Podcast Summary: The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show
Episode: The Truth with Lisa Booth: Why Did Simone Biles Attack Riley Gaines?
Release Date: June 10, 2025
Introduction
In this compelling episode of The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show, hosted by Lisa Booth, the conversation centers around a heated controversy in the world of women's sports: Simone Biles's public criticism of Riley Gaines. The episode delves deep into the dynamics of fairness in women's athletics, the influence of powerful brands, and the broader societal implications of such high-profile disputes.
Guest Introduction: Jennifer Say
Lisa Booth welcomes Jennifer Say, the president and founder of XXXY Athletics. Jennifer is not only a business leader but also a former executive at Levi's and an elite gymnast. Her company focuses on maintaining fairness in women's sports by ensuring that only females compete in women’s categories. Jennifer has previously appeared on the show to discuss her stance against lockdowns and school closures during the COVID-19 pandemic.
Notable Quote:
"I wanted to influence the culture because I think the legislation and the politics are downstream from culture."
— Jennifer Say [05:28]
A History of Advocacy and Abuse in Gymnastics
Jennifer recounts her journey from being an elite gymnast to an outspoken advocate for athlete protection. She authored the book "All Chalked Up," shedding light on the systemic abuse within USA Gymnastics long before the MeToo movement brought widespread attention to such issues.
Key Points:
- In 2008, Jennifer was the first former elite gymnast to speak publicly about the abuse she endured, addressing emotional and physical mistreatment by coaches.
- Her revelations were met with hostility from governing bodies like the U.S. Olympic Committee and USA Gymnastics, leading to personal and professional repercussions.
Notable Quote:
"The governing bodies are not in it to protect the athletes. They never have been."
— Jennifer Say [05:24]
The Nike Campaign and XXXY Athletics' Mission
Jennifer discusses XXXY Athletics' viral Dear Nike campaign, which criticizes Nike for its perceived hypocrisy in claiming to support women's sports while allegedly neglecting their protection and empowerment. The campaign highlights instances where prominent women athletes faced mistreatment and a lack of support from major brands.
Key Points:
- The campaign garnered nearly 20 million views without paid media, highlighting significant public interest and support.
- Jennifer emphasizes the need for brands to authentically support and empower female athletes rather than just engaging in "woke capitalism."
Notable Quote:
"They pretend to champion women and empower female athletes while putting them with astonishing disregard."
— Jennifer Say [34:09]
The Simone Biles and Riley Gaines Controversy
The focal point of the episode is Simone Biles's public attack on Riley Gaines, where Biles criticized Gaines for being "a bully" and commented on her appearance. This incident has sparked widespread debate about conduct, fairness, and the protection of women's sports.
Discussion Highlights:
-
Simone Biles's Motivation: Jennifer speculates that Biles's actions stem from a desire for approval and possibly a lack of understanding of the broader implications of her comments.
Notable Quote:
"She just didn't think about it much. I think it was impetuous."
— Jennifer Say [19:49] -
Public Opinion: Despite the backlash, Jennifer points out that a significant majority of Americans, including those in liberal states like California, support maintaining gender divisions in sports.
Notable Statistic:
"A 2025 poll by the Public Policy Institute of California found that 65% of likely California voters support requiring athletes to compete based on biological sex rather than gender." -
Impact on Women's Safety: Jennifer raises concerns about the physical safety of women competing against men in sports, citing potential for increased injuries.
Notable Quote:
"Men are bigger and stronger. I really am terrified that what is going to end this or put us on a different path at least is a very serious injury to a woman."
— Jennifer Say [31:16]
Cultural and Legislative Implications
Jennifer argues that the battle for fairness in women's sports is as much a cultural fight as it is a legislative one. She believes that influencing public culture is crucial for enacting meaningful policy changes.
Key Points:
- Cultural Battle: The episode emphasizes that societal perceptions and cultural norms play a significant role in shaping policies related to women's sports.
- Role of Major Brands: Jennifer highlights how influential companies like Nike have the power to sway public opinion and either support or undermine the protection of women's sports.
Notable Quote:
"If Nike said something and they weighed in the biggest name in sports, bigger than the NFL and the NBA, if they said women deserve their own sports, it would be over tomorrow."
— Jennifer Say [32:38]
Future Goals and Aspirations
In concluding the discussion, Jennifer outlines her dual objectives with XXXY Athletics:
- Cultural Influence: To make it socially acceptable and "cool" to stand up for the distinctions between men’s and women’s sports.
- Business Success: To build a profitable brand that genuinely empowers female athletes, ensuring financial sustainability to support her advocacy.
Notable Quote:
"I want to empower female athletes and build a very successful, profitable business. Both of those things."
— Jennifer Say [35:51]
Conclusion
This episode provides a thorough examination of the complexities surrounding gender divisions in sports, the responsibilities of governing bodies and major brands, and the personal experiences of those advocating for change. Through Jennifer Say's insights, listeners gain a nuanced understanding of the challenges and stakes involved in protecting and empowering women's athletics.
Notable Quotes with Timestamps:
- "I wanted to influence the culture because I think the legislation and the politics are downstream from culture." — Jennifer Say [05:28]
- "The governing bodies are not in it to protect the athletes. They never have been." — Jennifer Say [05:24]
- "They pretend to champion women and empower female athletes while putting them with astonishing disregard." — Jennifer Say [34:09]
- "She just didn't think about it much. I think it was impetuous." — Jennifer Say [19:49]
- "Men are bigger and stronger. I really am terrified that what is going to end this or put us on a different path at least is a very serious injury to a woman." — Jennifer Say [31:16]
- "If Nike said something and they weighed in the biggest name in sports, bigger than the NFL and the NBA, if they said women deserve their own sports, it would be over tomorrow." — Jennifer Say [32:38]
- "I want to empower female athletes and build a very successful, profitable business. Both of those things." — Jennifer Say [35:51]
This summary encapsulates the key discussions, insights, and conclusions from the episode, providing a comprehensive overview for those who haven't listened to it. The inclusion of notable quotes with timestamps offers direct insights into the perspectives shared by Jennifer Say.