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The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show
The Viral Cartoonist Who Shook America’s Consciousness | George Alexopoulos | Ep. 59
00:52:46
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- [00:00]
George Alexopoulos
This is an iHeart podcast.
- [00:05]
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- [03:29]
George Alexopoulos
There's this argument going on among artists. They're like, oh, there's no such thing as a conservative artist. They're all leftists or you're a silent conservative. That's what is expected out of you. And I'm not a silent conservative. My name is out there. It's been out there for a long time. I don't believe in shutting my mouth and if no one wants to hire me, I consider that their problem.
- [03:54]
Interviewer / Host
Let's take that, that recent image of the four box of the girl on the Train. Just tell us a little bit about how you bring, you know, these, these ideas or images to life in your art. One of the most challenging things in my opinion is, is how to capture culture in a way that's outside of what we're traditionally inundated with political pundantry or, you know, hammering people on YouTube or calling people out. You know, I, I think there's always a, a unique way that can emerge through a medium that I've been passionate about since I was a little kid. And that's through art or that's through writing or poetry or whatever it might be. And so, so today's guest, George Alexopoulos, is, I don't want to call him a conservative artist or a right wing artist because I don't think that's appropriate to constrain any artist in that measure. But certainly George's images have and are having a profound impact on kind of the social consciousness of, of the conservative movement. His last image that was posted two days ago was already has 5.4 million views on X. And it's an imagery depicting the tragedy of the Ukrainian girl who was murdered in North Carolina on the transit Bus. So, you know, George, I can't thank you enough for. For coming on and willing to have a. A conversation not only about social commentary, but more importantly about art and what it means to society.
- [05:46]
George Alexopoulos
Thanks for the invite. The pleasure is mine, I promise.
- [05:50]
Interviewer / Host
Awesome. Thank you. Can I just get started? I. Every artist that I ever have the opportunity to chat with or to meet or that I come across, you know, I always start with the same question. When did it begin? And how did you know you were passionate about art? Right.
- [06:07]
George Alexopoulos
Yeah, I guess in elementary school. Middle school. Let's start elementary. I think everybody likes drawing, or almost everybody. And it's just fun. You play around, you tell stories. I think the only difference between someone like myself and my classmates would have been that I never stopped. So in middle school, I kept drawing cartoons because I wanted to make my friends laugh at the lunch table. I would show them my comics, and they were terribly drawn, but they would laugh, and that would encourage me to keep doing it. And then by the time high school came around, I realized I'm not a good. I'm. I was not a good renderer. I was terrible. So I had to really practice, and there were better students than me. I said, I'm not going to get left behind here. I'm going to work harder and study. And then by senior year, it's like, oh, what are you doing for your career? And I was like, okay, well, I guess I'm going to go to art school then. And that didn't work out, but I started to take it seriously career wise. I didn't know what to do. There weren't a lot of career paths open to me for various reasons, but I still pursued it as, like, let's say, eight hours a day of practice or as many hours as I could, thinking, eventually something's going to happen. So I got a couple of chances at making a big break, but it didn't work out for various reasons. Like the 20078 crash. I was working with a publisher. They went out of business, that sort of thing. But I was working in the comics world, and then I ended up in the indie comics world and just struggling to get my name out there. Many years later, through various. I don't know if I'm getting off track as far as the story goes.
- [07:51]
Interviewer / Host
But no, it's wonderful.
- [07:53]
George Alexopoulos
You know, you do a couple comics that go viral or something, and then it's like, okay, this is what you should be doing. And I was like, all right, well, I'll spend my time doing this because I'M not good at anything else. So that's. I just kind of fell into it. I kept doing. It never stops. So here I am.
- [08:11]
Interviewer / Host
I respect that so much. I mean, from same for me, when I was a kid, it was, you know, my older brother was an artist as well, and we would sit together and as, you know, we were on road trips with my family in the back of the station wagon with our giant sketchbooks. You know, he draw a portion of the picture and then give it to me and I draw a portion. And so it was. It was this familial thing with. With us, and it was time I got to spend with my brother too, in. In this kind of unified endeavor to create some kind of collective image out of our very distinctly different styles. And, you know, and then. And then as it emerged for me as well, it was like I. I always drew these, you know, these war scenes of, of, you know, army men and just really had this desire to kind of capture those images. And, you know, and I remember as. As, you know, like you said in that middle school age, it was. It was just keeping the drawing, and for me, it was doodling for many, many years. But I. It was the thing that I really enjoyed doing. And, And I'll never forget my. Going into my senior year in high school are. The guy who ran apart in the art department came to me and was like, you know, David, you know, why aren't you in an art class? And I go, I don't know. I didn't think of myself as an artist. And the next was, you know, hey, come in and take apart, which I got an A. And. And it was like, wow, okay, there's. There's a structure to this. There's a way to improve on it, you know, and. And that was something that I felt like if it. If it had been more of that, you know, education. Hey, these are all the different facets or angles. Not angles, but pathways that you can go down to discover something, some type of professional endeavor. Right. Utilizing art. You know, I think that would have been a lot, a lot better because, you know, when I went to college and was an art major, you know, I was taking the, you know, 3D design and I was taking the classes where you're doing the, you know, the live. What, the still life people, the know, the ugly naked people that would come in for money and doing all this.
- [10:35]
George Alexopoulos
But it's better that they're ugly, though. It's less of a distraction. That's right.
- [10:40]
Interviewer / Host
That's right. But. But it's like, all right, how is this going to manifest in art? And, and the one place I think, much like you, like, I always love the idea of cartooning, right? There was something that could take place. And as a kid, it was the Garfield strips. It was, you know, all of those ones that she had had. And then, you know, and I even did my own in college. It was a character I come up with, Stymie, and, you know, he'd sit around and rip bong hits and, you know, hang out with his friends type stuff and. But it was like, all right, how do I manifest this into a career? How did you get to the space where you began to realize, whoa, this is, this is an opportunity? Was it an individual you met? Was it just you? There was enough information to go down that route where you're like, oh, wow, this is a viable form of a profession that I can make money on, Can I?
- [11:44]
George Alexopoulos
If I tell you the truth, like, I still don't know if it is viable. I'm. I'm 40 years old. I can't. Every year is different. Like I'm self employed, so every year I don't know what my income is going to be depending on what I'm working on. But that also part of the blame for that is that I'm not a good business person. But to answer the question of when it clicked for me, I was struggling as an indie creator for most of my 20s, just trying. Like I was doing a four panel strips in the style of like a Charlie Brown, Calvin Hobbes sort of thing for many years. And it was cute, it was fun, people liked it, my friends and family were supportive. But it never, like blew up. It was years after that I was thinking about doing a career shift. I had just gotten married and I was thinking, well, I can't be doing cartooning for the rest of my life. I'm not getting any money off of this. And so I was fooling around, posting strips on Reddit of all places. And I posted a series of strips that got really famous for almost no reason. It was like a joke, a joke within a joke. They had made me the number one cartoonist on the website and I had joked that you guys are going to cancel me like tomorrow. And they did because they realized that I was a conservative person, whatever, and they thought I was putting secret messages in my comics, long story. But anyway, so they ruined my career. They just ruined it because I was trying to do business on Reddit for many years. I was getting commissions, nobody wanted to talk to me anymore. And so I had to rebuild my career on Twitter at the time, that was 2018. And I started doing just comic books, whatever, fooling around. And then I did a couple of modern, Modern event strips. The, the one that really blew up was there was this Joe Biden strip where he jokes with. Not jokes. There's this black woman, she's like, I'm not going to vote for you. And he says, well, you ain't black. And he sucks the black out of her.
- [13:47]
Interviewer / Host
Yeah, yeah, I remember that one.
- [13:49]
George Alexopoulos
So that was like the big one that everyone like that blew up a lot. And it was like just a basic four panel structure in a, arranged in a square. And that worked so well multiple times. I just kept doing that realizing, okay, my profile is finally growing. This is what the, this is what the market seems to want right now. And I guess if I'm the guy to supply it, this is my calling. Something like that. So I just kept doing it and it's been what, six, seven, eight years? Seven years. And I just keep doing it. And people keep saying, we want more, keep at it. It's like, okay, there's other things I would love to do, but none of those worked out financially. So this seems to be the path forward as far as, how do you put it? Like, I would joke like I'm, I keep trying to get water out of a stone. I keep drilling and trying to find water. And it's like, okay, well this is the one place where the water is coming out. So I'll just keep at.
- [14:50]
Interviewer / Host
Is fascinating, right? When you, when you have an opportunity to, to chat with people within the arts, you know, they, nobody ever imagines that whatever hits for them ends up hitting right. And, and you know, next thing you know, you, you're, you're, you know, you're doing this one particular type of, of, of, of deliverable that people want more and they have an appetite for. And even though, you know, most artists want to move on, you know, to the next iteration of, of or development of their, their, their craft, they get locked into this, you know, one particular space of creation. And you know, I, I would imagine and I do. Can you describe some of the other characters or books or things you've worked on in the past? I saw one video that you worked a little bit in gaming and you were talking gaming where you could choose your own outcome in the games. Can you, can you talk about a little bit of the variations of where your craft has gone and what you've chosen or what you wanted?
- [15:59]
George Alexopoulos
Well, yeah, I've I've worked in the gaming, indie gaming. So I would work with just pals that I met online and stuff. And it's like, oh, let's make a little game. There's maybe three of us, maybe 10 of the projects ever made it to something that kind of looks like completion. I've done 3D modeling, animation, texture work, storyboards for movies. I've done comics, published comics. I published my own comics. I've got a children's book coming out hopefully next week that I spent the last six months on. It's the sequel to another children's book and that's for my wife's business. So that's like on the side. Hopefully that's, you know, decent little income stream. So, yeah, I've done pretty much anything you could do as far as illustration, drawing, animation. And it's all fun. I like doing it. It's just the current market is not super fertile ground. There's this argument going on among artists. They're like, oh, there's no such thing as a conservative artist. Because if you work in the industry where like you're really like, say I moved to California or something, they're all leftists or you're a silent conservative. That's what is expected out of you. And I'm not a silent conservative. My name is out there. It's been out there for a long time. I don't believe in shutting my mouth. And if no one wants to hire me, I consider that their problem. I think I'm talented enough that I would be hireable. But I'm happy to work on, on my own as an independent too because I'm so opinionated, whatever. But yeah, there's this fake, I don't believe it, that there's like no such thing as a right leaning or conservative artist. I think there's a lot of us, it's just that we tend to quit because we realize or we're convinced by our families, rightfully so, that like, oh, there's just not a lot of money in this. And I certainly was told that by everyone I knew growing up for many years. Like even when I was thinking about going to art school, I was told by everybody, don't go, go to community college, get some other degree teaching or something like that. Get a real job. You know, that's the usual thing you hear. And that's why I get so pissy. I used to get so pissy at like guys like Matt Walsh that we talked about. When I hear the echo of get a real job, I get so angry because I've spent my whole adult life training for this job that they were right. And I hate to admit it, there just is not a lot of money in it. Unless you're in a very specific. You allow yourself to be put into that box of I'm going to be a quiet conservative, living amongst people who hate me and don't let me talk and see me as like some kind of, Anyway, that's another topic. But I don't even remember what the question was.
- [19:01]
Interviewer / Host
The variable crafts, the, the things you've done, you've explored with it. And then, you know, how you found your, yourself, you know, really finding the niche and I think you started to, to move into that, which is, you know, the, the distinction between in what was what many people consider to be an overwhelmingly liberal, even progressively liberal industry, you know, which is the irony for me is, is profound because when you think about the places where certain artists have just exploded, right? Whether it's some of the, you know, what was it? What's the, the couple monster Japanese anime movies that, that Bebop.
- [19:53]
George Alexopoulos
Oh yeah, Cowboy Bebop.
- [19:57]
Interviewer / Host
You know, Frank Miller's 300, Sin City, you know, there's, there's a, there's what? There's an aggressiveness, right, that, that's in there. There's an edginess, there's a, there's a violent construct that's at the root of these social tales that are being told in these heavy stories. And man, that seems in my mind like a, a conscious conservative exposure of reality. Whereas, you know, the leftists or whatever they are, are trying to paint this, you know, these social justice profiles or whatever they're doing. So, you know, for me, it's like I, I, I never thought of art as a place where it should be so controlled by one side or the other. I mean, that's the beauty of art, right? It's the, it's the intersection of our conscious and subconscious coming together to give commentary about particular events or ideas within the social hierarchies to, to, to say something vividly. Right? And, and I think that's what you're. For me, when I first started seeing your stuff, I was like, oh my God. You know, and I'm a Ben Garrison guy too. I think it's a lot more, you know, your, your, your style is, is a lot different than his. I like your, but it's powerful. I mean, it, it, you see it and hits you to your core with what you're trying to do. And was there in that process for you where you're trying to figure out, all right, how am I going to earn a living doing what I love? And then how am I going to earn a living doing what I love in this world that's controlled by, you know, left leaning people? Was it difficult to just stand your ground and be like, to hell with that. I'm just going to do what I want to do.
- [21:56]
George Alexopoulos
For my personality. It's, it's mandatory. Like, I can't, I physically can't be in a situation where like I'm working for people and I have to shut my mouth while they're allowed to speak freely. I would not be able to physically tolerate it for more than a few days or weeks. I don't know, like I couldn't be in an office where they're talking smack about Trump. Or let's say I was working at a place right now where they were. If someone was cheering that Charlie Kirk died. Right, Yeah, I would be fired immediately after. Like, I can't shut my mouth. I would tell them off so hard. Like I would be yelling until they kicked me out of the building. If I was working in a place, how do I put it? I would rather work on my own and be a starving artist. Even though I'd like to do well and, you know, not be a starving artist. But like, it's more important to me as an, a creative person. It's like I, I have to do this. I have to be this person. I don't know why. I was listening to your discussion with Sean Ryan. You were talking about you were studying like Van Gogh and stuff. And that was one of, and even Bukowski too. These are guys that are like borderline, like they're, they're quite unwell in some cases, especially Van Gogh. And it's like he just for some reason needed to do what he did and he never made money at it. And of course he famously ended his life. But like there is some, some germ of that in my head. Not like to that extreme. But I have to do whatever path that is. I have to do it and I don't know why. And sometimes it hurts and sometimes I'm thirsty and hungry, but I have to keep doing it for whatever reason. So when I hear about Van Gogh never selling a painting until after he was dead, it's ironic to me, but I understand memetically why that happened. People want to buy pieces of history. They don't care so much about the art itself. So when they saw his paintings while he was alive, I don't Think they understood what they were seeing. They just saw badly drawn, badly painted images that kind of looked childish. But then that coincided with the Sigmund Freud era of psychology and illustration as a way of illuminating the subconscious. Jung was very. Was not around. He was. They were contemporary or close to each other.
- [24:34]
Interviewer / Host
He was. He was a protege of Freud, actually worked with him for years.
- [24:39]
George Alexopoulos
Yeah. And I don't know what year that was. I want to say late 1800s. So Van Gogh would have been a few years before that. Maybe. But when psychology and art met, that also coincided with the rise of photography and the, in my opinion, death of painting or the. The irreconcilably. How do I put it? Painting changed from a photography substitute to now we're expressing ourselves.
- [25:05]
Interviewer / Host
Right.
- [25:06]
George Alexopoulos
Photography completely took over anyway, so then people valued Van Gogh's paintings because of the psychological meaning and historical meaning. Here's this sad story of a guy who killed himself because no one bought his paintings. I must have it right.
- [25:23]
Interviewer / Host
Right.
- [25:24]
George Alexopoulos
He was the Impressionists. His contemporaries couldn't stand him because he was so unwell. A lot of the times I can't remember who he lived with.
- [25:35]
Interviewer / Host
Yeah, I thought it was either, what, Cezanne or one of those guys.
- [25:38]
George Alexopoulos
Yeah, he lived with him in Paris. His brother couldn't. Theo, did you read that? What was it? Theo? Yeah, like he. He could not be tolerated. You couldn't be around him as a person. Well, he's intolerable.
- [25:55]
Interviewer / Host
Institutionalized the most a ton of times, like twice, two times because of it.
- [26:02]
George Alexopoulos
But he's regarded as, you know, one of those geniuses. Yeah, it's so weird. Not that I would ever compare myself to that, but it's like I. I understand why people like that do what they do.
- [26:15]
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- [28:12]
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- [29:43]
Interviewer / Host
Ah come on. Why is this taking so long?
- [29:46]
George Alexopoulos
This thing is ancient.
- [29:47]
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- [30:03]
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- [31:23]
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- [32:20]
Interviewer / Host
I think that's the crux of what so many I mean obviously you know very few people. Although I think it's it's expanding more now with digital art. I think it's really, I feel like the the reach of art even though it's been dramatically reduced in our educational system right in in K through 12 in particular. I mean I obviously K through 4 or 5. There's still art classes or whatever, but it's, you know, the development of art, art history that, that kind of thing has pretty significantly within high school for sure. You know, I, it's, I, I think digital art and, and anime and manga. Manga. I'm saying that I always say that wrong. You know, there's, there's a movement and now with AI, I think there's a, you know, maybe it'll be a revitalization and we'll have more of those people that are living in that. What would be the appropriate or living in that sense of retracted capability, right where there's this energy inside of them driving a need to express themselves, but they're not quite sure how to do it, where to do it, why to do it or in what capacity to do it. And so I feel like now as an opportunity for so many more people to, to figure out how to create. I mean obviously you see the explosion of creators or Whoever on, on YouTube, Instagram, you know, all the different social media, but it's like, are we, is there more and more unique artists emerging through these new kind of technological capabilities? I mean you're immersed in that world, you're, you're paying, I don't know if you are paying close attention to what's popping, what's not popping, what's what' gaining the rounds in terms of views or likes or what, or the markets of what's being sold. But what are you saying? As, as the modern era of, of art and technological art is emerging? What are you seeing that's kind of gaining relevance in your opinion as far as popularity?
- [34:44]
George Alexopoulos
I mean obviously AI is making, it's completely shattering, is threatening to shatter the entire industry, including mine. So I don't like AI for personal reasons. It is a tool. That tool, that's another hot word too. People use it and they say that I'm an artist and it's, it's a whole two hour discussion in itself. How do I even begin?
- [35:12]
Interviewer / Host
I believe it's not going to replace artists. I just don't think it is. I think, I think what it'll be is there'll be a stand, you know, or something, you know, because it, art will be like you just referenced with Van Gogh. The art is connected to the individual. And I think like you, right, your art is connected to you. And I think the more the, the public begins to get to know you and understand your stance and where you're at, your commentary about if I worked in an office and someone made A horrific comment about Charlie Kirk's death. I would go off. So now those images that people are seeing, and this is my hope with doing the interview with you, is that they're going to start to connect the individual with the art. And I don't think AI is going to be able to replace that. I think it'll make a hardcore run at it, but I don't think it'll replace it.
- [36:06]
George Alexopoulos
Replace. No, I think it's something like it will give everyone, like, naysayers will say, photography didn't replace painting. Painting still exists, but I would argue that painters had a lot more opportunities for jobs before photography became a thing. And then when people realized, oh, I could just take a picture of my family, a. It's cheaper. I understand that. It's like a painting. It's better than paintings now you can record people in video now. It's. Painting's kind of like a niche thing. It's. It's the way I would compare AI if there was an artist next to me that said, I'm going to use AI to help me train and do better images, and they don't train as hard as another artist. It's like if I'm climbing a mountain and then I go on foot all the way to the peak and I say, I climbed this mountain versus they take a helicopter up to the peak and say, oh, I made it to the peak, but did they climb it? It's not life and death. It's not serious. But like, for the people who have spent their whole life and want to spend their whole lives dedicating themselves to the discipline, like, I. I compare it. This is really corny, but, like, I'm a huge fan of the series called Vagabond. It's a manga series about Miyamoto Musashi. And it's all about, like, for him, the way of the sword and all that cheesy stuff. But like, the whole point of it is to learn about yourself and gain enlightenment, and it's about the journey. So you're. You're studying this art for your whole life, and it is tempering you as a person. And the. The whole journey is the point of it. If someone uses AI to get really good at rendering, that's not the same thing as devoting yourself to the discipline. It's like buying a black belt versus earning a black belt. So I realized, like, when someone argues with me that they're using AI and they're just using it to illustrate what's in their head. I get it. If everyone uses AI and clients decide to use it. Then people like me, let's say I was 20 years old and I'm losing jobs to AI people I would maybe be discouraged from pushing it, pushing my career to my 40s. So I'm losing 20 years of practice. Whereas now it's too late for me. I've already put in the practice. I'm not going to ever use AI I'm never going to touch it. So I'm a stubborn middle aged guy, whatever. I'm getting older and I'm never going to touch it because I value the path of the artist, the way of the sword, whatever. Yeah, no, it's true but, but that's, you know, I realize I may be one of the last people who are think that way the generation after me. If you're 20 years old right now, practic use AI and I don't know it, it's like swords vs guns, guns will beat swords. But I'm devoting myself to the sword anyway, even if I'm outclassed. What, what, what can I do about that?
- [39:22]
Interviewer / Host
Well, I, I, I think there's nobility in that and that that'll drive more people towards, towards you. I mean there's, you know, obviously art is a, is a, is a niche thing anyways in terms of, of, of people's opinion and what they see as art versus another person and what they see as art. I think you know, the same thing is, is potentially going to happen in music and film and you know, maybe not theater obviously, but you know, I just, I, I believe that there's going to be a large contingency of people that are going to always seek out, you know, the, the guy who cuts his ear off, you know, and, and I think that's just that, that the correlation of, of the human soul and the art is what makes the art beautiful. And so I, you know, I, I hope it doesn't happen. I think you know, you're a lot of your, your, the, the probability of it is, is, is certainly there. But I, I also still think that people are seeking out, you know.
- [40:28]
George Alexopoulos
You.
- [40:28]
Interviewer / Host
Know, what, what you're doing. I mean I, obviously your following is, is getting bigger and bigger and bigger. You know, how, how when you, the process, like let's just take that, that recent image of the four box of the girl on the train. Talk to us about the process of seeing her video or whatever it is, how it hits you, what you do and how you come up, how you go through the process. If you want to get technical, not technical how you frame it out in your head. Just tell us a little bit about how you bring, you know, these. These ideas or images to life in your art.
- [41:13]
George Alexopoulos
I mean, I consider these strips. Diary entries more than people call. Some people try to call it memes or something. They're not. I'm just expressing. Like, I read the news constantly. I'm a huge news, like, freak. Mostly because I'm. It's like, with 9 11, I was comparing the Charlie Kirk thing to 9 11. I couldn't stop looking at the news, I think because subconsciously I'm so afraid that I need to have every little piece of information in case I have to do something. But what am I going to do? I'm not going to dodge a bullet. So I'm obsessively looking at the news. And last. Earlier this week, it was the arena story with she got slashed or stabbed or whatever. And, man, I could not. I have not slept properly this week at all. Like, yeah, I've been crying for no reason. Not for no reason. Like, I have this room behind me. I don't know why I'm telling this story, this little quiet room. I have my little Zen room. And I'm just sitting there for. I've been sitting there for hours, just staring and listening to the news and, like, really, like, getting emotionally, like, I'm wrecked. I can't sleep. So first thing this week was the arena story. She gets stabbed. And it's just the saddest thing, like, I've seen in a time. And it's so pathetic and sad the way she died. And it's like, it's bothering me. I need an exorcism. And so I'm thinking, like, well, I have to draw something because I need to get this out of me. I need to sleep. There's something that's trying to come out, and I don't know what it is. And I keep, like, thinking, okay, is this somebody? What if this is someone I love that got stabbed like that? That's very sad. What if it's me? So the next thought was, okay, I'll put myself in her shoes. Okay, we're looking at her pov. What is she looking at? Her phone. Next thing she knows, she's getting hit by something. Looks up, there's this. Sorry for cursing. This demon looking down at her. Next thing she. She looks down, she's bleeding to death. Maybe she's got 15 seconds left. And then she just cries. Saddest thing I've seen in a long time. So, like, okay, that's Four. One, two, three, four. That's four panels. I'll just draw that. And I treat every strip the same couple hours. Only takes a couple hours to do them. And then I just draw it, I upload it and then hopefully other people get something out of it meaningfully, you know, to get some meaning out of it. And in this case a lot of people were talking about it non stop so it just, it struck the bullseye. I don't care about the fame, I don't care about the numbers. I just needed to get it out of me and it was so sad. And then of course Charlie Kirk was like the next. No, it was the same day I put that strip. It was later that day. So that's been the week, that's been this week. I have not. I Woke up at 4:30 this morning. I couldn't sleep. My cat woke me up too. And yeah, it's just, it's been a hell of a week. And sometimes when you're going through pain, whatever difficult stuff, the best thing to do is try to, try to manage it is to somehow express it, get it out of you. Kind of like a puzzle that you're trying to solve just so that it's not bouncing around in your head. Put it in a physical form, even just write it down like a poem or a short story, get it out and then maybe your brain can say, I can stop worrying about this. I, I've put it in a box here, so I'll do my strips there. It's uploaded, it's done. I'm gonna try to not worry about it anymore. But you know, we live in weird times where something's always going to be. I think it's going to get worse, I don't know. So, I don't know, I don't know what's going to keep, keep if it's going to keep happening. But yeah, I don't care so much about the numbers, you know, fame, whatever, who cares? But if people get something out of it, I think that's probably good if it helps. People would message me, DM me and say like your strip made me cry or something. It's like, well, I guess that's probably good. Yeah, you know, it, it helps, it helps with the managing because like I, I'm talking too much now. But no, I had a death in the family like a couple years ago and I was not able to cry at the time and I don't think that's healthy. I think you people should cry because if you don't, I think it manifests negatively in other ways. So it's good to try to get it out. So if the strip helped people, that's good, good. That's a good thing. They're not supposed to be funny. You know, there's no joke here.
- [46:07]
Interviewer / Host
I, I'll tell you what, it helped me for sure. It was one of the first things that came across my feed and you know, I, I did a show that'll, that'll drop in a few days where I, I had hit a pretty significant place of outrage. And, and you know, I think as we are viewing, you know, this.
- [46:35]
George Alexopoulos
This.
- [46:35]
Interviewer / Host
Vitriol, this insidiousness that's permeating across our society and I think into a grander stand around the world. I mean, I mean, take five seconds and look at Ukraine, right? You know, 2 million plus young men have been annihilated over nothing. You look at what's going on in Israel, you look at what's going on Scotland, Britain. Scotland, Britain. That, that girl, I mean, that was another one you did with the girl with the, the hatchet and the knife. And you know, I, I did a little piece and posted that and it's gotten several hundred thousand views on it. And, and you know, I, I think what it is, is what you're feeling a lot, a lot of people are feeling, I'm feeling it. And I think the, the beauty of art is art can encapsulate those feelings beyond the, what is it, the surreal horror of the video we watch. I mean, you know, I remember I was at a volleyball game when the, the news of, of, you know, Charlie's death was exploding across the net. And, and then, you know, it was the far video and then there was the up close video of, of the next shot and impact and then, you know, his massive exsanguination and, and this woman was like, oh my gosh, just think of all the kids who are going to see this. And I'm like, my kids are going to watch it. I'm going to, I'm going to force them to watch it. And she looked at me as if I was crazy and I was like, no, this is the state of things. This is our reality. And I think what really hit me about your piece and a lot of your pieces, for as long as I've been paying attention, you are a, you in, in this one in particular, you were able to put us in her seat. And, and I think, I think artists have the capacity to do that, right? They put you inside the emotion. And you know, anybody that, you know I don't, I don't know if I think so many people are just under. What is it under informed about what art is and how it works and where it comes from. Like, I love that you talk about it. It's just inside of you. You have to do it like it's the thing that keeps you up and, and it's searching for the answer cognitively, emotionally. Well, when you can do what you do in those images, man, that transforms people's it. It deepens their emotional connection to the moment.
- [49:21]
George Alexopoulos
So yeah, there are instances where people would not want to watch those videos. Like you mentioned, it's too horrific. But then maybe a cartoon is allowing for a level of abstraction to exist where you're, you're taking the lesson, but not. It's like putting sugar on the medicine. A little bit of sugar so that it doesn't taste as bad or it doesn't haunt you as badly. No, I don't want to watch that lady get stabbed arena or and bleed out. It's horrifying, it's haunting. But maybe if I do a little puppet show of it, I can communicate the horror without having to show people. But there are some people who just will bury their head in the sand. And unfortunately, I don't think society, the world is in a place where we can keep doing that because that just allows the badness to keep growing.
- [50:16]
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- [51:46]
Interviewer / Host
Ah, come on. Why is this taking so long?
- [51:49]
George Alexopoulos
This thing is ancient.
- [51:50]
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Interviewer / Host
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- [53:26]
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- [54:21]
George Alexopoulos
I was thinking about like a guy. Guys that are in your position, your profession, with your history and stuff. It's crazy to me to think like you guys are just as helpless as I am. Even with all your training and everything. I can't imagine what it must feel like. Because if somebody robs you on the street, it's like, oh, I'll just beat his ass and get my money back. But there is no bad guy in front of you. Who are you supposed to go after? When that guy stabbed the lady on the bus, you can't do anything. You're as helpless as anyone. And that's especially horrifying. Who, who do we fight to make this stop? How do we make ourselves and our families safe? How do we make a Charlie? If someone could get Charlie that way we're all vulnerable. Which is fine, I can accept that. But you, the human mind is not designed to be under that much stress for that long. Especially without training for that, that much continuous stress. And people can go crazy. I'm sure you have a million stories. The average civilian is not able to handle that kind of stress. Like they end up doing drugs or drinking or who, who knows what else. Kind of just self destructive behavior psychologically. It's like, I just want to. I'm talking too much. Men, men try to hurt other people and women hurt themselves. This is a broad generalization. When they're too stressed and they just need to hu thing. We keep seeing this pattern. The bad guys need to hurt society, punish society, and women end up doing self destructive behavior in other ways. And we just keep spiraling and it's not stopping. And the only way I can describe it is it's a spiritual crisis that needs supernatural intervention. So when a guy like Charlie dies and I think, okay, if he was really like a super Christian, he would not want us to want retribution, at least in terms of like, let's go and get bad, let's go get them. He would say, pray for your enemy. Just like Jesus would say, which is a very hard thing to do. Very, very hard. But then I think about those passages where it's like, Jesus, we were God's enemies and Jesus died for us anyway. So therefore we have to love our enemies. I'm like, that is so. In light of this week, that is so much harder than it sounds. Like on text, on a page. Turn the other cheek. But hey, look, we're going to shoot you in the neck. Are you still going to turn the other cheek? Oh, that's what happened to the apostles. They all died. Almost like they just let themselves die because that's what Jesus did. It's like, oh, that's what it means to be a Christian. Oh, that's why so many Christians and churches are like falling, because they don't actually believe that. I don't think I can't. It's hard. I think Charlie did, though.
- [57:22]
Interviewer / Host
I, I 100 believe he did. And, and what I, what I hope is that, you know, the, the, the feeling that everybody's feeling just makes us want to preach the gospel even more. Or, or preach. Even if you can't do that, even if, if you're not convinced, you know, your conviction of, of the gospel isn't, is where you have the courage to do that, but it's, it's, it's bring bring awareness, to bring dialogue, to, to bring the light, right, to expose the insanity of, of the opposition's ideology or the pathology or whatever you want to describe it, and to bring more attention, to bring more young people, to bring more people. I don't even know how many videos I saw of supposed liberals saying, that's it, I'm done. This is horrific. This is not. Okay, so, you know, you know, in that sacrifice, I. E. The sacrifice that the apostles all made to martyr themselves to spreading the good nerd, not to denounce the good news, you know, that's what Charlie has become, an apostle. Right? He sacrificed himself to, to bring that, that reality to people, to, to, you know, to get out there and have dialogue, to attack these destructive, violent, insidious ideas and dismantle them publicly. Right? To dismantle them in a framework. And that's why they went after him. I mean, that's why he was such a target, a threat. Because he wasn't advocating for violence. He wasn't trying regime changes or killing innocent civilians for power grabs. What he was merely trying to do is say, hey, listen, you need to rethink about what you're doing. You know, and I think your, your images are triggers for that because. And it's, and it's a way nobody else can communicate. Nobody else can communicate. The sensation of being in that seat and being in that girl's mind. Propose. You know, I don't know if it's proposedly or, I don't know, whatever, but to imagine ourselves in that whole horror like you were able to do. And, and I just, man, I, I just think like, that gift and that Opportunity, man, that's, that's your ability to fight back against these on the other side, right? It's the, the irrational, deranged, delusional thinking. And on our side, it's, it's to temper the what the, the, the, the, the, the guttural, limbic reaction to want to seek retribution and revenge violently. I think that's why it's so important that you continue doing what you're doing in, and, and in the ways that you're doing it. Do you feel any type of, kind of that weight to your work now, especially after this work week?
- [60:26]
George Alexopoulos
I try not to think about it, it, or worry about it. So like, if a strip, if I'm just reading the news, if I'm submerged in it and something's bothering me, or if I think of a funny way to twist something, I'll just draw it as a strip and that'll be the last time I think about it, hopefully. I, I, I, I, I don't want to think about this in terms of big picture because I think I have a, my personality. Like there's a lot of problems with, tends towards narcissism and pride and stuff. So I don't want to start thinking like I'm special or anything. I'm not. And I don't want to let myself think that I am. So I, I just do these because I feel compelled to. And whatever happens, happens, I think is going to be my position. If I'm told like, oh, this is good, you should keep doing it. And if I'm able financially to keep doing it, which I am right now, then fine. That's as far as I care about it. I don't care about it much further than that. But I do understand that there's people who are disposed like a Charlie. Like he's, he's a special person. He's got that personality where he can, like, I mean, he, he carries this torch with him where, carried this torch with him wherever he went and people followed and it's like, oh, wow, I'm gonna follow and listen to that guy. There's, I think, I suppose you could say we all have a role in this drama, this stage play that we're living in. And I guess whatever our calling is, just do get up every morning and do what you can faithfully, I suppose. I mean, that's the way I'm doing it. Anyway, Charlie had his calling. If I have mine, fine. So I'm not, I'm not too worried about my role in all this, but I would like to See a healed world. But because of my faith, it, you know, it's going to get worse before it gets better. It's one of those things if, if the Bible is to be believed. So I'm just going to continue faithfully as best I can and not worry about the details because it's out of my hands. And thank God it's not in my hands because I would, I would botch it for sure.
- [62:43]
Interviewer / Host
Well, George, I appreciate your sincerity and your comments. I, I'm, I'm beyond grateful for your talent and what you're doing out there. You know, where can people go and help support you and follow you and then do you have anything coming in in the future other than that ch. Children's book?
- [63:10]
George Alexopoulos
Well, I'm on x and Instagram @g prime85. I guess I have subscriptions open on X if anyone wants to subscribe. It's just like a tip jar basically. And my next project is going to be coming out. We're expecting the books any minute now, maybe even today. It's a children's book, a sequel to my first. It's like a little mouse book for kids. The first one's called Goofberry Pie. The second one's title's not been announced yet. So yeah, if you have like kids, I would say under 10, it's like a fun book to read to them. They, I'm told they love the pictures and stuff. So yeah, it's. It should be coming up very soon. We're selling it through my wife's shop, which is at Polkadot P O K I D O T Underscore Shop. But we'll be making announcements in the next few days. Well, with the news being what it is, I don't think we're going to announce anything, but it'll be out soon enough.
- [64:10]
Interviewer / Host
Awesome, George, thank you so much. I appreciate it. Keep drawing, keep art alive. And I just, I'm grateful for what you do, buddy. Thanks for coming.
- [64:19]
George Alexopoulos
Thank you. Thank you for the invite.
- [64:26]
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- [64:56]
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- [65:56]
Interviewer / Host
Ugh. Come on. Why is this taking so long?
- [65:59]
George Alexopoulos
This thing is ancient.
- [66:01]
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- [66:15]
Interviewer / Host
Whoa, this thing moves.
- [66:16]
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- [66:34]
George Alexopoulos
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- [67:26]
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- [67:56]
George Alexopoulos
This is an iHeart podcast.