Hour 3 - Gonna Be Gavin

Summary

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The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show

Episode: Hour 3 - Gonna Be Gavin

Date: November 4, 2025
Host: Clay Travis and Buck Sexton

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Overview

In this fast-paced hour, Clay Travis and Buck Sexton analyze the political mood ahead of major elections in New York City, Virginia, New Jersey, and California, with particular focus on the potential for Gavin Newsom to become the face of the Democratic party’s 2028 presidential bid. The hosts discuss voter frustration, Democratic strategy, and public safety, contrast past Republican decisions with current Democratic narratives, and reflect on the legacy of Dick Cheney upon news of his death. Through humor and candid debate, they express skepticism toward left-leaning media, explore California’s influence on national politics, and critique the persistent use of identity politics.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Elections and the National Mood

• Voter Engagement: Buck urges listeners to vote in local races, underscoring the importance of “down-ballot” offices (e.g., alderman) and the broader “vibe of frustration” among Democrats.
• Democratic Frustration: Democrats are, in Buck’s words, “vent[ing] their spleen” after repeated losses to Trump and the GOP, focusing on symbolic opposition rather than policy substance.
  • “It’s emotional manipulation in place of an argument. It’s very effective… in mass psychology and mass politics.” — Buck, [02:17]

2. Gavin Newsom as the Next Democratic Nominee

• Newsom’s Rhetoric: The hosts criticize Newsom for “blatant lying” and argue Democrats require such a candidate, since they believe the party “is wrong about everything.”

  • “It’s going to be Newsom and he’s going to lie blatantly like this.” — Clay, [05:22]

• Notable Audio:

  • “Nothing I dislike more than the politician that sits there and lies to you. And we all just sit there rolling our eyes going, give me a break.” — Gavin Newsom (clip played), [19:05]
  • Clay and Buck, with amusement, point out the hypocrisy.

• Newsom/AOC Ticket Speculation:

  • Buck theorizes a Newsom/AOC ticket could be effective, appealing to both blue-state progressives and moderate “purple” voters.
    • “I still think it’s probably AOC as VP makes the most sense, especially seeing what’s going on... Then Gavin Newsom does his whole sweet talking... and all of a sudden you have a real formidable ticket.” — Buck, [19:27]

3. Public Safety & “Trump Was Right” Narrative

• DC Crime Drop: Buck highlights a 60% drop in the Washington, DC murder rate and a 30% overall crime reduction, attributing it to Trump’s policies—contrasting this with Democrat narratives.
  • “The murder rate since Trump has tried to do his security plan in D.C. is down 60%... So it is working. It’s not perfect, but it’s working.” — Buck, [03:35]
• Newsom’s Focus: Critique of Newsom for shifting the focus to immigration and “fearmongering,” rather than crime and public safety.

4. Iraq War, Republican Accountability, & Dick Cheney’s Death

• Republican Self-Reflection: Buck and Clay both argue that the Iraq War was a foundational mistake, with Buck noting bipartisan responsibility but with “the charge... led by a Republican administration.” He reflects that the Republican Party learned from this mistake, while Democrats have yet to own miscalculations like their COVID response.
  • “Iraq war was a mistake. We should not have done it. Biggest mistake the Republican Party has made in the 21st century.” — Buck, [23:05]
• Cheney’s Legacy: Dick Cheney, who had died the previous day, is discussed with nuance:
  • “He did have a remarkable career...he loved his country....But he was wrong on some big stuff.” — Buck, [11:17]
  • Both distinguish between bad decisions made in good faith and those made with malice.
• Halliburton Myth: Buck fiercely pushes back on the narrative that Cheney profited from war contracts, citing Cheney’s divestment from Halliburton before office.
  • “He had to divest from Halliburton when he went into government. And that is what happened.” — Buck, [22:41]

5. COVID, Historical Judgment, and Political Double Standards

• Will Democrats Admit COVID Failures?: Clay questions whether Democrats will admit to mistakes during COVID as Republicans have with Iraq. Buck is doubtful, predicting that they “would do it again.”
• War Decision Parallels: The duo discuss historical military blunders, noting that poor judgment is common and should be evaluated factually rather than ideologically.

6. California, Gerrymandering, and Demographic Shifts

• Schwarzenegger Clip & Prop 50: Buck plays a clip from Arnold Schwarzenegger criticizing California’s gerrymandering, highlighting one-party dominance and the irony of Democrats decrying gerrymandering elsewhere.
  • “Even Schwarzenegger...sees what this is. They complain about gerrymandering where they’re not doing it, and they do it to the absolute max where they can.” — Buck, [32:55]
• Population Trends: Clay notes that population movement toward “red states” will impact the 2030 census and, ultimately, political power.

7. Identity Politics and Media Accountability

• Karine Jean-Pierre’s Book Tour: Clay and Buck mock Jean-Pierre’s frequent references to her own identity as a shield against criticism.
  • “No one cares that she’s black and gay. We care that she's dumb and was in a position of power.” — Clay, [38:17]

8. Humor & “On the Road” Moments

• Light banter about book promotions, Clay’s local election voting confusion, and Alexi Lalas searching for Clay’s book in California.
• A playful exchange about the notion of a single copy of Clay’s book becoming a “golden idol in Indiana Jones" at a Manhattan Beach bookstore. [39:44]

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Notable Quotes & Timestamps

• Emotional Politics:
  • “It’s emotional manipulation in place of an argument. It’s very effective, unfortunately, in mass psychology and mass politics.” — Buck Sexton, [02:17]
• Gavin Newsom on Politicians Lying (Ironically):
  • “Nothing I dislike more than the politician that sits there and lies to you. And we all just sit there rolling our eyes going, give me a break.” — Gavin Newsom (clip), [19:05]
• On Dick Cheney and Iraq:
  • “He did have a remarkable career...he loved his country....But he was wrong on some big stuff.” — Buck Sexton, [11:17]
  • “Iraq war was a mistake. We should not have done it. Biggest mistake the Republican Party has made in the 21st century.” — Buck Sexton, [23:05]
• On Identity Politics Excuses:
  • “No one cares that she’s black and gay. We care that she's dumb and was in a position of power.” — Clay Travis, [38:17]

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Important Segments & Timestamps

• [00:34] — Election coverage, Democrat frustration, opening critiques
• [03:11] — Urban crime, Trump’s public safety plan for D.C.
• [04:20] — Newsom’s “fearmongering” on immigration (audio clip)
• [05:08] — “It’s going to be Newsom” segment
• [06:44] — Iraq war as GOP’s major 21st-century mistake; Cheney legacy
• [11:17] — Reflections on Dick Cheney’s legacy and controversies
• [14:05] — 9/11 communication, history, and Cheney’s role
• [18:56] — Newsom “hates liars” audio and ticket speculation
• [23:18] — Listener challenges Cheney/Halliburton claims
• [25:48] — Clay questions if Democrats will ever admit COVID mistakes
• [32:25] — Schwarzenegger on California’s Prop 50 and gerrymandering
• [36:53] — Riffing on Karine Jean-Pierre’s use of identity as a shield

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Episode Character & Tone

• Language & Tone: The episode features Clay & Buck’s trademark mix of irreverence, deep skepticism of Democratic talking points, and direct, forthright political analysis. Their humor and camaraderie contrast with sharp critiques of political hypocrisy from both parties, but with particular focus on Democratic figures.

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Summary For the Uninitiated

This episode explores the growing dissatisfaction among voters, sharpens the criticisms of likely Democratic moves heading to 2028—especially around Gavin Newsom and the party’s messaging—and analyzes the lessons (and lack thereof) that parties have learned from major crises like the Iraq War and COVID-19. The hosts repeatedly call for fact-driven political arguments, lambast the shortcomings of identity-driven defenses, and remind listeners that real change often begins locally—so regardless of the ticket, “Go vote, go vote, go vote.”

Transcript

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[Buck Sexton]

We've covered a lot. We're going to keep covering a lot because we've got the New York City mayor's election, the governor's races in Virginia and New Jersey. Go vote. Go vote. I voted for my Miami beach mayor here and commissioners. Clay voted for Franklin alderman or the alderman or whatever.

[Clay Travis]

I'm not even sure exactly what the alderman does, but I went and voted.

[Buck Sexton]

Yeah, you got to make sure you got the right alderman or else all hell's going to break loose. And, you know, you might have some, I don't even know what going on in, in the town of Franklin. You know, you could have people, you.

[Clay Travis]

Could have a little bit of utopia.

[Buck Sexton]

Where I live a little bit. I say you could have people thinking they can just drive the golf cart all the way into town. Like, what's going on? You know, civilization, friends, we can't just let these things happen. So yeah, we are going to follow this up. Also, talk a little bit about California where Gavin Newsom. So much of this is, it's interesting. It's just, it's just tapping into Democrat frustration, Clay. I think that's true in all of these races. It's certainly true. Virginia, New York and California and New Jersey, where Democrats feel like their party has been cuz it has been outplayed by Trump and the Republicans. They're losing and losing and losing again this year in their opposition to Trump and their opposition to his agenda. So this is just an opportunity to vent their spleen a bit with a vote against whatever the Republican option is. I don't think it really even gets in for most people. I don't think it really even gets into what they think is going to happen here because cost of living is such a big thing in New York, in California, in New Jersey and Virginia too. Especially if you get closer to D.C. and Democrats will make it worse. Guaranteed they will make it worse. Because even what they do to make it, make it seem like it might improve in the short term is to Just squeeze the balloon at one side, right? To redistribute the wealth, to find some way to subsidize. And we see this with Obamacare, which I still wish people would pay more attention to this, Clay. We're still in a shutdown. Everybody, which is going to end after the election. All ties in, I might add, right? Democrats, government shutdown, getting people frustrated, making people think, oh, the Democrats are standing up, they're fighting. Well, what are they fighting for exactly? Like, how are they making anyone's life better? Ah, forget about that. They're fighting. It's emotional manipulation in place of an argument. It's very effective, unfortunately, in mass psychology and mass politics. But the Democrat offerings on all this stuff, like Obamacare specifically, is to ignore market reality and to make promises that they can't keep. And you're going to see a lot more of that. Gavin Newsom, meanwhile, I didn't get to yesterday, Clay. I meant this is a little bit of a pickup because I'm about to talk about public safety. We talked about D.C. and the crime situation there and how. Who was it? It was Nora o' Donnell was like, well, I just go to work and I don't know if it's safer on the streets. Because she doesn't want to admit it on camera that Trump is right. The murder rate since Trump has tried to do his security plan in D.C. is down 60%. OK, 60% drop in the murder rate and all crime is down Substantially, almost 30%, I think in D.C. year to date, with a big chunk of that coming since Trump. So it is working. It's not perfect, but it's working. No one thought it would be perfect, meaning that there'll be no murders or no crime. But it's substantially improving the situation. Meanwhile, you know what Gavin Newsom's worried about? Not whether people feel safe on the streets or they're gonna be harassed by some maniac. But of course, immigration play 19 people are on edge.

[Guest Commentator]

Communities of color are on edge. I mean, folks scared to death that go out trick or treating the other night, scared to walk their dogs, go to a playground, go to a park, go to a loved one's funeral because they might be disappeared on the basis of what they look like, where they congregate, the language they speak. In the United States of America today, you heard notion of a private police force that appears to have taken oath of office to the president United States, not to the United States Constitution.

[Buck Sexton]

All just, just hyperbolic fear mongering blather. Are they illegals? And also this notion they're being disappeared. They're not being disappeared. They're being detained, processed and returned to their country. Free flight back to where they actually should be.

[Clay Travis]

I think we just have to prepare for this. I would, I know it's still a year away from the midterms and I know we're not going to start the 2028 presidential cycle until January.

[Buck Sexton]

It's going to be Newsom. It's going to be Newsom.

[Clay Travis]

It's going to be Newsom and he's going to lie blatantly like this. Do we still have Gavin Newsom? I don't think we played it yesterday, but we played Newsom saying the one let's. Greg, you can grab that. I think we had it yesterday. But when Newsom said it went mega viral. I hate when politicians lie, you know, and he's like moving his hands and moving his face awkwardly and it's just so diabolically sinister because I don't know that anybody lies more than Newsom. And by the way, there's a difference between getting a fact or two wrong in sort of hyperbole and blatantly lying. And Gavin Newsom is just such a blatant liar. And the reality is, I think you have to have a blatant liar on the ticket because Democrats are wrong about everything. I mean, they really are, by and large. It used to be you could be a reasonable person and you could look at the two parties and you could say, hey, you know what, I disagree with my party on this perspective or this issue, even though I might vote the other way. I can't even think of what Democrats are. It used to be Democrats would say, hey, we know health care. They're destroying everything having to do with insurance. Nobody can even afford health care anymore.

[Buck Sexton]

If, if you are looking for something that Republicans and this is going to tie into another news item that Republicans I think look back on and say, ok, we actually got that one wrong. I think it's the Iraq war as a party, which Trump among others have said that was the, we were on the wrong side. We weren't on the wrong side of Afghanistan at post 9 11. But the Iraq war thing. But the thing about the Republicans there is Democrat establishment went along with it, too. Yeah, right. Hillary Clinton, all the, you know, the Schumer, all the Democrats were in favor of it as well. But it was the charge was led by a Republican administration, to be fair, and that included Dick Cheney, who just passed away. And we haven't mentioned this, but Dick Cheney, just what is he. 84, I think he just died in.

[Clay Travis]

Early this. Early this morning.

[Buck Sexton]

Early in the morning, yeah. Last 24 hours, he passed away. I remember meeting the vice president on several occasions when he was the Vice president in the Oval Office. And I will tell you, Clay, it was. We had multiple wars going on, a very different Oval Office experience as a young CIA analyst briefing then Vice President Cheney than what we got when Clay and Buck show up to hang out with Trump in the Oval. I mean, just knighted. It didn't even feel like the same movie set, the same universe. It's just a totally different feeling. There was an intensity and a solemnity under those Bush years because of 9, 11, and everything else. And you walked in there and you made sure your jacket and tie were crisp, and it was, yes, Mr. President. No, it's President. You know, we went in there and saw Trump and he's like, we got the owner of the Saints. Come on in here. We got J.D. we got. You know, it was. It was like we were.

[Clay Travis]

Check out the new guilt that I put in the, you know, cabinet.

[Buck Sexton]

Just showing us cool stuff. He's like, isn't it beautiful? Look at this painting? Redid this painting. Beautiful painting. It was just a very different feeling. But, yeah, Dick Cheney passed away. He became very controversial, I think more controversial, actually, in some ways after he left office with the legacy of the Iraq War.

[Clay Travis]

And also, to be fair, he and his daughter refuse endorsing Kamala over Trump in the 2020.

[Buck Sexton]

I knew his daughter did. I actually forgot that he did until you just mentioned that to me now, which is insane.

[Clay Travis]

Yeah, that's.

[Buck Sexton]

That, That's. That's personal bitterness overriding political. Look, I. I think he just passed away. And I know we're not supposed to speak ill of the dead. I'm not going to. I'm not trying to speak ill of someone who just passed away. I think Dick Cheney was a patriot. I think he loved his country, and I think he did what he thought was best for the country. And I think a lot of the stuff that was used to attack him about how it was like he was enriching him, that that actually wasn't true.

[Clay Travis]

And even the unitary chief executive attacks on Dick Cheney. I mean, those are. He believed that the President had the authority to make important decisions.

[Buck Sexton]

I was in the Oval Office, and I could tell you that the vice President watching them make decisions and discuss at various points, and the vice President was deferential to George W. Bush as president. This notion that he was the puppet master and Bush the Media this. Because they could get away with this. Clay, I'm not trying to get diverted. I know we got Election Day here, but I think the media lied to people so much about George W. Bush that they have this complete. They weren't, you know, because of Trump and the way he did things by going right to them and bypassing the media. People's conception of who George W. Bush is, a lot of just everyday America is a complete caricature. The guy was not dumb. The guy was not shy about leadership and making decisions and was. Was actually very on. He wasn't a scholar of Middle Eastern history, you know, but guess what? Neither is Kamala or Biden or any of them, right? But the notion that he was some sort of buffoon and was bumbling and an idiot is absolutely absurd. Not true at all.

[Clay Travis]

Not only that, I mean, it's funny. They remember early in Trump 2.0, it didn't work because it's Trump. You can't call somebody a dictator and then be like, they tried to say that Trump wasn't president. Remember, they tried to say President Elon. They tried to demean the person in the chief executive office, the president of the United States. And so the argument when Bush was there was, oh, Cheney's the actual president. They tried to argue, oh, Trump's there. Elon's the president. You ever hear anybody argue that Obama wasn't the president when Obama was in office? You ever hear anybody argue Clinton wasn't the president when Clinton was in office? Whatever you thought of their vice president. Now, to be fair, during Biden, people may have accurately said it's actually Obama who's still president.

[Buck Sexton]

To be fair, during Clinton, there may have been moments where he was busy, otherwise occupied, not really indisposed. The country indisposed would be one thing you could say about Bill Clinton, but I think so. Cheney passed away. The guy had a. He did have a remarkable career. And I do think, I think the best thing that can be said for him or the things that can be said for him is he loved his country. And he tried, but he was wrong on some big stuff. And unfortunately, he got particularly wrong toward the end about, About Trump and the, and the, you know, The. The trajectory of the country.

[Clay Travis]

I think, and I think it was.

[Buck Sexton]

Personal because of the repudiation of Bush, Cheney by Trump.

[Clay Travis]

I think that's exactly right.

[Buck Sexton]

He was trying to be. People are going to get mad at me. They're gonna say he's a warmonger.

[Clay Travis]

I'm trying.

[Buck Sexton]

The guy just died. I'm trying to be charitable. He served his country for many, many years. And I think he loved America. He was willing to go to the mat against the jihadis, I will tell you that. And we needed people that were willing to go to the mat.

[Clay Travis]

You can love your country and make awful decisions.

[Buck Sexton]

Correct.

[Clay Travis]

Those aren't opposite things.

[Buck Sexton]

And I think people always throw Neville Chamberlain under the bus. Yeah. Was he wrong about how things would go with the Nazis? Sure. But people forget that World War I had just destroyed an entire generation of Europe, including Englishmen and people from the United Kingdom. And he was hoping we wouldn't have to do that again. Right. He may have had the wrong remedy, but he, he didn't want to go to war. I mean, that's this and reasonable thing to do.

[Clay Travis]

And to be fair, I read the oral history recently in the last year OR so of 911 because I wanted to re experience that. Remember, they thought the White House was going to get hit and Cheney was underground monitoring 911 while Bush was up in Air Force One and nobody could get in touch with him because they were trying to keep him safe.

[Buck Sexton]

People forget this because they always think now of KSM Khalid Sheikh Mohammed in his like, you know, pulled T shirt and getting arrested and all this stuff. They were planning multiple 9 11s. And that's real, that is fact. They were going to keep coming at us with all kinds of stuff. The war on terror was absolutely necessary. And those of you who fought it should always remember that and always feel, you know, honored in your service for the fact that they were coming for us. It wasn't just 9 11. There was more after that. And yeah, it was. The fight against. It wasn't perfect. No war, the fight is never going to be perfect. But it was a necessary one. It was Iraq. That was the expansion of it that I think was a strategic miscalculation. But I don't think the people that said, I mean, I got hit with this even a while back was on a podcast. People said, oh, it was all so Cheney could make money through Halliburton. Yeah, it's actually not, that's actually not true. Yeah, you, you can say that he was a warmonger and he made the wrong decision and it was terrible. But he actually didn't do this to make money through Halliburton for himself. And I, I just, I like the criticisms to be rooted in reality.

[Clay Travis]

One thing that stood out to me as I reread to experience the history of 911 that is really kind of crazy to think about is There was almost no communication to the President because Air Force One wasn't able to get telephone signals. They weren't able, obviously the Internet was not in place. They got spotty every now and then, television. So Cheney had to manage much of 911 because the president, they were afraid of where the next strike might be. He was just up in the air. They didn't have any idea. And so I would encourage you to go back and do some reading about that day.

[Buck Sexton]

They could have had 50 planes hijacked. Given how easy it was to hijack the ones that they did, they could have had 50 of those planes turned into essentially massive guided missiles with hundreds of innocents aboard. We had, you know, I mean, it's crazy to think about the worst terrorist attack ever in history. And it actually could have been a lot worse.

[Clay Travis]

Yes, yes.

[Buck Sexton]

And it would, by the way, it would have been worse if not for those, Those brave souls.

[Clay Travis]

Pennsylvania on United Flight 11.

[Buck Sexton]

That's exactly right. Let's roll. If that does. A Beamer, I believe. Was it Todd Beamer?

[Clay Travis]

Beeman, I think. Or is it Beeman or Beamer? You may be right.

[Buck Sexton]

If it's not, it's not for him. And saying, let's roll. That plane ends up, we have a smoldering United States Capitol or White House, everybody. That's how close we were.

[Clay Travis]

Flight 93, I think if I'm getting, remembering that.

[Buck Sexton]

But to be, you know, to be fair to Chane, we needed a wartime consoliery, so to speak, after 9 11. I'm not saying that everything was good or right, but I mean the guy, the guy did step up and, and a lot of bad guys needed to be taken off the battlefield. All right? Money gets tight this time of year. Christmas gifts, holiday travel, donations you want to make. So let's just save you money with something that is just going to be better for you all around. Pure Talk, my friend. You can save hundreds of dollars a year. In fact, the average family of four saves over $1,000 a year when they switch from their big wireless company to Pure Talk. Because Pure Talk gives you unlimited talk, text and plenty of Data for just $25 a month on Pure tax. A Pure talks lightning fast 5G network. Plus right now they'll take an additional 50% off your first month. That's immediate savings. Immediate savings. 50% off your first month. Keep your phone and your number if you want. And you can keep a lot of your own money too. Dial pound250. Say the keywords Clay and Buck and PureTalk's US customer service team will switch in as little as 10 minutes plus say 50% off your first month. Dial pound250, say Clay and Buck to switch to America's wireless company PureTalk.

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[Clay Travis]

Welcome back in Clay Travis Buck Sexton show we mentioned Gavin Newsom saying boy, he just really hates liars. Here is Gavin Newsome. Let's listen.

[Guest Commentator]

Nothing. I just like more than the politician that sits there and lies to you. And we all just sit there rolling our eyes going give me a break.

[Clay Travis]

I'm telling. I mean it is going to be so ridiculous to watch this entire campaign play out where he just lies about everything that he's ever done and refuses to take responsibility for it.

[Buck Sexton]

I have to say if it does turn into JD versus Newsom, it's going to be, it's going to be good tv. It's going to be an interesting matchup. And I still think that, you know, we agree on this and usually I would pick something else just so we could argue over it. But I still think it's probably AOC as VP makes the most sense, especially seeing what's going Mamdani wins New York. That shows you that in the blue centers socialism plays great and helps with turnout. And then Gavin Newsom does his whole sweet talking the, you know, ladies of the purple states and all of a sudden you have a real formidable can a real formidable ticket. It doesn't have to be that good. Commonly lost by 250,000 votes. Horrible.

[Clay Travis]

That's what scared I remember that. That's what scold guys.

[Buck Sexton]

They're going to come back, everybody. The empire always strikes back.

[Clay Travis]

Hey, they should make a movie about that.

[Buck Sexton]

You know, maybe I'll let them use my title. When you get to gift shopping this holiday season, do what I do. Cozy earth. My friends, cozyearth.com they make the most comfortable sheets in bedding. I was sleeping on them last night. I love their stuff, all their stuff, honestly. The throwback blankets, the clothing, they even got furniture. We love these sheets on clay and Buck. Cozy Earth sheets, that's really the baseline. I would start with the sheets. For so many of you out there, they're better than whatever sheets you've got. You're going to absolutely love them. I've got my parents in New York City a bunch of these sheets on the way and they're absolutely, absolutely going to love them as much as I do. Cozy Earth products are unbelievably soft, lightweight, cool to the touch. Their bed sheets are just cozy and breathable so you never overheat. And they all come backed by 100 night sleep trial money back guarantee and a 10 year warranty. Get some Cozy Earth products. You're gonna love it. Right now. Black Friday has come [e-mail] use my name Buck as your promo code on top of their site wide sale for up to 40% off cozyearth.com today. Use code Buck and share luxury with your family this season. Get some gifts from Cozy Earth. Welcome back in to Clay and Buck. Talk to you about The California situation in a second. But here we go. I knew I'd get some of these Clay. So I'll address one VIP email from Patrick Buck is absolutely delusional to say Cheney didn't get rich off Iraq. KBR got billions of dollars in no bid contracts in Iraq. Cheney was part of Halliburton, which owned kbr. I did multiple deployments in both Iraq and Afghanistan. Iraq war was a fraud. Let's work backwards on this one. Iraq war was a mistake. I said so. You're saying so. I don't. So there we go. That's. We have agreement there. We should not have done it. Biggest mistake the Republican party has made in the 21st century, in my opinion. Multiple deployments. Thank you for your service. Thank you for putting your life on the line for your country and doing what was necessary in a moment where the country was in fact under substantial threat and did have enemies abroad that sought to do us harm. And then on the no bid contracts, Dick Cheney divested all shares in all the shares that he owned in Halliburton before he took office in 2000. All of it. So that was before 9 11, mind you. I don't, I don't know what else. This is all. There's, there's, there's records of this. You can check this out. I don't know what else anyone wants me to say. There was some deferred compensation of, of like a couple million dollars that was paid afterwards. But Cheney had already. He sold his stock for like 40 million bucks. And that was in 1999 or $2,000. So it'd be like selling it for close to $80 million today. He didn't care about the $2 million in deferred compensation. Everybody. So I understand people get very passionate about these things. But there's just facts and there's record. And the record is he did not own. Trust me, they would have told you if he continued to own Halliburton stock while that was actually happening. He had to divest from Halliburton when he went into government. And that is what happened.

[Clay Travis]

And he just made awful decisions as it pertained to Iraq.

[Buck Sexton]

I'm not, I'm not defending any of his decisions.

[Clay Travis]

That's a terrible.

[Buck Sexton]

The, the, the, the Iraqi reconstruction was, was an absolute debacle. They had incompetent people. The Iraq war on false premises. That's all. But it wasn't to make Dick Cheney richer than he already was before he became vice president. Everybody. I just, I, I don't know what to Tell you, you show me the. Show me the data or show me the facts to prove otherwise. That's all. If you show me that Dick Cheney actually sold $20 million of Halliburton stock in 2003, I will come on here and say, oh my gosh, I'm sorry, I was wrong about this. I don't know why they were so effective. It was all the Daily Show. They were so effective at selling this narrative that Cheney did it for Halliburton. It was. That was not true. He did it for other reasons that maybe are very bad. And it was a big mistake. He did not do it to get rich off of Halliburton. Read the Internet, everybody. It is there for you to see.

[Clay Travis]

So here's a question for you about this. Since people are fired up. Most people I would imagine, listening to us right now agree that the Iraq war was a bad decision. In fact, I would argue to you, I know this was true for me. The first time I said this Trump guy is actually pretty interesting, was when he went after the decision to go to war in Iraq before anybody else in the Republican Party had been willing to do so. If in that summer of 2015 big time Republican debate that Megyn Kelly moderated when he went after Rosie o'. Donnell. The part of going after the Iraq war, which I think you're correct on, Buck, is what broke and embittered Dick Cheney to such an extent and Liz Cheney as well, on some level to eventually say that Trump is the unique threat to the republic and come out against him and endorse Kamala Harris of all things. But most people in the Republican Party and most people, I think in America now say the Iraq war was a mistake the way it was implemented. A lot of you served in it who are listening to us right now, Buck, you were in Afghanistan. I mean, you were in Afghanistan.

[Buck Sexton]

I was in Iraq, too. I deployed to Mosul. I deployed to Baghdad. I deployed to Afghanistan. I saw some of these garden spots up close and personal.

[Clay Travis]

So let me ask you this. Will Democrats ever acknowledge that they screwed up Covid like Republicans have acknowledged that they screwed up Iraq?

[Buck Sexton]

No, because they would do it. I truly. Well, actually, that would be an interesting conversation because there is a concern over a return. There is a concern and I understand it. And I think this even ties into why there's such a. There's such a venom about Cheney and the war profiteering thing, which again, my position is not that Cheney was some grand architect of a great war that should have been fought. My position is he did really incredibly dumb things, but he actually didn't do those dumb things per se, to get rich.

[Clay Travis]

He did them because he thought he was making the right decision. Which is not different if you go back in time to Robert McNamara during the Vietnam War, and McNamara later came out and said, I blew it effectively in the way that they implemented that. And if you study war, it's actually very common for people to think that they're making the right decision, and they end up making the wrong decision because war is tough. And making decisions on the spur of the moment to be judged by history for generations. I'm a Civil War history nerd. People still mock decisions made at Chickamauga, you know, all the way back in 1863, or Lee at Gettysburg, pickets charged. I mean, people still argue about it.

[Buck Sexton]

You can, you know, come at. You can come at Jefferson Davis with a lot of very valid criticism, but he did not fight the war because of his position on trans rights. That's all I'm saying. You know, like, that wasn't it, right? So we just have to stay in the facts. We have to stay within the reality. And with the Cheney situation, it's just. It's became such a thing where everyone says, oh, it's because anyway. And I'm not some big.

[Clay Travis]

They were, by the way, I sound.

[Buck Sexton]

Like I'm the big Cheney defender. It was the biggest mistake of the 21st century, but he didn't make it to get rich. He made it because he made a huge error. Well, in judgment.

[Clay Travis]

And honestly, it was an error in judgment that was very liberal in nature. Because the idea in my mind was the neocon aspect of we're going to create a democracy in Iraq that is similar to the democracy that we have in the United States was clearly a impractical, impossible goal.

[Buck Sexton]

Even more preposterous, honestly, in Afghanistan, too, or that that was where the mistake was made as well in that mission. But I do think that there is a considerable. To your point about COVID there is a concern on the right, broadly speaking, that without Trump at the helm of the party, we could return to an interventionist neocon foreign policy. And I get that, and I understand a lot of people who fought those wars, including, by the way, nothing but respect for our vip. Patrick, and thank you for your deployments. Just have to clear up that one fact. And if I'm wrong on that fact, someone show me how I'm wrong on the fact. But Dick Cheney did not make a lot of money after he took office. Just to be very clear from stock in Halliburton or kbr. That is not true. He made a lot of money before he took office and you can argue well, I mean, I don't know like that he's just like loves the war profiteers in general and wants to spread the wealth to his buddies, but he did not make money personally from that. So and I think it's important we stick with what is fact.

[Clay Travis]

I think, though, that's true. I think he genuinely thought, again, patriotically he was making the right decision and he made totally the wrong decision, which is actually the Middle east has been a interesting.

[Buck Sexton]

Yeah, the Middle east had been a mess for for, you know, post World War II. Middle east has just been one series of conflicts and mess after another. And this was the, you know, the Bush cheney idea post 9 11. And this is a very complicated and much bigger discussion than we have time for right now. But it was essentially instead of mowing the grass, maybe we got to just, you know, plant something new. Maybe we got to go with a whole new direction and that means regime change and nation building. And we tried it and it failed and it was a bad idea in my opinion. And I think the opinion certainly the opinion of Donald Trump and MAGA and the right, but I just think that the hit we should stay clear on what the history, as I said, Jefferson Davis not fighting for trans rights, like, we have to stay clear on what the, you know, the history of different figures and what the actual arguments were. So anyway, I knew that I knew the Cheney thing would get some we're going to get more emails about this too. People get very passionate about this still. But yeah, the guy passed away and it's a different Republican Party now. And that's why I think he also went for like to go for Kamala is really just now you're just going to burn down you're going to burn down everything that you've stood for because you're so bitter about who's in charge now. And, and that's a shame. I mean, I the Iraq thing was a much bigger Ms. But that was a it was in good faith. Ms.

[Clay Travis]

I mean, and what I mean by that is he's not trying to have the result that he did. He thought he was doing the right thing. The endorsing Kamala over Trump is, I think, a middle finger too much of America. Also funny about that. It also played on Kamala Harris's poor political instincts because she somehow thought that Dick Cheney was popular with the Republican voters and that Liz Cheney was and that it was going to persuade moderates. They had. They had Liz Cheney, if I remember correctly, Buck speaking at some of the final rallies for Kamala Harris about why Kamala was such a great choice.

[Buck Sexton]

Yes. They deployed Liz Cheney. I know. Well, she. This is the problem with people that oppose Trump. Always end up becoming Democrats, essentially. Like, to really oppose Trump, you end up just. Yeah, it just. You just become a Democrat. I don't know what else to say. There's. There's a very clear history of this, and I've seen this in it, especially in the pundit space. You go from, like, I don't agree with Trump's tone to like, yeah, Kamala Harris is a great candidate. Like, how does that happen? Well, it happens pretty much every time.

[Clay Travis]

It's bonkers. And I do think it was funny because it spoke to both Liz Cheney's lack of political instincts and also Kamala's lack of political instincts that somehow they thought the winning argument down the stretch is a combo of Liz Cheney and Kamala Harris convincing you that they should be in charge of the country.

[Buck Sexton]

You know, Barack Obama has been deployed as the closer in some of these campaigns that are going on today, the elections today. I know we've got these big. These big decisions that are being made about the governor's mansions for New Jersey, for Virginia, and then the New York City mayor, but also in California. I wanted to play this. Schwarzenegger has weighed in on CNN about Gavin Newsom's Proposition 50. Can you guys play that clip for me?

[Political Analyst]

There is such extreme gerrymandering going on that in a state like Massachusetts, it has, like, 40% of the people voting for Trump. They only had zero representatives. The Republican Party has zero representatives sent to the House. Think about that. In New Mexico, 45% of the people voted for Trump and vote Republican, and zero is sent to the House. Zero representative from the Republican Party.

[Buck Sexton]

Clay, Prop 50 is really straightforward. It's just Democrats in California with Gavin Newsom leading the charge. Even. Even Schwarzenegger, who's kind of a. Yeah, maybe a moderate Democrat now, or I don't know what you'd call him, and formerly a Republican, even he sees what this is. They complain about gerrymandering where they're not doing it, and they do it to the absolute max where they can.

[Clay Travis]

And ultimately they're in trouble because the 2030 census, so many people have moved to red states that even if they gerrymander to the nth degree, they're in trouble when it comes to the overall calculus, that will be out there because red state populations are surging and blue state populations by and large are collapsing. Look, no matter what state you live in, you can play along with us at prize picks more or less on the projections. If you're right, you could win big 40 plus states California, Texas, Florida, Georgia, New York where I am. If you're feeling left out, get hooked up and have some fun. I'll give you a pick on Thursday. All you have to do pick your favorite athletes. They give you a stat. You pick more or less. Are they going to have more or less on points, on passing yards, on touchdowns and and you can be on your way hopefully to having some fun and winning a little bit of money on the side as well. You get 50 bucks when you sign up. Right now it's prizepix.com my name Clay. You can also download the prizepix app. There are over 13 million people playing and we have some fun with a pick every Thursday during football season. That's prizepix.com my name Clay. 50 bucks just for playing when you play $5 that's pricepix.com code C L A Y.

[Podcast Promo Announcer]

Keep up with the biggest political comeback in world history on the Team 47 podcast Clay and Buck highlight Trump replays from the week, Sundays at noon Eastern. Find it on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

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[Buck Sexton]

Today.

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[Clay Travis]

Welcome back in Clay Travis Buck Sexton Show. I'm on my book tourise. Jean Pierre's book tour has been going on for weeks. I. I don't know what's going on here, but she keeps talking. Anytime she gets criticized about the fact that she's black and gay, uh, and somebody brought up that she uses that excuse all the time. And she was mad that people brought up the fact that she uses the fact that she was black and gay as an excuse. This just happened.

[Jean Pierre]

Listen, it pisses me off that people who have not walked in my shoes, who have no idea who really I am as a person, get to tell me how I get to identify myself, Jake. So it's like, I was like, you can't tell me how I get to identify myself. You can't tell me how I get to call myself. Like, screw you. Like who?

[iHeart Radio Announcer]

Like you.

[Jean Pierre]

That's not okay. Like, that is not okay. You have no right to tell anybody how they should identify themselves and how they see themselves in the world. Like, you have not walked through my battles. You have not walked through my life. You don't even know my personal story. So that's how I really. That just. That just boils me up.

[Buck Sexton]

So I need help here, Clay. Is she really so stupid that she doesn't understand that no one is challenging her self definition? They just think that she doesn't have to bring up her self definition in every single interview, in almost every other sentence. Is she that dumb? Is that possible?

[Clay Travis]

She is that dumb, I think, because no one cares that she's black and gay. We care that she's dumb and was in a position of power. And you can't defend the awful decisions. If Dick Cheney, we just said Iraq. If Dick Cheney, whenever he got criticized on Iraq, said, as a white man, you have no idea what I went through. People would say, well, okay, some people do, but we shouldn't have been in Iraq. And that doesn't really have anything to do with your race or your gender. You made a poor decision as a leader and you should have to own it instead of trying to dodge all accountability by constantly bringing people back to your race and your gender, which is what she tries to do. Norma, Long Beach, California, what you got for us? Normal.

[Buck Sexton]

Going once, Norma going twice.

[Clay Travis]

Norma's here, I think, Buck. Norma, what you got for us? Thanks for calling.

[Buck Sexton]

I am, I am.

[Commercial Announcer]

I'm here.

[Clay Travis]

Thank you.

[Buck Sexton]

I ordered your book. I get it in two days.

[Clay Travis]

Thank you, Norma. I appreciate you calling it. I hope you enjoy it. That, that is fantastic. You're in Long Beach, California. I'm glad it's going to get to you in two days. Alexi Lawless, our friend. Thank you, Norma. Our friend Alexi Lawless just posted a picture. He said he went to the Manhattan Beach Barnes and Noble. They had one copy of my book. I'm guessing I'm probably not gonna, probably not gonna be on the bestseller list in Manhattan Beach, California.

[Buck Sexton]

I feel like the one copy of your book in that Manhattan Beach Barnes and Noble would be like the golden idol in Indiana Jones. Like the one person that tries to take sets off a booby trap. And yes, they have to, they have to escape a boulder. I think that's what happens.

[Clay Travis]

Alexi said that he asked, went, you know, ask at the front desk or whatever, and the woman just kind of wrinkled her face and walked around and they managed to find one copy. So if you're in Manhattan beach and you were thinking, I'm going to go to the Barnes and Noble, Alexi beat you to the beat you to the table. He's already got it in all serious know the Buck, I'm going straight. I'm going to be on with Jesse Waters tonight talking about the book. And I'm going to be on America's newsroom and tomorrow morning and then Sean Hannity. And I've been talking to a lot of people at all our different affiliate stations. I appreciate all of you guys for the support. I think you're going to enjoy the book. If you're not a reader, you can listen to it. And thank you guys. And Buck's book will be out in, in January.

[Buck Sexton]

February. February.

[Clay Travis]

And you will have another opportunity so you can read at least two books this year or you can listen to at least to it's definitely on Amazon. I appreciate all of you buying it. You can go grab it and I'm excited to hopefully help to influence the conversation going forward with young men and how they can continue to win cultural battles going forward and also continue to celebrate. Tomorrow is the one year anniversary of Trump's big win, which is the timing behind this book. Go vote. Go vote. Go vote. New Jersey, Virginia, New York City and all other cities picking mayors and other important office holders. Please go vote. Make your voice heard. We'll talk about the results tomorrow.

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[Clay Travis]

Com.

[iHeart Radio Announcer]

This is an iheart podcast.