Hour 2 - Saving Black Lives

Summary

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The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show

Episode: Hour 2 - Saving Black Lives
Date: August 20, 2025

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Overview:

This episode centers on public safety, crime rates—particularly in Washington, D.C.—and the politics and policies surrounding law enforcement in American cities. Hosts Clay Travis and Buck Sexton engage with Heather Mac Donald, fellow at the Manhattan Institute and author of "When Race Trumps Merit" and "The War on Cops." The conversation draws on crime statistics, the failures of progressive criminal justice policies, the impact on black communities, and the political narratives shaping public perceptions of crime.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The D.C. Crime Debate and Trump’s “Liberation Day”

• Clay Travis introduces Heather Mac Donald ([02:05]):

  • Mac Donald is brought in as an expert on criminal justice and race-based policy.

• Heather Mac Donald on the political response to D.C. crime ([02:51]):

  • Accuses national Democrats of defending high crime and “normalizing the unacceptable.”
  • Praises Trump’s Aug. 11 "Liberation Day" speech as “breaking with the dominant ideology” that excuses crime.
  • Criticizes Democrats for framing crime as a racial issue rather than a matter of public safety.
  • Quote:

    “We are no longer going to make excuses for crime. This is something we can control.”
    — Heather Mac Donald ([03:16])

• Argues that claims of falling D.C. crime rates are misleading—cites ongoing and unacceptable violence, particularly fatal incidents affecting children.

  • Quote:

    “Are you defending 3-year-olds being shot fatally in the head sitting in their car, as has happened over the last couple of years regularly? You cannot defend that. And yet that’s what the Democrats are doing.”
    — Heather Mac Donald ([04:19])

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2. Media Narratives and Shifts in Public Discourse

• Buck Sexton on media acknowledgment ([04:35]):

  • Reads from a New York Times editorial admitting that “Defund the Police” was harmful and linked to increased crime.
  • Wonders at the apparent reversal in left-leaning media and its possible cultural significance.

• Mac Donald’s response regarding media ([05:50]):

  • Notes the disconnect between the editorial page and news reporters in the NYT.

  • Reiterates that police deter crime and protect black lives; removing support results in more victimization.

  • Quote:

    “If your claim is to care about black lives, you have to support the police because they are the strongest agency… dedicated to saving black lives.”
    — Heather Mac Donald ([07:09])

  • Describes first-hand experiences at police community meetings, where law-abiding black residents request more police—not less.

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3. Crime Statistics: Are Reports Trustworthy?

• Clay Travis on DC crime stats skepticism ([07:48]):

  • Wonders if reported decreases in crime (about 30%) are reliable or potentially fudged.

• Mac Donald’s response on integrity of crime stats ([08:33]):

  • Acknowledges potential for manipulation, noting pressure on precinct commanders to lower crime stats, particularly in proactive departments (e.g., NYPD’s CompStat).

  • Nonetheless, finds DC’s drop consistent with national trends—not an outlier.

  • Critiques the fixation on statistical drops from an unacceptable baseline:

    • Even conceding a drop, the rates of violence and mayhem remain intolerably high.
    • Argues that any non-trivial number of daily violent crimes (e.g., “10 violent crimes, 14 car thefts, six, three juveniles shot a day”) should not be normalized.
    • Quote:

      “Is it acceptable that our homicide rate is 27 times that of London’s and 60 times that of Switzerland? The only possible response is none of that is acceptable.”
      — Heather Mac Donald ([10:34])

  • Blames reluctance to enforce the law on fears of racial disparity, asserting that enforcement should serve the law-abiding public.

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4. Policy Bright Spots: Lessons from New York City

• Buck Sexton asks for positive policing models ([12:49]):

  • Is there a city/state handling violent crime notably well and offering scalable lessons?

• Mac Donald credits old New York City model ([13:54]):

  • Praises 1990s NYPD (Bratton, Safer, Kelly) for cutting crime by up to 80% through accountability and focus on public disorder.
  • Notes public order policies (e.g., against encampments, public drug use, and squalor) are critical to safe cities.
  • Calls Trump’s instinct against accepting disorder “thrilling” and potentially epoch-shifting.
    • Quote:

      “Trump’s Liberation Day speech could be epic changing if people get rid of the idea that they should just accept squalor, disorder, and violence as the normal part...of American cities.”
      — Heather Mac Donald ([15:27])

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5. The Real Consequences of “Sanctuary City” Policies

• Buck Sexton transitions to immigration/crime overlap ([22:42]):
  • Outlines the problem with cities refusing to cooperate with ICE, letting dangerous undocumented criminals back onto the streets.
  • Plays a clip from Stephen Miller ([25:37]):
    • Describes how sanctuary policies result in child predators being released instead of handed to ICE, causing repeat offenses.
    • Quote:

      “What they’re doing...is evil. And President Trump will see that they are held to account for their crimes.”
      — Stephen Miller ([26:19])

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6. Public Perceptions: Who Wants Less Policing?

• Clay Travis and Buck Sexton share personal anecdotes ([27:14]):

  • Emphasize that, aside from criminals and left-wing activists in safe areas, most people—including those in high-crime neighborhoods—want more policing.

• Sen. J.D. Vance at Union Station, D.C. ([29:40]):

  • Cites D.C.’s high crime, dismisses protestors calling for less law enforcement.
    • Quote:

      “Let’s free D.C. from lawlessness. Let’s free Washington D.C. from one of the highest murder rates in the entire world.”
      — J.D. Vance ([29:51])

    • Points out irony of privileged activists protesting policies that promote safety for vulnerable residents.

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7. The Politics of Crime and Racial Narratives

• Buck and Clay discuss Democratic politicians, including L.A. Mayor Karen Bass, who frame enforcement against crime as racially motivated ([32:54]).

  • Clip from Karen Bass ([33:13]):
    • Expresses concern that anti-crime measures target “young black and brown youth” and don’t work, claiming that crime is already going down.

• Travis & Sexton rebut ([34:23]):

  • Argue that law enforcement protects, rather than oppresses, minorities in high-crime areas.
  • Point out the faulty logic: Not enforcing the law disproportionately harms law-abiding black and brown victims.

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8. Root Causes: Poverty, Family Structure, and Crime

• Buck Sexton and Clay Travis push back on the poverty-crime narrative ([35:42]):

  • Cite New York City data showing Asian subgroups (with high poverty rates) have very low crime rates, suggesting poverty alone doesn’t explain violent crime.

  • Suggest the lack of fathers in the home is a major factor—pointing to changes in family structure in black America since the 1950s.

  • Quote:

    “I think we could cure 90% of our social ills in this country if dads were at home.”
    — Buck Sexton ([36:44])

  • Reference Thomas Sowell’s arguments about family structure and youth outcomes.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Democratic response to D.C. crime:

  “Their argument is a set of non sequiturs. They say, well, crime isn't bad in D.C. because it went down somewhat last year. That's a. So what?”
  — Heather Mac Donald ([03:57])

• On black community attitudes:

  “All I hear from the good law abiding black residents there, especially the elderly ladies in these fantastic hats, is the police are our friends. Please, Jesus, send more police.”
  — Heather Mac Donald ([07:31])

• On fixing crime:

  “It does not have to be that way at the border. It does not have to be that way with crime in major American cities. We do not have to live like this.”
  — Clay Travis ([21:42])

• On sanctuary cities:

  “They are willing to obstruct federal law enforcement efforts…they would rather a child predator who is an illegal alien be back out in circulation...”
  — Buck Sexton ([23:33])

• On real solutions vs. politics:

  “Whether or not you should have fewer murders is not a debatable thing to me. Hey, I'm in favor of people being alive for as long as they possibly can. Seems like something that should be beyond politics.”
  — Buck Sexton ([32:49])

• On the root of social ills:

  “If you want to go to where it comes from at its most baseline level, this is one of the things that I think Thomas Sowell has done such a good job of arguing about...if you control for households where there's a dad in the home...I bet the crime disparity between all these different groups evaporates.”
  — Buck Sexton ([36:40])

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Heather Mac Donald joins, D.C. crime debate: [02:05 – 04:35]
• NYT editorial shift, role of police: [04:35 – 07:48]
• Crime statistics, challenges of measurement: [07:48 – 12:49]
• Best city/state policing practices (NYC model): [12:49 – 15:47]
• Sanctuary cities, ICE and violent crime: [22:42 – 27:14]
• Who wants less policing, anecdotes & Vance speech: [27:14 – 30:28]
• Politics of crime enforcement, race discourse: [32:54 – 35:42]
• Family structure, poverty, and crime causes: [35:42 – 36:44]

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Summary

The episode is a robust critique of progressive criminal justice policies, with a cross-cutting theme that true concern for black lives requires supporting effective policing rather than defunding or delegitimizing it. The hosts and guest challenge statistical misdirection, emphasize personal responsibility, and advocate for a return to proven law enforcement strategies—from the NYPD “CompStat revolution” to reestablishing expectations of order in public spaces. The segment also highlights the disconnect between left-leaning activists and working-class urban residents, and dissects the impact of family structure and community stability on crime rates. Throughout, the tone is passionate, combative, and insistent on the urgency of reclaiming safety and sanity in American public life.

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This summary captures the main arguments, statistics, and rhetorical moments from the hour, providing a thorough guide for listeners and non-listeners alike.

Transcript

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[Clay Travis]

Second hour of play and Buck kicks off. Now we're joined by Heather McDonald, Manhattan Institute fellow author of When Race, Trump's Merit and the War on Cops. Particularly apropos in light of today's discussion here. Heather, always great to have you on the program.

[Heather Mac Donald]

Thank you so much Buck. It's great to be with you guys.

[Clay Travis]

So you must be watching this debate play out over specifically the D.C. crime rate but more broadly, obviously this brings in a lot of arguments that you've heard from the other side in the past and counterarguments that you've been making. Are you surprised that it seems that so many national level Democrats have fallen into the trap of defending the indefensible, which is the D.C. crime rate? What's your perspective on this?

[Heather Mac Donald]

Well, I think this is one of the greatest moments of the Trump presidency. His Aug. 11 Liberation Day speech just sent chills down my spine. And I mean in a good way. Words like we are not going to let it happen anymore. We're not going to take it, we're not going to lose our cities, we're taking our capital back. He has finally broken fully with the dominant ideology in America, which is to normalize the unacceptable, to define deviancy down. And Trump is saying, we are no longer going to make excuses for crime. This is something we can control. The Democrats have spent decades trying to write this off, to say, well, it's just kind of a normal aspect of cities. A lot of this almost entirety of the criminal justice discourse on the Democratic side is driven by race considerations. They've of course played the race card here. So no, I'm not surprised. It has just brought out their innate tendencies to normalize crime in an extraordinarily vivid way. And they are going to lose the debate. There's just no question. You cannot, as you say, they are defending the indefensible. Their argument is a set of non sequiturs. They say, well, crime isn't bad in D.C. because it went down somewhat last year. That's a. So what? The fact is, are you defending 3 year olds being shot fatally in the head sitting in their car, as has happened over the last couple of years regularly? You cannot defend that. And yet that's what the Democrats are doing.

[Buck Sexton]

Heather, I actually thought about you on Sunday when I read the New York Times editorial which basically said, hey, Heather McDonald was right about everything, without saying, Heather McDonald was right about everything. I don't know if you officially read that editorial, but let me just read to you from the New York Times Sunday. And I want to just get your thoughts on the cultural winds shifting that would allow this to occur during the. This is the New York Times. During the 2020 protests, many progressives embrace calls to, quote, defund the police, including prominent Democrats Kamala Harris, AOC Eric Garcetti, then Mayor of Los Angeles. And the protesters had an effect. Officers were disheartened by public criticisms, quit their jobs, police departments had staffing shortages Overall, crime surged and Democrats have to recognize that they were responsible for it and their arguments created this. Did you ever think the New York Times would say this when it came to policing? And what is the significance of them completely abandoning the cultural arguments they were making certainly five years ago?

[Heather Mac Donald]

Well, the editorial board would appear to be a little tiny island of sanity in the paper. Large because their news coverage is continuing to harp on the theme that Trump is a fascist by daring to talk about crime in D.C. and worse, daring to do something about it. And this is all just a race based ploy to try and go after black cities. So there's an absolute split in sensibility there. But it is a good thing. I'll take every win I can get. It is a good thing that the editorial board has put out a little strand of sanity there that says that the police are not the problem in high crime communities, criminals are. And when you demoralize the police, when you delegitimate prosecution and arrests, there's only one thing that's going to happen. You're not going to get peace. You're going to get more criminal victimization. And if your claim is, and this is of course a complete hypocritical pose, but if your claim is to care about black lives, you have to support the police because they are the strongest agency in any city in any state that is dedicated to saving black lives. They make arrests, they deter crime. The National Guard there is there now just to deter crime. Further, it is not there as some kind of occupying force. It is using its command presence. And when the cops back off, criminals take over. I have spent years going to police community meetings in high crime areas like the south side of Chicago or central Harlem or Brooklyn. And all I hear from the good law abiding black residents there, especially the elderly ladies in these fantastic hats, is the police are our friends. Please, Jesus, send more police.

[Clay Travis]

Yeah. Heather McDonald with us here from the Manhattan Institute. War on Cops is her excellent book. Heather, you are somebody who also not just looks at the narratives, but looks at the stats, the numbers. And have you been able to. I know it's hard at some level because you have to rely on the DC Crime stats from DC Right. Meaning that the police, if they're cooking the books, it might be a little tough to see that because you have to rely on the frontline numbers at some level that they're putting out there. But have you looked into that at all? Do you think it is possible and or likely that this 30% crime drop, which as you pointed out isn't even really significant, but that that 30% crime drop may be the result of some fudging of the numbers.

[Heather Mac Donald]

I haven't looked into that personally. It is in line with the crime drop that we're seeing in the rest of the country. So if it were like twice as much, that would be a real red flag. But I can say, you know, there's constant pressure and ironically, in the police departments that are the best run, which means the ones that are most aggressive towards their own police commanders, that are demanding accountability, that are demanding that those account, that those commanders have a plan for lowering crime. And the top brass should be monitoring their numbers on a daily, daily, if not hourly basis. So those precinct commanders are in the hot seat under what was known in New York city as the CompStat system. They're going to feel the most pressure to get their crime statistics down. And if they don't have 100% integrity, they're the more likely to possibly declassify things. Muck around with how you categorize crime. The police departments that are lackadaisical, that don't have a strong commencement structure, their precinct commanders are under less pressure. So it's a weird thing and it's something that departments have to fight. The New York Police Department has a whole unit dedicated to police integrity and going after corruption. And it's not well loved in the department. But this is a constant battle. I can't say in this case, but again, I would say that conservatives should not be pulled into this game that the liberals are playing, which is that, well, because crime dropped 27% last year compared to its overwhelmingly high post George Floyd race riots thing, that everything is okay and conservatives saying, well, it's still bad. Is that a true crime drop or not? The fact is you can concede that crime has dropped in the last two years in Washington D.C. and still say, so what? I don't care. Is it acceptable that every single day in Washington D.C. there were 10 violent crimes, 14 car thefts, six, three juveniles shot a day? Is that acceptable? Is it acceptable that our homicide rate is 27 times that of London's and 60 times that of Switzerland? The only possible response is none of that is acceptable? And that is what is so thrilling about Trump's instincts. It's not even the details of the plan. It's that he has instincts that are correct, which is that any level of crime is not compatible with a civilized society. Children being shot, cars being stolen, mass looting going on, the carjackings. And it's overwhelmingly juvenile. 60% of all carjackings in D.C. are juveniles. TRUMP is correct. They are not punished. In 2023, there were five girls ages 12 to 15 who beat to death a 64 year old cancer victim weighing 110 pounds. They filmed themselves laughing as they stomped and beat him to death. None of them had long sentences. The most they're serving time Is until they're 21. Most of them will be out long before that. Trump is absolutely right. D.C. has a soft on crime approach. That must change just as every progressive prosecutor. It's all driven by not wanting it to have a racially disparate impact on black criminals. All law enforcement will simply because the brack crime rate is so high. In D.C. blacks commit about 96% of all homicides, even though they're only 43% of the population. Whites commit just under over 1% of the homicides, though they're 39%. You do not. That should not affect how you enforce the law. You enforce the law to protect the law abiding, not to protect the criminals.

[Buck Sexton]

Not only that, Heather, and the people who are the victims overwhelmingly would be black too. So when you say, oh, we're arresting people disproportionately for based on race, you're also disproportionately protecting people who are race. Right, because most black murder victims are going to be killed by black murderers. But last question for you here. And I love all the data you provide. Is there a city or a state based on the data that you have seen that is handling violent crime better than any others and do they have policies that should be replicated nationwide? We're fortunate because we have these 50 different federal systems so we can try experiments. And the idea is somebody in a state does something good, hopefully it spreads. Is there any one city or state that you would point to and say, boy, from a violent crime perspective, these guys and gals are doing great. We should be copying more of what they're doing nationwide. Any positive out there?

[Heather Mac Donald]

Well, until recently I would have said New York City because of the Compstat revolution, the accountability revolution, where Police Chief William Bratton followed up by William sit with.

[Clay Travis]

Sapphire.

[Heather Mac Donald]

We are going. Kelly, go ahead.

[Clay Travis]

No, no, I just. Safer. Kelly, I was trying to give you the next commissioner, but go ahead.

[Heather Mac Donald]

Right, right. Kelly said we are going to bring this down. They brought, they brought crime and homicides down 80% by enforcing the law and above all by paying attention to public disorder. That's why also the, the Trump initiative against the encampments is so Important, because this is something else that simply should not be tolerated in a city. You cannot have public space overcome by people urinating, defecating, shooting up drugs in public. This is not acceptable. We cannot define deviancy down. So New York was very good in paying attention to public order, in using its officers proactively to use their powers of observation to stop people suspected of carrying guns. It had an enormous effect. They've backslid in recent years. Now they've got a pretty good commissioner, Jessica Tisch. So that's good. But it's a constant battle and, you know, we need politicians to have the basic expectation that crime is not normal. And again, it just cannot be stated enough. Buck and Clay Trump's Liberation Day speech could be epic changing if people get rid of the idea that they should just accept squalor, disorder and violence as the normal part and also mass looting, mass shoplifting as simply normal parts of American cities.

[Clay Travis]

Heather McDonald, everybody. Always excellent, Heather, thank you so much.

[Heather Mac Donald]

Thanks so much.

[Clay Travis]

Mike and Clark, this is something that I should talk to you about now because we're just discussing crime and sure, Trump, the anti crime revolution. That's fantastic. And we're hoping that this has huge ramifications across the country in a lot of cities. But just like with so many things, you are your first and last line of defense. You for your family, for yourself, for your home. This is where Sabre comes in. Yeah, I want Trump to be hugely successful in national crime stats dropping, but there's still a lot of crime out there and you need to be prepared. And if you want non lethal options to defend yourself, Sabre is simply the best. I want to be very clear about this. A lot of you are two a people. I'm a two way guy. I've got plenty of guns right here in the room with me in the studio. But I also believe in having less lethal options when the situation requires it. And my wife just prefers when she's, you know, I'll conceal carry, but she will conceal carry if you will. Not a firearm, but non lethal options. She likes the pepper sprays and the pepper gels from Sabre. Sabre is the best in class. And this is a family owned company that's been in business for over 50 years. Clay and I know the CEO, he relies on his own products to defend himself, his wife and his kids. So trust me when I say these are tested, reliable and get the job done. For non lethal self defense, their projectile devices in the shape of either a rifle or a pistol, depends on the, on the model, are so effective and they will stop the threat. Act now to protect yourself and your family. Save 15% on Sabre's mega bundle with extra projectiles magazine and practice targets. The website to go to is Sabre. Now listen to the spelling S A b r e saberradio.com that's saberradio.com or call 844-824 safe.

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[Buck Sexton]

But you could on the Sunday Hang with Clay and Buck podcast this Labor.

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[Buck Sexton]

Welcome back in Clay Travis Buck Sexton show. Our thanks to Heather McDonald. And the reason I love Heather and we've had her on a lot in the past years is data tells a story. And a lot of people don't want to look at the tape, the data and what she said. And I think whoever created this graphic the first time, I think it really cut through the noise. She reinforced it here. Basically, if you're in London, you have and you're comparing London, which obviously is the capital of England, and you're comparing it to D.C. which is capital of the United States. You are 30 times as likely to be murdered in Washington, D.C. as you are in London. I think that's a stat that it's hard to not have your eyebrows raised by. And I think Trump saw this data and I think a lot of the people have seen it. And what it tells us is we have just come to accept very, very high rates of violent crime as standard. And what Trump did in D.C. is actually seen as revolutionary. But it's just basic common sense. We shouldn't have to live like this. Any of us in danger that we're going to be murdered at any moment.

[Clay Travis]

And I do like to compare these things because I think it's, it's important for us to see that with the right political leadership, you can just do things and you can just fix things. We were led to believe by the Democrats and the Democrat aligned media that the border was, there was no way to fix this. Oh, asylum. Oh, there's all the, oh, too many people. Trump fixed it in 30 days, 60 days. I mean, you know, whatever timeline you want to look at, guess what, it doesn't have to be that way at the border. It does not have to be that way with crime in major American cities. We do not have to live like this. And that is the mental shift that is so important. And it affects everything, by the way. It affects business investment, it affects people's how they feel about where they live and walking down the streets. And it truly is the Republican position. We want everybody to be safe in every neighborhood in America and to feel good about where they live in terms of safety. No question.

[Buck Sexton]

Amen.

[Clay Travis]

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[Stephen Miller]

Play three, you'll have a situation where local police in Boston will arrest an illegal alien who is a child predator, and ICE will then send what's called a detainer request or a hold request, and we'll say, don't release this person. Hand them over to ice and we'll remove this child predator from our community. Insist instead, these sanctuary mayors will order the police department to ignore the federal request to set them free, out of the jail, out of the prison, and they will go back into the community, and then they will reoffend. They will hurt another little girl, they will hurt another little boy. And then ICE has to spend weeks trying to scouring the community to find this public safety threat. What they're doing, Sean, is evil. And President Trump will see that they are held to account for their crimes.

[Clay Travis]

It's. It is just totally true. And I think everyone needs this. But, Clay, that goes to the point of it's not just, oh, we don't want people who are, oh, they're doing the jobs Americans won't do. And all the propaganda about how everybody who comes here illegally is about to start Google and is always volunteering at their church, you know, baked goods day on Sunday or something. I mean, that's what they're always saying. No, there are people who are truly public safety threats. Murderers, gang members, rapists, child rapists, who ICE is saying, hey, that guy's not even supposed to. Guys, we're talking about that stuff. That guy's not even supposed to be in the country. Can you hold them for us for a minute? And the policy, the open and stated policy of these cities is no, let the child rapist go. We can't let immigration enforcement have him.

[Buck Sexton]

This is where, again, I think Trump sometimes just innately hits on things because their basic common sense they have got right now at Union Station, the main train depot in Washington D.C. stephen Miller is there and J.D. vance is there. They are shaking hands with the National Guard troops who are deployed in D.C. right now. There are protesters outside of Union Station demanding that there be less security in Washington D.C. and I just come back to a very basic question. Unless you are a criminal, can you ever remember a time in your life where you thought, I wish there were way fewer police officers here? I'll tell you, I do a lot of public events, sporting, sporting events in particular. There's never been a time in my life where I have been at a big college football game and I've thought, you know what? I wish there were fewer cops here. I wish there were fewer campus security officials. The only people who want less crime are two people. Buck one is criminals. Because remember, producer Ali can come up on this. The last time we were in D.C. i was going to get in a van to do a Piers Morgan hit and producer Allie was getting nervous because it was getting too close to our showtime. Ali can pull her mic up. What did we see in an alley as we were walking to get into the, into that van at 11:50am we.

[Clay Travis]

Saw a full on drug deal going.

[Buck Sexton]

Down, legit drug deal, guy standing guard. We walk by the alley, they see that we are not threats, right? We're not cops. Middle of the day, drug deals going on. Those guys don't want more cops around. And the only other group that does not want more cops around is rich left wing activists who live in areas where they feel no crime and have so reflexively adopted anti Trump sentiment that they are just very comfortable screaming about this. And in fact, J.D. vance just spoke about this cut 30. This just happened at Union Station. J.D. vance addressing this issue directly. Play it.

[J.D. Vance]

The DC has a terrible crime problem. You just got to look around. Obviously D.C. has a terrible crime problem. The Department of Justice statistics back it up. The FBI statistics back it up. Just talk to a resident of this city, this beautiful, great American city, don't they deserve, I mean we talk about human rights, we hear these people outside screaming, Free D.C. let's free D.C. from lawlessness. Let's free Washington D.C. from one of the highest murder rates in the entire world. Let's free Washington D.C. so that young families can walk around and feel safe and secure. That's what we're trying to free DC From. And as Stephen said, it's kind of bizarre that we have a bunch of old, primarily white people who are out there protesting the policies that keep people safe when they've never felt danger in their Entire lives.

[Clay Travis]

This is the, this is the delusional purple haired wannabe civil rights marchers of the left. I mean, that's, that's what this is. They think any time they can stand against Trump and also anytime they can stand against police. So unless it's January six related, then they want SWAT teams. Isn't that amazing? Anyone who was involved with January six, the Democrats across the board, they wanted to send in SWAT teams, you know, flashbangs, grab them. That old lady, she walked into the open doors and she was in there for three minutes. Let's throw flashbangs into her house and ruin the rest of her life and try to lock her up for years and put her in solitary confinement. No concerns from the Democrats about police state tactics there. But if you're part of a, of a, you know, feral mob that murders somebody on the streets of D.C. oh, we don't want, we don't want to hurt your, you know, your future prospects in life. Like, let's go, let's go easy on these individuals. What's going on here? It's, it's nonsense.

[Buck Sexton]

I just, I don't understand. First of all, we talk about this a lot and I do think it's important politics. Oftentimes there's two different tracks. One is, is it good politically? Another is, is it good for the country? Right. I think this is an, a great example of Trump nailing it on two fronts. It is good politically to be against violent crime. It has been good politically, whether you're a Democrat, Republican or an Independent to historically have been opposed to violent crime. So it is a political benefit. Also, fewer victims of violent crime is a good thing. There, there are so many things we can sit around and have nuanced debate about. Should. I'll give you an example. How should food stamps deal with sugary sodas and potato chips? Like, okay, we could have a real debate about that.

[Clay Travis]

There's some arguments on both sides of that. I actually think that the cutting the sugar thing is probably the better.

[Buck Sexton]

I think you and I are probably going to be somewhat aligned on that. But there are reasonable arguments out there about what you should be able to buy with your SNAP funds. Right. Like that. Whether or not you should have fewer murders is not a debatable thing to me. Hey, I'm in favor of people being alive for as long as they possibly can. Seems like something that should be beyond politics.

[Clay Travis]

Well, the mayor of Los Angeles.

[Buck Sexton]

Yeah.

[Clay Travis]

Very explicitly laid out that this is, this is essentially a function, the, the desire not to enforce the law. More. Here is a prominent Democrat, a black woman who's the mayor of Los Angeles, saying that cracking down on crime in D.C. is. Well, you know what, I'll let her say it. Here she is. This is cut to play it.

[Heather Mac Donald]

I'm concerned about the way he is rolling that out in Washington D.C. which is essentially callingessentially going after young black and brown youth in Washington D.C. imposing.

[Big 3 Basketball Promo Announcer (Alternate)]

A curfew, saying that if they violate.

[Heather Mac Donald]

The curfew, the parents could be charged $500, saying that the kids could be detained and arrested. We've tried those people policies before. They do not work. And it's my understanding that crime was.

[Big 3 Basketball Promo Announcer (Alternate)]

Going down in Washington D.C. so what is the purpose of this?

[Clay Travis]

Okay, well that's the irrelevancy we keep hearing. Oh, crime is going down. Put that aside. We all know it's too dangerous.

[Buck Sexton]

From his historical all time highs, it's worth mentioning too.

[Clay Travis]

So FYI, yeah, it's essentially going after black and brown youth is the quote that she puts out there. Okay, so now we get to why Democrats take this very, you know, very emotional position. And as you pointed out, a lot of them are middle aged and retiree aged. You know, white Democrats. Yes, but they view this, they view enforcement of the law as inherently racist. Well, what does that say about their perspective? Like she's the one saying this. That's interesting.

[Buck Sexton]

Well, I think just at a very baseline level that actually leads to a conversation we should be having. Why are rates of violent crime so much higher for black and brown people such that they end up being arrested for rates of violent crime outside of the percentage of their overall population? That's a real conversation that an adult country would have and we would try to figure out adult solutions. I would also point out that a very easy, and I mentioned it with Heather McDonald, but a very easy counterpoint to this is why should non criminal black and brown citizens be held hostage effectively in their neighborhoods by criminal black and brown people? Well, you're actually, they're the victims of the violence that you're not willing to end.

[Clay Travis]

And there's a tremendous sensitivity on the left about, for example, in New York City, Asian is such a large. Asia is, here's a, here's a statement for everybody. A very large place. So when you say Asian and in the context of, if you watch any like uk, you know, shows, you know, scripted drama, they're always like, oh, these are Asian males. When they say Asian, they mean South Asian, overwhelmingly.

[Buck Sexton]

Right.

[Clay Travis]

I mean, when they're talking about South Asians in Britain, they're talking of people from India, from Pakistan. So to say Asian is such a broad thing. I bring this up, though, Clay, because the left would like you to believe that poverty and lack of opportunity is what leads to crime. Problem is, in New York City, they have very good data on this. And the subgroup within Asia of Pakistani and Bangladeshi individuals, for example, have higher poverty rates, higher poverty rates than black or Latino New York City residents and. And exponentially lower crime rates. This is just the data. So it's not about just. It's not just a poverty thing. And now we get into family formation. Now we get into cultural influences. Now we get into dads being home or not. If you control. You know what I mean? I don't have this data. If you control for households where there's a dad in the home, I get. I bet the crime disparity between all these different groups evaporates.

[Buck Sexton]

I think that we could cure 90% of our social ills in this country if dads were at home. This is my soapbox issue. If you want to go to where it comes from at its most baseline level, this is one of the things that I think Thomas Sowell has done such a good job of arguing about, because they've tried to say, hey, racism is what causes this crime discrepancy, this poverty issue, everything else. You go back and you look before the civil rights movement almost. I think it's like 75%, 80% of young black kids in America grew up with a dad at home. Think about that 1950s America. Black men were at home with their families, raising their kids. Now, I believe it's 25% of black households have a dad at home. And if you go and overlay that data, as Buck just said, and you look at crime rates, I think you would see overwhelmingly, dad, not home crime happens. Dad home crime comes down because these young men, they're acting out. They have no role models. They don't have a culture of male growth. Sometimes granddads try to do it, uncles try to do it. But that void in the household of the dad. And I'm not taking shots at single moms, because I know a lot of y' all out there are trying to do both jobs. Young girls do better in homes without dads than young boys do. And that is where I think a huge percentage of this violence comes from. That's the reality. And that's a conversation that a grown, healthy country would have instead of what you got there. Karen Bass saying, I'm concerned that if we enforce the law. Too many people who are black and brown are going to be arrested. So it's racist to enforce the law. What about all the black and brown people who are going to be victimized when you don't enforce the law? Do they have rights? I think they do. In fact, I think they should be protected. We should protect the people who don't break the law. Yesterday had an incredible day. Left the show a little bit early, went down to Chattanooga, spoke to the Hamilton County Young Republican group. Awesome crowd. Great event. And before that I went and toured Legacy Box and if you're watching on the live stream right now and I'm sure we'll clip this and we will share it on YouTube. You can see some of my tour. We had somebody walking around taking footage as I toured the factory at Legacy Box. And so you can see how they digitally transfer old media. More VCRs than I've seen ever took me back in time. I felt like it was 1985. Super 8 film, photos, audio tapes, 19 different media they can turn into digital files. That's why Legacy Box exists, to help you preserve and relive your family's history. I even got to help a little bit with some of the transfers. Very little bit. But it was awesome just to see how this happens. They've done it for a million and a half families to date. When they take on your project, they stay in touch with you every step of the way. Then they'll send everything back. You get back all of your originals with a digital link. Allows you to see your stored memories up in the cloud as well and also on a digital file so that you can share it easily with your friends and family. This business really is about preserving your family's history and your family's legacy and it is incredible to see in person. Go check them out. Legacy box.com Clay for 50 off your order that is legacybox.com Clay, Adam and Nick. They're doing an incredible job. Everybody there. I had an awesome day touring it. Legacybox.com clay news and politics. But also a little comic relief. Clay Travis and Buck Sexton. Find them on the free iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

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[Big 3 Basketball Promo Announcer (Alternate)]

The reviews and ratings are in and Ice Cube's Big Three is the surprise hit of the summer and to cap off the season, iHeart presents the Big 3 Basketball Championship and 8th Annual Big 3 All Star Game this coming Sunday, August 24th. Live from Orlando. The remaining two teams fight it out for the Big 3 Championship Dr. J Trophy in the most physical, fierce and competitive basketball league in the world. Don't miss the wild conclusion of Big Three's eighth and most historic season ever. This is the game no one wants to lose and there's no crying in the Big three. The action starts with the Big Three eighth Annual All Star Game. Don't miss All Stars Dwight Howard, Montrez Harrell, MVP Michael Beasley, Lance with make you Dan Stevenson, Jordan Crawford, Greg Monroe, Earl Clark, Nazir Kor and more show you why they are the best three on three basketball players in the world. Big three's exciting all star game plus the crowning of a new big three champion. The no holds part action starts Sunday at 2pm Eastern, 11 Pacific only on CBS.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Hey there. I'm Mary Kathryn Ham.

[Carol Markowitz]

And I'm Carol Markowitz. We've been in political media for a long time.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Long enough to know that it's gotten, well, a little insane.

[Carol Markowitz]

That's why we started Normalely, a podcast for people who are over the hysteria and just want clarity.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

We talk about the issues that actually matter to the country without panic, without yelling, and with a healthy dose of humor.

[Carol Markowitz]

We don't take ourselves too seriously, but we do take the truth seriously.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

So if you're into common sense, sanity and some occasional sass, you're our kind of people. Catch new episodes of Normally every Tuesday.

[Carol Markowitz]

And Thursday on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen.

[Buck Sexton]

When we come back, we will take some of your talk back some of your calls. No guest 3rd hour, 800-282-2882. You can react to a variety of different topics that we have discussed in the first couple of hours. The Trump administration in D.C. accelerating their push to lower the rates of violent crime. And we'll give you a little bit of an update on the Ukraine and Russia situation. Plus Mississippi. Now maybe we can have some more fun with that. I really do like Buck's idea. Earlier on Scarborough, I got a Kaepernick story and Superman story for you too. Not connected those two. What else you got for us, Buck?

[Clay Travis]

It's going to be a great third hour. Just stick around with us and you'll see some people are saying fabulous iheart.

[Big 3 Basketball Promo Announcer]

Presents the Big three Playoffs this Sunday. The remaining four teams battle to make the championship in the most physical, fierce and competitive basketball league in the world. The action starts with the Big three Monster Energy celebrity game. Then Dwight Howard and his Ellie Riot take on Montrez Harrell and Dr. J Chicago triplets. The finale will see popular Maya Miami 305 with stars MVP Michael Beasley and Lance Stevenson take on Nancy Lieberman's Dallas Power who will make it to the Big Three championship. The no holds barred action starts Sunday at 3pm Eastern, 12 Pacific only on.

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[Mary Kathryn Ham]

You want smart political talk without the meltdowns? We got you and I'm Carol Markowitz. And I'm Mary Kathryn Hamm. We've been around the block in media and we're doing things differently.

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[Mary Kathryn Ham]

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