Hour 1 - Epstein Files Fallout

Summary

The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show

Episode: Hour 1 – Epstein Files Fallout
Date: February 27, 2026
Podcast: iHeartPodcasts
Hosts: Clay Travis & Buck Sexton

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Episode Overview

This episode centers on the ongoing fallout from the unsealed Jeffrey Epstein files, high-profile depositions from Bill and Hillary Clinton, and the broader political implications. Clay and Buck break down the facts, challenge the prevailing narratives about the Epstein case, and question the motives behind the renewed focus—especially as it relates to attacks on Donald Trump. The conversation also explores related topics, including the nature of media coverage, moral panics, and how both political parties leverage scandals for their own ends.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Clinton Depositions and Epstein Fallout

• Main story: Bill Clinton’s testimony in the Epstein investigation; Hillary Clinton’s deposition the previous day ([00:00], [02:20], [18:55], [19:22]).
• Key Insight: Both hosts assert that, despite the spectacle, “nothing is going to come of this.” They suggest these depositions are highly unlikely to yield criminal charges due to lack of new evidence and Clinton’s legal savvy ([02:20], [03:52]).

“Bill Clinton is going to answer questions as a smart attorney would, denying he's already put out a public statement denying that he had any knowledge of it at all… basically impossible to prove that he did anything wrong.”
—Clay Travis ([02:20])

• Hillary’s Perspective: Hillary Clinton dismisses the deposition as repetitive and unproductive.
  • Quote:
    “I thought that they asked literally the same questions over and over again, which didn’t seem to me to be very productive toward the end.”
    —Hillary Clinton ([19:29])

2. The Political Weaponization of Epstein

• Democratic Strategy: The hosts argue that the Epstein files are being used primarily as a political tool to attack Donald Trump, not to address actual crimes ([02:20], [03:52], [06:33]).
• Comparison to Previous Scandals: The situation is likened to the “Steele dossier,” “Russia collusion,” and the Brett Kavanaugh accusations; the hosts see a pattern of using scandals to delegitimize conservatives without substantive evidence ([02:20], [03:52]).

“The Jeffrey Epstein case...is now the primary method by which Democrats are attacking Donald Trump. And it is illegitimate and it is not based in reality.”
—Clay Travis ([02:20])

• Trump’s DOJ vs. Biden’s DOJ:
  • Trump’s Department of Justice charged Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell ([07:59], [27:36]).
  • Biden’s DOJ did nothing with the files for four years—Democrats made no demands for further investigation during that period ([07:59], [09:10]).

“Trump's Department of Justice charged Epstein...Point two, Joe Biden's Department of Justice had all of these files for four years. Not one Democrat demanded that they release all these files.”
—Buck Sexton ([07:59])

3. Moral Panic, Media, and the Search for Villains

• Moral Panic Thesis: The hosts believe a “MeToo-like feeding frenzy” is underway, with reputations being destroyed over mere associations with Epstein, regardless of actual wrongdoing ([09:10], [10:33], [13:49]).
• Selective Outrage: They assert that many of the high-profile names in the Epstein files are Democrats, but media focus remains on Trump for political gain ([10:33]).
• False Equivalencies: Examples like Howard Lutnick’s lunch with Epstein and the “Pizzagate” references are discussed to illustrate how tenuous connections are misconstrued as evidence of criminality ([09:10], [22:46], [23:10]).

“There are a lot of people who are, you know, they're being essentially smeared for any association with Epstein whatsoever. I'm talking about a pretty de minimis one...”
—Buck Sexton ([10:33])

4. Distinguishing Unseemly from Criminal

• Proof v. Presumption:
  • The hosts emphasize that sexual misconduct and poor judgment should not be automatically equated with criminality if there is no direct evidence or charges ([03:52], [24:07], [26:35]).
  • They stress the need for clear distinctions and due process—even while calling Epstein himself an unequivocal criminal ([28:38], [30:58]).

“Epstein, clearly bad, clearly a pedophile. He's dead. That's that. Jillian Maxwell, clearly complicit, involved. She's in prison... Are there going to be charges against other people? Just show the evidence. Even we don't have the evidence, though. That's where it stops.”
—Clay Travis ([30:58])

5. Media Reluctance & Manufactured Delusion

• Fear of Blowback: The hosts point out that many media figures privately agree with their skepticism but “won’t say it publicly” for fear of being targeted themselves, referencing the Matt Damon MeToo incident ([12:36]).
• Right-Wing Overpromising: Some right-wing media personalities are criticized for overhyping the potential for bombshells in the Epstein files, leading to disappointment among their audience ([28:38]).

6. Callers’ Perspectives

• Caller Andrew: Expresses frustration that the Epstein story receives so much attention despite the lack of prosecutions.

  • “Can we just stop with the Epstein man? No minds are gonna change... No charges... Get the over it.” ([21:33])
  • Both hosts agree, but note they’re covering the story because of its prominence in the news cycle.

• Caller John: Criticizes the hosts for downplaying the content of the files, referencing blacked-out sections and “500 references to pizza” (a nod to Pizzagate conspiracy theories).

  • The hosts dismiss this as an example of conspiratorial thinking ([22:46], [23:10]).

• Caller Judy: Questions Bill Clinton’s trustworthiness, referencing his denial in the Monica Lewinsky scandal ([34:19]).

• Caller Vince: Predicts nothing will come of the Epstein files, likening it to past Clinton scandals ([35:58]).

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On the Political Weaponization:

  • “People who are Trump supporters are being used through the Epstein files to attack Trump.” —Buck Sexton ([06:33])

• On the Moral Panic:

  • “We're entering moral panic phase now with the Epstein thing.” —Clay Travis ([13:49])

• On the Difficulty of Prosecuting Powerful Figures:

  • “The idea that suddenly in a question and answer session, a guy is suddenly going to say, hey, you know what? You got me... It just. It doesn't happen.” —Buck Sexton ([35:08])

• Dismissing the Pizzagate Conspiracies:

  • “We're still there. Guys, come on now. You know what? This is a big boy show. We have big boy thoughts here.” —Clay Travis ([23:41])

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [00:00]: Episode Intro, Summary of Topics
• [02:20]: Bill Clinton’s Deposition & ‘Nothing Will Come of This’
• [03:52]: The Epstein Files as a Political Weapon
• [06:33]: Trump’s DOJ Charged Epstein; Biden’s DOJ Did Nothing
• [09:10]: Feeding Frenzy & the MeToo Comparison
• [10:33]: The Truth about Who Was Close to Epstein
• [13:49]: Moral Panic & Media Fear
• [18:55]: Hillary Clinton’s Deposition Perspective (audio)
• [21:33]: Caller Andrew—‘Can We Stop with Epstein?’
• [22:46]: Caller John—Pizzagate Reference & Host Rebuttal
• [24:07]: P. Diddy Analogy, Dangers of Guilt-by-Association
• [26:35]: On Adult Women, Evidence, and NDAs
• [28:38]: Unrealistic Expectations on the Right
• [30:58]: Kavanaugh Analogy; Final Points on Criminal Evidence
• [34:19]: Caller Judy—Clinton’s Trustworthiness
• [35:58]: Caller Vince—Predictions of a ‘Nothing Burger’

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Language & Tone

• Candid, direct, sometimes sarcastic or exasperated.
• Openly skeptical of government and media narratives.
• Willing to criticize both sides of the political aisle.
• Emphasis on transparency, facts, and legal distinctions.
• Uses humor and pop culture analogies to clarify points.

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Summary

This episode offers a critical, often skeptical, perspective on the political and media handling of the Epstein files as the Clintons testify in Congress. Clay and Buck dissect the lack of prosecutable evidence, the opportunistic use of the scandal to attack Trump, and the culture of moral panic that surrounds such stories. While acknowledging the real and serious crimes of Jeffrey Epstein, they emphasize the difference between unseemly association and illegal behavior, push back on conspiracy thinking, and encourage careful examination of evidence—reminding listeners that some stories become powerful tools for propaganda rather than justice. Callers and listeners offer a cross-section of reactions, from frustration with the endless coverage to more conspiratorial takes, which the hosts address head-on. The episode is a masterclass in political media analysis, peppered with humor and candor.

Transcript

[Clay Travis]

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human welcome in everybody. Friday edition of the Clay Travis and Buck Sexton show kicks off right now. Got some things to discuss with all of you. Got the continuing Epstein fallout of all the documents, including Bill Clinton's deposition. Now something we can discuss here. Hillary Clinton testifying Clay, just as a follow up, remember when they said that some photo got leaked? Apparently it was being recorded and so it just. The photo came out in advance of the recorded session. So it was really just a total tempest in a teapot. The whole thing was absurd. No surprise with any of that. More on the Trump USA Hockey relationship awesomeness for Americans who love America. But there are some, there are some sad, sad exclamation point malcontents out there who do not love fun America, gold medals, hockey. And they are annoyed about this. Including one athlete who only ever gets attention anymore for being one of those people who is a malcontent and cannot celebrate the greatness of USA USA without raining on the parade. A bit update on the NYPD snowball assault situation, which I have to say I am gratified that at least some people. Well, we are certainly. But the police commissioner was taking it very seriously. But as I warned you, I saw this one coming. It's not up to the police commissioner whether these individuals get punished or not. So we will give you the latest on that. Some Immigrations and Customs Enforcement updates and then Paramount takes over Warner Brothers. Clay, our media M and A expert is going to explain why this matters. This is one of those things where truly I don't even know. He knows. He could run the org chart for all these places from his head. Like he actually knows who's in charge and who owns what. I don't even. This is like Viacom, Discovery Channel, movie studio. I don't think it's gonna be. I don't know any of this stuff.

[Buck Sexton]

I think it's gonna be a big deal. We'll dive into that. But I think probably the number one story right now, as we were just talking about off air Buck, is Bill Clinton is testifying in the Epstein probe. Yesterday was Hillary, today is Bill Clinton. And so let me give you my take and then everybody can be angry at it. Nothing is going to come of this. Bill Clinton is going to answer questions as a smart attorney would, denying he's already put out a public statement denying that he had any knowledge of it at all, wagging his finger at all of us like he did with Monica Lewinsky. And it's going to be basically impossible. To prove that he did anything wrong. Let me tell you where this is going because I do think this is significant. And we'll open up the phone lines if people want to weigh in. The Jeffrey Epstein case, whatever you might have thought of it in the past, is now the primary method by which Democrats are attacking Donald Trump. And it is illegitimate and it is not based in reality. But they have used anger on the right and some anger on the left and they are just trying to channel that anger into Trump. And they are using Steele dossier like beef bs Russia collusion like bs Brett Kavanaugh accusation like BS to now attack President Trump who did nothing of any criminal nature at all. So that is where we are. You are.

[Clay Travis]

That's a very important observation I agree with. Nothing is going to come from this. I'm always the womp, womp guy here. I told you nothing's going to come. The JFK files, nothing is going to come of the Epstein files. Let me be clear. That's not the same as saying, I don't think that we should have transparency into them. Sure. But if there were something in there that could be charged, they would have charged it. They're, they're not going to release files that say, oh, here's this like super powerful rich guy who's actually an underage sex criminal. And we just didn't even think about this till now. Of course, there's nothing in there that they're going to charge. There are things that are unsavory. There are things that are make you think, you know, people have lost jobs and professorships and, you know, this is, there is fallout for sure, but the fallback fallout is for being a scumbag and to be clear, not for criminal behavior. People are suffering consequences now. And you can make of this what you will, but I do think there's a little bit of a moral panic going on where you have some people who are having to defend themselves on the Trump side of things who didn't do anything. Yeah, but because they're in the Epstein files and this has been turned into this, you know, giant conspiracy of global cover up and everything else, you know, you have to go with the facts and you have to be clear and precise on this clay to what you're saying. This is the primary way to that people who hate you and everything that Donald Trump is trying to accomplish for you is trying to cleave Trump from the base with this is their weapon. Right now they go, Epstein, Epstein, Epstein. And they say that this as if like Trump is Somehow the guy who is implicated, he's, if anything, he's implicated in being the one guy who's like, Epstein's a scumbag. Why aren't you guys doing more about this 15 years ago? And yet Clay Democrats recognize that this is now a tool that they can use through misrepresenting what's in there. And it also goes to, why did Trump not really want to get into this? Why did Trump look at some of this and realize, you know what's going to happen here? You're going to get a lot of, a lot of people are just going to come to conclusions about this that aren't in evidence. And then Democrats are going to say, see, it's all Trump or he's still covering it up or his name is in there. They're going to misrepresent this to suggest that Donald Trump is like the primary Epstein suspect number one, when that's the opposite of what the files actually shows about Donald Trump.

[Buck Sexton]

Yeah, I think what you said is important. People who are Trump supporters are being used through the Epstein files to attack Trump. And here's two big things that I think are here. And again, the story today is President Clinton, former President Clinton is testifying. Um, I don't think anything's going to come of this. I don't think anything's going to come of the Hillary Clinton mess. Was it unseemly? Yes. Was it criminal in nature? I don't think so. Based on everything that I've seen, I think it would be very hard to charge people criminally. Here are two big facts that I think are important that are not getting talked about enough. The Trump DOJ charged Epstein. I don't know why no one is talking about this. The Trump doj, these charges that came down against Jeffrey Epstein, they were brought by the Donald Trump Department of Justice in 2019, when Trump was still in office. Nobody was charging Epstein. Nothing was being done. The Trump DOJ charged him. This is after the, the, the, the plea, pleading guilty to the interaction with, I think it was like what Alan Dershowitz told us was a 17 and a half year old masseuse for sexual assault in that case in some way.

[Clay Travis]

So point one, Soliciting a prostitute was actually the charge. Soliciting an underage prostitute? Yeah.

[Buck Sexton]

Trump's Department of Justice charged Epstein is point one. Point two, Joe Biden's Department of Justice had all of these files for, for four years. Not one Democrat demanded that they release all these files. Not one Democrat demanded that there be any sort of public investigation surrounding Epstein at all. Again, Trump's DOJ charged Epstein in 2019, which led to his death when he was eventually in custody. Suicide. According to the FBI, Biden's Department of Justice had these files, kept them private for four years, did nothing with them, and. And no Democrat made any demands whatsoever. So why do I bring both of those things up? Do you think that if there had been evidence of criminal wrongdoing that Biden's DOJ wouldn't have charged Trump in a heartbeat? They tried to bankrupt and imprison him for the rest of his life.

[Clay Travis]

Can I just add to this? I don't want to stop your flow. They made up crimes to charge him with on other things. You don't think that they would love to nail him as a sex criminal? They would have killed MAGA as a movement in one fell swoop? No, of course they didn't have anything on him.

[Buck Sexton]

So again, Trump's DOJ charged Epstein. Biden's DOJ had these files private for four years. Not one Democrat said anything. I think you need to be smart, and I think you need to ask yourself, wait a minute. Why now do all these Democrats claim that they care so much about Jeffrey Epstein when they didn't say one word when Biden's Department of Justice had all these files for four years? Because Trump is right. It's being used as a way to attack Trump, and they're using a lot of Trump supporters as the fuel under which they are making these attacks. I just think might make some people uncomfortable. We'll open up phone lines, but that is the reality of where we are right now. I also think, Buck, we're dealing with a me too like feeding frenzy. I'll give you an example. Howard Lutnick. Whatever you think about him, and I don't know Howard Lutnick personally, he took his family on a boat and his kids to have lunch with Jeffrey Epstein in the Caribbean. You might not like that, but the idea that he's in some way engaged in some sort of nefarious underage sex ring when he took his own children and his wife to have lunch in the. On the Caribbean island when he was on a boat in the Caribbean, this, if your name is in there, it's a feeding frenzy, like the MeToo thing, where people don't actually look at the accusations and details themselves.

[Clay Travis]

But also, this is why the dis. The dishonesty of Democrats about this, the Epstein list, when you're really looking at who knew about his criminal conviction and that he was a scumbag and that there was stuff here because they spent a lot of time with him and they really liked him. It is a who's who of Democrats. It's a who's who of Democrats on the Epstein list. And all they are trying to do is go, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump. They are running a propaganda op, my friends. This is why you have to get to manufacturing delusion because I explain in the propaganda chapter exactly the tactics that they are using here. It doesn't matter what the facts are, it doesn't matter what's really in the files. They are going fire hose of falsehood. This is all about Trump and Clay. To your point, this is very important. They are setting Trump's own supporters after him and after his people on this for, for months now. And you know, we've been fielding a lot of the angry emails and calls too. First of all, as if like we're, we're two guys sitting here in T shirts talking about things like I have no power to release DOJ files. I'm glad that they've released the files. But I want to point something out now. What's happened is that there are a lot of people who are, you know, they're being essentially smeared for any association with Epstein whatsoever. I'm talking about a pretty de minimis one. I mean, imagine in the P. Diddy case, think of all the people P. Diddy, P. Diddy, he was doing was disgusting. He's a disgraceful deviant who's now in prison. There are some people that knew and that participated and that were probably complicit in his crimes. And there were a lot of people who went to his fancy parties. Is everybody who is in P. Diddy's orbit equally guilty? No, of course not. But what you're seeing with the Epstein thing is a lot of selective focusing of attention on Trump, on Lutnick, on irrespective of what the facts actually show. And I think this is what Trump was concerned about all along and he was right.

[Buck Sexton]

All of that is true. I would add in the reason why a lot of people aren't being honest with you across a lot of media about this is because much like in me too, if you speak out, a lot of people are afraid that they're going to become targets. So there's a lot of people out there who agree with 100% of everything that Buck and I just said in media and they won't tell it to you because they're afraid that suddenly everybody's going to target them. Much like in me Too. I'll give you an example. The Matt Damon one was a good one. Remember when Matt Damon came out and said, hey, you know, there's a big difference between grabbing some woman's butt at a party and, and rape. And we should keep in mind that every accusation in me too is not the same. And remember, he got ripped to shreds by people in Hollywood who said, oh, no, no, no, there is no difference at all. Like, like, wait a minute. You know, the whole reason we have a criminal justice system is because there is a difference between grabbing a girl's butt at a party and actual rape. And Matt Damon tried to say that in the middle of me too. And, and they ripped him to shreds for it. And a lot of other people just said, I'm not going to touch it because I'm not going to get targeted.

[Clay Travis]

And this, we're, we're entering moral panic phase now with the Epstein thing. If you want more trans. You know, I don't know what transparency even would mean at this point. I mean, there's millions of. Have people. Have people wanting more transparency, even read 10 of the files that have been released. I mean, that's another question here. But you know, if you want more answers, that's. I respect. If you want to know how the DOJ screwed this up so badly the first time around, meaning the release of the documents, that was a total. And we called them out for that. It was a, you know, a PR disaster. But there's a difference in a PR disaster and being a pedo protector, which is what. And I'm seeing people on our. At least ostensibly on the right who are saying this about some of the top Trump people. And I'm, I'm just like. And we, you know, we know some of these people, you know, if you. This is what I was trying to say. Even when there was all that heat, remember, there was all that heat on our friend Dan Bongino when he was doing this. And we're like, no, guys, he's trying. I promise you he's trying. If you think Dan Bongino is protecting Pedos, you're a moron. Ok? He's not. And I just have to speak honestly to people about this. If you think that's happening, you are in the midst of a manufactured delusion. OK? 15 years, OK? Trust me, like the, the last guy who's going to, you know, bend the knee on something like that when it comes to protecting kids. Crazy. But people are. And Trump. Oh, I just, I start to lose

[Buck Sexton]

with this so no, but I think it's important. So the Clinton thing is going on. We'll open up phone lines. You can disagree with everything we just said. We are right. And I understand that the Trump administration has not been perfect. Pam Bondi the biggest mishap of year one was Pam Bondi trying to answer questions about this. And there are lots of people in media who have tried to convince a lot of people that there's some sort of pedophile ring that's running around and everything else. The evidence shows that there were a lot of rich guys that wanted access to 20 year old models. I mean that's like 90% of the women.

[Clay Travis]

Doesn't make you a bad, evil criminal person. If you want to be with a 25 Victoria, 25 year old Victoria's Secret model. You're like 90% of, you know, single guys in America.

[Buck Sexton]

Okay.

[Clay Travis]

That there's nothing wrong with that. You might think it's skeevy if you're a married guy or something that's different. But you know, we just need to have these distinctions. All right, I know. Take the calls. Let's go. More than 50%.

[Buck Sexton]

Let's go.

[Clay Travis]

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[Producer Greg]

Making America great again isn't just one man, it's many. The Team 47 podcast Sundays at noon Eastern in the Clay and Buck podcast feed. Find it on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Buck Sexton]

Welcome back in quick turn here we will take your calls. It is Friday and we will have a ton of reaction from all of you. You don't have to agree. Producer Greg says we are Flooded already with talkbacks. Every line is ringing simultaneously. 800-282-2882.

[Clay Travis]

Can I just say, anyone who's going to call in or whatever and say, can we stop with the Epstein stuff? We've been trying. We've been trying for months. We've been telling you that nothing is going to happen. Nothing is going to come out of this. People are so angry about this. When you tell them what is true, they want to be told what people were told for a long time before, which was the whole big ring of evildoers is going to come down. That's not happening.

[Buck Sexton]

No doubt. But we will take your calls. We'll react again. Bill Clinton in a deposition right now, as we speak, relating to Epstein. So it is leading every news story out there. Look, we want to tell all of you, if you. You love sports and I love sports. Many of you love sports. Been a crazy week for sports since the US Men won the gold medal and much of sports media lost its mind. You can get hooked up right now with prize picks. You play $5, you get $50 in your account. Play $5, you get $50, you can play everywhere. California, Texas, Florida, New York, Minnesota, Montana, all over the country, every direction you go. Prize picks in all 50 states is legal and able to roll. That's prizepix.com Code Clay. Prizepix.com Code clay for $50 in all 50 states when you play $5.

[Clay Travis]

All right, welcome back into Clay and Buck. So we're talking about the things going on, including the. Look, you're asking why we're talking about it. Because there's testimony on Capitol Hill about this right now. People demanded this. They want this. Okay, so now we have Hillary up there, and here she is telling everybody her version of what went. What went on at this deposition. This is cut six. You could hear it from Hillary herself. Go for it.

[Hillary Clinton]

Do you believe this was a fair hearing and do you still want to

[Buck Sexton]

testify publicly even though you gave this deposition?

[Hillary Clinton]

Well, I'm not going to do it again. You know, they had a chance to do it in public, and I wish they had done it in public. And I think they're making the wrong decision, avoiding doing it in public. I thought it was very repetitive. I thought that they asked literally the same questions over and over again, which didn't seem to me to be very productive toward the end. You know, there were other questions that were totally off subject. So if they are going to fulfill their responsibilities to literally investigate the investigations, which is what they originally said was the scope of their work. I think they could have spent the day more productively.

[Buck Sexton]

Okay, that is Hillary.

[Clay Travis]

They didn't lay a glove on her is the point here, folks. Okay, there's. Does she sound like she's rattled after this? Does she sound like, oh, they really got the big one. They really finally nailed me, you know, this. Well, let's, let's keep, you know, we just keep going. More, more Capitol Hill. People demand it. People demand it. So we'll do more of these depositions.

[Buck Sexton]

Look, I, I think, well, we got a bunch of callers that want to weigh in and a bunch of talk back. All right, all right. This is, I think a good, good email guy. Epstein is now the number one tool to defeat Republicans in the midterms. We won't know till the elections are over, but the Democrats will pound it for the next six months. The problem, Republicans really have no way to effectively fight this big problem for Trump in the midterms. Democrats know it. I actually don't. I, I do agree that Democrats are going to try to pound it because they have sensed vulnerability. But the reality is again, Trump's DOJ charged Epstein and Biden's DOJ had these files and didn't release them for four years and nobody talked about it. I would just hammer that over and over and over again. Let's see Andrew in Arizona. K F, Y I G. Is he cursing? Do we block these out? I don't know. Let's see Andrew.

[Caller Andrew]

I get why you guys are talking about it today because Hillary and Bill. But can we just stop with the Epstein man? No minds are gonna change on either side. So it doesn't matter. No charges like you said, will ever be brought. Why do we keep bringing it up? There's a bunch of sick in there. Yeah, we get it. Get the over it.

[Clay Travis]

I mean, I got to say I agree with Andrew. I think, I think Andrew is correct.

[Buck Sexton]

Andrew is an astute political analyst.

[Clay Travis]

I think Andrew sees this as. Andrew, I'm with you. And if I could curse on the air and not get a big fine, I probably would too. But we, the demands. And you're saying, look, we're not choosing for this to lose the, to run the news cycle today because we're also, you have a former presidential candidate, a former two term president Bill Clinton are being forced to testify about this. Okay. That's what's going on right now in D.C. this is a politics and current events for a show. This is happening right now. So here we are.

[Buck Sexton]

Here's the flip side, John. In Minneapolis. He's furious with us. This is cut. Hi, guys.

[Caller John]

What in the F are you talking about? Like, there's, there isn't much in there. There's a world of things in there. Let's start with all the blacked out things and then you can start moving on to like, I don't know, the 500 references to pizza and stuff like that. Are you pretending this stuff just doesn't exist in the world? It's, it's kind of maddening to hear.

[Clay Travis]

What the hell does that even mean? I'm just, I'm really like. Just tell us what you're saying. John, we. I love that you listen to the show and I appreciate that you give us your time, but I need you to say things to us that I can understand what you're trying. There's 500 references to pizza.

[Buck Sexton]

I think he's trying to say a Pizzagate connection. I mean, look, this is every email that they have from, from Epstein and a lot of times he's just talking about pizza, man. I just have to tell you.

[Clay Travis]

You said pizza. I know he's referring to pizza, but what, so what's this? There's, there's still some huge conspiracy that there was like a child sex ring in the parlor of or in the basement of a pizzeria in the D.C. area and that the global elites have been covering that. Like, does somebody really believe this still? We're still there. Guys, come on now. You know what? This is a big boy show. We have big boy thoughts here. We don't have to agree, but we have big boy thoughts on the big boy show.

[Buck Sexton]

There is, based on everything that I have seen, no actual charges that can be brought against anybody. And to buck's point, I actually think this is a good one and nobody talks about it. If every email that P. Diddy sent over the last 15 years was suddenly released, every somewhat famous person in Hollywood probably was interacting with P. Diddy or his agents. And P. Diddy has been convicted of a variety of crimes. He got not convicted of of several of them. I don't know when he's going to be out of, of prison. But being in. And you and I are not in it. So again, I think we're kind of.

[Clay Travis]

We're, we're, we're, we're clear of like

[Buck Sexton]

the only people in media that are not named in the.

[Clay Travis]

There are people in right wing media who are very much not clear. I'm not going to name any names because I want to play that game, but I'm just Saying it's not like there are people that, you know, they're in there. That's all I'm saying. But we're not in there.

[Buck Sexton]

So there are no crimes that can be prosecuted. And I just, I get what this story is. The Epstein story to me is Jeffrey Epstein realized that he had a modeling agency. And if he had constant access to attractive women, it was going to help him build connections across all of the, all of the powerful worlds of media and business and everything else. And guess what? He was right. And that's one of the coins of the realm that he used was he was a inveterate networker who wanted to find ways to be connected to powerful people. And the way that he found to do it to make more money, to be more connected was to, if you read about it, he had access to a modeling agency and a lot of these women who were of age. He was pimping out in many ways to rich and powerful guys.

[Clay Travis]

But again, pimping out may actually even be too, too, because it's never been asserted that he ever used force or threats against any of these women or

[Buck Sexton]

was directly paid for sexual.

[Clay Travis]

And again, we're talking about the adults, to be clear, we're talking about adult women here. Okay, 18 plus women that he was involved with. He never threatened or, or physically abused any of the adult women. As far as I understand. If I'm wrong, we'll correct that.

[Buck Sexton]

And, and what we would say also is the women who are alleging that they were victims of crime. I think this is important. I've talked about it before, and this is me having been, and still being a lawyer who has been involved in cases like these in the past. These women were paid hundreds of millions of dollars by Jeffrey Epstein's estate by different banks that help to facilitate the movement of cash associated with Jeffrey Epstein. And they are able at any point in time to name people who committed crimes against them, and they have refused to do so. My argument would be if, if to anybody out there, if someone commits a crime against you, you actually are doing a disservice by not naming that person or those persons because they're likely to commit crimes against other people. So my argument here is, and people say, well, they signed NDAs and you can't sign.

[Clay Travis]

They're unenforceable. They're unenforceable and everybody knows it.

[Buck Sexton]

So the NDA argument doesn't pan out. Elon Musk has actually said, if you're concerned about legal cost, he has said, I will cover the legal cost for Anyone that wants to bring lawsuits. So this story, when you actually unpack it, there are a lot of people that have come to believe a lot of things that there is not evidence for. And my point is, again, I think this is important. I want to circle back to it. Trump's DOJ charged Epstein and Jelaine Maxwell. Jelaine Maxwell was convicted because of charges brought by Trump 1.0's DOJ. And again, if you think Democrats have the best interest of the country at heart here, Biden's DOJ had these files. They kept them private for four years. They did nothing to release them. Suddenly Trump is in office and Democrats are arguing that Trump is to blame, that he's done something wrong with Epstein. Again, it's me too. Russiagate all over again.

[Clay Travis]

There's some blame here on the right. This is true. There's some blame on the right and blame on Trump for this too, for I think over promising on the swift and powerful wave of justice that would come along with these revelations, et cetera. I think a lot of people feel like they were. And this is, again, I agree with this sentiment. And there are people in right wing media who are not, you know, pedo protectors. But I think they got, and I'll say this, I believe that there was a much broader Epstein conspiracy. I did believe that. And I still think that there are things that we don't know. And I still think that there are guys who were in the Epstein orbit who probably did cross that line into illegality, but we do not have proof. And it is immoral to ruin a person's life, never mind lock them up for something as serious as that or to do that for any reason. Unless you have proof, there's a reason. We have a, we had plenty of proof on Jeffrey Epstein. They had proof of Epstein just being a pedophile based on all the child abuse exploitation material they found in him. He, he was going to get 20 years to life just on the stuff that they found in his safe, never mind the actual physical acts that he had done with underage girls. So we know that Epstein, everyone agrees he was a pedophile, a true pedophile. Everyone agrees he was a very bad guy, an evil guy. There are people that covered their eyes a little too much and spent a little too much time around him. That's gross. And if you want to fire a person for that or not associate them, that's fine. That's not a crime. And these are distinctions that still matter. It still does matter. If someone broke the law or not. If you want more transparency on this, or rather you want to know why is Trump's doj. Why are there some things that are blacked out? They have said it is because of victim protection. It is because of personal details. Because you're also now at risk of having people. You mentioned Howard Lutnick. Howard Lutnick, from everything we've seen, did less than nothing wrong. Ok. I mean, Howard Lutnick, it's preposterous that. But they drag his name into this. They're trying to destroy people's reputations who don't deserve it. And I. You saw some of this with the Kavanaugh stuff, too.

[Buck Sexton]

It was.

[Clay Travis]

Oh, you're protecting a rapist. No, actually, Brett Kavanaugh, based on all the actual facts, evidence, or really the lack of any facts, evidence against him, clearly was not a rapist, clearly had done nothing wrong. Epstein, clearly bad, clearly a pedophile. He's dead. That's that. Jillian Maxwell, clearly complicit, involved. She's in prison. Are there going to be charges against other people? Just show the evidence. Even we don't have the evidence, though. That's where it stops.

[Buck Sexton]

Even the charges that have been brought in England are about leaking information. They're not about sex.

[Clay Travis]

That's just political cover. You know, that's cya politically has nothing to do with sex crimes for Andrew. Because Andrew, and this is the thing you could say to people and they completely. Andrew, even, first of all, he says that he didn't do it and, you know, there's actually no proof that he did it. To be clear, it is a. You know, other than there's the accusation from the woman, but they don't have the proof that he did the thing that they said that he did. And he's never been charged with that.

[Buck Sexton]

Yeah.

[Clay Travis]

Why hasn't he been charged with that? Everybody? Well, do they have the evidence? Show the evidence. What is the evidence? An accusation alone is usually not enough to throw someone in prison for 20 years.

[Buck Sexton]

We'll take your calls. We'll take some of your talkbacks. Again, one of my frustration, Clay, is

[Clay Travis]

just, you know, we might go to war with Iran this weekend and people just like, what do you want us to do? Like what? These members of Congress are like, we're going to really rake Hillary over the coals. No, you're not. Hillary's going to smoke you. Hillary is. No, no spring chicken. You know, she's not new to this game. You're going to what? She's going to be like, you know, What? You're right. I was right there with Ghislaine trafficking women. What is the point of putting her into that position? They're going to get nothing, and they got nothing.

[Buck Sexton]

I agree. And I think it's likely to be the case with Bill Clinton, too. But he is under oath right now, so we will see what ends up coming out of that. But that is the lead story everywhere. We'll take some of your talkbacks. Our greatest ally, Middle East, Israel, far and away. And right now they are.

[Clay Travis]

We're.

[Buck Sexton]

Buck just mentioned it. We're potentially going to have a war with Iran. We'll see what ends up happening there. But right now, a lot of you are trying to help protect people who are in the Holy Land. It can be a small gift, like groceries for an older widow. I saw what they do. They do food banks, they do armored vehicles. They. They build new bomb shelters. That's what the IFCJ does. Because life in Israel is perpetually potentially dangerous. And a lot of people out there, Christians, Jews, they want to do everything they can to try to keep people in the Holy Land safe. By making a donation today to the International Fellowship of Christians and Jews, you're empowering the IFCJ to help those in Israel that need it. Learn how you can bless Israel, be blessed in return. Visit IFCJ.org Again, that's IFCJ.org Geek out

[Producer Greg]

with the guys on the Sunday Hang with Clay and Buck podcast, a new episode every Sunday. Find it on the iHeart app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Buck Sexton]

Welcome back in play. Travis Buck Sexton Show. Okay, let's take some of your calls. We'll roll through. It is Friday. Open lines. A lot of talk backs coming as well. Judy in Kentucky, what you got for us?

[Caller Judy]

Hi, Clay. I just, I haven't heard anyone remember Clinton when he was president, standing and saying that he had not had any relations with Monica Lewinsky, the young female. I just don't trust him with anything he has to say about this. That's. That's all I've got to say.

[Clay Travis]

Well, Judy, look, we agree with you that he's, he's a, he's a. Look, Bill Clinton is probably a sex addict and is a. An inveterate liar. Is that the right word? Inveterate liar?

[Buck Sexton]

I think that works out there.

[Clay Travis]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's no doubt about that. The point is, what do you think Bill Clinton's gonna all of a sudden get religion and start telling the truth about this stuff in a, in a deposition with members of Congress.

[Caller Andrew]

Right.

[Clay Travis]

I mean, that's. That's why I'm just.

[Buck Sexton]

I used. I've said this before. I used to do sexual harassment investigations. I would go, listen, and sometimes the women I thought were telling the truth, sometimes they were not every woman was accusing a man. I interviewed lots of men. Do you know how many times the men told me that they had sexually harassed the women? Buck? Zero. They never like the idea. And I get it. But the idea that suddenly in a question and answer session, a guy is suddenly going to say, hey, you know what? You got me. I committed. You know, something that's going to cost me my job. Or in the case of Bill Clinton here, he's going to admit under oath something that could lead to criminal charges. It just. It doesn't happen. Vince in Florida, what you got for us?

[Caller Vince]

Yeah, Clay. Clay and Buck. I listen to you guys every day. You're great. So I retired from Department of Homeland Security. And from all my knowledge and investigations, I could tell you this Epstein file is going to be a big nothing burger. There's going to be no prosecutions. Just like if we all recall Hillary Clinton destroying the server in her basement, busting up cell phones. What happened there? Nothing. Benghazi. What happened? Nothing. So, you know, and Bill getting up there, the definition of is is.

[Clay Travis]

Oh, yeah. Well, you're right. I mean, in my opinion, it's. Buck. I think you're right, sir. So thank you. This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.