Hour 3 - Kamala's Beyonce Betrayal

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show

Episode: Hour 3 - Kamala's Beyonce Betrayal
Date: May 14, 2026
Duration Covered: [03:19]–[46:13]
Hosts: Clay Travis, Buck Sexton
Guest: Senator Dave McCormick (Pennsylvania)

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Episode Overview

Hour 3 of The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show dives deep into Democratic Party dynamics, Kamala Harris’s prospects for the 2028 presidential nomination, and the internal strategies and coalitions shaping the future of the party. The episode features sharp political analysis, lively banter, and a substantive interview with Senator Dave McCormick about U.S.-China relations, Pennsylvania’s battleground status, and American energy policy. The hour concludes with spirited listener calls about Kamala Harris’s relationship with key Democratic constituencies, including Black women voters.

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Key Topics and Discussions

1. Security and the U.S.-China Summit Context

Timestamps: [03:19]–[06:27]

• Topic: President Trump’s state visit to China, security concerns for American executives, and cell phone surveillance.
• Key Insights:
  • Clay and Buck discuss how U.S. CEOs (e.g., Tim Cook, Elon Musk) likely bring “special phones” or nothing electronic to China due to state surveillance.
  • Buck’s personal experience: “I brought nothing electronic with me when I went to China at all… everything I did was under full surveillance the whole time. So that’s... the way that you have to operate.” ([04:33] Buck Sexton)

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2. The Kamala Harris 2028 Nominee Theory

Timestamps: [06:27]–[17:30]

• Clay’s Prediction: Kamala Harris will be the 2028 Democratic nominee.
  • “Kamala Harris is going to end up being the nominee in 2028 for the Democrat Party.” ([06:27] Clay Travis)
• Buck’s Skepticism: Reminds Clay of his previous Michelle Obama prediction; jokes about the improbability, but acknowledges that the Democratic Party has made unexpected choices before.
• Analysis of Kamala’s “No Bad Ideas” Interview: ([07:20]–[11:07])
  • In a brainstorming session, Kamala suggested:
    • Expanding the Supreme Court
    • Granting statehood to Puerto Rico and Washington D.C.
    • Abolishing the Electoral College
    • Adopting multi-member congressional districts
    • More ethics rules for the Supreme Court
    • Criminalizing lies to the Senate Judiciary Committee
  • Clay dissects these, noting some are already law (e.g., perjury), and argues these proposals are "radical."
  • Quote: “She’s calling for a criminalization of a crime that has already been criminalized and that people have been prosecuted for violating… one of the dumbest takes that I have ever heard.” ([11:10] Clay Travis)
• Democratic Party’s Direction:
  • Buck: “Have the Democrats moderated? Have they pivoted?... Absolutely not... as soon as they're in power, they're going to unleash the fury on us as much as they possibly can, get as crazy as they can.” ([13:32] Buck Sexton)

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3. Identity Politics and Democratic Base Analysis

Timestamps: [09:15]–[17:30]

• Clay’s Strategy Argument: Kamala Harris’s campaign relies on Black women as her base, something no other contender possesses as strongly.
  • “She is going to identity politics this and gender politics this, the likes of which we may never have seen before.” ([09:15] Clay Travis)
• Comparing Kamala and Gavin Newsom:
  • Clay questions who Newsom’s unwavering voter base could be.
  • Buck humorously posits: “Wine moms who are on marriage number three who are thinking, wow, that guy is handsome… see the wind blowing through his hair…” ([15:49] Buck Sexton)
• Prediction Market Discussion: Clay notes Kamala’s odds are long in betting markets, but he thinks her coalition is underestimated.

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4. Listener Calls: Kamala’s Support Among Black Women

Timestamps: [22:48]–[24:43], [44:11]–[45:40]

• Callers Debate the “Kamala Bloc”:
  • Donna in Virginia: "Any black woman that will vote Democratic just because will vote for Kamala, especially the angry, college educated ones… they may not even like her, but they'll vote for her first because she's Black woman." ([44:26] Donna)
  • Dan in Tampa (married to a Black woman): Strongly disagrees: "[Kamala] doesn't even admit she's black… she's burnt her card with black people. We're exhausted with her. She's not a black woman. She doesn't claim to be a black woman. We don't identify her as a black woman." ([45:25] Dan)

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5. Interview with Senator Dave McCormick

Timestamps: [26:10]–[40:11]

a) U.S.-China Relations and Economic Security

• Spouse on China Trip: Senator discusses his wife, Dina Powell McCormick, President of Meta, traveling with President Trump to Beijing.
• Geopolitical Framing: “China is vying for global superpower to replace America... their goal is to... get in front of us.” ([26:10] Sen. McCormick)
• China-U.S. Issues: Rare earth minerals, fentanyl precursor chemicals, trade imbalances, and AI chip agreements.
  • Senator doubts the benefit to the U.S. of allowing Nvidia to sell chips to China: “That’s not going to do anything but accelerate China’s AI rise.” ([27:39] Sen. McCormick)

b) Pennsylvania Politics and the Economy

• State of the Economy: Focus on jobs, energy dominance, and rising costs (especially gas price pain for working families).
• Personalizing Politics: Discusses positive bipartisan relationship with Senator John Fetterman—“I admire him. I think he's shown a lot of courage and independence... people respect that we're working together.” ([31:50] Sen. McCormick)

c) Policy Initiatives

• Unlock American Energy and Jobs Act: Streamline energy project permitting.
  • “It takes about six years to get a permit on average for an energy project in America. It took three and a half years to win World War II. This is ridiculous.” ([33:43] Sen. McCormick)
  • Legislative goals: One-year environmental review deadline, permit finality, written justifications for disapprovals. Would unlock $1.5 trillion in capital.

d) National Economic Outlook

• Balancing Data and Sentiment: While indicators (jobs, stocks, wage growth) are positive, people “are still feeling pinched and struggling in energy prices, housing, and health care.” ([36:43] Sen. McCormick)

e) Sen. McCormick’s 2028 Prediction

• On Kamala/Gavin Newsom: “She could not connect to the people of Pennsylvania... Both [Kamala and Gavin] get a thumbs down... they're going to have to understand working people before winning nationwide, certainly in Pennsylvania.” ([39:11] Sen. McCormick)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Clay Travis on Kamala Harris Base:
  “She knows that black women are her base and she knows if black women do not leave her, she's going to be the nominee.” ([09:15])
• Buck Sexton on Democratic Radicalism:
  “As soon as they're in power, they're going to unleash the fury on us as much as they possibly can, get as crazy as they can.” ([13:32])
• Sen. McCormick on Energy Permitting:
  “It takes about six years to get a permit on average for an energy project in America. It took three and a half years to win World War II. This is ridiculous.” ([33:43])
• Donna (Caller, Virginia):
  “Even though they may not even like her, but [Democratic Black women] will vote for [Kamala] first because she's Black woman.” ([44:51])
• Dan (Caller, Tampa):
  “We're exhausted with her. She's not a black woman. She doesn't claim to be a black woman. We don't identify her as a black woman.” ([45:40])

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Timeline of Major Segments

• [03:19]–[06:27]: China trip security and cell phone surveillance
• [06:27]–[11:07]: Kamala’s Democratic base, radical policy brainstorming, Supreme Court/EC expansion, and Buck/Clay banter
• [13:32]–[17:30]: Analysis of party shifts post-Trump 2024, identity politics, Kamala vs. Newsom, primary math
• [22:48]–[24:43]: Listener debate on Kamala's Black women support
• [26:10]–[40:11]: Interview with Sen. Dave McCormick covering China, Pennsylvania, Fetterman, energy policy, economic perception, and 2028 predictions
• [44:11]–[46:13]: Listener calls (Donna, Dan) on the Kamala-Beyonce “betrayal” and the Black Democratic vote

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Tone and Style

The conversation is lively, at times humorous, with direct but not hostile exchanges. Both hosts use sharp political analysis paired with playful ribbing (e.g., “wine moms,” “Clay’s prediction market bets”), while callers add personal and sometimes intense perspectives. Senator McCormick’s interview is measured, pragmatic, and focused on policy substance.

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Takeaways for Listeners

• Kamala Harris’s future and Democratic coalition-building remain hotly debated.
• The Democratic Party is seen by the hosts as likely to double down on progressive policy, not moderate, after 2024.
• Energy reform and U.S.-China competition were discussed in detail, highlighting the intersection of domestic policy and international diplomacy.
• Pennsylvania’s politics and economy serve as a barometer for national trends.
• Voter coalition dynamics—especially among Black women for Democrats—are nuanced and contested.

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This summary covers the primary content and spirited exchanges of “Hour 3 – Kamala’s Beyonce Betrayal” and provides an engaging, timestamped guide for listeners seeking the key themes and takeaways from this episode of The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show.

Transcript

[Senator Dave McCormick]

This is an iHeart podcast.

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[Martha Stewart]

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[Clay Travis]

Welcome back in hour number three, Clay Travis, Buck Sexton SHOW President Trump in Beijing. We have talked about it quite a lot. It is right now around 2 in the morning, Friday morning in Beijing. They are 12 hours ahead of us. The first day seems to have been going and have gone very well. A lot of conversation. We discussed it in the first hour of the program. I'm sure we will discuss it some with Senator Dave McCormick of Pennsylvania, who will join us at the bottom of the hour. His wife, Dina Powell McCormick is in Beijing right now with President Trump as one of those executives that traveled with the president on the China state visit. We will see if Senator McCormick has gotten any feedback from his wife. Buck One thing that I'm sure is going on is you've been to China before. What did you do about phones when you were in China? Because I if I were Elon Musk or I was Dina Powell McCormick or Tim Cook, the CEO of Apple right now, Yinsen Huang, all the Nvidia CEO, I imagine they had to get special phones, didn't they? Wouldn't you want a special phone when you went into China?

[Buck Sexton]

I brought nothing electronic with me when I went to China at all, at all. And I was advised not to. And I knew about this from my previous life, what the capabilities of the Chinese surveillance state are. And when I was there, I rented a smartphone, which of course could not use, could not go on Google or Facebook or these other sites, but I rented a smartphone and knew that everything that I did was under full surveillance the whole time. So that's the way that you have to operate when you're in charge well with and you leave it behind. But you don't bring anything, you don't buy anything electronic. Heavens, no. And bring it back with you either. You leave that smartphone there and you hope that they haven't been able to get into your passwords and stuff when you've accessed things overseas. So you got to be very, very careful because they will.

[Clay Travis]

So you would, you would probably just Advise basically those CEOs to just not take communication devices while they're over there. And, and almost just because the piracy that goes on, the state espionage, the, the, the, the stealing of assets. I would probably just say don't even worry about trying to have a phone while you're in China. Or I would imagine the United States is creating some form of skiff. Right. That they are able to communicate from while the President is secure.

[Buck Sexton]

We have secure diplomatic and intelligence channels. Obviously, you know, the, the embassy is going to be able to communicate back to the, to, to our country without everything, at least we would hope everything being read and intercepted. But in terms of, yeah, being over there as a civilian, you have to just assume that whatever you're doing is being collected and at least scanned by, you know, AI, etc. If not actively monitored by a person who works for the vast Chinese Ministry of Security.

[Clay Travis]

So, yeah, so we will Talk with Dave McCormick about that trip and more. But I did want to not avoid or not ignore the fact that Democrats are increasingly getting crazier, I believe, and Buck thinks I'm crazy for this, that Kamala Harris is going to end up being the nominee in 2028 for the Democrat Party.

[Buck Sexton]

This would make up for you believing that Michelle Obama was going to be parachuted in at the last second to take over the last election. So I'll give, I'll give you this, this way, this way. So I'm trying to, I'm trying to beat you before you make the Buck island comments here. This way you can make up for that one Clay, because this is a long distance call you are making. That to me seems. I just cannot fathom that the Democrats would do that. But then again, they did it the last time, so how crazy can it really be?

[Clay Travis]

So she is now doing interviews. We all know how dangerous Kamala interviews can be. And I want you to listen to what she said. She said this is a conversation that we just need to brainstorm, I think is the phrase she uses. But she talks about expanding the Supreme Court, adding Puerto rico and Washington D.C. estates and potentially doing away with the Electoral College all in the. In the goal of dealing with, quote, red states and their radicalism. Listen to what Kamala said here. This is a moment where there are no bad ideas. No bad idea brainstorm is what I'd like to call it. And in that no bad ideas brainstorm, we talk about what we need to do and think about doing around the Electoral College. We talk about the idea of Supreme Court reform, which includes expanding the Supreme Court. We invite a conversation about Multi member districts, that there are rules in place to actually penalize people for lying to a Senate Judiciary Committee, that we agree that it is right to have ethics rules for Supreme Court justices. And let's put those in place. Let's talk about statehood for Puerto Rico and D.C. these are the things I

[Senator Dave McCormick]

think that we've got to do.

[Clay Travis]

We've got to neutralize these red states from cheating, including blue states, expanding their maps.

[Buck Sexton]

What is this with Kamala leaning into the, how do we put this more? The urban vernacular, I guess you would say, you know, she's, she's talking a little more street, perhaps. How do you, how do we say this? What is the, what is this that she, we can all hear it. What is it that she is doing here?

[Clay Travis]

She knows that black women are her base and she knows if black women do not leave her, she's going to be the nominee. And so I think she's, look, she is going to identity politics this and gender politics this, the likes of which we may never have seen before. Now, I like to believe that she is unelectable, but Buck, she was within 240,000 votes of beating Trump. I know Pennsylvania, Michigan, Wisconsin, thankfully narrowly went for Trump, but she would have won a 270 to 268 electoral college victory even if she lost, as she did the popular vote to Trump. So look, listen to some of the things she said. First of all, she said we've got to neutralize red states from cheating. And she wants to expand blue states, which I assume she means expand the congressional districts there. She talked about multi member congressional districts, which is actually kind of a radical idea that I haven't even even heard talked about very much. Buck, that would mean expanding the House of Representatives, right? We have right now, every year the districts are growing for the House of Representatives. As long as the United States population is growing and we have 500 and 435 members in the House, 218 is the majority. And so she's talking about expanding multi district. Well, that's big city. She wants more big city congressmen and women. She also randomly is saying we need to make it a crime. When you lie to the Senate Judiciary Committee, that is a crime. It's called perjury. Like when you raise your hand and swear to tell the whole truth, that is a courtroom proceeding, the equivalent of it when you're testifying to Congress.

[Buck Sexton]

Wasn't she California Attorney General? Am I forgetting?

[Clay Travis]

Not only was she California Attorney General, Buck, she sat on the Senate Judiciary Committee, which makes this one of the dumbest takes that I have ever heard. She's calling for a criminalization of a crime that has already been criminalized and that people have been prosecuted for violating. Now, perjury, as we have talked about on this program before, is a very hard charge to prove because you have to prove knowledge, intent. Perjury is just a high standard. And so it is very difficult oftentimes to get a perjury conviction. But look, I mean, let's just focus on this. Puerto rico and Washington, D.C. that would be four, in theory, four new Democrat seats. If we know, Buck, that Democrats will do away with the filibuster. What she is trying to do is say we need to get to 50 plus the president, which would get a tie break, and then we can add those two states that will get us to 54. And Democrats are then gambling that if they get four extra Senate seats, that they would be able to hold control of the Senate for many years to come, particularly if we abolish the Electoral College. I guess she would go straight popular vote at that point, which, of course is interesting and ironic and a little bit funny because she lost the national popular vote to Trump. So she would have lost whether the Electoral College existed or not. Obviously, money would be spent very differently if the Electoral College were abolished and the winner take all system would be different. My point on all this is this is a radical. I understand she's probably gonna say the COVID is, well, I'm just brainstorming ideas. I'm not saying I'm gonna endorse him, but expanding the Supreme Court, expanding the Senate, neutralizing red states from cheating, whatever that means, expanding, potentially the House of Representatives if Democrats get back into power. All of the time that you guys out there listening to me and Buck have spent fighting with each other is going to be so much wasted energy because you're fighting over subtle differences of political perspective and Democrats will just drop a political neutron bomb on you and you've been in knife fights and instead you're going to have nuke weapons dropped on you.

[Buck Sexton]

And, and it's. It's also an answer to anyone who has the question out there. Still, have the Democrats moderated? Have they pivoted? Have they shifted in response to Trump's 2024 win? Absolutely not. So you're wondering, hey, have they. Had they learned their lesson? The lesson they've learned is as soon as they're in power, they are going to. To unleash the fury on us as much as they possibly can, get as crazy as they can. Everything that we can point to and say we've been. They've been proven wrong. They will go back and try to do those wrong things again, whether it's the border or crime or spending or anything. They will make a mess of all these things again, which is why it's so important that the Republicans maintain power and that Trump stays on message and keeps the focus here with the agenda going forward to get as much done as possible so that whoever the Republican nominee is can run with a powerful party record and record of Trump achievements behind him or her probably going to be him. But nonetheless, that's where I see all of this. And Kamala Harris, she was speaking, by the way, Clay, I didn't know this. The team told me this. She was speaking to a quote, win with black women virtual meeting. So this is why her.

[Clay Travis]

Your vernacular was noted. But again, I, she, as long as she knows this. And if I were at Kamala Harris's campaign manager, which would be an awful job. But if I were that person and I got paid a billion dollars, if Kamala were the nominee, I would say, kamala, this campaign is black women directed black women. As long as they stay in your corner, you're going to be the nominee. There is nobody else that has a contingent of the Democrat electorate. This is why I'm saying Poly market Cal sheet, like these prediction markets where you can go and you can wager on who the nominee is. You can get Kamala 10 to 1. She's only 10% chance right now. The favorite is Gavin Newsom. What's Gavin Newsom's base? That's never leaving him. Him. I don't think it exists. Could he be more appealing?

[Buck Sexton]

What are you talking about? Wine moms who are on marriage number three who are thinking, wow, that guy is handsome. See the wind blowing through his hair. What a silver fox. Look at how low that shirt is buttoned.

[Clay Travis]

I will say our friend Alexi Lawless and Gavin Newsom, they do more. Alexi Law is going to be the head Fox commentator for the World Cup. We were hanging out this weekend, this week in D.C. alexi and Gavin, they have more unbuttoned dress shirts than anybody I've ever seen. Like, you can basically see their belly buttons. Like, you walk in and you're like, alexi needs to add like 8 chains. I'm surprised Gavin Newsom hasn't gone with the. The long chain to, to further expose the navel for the unbuttoned shirt. Making jokes about all this. I really don't think Gavin Newsom has A base. I think a lot of black women are never leaving Kamala and Buck. I think there's a lot of white women, like that crazy woman who was fine with getting shoved down the stairs because she didn't want a black guy to get incarcerated. She's going to like Kamala, too, because it allows her to tell her friends, I'm going to support Kamala.

[Buck Sexton]

I think the only if. If Kamala is able to get around the Newsom speed bump, then I think that her chances get very real very quickly. I mean, it's really between those two in the state of California. And because think about the donors early on. I mean, they're going to be fighting over every. They're fighting over all the same political real estate right away.

[Clay Travis]

Yes.

[Buck Sexton]

Same donors. They're both from California. They're both going to be trying to use the networks that they have there. So we. We shall see.

[Clay Travis]

I just. Buck, again. People can tell me I'm crazy on this. Black women aren't leaving her and all that money matters for other attributes. But if you get into. You only need to win, like, 30% of the electorate to win most of these primaries.

[Buck Sexton]

I'm just. Gavin's not. I'm. I still think Gavin's gonna be the nominee, and he's not drinking chardonnay with Clay anymore. Clay is a fair weather Gavin friend. That's that much we have established. No more.

[Clay Travis]

I think that's fair. That is fair.

[Buck Sexton]

No more trips to the vineyard for Clay. That's for sure. All right. A week from today, we'll be getting ready for Memorial Day weekend. Do you know when the first national observance of Memorial Day took place and what it was called? Clay will probably know because he's a Civil War nerd. Memorial day started in 1868 and was originally called Decoration Day. It was a day set aside to decorate the grave sites of Union soldiers who died in the Civil war. More than 600,000. Decoration Day was officially changed to Memorial Day and established as a federal holiday by Congress in 1971. For a lot of people, it marks the kickoff to summer. But next week, when someone wishes you a happy Memorial Day weekend, take a moment to honor the legacy our men and women in uniform left behind. Remember their courage and pause to recognize the responsibility that comes with the freedom that they secured for all of us with their sacrifice. Sure. Enjoy the time off if you're not working, but also remember to appreciate the rights we enjoy and how they came to be in this country because of that ultimate sacrifice that others made. Before us. Our friends at Americans for Prosperity take this all to heart. We know you do too, especially the military families in this audience. What about your neighbors and friends? Let's make sure they do as well. Americans for Prosperity has something to help with that. If you believe we all share a responsibility to preserve what makes this country strong, go to AFP buck.com for your free guide on how you and your community can get involved. That website again is a FP buck.com paid for by Americans for Prosperity.

[Clay Travis]

Level up your brain mental mogging with

[Public Podcast Sponsor Announcer]

Clay and Buck Support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like ETFs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA and SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors llc, SEC Registered Advisor. Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not an investment recommendation or advice. Complete Disclosure is available at public.comdisclosures

[Firestone Tires Sponsor Announcer]

Real value shows up in reliability. You don't have to second guess like a set of Firestone All Season tires. They're designed to deliver confidence inspiring wet weather, traction and a quieter ride no matter the road, season after season. Firestone All Season Tires for durability you can count on just like people count on you. Firestone always dependable since 1900

[Martha Stewart]

this is Martha Stewart from the Martha Stewart Podcast. Ever wonder how to make hosting look effortless? Here's a secret. Getting ahead of the mess with new Reynolds Kitchens Countertop prep paper Just lightly wet the counter beforehand so the paper grips and stays in place. Then lay down the Reynolds Kitchens countertop prep paper so drips and spills stay on the paper, not all over your kitchen counter. You can roll out dough, prep a party spread or cook alongside family when you're Done. Cleanup is as simple as lifting the paper and revealing that clean counter underneath. Effortless. You can use it for cooking and baking, prep and even crafting, especially when you need extra working space. Because when the mess is already handled, you can focus on what matters. The food, the people, and the moment. It may look effortless, but now you know. It's Reynolds Kitchens countertop prep paper. Take a tip from me. Wet it, set it, prep it, done. Make it easy. Make it with Reynolds Kitchens countertop prep paper. Available now in the Reynolds wrap aisle in Walmart, Target, Amazon, and Costco.

[Okta Sponsor Announcer]

These days, it seems like AI agents are just about everywhere you turn, every field and every function. But without identity, you can't trust they'll serve your business instead of jeopardizing it. Fortunately, Okta helps you get identity right by securing your AI agents identities, giving you a single layer of control, a single standard of trust. So whether an AI agent supports a single user or your entire enterprise, with Okta, you'll turn risk into opportunity. Secure every agent, secure any agent. Okta secures AI.

[Buck Sexton]

Welcome back in here to Clay and Buck. Tom in Virginia wants to chat with us about Clay's Kamala analysis. Tom, what's going on?

[Clay Travis]

Well, as soon as she starts campaign and her numbers are going to drop. She didn't get any votes the first time she ran. I'm not saying she's going to win the presidency, although I am nervous that that could happen. Black women are not going to not vote for Kamala unless they can find another candidate that has appeal to black women, which I don't think there's going to be one. West Moore is a disaster. He just said he was fine with his 14 year old getting his penis chopped off. Yeah, good luck with that. Maybe AOC because she has like minority female appeal, but I don't think black women are going to go to aoc.

[Buck Sexton]

I think you're underestimating Gavin's handsomeness and how. I think, I think ladies of all ethnic backgrounds might be swept up by

[Clay Travis]

that as Cheshire cat grin that he's got. As good looking as Gavin Newsom is, he's got to compete with Mayor Pete, which sounds silly, but white women love gay guys, right? They love. Oh, this is my gay friend Mayor Pete. We love him. Oh, like the white women vote is going to be sliced and diced more ways. Black women are going to show up and they are voting for Kamala and she's going to be the nominee and you guys are going to sit around here and when it happens, you're going

[Buck Sexton]

to have to I'm going to give a front we're front of the front of the line of the callers to any of our black female listeners. If you want to weigh in specifically on Clay's analysis on this one, I am, I am very curious to hear what your thoughts would be on this because Clay is, I don't know, Gavin. I think you're just selling Gavin short. I really do.

[Clay Travis]

I are there any black women that would vote for Gavin Newsom in the audience? I bet there's not a one. Let's see. Tunnel to towel though he is diabolically handsome. Tunnel the towers makes a tremendous difference with all the work that they do. We are helping to schedule already our events in the fall with them. I was texting with producer Alex Valley about this last night because I want to make sure we do as much as we possibly can to help them, especially heroes like United States army specialist Anthony Vargas. After the terror attacks of 9 11, he served honorably, dreamed of one day being a member of the nypd. But he was killed instantly when an led detonated near his unit. He left behind his wife Louisa, their kids and his siblings. It's the 25th anniversary year now, of course of 911 honor all sorts of people like our incredible specialist Anthony Vargas. You can join Buck and [e-mail] that's t the number 2t.org welcome back in the late Travis Buck Sexton Show. We are joined now by our friend Senator Dave McCormick of Pennsylvania. Had a great dinner at his house the night before the White House correspondents dinner. And actually we finished the dinner at your house, Senator. Thanks for having wife and I over among among others, an awesome time. And your wife, Dina Powell McCormick who is now at Facebook. We'll get into all the different political machinations on on Pennsylvania and more and what's going on in the Senate. But she's in Beijing right now. Have you been able to talk to her, text with her, hear from her? What has she said about that state, state visit trip so far?

[Senator Dave McCormick]

Yeah. Well, listen, thanks, Good, good to be with you guys. You know, I'm super proud of her. You know, she's the president of Meta, so it's a big deal. We haven't, I haven't had a chance to get much of a download on the trip. I just know she's there safe and she told me she was in the dinner and it was amazing. But you know, it's a, it's an important, it's an important trip and you know, I always Start this by saying, I think, I think we gotta, we gotta talk about China is the true adversary that it is. Our starting point has to be that China is vying for global superpower to replace America. And so I really applaud the President's efforts at diplomacy, but we should have no doubt that we're dealing with a country that, that is seeking to displace America. And this summit with the President, I think was, was focused on topics that we hopefully have mutual interests, but we, we shouldn't doubt that, that their goal is to, is to, is to get in front of us.

[Buck Sexton]

How do you think the trade negotiations such as they're lined up here. How do you think that's going to shake out with all of this? My sense is from the preview analysis, China wants to push back pretty hard on some of the Trump tariffs. And one of the tools they have in this is certainly the rare earth minerals supply chain issue. What do you think is likely to be at stake there and how are you hoping President Trump is able to bring this to a next level, a next stage?

[Senator Dave McCormick]

Well, you know, there's nobody that, that's been calling balls and strikes, I think, more accurately on the China relationship than President Trump. Over many decades. He's identified that we've had a very unfair relationship. I think the focus, you know, and I've been someone who said we should be very careful, we should be strategic in decoupling. And what I mean by that is not make ourselves dependent on China for anything that really matters to America's security. But we are unfortunately at the moment, very dependent, particularly on rare earth metals, as you say. I think there's a couple things. One, it's not exactly trade, but I think we've made a lot of progress. And the President will double down on the fentanyl prefactors and stopping the flow of those into Mexico and into the United States. That's what has killed almost 100,000Americans a year for the last four or five years. I think it'll be a big focus on farm products, soybeans, big deal that China buys soybeans, buys natural gas, buys petroleum. And in a time when Iran is, and the strait is closed, I think American energy is going to be an area where we hopefully can find common ground. It sounds like from the reporting that there's been an agreement on the H200 chips from Nvidia, frankly, I'm not in favor of that. Respectfully, I disagree with that. I think it's not going to do anything but accelerate China's AI Rise. But, but that was a decision I think made, and that's very valuable to China. I think that's probably allowing them to make some pretty significant concessions on the other side. And so, you know, I think the way I take about this, talk about this, I think there's probably some tactical wins that the president's going to be able to bring back and say we've made real progress, also making sure that China lives up to the commitments it's made in the past.

[Clay Travis]

You're traveling around all over the ultimate battleground state of Pennsylvania. Want to get kind of your read on what you see on the ground in Pennsylvania. You want a close election. Thankfully, Senate seat. John Fetterman is also there. You have a very good relationship with Fetterman. I'm curious what you think his political future is going to be. And generally, when you're going around and talking to your constituents all over Pennsylvania, what are they telling you the most as the midterms get closer and closer?

[Senator Dave McCormick]

Yeah, I think it's, I mean, I think they feel mostly pretty good. Jobs, jobs, jobs. And the economy is the focus. I mean, they're certainly very, very focused on Iran and other things, but I think they're really seeing the benefit of a number of the big things President Trump has done, particularly energy dominance for an energy state. We're the second largest producer of energy. We're the fourth largest natural gas reserves in the world. So, Clay, if we, if we were a country, we'd be number four. And I was in Pennsylvania last week. I visited, I visited shipping port. They're built, they're making a big coal conversion to natural gas. That's going to be 1.1 gigawatts, thousands of jobs building the energy capability and also the data centers. I also went to or I got a download of Homer City. This is a place that they're, they're building 4.4 gigawatts of energy. That's 1% of domestic energy demand. So huge job creation from advanced manufacturing data centers and energy. I think they're feeling some more money in their pockets because of the Working Families tax cut act. $3,500 on average, 11% more money in the pockets of folks. But I also think they're feeling that, that jump in gas prices. If you're living paycheck to paycheck, which a lot of Pennsylvanians are, $52,000 a year is the median income. And if gas goes up a buck and a quarter, man, you feel it. And so I don't want to downplay that they're feeling it. I think they know that we can't let Iran have a nuclear weapon, so they support the president, but they're feeling the bite. And I think they're hoping, and I'm hoping that that will come to an end relatively quickly.

[Clay Travis]

You have a good relationship with Senator Fetterman, also from Pennsylvania. I know he voted for your friend Kevin Warsh to be put on as chair of the new Fed board. What can you tell us about Fetterman? What do you see his future and about the new Fed chair?

[Senator Dave McCormick]

You know, I. I've got a great relationship with him. I admire him. I think he's shown a lot of courage and independence. And, you know, he campaigned against me, but we forged a relationship where we both said, let's what. What do we need to do together to help Pennsylvania? Now, he, you know, we disagree on a lot.

[Buck Sexton]

He.

[Senator Dave McCormick]

He votes 80% of the time or more with Democrats. So it's not like we agree on everything, but we look for areas where we can do good things for Pennsylvania, whether it's fentanyl or whether it's funding for the highways or whatever it is. I always tease him. He's pretty popular in Pennsylvania. Unfortunately, he's less. Less and less popular with his party. But if you looked across both parties and independents, he's more popular than I am. And I always say. I say, hey, you may be more popular with Republicans than I am, so who knows what his future holds? I'm not sure. I haven't. I've never asked him what he plans to do. I've never tried to encourage him to change parties. I think he needs to do what's best for him, but I think he's a pretty unique person. And the thing. It's interesting, Clay. I mean, of all the stuff we've done in Pennsylvania, the Energy and Innovation Summit, the jobs, the. All the investment that's coming, the thing people pull me aside and say the most about is the fact that he and I work together. And I think, you know, maybe it's because Pennsylvania is a purple state. I'm not sure. But people respect that. They're grateful for it. So I think he's a pretty formidable figure. I'm not sure what he'll do, but I'm. I'm wishing him the best.

[Buck Sexton]

We're speaking to Senator David McCormick of Pennsylvania. A senator. Appreciate you being with us. And you unveiled something recently, the Unlock American Energy and Jobs Act. So this has to do with federal permitting process?

[Senator Dave McCormick]

Yes.

[Buck Sexton]

That doesn't sound like something that's going to blow everyone's mind. But actually, I'm sure it's incredibly important for the speed of business. It's one of these things where government should get in the way a whole heck of a lot less. What can you tell us about this?

[Senator Dave McCormick]

Yeah, well, first of all, may not have sex appeal, but this is a big deal. This is a big deal. Let me tell you why I told President Trump this, and I think he agrees. This isn't just energy policy. This is the single most important thing we could do for the economy. It's a really big deal. What's happening now is laws like the Clean Water act and NEPA and other things have been hijacked by the environmentalists, the environmental activists, to stop investment, to stop investment in projects like nuclear power plants and gas fired plants. And so what my legislation does is it streamlines permitting. It takes about six years to get a permit on average for an energy project in America. It took three and a half years to win World War II. This is ridiculous. And, and we have to, we have to stop it. And so what, what the bill does is it basically puts a limited amount of time for environmental review one year. It requires that if a, if there's a permit is approved, it's permanent. In other words, you can't re litigate it down the road. And finally, if you're going to disapprove a permit, you have to give a written justification of how proving the permit would be in violation of the law. Those seem so simple and common sense. If we were able to do that, it would unlock $1.5 trillion of capital that's sitting on the sidelines waiting for these projects. And you know, I was a CEO for a number of years. I was an investor. You can't live in this world of uncertainty where you allocate capital and then it gets re litigated. That's the reason three pipelines were canceled in Pennsylvania since 2019. So this could be a big deal for the economy. It's, it's, it's an area where I think we can find enough bipartisan support because the permitting, the accelerating of permitting would be across everything. It's nuclear, it's natural gas, it's coal, it would be solar, it would be wind. Whatever it is, it supports an all of the above energy strategy. It just extremelines the permitting for all

[Clay Travis]

stock market is setting a record high today. I shared that fact on social media. Every time I do, people say, yeah, that's great, Clay, but I don't feel it. Stock, obviously the Oil and gas prices are up. It sometimes takes a while, as you well know. You're a business guy. The US Economy is an aircraft carrier that you're trying to turn. It takes a while for people to start to feel it. So I'm curious how you straddle this because Buck and I thinking about, I think about it a lot too. The numbers are actually pretty good for the economy. AI growth so far is very positive. But when people don't feel that yet, when you are too optimistic, you risk seeming out of touch with the way that people feel. How do you reconcile on the ground data with really kind of emotional feels with larger economic trends? Because I do think things are getting better. But if people don't feel it, they can say, oh, you're out of touch. How do you balance it?

[Senator Dave McCormick]

You're right. Well, I, I completely agree with you. And getting that messaging right, the truth is as follows. Things are better if you're a working family, things are better if you're anybody in the economy, things are better than they were under Joe Biden. Inflation take away the last two months because of what's happening with Iran is significantly less than it was during the Biden administration. About half of what it was on average. Wage growth is about double. Wage growth was 2.5 under Biden, it's 4. Given the working Families Tax Cut act, Every family has $3,500 more in their pocket. The job numbers are strong. So the economy is getting better for you. And there's a lot more on the horizon that's going to make it better. So that is true. The other thing that's true is that people are still feeling pinched and struggling, particularly in three areas. Energy prices, housing prices and health care cost. All three of those continue to grow. And, and that's putting a lot of pressure on folks. So we need to continue to do the things that President Trump has laid out. For example, the most favored nation provision on pharmaceuticals. Pharmaceuticals are 20% of health care costs particularly have a huge impact on elders. The housing bill that came out of the Senate and the House, we're trying to find a common bill that we can send to the President's desk. Housing prices in Pennsylvania up 11% last year. So that's, that's a pinch. And energy prices, and that particularly the gas prices as a result of the conflict in Iran. The way to address that in the medium and long term is permitting reform and all the things that get more energy into our system. Our energy dominance is incredible. But energy demand is growing. So as we build out this new energy. We have to build out more for consumers to take down prices, even though we're also supporting data centers and other things. So we got a lot of work to do. But the American people should feel confident that this economy is getting better. And they need to acknowledge that, even as we also acknowledge there's more work to do.

[Buck Sexton]

Super important question for you before we close, Senator. Make this, we can make this one quick, but Clay has this crazy idea that Kamala is going to be the Democrat nominee in 28, and I still think it's going to be Gavin Newsom. Can you just tell him that I'm right?

[Senator Dave McCormick]

Listen, I mean, my, my two favorite guys. Here's what I will say. Here's what I would say. I, I, you know, campaigned alongside, I mean, not with her, but obviously she was in Pennsylvania the whole time. And, and I, she could not connect to the people of Pennsylvania. And I believe part of the reason Trump won and I won in Pennsylvania was Kamala Harris and Bob Casey could not say the word fracking. It could not come out of their mouth. They could not acknowledge this energy revolution, what was required. So she's going to have to get back. She's going to have to get very much a PhD in what the issues are for working people before she's going to be able to win nationwide and certainly win in Pennsylvania. I can't speak for Gavin Newsom. All I know is when I listen to him on these podcasts and he talks about that, that tough upbringing he had and how he went to the school hard knocks. I mean, it's hard for me to imagine that that's a guy that's going to connect with people on the fracking rig in Pennsylvania too. So I give them both a thumbs down. But, you know, what do I know?

[Clay Travis]

Good stuff as always, Senator. Look forward to seeing you again, and thanks for the time.

[Senator Dave McCormick]

All right, thanks, guys. Have a good day.

[Buck Sexton]

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[Clay Travis]

Miss the show While you're on the go, wind down your day with the Daily Review podcast. Find it on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcast.

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[Buck Sexton]

Welcome back here to Clay and Buck. We got some calls. Here we go. Donna in Virginia, African American woman who agrees with Clay about Kamala. Oh, my. Let's go, Donna. What's going on?

[Senator Dave McCormick]

Yeah. Unfortunately, Clay is correct. Any black woman that will vote democratic just because will vote for Kamala, especially the angry, college educated ones. And I can say this as a black woman with a master's degree in education.

[Buck Sexton]

What did you. You don't think they'll vote for handsome, handsome Gavin, though? I mean, you know, what about that smile?

[Senator Dave McCormick]

No. Kamala first. Even though they. And they may not even like her, but they'll vote for her first because she's black woman.

[Buck Sexton]

Donna.

[Clay Travis]

Thank you, Virginia. But Dan in Tampa says I don't know anything about black women. He's married to one. He disagrees, I guess, with Donna, too. Dan, fire away. Yeah, I disagree with Donna wholeheartedly. Kamala, first of all, doesn't even admit she's black. Secondly, the way she disrespected the black community by not even coming out, giving a concession speech and left all the people at Howard looking stupid. Thirdly, Morgan said he's not giving her another penny.

[Senator Dave McCormick]

He's a huge Democratic donor.

[Clay Travis]

And fourthly, she's just.

[Senator Dave McCormick]

She. When she said Beyonce was going to

[Clay Travis]

give a concert and Beyonce said two words and get off the stage. She's burnt her car with black people. We're exhausted with her. She's not a black woman. She doesn't claim to be a black woman.

[Senator Dave McCormick]

We don't identify her as a black woman.

[Clay Travis]

That's a strong take from Dan and Tampa. That was funny. Buck, do you remember when they advertised Beyonce was going to show up and then she didn't perform at all? That was. That was kind of remarkable. And Trump was right. Kamala made a big deal of being Indian. She's half Indian, half black. And then she pivoted in a big way and decided that she wanted to identify as black primarily for the campaign. We will see. Put a pin in this one. Not going to shock you, you buck. I think I'm right. More fun tomorrow.

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