Hour 2 - Democrats Double Down on Failure

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show

Episode: Hour 2 – Democrats Double Down on Failure
Original Air Date: July 24, 2026
Guests: Ann Coulter
Main Theme:
A deep dive into the Democratic Party’s 2028 presidential primary strategy, shifting political alliances, intra-party divisions over immigration and wokeness, the emerging candidate field, and broader cultural observations with characteristic wit and sharp commentary.

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Main Theme & Purpose

The episode focuses on the Democratic National Committee’s decision to set the primary order for the 2028 presidential election (South Carolina, Nevada, New Hampshire, Michigan) and analyzes what this reveals about current fault lines and power players within the Democratic Party. Clay Travis, Buck Sexton, and guest Ann Coulter explore party trends—especially the influences of identity politics, the left’s stance on immigration and foreign policy, and the viability of leading candidates like Kamala Harris, Gavin Newsom, and AOC. The discussion balances political analysis with humor, cultural hot takes, and even a viral debate about women’s haircuts.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. DNC’s Primary Schedule & Its Implications

• Breaking News (02:35, 20:42):
  The DNC announces South Carolina will hold the first Democratic primary for the 2028 cycle, followed by Nevada, New Hampshire, and Michigan.
  • Clay Travis: Suggests this order heavily favors Kamala Harris due to her strong support among Black Democrats, particularly in South Carolina.
  • Buck Sexton: Notes that while winning the first primary is advantageous, it doesn't guarantee overall victory; points out the lack of enthusiasm behind Kamala.

Notable Quotes:

• Clay Travis (03:00):
  “South Carolina presumably very strong for Kamala... Is it too early to start handicapping things?”
• Ann Coulter (03:38):
  “By starting with South Carolina in Democratic primaries, that is heavily, heavily black Democrats... And by the way, black Democrats hate wokeness way more than white Democrats.”

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2. The Left’s Coalition: Wokeness, Socialists, and Foreign Policy

• Wokeness & Primary Electorate (03:38–05:07):
  Ann Coulter and Buck Sexton discuss the tension between “woke” progressives and traditional Democratic voters.
  • Coulter highlights a divide: “The woke us are always, it’s always the prototypical white... that dyes their hair purple, joins Antifa...”
• Socialist Influence:
  Socialist politicians are gaining media coverage, but Coulter doubts they represent the broader electorate, especially outside of places like New York City.

Notable Quote:

• Ann Coulter (05:07):
  “The places where people like Mamdani are winning are not really representative, certainly not of the country.”

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3. Foreign Policy as a Party Splitter

• Republican Opportunity (05:07–06:53):
  Foreign policy, particularly regarding Iran and the cycle of endless wars, is seen as a vulnerability for Democrats.
  • Coulter laments Trump’s shift from “no new wars” to involvement in “a lot of new wars.”
  • Advises: “Declare victory and get out. Just come to any deal. It doesn’t matter... Let gas prices go down and try not to absolutely destroy the midterms for Republicans.” (06:53)

Notable Quote:

• Ann Coulter (06:53):
  “It’s been a disaster from the beginning... Declare victory and get out. Just come to any deal. It doesn’t matter.”

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4. Immigration: Numbers and Optimism

• Debate Over Real Numbers (07:39–09:29):
  • Both hosts agree efforts to control the border are insufficient.
  • Coulter claims the real number of illegal immigrants is underreported (“minimum 40 million”) and criticizes both parties for not enforcing stricter policies.
• Optimism (11:50):
  • Coulter is optimistic that American public opinion has turned decisively against illegal (and large-scale legal) immigration, making it politically untenable for leaders to ignore.
  • Notes increasing mainstream acceptance of what were once fringe anti–open borders views.

Notable Quote:

• Ann Coulter (11:50):
  “At least the American people are completely won over on illegal immigration. I might add legal immigration... talk radio hosts and TV hosts who would never have said the things they’re saying now sound like they’re reading straight from Adios [America].”

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5. Viral Moments & Pop Culture Commentary

• Viral Haircut Tweet (13:32):
  • Buck’s tweet—"Always remember the friend who tells you, ladies you’d look great with short hair is the friend who secretly hates you”—goes viral, discussed with Ann Coulter co-signing the sentiment (14:16).
  • Both hosts and Coulter joke about childhood haircuts and the perils of fashion advice.

Notable Quote:

• Ann Coulter (14:16):
  “I completely co sign. This is something a lot of us girls have talked about... our mothers really want us to look like lesbians... always cutting our hair to a short little thing.”

• Pop Culture (15:40–16:27):

  • Coulter attended the opera and a Yankees game that week; dismisses recent “Odyssey” adaptation as “PC nonsense” with “no fun involved.”
  • Tone: Dismissive and amused, contrasting highbrow and mainstream culture.

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6. Detailed Breakdown of Primary Field & Demographics

• Polling Highlights (24:14):
  • Kamala Harris is the overwhelming favorite among Black Democratic voters (47%), far ahead of Gavin Newsom (13%), AOC (4%), and others.
  • Kamala also leads with white and Hispanic Democrats, and among younger voters.
  • Speculation on state-by-state strategies: Kamala strong in SC, AOC could make a play for left-leaning New Hampshire and Nevada, Michigan is a wild card due to diverse demographics and the Muslim-Jewish divide (31:13).

Notable Quote:

• Clay Travis (24:14):
  “Black Democrat voters, 47% Kamala Harris, Gavin Newsom, 13%. This is the one that’s staggering to me, Buck. AOC, 4%.”

• Kamala’s Narrative (25:42–27:13):

  • Buck outlines the expected narrative: Kamala stayed loyal to Biden, took on the presidency at a difficult time, and almost won the presidency.
  • Critique: She’s not naturally a good campaigner; Newsom could exploit her limited accomplishments.

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7. VP Speculation & Coalition-Building

• AOC as Running Mate (29:29):
  • Buck Sexton argues AOC is “a perfect vice president for any Democrat”: brings far-left enthusiasm, appeals to young and Latino voters, and can unite Sanders supporters.
  • Suggests a Kamala–AOC ticket backed by the Bernie machine could be “game over.”

Notable Quote:

• Buck Sexton (29:29):
  “She is a perfect vice president for any Democrat... brings the left crazy enthusiasm but keeps it under control. Young, getting ready for the next [cycle].”

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8. Michigan as a 2028 Primary Wild Card

• Listener Call from Michigan (32:47):
  • “Tommy” asserts “nobody’s talking about Michigan and Gretchen Whitmer,” despite her popularity; speculation on Mayor Pete’s calculated move to Michigan and possible candidacy for governor or vice president.

Notable Moment:

• Clay Travis (33:30):
  “[Whitmer] would have been a much better VP candidate, I think, than Tim Walls was. But that’s worth paying attention to, to be certain.”

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9. Lack of Enthusiasm for Kamala & Modern Democrats

• Merchandise Commentary (41:28):
  • Discussion comparing Obama’s historic popularity to lackluster enthusiasm for Biden, Hillary, and Kamala; zero excitement, no “Kamala merch.”
  • Black voter unity seen as Kamala’s firewall, but challengers could question her record.

Notable Quote:

• Buck Sexton (41:28):
  “I don’t think that Kamala has people wearing her merch either. She’s not somebody people can be enthusiastic [about].”

• California Demographics (43:12):

  • Surprising stat: Only about 8% of California’s population is black, explaining nuances in Kamala’s prior political positioning.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

| Timestamp | Speaker | Quote | |-----------|-------------------|------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 03:38 | Ann Coulter | “Black Democrats hate wokeness way more than white Democrats.” | | 05:07 | Ann Coulter | “The places where people like Mamdani are winning are not really representative, certainly not of the country.” | | 06:53 | Ann Coulter | “Declare victory and get out. Just come to any deal. It doesn’t matter... Let gas prices go down and try not to absolutely destroy the midterms…” | | 11:50 | Ann Coulter | “At least the American people are completely won over on illegal immigration. I might add legal immigration.” | | 14:16 | Ann Coulter | “I completely co sign. This is something a lot of us girls have talked about... our mothers really want us to look like lesbians…” | | 24:14 | Clay Travis | “Black Democrat voters, 47% Kamala Harris, Gavin Newsom, 13%. This is the one that’s staggering to me, Buck. AOC, 4%.” | | 29:29 | Buck Sexton | “She is a perfect vice president for any Democrat... brings the left crazy enthusiasm but keeps it under control.” | | 41:28 | Buck Sexton | “I don’t think that Kamala has people wearing her merch either. She’s not somebody people can be enthusiastic [about].” |

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 02:35 | DNC announces primary order; what it means for 2028 field
• 03:38 | Ann Coulter on state demographics, wokeness, Black voters
• 05:07 | The rise of socialists and why it’s overblown nationally
• 06:53 | Ann Coulter’s foreign policy advice—“Declare victory and get out”
• 08:52 | Debate over the real number of undocumented immigrants
• 11:50 | The shift in public opinion against open borders
• 13:32 | Viral discussion: "Short haircuts are sabotage" tweet
• 24:14 | Kamala Harris dominates latest Democratic primary polling
• 25:42 | Kamala’s narrative after Biden’s presidency
• 29:29 | AOC’s best play is as VP
• 31:13 | Implications of Michigan, Muslim/Jewish split in Dems
• 32:47 | Listener call from Michigan on Whitmer and Mayor Pete
• 41:28 | No “Kamala merch”—lack of genuine grassroots enthusiasm

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Tone & Style

• Clever, sharp, often playful.
  The show maintains a critical, often sardonic tone about Democrats’ strategy, balances analysis with pop-culture humor, and doesn’t shy away from controversial takes.
• Ann Coulter:
  Blunt, irreverent, with historical and statistical references to back up her points.
• Hosts:
  Conversational and quick to riff off each other and Coulter, segueing seamlessly between deep political commentary and offbeat banter.

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Useful for Newcomers?

Absolutely. This episode is a masterclass in breaking down primary politics, party coalitions, and polling dynamics, and it does so with wit and real-time analysis. Even those unfamiliar with the specifics will find the discussion illuminating, especially around how states, demographics, and personalities drive primary outcomes—and how the surface-level media narratives often miss the undercurrents at play.

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Quick Reference: Who’s Up & Who’s Down?

• Kamala Harris:
  Dominant in early states due to Black voter base, but faces enthusiasm gaps and questions about her campaign skills.
• Gavin Newsom:
  Second tier, posited as less likable on closer inspection; could challenge Kamala by questioning her record with Black voters.
• AOC:
  More likely as a VP pick—young, energizes the base, builds a left-liberal coalition.
• Gretchen Whitmer:
  Popular in Michigan, potential VP, publicly says not running for president (but it’s early).
• Mayor Pete:
  Politically calculating, moving for position in swing state; currently trailing in polling.

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Final Takeaways

• The DNC’s primary reshuffle is designed to bolster Kamala Harris but exposes the party’s deeper divides, especially among racial, activist, and geographic lines.
• The “woke” left and DSA-types are influential in media but not in setting the party’s national agenda.
• Immigration is now a losing issue for Democrats with the general public.
• There’s an authenticity gap; none of the current Democratic stars have Obama-level grassroots enthusiasm.
• The future ticket may be a coalition of establishment and left; Kamala with AOC is plausible and would bring the party’s disparate parts together.

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Transcript

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Welcome back in hour number two, Friday edition of the program. We are rolling through a huge number of different stories again. The the biggest breaking news I would say the DNC has just decided that the first four states that they are going to have primaries in Michigan, South Carolina, New Hampshire, Nevada. We bring in Ann Coulter. I don't know if you'd seen that news that just popped in the last 10 minutes or so. Do you have any strong read on what Democrats are going to try to do? I know the midterms are coming up in a couple of months, but this is going to start the tongues wagging a little bit. South Carolina presumably very strong for Kamala. New Hampshire very strong according to recent polls for AOC and, and Mayor Pete. Michigan. Mayor Pete lives there. Is it too early to start handicapping things or now that those four states we know are the first four, does anything come to your mind?

[Ann Coulter]

It's definitely too early to handicap anything. We don't even know who's running. But I, I do think that by starting with South Carolina in Democratic primaries, that is heavily, heavily black Democrats. And New Hampshire, which doesn't, I mean even the Democrats in New Hampshire I don't think are big on the Democratic Socialists of America. And I assume the powers that be in the Democratic Party don't want to frontload it with a lot of DSA types. So that's all I notice about that. They're trying to. Oh, and by the way, black Democrats hate wokeness way more than white Democrats.

[Buck Sexton]

Yeah, the woke us are always, it's always the prototypical white sort of second tier school, but masters in irrelevant degree that dyes their hair purple, joins Antifa and tries to, you know, throw rocks at ICE or cops or whatever. So we've definitely seen that play out a lot. But in terms of the dynamic within the Democrat Party right now and going, we got the midterms so people are paying more attention to this. I'm going to pay a lot more as it gets just weeks away. The left is ascendant. Right now. Mamdani seems to be the Democrat who gets more ink, so to speak, than anybody else. Is that just a now thing or do you think that's part of what, who's, who's actually calling the shots going forward?

[Ann Coulter]

I never know the answer to anything involving the Democrats. I think they're completely crazy. But it seems to me looking in from the outside that the places where people like Mamdani are winning are not really representative, certainly not of the country. No one. There is not an expression. As New York City goes, so goes the country. And I don't think even particularly representative of the Democratic Party, though I guess we'll find out. I think there are a few issues that are driving the socialists in the Democratic Party and probably the biggest one is foreign policy. So it's unfortunate that Trump changed his mind on what his position on foreign policy was, which was no new wars, and then gets us in a lot of new wars, including one that seems to be never ending and is to quote Democrats on all the wars we win unwinnable. So I think Republicans could, could really crush the socialist aspect of the Democratic Party if they want back to their more pacifist roots.

[Clay Travis]

What would. And this is probably going to get people fired up in the comments. We now are on YouTube every day and, and so you can watch both Buck and myself and you on video as well. If President Trump asked you what should I do on Iran, you would say, what would you just say? Just cut and run. At this point, there is no benefit to being there. What would your advice be, particularly given what we're sitting here three, four months away from the midterm and gas prices being up. No matter. You don't have to be a genius to know that people don't like paying more for gas. What would you tell them at this point?

[Ann Coulter]

It's a disaster. It's been a disaster from the beginning. And basically two weeks in what I'd recommend, the same thing I am recommending now. Declare Victor victory and get out. Just come to any deal. It doesn't matter. Don't worry, we will back you up. We'll tell you it's a great deal. You've done a fantastic job. We're so glad you bombed Iran. Now please just stop. Let the Strait of Hormuz get opened. Let gas prices go down and try not to absolutely destroy the midterms for Republicans when that happens. Very, very, very bad things happen when Democrats have control, especially a large super majority control of the House and the Senate. Now may, we won't get that, but this is the strongest issue for them.

[Buck Sexton]

Yeah, it is concerning seeing some of the polling and to be sure, how are we doing on deportations? How's the immigration situation? We've given Trump lots of credit here. We continue to for securing the border. Did that right away. Great Interior enforcement, though. We had 10 plus million illegals come into the country under Biden. Everyone, even our friend Bill Maher has admitted that that is crazy that they did that, but they did it. Now we're being told, I think it's, I don't know, 300,000 or something this year. And I'm looking at the clock and I'm saying, okay, well, we're halfway through the year. How is this going what could change? What do you think needs to happen?

[Ann Coulter]

Well, I don't want to criticize the administration. I think they're doing the best they can. But it needs to be more. You're definitely right. It needs to be more. Who knows if we'll ever get this opportunity again. And I mean it's crazy that Democrats, and I might add some Republicans spend all this time bringing in tens of millions of illegal aliens. And as I said in a tweet this week, it was 30 million back in 2005. This is explained in Adios America. It was absolutely minimum 30 million illegal aliens 20 years ago. Who knows what the number is now?

[Buck Sexton]

But what would you guess? And I gotta ask you, what would you guess the number is now? I mean you've looked at this a lot for, for quite some time. Like what do you think the number is?

[Ann Coulter]

Well, minimum 40 million. There are ways of calculating this. People I think should probably be growing suspicious that they've been claiming it's 11 million for the past 50 years and it's never budged. Not one more illegal alien has come in. And so the things I, I cite in the book that you can look up yourself is first a couple of Pulitzer Prize winning journalists spent a year investing their Bartlett and Steel. They have their own in Wikipedia, very famous investigative journal spent investigative journals. They spent a year investigating the border in 2005 and concluded then, then 3 million were coming in a year. Then a couple of analysts, same year at Bear Stearns did an analysis to advise people on things that matter to their money. Something very important. They looked at remittances, what immigrants and illegal immigrants most of all send back to the home country. They looked at the number of housing permits and school graduation rates in illegal immigrant enclaves. I don't know if it was they or someone else pointed out back around then early 2000s, our, our census said there were about 8,000, I don't know, a few thousand, I don't know if it was 8,000 Brazilians in New York City, but both the Brazilian consulate and, and its embassy concluded there were hundreds of thousands of Brazilians just in New York, which is to say we have no idea. They're minimizing it as much as they can and you got it. You can't just let them move it in and millions in and have it be a ratchet effect where they move in 20 million in, in four or five years and we can only deport 100,000 a year. This is a ratchet effect. We never ever, ever can win that way. All the resources of the federal government ought to be going to deporting illegal aliens and I might add, not starting point endless wars.

[Clay Travis]

What are you optimistic about? Is there any, there we go. Is there anything out there on the horizon? I, I, I didn't get to talk to you, I don't think since the birthright citizenship decision came down. But I actually was somewhat encouraged, as you well know through the law. A lot of times dissents are written that end up emerging as the predominant decision. 20, 30, 40 years as we've seen. A lot of times it was taken far more seriously than I think a lot of quote unquote experts said. I know you started this argument in a significant way. Are there any things out there that you are optimistic about as you look on the horizon beyond four, six months, even beyond this presidential term, is there anything trend wise that you find to be positive?

[Ann Coulter]

Well, at least the American people are completely won over on illegal immigration. I might add legal immigration. I mean to have the illegal or the anchor baby issue sort of figures into this. All Rupert Murdoch properties have been pushing mass open borders, mass third world immigration because third worlders work harder than Americans do and we don't want our kids picking tomatoes. Well, I think that people have spoken on that and talk radio hosts and TV hosts who would never have said the things they're saying now sound like they're reading straight from Adios. I think it's hard for politicians to keep defying the will of the people and the will of the people is so clearly against illegal immigration and a big major change in legal immigration. As for the anchor baby, I mean that's perfectly illustrated. I think I was the only person on Fox defending Trump on his anchor baby position and was frequently cut off, not allowed to talk about it. All I heard was from legal experts on Fox news that oh it's going to be 9 0. He's trying to overrule the 14th amendment. Apparently he's not. It was a 54 decision and John Roberts and Amy Coney Barrett on one side with Gorsuch, Thomas Alito Kavanaugh on the other side. I think you know who was right on this one. But we don't have 30 years to, to waste. I hope, I hope we get another chance to, to make and something, something

[Buck Sexton]

not quite as important, not quite as important to the future of the republic. But I did wanted to get you to weigh in on, you know, sometimes I'm sure you've experienced this, you'll just throw a little thought out there on Twitter X and it all of a sudden catches fire. I am not known for my fashion sense, nor am I a guy who gives people hair advice generally. But I did weigh in on a video that showed a lady who had her hair cut from very long to very short. And I just wrote the following. Always remember the friend who tells you ladies you'd look great with short hair is the friend who secretly hates you.

[Ann Coulter]

This will be.

[Buck Sexton]

This is coming up on 10 million views, by the way. 10 million views of this tweet will have happened. Do you co sign this? What do you think?

[Ann Coulter]

I completely co sign. This is something a lot of us girls have talked about it for some reason. I don't know if this is still going on when. When, when you're little, like, you know, four, maybe up to age eight. For some reason, our mothers really want us to look like lesbians. They're always cutting our hair to a short little thing. And I had older brothers begging my mother, would you please stop cutting her hair?

[Buck Sexton]

There we go.

[Clay Travis]

10 million views on that buck. What is the overall consensus? Is it mostly positive? Like, as you can assess, what would you say the take is reacted to this?

[Buck Sexton]

It is hilarious. 100% of guys are like, absolutely, like, ladies, don't cut your hair. Every. Every husband, every boyfriend, every. Every straight guy that's weighing in, the ladies, don't cut your hair. And then I'd say it's 8020, because there's some women who are like, but what about, you know, And I'm like, I'm trying to do you a favor, ladies. I'm trying to do you a favor. However long your hair can be. And, you know, and then people are like, what about if somebody has a medical issue? I'm like, we're not talking people with medical issues, okay? I'm talking about somebody who went into a salon and paid some guy in Turke like €500 to chop off all of her hair. And it has gone mega viral. Not a good idea. And approves. And queen Anne has weighed in clay. So there we go.

[Ann Coulter]

Yeah, we'll have to get into tattoos next time.

[Clay Travis]

By the way, as we get ready for the break, do you engage in a big way in pop culture? Like, when's the last time you went to a movie theater?

[Ann Coulter]

Well, this week I went to the opera and a Yankees game. Do either of those count?

[Clay Travis]

That's a pretty good. That's a pretty good stretch out there. I was just curious if you had a take on the Odyssey. Everybody's weighing in on the Odyssey.

[Ann Coulter]

Like, I do Though I have a story like that, I think it's gonna, it's gonna be a complete boar PC nonsense. I would never see it in a million years. And from people I respect who have actually taken the trouble to watch it. That's what they say. It's no fun there. There's no, there's no fun involved. And it's not, it's not a, it's a slog to sit through is what I hear from reviewers I trust there

[Buck Sexton]

is always fun on Ann Coulter Substack. Guys, go follow, go check it out. Unsafe on substack and follow her obviously on X. Ms. Coulter, always great to see you. Thanks for being here.

[Ann Coulter]

Good to see you. Thank you. Bye bye.

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Download it for free. Welcome back. We are rolling through but breaking news. We'll dive into this on the backside here. More breaking news. South Carolina is officially going to be the first Democrat primary of the 2028 calendar. Just voted on narrowly beat Nevada. So South Carolina will be the debut location for the Democrat primary in 2028. Buck, go ahead and write it down. You guys can save it. I will make the prediction right now. Kamala Harris is going to win the state of South Carolina and begin the 2028 Democrat primary process with a dub. This is the best result for her Large black audience. The numbers just came out. I just flagged it. Buck, I'll hit you with it on the backside. Nobody's even close to Kamala right now in black voter support. And I just think it's going to be hard to pry this away from her.

[Buck Sexton]

Well, I think your, your South Carolina take is not controversial. I think most people would. Would agree. But a lot of people win the first. Get the first domino, so to speak, to fall in their favor and don't get all the rest of it to go their way. I don't think that Kamala is a lock for Nevada or New Hampshire or Michigan or any of these places. So, you know, I'm not judging. Look, look, buddy, you eat a little highfalutin because Kamala's obviously running again, okay? I don't know what I was thinking

[Clay Travis]

in the first primary. And she's going to win it big.

[Buck Sexton]

The first primary is not that big of.

[Clay Travis]

I will say this. It's a sign that people are not lining up aggressively against her because South Carolina winning means their support for. We'll talk about it. We come back.

[Buck Sexton]

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[Clay Travis]

Welcome back in Clay and Buck. All right, Kamala Harris, you're hearing it here. First South Carolina primary. Kamala Harris just announced South Carolina will have the first primary of the 2028 Democrat cycle. Couple of things that we'll break down about why that's significant. Again, that news just coming down, the McLaughlin Group Democrat primary cross tabs. This also just came out a couple of hours ago. Black Democrat voters, 47%. Kamala Harris, Gavin Newsom, 13%. This is the one that's staggering to me. Buck AOC, 4%.

[Buck Sexton]

Hmm.

[Clay Travis]

Then Mayor Pete. Congratulations to Mayor Pete. He is surging up to 3% support among black primary voter Democrats. And then mark Kelly at 2%. Kamala Harris also leads, according to this poll, white Democrats and Hispanic Democrats. She leads 18 to 54 year olds substantially with AOC in second place. But the thing that really kind of stacks stands out to me here in this poll, Buck is AOC is pretty well known at this point in time. She is not in any way resonating with black voters, which to me is a bit intriguing. Gavin Newsom is, I don't know what that's based on, but he is way behind Kamala Harris. But he's in second place. White Democrats, Kamala one Gavin NEWSOM two Mayor Pete, AOC and then Mark Kelly. So Mark Kelly to me is kind of the, kind of the dark horse here. Now, why does South Carolina being first matter? It, it beat Nevada. I think this is a sign that there are still a lot of Kamala Harris loyalists inside of the dnc because if you are Kamala Harris, you overwhelmingly want South Carolina to be number one because it gets you off on a good foot.

[Buck Sexton]

Let's, let's do this. Let's step into this for a second. We're going to be Kamala's messaging and PR team here for a minute. The story that Kamala and this is in her book, of course, but this or the book that was written for her, the story is that she was loyal to Biden, that she never saw anything herself that made her think that he couldn't finish out his term. And it wasn't her place to try to push a sitting president aside and that she stepped up with a shortened schedule in the midst of an embarrassing moment for the Democrat Party overall and took all the slings and arrows and came within 250,000 votes spread over a handful of states of winning that election, despite starting a few laps behind, so to speak, in the, you know, in the race.

[Clay Travis]

Yes.

[Buck Sexton]

So that is her narrative. It is not a, a unworkable narrative. The part of Kamala that I think is going to run into some trouble is she is not a good campaigner and she is not a good politician. But name recognition, former vice president, it's, it's going to be interesting. I, I, I, you are counting out handsome Gavin, I think way too quickly in all this. Yeah, I know you, you're like, you don't even think he's really in the conversation in a meaningful way way.

[Clay Travis]

I, I look so a couple of things. I think Kamala could follow the Trump example and say everybody knows everything they need to know about me. I'm going to go talk to the American public. I'm going to be out there and I am going to make my case to voters. I don't need to be in the primary. So I think that is a possibility that could be floating around out there. Gavin, to me, Buck has a little bit of a Kamala problem, which is the more time people spend watching him, I think the more polyagonist he appears to be, the more unctuous, the less likable of a candidate he is. And I do believe that that starts to become an issue for him. Now let me hit you with this. The first four states we know, South Carolina is going to be one. New Hampshire. If I'm aoc, I'm thinking to myself, okay, that's a state where I can make. Bernie won it. A lot of times, I can win that state.

[Buck Sexton]

I'm going to tell you this. I think for aoc, the play is just have a really good showing. She is young for the role of president.

[Clay Travis]

Yeah.

[Buck Sexton]

By constitution, I mean she is I think just a year over, maybe two years over the 35 minimum age. So she is now it's an interesting question. I know a lot of you are like, but you know, look how old Thomas Jefferson was and, and at the founding and link, George Washington was the oldest at like 40 and 17. I know, I know. But you know, people might think that there's an experience gap relative. We've gotten used to our presidents being white haired guys in their 60s, basically. You know, that's, I mean, think about it.

[Clay Travis]

I said this on the show, but it is kind of a crazy coincidence. Trump, George W. Bush and Bill Clinton were all born in the same year, 1946.

[Buck Sexton]

Yeah.

[Clay Travis]

What are the odds of that? I mean, it's kind of within a few, I think within six months of each other. 3. What is that? 24 years basically of presidents since 2000, since 1992 have all been born in the same year.

[Buck Sexton]

I want to get to this because I want to remind people that I've been saying this all along. So that'll hopefully cancel out my crazy combos and I'm going to run take, which is that I think the, the, the odds that AOC becomes a vice president To. She is a perfect vice president for any Democrat who would be running because she brings the left crazy enthusiasm but keeps it under control. She's got the optics of being attractive. She's a Latino woman, a wise Latina, all that stuff. Young, getting ready for the next. Like we. You could write the press release in. In. In 30 seconds or have AI do it for you. About why AOC is a perfect vice president for Gavin, for Kamala, for any of them. I don't think that she's top job likely, but if she think you right, it then becomes so easy for her to create that coalition moment where if she wins, say, New Hampshire, let's just. Or she comes in first or second. I mean, whoever. Let's say it's Kamala just to make you happy. It's driving me nuts, but let's say it's Kamala. If Kamala is the. Is the lead role, she says, you know, let's. Let's, you know, unite forces. I'm not going to drag this thing out longer than I have to, but she'll bring some enthusiasm, probably some Latina support to Kamala's banner. So, yeah, I think that that's the way that this, this likely goes. By the way, also, it would bring the Bernie machine behind Kamala, and if the Bernie machine gets behind Kamala, it's. It's game over. I mean, she wins the. She wins the whole thing. I think. I don't think Gavin Newsom can split the Democrat establishment wing and then have Bernie go with Kamala and have. Have Gavin come out ahead.

[Clay Travis]

The other state that jumps out to me, Michigan. Why does that jump out? Obviously, it's the only real swing state in the first four. But Buck, this makes the Arab Muslim versus Jewish dynamics of the Democrat party impossible to ignore because the Dearborn area in southeast Michigan has basically the largest Muslim population per capita. I think it's anywhere in the United States. And so how do you thread that needle for the Democrats? We've talked about the fact that the party increasingly turns their back on everyone that is in any way, you know, related to the. To. To the Jewish faith. I think that's attention. I'm a little bit surprised that they put Michigan in there, but to me, it looks like the most wide open of all these states because I can make you an argument that South Carolina's off the board basically with Kamala. AOC, is going to be very favorably disposed given the Bernie backing, presuming she runs in New Hampshire. Nevada also, I should have said, is a Swing state as well. But it's been one where Bernie has traditionally done really, really well. So I would think that would be helpful for AOC also obviously has a big Hispanic population. Michigan feels like the one where you don't really know of those four where it could go.

[Buck Sexton]

Do we still have Tommy in Michigan, guys? Speaking of Michigan, is he with us still? I know he was a minute ago.

[Clay Travis]

Yes.

[Buck Sexton]

All right, let's take Tommy in Michigan. He's got a. He wants to weigh in on his stay. What's going on, Tommy? How's it going, fellas? Hey, first off, Clay, you gotta stay off tv, man.

[Clay Travis]

My wife

[Buck Sexton]

trying to steal my wife, bro. But aside from that mission, nobody's talking about Michigan. And Gretchen Whitmer, who is wildly, wildly popular here. Yeah, nobody's thinking about Mayor Pete at all in Michigan.

[Clay Travis]

Thank you for the call.

[Buck Sexton]

I think that's she's George Souls back candidate. And rumor has it that that's who Biden wanted originally, but because she was a woman. But she was not a woman of color. But she's on.

[Clay Travis]

Thank you for the call. Tell your wife I appreciate her being a fan. Sorry for trying to steal her from you. The Buck. If you look at Michigan, Mayor Pete has moved to Traverse City, northern Michigan area. Awesome. Beautiful place. So he's in the state. Some people have said that felt calculated because obviously he was formerly in South Bend, Indiana and now he's moved into Michigan, which is a big toss up state. Whitmer said up at Mackinac island for a big event that they did there that she was not going to run in 2028. Now it's early. She could obviously change her mind. But she has said publicly that she was not going to run. Of course she's term limited out. There's an open election for the governor of Michigan. We will see whether or not she stands by that. To me, she feels like a VP candidate. She should have. She would have been a much better VP candidate, I think, than. Than Tim Walls was. But that's worth paying attention to to be certain.

[Buck Sexton]

We will keep an eye on all of these things. We will be looking out. We'll take your calls, take your talk backs, maybe even some pithy comments from the YouTube live stream. By the way, if you haven't checked us out yet on YouTube, please do. We are there, Clay and Buck. We are streaming. You want to have a family feel good moment Coming up, find your old family movies that you recorded on videotape 20 years ago and share them with the entire family. If you've been storing those agent cassettes in the attic or basement. Now is the time to get them together and send them into Legacy Box. Based in Tennessee. We love Legacy Box. They digitally transfer that old media onto the new media that you can actually watch on your smart TV, your iPhone, or your Samsung or whatever you're carrying these days. Legacy Box started doing this more than 15 years ago. Keeping alive those memories is what motivates the 200 plus technicians working at Legacy Box to hand transfer your family memories from the old videotapes, films and photos you send to them. They've done it now for 2 million families including mine and Clay's. When you send your old media to Legacy Box, they treat them like the rare and important sentimental items they are, carefully transferring everything by hand you'll get them back as well as brand new files on the cloud ready to watch and share from anywhere. Shop Legacy Boxes sale [e-mail] Buck They've always got one great deal or another at the website. Find this one today. Legacybox.com Buck

[Clay Travis]

laugh, learn.

[Buck Sexton]

Hang with the guys right there when

[Clay Travis]

you need them most.

[Buck Sexton]

Clay and Buck just preset them on the iHeart app.

[Clay Travis]

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[Clay Travis]

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[Buck Sexton]

Welcome back in here to Clay and Buck. We got some talkbacks. Let's do it, everybody. Kurt, this is C. Kurt from Minnesota. Play it, Buck. Kurt from Minnesota.

[Clay Travis]

Yeah.

[Buck Sexton]

Well, Kamala can get some traction, but at some point, she's gonna have to open her mouth, and that'll be the end of it.

[Clay Travis]

I don't.

[Buck Sexton]

I mean, she's not good, but she's not that bad.

[Clay Travis]

I think she'll dodge doing a lot of media. I think she'll do a ton of events that are closed to media. I just think that's going to. To. To play out in a significant way. By the way, more details coming out about the dim Cal, most likely South Carolina, then Nevada, then New Hampshire, then Michigan, followed by New Mexico and Virginia as being the most likely first six of the. Of the Democrat primary. I will say, Buck, one of the significant factors here is it takes away a lot of the sort of, I would say, excitement that going Iowa, New Hampshire for both Democrats and Republicans. You have people both campaigning in relatively small states, both parties appealing to the same voters at the same time. This really kind of changes that dynamic significantly because you're basically going to have Democrats going off on their own cycle and then Republicans going off on their own cycle where they don't overlap very often.

[Buck Sexton]

I feel like I need to just grow out my hair to more like Aunt Barbara style. To borrow from our. Our very amusing listener, by the way, I got a haircut. So no more on. No more aunt Barbara on the live stream. Thank you very much. But I kind of want to go to some of these. Like, Clay, I want to go in. I could just. I know I wear, you know, I'll wear a face mask to protect everybody from my, you know, Covid 2027 or whatever.

[Clay Travis]

And.

[Buck Sexton]

Or 20. Yeah, 20. 27. And I'll make sure that I can. I just want to talk to the people that are at these. I'm so curious, actually, to speak to the people who are excited about a Kamala candidacy. Like, and by the way, I don't want to. I don't want to argue with them. I don't. I just want to know. I want to hear from every day. Not TV pundits. They just do. I know exactly what their game is. Right. I know who they're trying to please and what their audience is. But I want to speak to people and hear. Because I bet you hear a lot of people like, I hate Trump. So, you know, I guess I'll go with Kamala. I just don't think, you know, you said this and it was true. No one wears Biden. Biden merch. No one wears Biden T shirts. I did have to point out, except for illegal showing up at the border, but no Americans wear Biden merch. I don't think that Kamala has people wearing her merch either. There's not merchandise. There's not. She's not somebody. People can be enthusiastic.

[Clay Travis]

Obama people were fired up about. They. They have not had a candidate that people were really fired up about since 2008, 2012, and, you know, Hillary, for whatever you want to say about Hillary. People were not in love with Hillary.

[Buck Sexton]

There were a lot of women of Hillary's generation who I do think were.

[Clay Travis]

Were there on her team.

[Buck Sexton]

Saw.

[Clay Travis]

Yeah, saw her.

[Buck Sexton]

Saw themselves in Hillary's ascent. The ultimate glass ceiling, all that stuff. Right. So I think that there was, you know, and the Clinton brand was a

[Clay Travis]

brand with her, worked, certainly. There was never Biden. I don't think there's any real enthusiasm for Kamala. I think you're right. And I do think this thing could drag a while, which is why I'm saying black voters staying behind Kamala and supporting her, black women in particular. I think it's going to be hard to dislodge that unity.

[Buck Sexton]

I think it's. By the way, I'm going to bring Gavin. I'm going to bring Gavin into the chat, so to speak, here. Gavin Newsom. I think it's very. I think he says, if he. When he's running Clay, he says, what did Kamala do for you? He looks at the black community, so to speak. He speaks to them and says, what did Kamala do for you when she was vice president? She do anything for you? Why would you go with her? Again, you know, I, Gavin Newsom, will deliver now, you and I, and maybe all the black Democrat voters will laugh. But it's a pitch. It's a pitch that he can make. I, I don't, I don't think that Kamala has anything she could point to that she has done for the black community while she was vice president. Now she'll say, I'm vice president, not president. But, you know, I see more openings here.

[Clay Travis]

Stat. That blows people away a little bit. Do you know what percentage of the population in California is black?

[Buck Sexton]

Like seven or something. It's not big.

[Clay Travis]

I think it's eight. But yeah, like, I think a lot of people think as California, oh, it has a large black population. It actually has a tiny black population relative to a lot of southern states. And I think that's one reason why Kamala Harris, when she was in California, often said, oh, I'm of Indian descent and played that up as much or more than being black. Final hour of the week.

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[Clay Travis]

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