Hour 1 - Twist of Irony

Summary

The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show

Episode: Hour 1 – Twist of Irony
Date: January 6, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this lively first hour, Clay Travis and Buck Sexton discuss recent political upheaval surrounding Minnesota Governor Tim Walz, the U.S.-led operation in Venezuela, and broader geopolitical shifts. They tackle themes of political authenticity, masculinity narratives within the Democratic Party, post-coup fallout in Venezuela, U.S. territorial ambitions, Cuban security forces, and the resilience of authoritarian regimes. The conversation mixes serious commentary with their signature banter and humor, making for an engaging dive into unfolding news.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Fall of Tim Walz: Democratic Miscalculation

[00:34–07:29]

• Political Downfall:
  Clay and Buck open by dissecting the dramatic implosion of Tim Walz’s political future after his vice-presidential candidacy and exposure to the Minnesota fraud scandal.

  • Clay argues Walz would have survived the local scandal and won reelection for governor if he hadn't been elevated onto the national stage ([00:34]).
  • Buck describes Walz’s fate as a “twist of irony," noting that attempts to present him as an emblem of “American masculinity” backfired ([02:13]).

• Authenticity & Masculinity:

  • Clay lampoons Democrats for their “zoo animal” approach to voters—trying to engineer a candidate formula rather than offering real connection or authenticity ([03:04]).
  • Discussion of how authenticity (even if unconventional, e.g., Ron DeSantis being labeled a “nerd”) matters more than image ([03:57]).

Notable Quote:

“The problem is what they missed is authenticity matters more than anything.” — Clay Travis, [03:57]

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2. Banter: Masculinity, Home Repair, and Stereotypes

[07:29–09:34]

• Clay and Buck joke about which politicians would be best at home improvement (Gretchen Whitmer vs. Tim Walz) and share personal stories about lacking handyman skills.
• Transition into Buck’s (self-deprecating) claim that his cautious driving makes him unsuited to espionage chases ([08:31]).

Memorable Exchange:

Clay: “Gretchen Whitmer might be better at home repair than either you or I.” ([07:52])
Buck: “She definitely is... I have to go in my free time and shoot lots of guns and do tactical training on the weekends to... make up for my inability to change a light bulb and driving like a little old lady.” ([08:31])

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3. Venezuela: American Presence & Territorial Fantasies

[09:34–13:49]

• Americans in Venezuela:
  Discuss estimates of how many U.S. citizens remain in Venezuela, referencing the Grok AI tool and sports figures like Ronald Acuña staying there in the off-season ([10:13]).
• Territorial Expansion Jokes:
  Buck jokes about Venezuela as a potential U.S. territory—“like Guam but a lot bigger and with a lot more oil”—and speculates on U.S. motives and historical precedents such as Ulysses Grant wanting to annex the Dominican Republic ([10:44–13:49]).

Notable Quote:

“Maybe Venezuela becomes like Guam, but a lot bigger and with a lot more oil.” — Buck Sexton, [10:44]

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4. U.S. Control & The Case for Cuba

[13:49–15:16]

• Clay urges revisiting U.S. territorial acquisition of Cuba, reviving ideas of making it a protectorate similar to Puerto Rico or the U.S. Virgin Islands. He argues this would end communism there and restore freedoms ([13:49]).

• Buck lists the benefits for current U.S. territories—military protection, infrastructure, access to markets—framing it as “not a bad deal” ([14:49]).

• Both agree such arrangements are preferable to the status quo.

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5. Greenland: Who Should Control It?

[17:17–18:42]

• Denmark’s Claim to Greenland:
  Buck introduces a segment with Stephen Miller questioning Denmark’s control of Greenland on CNN. Clay and Buck both humor Miller’s argument that America could provide a higher standard of living, suggesting Greenlanders should get to choose their affiliation ([18:16–18:42]).
• Joking skepticism about Denmark’s colonial claim over Greenland.

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6. Venezuela Coup Aftermath: Cuban Security Forces

[21:11–22:30]

• Cuban Bodyguards:
  Clay notes reports that 32 Cuban security forces loyal to Maduro were killed, highlighting how their elite reputation stemmed from KGB training and Cold War experience ([21:11]).
• Buck analyzes: Cubans are “mercenaries for hire” but “ain’t Delta Force, that’s for damn sure” ([21:11]).

Notable Quote:

"They've been these mercenaries for hire for a long time, but they ain't Delta Force, that’s for damn sure." — Buck Sexton, [21:11]

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7. U.S. Operations and Internal Venezuelan Dynamics

[22:30–28:04]

• Speculation on U.S. Intelligence:
  Clay muses whether Venezuela’s VP may have aided the coup, suggesting her public anti-U.S. stance might mask secret cooperation ([22:30]).

  • Buck counters that the real lesson is fear: “We can get you in your sleep... in the blink of an eye. We can do that to anybody.” ([23:49])

• Lessons from Iraq:
  Buck draws parallels to Iraq’s “de-Ba’athification,” arguing the U.S. won’t repeat the error of excluding all experienced officials. Instead, the U.S. is likely to use economic leverage and work with existing actors ([25:10–26:11]).

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8. Geopolitical Realignment & Endurance of Authoritarianism

[28:04–33:12]

• Clay sees hints of a major global realignment against left-wing and authoritarian regimes, likening Trump to Reagan in emboldening dissidents and destabilizing adversaries ([28:04]).
• Buck is more cautious, citing stubbornness of autocratic rulers and historic examples (e.g., Syria’s Assad, North Korea). He argues dictators focus on sheer survival even as regimes collapse around them ([30:28]).

Notable Quotes:

“What we are seeing is a major geopolitical realignment...” — Clay Travis, [28:04]
"All they really focus on is staying in power." — Buck Sexton, [32:25]

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9. Safe Havens for Dictators: Where Would You Flee?

[33:09–34:29]

• Banter over ideal countries for exile with no U.S. extradition treaty (“Russia, China, North Korea”), riffing on the lifestyle, food, and weather.
• Jokes about Maduro’s choices and references to the realities of global diplomatic leverage ([33:09–34:29]).

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10. Lighter Fare and Show Notes

[37:07–38:25]

• Plug for their YouTube channel, where Clay is teased for his Santa Claus-esque white beard and Caribbean tan.
• Personal banter about family, childhood memories, and aging.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Buck, on Walz and political irony:

  "In a twist of irony, the guy who Democrats put forward to be the avatar of American masculinity is losing his political future..." ([02:13])

• Clay, on political calculation:

  "Democrats, by and large, look at voters like zoo animals..." ([03:04])

• On authenticity (Clay):

  "The problem is what they missed is authenticity matters more than anything." ([03:57])

• On U.S. projection of power (Buck):

  "We can get you in your sleep, surrounded by the best of the best, and have you...transferred into a federal penitentiary hellhole...in the blink of an eye. We can do that to anybody." ([23:49])

• On autocrats' focus (Buck):

  "All they really focus on is staying in power." ([32:25])

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Key Timestamps

• 00:34 — Opening discussion on Tim Walz and Democratic strategies
• 02:13 — “Twist of irony” for Tim Walz
• 03:04 — Democrats' misunderstanding of “masculinity” and voters
• 07:29 — Comparisons of Walz, Whitmer, and DeSantis’ authenticity
• 09:34 — Number of Americans in Venezuela and regional banter
• 10:44 — “Venezuela as the next Guam”
• 13:49 — U.S. protectorate argument for Cuba
• 18:16 — Greenland and American “Manifest Destiny”
• 21:11 — Cuban security forces’ collapse in Venezuela
• 23:49 — U.S. demonstrates reach (post-coup)
• 25:10 — Iraq lessons for post-coup Venezuela
• 28:04 — Clay projects a global realignment against authoritarianism
• 32:25 — Buck’s realism: dictators survive against odds

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Tone and Style

Clay and Buck blend political analysis with irreverence, analogies, and personal anecdotes. Their discussion ranges from pointed critiques of political strategy to comic asides about holiday beards and bumbling home repairs, always maintaining a conversational, even playful, rapport.

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For Those Who Missed the Episode:
This hour provides a thoroughly opinionated, entertaining, and informative breakdown of current politics, geopolitics, and the personalities driving major headlines. Clay and Buck’s approachable mix of detail, humor, and speculation makes complex issues—like coup dynamics and American foreign policy—both digestible and debatably fun.

Transcript

[Buck Sexton]

This is an iHeart podcast, Guaranteed Human. As a consumer, you decide which companies succeed with your purchasing power. PureTalk wants to say a heartfelt thank you for choosing them. Because of you, PureTalk had a record breaking year. You've helped them donate over half a million dollars to America's Warrior Partnership to help prevent veteran suicide. You also help provide 1000 hand sewn made in America flags to veterans. And you're supporting U.S. jobs by choosing a proudly American company from the Pure Talk family. Thank you for your trust and God bless America.

[Clay Travis]

Welcome in Tuesday edition. Clay Travis, BUCK SEXTON show. We've got a fun one headed your way as we continue to discuss the fallout of Maduro being seized in Venezuela. We are expecting for there to be, I believe, another another out there of the Tim Walls press conferen. His political career is in shambles. We will discuss all of that with you and more. We'll also open up phone lines. We didn't take very many calls. Your talkbacks as well to allow you to ask the questions that you may have surrounding everything having to do with the Venezuela situation as well as maybe the Tim Walls continued fallout because if Venezuela hadn't happened, the Minnesota fraud story and the, and the fact that Tim Walls has gone from what, 240,000 votes away from being vice president, a heartbeat away from the presidency, to basically having his complete political career be over. And I, I don't know about you, Buck, on this, but let's kind of dive in. Do you agree with me that if Kamala hadn't picked Tim Walz, he probably runs for governor again, gets elected? People don't really pay that much attention to the Minnesota fraud situation just because Minnesota is not typically the focal point of any major national news stories. And yes, the fraud would have still existed. It would have been indefensible, but it wouldn't have been out there in the public arena to such an extent. And so Tim Walls would have gotten reelected and he would have continued right on with the path that he was already on.

[Buck Sexton]

Yes, in a twist of irony, the guy who Democrats put forward to be the avatar of American masculinity is losing his political future after one, people questioning whether he was a good avatar of that masculinity broadly mocking him. And two, he is a household name now because of his short and ill fated run. And therefore the wild corruption that has been unearthed in Minneapolis is a much bigger story because the governor of Minneapolis, Tim Walsh, is a national figure, which he would not have been before. I mean, if I sat here right now and asked everybody, if you don't live in the state of Idaho, who's the governor of Idaho? Everybody, everybody knows the governor of Minnesota, though. No, by the way, no shade to the governor of Idaho.

[Clay Travis]

I think he's a Republican, but I'm with you. I don't know who the governor of Idaho is. He might be listening right now. We love Idaho and we've always been a big fan of your work, Celebrate your entire catalog. In fact, you know, when you look at that, I think it's also emblematic. Did you send out a, a tweet? I think I saw where you're just like, what if Democrats are just horribly wrong about everything? Like, Yep. And, and I do think there's a lot of truth to that. But to me, the Tim Walls entire experience is indicative of the fact that Democrats, by and large, look at voters like zoo animals. They have to go out in the wild. They look at men and they think, you know, in the same way. Was it Diane Fosse who was, I think, one of the great primatologists, if.

[Buck Sexton]

That'S a word, talking about gorillas, gorillas in the mist. And there was Jane Goodall with the chimpanzees.

[Clay Travis]

Yes. They, they would go out and they would sit in the, in the, in the wild, and they would observe what the chimpanzees did, what the gorillas did. And in an effort to understand how their society works, Democrats now are like that with men. They, they, they, I, I, I'm not kidding about this. They sit there and they, and they've got their notepad out and they, and they say, you know what we need? We need a older white guy who wears cowboy boots and car heart and knows how to go out and walk around with a gun. And he used to coach high school football. And you put all this together and it's like they're trying to create an AI avatar of what they think is going to be a man who connects with other men. The problem is what they missed is authenticity matters more than anything. You look, there are nerds out there who are not the foundation of, I think, typically masculine, you know, bigger, stronger, faster men don't aspire necessarily to be like them. That can be really, really popular. Right. I mean, I would say, no offense to him, Ron DeSantis, a little bit of a nerd. Right. And, and, and I don't mean that.

[Buck Sexton]

In a meatball, as they called him. What was with the meatball? Was that some kind of weird underhanded or backhanded, like, Italian American thing? Like why are they hitting him on Meatball? That never made sense to me.

[Clay Travis]

I met one of Ron DeSantis fraternity buddies over. Over break, during. And we were talking, and he said, you know, he loves Ron DeSantis with every fiber in his being. He said, the guy is the best at just doing jobs. If you need a guy who's just going to build you a shelf in the frat house, Ron DeSantis will build a shelf in the frat house that will be there for generations. He's like, if you want a guy that's going to go out and pound a bunch of beers and try to pick up girls, not Ron DeSantis's thing. And so he's like, you know, the going on the campaign trail, which is in many ways kind of a seductive thing. Right? You got to seduce voters, convince them. The popularity contest, yes, it's not necessarily his thing. But every guy out there listening to us right now, you're saying to yourself, you know what? Ron DeSantis, I wish he could be governor of Florida for the next 20 years. He's done maybe the greatest job as a governor that. That Florida has ever seen. And. And so I guess what I'm getting at is Democrats don't understand men to such an extent that they don't understand the wide range of masculinity that I think Republicans can end up supporting. And so they toss out this fundamentally inauthentic guy in Tim Walls, and he in instead of actually convincing men that they should be voting for Kamala and Walls, I think he actually cost her votes. I. I think it would have actually been better for Kamala Buck if she. If she had gone and just said, hey, you know what? Gretchen Whitmer is my pick. Yeah, you got a double chick ticket. And it might have hurt her, but I think she probably would have won Michigan.

[Buck Sexton]

I don't think she would have called it a double chick ticket. But, yeah, I hear what you're saying.

[Clay Travis]

I mean, a double dude ticket, double chick ticket. I think she would have been better off. I don't like Gretchen Whitmer, but I think Gretchen Whitmer is more authentic as a governor than Tim Walls was. And I think men might respect Gretchen Whitmer even more than they did Tim Walls because he's so fake. And so we start off this day with Tim Walls political career being over, which I think is kind of a remarkable story.

[Buck Sexton]

Let's be honest here. Good chance that if you're wondering who could hang the picture frame and get it done with the tool belt, and all the things I think Gretchen whimper might beat out. Tim Walls, if you're looking for someone to choreograph your next Gretchen production, Chicago better, I would say Tim Walls is your guy.

[Clay Travis]

Gretchen Whitmer might be better at home repair than either you or I.

[Buck Sexton]

She definitely is. I take no if my in laws are listening.

[Clay Travis]

Every time.

[Buck Sexton]

Every time my father in law shows up here to visit, it's like a trade. He gets to see his grandchild and his daughter, and I get to present him with a list of things in the house that are broken that I don't know how to fix. It's great works.

[Clay Travis]

Laura. Laura is the same. My father in law can fix everything. He's an engineer. And you know, she. He just shows up. And by the way, he's about to be 80. Happy early 80th birthday to my father in law. And he's still infinitely better at fixing anything in the house. So. Look, I. I'm not claiming that at least.

[Buck Sexton]

At least you drive way too fast like a maniac and are ready for the F1 circuit. I drive slow. This is why I have to go in my free time and shoot lots of guns and do tactical training on the weekends to. To make up for my inability to change a light bulb and driving like a little old lady.

[Clay Travis]

Yeah, you know, you're driving like Miss Daisy. Is. Is definitely. I was. I was doing all that. This actually, I thought about this. He should just said.

[Buck Sexton]

He should just say, thank you, Buck, for keeping me safe. But instead I get all this.

[Clay Travis]

You know, when they were talking about the CIA agents who were in Venezuela. Officer. I always get that wrong. But the. The CIA officers who are in Venezuela, I was thinking to myself, you know, this could have been a job for Buck. But hopefully they were never chased because if they were, he would have gotten caught and captured just like that. Because the guy can't. He has no evasive driving skills. He would be obeying whatever the speed limits are. And. And. And as a result, we might not have gotten Maduro just because you don't drive fast enough.

[Buck Sexton]

It's called going low profile. Low vis. You obey the local traffic ordinances so you don't arouse suspicion, Clay. That's how highly trained I am. They would think that I'm a retiree on vacation there. They would never suspect.

[Clay Travis]

How many Americans are there in Venezuela, by the way? Do we know, like actually in Venezuela?

[Buck Sexton]

I mean, the number is a lot less now than. I mean, obviously right now particularly. But it's been going down and down for A long time. I mean, the State Department has had a do not travel order up for, for Venezuela for quite some time, I think. So it hasn't been a probably don't go. It's a don't go.

[Clay Travis]

This is my, My boys is not going to shock you that as soon as we raided Venezuela. My boys are super sports fans. One of my sons said is Ronald Acuna. Okay. Ronald Acuna is the star Venezuelan baseball player of the Atlanta Braves. And a lot of, I mean, this is true. A lot of baseball players in the off season go to Venezuela. Weather's perfect. Baseball is hugely pop there. And so there are a lot of Major League Baseball players in Venezuela. I think right now, before spring training.

[Buck Sexton]

Starts next month, maybe Venezuela, we decide. We get. Look, you can't make them citizens. They're not Americans. They're, they're, they're Latinos. They're South Americans and Latinos. But you know, maybe we, maybe Czar Miller, I don't know if he's officially being called that yet, but Stephen Miller in the White House, if in fact he gets the Venezuela portfolio, we move toward Venezuela becomes like Guam, but a lot bigger and with a lot more oil. Like, you're not, you're not voting in our. Exactly like the US Virgin Islands, except where I.

[Clay Travis]

With a lot about territorial law, by the way, cleaning up a couple of things. We are big fans of. Let's make sure that I get this right. We are big fans of Brad Little, current governor of Idaho. No one. No one bigger fans than us.

[Buck Sexton]

Let's make sure you get it right because you've been thinking about Brad a lot lately.

[Clay Travis]

Yes, I have. I've been. I've been thinking. Need to talk about the job Brad's doing in Idaho.

[Buck Sexton]

You know what the truth is though. Can I just really quickly. The reason we don't talk about Brad a lot here is because Idaho is a great state and he's obviously doing a great job. So because he's not the focus of commentary is a good thing.

[Clay Travis]

Grok. I don't know how much you use Grok now.

[Buck Sexton]

All the time. Replace Google for me. It's amazing. I love it.

[Clay Travis]

Grok says that there. And if you have not, this is worth getting on Twitter. X by itself. I am stunned by how effective it is at just giving me basic facts. Like yesterday I was looking up. We'll talk about it a little bit later, but I was looking up the number of murders in Washington D.C. you can go on Twitter, hit the Grox symbol and you can just say hey, tell me how many murders there have been graphically from 1970 in Washington D.C. to the present day. Wait, like 45 seconds a minute. Boom. All of the data right there in front of you. Grok says there are 10,000Americans roughly that are living in Venezuela right now, according to recent estimates. Right.

[Buck Sexton]

Small number when you consider the size of Venezuela. And I wonder what it would be comparatively, say to Colombia next door. So we can grok that one, by the way, Clay, in retrospect. Now, given that maybe Stephen Miller can bring about the territorial dispensation of Venezuela for us. I'm not saying he's going to do that. It's just a fun idea. We should talk about Greenland, which I don't think is entirely a joke. I still think that there is an interesting conversation that is being had about people say it belongs to Denmark. Okay, why the Greenlanders are not Danes. What has Denmark done for Greenland? Does Greenland get a say in this? It's a big piece of territory. And also, just because you're a Civil War nerd, self described, people forget this. Ulysses Grant had a great plan. He wanted to make the Dominican Republic. You were talking about baseball before. He wanted to make the Dominican Republic a US Territory and got shot down by the Senate.

[Clay Travis]

First of all, there are a lot of decisions we made surrounding territories that I think were wrong. And I think in like the first year of this show, four or five years ago, I said we should go into Cuba and we should end this absurdity. I'm going to re. I'm going to re. Bring that back up, double down, double down, triple down, quadruple down, whatever necessary. We should right now in this year of 2026, end the fact that Cuba is a communist country and return basic freedoms to Cuba. To your point on territories, I would even suggest that we should look at what we've done with Puerto Rico and with the US Virgin Islands, Guam, as you mentioned, and consider making Cuba a territory of the United States, not a full part of the, of the citizenry. You're not voting. You don't. In the Senate. You don't have congressional representation, but just a protectorate of sorts. To me, that is a. Something that should significantly be looked at.

[Buck Sexton]

Think about the deal that we've gotten in other places. I mean, Guam is one example. They get US Military protection, we put bases there. They don't ever have to worry about foreign relations, foreign invasion, anything like that. They get infrastructure, they get rule of law, they get access to, you know, American markets, etc. It's not a bad deal.

[Clay Travis]

We already have the huge base at Guantanamo and thanks to Colonel Jessup, we still have it.

[Buck Sexton]

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[Clay Travis]

America One Thought at a time Clay.

[Buck Sexton]

Travis and Buck Sexton.

[Clay Travis]

Find them on the free iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcast.

[Buck Sexton]

As the consumer, you carry the success or failure of business in the palm of your hand. Their success depends on your decision to spend money with one business or their competitor.

[Clay Travis]

Our friends at PureTalk would like to say thank you from the bottom of their hearts for choosing PureTalk as your cell phone service provider. Because of you, they've had a record breaking year because of your generosity. Through their Roundup for Charity program, they've been able to donate over half a million dollars to America's Warrior Partnership. That's a nonprofit that stands on the front lines of preventing veteran suicide. Your patronage has allowed PureTalk to donate a thousand hand sewn Made in America flags to your fellow veterans.

[Buck Sexton]

When you choose PureTalk as your wireless provider, you choose to support American jobs. Like I said, as a consumer you have the power to make or break companies. And with the money the big wireless guys throw around on advertising. You're inundated with offers everywhere you look. So from everyone in the Pure Talk family, thank you for your trust and God bless America. Welcome back into Clay and Buck. We talked a little bit for a second there about Greenland. Not really well named. It really should be Iceland as we know. Quite tricky, sneaky. The the Vikings were with this. The Iceland actually has some green. The Greenland actually has basically nothing but ice. But that's the way it goes. Stephen Miller asking a question. He's just asking questions. He was with Fake Tapper over at cnn, which still exists, I might add. CNN is still a thing technically. Cut 22. Stephen Miller asking the question, why does Denmark have Greenland?

[Clay Travis]

Can you say that military action against Greenland is off the table?

[Buck Sexton]

What do you mean military action against Greenland?

[Clay Travis]

Greenland has a population of 30,000 people, Jake. The real question is by what right does Denmark assert control over Greenland? What is the basis of their territorial claim? What is their basis of having Greenland as a colony of Denmark? The United States is the power of.

[Buck Sexton]

NATO for the United States to secure.

[Clay Travis]

The Arctic region to protect and defend NATO and NATO interests. Obviously Greenland should be part of the United States. It is a really great question why Denmark is just has Greenland. Because Greenland has been a colony of Denmark for hundreds of years, basically. It is a fantastic question. There's only 30,000 people there. It seems to me that the people of Greenland should be able to choose do they want to be a part of America or they'd be rather be a part of Denmark. And I don't know what that outcome would be, but I feel pretty good about our ability to provide a higher quality of life for the people of Greenland than than certainly Denmark does. I mean, does anybody doubt that at all? We'll come back, we'll take some of your calls and take some of your reactions. Prize Picks in the meantime is available in all 50 states including California, Texas, Florida and Georgia. All 50 states. Just in time for college football playoff game Thursday, College football playoff game Friday and then NFL wild card Saturday, Sunday and Monday. You know, back in the day, Rush was one of the greatest of the of the individuals when it came to daily fantasy. Nobody signed up more people than him. And Rush back in the day considered buying an NFL team. And I know that he would be excited for all five days of games back to back to back. And I think he'd love prize Picks which is available, like I said, in all 50 states including California, Texas, Florida, Georgia. You can download the Prize Picks app today. Use My name Clay as the code. You get $50 instantly in lineups when you play $5. That's code CLAY on prize picks. 50 bucks in lineups in your account when you play $5. Pricepix.com code CLAY welcome back in play Travis Buck Sexton show Having an awesome time hanging out with all of you. On the Tuesday edition of the program. We've been talking about Tim Walls and the fact that his political career is potentially over. Continuing to discuss Venezuela, Cuba has now announced, Buck, that 32 Cubans were killed by the special forces that seized Maduro. Now, what's interesting about this is for those of you who had not paid a lot of attention, the idea that Cuban bodyguards were uniquely skilled and uniquely talented was a huge part of why Maduro felt confident that he was well protected.

[Buck Sexton]

Well, there's, and there's a reason for this. The reason, as we had discussed a little bit yesterday, is that the Cuban relationship with security and security services goes all the way back to the Cold War and the kgb. I mean, I said things to you guys like the KGB helped them. The KGB brought Clay, the Cuban services to Moscow. I mean, they brought them to their academies to train them in, you know, counterintelligence, subversion, assassination, all of these things that the KGB excelled at. And remember, they learned this in a rule of law free framework. So it's just, you do whatever you have to do, whatever goes right. It's a no holds barred approach to intelligence and security work. And so the Cubans developed quite a reputation for being the most adept intel operatives in Latin America, which was a huge problem for the US obviously, and our allies. But even places like Angola, the Cubans were sending military and security resources to shore up communist revolutions elsewhere in the world. So they've been these mercenaries for hire for a long time, but they ain't Delta Force, that's for damn sure.

[Clay Travis]

So 32 of them killed and I don't know to what extent there's going to be any of the cameras are that are going to get leaked or released. I'm just putting this out there, but it is, I, it is staggering how good these guys were, Buck. And I know they trained and I know they had a mock up of exactly where Maduro was. And a part of me, by the way, thinks that we were talking about this yesterday, people were saying, okay, why is President Trump seem to be okay with the existing Vice president potentially being elevated? Part of me thinks, Buck, she might have been one of the CIA sources that helped Maduro get taken out. Crazy theory or do you think, why would she said publicly, oh, I'm not going to do anything for the US and, and Rubio and Trump and everybody, they're like, hey, you know, we kind of, we kind of understand that she has to say things inside of her country that seem like she's not working with us. But we're, they're saying here we're very confident we're going to be working with her. What would the basis for feeling comfortable that you were going to have a good relationship with her be unless you had had some relationship in the past? I have a very, I have a.

[Buck Sexton]

Very different feeling about this Clay, which is that all of the players still on the chessboard in Venezuela just as a matter of basic self preservation. Now understand, we can get you in your sleep, surrounded by the best of the best, and have you, and have you transferred into a federal penitentiary hellhole that you're never getting out of in the blink of an eye. We can do that to anybody.

[Clay Travis]

So your, your take is that they're just getting in line because they saw what happened to Machado and they're afraid that it could happen to them. My question, and certainly the motivating factor there is strong based on your analysis. My thought, though, is for the President to have come out and basically said, hey, this other woman who won the Nobel Prize, that side of the political equation we don't feel comfortable with at all. I feel like the VP may have been one of the sources that helped give up Machado.

[Buck Sexton]

I mean, it's. Yeah, there's, we could, we could speculate. It's impossible to, to know the inner workings here of this stuff unless you were involved in this kind of an operation. I would say that on this front, though, the Iraq lesson is something that's very. I have a different view of. People bring up Iraq in the context of, oh, it's quagmire and we might get into a quagmire. People are saying that, okay, you can always say that about pretty much any military intervention we take anywhere in the world. It, it could always go wrong, it could always get worse. That's true, but that's not necessarily helpful or insightful. I think that the lesson we've learned in the, in the Iraqi context is the big mistake that was made early on. This was actually before I was in the Iraq office at the CIA. But the big, the big mistake was de Ba'. Athification. Right? Because that meant that whether you were like a traffic cop in a, you know, in doing the most basic stuff in Baghdad, all the way up to the Minister of Defense. You were now not allowed to be a part of the new governing. Ok, so basically everybody with training and a gun and any authority in the country was told you got nothing to do, you have no source of income, go home and you know, pound sand. Sand.

[Clay Travis]

Yes.

[Buck Sexton]

And the truth is that was a huge, huge, huge mistake. And we're not going to do that in Venezuela because I think we've learned that lesson, which is you work with. It's funny because Rumsfeld actually had a great insight about this. You go to war with the army, you have. You have re. You have a new regime in Venezuela with the pieces you've got in place. You don't try to build. This isn't. You break it, you buy it. The Colin Powell thing, this is. We have to work with the existing realities of power on the ground and use the leverage that we have. In this case, the huge leverage of you want to oil the flow or not? Because that's. Without that, you guys got nothing. Basically your economy is on its ass and you can't pay your bills and you know, there's no food on the shelves. So we have tremendous leverage. And I think that leverage is of course economic, but then also on the security side, who, who really wants to play games with Amer with. When you just saw like imagine you are. Whether it's the VP or Clay, they got a cast of characters, man. The. The minister of defense is actually named for Vladimir Lenin. His name is Vladimir Podrino. His parents are such commies that they named him for Vladimir Lenin. He's a whack job. I think he has a 15 or $25 million bounty on his head. The minister of police basically like national police guy or internal security guy. He has a TV show that he runs. This is true. A TV show where called the. Or Hit it with a Sledgehammer where he on TV talks about like politics and stuff and he has a bat with nails in it like the guy from the Walking Dead. Ok, These are the people that run this country. This guy of course been involved in all kinds of oppression. Do they want to be a part of. Of doing things better or do they want to get a knock on the door from Delta Force at 5am that's where they are now.

[Clay Travis]

I also think if you combine Iran and Venezuela, you have these countries where the leadership has been telling the people for decades, generations now, hey, we are standing up to American imperialism. We're not going to be bullied by Israel. We're not going to be bullied by the West. And then they can't even keep their president from getting taken right out of his house and 32 of his top bodyguards being wiped out. And they can't stop their nuclear ambitions. They can't even stop America and Israel from flying over them. I think what we are seeing is a major geopolitical realignment. It feels early. You and I were kids in 1989 when the Berlin Wall came down. But man, when I look at these protests that are going on in Iran, when I see what's going on in Venezuela, when I see what's going on in Cuba, it feels like the forces of repression and the forces of socialism and communism are, look, they've lasted maybe longer than people thought because there was the argument after 1989 that we had reached the end of history because country was effectively going to become a democratic republic embracing capitalism because it is the best form of government for the overall freedom and financial success of everyone. That is a reality. But they've held on and it feels like Trump is maybe in a Ronald Reagan like fashion in standing up against it in a way that others have not been willing to and challenging it directly in a way that others have not been willing to, almost pushing these last vestiges of left wing excess off the, off the cliff. Am I crazy or do you see that? And I know Iran is different because it's a theocracy in many ways, but what it has in common is just a repression of people and a restriction of their ability to be exposed to the larger marketplace of ideas in the world. And it feels like they are all starting to crumble simultaneously based on the strength being shown by President Trump.

[Buck Sexton]

I think they're being put on their back foot for sure. I mean, one of the, one of the stories that has come out of this raid is that the Chinese provision of seemingly or supposedly sophisticated surface to air missiles, air defense radars, including or aerial defense radars, including anti stealth technology, things like that, were a total joke. So whatever the Chinese were giving the Venezuelans as their client state to help them protect their territory was a joke. And this certainly also affects thinking about something like a Taiwan situation where turning off the lights for the Taiwanese and you know, cyber and things like that, whole different level of complexity and ball game than doing it in Venezuela. So I'm going to start for the. Yeah. For the Taiwanese. So the Chinese would have their hands full on something like that. And clearly America still has some military advantages that allow us to do something like this. So I think that That's a. That's a. A lesson that a lot of our adversaries take out of this. But, you know, look, Russia, as long as the world still runs on hydrocarbons, Russia is going to have tons of money, a big military, lots of nukes, and the ability to throw its weight around. China's a billion people and the second largest economy in the world. You know, these are taking a step back. Doesn't mean these places are about to fall or crumble. You think about something like the Assad regime, Clay. The Assad regime in Syria. It got to a point in 2011, 2012, where there were actually suicide bombers infiltrating, like the inner sanctum of the Assad regime. Like they were right on the ropes. But you go back to the 80s and what was it? Tom Friedman with Hama rules and the leveling of Hama after an uprising there. These guys, these scumbag, tin pot dictators, theocrats, whatever, all they really focus on is staying in power.

[Clay Travis]

Yeah.

[Buck Sexton]

Because that's their whole. So even when everything around them is crumbling. Look at North Korea. Even when everything around them is crumbling and falling apart, even when, by all rights and sanity, they shouldn't be able to hang on, they hang on. You know, this is what. So I just don't want to get too far. Like, we've been talking about Iran falling for as long as I've been alive.

[Clay Travis]

Well, yeah. And by the way, Maduro, to your point, Trump offered him a gilded existence in a foreign country, Turkey. Turkey's, I think, where he could live in, you know, splendor and excess for the rest of.

[Buck Sexton]

Not bad, by the way. Better weather than Russia. At least if you're along the coast, you go to, like, Izmir or something. Decent kebab. You get done. Donner kebab with the yogurt. Very good.

[Clay Travis]

Definitely better than a New York City prison.

[Buck Sexton]

Better food than Russia, for sure. I. I wouldn't get that excited about the. The Assad move. Like, apparently he just plays FIFA, the soccer game or not. It's FIFA FC now. He plays, like, soccer, video games all day in a. You see that in an apartment in Moscow.

[Clay Travis]

Really, really funny.

[Buck Sexton]

Moscow's cold in the winter, man. I. I take my eggs out. What would be your. If it had to be, like, you can't do, like, Switzerland or England or something. If you had to do a. A kind of adversary country, which. Turkey's not really an adversary. They're kind of a midway pain in the butt for us, but, you know, they're an Ally in some ways, too. I know they're NATO. What would be your country of exile?

[Clay Travis]

Oh, I would go to, like, the British Virgin Islands.

[Buck Sexton]

No, no, that doesn't count. I'm talking about you got to go somewhere that has, like, no extradition treaty. Yeah, I don't know.

[Clay Travis]

There's not that many. Great. Non extradition treaty.

[Buck Sexton]

Yeah, no, no, duh, buddy. Vietnam, I think, would be pretty high on my list. Vietnam, I like the food.

[Clay Travis]

You know, you have to be concerned that they might, because, like, Vietnam has pretty good relations now with the United States. So you could become an extraditable country.

[Buck Sexton]

They could offer you up. I mean, the only places where you are 100% not getting turned out, if you are in the world really, are Russia and China.

[Clay Travis]

I think that's really it. North Korea, if you could get in.

[Buck Sexton]

Okay, I'm sorry. Yeah, North Korea, too. But the only places where there's zero chance that if they don't want you to get turned over, you're not getting turned over are those countries. You could say, oh, what about, like, European allies? We can bring a lot of pressure to.

[Clay Travis]

Oh, I think. I think Russia. Look, whenever the Ukraine war ends, which I think will happen at some point in 2026, I think relations between Russia and the United States could be decent. I think you might start to have people just kind of get handed back and forth. I was reading a good story about Witkoff and his relationship with Putin and how that entire process came to be when they got Fogle, I think was his name. The, The. The hostage. Putin just said, hey, I'll potentially give you Fogle, but you have to meet me one on one with no apparatus, otherwise there at all. And Witkoff just said, okay, I'll do it. No preconditions. And, you know, he gets the former, what, Marine and American schoolteacher. Right. Who was otherwise been there for years.

[Buck Sexton]

Some exciting news in the Sexton household. Baby Speed. He's moving around all over the place now. He is crawling like army crawl style. You know, he's all.

[Clay Travis]

He's.

[Buck Sexton]

He's moving fast. Ginger Spice is his hype man when he does it. They actually, I play fetch now with both of them. It's always funny to see Speed disappointed when Ginger gets to the ball first. But maybe one day that will change. Legacy boxes there, though, because they can digitize these memories that I'm creating right now. Right. But this is the thing. Back in the day, back in the day, you didn't have the digital stuff out there. You had VHS tapes, you had photos. So this is where it's so important to bring those old memories back to life today, right? So if I had speed crawling around 20, 30 years ago, it'd be on some VHS tape and I wouldn't be able to enjoy it. But, my friends, you can enjoy it. That's where Legacy Box gets it done. Go to legacybox.com/buck say 55% off when you preserve your past with Legacy Box, kick off the new year by protecting your family's most cherished memories that haven't been watched or enjoyed in years, perhaps even decades. Your children might be all grown up now, but everybody remembers those first steps. So enjoy the first crawls that your kids had back in the 80s or whenever. Keep those memories safe at Legacy box. Go to legacybox.com buck send in your old photos, videos, tapes, everything. Legacybox.com buck that's legacybox.com buck to save 55%.

[Clay Travis]

Patriots radio hosts a couple of.

[Buck Sexton]

Regular guys, Clay Travis and Buck Sexton.

[Clay Travis]

Find them on the free iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Buck Sexton]

Welcome back into Clay and Buck. Just a quick programming note. You know, we have a YouTube channel, uh, it's Clay and Buck on YouTube, and it's growing and growing. And this year we're gonna be doing a lot more video. And let me give you a little, a little teaser here. If you want to know how much Clay loves the Christmas season, just check out our YouTube channel today after you subscribe and see how his beard has gone fully white like Santa Claus. It's amazing he's decided, in solidarity with St. Nick, to have a almost entirely white beard. Clay, I am impressed.

[Clay Travis]

I have not trimmed my beard since we left the air on December 19, so I let it go. Pretty substantial. And it is super, super white. And also I'm told that I look, according to producer Ali, a bit like Kramer on Seinfeld, when he was overly tan, at least based on the video footage right now. And I'm super tan because I was down in the Caribbean for. For Christmas. But you'll only be able to see that if you go and subscribe to the YouTube channel.

[Buck Sexton]

Do you. Do you like to be called Father Christmas as part of the season? Do you wear a red suit? Like, how do you really engage with this big white beard?

[Clay Travis]

Clay I'm a jolly fellow, and I'm getting fatter, so this might be my future.

[Buck Sexton]

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.