Team 47 - Trump’s Economy

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show

Episode: Team 47 – Trump’s Economy
Date: September 7, 2025
Host: iHeartPodcasts

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Overview

In this episode, Clay Travis and Buck Sexton dive into the state of "Trump’s Economy," discussing current economic trends, inflation backlash from the Biden years, and public perception challenges. The show pivots to breaking news on the U.S. military’s unprecedented kinetic strike against a narco vessel—an escalation in the war on drugs, especially targeting fentanyl trafficking. Special guest Dr. Nicole Safire joins to analyze the contentious Senate hearing featuring RFK Jr. and broader issues in public health post-COVID, including vaccine skepticism and trust in institutions. The hosts keep the tone sharp, lively, and skeptical of established narratives throughout, blending hard news with banter.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. The State of the Economy Under Trump (03:13–06:46)

• Current Job Market:
  • Buck notes a mild summer slowdown with 22,000 jobs added in August but cautions against panic ("No panickings, Clay allowed").
  • Clay attributes lingering economic anxiety to Biden-era inflation, stating prices never truly revert after spikes, only stabilize.
• Inflation’s Impact:
  • Clay: "The challenge is prices never come back down ever. This is the pernicious nature of inflation." (04:42)
  • Both agree that while the economy seems to be stabilizing, residual anger over cost-of-living increases still impacts public perception.
• Political Framing:
  • Buck warns that since it’s now "Trump’s economy," Democrats will exploit any hiccup, regardless of context ("There's going to be some of that gamesmanship going on here." – 05:45).
• Tariffs Controversy:
  • Open questions around tariff authority post-Supreme Court challenge could cause major financial and legal ripple effects.

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2. Escalating the War on Drugs: Kinetic Strike Against a Narco Vessel (06:52–19:55)

• Breaking News:

  • The U.S. executed a kinetic strike on a suspected narco-terrorist vessel carrying fentanyl toward the U.S., a significant policy escalation.
  • Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth claims full legal authority for the strike, citing defense of the American people:
    • “Alone, 100,000 Americans were killed each year under the previous administration because of an open border and open drug traffic flow. ... We smoked a drug boat and there's 11 narco terrorists at the bottom of the ocean.” (08:02–08:27)

• Debate: Effectiveness and Legality

  • Clay questions if lethal force changes cartel calculus or just raises stakes—"We need a game-changing element to truly alter things because what we're doing right now, frankly, isn't working." (08:29)
  • Buck flags the use of advanced military capabilities (drones, jets) and notes expanded authority after classifying cartels as terrorist groups.
  • Clay observes: “Every drug dealer and drug smuggler in America is going to see that video... I think it's going to set off alarm bells.” (13:59–14:12)
  • Both agree economic incentives drive drug trafficking, noting that unless the cost exceeds profits, the problem persists.

• Cartel Sophistication and Economics

  • Clay and Buck discuss how cartels adapt rapidly—using submarines, drones, and advanced smuggling techniques.
  • Even with more seizures, profits remain high enough for cartels to continue ("If we were to double the level of seizures... it's still profitable." – 10:20).

• Changing the Risk Equation

  • Buck wonders if lethal risk actually deters traffickers or if it’s simply another risk they game plan for: “Does spending 25 years in a US federal prison seem worse to them than maybe just getting blown up and getting it all done at once?” (14:38)
  • Clay: "I think getting blown up changes the calculus. That that's my ultimate analysis of the narco terror community." (17:14)

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3. Drugs, Fentanyl, and Public Awareness (19:55–21:16)

• Parental Warnings:
  • Clay urges listeners to talk to their children and grandchildren about overdose risks, especially with party drugs being unknowingly laced with fentanyl.
  • “People who are huge party drug people are now using strips to check and see before they take their party drugs whether it's fentanyl or not.” (20:30)
  • Real-life consequences: accidental deaths from undetectable fentanyl contamination.

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4. Public Health, RFK Jr., and Vaccine Trust with Dr. Nicole Safire (24:39–37:01)

• Senate Fireworks:

  • Dr. Safire recaps the contentious hearing with RFK Jr., describing it as “more arguing of semantics than anything at all... not for the greater good of America.” (25:32)
  • She notes the deep polarization post-COVID: “We have weaponized public health, we have politicized. ... We are nowhere closer to unifying the nation as we were four years ago.” (26:45–27:01)

• Notable Exchange:

  • Senator Wyden confronts RFK Jr., to which RFK Jr. retorts:
    • “Senator, you've sat in that chair for how long... while the chronic disease in our children went up to 76%. And you said nothing.” (27:28)
  • Dr. Safire: "That was one of RFK Jr.'s strongest messages... cheeky, but also very poignant.” (28:12)

• Trust in Public Health:

  • Dr. Safire identifies the erosion of trust as central: “We have to take a big step back. ... Just saying, well, this is what's the right thing to do, that doesn't work anymore.” (31:16–31:36)
  • She pushes for transparency, diverse advisory committees, and acknowledgment that “not all vaccines are created equal”—advocating for a nuanced, evidence-based vaccine schedule.

• Vaccine Schedule Debate:

  • “Lumping them together just completely erases the science... I think we can change the vaccine schedule. We could actually decrease the amount of vaccines children get without risking the safety of the individual child or the community.” (33:18–34:36)

• Public Persona and Messaging:

  • Dr. Safire laments that RFK Jr. and Trump both trigger “derangement syndromes”—half the nation tunes out important health messaging solely because of the messenger.

• Dr. Safire’s Content:

  • She plugs her podcast, Wellness Unmasked, part of the Clay and Buck Network, offering weekly rundowns and in-depth interviews.

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5. Memorable Moments and Quotes

• No Panicking Allowed:
  • “We have a no panickings policy.” – Buck Sexton (03:21)
• Inflation Reality:
  • “The pernicious nature of inflation... once prices go up, they are inflated and the new normal becomes whatever those prices are.” – Clay Travis (04:11)
• On Drug War Escalation:
  • “It's a different thing to face getting blown up with a hellfire missile or whatever it is.” – Buck Sexton (12:55)
• Cartels and Economics:
  • “People respond to incentives when it comes to making money.” – Clay Travis (17:46)
• Political Gridlock:
  • “This was all about people just trying to get talking points out for media headlines. This was not a conversation. This is not for the greater good of America.” – Dr. Nicole Safire (25:44)
• Vaccine Schedule:
  • “Lumping them together just completely erases the science. ... Americans truly deserve nuance.” – Dr. Nicole Safire (33:25)
• Public Health Trust:
  • “We can't have that paternalistic attitude when we're talking to the American people, because the American people are educated. They want to make informed decisions.” – Dr. Nicole Safire (31:32)
• Worst Date Story:
  • “The worst date I've ever been on in my life was my first... when I met my husband, because ... I was drinking hot tea and this guy comes up to me and he starts, he's thinking that my tea is spiked.” – Dr. Nicole Safire (36:11)
• Persistence Pays:
  • “Persistence is the key in all things.” – Buck Sexton (37:01)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Opening Economic Rundown: 03:13–06:46
• War on Drugs Escalates—Narco Vessel Strike: 06:52–19:55
• Fentanyl Warning to Parents: 19:55–21:16
• Dr. Nicole Safire on Public Health, RFK Jr., and Vaccines: 24:39–37:01
• Notable Senate Exchange with RFK Jr. and Senator Wyden: 27:12–27:59
• Vaccine Schedule Nuances: 32:57–34:51
• Dr. Safire’s Worst Date: 35:50–37:01

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Tone and Language

The hosts maintain a balanced mix of skepticism, humor, and seriousness. Clay often relates issues to personal life and pop culture (e.g., Chick-fil-A, parenting); Buck contextualizes developments in U.S. policy and security with institutional insights and wry banter. Dr. Safire brings medical authority, blunt realism, and an earnest urge for nonpartisan communication, especially in health matters.

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For Listeners Who Missed the Episode

This episode gives a comprehensive update on the U.S. economy under Trump, digs into contemporary challenges around inflation, and unpacks a bold new front in the war on drugs, complete with real-world, on-the-ground perspectives. The appearance by Dr. Nicole Safire lends depth to the ongoing debate around vaccines and post-pandemic trust in public health. Throughout, listeners are treated to sharp political commentary, personal anecdotes, and memorable guest interactions—delivered in the signature Clay and Buck style: spirited, unfiltered, and laced with dry humor.

Transcript

[Buck Sexton]

This is an iHeart podcast.

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[Clay Travis]

Now you can stream Fox News Live on the Fox One app. Stay on top of breaking news and the biggest stories live as they happen. All from the Fox voices you trust, bringing you the coverage you won't find anywhere else.

[Buck Sexton]

Start your seven day free trial today. Offers are subject to change. Go to Fox one for complete terms and conditions. Fox one we live for live streaming now.

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[Buck Sexton]

The stories making the news headlines across the world.

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The News Agents we're not just here to tell you what's happening, but why. From me, Emily Maitlis and me, John Sopel with Global's award winning podcast the News Agents Dropping daily covering everything you need to know about politics and current.

[Buck Sexton]

Affairs and The News Agents USA listening.

[Emily Maitlis and John Sopel]

To the News Agents on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Open your free iHeart app and search Search the news agents to start listening.

[Clay Travis]

The Team 47 podcast is sponsored by.

[Buck Sexton]

Good ranchers making the American Farm strong again.

[Clay Travis]

Team 47 with Clay and Buck starts now.

[Buck Sexton]

We've got hiring stalled, US economy out of 22,000 jobs in August. A little bit of a summer slowdown, but no big deal. Don't panic. It's all going to be fine. No panickings, Clay allowed. We have a no panickings policy. I might have to get a no panic INS sign. Whenever we talk about the economy, you Certainly don't panic. Mr. Mr. Clay over there telling everybody when the market was getting shellacked earlier this year. Don't, don't run for the lifeboats. Stay on the icon of the seas or whatever your preferred vessel is and you'll be fine. So, Clay, do you, do you see any. I got something else we're going to dive into in a second. But just your quick reaction to jobs report, where the economy's heading right now, how it's all looking.

[Clay Travis]

Jerome Powell was late again and they're going to cut rates in September. He was wrong in allowing the overall, the overall inflation rate to get to 9.1, sorry, 1% during Biden. And I think the biggest issue that Trump faces in terms of sort of vibe, for lack of a better way to describe it, is people are still angry because prices went up so fast under Biden. I mean, to me, that is a lot of people are out there and they're saying, well, prices haven't come back down. And I think the challenge is prices never come back down ever. This is the pernicious nature of inflation. Once prices go up, they are inflated and the new normal becomes whatever those prices are. The best you can do is try to get back to normalcy. And we are back to normalcy. But trust me, I've been saying this for years. Every time I go through a fast food restaurant, drive through with my kids, Chick Fil A is usually our preferred place. The amount of money that it costs me makes me shake my head. It doesn't feel right. And people have sort of internal calculators in their head for what something should cost. Coffee in the morning, a trip to a fast food restaurant with your kids, a pizza. And all of it is wildly out of sorts with what it should have been if Biden hadn't gotten elected and screwed up everything. So I think there's a lingering hangover effect for lack of a better way of describing it for the massive run up in inflation that we saw. And it's going to take years for people to recognize that things start to feel normal again. Does that make sense? And so I think that's what's going on.

[Buck Sexton]

Even if what you say, and I think what you say on this is correct, even if it's economically true, it can still be politically a problem. Right. It is Trump's economy now. So the Democrats are going to try to pounce on this. They don't care that Biden. It's like blaming the, like Republicans will get blamed when the debt's $37 trillion, but when it was 36.5 trillion, Democrats had no problem. Right. I mean, there's going to be some of that gamesmanship going on here. But bottom line is I think the economy is still very strong going to better places. And I am, I am optimistic. Although I will say we didn't discuss this. The Trump team looking at tariffs, or rather the Supreme Court is supposed to look at tariffs. Trump team had an appeals decision that went against them and now there's the possibility that this tariff stuff may be undone by judges saying the president doesn't have the authority. That's a mess. That's a mess. So I don't know what that's going to do. But this is in the. Are we really, we really want to see what happens if almost a trillion dollars in collected money. What are we going to do? Give it back to these? It's crazy. So we'll see.

[Clay Travis]

You're listening to Team 47 with clay and Buck.

[Buck Sexton]

A kinetic strike on a suspected narco vessel, narco terrorist vessel making its way through the Caribbean to some transshipment point to bring most likely fentanyl, but could be cocaine, fentanyl, a whole bunch of different things on that boat into the United States. And Pete Hegseth, who's a secretary of defense and whom Clay and I know personally pretty well, he spoke about this because there is, look, there's just some facts that to be aware of. This is an escalation. We've never done this before. This is so it is new. This is not business as usual in fighting the cartels. We've never been in a position where we've used immediate lethal force on a non immediate cartel or non immediate, you know, drug trafficking threat. Here is Secretary of Defense Hegseth speaking exactly about this or in specific about this, this situation. Play 20.

[Dr. Nicole Safire]

What legal authority did the Pentagon invoke to strike that boat full of drug smugglers?

[Pete Hegseth]

We have the absolute and complete authority to conduct that. First of all, just the defense of the American people. Alone, 100,000Americans were killed each year under the previous administration because of an open border and open drug traffic flow. That is an assault on the American people. I said we smoked a drug boat and there's 11 narco terrorists at the bottom of the ocean. And when other people try to do that, they're going to meet the same fate.

[Buck Sexton]

What do you make of it, Clay?

[Clay Travis]

I think the question is how do we solve the issue of fentanyl coming across our southern border in particular, but also increasingly northern border. It's getting into the country. The drug war has failed. I think most of you out there recognize the drug war has failed. When I was younger and I think you were in this camp, Bug, my inclination was just to say we should legalize more drugs. We should spend less money fighting against it. But these drugs are so strong and so many relatively young people otherwise of good health are dying from them that I don't think we can allow it into our country. 100,000 people a year, again overwhelmingly in their teens, 20s, 30s, 40s, people with decades of healthy life to go, are dying from these drugs. So what do we have to change? We need a game changing element to truly alter things because what we're doing right now, frankly, isn't working. Now, securing the southern border is a huge part of this. We have now done that. It appears there still is a lot of fentanyl coming into the country. And I talked about reading a big story from the New York Times about how incredibly sophisticated the cartels have become when it comes to getting illegal drugs. I mean, they, they have submarines, they've.

[Buck Sexton]

Had submarines for a long time. The Clay, they're using drones and they've been using drones at the border for surveillance of our.

[Pete Hegseth]

For.

[Buck Sexton]

Of our border patrol and even sometimes to do drops.

[Clay Travis]

Yeah.

[Buck Sexton]

And part of the problem. And you know, I used to, going back a long time ago, I used to occasionally spend some time with the nypd, co located with dea and we'd. Obviously, when you're sitting with DEA guys, what do you talk to them about? Drug cartel stuff. Right.

[Clay Travis]

Yeah.

[Buck Sexton]

They were there just in case we needed them as a liaison during the counterterrorism work. But the things that we would talk about, the sophistication of the cartels was. Was extremely high. And one of the problems you have is even as seizures go up, so as you get more of the illegal drugs, it's a supply and demand curve. So price, street price can go up. So you have to, you know, keep in mind that if you were to. If we were to get one and, or if we were to get rather three out of four drug loads and take them out of circulation, it'd still probably be very profitable for the cartels to do what they're doing. That's the problem is that, is that you have this very steep economic analysis. I mean, you brought this up in the context of if somebody thinks that they can feed their family for a year, are they going to. Are there going to be people willing to risk 20 years in prison to bring a few kilos of cocaine into this country on a fast boat or, you know, fentanyl, whatever it may be, the answer is yes. And for the cartels, even if there are seizures of cartel product, they can still make a whole lot of money. If we were to double the level of seizures. So this is the challenge in trying to stop this stuff. It's, it's. There's a lot of money to be made in this black market for drugs, which obviously is killing a lot of Americans.

[Clay Travis]

Well, I think the question I have, and I don't know the answer, but I think it's a worthy one to contemplate and debate. Does blowing up a speedboat that is filled with illegal drugs that reports are refused multiple commands to stop, by the way. So this was not completely without some sort of provocation.

[Buck Sexton]

Can I add add to this, Clay, I think it's important we have this discussion because Reuters was reporting there have been. There's been a deployment of 10 fighter jets to Puerto Rico to fight against drug cartels. Now, that hasn't been confirmed, I think by the administration yet, but that's what the report that I saw on Reuters is. So the four, they're now moving and for deploying more assets that would be capable of doing these kind of strikes. So to your point, we better really be clear on. Is this something we have a constitutional. The president has a constitutional and legal authority. I mean those are one of the same, but legal authority to do. And what will the effects be on the war on drugs? I will say this. People say the war on drugs has failed. This does change the calculation. I think you pointed this out.

[Clay Travis]

This is my point. Yeah, this is my point.

[Buck Sexton]

It's a different thing to face getting blown up with a hellfire missile or whatever it is.

[Clay Travis]

My wife is pointing out also that we have, according to her, and she's kind of an expert on this from her law training, she says this is the first time that we have officially designated terrorist organizations that are dealing drugs as terror organization which changes the rules of engagement. Now I'm quoting her.

[Buck Sexton]

Well, she's, she's correct. And this is when we remember, I think I, we talked to very high level intel sources in this administration. Clay was there for most of it. Unfortunately when he showed up in flip flops to the White House, they had to turn him away. But I just want to get this, this legend started at Clay which is like yo, dude, I'm here for the, I'm here for the high level intel.

[Clay Travis]

I still don't have a real ID and they would not allow me in to meet with the directors of intelligence. Keep.

[Buck Sexton]

We're going to go back to the White House probably like in the next few months. Can you please get a real I.D.

[Clay Travis]

Sir?

[Buck Sexton]

All right. I don't have to tell everybody. I'm going to have to tattletail on you to everybody again. Get a real id Clay.

[Clay Travis]

It's complicated. You have to make these appointments. I'm on the air for four hours every day. It's not that easy to just in the middle part of the day go get a real id. I have a passport. But my thing here, in addition to all of this is does it change the calculus? Every drug dealer and drug smuggler in America is going to see that video. And I think, I don't think it's irrational. Most people analyze risk, reward in everything that we do all day long. And one risk clearly of being a drug mule is you get caught and you go to prison and you essentially have to serve time.

[Buck Sexton]

Can I ask you an honest question? And I don't because I can't put myself in the, in the mindset of one of these drug mules or cartel employees, whatever, whatever you want to call them. Does spending 25 years in a US federal prison seem worse to them than maybe just getting blown up and getting it all done at once? I'm being, you know, I don't know, I, that that could go either way. I think for some people.

[Clay Travis]

Yeah, I think it's a valid question. I think life risk is different. So I don't know. First of all, none of, unless you're a drug mule listening right now and you want to call in and tell us the drug mule thought process. As a rational person, my analysis of people who are drug smugglers is they see it as a way to make relatively short period of time, life changing money for both them and their family. And if you are required to risk time in prison, you at least know that at some point in time, you can return to your family. I bet the cartels, I don't know this, but I bet the cartels give good payouts. Even if you get arrested. I bet they go back and take care of your family to try to encourage people to continue to take care of this risk. This is my.

[Buck Sexton]

Depends on what I think. If you're a mule, maybe not. But if you're somebody, if you're like a sicario, you know, somebody that's done really nasty stuff, they may do some of that. But Clay, I also think that this is what I was going to say about the intel meetings and just the discussions that were going on in the White House. We have an incredibly, and I saw this up firsthand, we have an incredibly sophisticated counterterrorism. And by that I just to get more specific, our ability to track, surveil and blow up Al Qaeda style jihadis all over the world is pretty, pretty incredible. It has gotten to a point where the ability to hit HVTs and in Yemen, in Somalia, in Pakistani tribal areas, and you name it is. And there's a whole chain of events that lead up to it. Right? I mean, you know, finding these people, surveilling these people a target set, having the, whether it's drones or whatever it is we're sending in after them, it looks like this administration is gearing up to use that very sophisticated counterterrorism infrastructure and strike capability against the cartels who are now designated as narco terrorists, as your wife rightly points out. And that is a whole new level of something for the cartels to be considering.

[Clay Travis]

I think getting blown up changes the calculus. That that's my ultimate analysis of the narco terror community. Because right now your worst case scenario is taking drugs. I guess your worst case scenario is the cartel could become angry at you and decide to kill you, which is why you do your job. But I don't think you're anticipating that your boat may get blown up. And so every narco terrorist in America is going to be seeing that video and I think it's going to set off alarm bells. Here's the biggest problem though. The reason why the drug trade exists is because there's lots of money to be made from the drug trade. And ultimately people respond to incentives when it comes to making money. To me, the biggest challenge here is we haven't driven up the cost of bringing drugs in to the point where it exceeds the profit opportunity from the drug dealer. And that is ultimately why they're engaging in rational economic decision making, even if we disagree with the choices that they're making.

[Buck Sexton]

I would also point out that in discussions that I had with members of border patrol in years past, and particularly under the Biden Free for all open border years, Clay, the cartels, at one point, or, you know, at a certain phase of this, when the border was just wide open with the 10 million coming in, were making more, they estimated, on human smuggling than on drug smuggling. So that means billions of dollars, billions and billions of dollars on effectively controlling their side of the border. The. The plaza, right? They break these up into territories, and you have to pay. And that's where the wristbands, and I've seen the cartel wristbands in giant piles on the ground, because if you don't have that wristband, I mean, they'll pull you aside and execute you, right? I mean, you know, they'll do terrible things to you. So you got to have that wristband to show that you paid. But Trump has shut down that income stream. They're not coming into the country anymore that way, which means that now they have a greater desperation on getting money via the drug trafficking, which is made substantially harder as well, because the resources that were going to. To the humanitarian mission at the border, that is taking in illegals, making sure they're not, you know, dying of some disease or something like that, now that's all focused on the. So they have a higher need to make money off the drug trade, and we have a greater focus and resource on the drug trade. So, you know, this is a very different situation than it was even 18 months ago in terms of what the cartels are facing. And if we ramp up the strikes, the attacks and the pressure on them, this. This is a. This is a new phase. That's all I got. This is a. We have not seen something like this in a long time.

[Clay Travis]

Let me also, I'm going to say this. Every time we have a discussion about drugs, you need to talk to your kids and grandkids. They are often dying without even understanding the drug that they're taking. So they can think that they're taking a party drug. They can think, especially go off to college. You're often. You're in your 20s in a college town, uh, you're in a big city, and you're off on your own. There are so many kids that are dying of poisoning. They're not really dying of overdosing, because they're not. They're not taking what they thought they were taking. And you need to impress upon your kids that the intermixing between these highly dangerous deadly drugs and the ones they think are party drugs which are they're going to be fine from and they're just going to have a great time. It's ecstasy ish or it's cocaine or it's something that they're not afraid of dying from taking. They need to understand that there is a huge risk and I but this is a sign of how crazy it is. People who are huge party drug people are now using strips to check and see before they take their party drugs whether it's fentanyl or not. I don't think there's a ton of college kids doing this. I don't think that's a die hard party drug person who's doing that testing. But there are people doing basically dying of poisoning tens of thousands of them every single year. Your kids need to know about this.

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[Clay Travis]

Now you can stream Fox News live on the Fox One app. Stay on top of breaking news and the biggest stories. Live as they happen. All from the Fox voices you trust, bringing you the coverage you you won't find anywhere else.

[Buck Sexton]

Start your seven day free trial today. Offers are subject to change. Go to Fox one for complete terms and conditions. Fox One we live for live streaming now.

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[Clay Travis]

Youm'Re listening to Team 47 with Clay and Buck. We bring in our friend Dr. Nicole Safire, part of the Clay and Buck Podcast network. You can also see her regularly on Fox News. She does fantastic work across the media spectrum. And Dr. Sapphire, we will start with the fireworks that have just come. As senator. Sorry, Senator. As the as Robert Kennedy was testifying in front of many different senators out there about what exactly is going on as it pertains to two rules on Covid shots and rules on vaccines in general and science and everything else. What did you take away from that testimony and how would you assess what is going on right now from a health care perspective?

[Dr. Nicole Safire]

Hey guys, thanks so much for having me on. Yeah, I'll tell you, I tried to livestream as much as that Senate finance community with RFK Jr. As I could. I'm in the hospital myself so in between patients. But you know, there were a lot of fireworks. There were name calling, there were yelling, there was eye rolling. I mean, people were frustrated. But here's what I find as a layperson, but also someone in the medical community, what I find frustrating watching here, this was all about people just trying to get talking points out for media headlines. This was not a conversation. This is not for the greater good of America. What happens in these committee hearings. And that is what I find the most frustrating. I think RFK junior Secretary Kennedy, I thought he had made some really strong points. I think some of the senators made some really strong points. And ultimately, I think that there was more arguing of semantics than anything at all. And unfortunately for me, looking at this from the outside in, you know, throughout all of COVID we became a very fractured society. And all of a sudden, we have weaponized public health, we have politicized. And I was. All I'm looking for is what are we going to do to bring the country together to try and get politics out of public health, out of our health care system as best we can? I mean, you never will be able to completely, but the best we can. And how are we going to unify the nation? And unfortunately, watching some of this tells me that we are nowhere closer to unifying the nation as we were four years ago.

[Buck Sexton]

Well, I want to have you react here to an exchange, Dr. Safire, between RFK Jr. And Senator Wyden. It's about 40 seconds long. This is cut 18. Hit it.

[Senator Wyden]

I don't see any evidence that you have any regrets about anything you've done or plans to change it. And my last comment is, I hope that you will tell the American people how many preventable child deaths are an acceptable sacrifice for enacting an agenda that I think is fundamentally correct, cruel, and defies common sense. Senator, you've sat in that chair for how long, 20, 25 years, while the chronic disease in our children went up to 76%. And you said nothing. You never asked the question why it's happening. Why is this happening today? For the first time in 20 years, we learned that infant mortality has increased in our country. It's not because I came in here. It's because of what happened during the Biden administration that we're going to end.

[Buck Sexton]

How much, Dr. Safire, of the apparent animosity that these Democrat senators show toward RFK Jr. Is because he's RFK Jr. And they don't like what he has stood for in the past or just because he happens to be Trump's HHS guy?

[Dr. Nicole Safire]

Yeah, so that's a great question. And first of all, that was one of RFK Jr. S strongest messages, in my opinion, during that hearing, was everybody was criticizing him. And he's like, it turned to crap under you guys. You've been in office for decades sitting on this committee, and this is first time we're having these conversations about making people healthier again. So I thought that was rather cheeky, but also very poignant. You know, Senator Wyden came out saying that he is going to be releasing a report today. He asked to put it into evidence that supposedly will show the damage to health care of the American people done under RFK Jr highlighting chaos, corruption, and higher health care costs. And yet he said these things, but we did not see that report or the data. So, again, Wyden, I thought, was trying to get some of those talking points at the end of the day, and this is something I've said now for the last several weeks that I get some criticism on, is that we already know Trump Derangement Syndrome is real. I mean, one of these days it'll be a diagnosable condition that as a medical doctor, I can code it and it'll be a true diagnosis. But the RFK Derangement syndrome is real as well. And so for me, maybe he is not the perfect messenger to be out in front of the camera talking about the work that they're doing behind the scenes. He is bringing a ton of insight and a ton of innovation and a whole new thought process to the hhs. They're finally starting to look at root causes of chronic illness. They're trying to make a system more efficient. These are all great things. But the moment he steps in front of the camera or gets behind the microphone, half of the country is turning it off, just like they always do with President Trump. And so when it comes to public health, it would be great for me if there was another spokesperson who actually came out to deliver that message. Because as you see, if you look at social media right now, people are just making fun of Secretary Kennedy. They're making fun of the fact that he was breathing heavily into the microphone. Forget the fact that he has a neurological condition. And what they're doing actually is grossly inappropriate by making fun of someone, but they don't like him. And that's the bottom line.

[Clay Travis]

Dr. Safire, I think the biggest issue that we face as a country as it pertains to public health is in the wake of COVID many people, myself included, have lost all faith in public health so called experts to give us the best possible advice. What would your advice be to try to cure What I believe is the biggest issue in America today, which is just lack of trust in the wake of what happened with COVID I mean.

[Dr. Nicole Safire]

That'S a very complicated question, and there's not gonna be a one size fits all answer to that. But part of that is going to be getting people that are well respected on both sides of the aisle into the hhs, into the cdc. We undermine trust when we like right now. What we're dealing with right now, and you're looking at the conversation is surrounding vaccines, the cdc. We're seeing the fallout from what happened because not only are parents questioning the COVID vaccines, because the CDC doubled down on the mandates long after science changed, the reality is now parents are questioning all vaccines and just really questioning public health in general. And so we have to take a big step back. And what was settled science for the last several decades, if people truly believe that it's still settled science and the data is there to support it, then you need to show the data, because just saying, well, this is what's the right thing to do, that doesn't work anymore. We can't have that paternalistic attitude when we're talking to the American people, because the American people are educated. They want to make informed decisions. And when you have this digital era where all of a sudden they're realizing that the truth is at their fingertips and it's not necessarily just from the mouthpieces that they're seeing from the CDC or whatnot, you have to make sure that you are being very nuanced in the recommendations for public health. Part of that is going to be right now, RFK Jr. Is having to put together the vaccine Advisory Committee. He got rid of all the original members because he said that they were essentially all part of, you know, the industry standard and it was time for them to go. And while I may not disagree with a lot of them needing to go, you know, he's kind of swinging that pendulum far the other way by putting all new members on that are part of his inner circle and his inner thinking. We have to make sure that we have full dialogue and debate on these committees. So we can't just go from one inner circle to the next. We need to start building these institutions that are with people who are going to last much longer than just an administration.

[Buck Sexton]

Are there just way too many vaccines, Dr. Safire, in your opinion, in the suggested schedule for children? I think the number we had Dr. Makary on, and he said it was something like 70 or something along those lines over the course of now I know some of those are multiple shots and they're given over years. That does seem like. That just seems like a lot of shots.

[Dr. Nicole Safire]

Sure. So in my humble opinion, I think that we need to look at the recommended childhood vaccine schedule. What's happening in Florida where they're just trying to do away with all vaccine mandates? That's a completely different conversation. What I'm talking about is not necessarily implementing mandates or recalling or getting rid of the mandates. I'm like, let's reevaluate what we're even recommending. Can we change the timeline? Does every single child need all of these vaccines? Because the reality is not all vaccines are created equal. Lumping them together just completely erases the science. The MMR vaccine, the one with measles, that provides decades of protection while the pertussis one, that immunity wanes within months. And the public health messaging has to acknowledge the differences because we're undermining trust when we pretend that every vaccine works the same and Americans truly deserve nuance. I think we can change the vaccine schedule. We could actually decrease the amount of vaccines children get without risking the safety of the individual child or the community. But it just means you have to open up that conversation and you have to be willing to have that conversation because unfortunately, you have a lot of people who have their head in the stand right now with that vacuum thought mentality of, well, if you start changing it now, you're going to change the whole thing and that's going to creep in. Vaccine hesitancy. But if you don't acknowledge the people's concerns and you don't acknowledge all vaccines aren't created equal, you're actually promoting vaccine hesitancy more than anyone else.

[Clay Travis]

How can people find your podcast and dive in if they haven't already? Dr. Safire?

[Dr. Nicole Safire]

Well, thanks to you guys, Wellness Unmasked with Dr. Nicole Safire is part of the Clay and Buck family. We have a weekly rundown every Friday at 10am with about just five minutes of me telling you what happened that week. We're going to go all through the hearing tomorrow and then on Tuesdays dropping at 10. Wellness and math. You have a longer full episode next week. You will hear me with Jennifer Galardi. She's the senior policy analysts for Restoring American Wellness at the Heritage Foundation. We talk all things make America healthy again. We get into a little bit of a healthy debate on some things and I'll tell you, it's a great interview, so please make sure to catch it out. I'm also on X Instagram and Fox News.

[Clay Travis]

Okay, I gave you all that, but I meant to ask you this as well. So I encourage you to go follow Dr. Safire.

[Buck Sexton]

The Clay and Buck Podcast Network. Wellness unmasked. Dr. Sapphire.

[Clay Travis]

Tremendous collection of talent there. What's the worst date you've ever been on, doctor? Because Buck brought up the English Patient, I realized that I went on a high school date to watch that movie, which was not a great movie to go on as a high schooler. We just had Katie Miller on. Do you recall the worst date that you've ever been on in your life? Is there one that stands out?

[Dr. Nicole Safire]

I think the worst date I've ever been on in my life was my first kind of date, or not even a date, but when I met my husband, because we actually met in a wine bar during a medical conference. But I was drinking hot tea and this guy comes up to me and he starts, he's thinking that my tea is spiked. And the whole time he just cannot believe that I'm just drinking herbal tea while sitting in a wine bar. And it was very awkward and very uncomfortable. And 20 years later, we're married with kids.

[Buck Sexton]

Wait, how did he, how did he make the transition? Like, what? Yeah, like how did he go from like, hey, like I think something's been spiked in your tea to I'd like your phone number.

[Dr. Nicole Safire]

Oh, he was asking for my phone number the whole time. It took about two years for us to actually go on a date, but the man was persistence. And I'll tell you, persistence pays off.

[Buck Sexton]

I had a very wise man tell me, for many years, persistence is the key in all things. So There you go, Dr. Sapphire. Thank you so much. Guys, go check out wellness on Mass on the Clay and Buck Podcast Podcast network.

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[Clay Travis]

Dive into the stories making the news.

[Buck Sexton]

Headlines across the world.

[Emily Maitlis and John Sopel]

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[Buck Sexton]

Affairs and The News Agents USA listening.

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[Buck Sexton]

Start your 7 day free trial today. Offers are subject to change. Go to Fox one for complete terms and conditions. Foxwoard one we live for live streaming now. This is an I Heart Podcast.