Normally Podcast: The Big, Beautiful Bill - Friend or Foe?!

Summary

Podcast Summary: Normally Podcast Episode - The Big, Beautiful Bill: Friend or Foe?!

Podcast Information:

• Podcast Title: Normally Podcast
• Episode Title: The Big, Beautiful Bill - Friend or Foe?!
• Hosts: Mary Kathryn Ham and Carol Markow
• Release Date: June 5, 2025
• Description: Normally offers "normalish" takes for when the news gets weird, providing insightful and relatable discussions on current events and political happenings.

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Introduction

In this episode of Normally, hosts Mary Kathryn Ham and Carol Markow delve into the complexities surrounding the recently passed Big, Beautiful Bill. The conversation navigates through political frustrations, budgetary implications, and the broader impact on American governance. Additionally, the hosts touch upon recent developments in higher education leadership and critique Karine Jean Pierre's new book, offering listeners a comprehensive analysis of pressing issues.

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The Big, Beautiful Bill: Assessing the Impact

Discussion Overview: The primary focus of the episode centers on the Big, Beautiful Bill, a significant piece of legislation that has sparked diverse reactions across the political spectrum. The hosts discuss the bill's inclusion of tax cuts, border security enhancements, and its attempts to address the national deficit.

Key Points:

• Elon Musk's Frustration: The bill has elicited disappointment from business leaders like Elon Musk, who expected more substantial fiscal reforms. Musk's frustration stems from what he perceives as insufficient measures to combat governmental waste and prevent potential bankruptcy.

• Budgetary Reforms: The bill proposes approximately $9 billion in funding extensions and introduces $1.6 trillion in mandatory savings, aiming to reduce the national deficit by $1.4 trillion. Despite these figures, critics argue that the measures may not be comprehensive enough to address long-term fiscal challenges.

• Entitlements Debate: A significant point of contention is the exclusion of entitlements from the bill. Both Republican and Democratic factions appear hesitant to tackle entitlement programs, leading to a stalemate that prevents more robust financial reforms.

Notable Quotes:

• Mary Kathryn Ham [04:55]: "You and I have been around the political block a couple of times, and we're like, this is not even that bad."

• Russ Vogt [05:51]: "If we don't do something about it, the ship of America is going to sink. And we're all on that ship."

Analysis: Ham and Markow express a nuanced perspective, acknowledging the bill's efforts to curb the deficit while critiquing its limitations. They emphasize the importance of addressing entitlements to achieve meaningful fiscal sustainability, highlighting the political obstacles that hinder such initiatives.

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Florida Board of Governors Rejects University of Florida President Pick Santa Ono

Discussion Overview: The hosts shift focus to higher education, discussing the Florida Board of Governors' decision to reject Santa Ono, the University of Florida's proposed president from the University of Michigan. The conversation explores the reasons behind this decision and its implications for the university's future.

Key Points:

• Santa Ono's Background: Ono, known for his left-leaning administrative style, faced backlash for policies like DEI 2.0 and handling of campus safety post-October 7th attacks. His approach to free speech and protection of Jewish students garnered criticism.

• Board of Governors' Decision: The rejection signifies a shift towards prioritizing the university's regional culture and needs over national prestige. Ham and Markow commend the board for taking a stand against perceived "wokeness" and emphasize the importance of leadership that aligns with the institution's core values.

• Implications for UF: The decision is seen as a move to restore normalcy and appeal to a broader student base, contrasting with other institutions grappling with campus unrest and administrative controversies.

Notable Quotes:

• Carol Markow [15:05]: "It's not bad, right?"

• Mary Kathryn Ham [16:00]: "There is a vibe shift. You do not need to hire a man coming from Ann Arbor and the University of Michigan for any sort of prestige."

Analysis: Ham and Markow applaud the Florida Board of Governors for prioritizing the university's immediate needs and cultural fit over external accolades. They argue that this decision could pave the way for other institutions to adopt similar strategies, fostering environments that align more closely with their student populations and regional identities.

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Karine Jean Pierre's New Book: Independent – A Look Inside a Broken White House, Outside the Party Lines

Discussion Overview: The episode concludes with a critical examination of Karine Jean Pierre's latest book, Independent. Former White House Press Secretary Pierre presents her insights on the administration, but the hosts express skepticism about the book's substance and her motivations.

Key Points:

• Book's Premise: Pierre claims to offer an insider's perspective on the White House, focusing on protecting democracy and vulnerable communities. However, Ham and Markow question the authenticity and depth of her narratives.

• Critique of Pierre's Credibility: The hosts challenge Pierre's portrayal of events, suggesting that her statements lack accountability and fail to address significant scandals head-on. They highlight inconsistencies and perceived attempts to rebrand her political stance as "independent."

• Impact on Public Perception: The discussion touches upon the challenges Pierre faces in gaining media traction, portraying her as an "unbookable guest" who struggles to convey meaningful insights without resorting to generic political rhetoric.

Notable Quotes:

• Mary Kathryn Ham [23:31]: "The audacity. Let's hear a little bit of her audacity."

• Carol Markow [26:35]: "She's not going to be a casualty of the Biden scandals. I think they're done with him and by extension they're going to be done with her and her self-promotion."

Analysis: Ham and Markow offer a critical perspective on Pierre's book, questioning its value and the sincerity of her intentions. They perceive the book as lacking substantive analysis and serving more as a platform for self-promotion rather than providing genuine insights into the administration's inner workings.

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Conclusion

In this episode of Normally, Mary Kathryn Ham and Carol Markow provide a thorough examination of the Big, Beautiful Bill, its legislative nuances, and broader fiscal implications. They extend their analysis to the educational sector, highlighting significant governance decisions at the University of Florida that reflect shifting cultural and political landscapes. The hosts also offer a candid critique of Karine Jean Pierre's new book, questioning its depth and relevance in the current political discourse. Through engaging dialogue and insightful commentary, Ham and Markow equip listeners with a grounded understanding of these complex issues.

---

Notable Time-Stamped Quotes:

• Mary Kathryn Ham [04:55]: "You and I have been around the political block a couple of times, and we're like, this is not even that bad."

• Russ Vogt [05:51]: "If we don't do something about it, the ship of America is going to sink. And we're all on that ship."

• Carol Markow [15:05]: "It's not bad, right?"

• Mary Kathryn Ham [16:00]: "There is a vibe shift. You do not need to hire a man coming from Ann Arbor and the University of Michigan for any sort of prestige."

• Mary Kathryn Ham [23:31]: "The audacity. Let's hear a little bit of her audacity."

• Mary Kathryn Ham [26:35]: "She's not going to be a casualty of the Biden scandals. I think they're done with him and by extension they're going to be done with her and her self-promotion."

---

Note: This summary omits commercial breaks and non-content sections to focus solely on the substantive discussions within the episode.

Transcript

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

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[Erica]

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[Jack Armstrong]

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[Erica]

Iheartradio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Hey guys, we are back on normally the show with normalish takes for when the news gets weird. I'm Mary Kathryn Ham.

[Carol Markow]

And I am Carol Markow. And we are in the same room. Erica.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

It's weird.

[Carol Markow]

It's weird.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

It's weird on normally today.

[Carol Markow]

It's a weird, abnormally normally today. We're in Palm Beach. And the only reason I'm saying that is because we're going to be gone by the time this airs. My husband does not let me share location. It's, you know, ever since the four square days where people would check in everywhere they went, he did not like that.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

I've always been delayed on sharing location. It just seems like. It just seems wise.

[Carol Markow]

Right? I know normally listeners are our people and will not just show up to where they think we might be in Palm Beach.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

But nevertheless, it is nice to be in the free state of Florida.

[Carol Markow]

Not bad, right?

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Yeah. And at this lovely place where we are staying, I was craving chocolate and I was like, I'm gonna go get myself some chocolate. And I know it's gonna be overpriced at the little store in the hotel. And it was. And I paid too much. It was fine. I know where I was going back up to my room. And immediately after buying my overpriced chocolate, someone knocks on the door and says, here's some complimentary chocolate. I was like, well, it again.

[Carol Markow]

And you could take complimentary chocolate home. I'm doing.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

We'll see. It might be gone. Okay.

[Carol Markow]

All right.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Shall we get to the new.

[Carol Markow]

Yeah, let's get into it.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

So the big, beautiful bill, the one big beautiful bill is still the subject of much consternation. That is the word I was gonna use. We are on the same page. Look, I. Elon's mad. He's like, I'm out of here. I'm going back to my businesses. Right, right. He said, this is nonsense. Russ. Vote over at the White House, along with the White House saying, look, there's a lot of good stuff in this bill, which there is. We had to do this in order to get the. The tax cuts extended. We had to get it. We added border security with all this stuff.

[Carol Markow]

Yeah.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

I don't think I expected any better than this, which is why I'm like, yeah, expected better.

[Carol Markow]

You could hear the disappointment in Elon's, like, tone. He's so annoyed at this. And I fully understand him. But, you know, you and I have been around political block once, twice, and we're like, this is not even that bad.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Well. And so he. He puts forth all These cuts, those cuts can't necessarily go into this particular bill. They have to be part of a decision package.

[Carol Markow]

We talked about that on a previous episode. If anybody wants to catch up on what that means.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

And the President is sending that stuff over to a total of about 9 billion, which is not a lot of money in the grand scheme of things, but is something. And Speaker Johnson is like, yes, we're going to take that up asap. People who are invested in the Doge cuts are understandably mad. Like, this should be done immediately.

[Carol Markow]

Right.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

In fact, I would argue maybe they should have changed the order and done a couple Doge cuts first and moved on to this. But let's hear a little bit about why Elon Musk is upset and I'm with him on this. Here's a little clip.

[Russ Vogt]

The reason I'm here is because I'm. I'm very worried about America going bankrupt due to the corruption of waste. And if we don't do something about it, the ship of America is going to sink. And we're all on that ship. You know, and this may be a message to, you know, people out there who are wealthy, have a lot of means, or patrol companies. It's like, just remember, we're all in ship of America here. Your company's not going to exist if the ship of America sinks. And we should do everything we possibly can to ensure that America is strong for far into the future.

[Carol Markow]

It's really. He's not mad, he's just disappointed.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

And he's right.

[Carol Markow]

Yeah, of course he's right. And of course he's right.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

But part of the problem is neither Doge nor the Republican President, House, Senate, nor any Democrat wants to touch the thing that's actually the problem, which is entitlements. And if you don't do that, you really can't get a handle on the bankruptcy.

[Carol Markow]

You can't get elected if you're going to touch entitlements. And you can't fix things unless you touch entitlements. So they're in this catch 22. I, I don't think anybody even wants to fix it anymore. I, I don't know. You know, the deficit, like, we barely talk about it. And Elon is, of course he's right. Of course he's right that we're in big trouble together. But, you know, getting politicians who care about that and who are willing to take political risks to fix it, it's very tough.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

By the way, there is, there is an occasional headline that makes me go, hmm, about the big Beautiful bill such as the Hill, the big, beautiful bill, would secretly dismantle the civil service. I'm listening.

[Carol Markow]

Tell me more.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Katie Pavlich noted that there's a lot of border security stuff in here that would get Trump through this term. Here's Russ Vogt, who's the OMB director with this administration, explaining what he says is good about this bill.

[Russ Vogt]

We think the bill is a very good one. We think it's very strong. Fiscally, nothing's changed from our view of the world. We understand where he's coming from. But if you have an accurate baseline that treats taxes the same way it treats spending, this budget is $1.6 trillion in mandatory savings. It's the most historic amount of mandatory reforms that this town has ever seen, and certainly we haven't seen anything like it since the mid-1990s with welfare reform. And it's a $1.4 trillion improvement to deficits and debt. So. But I don't. I don't think there's any way that you could possibly suggest this is not a fiscally responsible bill.

[Carol Markow]

I feel like there's some ways we could argue this is fiscally irresponsible.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

You could find some.

[Carol Markow]

I'm going to try it with my husband. Like, I want to do some. A lot of shopping. And then be like, this is the lowest amount of shopping this family has seen in the last five years.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

You know, and to be analogous, you need to, like, really rack up your shopping for 2020, 2021, which is what the federal government did.

[Carol Markow]

The bags for everyone.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

The levels of spending from 2021 are absolutely insane. The baselines that they've been observing since then are insane insane, because that's what government does. And that's the part where I feel like if there had been an attempt to be really bold, you could have said, like, hey, let's back this train up. And by the way, this is bold on federal government standards, which is just like, let's take it back to normal town in 2019.

[Carol Markow]

Yeah.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Before we made it.

[Carol Markow]

We're asking it for. Right. It's not even like, okay, yes, cutting entitlements, obviously would be. Would make a huge difference, but if you're unwilling to do that, at least get us back to where we were before the pandemic. And I don't think Elon's really asking for too much.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Yeah. And Vote is right. That the way they score these things by the Congressional Budget Office, which makes the determinations, they count taxes as if that all that government beyond belongs to the government and not to you. So the way they calculate it does ding the bill in ways that are unfair to the bill, however. Nevertheless, there's a lot there I did see today that this is not through this bill. But Secretary Duffy cut 7 billion or 4 to 7 billion to California for their high speed rail which has never yet lain a track. Meanwhile Florida's like got a private high speed rail line that's just like oh yeah, we made light in like a year and a half and it's working great.

[Carol Markow]

Yeah, it's great. We'll be right back on Normally Looking.

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[Carol Markow]

Our second topic today. It's a little inside baseball, but I think it's actually pretty important. The Florida Board of Governors voted down the University of Florida President pick Santa Ono. Now this guy Ono came from Michigan and the University of Florida Board of Trustees was very dazzled by his prestige, but he was a really typical left leaning administrator and he kind of tried to walk it back in the last few months but it was a little too late for that. And I love that the Board of Governors did its thing and said no, not here. Some stories about him. He wanted to introduce D EI 2.0 at Michigan. He does land acknowledgements and he failed to protect Jewish students on campus after October 7th. Beyond just failing to protect Jewish students. He kept stressing that free speech was very important to him. But then when our friend Josh Hammer spoke there, he was shouted down by protesters. Santa Ono did nothing until the protesters came to his house one night and then he suddenly took action about where the protesters can protest.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Well, that was about his personal well, that's different.

[Carol Markow]

That matters.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

You know, administrators are often much better at putting out statements about how they personally think free speech is important until they have to actually do something.

[Carol Markow]

Exactly.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

To protect unpopular speech on campus. To me, this is. This just looked like taking an L for no reason. If you're going to hire this guy, it is Florida. There is a vibe shift. You do not need to hire a man coming from Ann Arbor and the University of Michigan for any sort of prestige or anything because the. All these Southern schools are attracting the best students in the nation now thanks to their, you know, free COVID policies back in the day, not punishing students in the terrible ways that Northeastern and Mid Atlantic schools did. And so what are you gaining exactly when you could be losing a ton?

[Carol Markow]

Yeah. And I can tell you that University of Florida has had a leap in applications in 2020. They had 38,000 applications this year. Last year the number was 65,000. Numbers are not in for this year yet, I think. But I can tell you that in my South Florida world, they called it the UF bloodbath this year. Like, kids got into Stanford and Harvard but not into uf. And it's a new day. You're absolutely right. The vibe shift is here. Why should UF care about the prestige of University of Michigan? It just, it made no sense and it was really a line in the sand. I think it was one of the first times that you could see and, you know, although headlines call this a historic stop to this, to this kind of thing, but it was the first time you could see people taking action to say, no, we're not just going to sign this guy in because that's what we've always done. We're going to take a stand and say, no.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Well, this is exactly. Not an SC school necessarily, but a college is exactly the kind of place. And a board of governors is exactly the kind of place that is very susceptible to being seduced by like, oh, I'm a guy from an important school and I have an important. Like, times are different now. Yeah. You don't have to play that game anymore. Certainly not these schools. And far be it for me to speak up for the University of Florida as a bulldog, but I will lay aside these regional differences in support of the. In support of the. The larger. The larger picture. And I, I think they, I think they made the right call here. I mean, going from Ben Sass to.

[Carol Markow]

Exactly.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Santa Ono from.

[Carol Markow]

Yep.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

University of Michigan would have seemed like a.

[Carol Markow]

An L. And it's. It showed that it could be done. So I think what will happen is in other schools, this kind of thing will happen and they will be able to look at the University of Florida and say, their board of governors was able to stop this wokeness encroachment and so can we.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

By the way, this like this reminds me of Sass's immediate October 7th statement and the I believe it was the Sabbath meal that they hosted inside the giant marina after October 7th. That's what you're looking for when it comes to supporting your, supporting your students, not this tepid nonsense or total dereliction of duty that you see at other schools.

[Carol Markow]

Right? And the thing was like oh, University of Michigan only had an encampment for like a month. Like university congrats. Not have one at all. They did not have one. And they had the biggest theater in the country in the April following.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

That's the divorce.

[Carol Markow]

It was just watching from, you know, my kids aren't college age yet, but everybody's kids around us started talking about University of Florida as the choice because it was such a sane place to be and it just looked so normal. And while the other schools were setting themselves on fire to try to protect the, you know, vandals and, and people who are harassing their Jewish students, University of Florida just wasn't having that. So yep, good on the board of Governors. Love to see it. Hope it spreads.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Yeah, I think, I think it will spread. As we have seen the Florida model spreading to the rest of the country is what you really want to see instead of what we had in the past, which is the California model spreading east.

[Carol Markow]

We're going to take a short break and come right back with normally.

[Jack Armstrong]

Looking.

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[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Models, can we talk a little about Karine Jean Pierre now? She's in the news today. She should have been in the news for the past two weeks, but interestingly, the former White House Press secretary has Become an unbookable guest.

[Carol Markow]

Right.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

No Sunday show seems to have her number to get her on the air during the Biden's dementia scandal news cycle. But now she's in the news because she's got a new book, Carol.

[Carol Markow]

Yeah.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

And that book is called are you ready?

[Carol Markow]

I love this so much.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Independent, colon, A look inside a broken White House, outside the party lines. I have trouble communicating about this one without cussing. This is the gall, absolutely insane.

[Carol Markow]

The audacity.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Let's, let's hear a little bit of her audacity. At the risk of giving her press she doesn't deserve, I think you do need to get your mind your ass around like what a person like her is willing to do to turn a career post White House. Post that disastrous White House that she covered up for. Here's, here's a little bit of her pitch about this book.

[Karine Jean Pierre]

Hi, I'm Karine Jean Pierre and I am the author of a new book that's coming out this fall called Independent. It's coming out on October 21st, so please, please do grab it. And the reason I wrote this book, coming out of the White House, you know, serving as White House press secretary was an honor and a privilege. But since I have left the people that come up to me, strangers that come up to just across the country as I'm traveling and sometimes right in my neighborhood at a grocery store, supermarket, airport, my daughter's school, the number one question they ask me is, Karine, how do we get out of this? How do we protect our democracy? How do we protect vulnerable communities among us? What do we do next? Because we don't have answers here. That's what they ask me. And this is my answer. And what I mean by that is in an era of misinformation, disinformation, the regressiveness of social policy, what we're seeing currently right now, what I have decided to do and I really have thought long and hard about this, is to follow my own compass. And that's what I've done and that's what this book does. And here's the truth and here's how I will lay it out to you. I think we need to stop thinking in boxes and think outside of our boxes and not be so partisan.

[Carol Markow]

Outside our box.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Outside our boxes. Okay, a couple things.

[Carol Markow]

I don't know what she is thinking with this.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Independent is such a ludicrous title. She said she's leaving the Democratic Party, but.

[Carol Markow]

Right.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

That's part of this. Your job description is to be the opposite of Independent, if you are the White House press secretary, she happens to be the worst one since I've been alive and this is an indication of why. And she's just, she's using this sort of bland news speak to pivot to this nonsense position in which she tells all of us, not White House press secretaries who covered up for a. Yeah, a old man president who couldn't do the job, that we need to be.

[Carol Markow]

Less partisan, better, we need to be disappointing.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

I love it when says, yeah, here's the truth. Nah, girl, you can't use that line.

[Carol Markow]

I like when she says misinformation and disinformation, like, oh, it was coming from a house.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

It is stunning. And I'll tell you what she's thinking. Politico has actually done some reporting on this, the Ungettable Guest, which they haven't been able to book for anything else, where they have found that what she is, what she was aiming for post White House was a spot on the View, but she didn't get it. So I think.

[Carol Markow]

Did somebody else get it? I don't think so.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

So I think I Was she gonna muscle one of them out? I don't know. What was the plan there? There's a Politico story that talks about Gilda Squire, who's a New York based publicist who worked with her while she was in the White House. Got her the Vogue spread, got her the women's health thing. Traveled with her to New York to appear on the View. According to two former officials, Jean Pierre had been hoping for a post White House job as a co host on the show, following the template of her predecessor, Jen Psaki, who departed the job after just more, after just more than a year for an anchor job at msnbc. But no such opportunity materialized for Jean Pierre. A factor three of her former colleagues surmised that likely led to the book. A little side story on this is that Gilda Squire, this PR person, a lot of people in the White House apparently were annoyed that KJP was using this woman to like boost herself at the expense of other people in the White House. And our Alex Thompson asked them at the time, I've heard that you have Gilda Squire roped in on official White House stuff, your publicist who is not vetted for anything. And he asked Gilda Squire and KGP about it and they said, no, no, no, that's not real.

[Carol Markow]

No, of course not.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Today, Alex Thompson burnt Gilda Squire as a source and published her off the record emails denying this, saying, if you don't Tell the truth. You're no longer off the record and I wish they would do that for more people.

[Carol Markow]

Oh, that's really interesting. I. Wow.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Burn everyone.

[Carol Markow]

Absolutely. You don't get to stay anonymous. It's amazing because I can't see her in any kind of news role. Jen Psaki. I am not a fan but she was effective and I could see why she would be good on television. Karine Jean Pierre ineffective. And I cannot see her getting a point across. I didn't understand what the point of her book was in that explanation.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

So no, you. It's actually, it's all the downsides of like I feel gaslit and yet there was nothing there that she's fighting for.

[Carol Markow]

Right.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

She's not even gaslighting me for a purpose anymore.

[Carol Markow]

Yeah. What do you mean? Broken White House?

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Who, who broke the who?

[Carol Markow]

You, you never mentioned anything was broken before.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Yeah, my, my take was like if I were to write like Free Spirit, the story of a broken laundry system in my home and how I had nothing to do with it. Right. Like it's just like this was your responsibility. You were part of this.

[Carol Markow]

Yeah, exactly. I was waiting for the insider books to come out because it would be like this is who was really running the White House and this is what the insider view was. But this is so mealy mouthed. Who broke the White House? What was broken inside of it? I can't quite envision what she's going to say and it just sounded so neither here nor there.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

Yeah. I assume that it's going to be an argument that they should have been further to the left. I also like the construction is very passive like inside a broken. Right, right, right. Your point? Who broke it? Yeah. It's like me looking at all the laundry in my house and being like Free spirit inside the story of a broken laundry system with which I had nothing to do. It's like this is part of your job, man. But she's just, you know, dispensing with responsibility for any of this. Even though she was these main spokesperson for the biggest presidential scandal of my lifetime.

[Carol Markow]

Yeah.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

And she's just going to be like, anyway, on to being a fiery progressive independent.

[Carol Markow]

I mean maybe she ends up at some sort of news program. I just, I get, I have a hard time visualizing it.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

I think she's going to be a casualty of the Biden scandals. I think they're done with him and by extension they're going to be done with her and her self promotion.

[Carol Markow]

Yeah.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

I don't think this will be juicy enough. To be a huge seller. I do look forward to the fact that suddenly she will be a bookable guest.

[Carol Markow]

Right.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

And maybe someone could ask her a question about the giant scandal.

[Carol Markow]

I have such a hard time picturing anybody asking her a question. Yeah, about the giant scandal. Other than Pete Doocy. I mean, at least she can go on Fox.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

The nice thing is that no matter how gentle the question, she will screw it up. Right?

[Carol Markow]

There's no way.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

So whatever the answer is, she might accidentally tell you the whole answer. I might be like, well, let me look in my binder. And the binder will just be like, yes, he was basically comatose for four years and here are the ways. Oh, wrong page. I shouldn't have read that.

[Carol Markow]

Well, I'm looking forward to that news cycle. Well, thanks for joining us on Normally. Normally airs Tuesdays and Thursdays and you can subscribe anywhere you get your podcasts. Get in touch with us@ normallythepodmail.com thanks for listening. And when things get weird, act normally.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

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[Jack Armstrong]

Why should you listen to Armstrong and Getty on demand? We're not boring. A lot of news is boring and.

[Erica]

Tedious and depressing and makes you angry. You don't want to live your life like that.

[Jack Armstrong]

Hey, I'm Jack Armstrong. He's Joe Getty. We're Armstrong and Getty. We try to bring you the truth and help help you figure out this crazy modern world about something about a comedic tone. We have a winner. Yes. Listen to Armstrong. You get it on Demand on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. In the fall of 1986, Ronald Reagan.

[Erica]

Found himself at the center of a.

[Jack Armstrong]

Massive scandal that looked like it might.

[Erica]

Bring down his presidency.

[Jack Armstrong]

It became known as the Iran Contrast Affair.

[Carol Markow]

The things that happened were so bizarre.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

And insane, I can't begin to tell you. Please do.

[Jack Armstrong]

To hear the whole story, listen to Fiasco Iran Contra on the iHeartRadio app.

[Erica]

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Mary Kathryn Ham]

This is an iHeart podcast.