Committee, whatever it was at the time, and Charlie Wilson knew, if I just got this guy in my pocket, I got whoever I need in my pocket to get the things through that I need to get through. So understanding that system is critical. Trump has come in not just with the right team to decide, but with people like Stephen Miller and others who know how the system functions. And this is part of what I think. Clay has driven Democrats so insane because first time around, Trump, great ideas, first term, not an understanding of the system. So, yes, a huge, huge difference this time around. Look, here in South Florida, we get huge downpours. We actually just got one a couple hours before the show came out of nowhere. The kind that will clog your gutters if you have the smallest amount of leaves, twigs, whatever else that's accumulated, a clean gutter clears the way for a carefree summer. Whether you're tired of unclogging your gutters or don't even know what they look like, it's time for a permanent solution with Leaffilter. Right now, save up to 30% [e-mail] Clayandbuck gutter clogs aren't just a nuisance, they can cause extensive water damage. Let Leaffilter's trusted pro help protect your home from flooding, roof damage, rotted siding, foundation issues and more. They'll clean out, realign and seal your gutters before installing Leaffilter's award winning and patented technology. Protect your home and never clean out gutters again with leaffilter. This is America's number one gutter protection system. Schedule your free inspection and get up to 30% off your entire purchase at leaffilter.com clayandbuck that's leafilter.com clayandbuck see the representative for warranty details.

Want to be in the know when you're on the go the Team 47 podcast Trump highlights from the week, Sundays at noon Eastern in the Clay and Buck podcast feed. Find it on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

This play is hot on this one. Let's dive into this. Canada just had a very disappointing election from the perspective of freedom, liberty, common sense. Pierre Pollyv, he of Apple eating and indifference to media fame did not succeed in his effort to become the PM of Canada. I'm going to put this out. Some of our Canadian listeners. What the heck happened there, guys? You're hearing us up because, you know, some of our big New York stations, Clay stretched, you know, well into Canada, probably some of our Michigan stations I would assume too. I got to check the wattage. But yeah, I think that they can be heard where the Canadian population is. We got Canadian listeners for sure, some of them streaming. What happened there? Well, here is Trump with the new Prime Minister of Canada, Mark Carney, who I'd never heard of until this talking about this play.

[Donald Trump]

It takes two to tango, right? But no, I do. I mean, I believe it would be a massive tax cut for the Canadian citizens. You get free military, you get tremendous medical cares and other things. There would be a lot of advantages, but it would be, it would be a massive tax cut. And it's also a beautiful, you know, as a real estate developer, you know, I'm a real estate developer at heart. When you get rid of that artificially drawn line. Somebody drew that line many years ago with like a ruler, just a straight line right across the top of the country. When you look at that beautiful formation when it's together, I'm a very artistic person, but when I looked at that beauty, I said, that's the way it was meant to be. But you know, it, I just, I do feel it's much better for Canada. But we're not going to be discussing that unless somebody wants to discuss it. I think that there are tremendous benefits to the Canadian citizens, tremendously lower taxes, free military, which honestly we give you essentially anyway, because we're protecting in Canada, if you have had a problem. But I think, you know, it's, it would really be a wonderful marriage because it's, it's two places that get along very well. They like each other a lot.

[Buck Sexton]

So then Carney Buck responded and I think we have Carney's response. So Trump still pushing, and I love it. He just, everybody wants to say, like, what is Trump? Trump's a real estate guy at his core. He's a real estate guy and he's looking at Greenland and he's looking at Panama and he's at Canada. And the truth of the matter is some of the most successful presidents that we've ever had basically have been real estate guys. Thomas Jefferson, Louisiana Purchase, kind of a good deal, Gadsden Purchase, Seward's Folly.

George Washington was a real estate guy and a landlord, in fact, a speculator.

Some would argue, that nearly went bankrupt many different times over the amount of land that he was acquiring back in the day. Most of the founding fathers, there's big agrarian land related guys. But then Carney responded and I actually liked his response. And you can hear Trump laugh because I think Trump kind of respects it a little bit too.

[Mark Carney]

Listen, as you know from real estate, there are some places that are never for sale.

[Donald Trump]

That's true.

[Mark Carney]

We're sitting in one right now. You know, Buckingham palace that you visited as well.

[Buck Sexton]

That's true.

[Mark Carney]

And having met with the owners of Canada over the course of the campaign last several months, it's not for sale, won't be for sale ever. But the opportunity is in the partnership and what we can build together. And we have done that in the past. And part of that, as the President just said, is with respect to our own security. And my government is committed for a step change in our investment in Canadian security and our partnership. And I'll say this as well, that the President has revitalized international security revitalized NATO and us playing our full weight in NATO's. And that will be part.

[Buck Sexton]

I think Trump, Buck is 100% right that the world would actually be better off. And look, if Canada was a part of the United States, I think he's 100% right. Here's the problem. It's not going to happen. One, two, if it did happen, the devil are in the details. Most of those voters would be far left wing voters. So you would actually have to, instead of making Canada a 51st state, you would have to in some way create some of the rural Canadian areas to give them an opportunity so that we could have senators who were not insane. It would if, if, if Canada were a part of the United States. I'm not very many people have talked about this. Kamala might well have won the presidency because you're bringing in 35 million ish new voters and that new voter registry is about 2 to 1 Democrat in America over Republican. So look, Trump's right. They would get a huge tax cut. I think the overall economy would be better for both countries if Canada were a part of the United States. I think that's all true. It's not going to happen. And, and the reality here is if it were going to happen, the details in terms of what it would be necessary to occur are substantial. What I like about it is it goes to the growth mindset of Trump. He's not looking at the United States as a finished product. I bought a map recently and I'm going to put it in the new house that we're building. It's what I love about it is it's one of those old school maps. Buck, do you remember when used to be able to pull down the map and the teacher would pull out a ruler or whatever and they would point to it and it would be this. Before everybody had the camera, had the computers to be able to put everything imaged out there. And it's a map from like 1840 and it has the continental United States and most of the United States is not filled in yet. We didn't know what the future of the country was going to look like. And I love the ambition, the scope, the metaphor of that unfilled map. And I think that is how Trump thinks that the United States is not a fixed and permanent and already fully formed country, that we still have a lot of growth. And I think that is what his expansionist mindset represents. Whether it's Greenland, whether it's Canada, whether it's Panama, and making us think in different ways. But that, to me, is the challenge of Canada. I'm not sure even if it's a great idea, and I do think it would be good for the economy overall, that the Canadian voters would actually agree with much of what we think is important in the United States right now.

But if it's not going to happen, and I agree with you that it's not going to happen, why does Trump know that it's not going to happen? Because.

Why?

This is the.

This is where it's a great question. I think Trump is a bit of a magical thinker. This is my psychoanalysis of Trump. And what I mean by that is anytime you build something that hasn't been built before, you have to be a creative, magical thinker. Real estate developers have to see things that haven't occurred and believe that they are possible. I think in Trump's mind, he believes that anything can be negotiated. And so even if there's a small chance of it happening, he thinks by putting it out into the larger discussion, he actually makes it somewhat possible. In the same way, if you say, hey, I'm going to build a 200 story building, well, maybe that's not going to end up happening. But the idea that you think you can expands the Overton window of possibility.

Clay thinks that Trump is a man who dreams great dreams, the greatest dreams. We got a caller, Dave, in Maine. He says he lives right near the Canadian border, wants to weigh in on this Canada stuff. What's going on, Dave?

[H]

Hi, gentlemen. Yeah, so my family is from Canada, back and forth. I would live right handy to it. My wife used to grocery shop there every week. Grew up playing hockey with Canadian kids. My daughter works for a Canadian company and we got a lot of friends that are Canadians. What, what happened was they were ready. The people that we know were ready to go for Pierre. But the whole 51st state.

[Buck Sexton]

Yeah.

[H]

Thing really touched off their national pride. And we compete in another sport and we have Canadians come over and, and compete with us. And they got so peed off, they're like, we're not coming to the US this year to compete. And sorry, you know, not, don't take it personal, but, you know, it's an attack on our country. I said, he's just messing with them anyway. But they didn't take it that way. And I said too, he should have marketed it as there's 10 provinces and three territories Canada. So one state wasn't nearly enough. Give them 10 states. Give them 10 or 13 states. But all seriousness, that is real, you know, that's the feedback directly from my best friend lives no Scotia. You know, another thing to about is their news is just horrendous like always having to re, you know, tell them these listen to what's the follow their Rebel News. You know, try to get some alternative news sources because they're regular news they get is just, you know, you think I mean it's common.

[Buck Sexton]

It's communist dribble. I, I know that because I used to, I used to do some news back in the day which I think became Rebel News or Ezra Levant. You know, very early in my career I actually appeared on Canadian TV when I needed more TV reps, Clay. I was like, hey, how are my Canadian brothers and sisters doing?

Oh, really? You that's, that's where you were honing the skills.

Buck is huge in Saskatchewan. You have no idea.

I, you know, it's thank you for the call. By the way. I do think, to answer your question, that the 51st state talk inside of Canada ignited national pride and it lit on fire the hopes of conservative governments because they were seen as closer to Trump.

I'm also going to say this. It reminds me of somebody that I know, somebody I spent a lot of time with day today. I don't know, I don't know if he needs to be named here. But when you tell Trump not to talk about something or that he can't talk about something, guess what is going to happen. And there are a lot of people who said stop with the 51st state talk. Yeah, Clay.

So I don't know how somebody could be I don't know how somebody could be that way. I also think this ties in. Trump also sees this as entertainment. I'm going to be honest with you. And I know some people were offended by the Pope. Trump as pope meme that got shared. I thought it was really funny. And I'm not Catholic, so I can't speak on behalf of the Catholic universe.

Trump spoke to this. Let's, let's hear his because by the way, I am Catholic. I went to Jesuit school and did all this stuff and you know, know some of the things I did not. I was not even vaguely offended by this. Ok, this is, there are things that appear about Catholicism or the way that it's depicted and the way the media and the focus on certain things is offensive. I agree with Trump on this one, a hundred percent. But here he is. Play cut five.

[Clay Travis]

Some Catholics were not so happy about.

[Buck Sexton]

The image of you looking like the Pope.

[Donald Trump]

Oh, I see. You mean they, they can't Take a joke. You don't mean the Catholics. You mean the fake news media. Not the Catholics. Loved it. I had nothing to do with it. Somebody made up a picture of me dressed like the Pope and they put it out on the Internet. That's not me that did it. I have no idea where it came from. Maybe it was AI, but I know nothing about it. I just saw it last evening, actually. My wife thought it was cute. She said, isn't that nice? My question about, actually, I would not be able to be married, though that would be a lot. To the best of my knowledge, Popes aren't big on getting married, are they? Not that we know of. No.

[Buck Sexton]

I mean, not that we know of.

Not that. Yeah, well, we talked about this. There actually were a lot of. Back in the day with a lot of illegitimate kids out there. If you. If you study, there's a really good.

Renaissance art that came out of those naughty Popes, So just putting it out there and.

But. So I thought that was funny. Again, I think you tweeted this, and I do think it's important, the fact that Trump has maintained a sense of humor and a lightness of being with the most important job in the United States. I think it's probably fair to say just a few months ago, he took a fricking bullet off his ear that nearly blew his head off on live television. The thing that doesn't get talked about at all. And I was with him at the NCAA wrestling championships on that arena floor in Philadelphia. Most people who come that close to death, who would have an assassin's bullet clip their ear, most people would be pretty apprehensive walking into big, crowded arenas. The guy is fearless, and I think, to your point, has a likeness of bearing about him, that even though he is engaged in serious things, he still has a sense of humor surrounding it. And so I think he's putting it out into the ether, this idea of. Of Canada or Greenland or Panama or whatever it might be, because of the expansionist idea, but also the Pope thing. I think he enjoys just having fun or the running for a third term in office, all of these things. I think he enjoys expanding the universe and kind of ridiculing the people who are most opposed to him. And I thought the Pope picture, I saw it, you know, like, I guess, when did it come out? Just before the Kentucky Derby or something, and I thought it was pretty funny.

I don't. I know a lot of Catholics. Okay. I'm related to a lot of them, too. I don't know A single Catholic who thought that that was like blasphemous or some big problem. All right, everyone could calm down, you know, Trump, Trump like on the cross or something that would upset people. Trump as the Pope. I think that's funny.

We come back, we'll take some more of your calls. We've got Senator Rand Paul joining us top of the third hour. After yesterday's debate about whether I could swim to shore from Alcatraz. Lot of disrespect for my swimming ability, I have to say. I'm bracing for the monster sized shipment of chalk's male vitality stack to arrive. I think Buck, right before I jumped into the water, into the icy shark infested waters of the San Francisco Bay to demonstrate my incredible swimming acumen, I would need to pound a bunch of chalk to just have the energy of a thousand men. A trump like set of energy to in order to propel me across the entire bay to land.

I can neither confirm nor deny. But if you were to take some Chad mode, would you be able to outswim a great white shark that was on your tail?

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Can I just throw something else out there too, just so all of you know, because you know, chalk has been part of my regimen now for months. I've been on the six month journey and the last time I saw Lara when she came over a few months ago, she looked at me, she was like, wow, you really did lean out.

I was like, yes, Property has, is going to live to be 140 and is very healthy and knows all about supplements. She was impressed with chalk. I don't know anything. I'm kind of a moron on many subjects, as many of you have learned. But in the meantime, you can get hooked up right now with chalk.com my name Clay for a massive discount on any subscription for life. Chalk.comchoq.com you can cancel your subscription anytime. Imagine what you could do with way more energy and 20 increased testosterone. It can make a huge difference for you and can just help me to be an even better swimmer than I already am. Get hooked up today. Chalk.comchoq.com My name Clay. Massive discount on any subscription for life. News you can count on and some laughs too.

Clay Travis and Buck Sexton.

Find them on the free iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcast.

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[Hannah Jewell]

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[Buck Sexton]

That'S if cj.org welcome back in Clay Travis Buck Sexton SHOW Appreciate everybody hanging out with us. We're joined now by Senator Rand Paul, a great state of Kentucky and Senator Paul. I know there's a ton of things we're gonna get into with you, but I wanna start with this. Anthony Fauci. The evidence continues to mount that he lied about gain of function research. You uniquely, I think, in the entire political class, have continued to hold his feet to the fire. What is the latest about that that you can tell us?

[Rand Paul]

We've been trying to get records on the deliberation of who made the call to send the money to Wuhan. The research, the lab, the leak, who funded it. We know the NIH did it, but we want to know who met about it, who discussed it and who made the final approval. We think that's Anthony Fauci and we're getting closer to that. The Biden administration refused to give us any documents. They basically refused for years to give any. Robert Kennedy has opened up the books to us. Jay Bhattach at NIH is also helping us, and we're sorting through it. We're going to begin interviewing everybody who's part of the process. So there's a committee over there that discussed it. When Fauci said everybody told him that it wasn't gained a function. It's interesting though, that the committee has documents and in the documents they have EcoHealth Alliance. This is a group that got the money that took it to Wuhan. They have EcoHealth alliance sending notes back to the NIH saying, thank you for lifting our gain of function pause. So they were paused. The government quit funding gain of function between 2014 and 2016. They thanked them for lifting their pause on the same research that Fauci said was never gain of function. So how do you lift a pause in funding for a project that was never gained a function if it was never gained a function? So we've got evidence like that. But ultimately, once we've interviewed everybody, we will get to Anthony Fauci. That will be within a month or two. And we'll be having him come in and testify.

[Buck Sexton]

In terms of that testimony, what are you hoping to be able to get final answers from Fauci on? And given the Senator Paul, given the preemptive pardon that he was given, which is still pretty remarkable when I say that out loud that that even happened, what are you hoping the final disposition of this whole situation will be?

[Rand Paul]

You know, you realize with a preemptive pardon, where they don't even list your crime that he's pardoned for anything. Stealing, you know, larceny, grand larceny, assault, you name it. He's pardoned for anything he could have done over a 10 year period. It's the craziest thing I've ever heard. I've never ever heard of a pardon that's preemptive and also includes any possible crime he committed over a 10 year period. I don't have high hopes that he's going to be ultimately held criminally responsible, but I think it's important that history judges him accurately and harshly. He made a decision that led to the million millions of people dying, basically a decision to fund a lab that was not up to safety standards and fund research that was incredibly dangerous. We also are concerned that this kind of research still goes on. So the President came out in the last day or so with a pause once again on gain of function research, importantly, not just in our country, but a pause on all funding we do around the world. Because of course, you know, Uncle Sam funds everybody's research lab everywhere in the world. And some of these, some of this, some people conjecture Anthony Fauci farmed out because he wanted less scrutiny. So for example, some of the most gruesome stuff that was done on beagles was done in Tunisia. They did in Tunisia hoping that their sensibilities about sewing their eyelids open and infecting them with sand fleas and then cutting their larynx out so you couldn't hear the dogs cry, that there'd be less sensibility for that somewhere else other than the United States. But same way with gain of function, we think some of it was farmed out. We need to know the degree of this and we need to get to the bottom of it. We're also very concerned with a couple of labs near Fort Detrick. Kennedy closed one down and the media reported he was anti science. I heard the accurate story from Jay Bhattachary. The accurate story is someone's hazmat suit was purposely cut in one of the areas dealing with Ebola and different very dangerous viruses. So getting that kind of disease out of a lab, if he were to have gotten infected is incredibly dangerous. And so next to that lab is an nih, no, a DHS lab, Department of Homeland Security, that we now have reports are doing experiments aerosolizing Ebola. We think that somebody, you know, somebody representing the taxpayer and the citizens of the country ought to be able to take a look at these labs and find out what experiments are doing and really should we be doing some of this?

[Buck Sexton]

I think both. All of this you just said is really important because I think it answers two questions. One, it is backward looking in the context of Fauci, should be seen as a villain of history, and his full trajectory of stories and lies should be analyzed for years to come. That's backwards looking, prospectively, as you just laid out. The reason why this matters is if China created Covid, which I think it's quite clear that they did, partly based on having gain of function, access to American taxpayer dollars, we should be massively concerned about, as you just laid out, whatever the next iteration of the virus that could be created is, because it could end up far more deadly than anything that we dealt with with COVID I think that's kind of a synthesis of all of this for people out there who would say, okay, why are we still talking about COVID Well, you.

[Rand Paul]

Know, the next virus could be avian flu. Avian flu has a 50% death rate. Coronavirus, or Covid, was less than 1%. So avian flu, currently a human can get it from chickens or from birds, but it doesn't go human to human. But there are experiments trying to get it to go human to human, mammal to mammal, through the air. These have been funded by nih. This is the kind of stuff that has to be discussed. Is it a death wish for humanity for someone to try to get avian flu and make it more transmissible among humans? I think we should be shouting this from the rooftops. This kind of research should not occur and the taxpayers shouldn't pay for it. But I don't know that we've actually gotten to that point yet. The Trump administration's ban, at least temporary or maybe longer on this is a good step. I have legislation that would do this. We actually have gotten bipartisan support. I passed it out unanimously at a committee last Congress. Do it again in the next month or so. And then we're hoping it can be included in some kind of legislation that's going to pass soon. But this would actually let President Trump appoint a panel of scientists. And importantly, these scientists would not be ones who get NIH grants. So they can't be bribed to have an opinion. They will be independent voices, but experts in their field, and they will examine all government research, all classified and unclassified documents, and they will give their opinion on whether it should be funded, and they will have the ability to stop funding. It will be a powerful committee, but it won't be a total ban. It would be, we're going to look at case by case. The reason you need that is if you just ban it and then the next people come in and say, well, that's not going to function. That's what Anthony Fauci did said, oh, yeah, we were, we had special safety for gain of function, but this wasn't gain of function. Anthony Fauci to this day still argues that the research in Wuhan that led to the death of six to 10 million people, he said that wasn't gain of function, which nobody else believes other than Anthony Fauci.

[Buck Sexton]

Speaking to Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky. Senator, on President Trump today, he spoke about the Houthis. I think he said there's a deal that they have now. Essentially it's please stop bombing us and we'll stop blowing up ships. But the Houthis are an extension and an allied with Iran. There's a lot of talk right now about one of kind of, I think you could say, a rare disconnect or disagreement at the senior levels of some of the Trump personnel. And it has to do with Iran and what we should do about Iran and its nuclear ambitions going forward. How do you see that? Where do you think Trump is on this? And where would you like to see this go?

[Rand Paul]

You know, I'm encouraged by the announcement today. And Trump shows great strength and they back down. So I think that is a good thing. And my hope is that we can get to a point where international shipping is safe to go around the bend there and up through the Suez. With regard to Iran, my hope is that we can move forward. And this is where Trump is different than some of the neoconservatives. The neoconservatives never want to get to the next step of negotiations. So Trump goes in with a firm hand. But he does get to the next step of negotiation. He did it with North Korea. Didn't necessarily work out, but most of the neocons, from Hillary Clinton to Bill Kristol, would have never talked to North Korea. They would never talk to an Iran. Ultimately, getting to the point where we talk to them is good because really, the only realistic way of stopping them from getting a nuclear weapon is in all likelihood through diplomacy. I don't think you can bomb away their nuclear. I don't think once they have enriched uranium, you know, a cup full of uranium enriched to 95 or 98% is probably enough for a bomb. You know, you once you get six or eight or ten cupfuls of uranium, you're missed to that point. You have the rest of the Technical knowledge to do it. You know, you can hide that thousands of feet below the ground where no bomb can get to. So, you know, I don't want that to happen. We want to stop it, but ultimately it has to be both stick and carrot. And so ultimately you have to talk to people and you have to. This is the same thing we should be doing with Russia. You know, they're wanting to put more sanctions on Russia. The Lindsey Graham bill wants to put a 500% tariff on everybody who buys oil from Russia. You know what that is? That's about 40 or 50 countries buy oil and gas from Russia. A 500% tariff would be a shutdown of basically all commerce in the world. I mean, it's a terrible idea. What we should be doing instead is going to Russia and say, you want to get back in the banking system, you want to get rid of some sanctions, bombing Venezuela, and let's have a ceasefire and peace talks. I think we have the ability to offer stuff, but I think it's. I think you. We have so many sanctions already on these countries that really, to get to diplomacy and get to peace, the peace should be offering to remove sanctions and allow Russia back into the banking world. But they have to do something real. It has to be real ceasefire and has to really ultimately be a peace plan.

[Buck Sexton]

All right, I know it's a complicated topic, but I want to give you an opportunity to weigh in on tariffs and analyze this. Reports today that India might be willing to go to zero tariffs for American goods. It seems to me that there is dual arguments here. One is, you hear it from a lot of Trump people. Hey, we want to actually eliminate many of the tariffs and have more free trade. The other argument is we need to have more protectionist trade, potentially with China, other countries. How do you analyze this? What should we do? And bigger picture, how does it impact the big beautiful bill? I know that's a big question, but the tax cut bill that's currently making its way along with border security through.

[Rand Paul]

Congress right now, there's two camps on tariffs. They're all pro tariff in the Trump administration, but two camps. One is the Neanderthal camp. The Neanderthal camp says that we keep tariffs on until there's no more trade defense. Well, you think we're ever going to get to the point where Bangladesh buys as much from us as we buy from them? Same with Vietnam. We're a very, very rich country. And part of a trade deficit is when you're richer, you buy more stuff from other people than they buy. From you. So it's just, that's a ridiculous Neanderthal sort of argument. The other camp says, well, we want reciprocal agreements, we want fairness, but we'll, you know, we'd like to see lower tariffs. That's a more reasonable camp. And I've actually said, well, I'm not for the tariffs. And I think tariffs are misguided. If Trump is able to use as a negotiating technique the ability to lower tariffs with India and they get to a much lower level than where we started, I'll be the first to compliment him on that. But realize that the tariff bill or the sanction bill that Lindsey is proposing on Russia actually would tariff because India and China are the two biggest purchasers of oil and gas from Russia. And if you put a 500% tariff, that's going the opposite way. So I don't think we're going to zero if we pass this new Russia sanction bill. So it's a 500% tariff. A 500% tariff is an embargo. It's almost like a declaration of war, basically. So it's a really, really, really foolish notion. But if, you know, they come up with a deal with India, I will be the first to compliment the president and say, great job. You know, if he gets, if he gets lower tariffs, we'll see what happens. But I think that should be the goal really, with every country, and I would say even including China, because I think the moment that we have no trade with China is the moment that they become less predictable and potentially more militaristic.

[Buck Sexton]

Senator, one more for you only got about a minute, but I just wanted to hear you weigh in on this because I know government spending and our unsustainable debt is something been for a long time. The doge cuts. I'm hearing there's been some cuts actually made a lot of cuts advised. What do you think? Where are we on that?

[Rand Paul]

None of them actually count until they come back to Congress. So if you say you've cut spending, unless it's actually booked by Congress and Congress votes on it, it doesn't really. It hasn't been transmitted or accounted for. There's supposedly a rescission package. It can be voted on by a simple majority that's coming back to US of only 9 billion. That's a pittance. That's a rounding error. I'm for it, but I'll say send us more, please. We'll see. But right now we have. We've been hearing about that for two weeks and haven't seen that. And if that gets over here and the weak need Republicans won't vote for that, then I say Katie, bar the door. You might as well plan on a full scale bankruptcy of the country if the Congress can't even cut 9 billion.

[Buck Sexton]

On that note, Senator Rand Paul, thank you for being with us as always, sir. We appreciate it.

[Rand Paul]

Thank you.

[Buck Sexton]

Yeah, yeah. Hopefully, hopefully it doesn't come to that. He's right, by the way, on the numbers and he knows it. And always such a good conversation with the senator from Kentucky. Few nonprofit organizations can make this claim. 350,000 lives saved. But that's exactly what Preborn has done over the 20 years of its existence. The preborn clinics nationwide welcome pregnant moms into their facilities when that decision is being made. Life or abortion. And here's what preborn does. They welcome in all those moms. They give them love, support, attention, care and a free ultrasound. Because when that mom meets the tiny life growing inside of her. I just went through this with my own boy going to those ultrasound check ins with my wife. It's incredible seeing that little heartbeat. And when mom sees that little heartbeat, the discussion is so much easier for oh yeah, life for my unborn baby. Preborn is on saving lives day in and day out. This way they do it with just $28 expense per ultrasound. 28 bucks. You could save a life with $28 of donation to Preborn. Some of you have very fortunate financial situations and you can do $280 or even more. Whatever you can spare Preborn will use for this incredible mission of saving tiny babies. To donate securely, dial pound250 and say the keyword baby. That's pound250, say baby or visit preborn.com buck preborn.com b u c K Sponsored by Preborn.

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[Clay Travis]

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[Buck Sexton]

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And I'm Travis Holloway. Welcome to the wealthbreak podcast, a real conversation about finance.

Let's be honest, building wealth doesn't look the same for everyone.

I feel like sometimes being broke is.

[Rand Paul]

A cycle and that we might have.

[Buck Sexton]

To revisit that and we're not stopping at success stories.

[Clay Travis]

What happens when it doesn't go right? How do you cope with it?

[Buck Sexton]

Because wealth isn't just about money. It's about creating a life where you thrive and help others do the same.

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