The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show

Episode: "Normally Podcast: Susie Wiles, JD Vance, and Media Meltdowns"

Date: December 18, 2025
Hosts: Mary Kathryn Hamlin & Kal Penn
Podcast: The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show / iHeartPodcasts

Episode Overview

In this lively and sharply observant episode, Mary Kathryn Hamlin and Kal Penn dissect the biggest political media moment of the week: a revealing Vanity Fair profile on White House Chief of Staff Susie Wiles. The conversation delves into the fallout from Wiles's candid remarks about major political figures—including Donald Trump, Vice President JD Vance, and others—analyzing both the substance of her comments and the media’s framing. The hosts also discuss the media’s treatment of conservative figures, the new revelations about the Mar-a-Lago raid, and end with reflections on the “6-7” sports meme as a bright spot of current culture.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Susie Wiles's Vanity Fair Interviews and Fallout

• Context:
  Susie Wiles, Trump’s White House Chief of Staff credited with wrangling his “large personality” and helping secure his 2024 election win, gave a series of eleven interviews to Vanity Fair’s reporter.
• Main Issue:
  The Vanity Fair piece captured Wiles’s off-the-cuff—and sometimes cutting—remarks about top officials, igniting a political and media firestorm.

Notable Takeaways:

• Wiles described Trump as having “the personality of an alcoholic” (even though he doesn’t drink), J.D. Vance as a “conspiracy theorist,” Elon Musk as “an avowed ketamine user,” and hit at others in Trump’s circle.
• Wiles claims her comments were taken out of context or cherrypicked for sensationalism.

“She said things that were...taken out of context...She referred to Trump as having a personality of an alcoholic, which is, you know, additionally crazy because he doesn’t drink.”
— Mary Kathryn Hamlin (05:00)

• The hosts speculate on why someone as seasoned as Wiles would be so candid. Was she planning an exit? Sending a signal to Trump? Or just too comfortable with the reporter?

Theories and Reaction:

• Media Trap:
  Susie Wiles—highly experienced—may have let her guard down with a “chummy” journalist, forgetting the inevitable negative framing of right-of-center figures.
• Possible Internal Messaging:
  Kal Penn hypothesizes that Wiles might be sending signals to Trump via the press if internal channels are being ignored.
• Rubio’s Portrayal:
  Marco Rubio, also mentioned, is praised as the “adult in every room,” in contrast to Vance.

Wiles's Response:

“The article published early this morning is a disingenuously framed hit piece on me and the finest president, White House staff and cabinet in history…”
— Mary Kathryn Hamlin reading Wiles’s statement (09:03)

• Wiles labels the piece an unfair attack, emphasizing omitted context and highlighting the Trump administration’s “unmatched leadership and vision.”

Media and Photo Treatment:

• Vanity Fair’s photo shoot is called out for making the subjects look bad, a tactic hosts say is reserved for conservatives.

“They don’t do this to Democrats. They just don’t.”
— Mary Kathryn Hamlin (09:52)

2. JD Vance’s Handling of the “Conspiracy Theorist” Label

[12:58–14:19]

JD Vance directly addresses Wiles calling him a “conspiracy theorist”:

“Conspiracy theorist. Sometimes I am a conspiracy theorist, but I only believe in the conspiracy theories that are true… A conspiracy theory is just something that was true six months before the media admitted it.”
— JD Vance (12:58–14:19)

Hosts’ Analysis:

• Both hosts praise Vance’s self-deprecating, agile retort—turning a negative into a joke and flipping the narrative.
• Mary Kathryn notes Vance's close association with Tucker Carlson will lead to ongoing scrutiny about conspiracies; he’ll need to field such questions adeptly.

3. The Alcoholic Personality Comment—Framing and Context

[17:43–18:27]

Kal Penn provides the fuller context of Wiles's “alcoholic’s personality” remark:

“She attributes her ability to work for Mr. Trump to growing up with an alcoholic father. The sportscaster Pat Summerall. High functioning alcoholics… their personalities are exaggerated when they drink, she said. And so I’m a little bit of an expert in big personalities. While Mr. Trump does not drink, she said he has an alcoholic’s personality…”
— Kal Penn (17:43)

Host Reaction:

• Both acknowledge there was broader context, but caution that Wiles can’t simply walk back her comments after extensive interviews.

4. Media Narratives—Right vs. Left

• The hosts reiterate a point: conservative figures should expect hostile media framing, both in words and imagery.
• Vanity Fair’s treatment is used to highlight broader media bias, referencing unfavorable photo selections and mocking tone.

5. The Mar-a-Lago Raid and Media Hypocrisy

[21:50–28:19]

• New Evidence from Fox News Digital:
  FBI emails indicate internal resistance to the DOJ’s push to raid Mar-a-Lago—members questioned probable cause and suggested negotiation with Trump's lawyers.
• Host Reflection:
  Both hosts believe the aggressive legal action against Trump galvanized his supporters and contributed to his re-election momentum.

“I pinpoint that as the time where Trump was going to win reelection. I think this is what led to it… Suddenly everything that he said about how unfair he was treated and how law enforcement was used against him… came into focus.”
— Mary Kathryn Hamlin (23:58)

“It is all with the end—almost confessed on paper in writing—that the point is to be done with Donald Trump…”
— Kal Penn (25:12)

6. A Lighter Note: The “6-7” Meme and Cultural Connection

[31:16–34:15]

• The show closes with a cheerful discussion of the “6-7” meme, which went viral at kids’ basketball games. Mary Kathryn recently wrote a defense of it in the Wall Street Journal. Both hosts praise it as an example of positive, modern monoculture—a simple, fun, communal act.

“It’s a meme about nothing. As I say in my piece.”
— Mary Kathryn Hamlin (33:19)

“We don’t have a monoculture anymore… Is six seven our monoculture? It might be…”
— Kal Penn (33:57)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

| Timestamp | Quote | Speaker | |-----------|-------|---------| | 05:00 | “She referred to Trump as having a personality of an alcoholic, which is, you know, additionally crazy because he doesn’t drink.” | Mary Kathryn Hamlin | | 09:03 | “The article published early this morning is a disingenuously framed hit piece on me and the finest president...” | Mary Kathryn Hamlin (reading Wiles's statement) | | 09:52 | “They don’t do this to Democrats. They just don’t.” | Mary Kathryn Hamlin | | 12:58 | “Conspiracy theorist. Sometimes I am a conspiracy theorist, but I only believe in the conspiracy theories that are true... A conspiracy theory is just something that was true six months before the media admitted it.” | JD Vance | | 14:19 | “A stellar response, extremely clever, very on his toes.” | Mary Kathryn Hamlin | | 17:43 | “She attributes her ability to work for Mr. Trump to growing up with an alcoholic father... While Mr. Trump does not drink, she said he has, quote, an alcoholic’s personality...” | Kal Penn | | 23:58 | “I pinpoint that as the time where Trump was going to win reelection. I think this is what led to it... everything that he said about how unfair he was treated... came into focus for me and I think it did for a lot of people.” | Mary Kathryn Hamlin | | 33:19 | “It's a meme about nothing. As I say in my piece.” | Mary Kathryn Hamlin | | 33:57 | “We don’t have a monoculture anymore… Is six seven our monoculture? It might be…” | Kal Penn |

Timestamps for Major Segments

• [02:16] Show begins – Hosts check in, discuss daily life and the value of offline connections
• [04:19] Susie Wiles’s Vanity Fair interview—explosive quotes and reactions
• [12:58] JD Vance responds to “conspiracy theorist” label
• [17:43] Full context: “alcoholic’s personality” comment
• [21:50] Mar-a-Lago raid, new FBI revelations, and reflection
• [31:16] "6-7" meme, monoculture and youth culture positivity
• [34:15] Episode outro and sign-off

Summary & Tone

The episode balances sharp political analysis and media criticism with irreverence and insight. The hosts mix humor, warmth, and pointed opinion, making the episode as enjoyable as it is informative. Whether analyzing media framing, internal political drama, or the meaning of memes, Mary Kathryn and Kal keep the conversation smart, relatable, and honest—perfect for listeners who want clarity, context, and a little fun in the chaos of current events.