Normally Podcast: Friends, Phones & Far-Fetched Theories

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Normally Podcast: Friends, Phones & Far-Fetched Theories"

The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show (iHeartPodcasts)
Date: November 27, 2025
Hosts: Mary Katharine Ham & Carol Markowitz

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Episode Overview

In this laid-back, Q&A-driven episode of "Normally," hosts Mary Katharine Ham and Carol Markowitz set aside breaking news in favor of candid conversation and audience questions. Topics range from the origins of their friendship, favorite conspiracy theories, entertainment picks, and nostalgic anecdotes, to reflections on contemporary political issues like the New York mayoral race and the debate over cell phones in schools. The hosts balance humor and insight as they dive into lighter, personal subjects, revealing their camaraderie and engaging perspectives on current events and everyday life.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. How Did the Hosts Meet? – Friendships & Blogging Days

• Early 2000s Connection: The hosts met post-9/11 through the blogging community; Carol ran the blog "Alarming News," and Mary Katharine was affiliated with Hot Air.
• Bonding over NYC Events: They reminisce about their single days in New York City, their skepticism about marriage, and mutual experiences at various events.
• Memorable Prank: They pulled a stunt on a 9/11 anniversary, handing out pamphlets titled "The Truth about 9/11"—which simply recounted the official events, confounding conspiracy theorists.

  “The truthers themselves would be confronted with the truth. Right. They would think we were on their side.” — Mary Katharine Ham (05:23)

2. The Podcast on YouTube – Why Not There?

• Technical/Practical Challenges: The podcast isn't on YouTube largely because neither host has the bandwidth to start yet another platform, and their current model supports them financially.
• Prior Attempts: They discuss briefly trying to upload clips to YouTube and Rumble, but found the format and promotion required didn't suit their content style.

  “Unless you're posting the really catchy titles and you get the cliffhanger episodes, it just…doesn't quite work.” — Carol Markowitz (07:06)

3. Conspiracy Theories – Favorites & Guilty Pleasures

• Sun "Truther" to Clinton "Truther": Mary Katharine jokes about being a “sun truther” before it was common, and admits to believing the Clintons are up to more mischief than is public.

  “My default assumption is that those two are just up to…pretty good worst. Up to the worst.” — Mary Katharine Ham (08:19)

• On distinguishing conspiracy from reality: “I'm not even sure that's a conspiracy theory.” — Carol Markowitz (08:46)

4. Casting a Biopic of Trump’s Second Administration

• Creative Cast Suggestions:
  • Trump: Norm Macdonald (hypothetically, if alive)
  • Rubio: Pedro Pascal
  • Hegseth: Glen Powell
  • Susie Wiles: Emma Thompson
  • Gabbard: Gal Gadot
  • Kennedy: George Clooney or (jokingly) Jerry Seinfeld

  “Trump is tricky because Trump is a comedic force.” — Mary Katharine Ham (11:13)

5. Favorite Entertainment – Joy and Downtime

• Reading to Kids: Mary Katharine finds joy in reading classics (e.g., “The Secret Garden,” “Pride and Prejudice”) and admits to missing out on Tolkien.
• Fiction Recommendations: Carol recommends “Go on Pretending” by Alina Adams, publishes an annual reading list, and marvels at her daughter's voracious reading.
• Comedy Shows: Mary Katharine endorses “What We Do in the Shadows” for stress-free laughs.
• On Quoting Films: Both hosts enjoy quoting movies like "Big Lebowski,” "Monty Python," "Ricky Bobby," and "Friday.”

  “They have us working in shifts.” — Carol Markowitz quoting Big Lebowski (15:36)
  “Probably Monty Python and the Holy Grail was a go-to when we were kids.” — Mary Katharine Ham (15:43)

6. New York City Mayoral Politicking

• Fears over Progressive Nominee: Discussion centers on Zoran Mamandi, the new Democratic mayoral nominee, and the dangers (as they see them) of hard-left candidates.
• Deportation Question: Both hosts advise against attempts by conservatives to unseat or deport him, warning it would martyr him or backfire in a democratic process.

  “When someone wins an election fair and square, you get a shot at it. You had the shot…that's not how democracy works.” — Mary Katharine Ham (21:32)

• Voting Strategy: They suggest non-socialists rally around Eric Adams, the incumbent, as the best (if not perfect) alternative, even considering his scandals.

  “He’s not amazing. He’s just good enough. He’s not communist.” — Carol Markowitz (24:11)

7. The Cell Phones in Schools Debate

• Enforcement Is Key: Carol argues the real problem is lack of rule enforcement in public schools, not the devices themselves.
• On Balance: Mary Katharine supports banning phones for better behavior and focus, but recognizes removing them relieves the administration from addressing individual issues case-by-case.

  “We try to keep our kids fairly screen free…their ability to problem solve is better, their desire to read books is better when they do not have access all the time.” — Mary Katharine Ham (26:36)

8. Nostalgic Anecdotes: 80s/90s School Memories

• Disciplinary Legends: Stories of intimidating wooden paddles, “legendary” teachers, and unairconditioned school buildings amuse the hosts.
• Totally Different Times: The tales elicit awe from younger generations; both reflect on how standards, comfort, and discipline have changed.

  “The legend I remember was that there were holes drilled in a wooden paddle...so you can go faster.” — Mary Katharine Ham (29:16)
  “My middle school did not have air conditioning in North Carolina.” — Mary Katharine Ham (29:41)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “We would see each other at various events and also hang out sometimes in New York City. Back when the two of us were just like wild single gals. Yep, yep. Skeptical about the institution of marriage.”
  — Mary Katharine Ham (04:09)

• “One of the cool things that we did together was we saw the 9/11 conspiracy theories start to develop…and we did kind of a prank…”
  — Carol Markowitz (04:35)

• “If I just stuck with [my YouTube channel], I would have many, many, many followers now.”
  — Mary Katharine Ham (06:32)

• “I think the thing that brings me really a lot of joy…is reading to my kids.”
  — Mary Katharine Ham (11:58)

• “You could just say you're not allowed to use your phones in class and that's it. But…the real issue is that public schools across the country do not enforce any of the rules.”
  — Carol Markowitz (25:36)

• “We had paddles…there were paddles. So it was like we had just gotten past that. But a couple of old school teachers, they would hang on the wall…”
  — Mary Katharine Ham (28:34)

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Important Timestamps

• 03:25 — How the hosts met, early blogging days
• 04:35 — The 9/11 "truther" pamphlet prank
• 06:27 — Why the podcast isn't on YouTube
• 08:05 — Favorite conspiracy theories
• 09:12 — Dream casting Trump administration biopic
• 11:58 — Entertainment that brings joy, book recs
• 14:52 — Most quoted funny movie lines in their households
• 20:59 — NYC mayoral politics, Zoran Mamandi discussion
• 24:11 — Whom to vote for if you’re not a socialist in NYC
• 25:11 — Cell phones in schools debate
• 27:39 — 80s/90s school memories and tough teachers

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Tone and Language

The conversation is personable, witty, and often self-deprecating, with both hosts leaning into honest takes and the “normalish” theme—where they aim for common sense rather than ideological extremes. Cultural nostalgia and parental humor abound.

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Summary

This episode serves as both a breather from the usual news cycle and a revealing window into the personalities behind the mics. It’s a mix of playful banter, lived anecdotes, and practical conservative-liberal commentary on culture, parenting, and politics. For listeners craving an authentic, unvarnished take on how news intersects with real life—and a few big laughs—this installment delivers.

Transcript

[Mary Katharine Ham]

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human hey Ryan Reynolds here wishing you a very happy half off holiday.

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[Mary Katharine Ham]

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[Mary Katharine Ham]

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[Carol Markowitz]

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[Mary Katharine Ham]

We are back on normally the show with normalish takes for when the news gets weird. And today we have normalish takes on all your questions. Because it's a chill week. It's chill.

[Carol Markowitz]

There's no news.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I'm at the lake, as you can tell, because if you see this on video, I'm like, basically a billboard right now with all my gear. I am Mary Kathleen Ham.

[Carol Markowitz]

And I am Carol Markowitz. And I would say these are going to be our least normalish takes.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Maybe. So shall we get. Let's do it.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

One listener asks, how did you two meet? It seems like you've been friends for a while. Thanks for the show.

[Carol Markowitz]

We have been friends for a while. Like, a really long time. But I would say we met somewhere in the early 2000s. It was post 9 11. I had a blog. Were you at Hot Air when we met?

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Possibly. Or even maybe slightly before that. I had sort of done things affiliated with Hot Air but wasn't necessarily employed with them. So. So a lot of people knew me from that. But yeah, I think it was just the early blogging days. And I noticed your old blog. Alarming news.

[Carol Markowitz]

Alarming news. That's right.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

We would see each other at various events and also hang out sometimes in New York City. Back when the two of us were just like wild single gals. Yep, yep. Skeptical about the institute of marriage and institution of marriage and whether we would enter into said agreements in the future.

[Carol Markowitz]

Funny, right? That we were kind of like, I don't know about this.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I mean, I think it's a. I think it's a testament to how when you meet the right person, you're like.

[Carol Markowitz]

I was going to say that, yeah, we were dating the wrong people. Let's be real here. They were very nice. They were very nice people, but they were not the right people for us. One of the cool things that we did together was we saw the 911 conspiracy theories start to develop. And we did kind of a prank on one of the anniversaries of 911 where we printed pamphlets that said the truth about 9 11. And then when you opened the pamphlet, it was like the story that is the official truth of 9 11. Because that's actually what happened. 19 terrorists boarded planes and crashed them into our buildings. And that's the story of 9 11. So yeah, but, you know, people would be, like, annoyed and be like, you know, walking by us, and we'd be like, you know, read the truth about 9 11. And then we'd be like, read it. Go ahead and read it.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah, and the. And the truthers themselves would be confronted with the truth. Right. They would think we were on their side. Gosh, that is a vintage.

[Carol Markowitz]

That is. There's a video of that somewhere. There's definitely video of that exists somewhere in the universe.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah, I'm sure I have it. But because of my, like, probable adhd, I would never be able to find it. It's just somewhere in my many, many files.

[Carol Markowitz]

I mean, it might be on YouTube or something, but. Yeah, well. So somebody actually asks, why is your podcast not on YouTube or listed on YouTube? Podcast search finds nothing. And I will be real with you. We don't know how to do it. The thing is that this pays us, that when you download our podcast, we get paid. I personally, and Maybe I think, M.K. you're in the same boat. I just don't know how to get it started on YouTube and elsewhere. Maybe we will in the future, but we're both fairly jammed and have a ton of things going on, and we can't kind of learn this new skill that we maybe should be learning sometimes.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I think back about my old YouTube channel, which I started in, like, 2007.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah, you could be rich right now.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

If I just stuck with that, I would have many, many, many followers now. Subscribers now. But, yeah, I think one of the things about being a working mom who loves to hang out with her kids is Carol and I are always looking to do biggest bang for your buck. Right. So what's the thing that's working? What's the thing that we can do and also do all the rest of the things we're doing, and this turns out to be the best way to do it for us. Right?

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

But, yes, I'm open to it, as my MK Hammer channel from 2007 attests, but.

[Carol Markowitz]

Right. Well, we kind of tried it when we first launched. Normally we did clips on YouTube and on Rumble, but unless you're posting like, you know, kind of like the. The really catchy titles and the. And you get, you know, the cliffhanger episodes, it just. It doesn't quite work. People aren't looking to, like, maybe they are, but we just didn't do it. Right. I don't know. But we just didn't have the. You'll never believe what happens next, you know, so that's not Our. No, it's really not. But going back to conspiracy theories, somebody asks of all the political conspiracy theories, which are usually the currency of the non normies, from JFK being assassinated by the mafia to chemtrails, which causes you actual pause. I don't know. I used to say I was a sun truther. Like, I thought, you know, for a long time it was like, sun is very, very bad for you. And I was like, is it though?

[Mary Katharine Ham]

And I.

[Carol Markowitz]

But I feel like people have. That's been kind of. It's caught up. Like I'm no longer a sun truther. We're all sun truthers now. People know that being out in the sunsh is actually not terrible for you. Yeah. Do you have any?

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I, I would say that the one, the one that I sort of like is my guilty pleasure, is that I think the Clintons are up to way worse than has been publicly exposed just all the time. My, my default assumption is that those two are just up to pretty good worst. Up to the worst.

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Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

So I would say that that's the one I could be convinced on. You know, when people read for sure.

[Carol Markowitz]

I'm not even sure that's a conspiracy theory.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

No, it might not even be a conspiracy theory. But yes, I have darker thoughts about them than the publicly approved version. Yeah. Can I, can I ask this one? Did you see this one? You're in charge of casting a biopic of the Trump second administration. Who do you cast as Trump? Rubio, Hegseth, Wiles, Gabbard, Kennedy, et cetera.

[Carol Markowitz]

Man, that's tough. Oh, do you have some good ones?

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I saw this one and it actually came to me pretty quickly. I don't have a Trump yet, which obviously is very important.

[Carol Markowitz]

Let me give you a Trump. Even though this person's not alive, I just feel like Norm MacDonald would have done a fantastic Trump. I could just see him nailing that role.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Okay, I'm going to give you a couple of my thoughts, and they are not, you know, political ideology does not require to be anything. I'm just looking it up.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah, yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

So Rubio, Pedro Pascal Hegset's going to be so happy with this. Glen Powell.

[Carol Markowitz]

I don't know who that is.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Glen Powell is the, the Iceman ish character in Top Maverick.

[Carol Markowitz]

Oh, okay. I didn't see it.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

The twisters guy.

[Carol Markowitz]

I really have to see that movie.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah, yeah. Glen Powell. Who else do I have? Susie Wiles, Emma Thompson. Hmm. That's good. Yeah. I mean, and then I think for Gabbard, I had maybe Gal Gadot bed.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah, Yeah, I could see that. Kennedy. Anybody for Kennedy?

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I didn't have a Kennedy one.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah, I'm trying to think. I'm just so. I'm. I don't watch movies, but yeah, Kennedy, he's. He's sort of a funky character. I could see, like, I got. I guess I just know comedians more than anybody else, but like a Seinfeld almost.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Can you.

[Carol Markowitz]

Can you see Jerry playing.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah, my. My casting. Straight casting. And I like yours. The, like, almost like Spaceball's version of Trump for Kennedy. I mean, this is. This is too predictable, but a Clooney could play a Kennedy.

[Carol Markowitz]

Oh, yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

That some same sort of weather looking older guy feel.

[Carol Markowitz]

Absolutely. Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

But Trump is tricky because Trump is a comedic force. So you.

[Carol Markowitz]

Right, that's the thing. I feel like it has to be somebody who gets that. And I just feel like. Yeah, even Alec Baldwin, when he played him, and he gets it, but he doesn't. He kind of is more about making fun of him. He doesn't get that. Trump is funny also.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

He was my first thought, but I thought there's too much of that and there's too much, like, in his heart, he thinks he's so malevolent that he's gonna be. He's gonna be intent on either playing him very stupid or very evil. And I think there's just like a. It'd be hard to find somebody who could do it.

[Carol Markowitz]

What do you watch, listen to, or read that's purely for entertainment purposes? What brings you joy?

[Mary Katharine Ham]

This is a great question. And sometimes I'm like, I wish I had more time for such things. I think the thing that brings me really a lot of joy, and I'm gonna sound like such a goody goody two shoes here, is reading to my kids. So I read classics with them. So we'll do children's classics like the Secret Garden or even right now I'm reading Pride and Prejudice to them, which is a little above their level, but I'm able to talk them through it. And we talk about what the sentences mean and the. And the language and. And they'll probably, you know, pick up some of it as they go. So I've been reading that to them. I'm told that now might be a good age for the Hobbit. And I've never done Tolkien before, which I know is like such a. So terrible on my track.

[Carol Markowitz]

I've never read it either.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah. So I might.

[Carol Markowitz]

I'm not a fantasy, but I would give that a shot.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah. So that Might be our next one after Pride and Prejudice. We also read, like, more contemporary stuff.

[Carol Markowitz]

That's amazing. That's really cool. I feel like I should do that, but I might have missed my window.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah, well, it ends up being my only fiction reading because I think that falls off for me. I'm trying to read fiction while I'm on vacation this week.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah, I read a lot. Not a lot, but my whole thing is I try to read fiction, and I'm reading, going, I'm reading right now. Go on Pretending by Alina Adams. She's one of my favorite writers. She just writes really, really beautiful fiction.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I always take recommendations from Carol because I feel like we're on the same wavelength when it comes to fiction.

[Carol Markowitz]

I'm gonna. I publish a list at the end of the year where I kind of feel disappointed with how little I read or, you know, it's not bad. It's more than I think the average person, but it's still, like, not where I want to be. And then, like, I'll have, like, let's say 15 books for the year, and my. My daughter will be like, oh, here's the 150 I read.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

If I read half as much as my children.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

A much better person.

[Carol Markowitz]

Same. Same. Yeah. But also, it's hard. It's hard.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

It is hard.

[Carol Markowitz]

We go easier on ourselves. Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

The very, very silly thing that I watch that makes me happy every time I turn it on is what we do in the Shadows, which is a, I don't know, vampire based mockumentary. Okay. Fantastic.

[Carol Markowitz]

All right.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

The comedic actors are fantastic. The plots are ridiculous. It's all just so silly that you don't have to worry about it. Right. It's like, I like that I have trouble sometimes gearing up for very serious TV programs. This I don't have to be in any mood for. Just turn it on.

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[Carol Markowitz]

I find it very hard to watch tense shows, especially at night, which is the only time we have time to watch anything. We're watching the Bear right now, but we're only in the first season. It has tension. Like, a little bit too much tension. Like, when things go wrong at the restaurant, you're like, like, why do I. Why am I stressing about, like, their lives? I like comedy. Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah.

[Carol Markowitz]

Same funniest line from any movie. I was thinking about this. I don't know if this is the funniest line, but this is the line that we use the most in our household. It's from Big Lebowski, where he has his car stolen and he has a clearance Clearwater tape in. And the police officer is. He asked the police officer like, do you think you're going to find my car? And the police officer is like, I don't know. And then Lebowski is like, but what about my Credence Clearwater tape? And the cop is like, oh yeah. They have us working in shifts. So they have us working in shifts. Is there a line that we use around the house when, like, are we.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Going to do blank?

[Carol Markowitz]

Like something that's just, you know, too difficult and too time consuming or like they have us working in shifts?

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I love it. I would say the most quotable movies in my family and my family of origin and my immediate family now are like Monty Python stuff. Probably Monty Python and the Holy Grail was a go to when we were kids. I feel like my dad really got us into comedy nerd space. So we watched a lot of Second City TV and all of the Ed Grimley and all the SNL characters from back in the day. Those are very quotable in my house. Ricky Bobby.

[Carol Markowitz]

Oh yeah, Ricky Bobby for sure. Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

The Billy Madison era for me. Still. I quote things that my kids have no idea what I'm talking about, by the way. And Friday might be my most favorite quotable movie of all time.

[Carol Markowitz]

Oh, that's really good. I mean, by Felicia is from Friday.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Well, there are so many things that are so embedded in culture that are from Friday that people don't even know they're from Friday. But that was really in my formative years, Friday was a go to. Yeah. So those have been just stuck in my brain ever since.

[Carol Markowitz]

We're gonna take a short break and come right back with Normale.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Hey, Ryan Reynolds here wishing you a very happy half off holiday because right.

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[Mary Katharine Ham]

To be clear, that's half price, not half the service. Mint is still premium unlimited wireless for a great price. So that means a half day. Yeah. Give it a [e-mail] Switch upfront payment.

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[Carol Markowitz]

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[Mary Katharine Ham]

Hey, audiobook lovers. This week on the podcast I'm sitting Down with musician, producer and walking encyclopedia Questlove. We're talking about Mark Ronson's memoir Night how to be a DJ in 90s New York City. All right, like we talked about before, Mark Ronson found sanctuary in the DJ booth. What's a tool or piece of equipment in the studio or on stage that gives you the most control?

[Carol Markowitz]

So I have two microphones on stage. We have the microphone that you hear as the audience.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Then we have a second microphone in which we communicate with each other. I feel like that second microphone kind of saved all of our friendships. No band likes each other after 20 years or 25 years. The Beatles broke up in seven and a half years and we're going on 35. Listen to Earsay, the Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club on the iHeartradio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

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[Carol Markowitz]

All right, switching gears a little bit to politics. We had got a few questions about the new Democratic nominee for mayor of New York City. I think, you know, Zoran Mamandi is. He's, frankly, it's scaring people that someone like this can get so close to being the mayor of New York. He's in pole position to win. So somebody asks, should the Trump DOJ make a move to strip Zorin of his citizenship and deport him? Only if you want to make him super popular and definitely going to win the election, is my thinking.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah. This is one of those things that conservatives should not get into that liberals have been into in the past, which is the idea that when someone wins an election fair and square, that you can unelect them. Right. Like you get a shot at it. You had the shot. Yeah.

[Carol Markowitz]

And you have another shot in November.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Just as the entire first Trump administration, they were going to get their shot in 2020, but they insisted on trying to unprecedent the president. And that's not how democracy works. Even though they want to claim that they're the guardians of democracy. So don't do that. You have to fight on fairground with this guy. It's un American to deport him simply because he's a bad choice for this city. He is a bad choice.

[Carol Markowitz]

He is a bad choice. Right.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

He's like a disastrous one.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

There's actually a clip floating around now from 2021 where he's like, well, the object is to seize the means of production.

[Carol Markowitz]

Right. Yeah. The thing is, I think people, not.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Productivity, modern therapy, speak to the new language.

[Carol Markowitz]

I think what people can take away from that is we should be more careful about who we let into the country. They should align with our values. They shouldn't want to bring down capitalism. All of these things are, it's okay to monitor people's social media or find out what they really, really, you know, care about and want to do here. And it's fine to say, you know, no, people like this.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah. No, I think it's also just so gross to have this rich kid doing the thing that rich kid revolutionaries always do, which is let Me not let anyone else get rich and demonize anyone who's working hard and moving up and creating products for a bunch of people and getting rich that way. And also let me take all your money. But you're awful and evil. It's just the whole thing is so gross. Please vote for Eric Adams. I guess. Yeah.

[Carol Markowitz]

Well, that's the follow up question somebody else had was should everyone who's not a socialist in New York City just commit to voting for Eric Adams? Right now there's some controversy around this. You know, people are like, well, why not Curtis Lewa, the Republican? I just think that Eric Adams is the best option here. I think he's got the biggest shot to win. I like Curtis a lot. I just, if I were living in New York, I would want people to put all of their chips behind, behind Eric Adams, because I think that he's, he's currently mayor, he has some advantages because of that. And he's normal enough is really what we're going for here. He's not amazing. He's just good enough. He's not communist.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

And the less you coalesce, the more.

[Carol Markowitz]

Chance, the more likely. Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I would also say I have read through quite a bit of the indictment of him because this is like a vote for the criminal, it's important situation.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

But I will, like I think you can. You might assuage yourself a bit on that front if you read the indictment, which is a little like, I'm sure there may be more stuff there. Yeah, A little like, oh, he got his flights upgraded and I'm supposed to be very concerned about that.

[Carol Markowitz]

Right.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I'm not sure how concerned I am about that compared to seize the means of production.

[Carol Markowitz]

That's really the thing that there is. There's questionable stuff around Eric Adams. I wrote out all of his problems in a Washington examiner piece before he was actually indicted, when it was like he was going to be indicted. He's got a lot of shady. He had a lot of shady people around him that he didn't fire. He's pledging to do better. Let's see if he does. But again, when you compare it to straight up communism, it's kind of an easy choice.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

What do you think of banning cell phones in schools? This person notes, which is a great point. I can see why they're doing it, but they're worried that if you take them out, then teachers won't be at all worried about being documented doing the things that have ticked off parents this far left indoctrination over the last Couple years. And of course, a lot of that was brought to light by Zoom. Right. And by having cameras in the classroom.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah, well, I would say that they still will have cameras in the classroom. These kids are all using Chromebooks now, which is a separate question of whether that should be the case. Right. It's. Should kids be using screens in schools? Pretty much, you know, at every level at this point. My 4th grader doesn't have screens, but my older kids do. And so you'll still have that. You know what the problem is? If you have a school that has enforcement of the rules, then it won't matter to ban phones or not. You could just say you're not allowed to use your phones in class and that's it. But the real issue is that public schools across the country do not enforce any of the rules. They do not suspend anybody. They certainly don't expel anybody. There's no risk to these kids to just not follow the rules at all. So if you have a rule following school, you could have phones that you're just not allowed to use at certain times. That's not what we have, unfortunately.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Yeah, I think, I tend to think the benefits of no phones are probably greater than the downsides of not having them. Yeah. Just for instruction. I think, you know, we try to keep our kids fairly screen free, not, you know, not totally crunchy, but I find that their behavior is better, their ability to problem solve is better, their desire to read books is better when they do not have access all the time. And so in a school setting, that would obviously help students. But I do think what you're saying, Carol, is what they're doing is when they take the option away entirely, it obviates the need for them to jump in on a case by case basis because they've shown not willing or able to do that. And parents will fight them tooth and nail. That's part of it, right? Parents will fight over this.

[Carol Markowitz]

Exactly.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Each adjudication. And so they're just like, nah, we're done.

[Carol Markowitz]

So, yeah, yeah, that's, that's the problem here.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Can I ask one question? Okay, so you went to 1980s, 90s New York public schools.

[Carol Markowitz]

I went, I went to. I went to Jewish schools, but yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

Okay, so I went to 80s 90s public schools in North Carolina. What's the wildest old school, 80s anecdote from your schools? Like something that Gen Z would be like, they did what, do you have any.

[Carol Markowitz]

You know, I had a really incredible teacher in high school. I went to a small private high school In Brooklyn. And I had this like, really, like one of those teachers straight out of the movies, like, who inspire you and you know, whatever. But those teachers are always a little crazy. And he used to do stuff like he'd get really angry and throw a desk out the window. It was just like he, he taught me how to write. But I also feared for my life.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

So, yeah, you know, a little from.

[Carol Markowitz]

Column, a little from column B.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

We've, we've had those. We're like. I remember in my public schools, like, enforcement by teachers was somewhat rougher than would be allowed now. And I would argue that in the cases where I saw that it was warranted, like physically restraining. Sure. One of two of my favorite ones. One, when I first came to my elementary school, which had been mid-80s ish, no one was paddled in our public schools, but there were paddles. So it was like we had just amazing. We had just gotten past that. But a couple of old school teachers, they would hang on the wall and they were sort of legendary as this unspoken threat that something could happen to you if you got out of hand. And the legend I remember was that like there were holes drilled in a wooden paddle. And I was like, why would that be? And the rumor was, I don't know if this is true. Older people than I can say is that that makes it more like cuts through the wind so you can go faster. Wow.

[Carol Markowitz]

They needed it to be worse. They needed it to really hurt.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

That makes sense though. Nothing actually happened, but it was like the, the threat. And then the other one was my middle school did not have air conditioning in North Carolina.

[Carol Markowitz]

No. None of our schools had air conditioning. Yeah.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

And the rule was, I remember that. I don't know who wrote this rule. The rule was if it was 98 degrees for three days in a row, we would get the fourth day off. Even my children, who I think I've toughened up a little more than the average kid this age, if I asked them to be in a school building in 98 degree heat for 10, three days.

[Carol Markowitz]

Yeah, I don't think they'd make it.

[Mary Katharine Ham]

I don't think they would make it. Yeah, society would lose its mind.

[Carol Markowitz]

Right. We were like in New York like two weeks ago, my 15 year old, my husband and I, and they were having like a heat snap. And I know I live in Florida, so I like heat, I assure you. But the problem was that everywhere in New York felt really under air conditioned compared to Florida. Like Florida. You walk into a restaurant, you're like, brrr. You know in New York it was like why am I still hot?

[Mary Katharine Ham]

What is this?

[Carol Markowitz]

My 15 year old was like oh, like this. How do they live like this?

[Mary Katharine Ham]

This is not cutting right.

[Carol Markowitz]

Not at all. This was so much fun. Thanks for joining us on Normally Normally airs Tuesdays and Thursdays and you can subscribe anywhere you get your podcasts. Get in touch with us@ normallythepodmail.com thanks for listening and when things get weird, act normally.

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