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The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show
Verdict with Ted Cruz: Exclusive with Scott Jennings on his new book "A Revolution Of Common Sense"
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Scott Jennings
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Senator Ted Cruz
No drama.
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Scott Jennings
But wait, there's more.
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Ben Ferguson
No, there isn't.
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Scott Jennings
For Black Friday, your Sunday plan is 30% off. Lock in your spring subscription today. Sunday Smarter Lawn Care for less getsunday.com welcome.
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Ben Ferguson
It is verdict with Senator Ted Cruz, Ben Ferguson with you. And Senator, we're going to have a really fun show today with a happy warrior. A good friend of mine, a good friend of yours is going to join us, a man that you know from probably going viral on cnn, Scott Jennings, is going to join us to talk about a really cool book he's written where he actually got to sit down multiple times with the president and every one of the cabinet members to talk about the inner workings of the president, what he's doing to save the country.
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Senator Ted Cruz
Well, that's exactly right. We have a terrific guest on our show today, Scott Jennings, the intrepid conservative warrior who goes on CNN every day. He battles the crazy commies on cnn. He does so with a smile. He does so with a light touch. He absolutely dominates the lefties. And he's written a brand new book and the book is entitled A Revolution of Common How Donald Trump Stormed Washington and Fought for Western Civilization. Here's the book. I would encourage you go buy it. And we're going to talk to Scott right now about this book and about battling for truth and justice every day on cnn.
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Ben Ferguson
Speaking about truth and justice. I tell you what, so many of you are really taking advantage of the incredible opportunity that Hillsdale College has given Verdict listeners with these 40 free courses that you can take at Hillsdale College. Hillsdale College also has something else you're going to love right now, and that is a miniseries that they put out that talks about the beginning of our country and those that came together, the Founding Fathers and what they have done that has shaped this country and made it great. If you have not taken advantage of this awesome opportunity to just take great classes at your own pace, then you need to check out exactly what they have for you at Hillsdale College. More than 40 free online courses, including a course on C.S. lewis, the stories of the Book of Genesis, the rise and Fall of the Roman Republic, and the Constitution 101. Now, I've been taking these classes and they are incredible and they are free for Verdict listeners. All of us can learn more about the Declaration of Independence and why it was written the way it was, who was involved and what we did to protect this country for centuries. Moving forward, it is amazing what you will learn and what you may have studied before, but you didn't understand the context. So check out this incredible opportunity for all of you listening to go right now to Hillsdale Edu Verdict to enroll for free. That's no cost to you. It's easy to get started, Hillsdale Edu Verdict to enroll for free and check out the more than 40 online courses that you can start taking right now. Hillsdale Edu Verdict. All right. It's really fun on Verdict and we get to take a moment to have a good friend on, especially when they're out there selling a great book that you should check out. Senator, you're in Washington, D.C. i'm obviously in Houston. This man, I get to do battle with the commies on cnn. Often they've stopped putting us together. I think that's on purpose. I think they didn't like it was an unfair fight. When you have the brilliant brain of Scott and then, you know, I'm there as well. I'm not saying I'm brilliant, but I'm saying it's a nice duo here. But it's really fun to have Scott Jennings with us on the podcast with a really cool book he has put out.
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Senator Ted Cruz
Well, Ben, I will say you spent seven years battling the commies on cnn and then I love you, man, but you ran scared for the hills. You came to the safe confines of the Verdict podcast where other than some ridicule about Ole Miss and you used to have a football coach, other than that, you avoid any confrontation.
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Ben Ferguson
Yes. Outside of that, I'm Switzerland, as you put it, sir, in Republican primaries.
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Senator Ted Cruz
And I will say Scott Jennings has. Jo, I gotta tell you, Scott is on CNN now. He is battling with these Bolshevik idiots and I actually feel bad for them because, like, he is beating the living crack out of them. And I watch the clips on Twitter. I'll confess, I do not watch cnn. So it's gotta go viral for me to watch it. If it's actually on tv, I won't turn the damn thing on. But if you have a moment that is 90 seconds that you're just like body slamming someone. I inject it like heroin into my veins. I mean, it is so. All right, and let's be clear. Why is Scott here? He is here for the oldest reason in the book. So it is 11:43 at night.
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Scott Jennings
Yeah.
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Senator Ted Cruz
This poor man has to get up at 4 in the morning to fly on a plane to LA.
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Scott Jennings
Correct.
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Senator Ted Cruz
He is here for one reason only. It's not that he loves me. It's not that he loves Ben Ferguson. He. He is here because he is selling a damn book.
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Ben Ferguson
And it's a good one.
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Senator Ted Cruz
It's a good. So his book is A Revolution of Common How Donald Trump Stormed Washington and Fought For Western Civilization. And there's a great picture of Donald Trump in a bright red tie. So go buy his book. His book is on Amazon. It's on Barnes and Noble. I feel confident you can get it in any place books are sold.
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Scott Jennings
Yes, sir.
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Senator Ted Cruz
Other than a lefty bookstore in Cambridge, Massachusetts, they will not have this book, but they will have how to Be a Transgender Witch and Study Marxism. So if you want that book, go to that bookstore, but anywhere else you can get A Revolution in Common Sense. Scott, welcome to Verdict.
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Scott Jennings
Thanks for having me on. And it's a true story about the bookstores. We've been setting up book tour events around the country. So we'll call ahead and say, oh, these people want to buy a couple hundred books. And we've been hung up on. We've been told no. I mean, I'm like literally trying to filter book purchases through your bookstore and they literally won't do it. And so we talk about, I laugh, these lefties constantly complaining about banning books. The only one I ever heard of was this one and they wouldn't carry it.
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Senator Ted Cruz
All right, so how did you come, how did you start to be in cnn? Tell us the start of how this began.
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Scott Jennings
Yeah, I've actually been there for eight and a half years, but for the first six years of it or so, it was really very much a part time job for me. I got recruited in 2017. I had done some work on Fox News in the election in 2016. They recruited me over because after Trump won and they didn't expect it, they didn't have many conservatives. Ben was there, he knows. And so they were looking for a few people who could explain what was going on. And so I did it. It was very part time. But then in the 2024 election and the advent of this debating show, it's become a much bigger part of my life. So I'm a longtime member of the family, but lately it's taken up a big percentage of my life.
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Ben Ferguson
Scott, I want to ask you real quick about this book. And the cool part about this book is a lot of people write books, but one of the things is you actually talked to the White House, the president about writing the book and them cooperating with you to do this book. How did that come about? Who did you get to sit with? How often did you get to talk to the president to come up with all of the material in it?
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Scott Jennings
Yeah, I went to see him in February. You know this title, A Revolution of Common Sense, is a phrase that he used in his inaugural address. I was sitting on the set at CNN listening to the speech Think that would be a good title for a book. And so I went to pitch the President on it. Truthfully, I didn't really know him. I talked about him a lot, but I hadn't spent any time with him. So I went to meet with him in early February and thought I was meeting with him alone. I went into the Oval Office and the whole Cabinet and the staff were there. So I sort of got inserted into one of these famous meetings where it's like six meetings at the same time. And we spent some time together. And I just told him that day, like, I think 100 of the usual suspects are going to come along and write books crapping on you. I think someone who likes you and voted for you and wants you to succeed should get a chance to cooperate with you about a book about what you're trying to accomplish here and the obstacles that you face. I told him I thought he revolutionized campaigning in 2024 and he was about to revolutionize governing, and that it would be a good opportunity to tell the story to half or a little more than half the country that doesn't get that much good news or true narrative about what's going on out of his White House. And so we discussed it.
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Senator Ted Cruz
He agreed to.
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Scott Jennings
I spent some time with him, a few meetings over the course of the spring. I traveled with him to Michigan on his 100th day in office. I interviewed most of the Cabinet, interviewed quite a bit of the White House senior staff. And, you know, some of the book is also just my observations. I picked out the issues that I thought were the biggest ticket issues of the first hundred days. And some of it's also informed by the debates that I was having on cnn. I was.
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Senator Ted Cruz
So what are the biggest ticket issues from the first hundred days?
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Scott Jennings
Well, number one, I thought the volume of executive orders made his presidency the most active presidency since fdr. Two, immigration is a big issue in.
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Senator Ted Cruz
This book and a massive success and.
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Scott Jennings
Probably his biggest success. I mean, it's the biggest promise kept.
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Senator Ted Cruz
99% decrease. I mean, that's insane.
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Scott Jennings
It's crazy. And we haven't passed any new laws, as you know. We've just got a new enforcement mechanism called the President and then also energy, frankly. And the book kind of ends where they're getting to passing the big beautiful bill and the energy piece and sort of how that's going to impact the race to win the AI competition against China. Also, frankly, some of the cultural issues that he took on, transgender issues, the DEI stuff, I mean, these are not inconsequential matters, because not only did he sort of rip them out of government, but it created a permission structure to rip them out of corporate America.
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Senator Ted Cruz
Yes.
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Scott Jennings
Even just today, I think I saw AT and T get rid of their DEI stuff finally.
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Senator Ted Cruz
And so the world's changed.
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Scott Jennings
It was an amalgam of policy, political and cultural issues. And he put a lot of balls in the air. A lot went through the net. Some are still laying out there. But what I came away with was this, that when you become a Republican president, you have entrenched things that are working to destroy you. You have media that's trying to destroy you, bureaucrats trying to destroy you, you.
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Senator Ted Cruz
Have.
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Scott Jennings
Federal judiciary trying to destroy you. And they're all sort of work together to overwhelm you. And he basically just decided, I'm not going to be overwhelmed, I'm going to overwhelm them. That's the story of the book.
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Senator Ted Cruz
So, look, I think there are very real differences between first term President Trump and second term President Trump. What do you see as the biggest differences? Totally agree.
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Scott Jennings
Spending time observing him with the team he got, the team that matches his leadership style first time around, not sure they expected to win. Sort of inherited, you know, politics the first time.
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Senator Ted Cruz
I think they were kind of the dog that caught the car. They were like, holy crap, we won. And I'll confess that there were some mistakes in terms of the early appointments. There were people that were put in the administration the first term who worked against the President and I think he regrets making those appointments. I think the second term is much better. It's a much stronger team.
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Scott Jennings
Yeah. And they know how to work with him. They know that they're there to execute his agenda, not their own. And they also understand the hands on nature of it. What I witnessed in the Oval Office with him is this is not a passive sort of situation. This is him telling them, go do this and come back to me and report. One of the cabinet secretaries said to me, you can tell the president, we're working on it one time, but you don't get a second bite at that apple. He expects you to go do it and come back and tell him what's happened and give your progress report. I witnessed that. And so this time around, they thought they were going to win. They knew who they wanted to appoint, they knew the issues they wanted to tackle.
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Senator Ted Cruz
And they had spent four years thinking about exactly what they wanted to hit. And so they hit the ground running with a speed. I mean, there is literally no precedent in American history for a president that has moved so fast, so many executive orders, so many actions. And listen, the vast majority I agree with, there are a couple of missteps that I think occurred. But you know what? I would describe this as a bias towards action versus a bias towards inaction. And I'll take action if you're moving fast and break a few things, but they are moving. And it's. I joke, but it's actually the truth. I wake up every morning, I grab my cell phone and I'm like, what the hell did we do today?
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Scott Jennings
Yeah.
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Senator Ted Cruz
And it is, I mean, it is real fast moving.
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Scott Jennings
And in the early days, in the early days of this, it had the effect of overwhelming the opposition. Yes, the Democrats really didn't know what hit them for the first several weeks of what he was doing. One reporter told me that I interviewed. She said, we don't know what to cover every day because there's so much, we don't know where to start. That was the point. He overwhelmed the forces that normally try to engulf and suck under any Republican administrator.
- [15:25]
Ben Ferguson
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- [16:24]
Commercial Announcer
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- [16:55]
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- [17:25]
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- [17:56]
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Senator Ted Cruz
So you and I met 25 years ago when we were both young staffers in the George W. Bush administration. You were in the White House and we've known each other a long time. And I actually came up with this theory then, which is there is a quantum of outrage in the media and I call it the arsenic quantum. So if you remember, in 2001, George W. Bush becomes president and one of the first things that happens is the EPA repeals a rule from the Democrat administration concerning the percentage of arsenic that could be in water. And it went from, I don't know, like 4 million parts per gallon or whatever it was, to 5 million parts per gallon. I mean, it was an infinitesimal shift. Right. But the media lost their ever loving mind. And for about three months, every media story was George W. Bush wants to put arsenic in your water to poison your kids. Yeah. And I mean, their hair was on fire, they were losing their minds. And I think one of the things that President Trump has understood, particularly this second term, that's all the outrage there is. So if you do 100 things and 100 things that are incredibly consequential, you get the arsenic quantum of outrage. They're still they scream, but they don't know what to hit because they're moving so fast. On so many fronts. They're repealing regulations, they're implementing policies that the media are just frustrated out of their minds. You're living on cnn. Do you see that on a daily basis?
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Scott Jennings
Yes. I mean, every day you're gonna get some outrage about something. I mean, today the guy had a three hour cabinet meeting.
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Senator Ted Cruz
Yep.
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Scott Jennings
So I showed up over there this afternoon and for like six seconds of the three hours, he closed his eyes listening to Marco Rubio talk about something and they're like, oh, Donald Trump slept through a cabinet meeting. He literally conducted a three hour meeting. He held a press conference at the end of it. This is crazy. And, and so, yes, they have to pick something and try to generate outrage, whether it's warranted or not. I will tell you, I think in this book, in my recollections of the first part of the year, the outrage was almost all directed towards these immigration stories, particularly the Kilmer, Abrego Garcia case.
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Senator Ted Cruz
So tell me, do you think it is a good political judgment for Democrats to say our party wants more illegal alien, violent gang member, wife abusing, human trafficking criminals in America, and if you elect us, the Democrats, we will bring ms.13 to your neighborhood. Like, help me explain, help me understand the reasoning behind a party that says, let's go have daiquiris with MS.13 gangbangers and say we're for bringing them into your community.
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Scott Jennings
Yeah, I'm only moderately good at math, but no, I don't think that is a great political strategy. But, you know, I also think they're doing it again on this narco terrorist issue. I mean, you've got people out here, you know, buying into the idea that these poor Venezuelan fishermen, you know, have fallen under the gaze of Donald Trump.
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Senator Ted Cruz
You look at the starter, Fishermen don't have 12 kilos of coke in their boat.
- [21:45]
Scott Jennings
And then, you know, on top of.
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Senator Ted Cruz
That sort of Basically, maybe it's 100 kilos of coke. I don't even know how much they have, but it ain't good.
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Scott Jennings
And also threatening these, I mean, essentially, like Mark Kelly and others are saying now, look, if you follow the President's orders, we may come back to you in a few years and retroactively decide that you broke the law and we will come after you if you help the president serve as the legitimately elected commander in chief. I mean, that's what they're. It's all about throwing sand in the gears. Shut down the government to keep him from operating. Get military people to stop obeying orders to keep him from operating as commander in Chief, that's the outrage that is coming out of their base.
- [22:24]
Ben Ferguson
Psychological warfare.
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Scott Jennings
It's the demand, like, you must stop him because we still don't view him as legitimate.
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Senator Ted Cruz
They are the party of hate. Like, the unifying theme of the Democrat Party is they hate, hate, hate Donald J. Trump. And it's performance theater, each one of them. The shutdown happened because Chuck Schumer and the Democrats had to show they hate him.
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Scott Jennings
Yes.
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Senator Ted Cruz
And it is. Listen, I've been in the Senate 13 years. This is the stupidest shutdown I've ever seen because it had no objective other than simply demonstrating we hate Trump. And look, you see it on cnn. I mean, I actually really like your book, A Revolution of Common Sense. You know, it used to be. All right, so there's a very common. As you talk to people just across the country, there are a lot of folks that will say both parties have gotten too extreme. And that sounds very reasonable. Like, if you're sitting around at the dinner table and you say that, that makes you seem very reasoned, very moderate. And I'll say to folks like, look, I get why you're saying that. That feels like it makes sense. I just don't think it's true.
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Scott Jennings
I agree with you.
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Senator Ted Cruz
And if you look at the two parties, one party, the Democrat Party has gone bat crap crazy. I mean, they've embraced policies, complete open borders, embracing human traffickers and narco terrorists, abolishing the police, boys and girls, sports, mutilating little boys and little girls. Like, these are extreme. Embracing Hamas, celebrating anti Semitic protesters. Like, it's almost like every issue that's 80, 20.
- [24:03]
Scott Jennings
Yes.
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Senator Ted Cruz
They went across the board and said, let's take the 20, let's take the 20. Sometimes it's 90, 10.
- [24:07]
Scott Jennings
And why? Because Trump's on the 80.
- [24:10]
Senator Ted Cruz
And if you look at the other side, and I'll say to people over dinner, I'll say, look, what are Trump's policy positions? Secure the border, cut taxes, cut job killing regulations, support small businesses, support the police, protect our families, support the Constitution.
- [24:30]
Scott Jennings
And the Bill of Rights, welfare reform.
- [24:32]
Senator Ted Cruz
Like, those are mainstream, middle of the road positions. Those are not crazy right wing positions. Those are common sense. And what's amazing is the Democrats have abandoned the middle of the field. They've abandoned the middle ground. Now, sometimes the rhetoric is a little hot. So the sort of both sides are too extreme. I do wish occasionally the rhetoric would ratchet back a little bit, but the actual substance of the policies, and I gotta say, even when I'm sitting down with lefties, they don't have a good response. Like, what policies is Trump implementing that are extreme? Well, he's deporting illegal aliens. You mean like Barack Obama, who deported millions of illegal aliens? Like, he's actually going and arresting murderers and rapists and child molesters and gang bangers? That ain't extreme. So my question to you, number one, do you agree with that? And since you've been nodding emphatically, I kind of assume the answer is yes.
- [25:30]
Scott Jennings
But I'm not nodding off.
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Senator Ted Cruz
You close your eyes for a second. And by the way, I have that effect a lot. I put people to sleep. So feel free to nod if you agree. Here's my real question. Why? Imagine for a second you're in the ninth circle of Dante's Inferno and you are Chuck Schumer's chief political advisor. Why would you do this? What's the reasoning? That presumably they think this makes sense. So what would a Democrat strategist say that would justify this?
- [26:08]
Scott Jennings
It's very simple.
- [26:09]
Senator Ted Cruz
Fear.
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Scott Jennings
And they operate out of fear. I mean, during the shutdown, which you're exactly right, this was the most pointless exercise. One of your colleagues anonymously told a newspaper, oh, we have plenty of votes to open the government, but none of us want to face the guillotine.
- [26:22]
Senator Ted Cruz
Their words.
- [26:23]
Scott Jennings
Their words. So they're using the language of the French Revolution to describe their own political base. They operate only out of fear, not principle, not ideas. It's strictly operating out of fear, and it's also strictly operating out of hate. I totally agree with you. And this is something about the book that I picked up on. If Trump has sort of an idea of, like, what the 80s are, and he knows they will reflexively pick the 20s because he picked the 80s, whether it's secure the border or get rid of paper straws, either way, it's gonna drive Democrats into a silly position.
- [26:57]
Senator Ted Cruz
I, for one, want toilets that can't flush and don't have enough water to actually remove your waste. Like. Like, who the heck says?
- [27:05]
Ben Ferguson
Is that an 80, 20 or is that a 9010 issue?
- [27:07]
Senator Ted Cruz
That would be a 9010 I'd actually like.
- [27:10]
Ben Ferguson
Okay, just making sure.
- [27:11]
Senator Ted Cruz
Straws that don't disintegrate in your mouth, toilets that can remove your excrement, and, like, light bulbs that can turn on.
- [27:19]
Scott Jennings
There may be a dark niche corner of the Internet that takes the other side of the toilet issue, but most people. Most people would like more water for.
- [27:28]
Ben Ferguson
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- [28:29]
Senator Ted Cruz
By the way, I'm going to tell you a quick aside. Hold on. Part of verdict is bringing you inside the Senate. So I'm going to tell you a funny story. So when the Democrats, when Harry Reid had the majority just off the Senate floor, there is a restroom that is the senator's restroom. And when the Democrats took over, they replaced the toilet paper with little square strips of Kleenex. And it was the most frustrating. I assume it's some lefty environmentalist idea that like a tiny little like four by four square is what you would pull off one at a time. And it was infuriating. And that's what the Democrats were saying.
- [29:08]
Ben Ferguson
You were saving the environment, sir. You were saving the environment one square at a time, man.
- [29:12]
Senator Ted Cruz
So when we retook the Senate in 2014, Richard Shelby became the chairman of the Rules Committee Republican from Alabama. Richard is a good guy, he's a good friend. And I'm on the rolls committee. I came to Richard and I said, okay, Richard, I got a simple request and could you put some friggin toilet paper in the restroom that actually works? And like two weeks later, I go to the restroom and there's a roll of toilet paper there. And I will confess, I went to Richard and I said, Richard, I've got your reelection campaign slogan. You need to make a bumper sticker right now. Richard Shelby, he gets shit done. And I will confess, even when Schumer took over, he did not return to the little squares of paper and it remains fixed to this day. But why is that complicated? And yet for the Democrats, like, all right, is there any person on earth that does not hate a paper straw that disintegrates in your mouth and doesn't actually serve the function of taking the liquid in your cup.
- [30:18]
Ben Ferguson
All right, so you're gonna laugh. The only one I hate more than that is the bamboo straw that cracks every single time.
- [30:25]
Scott Jennings
The paper straw story, which I tell in the book, actually, I was in the Oval Office the day he signed the executive order on paper straws. It was something funny, actually. When I was in there, some aide came in, he said, Mr. President, I just found out they're still using paper straws in the White House mess. He said something like, well, I guess they still had a few left over from Biden or whatever. But I tell the story of the paper straw because it's even more absurd than you think. Number one, they got the idea for paper straws because, like, a little kid gave a school report one day claiming that Americans were using, like, tens of millions of plastic straws and they were going in the ocean. It was completely fabricated. And then the other thing about paper straws is that they actually contain lots of these, like, chemicals and plastics in the paper straws that you ingest because they dissolve in the water. So it's terrible for you and it's terrible for the environment.
- [31:16]
Senator Ted Cruz
I haven't heard that, but I can believe that. Yes.
- [31:18]
Scott Jennings
And so. But because this kid one day in his, like, elementary school gave some report about supposed plastic straw straws in the ocean. Democrats adopted this cause of banning plastic straws and Donald Trump. It took Donald Trump winning an election to finally bring back plastic.
- [31:36]
Senator Ted Cruz
All right, so let me ask you this. A decade from now, what is going to be the legacy of Donald J. Trump? What are people going to remember from the Trump presidency?
- [31:46]
Scott Jennings
Broad macro. Foreign policy wins. Bringing peace to all the corners of planet Earth. I think he has been the most consequential foreign policy president.
- [31:57]
Senator Ted Cruz
So why. I agree with you. But what has been consequential, what has mattered.
- [32:02]
Scott Jennings
Well, what has mattered is you now have a strong American president who's willing to engage. I mean, this was the great failing of Biden. He was weak and he was indecisive, and he didn't fundamentally believe in engagement. And they didn't trust him. The other players on the board didn't trust him, and they didn't really care what he had to say. And so he weren't afraid of him.
- [32:23]
Senator Ted Cruz
Yeah, and that's a dangerous thing. I think our enemies should be afraid of the commander in chief. And I will tell you, I talk with our allies, I talk with our adversaries, and our enemies are afraid of Donald J. Trump. That's a good Thing. I want Iran afraid of Trump. I want North Korea afraid of Trump. I want Venezuela afraid of Trump. I want Cuba afraid of Trump. I want China afraid of Trump. And look, it goes back to when Reagan was president. The philosophy of peace through strength, that is what Trump is implementing. And I will say there's a debate in our party. There are some who are arguing, oh, Trump is an isolationist. He's never been an isolationist.
- [33:07]
Scott Jennings
Never.
- [33:08]
Senator Ted Cruz
He's not interested in extending an unnecessary foreign wars. And I agree with him in that. And he has been ending wars, which is the right thing. But look, he stands up to our enemies. And one of the great faults, both the isolationist left and the isolationist right believes that if you don't engage with your enemies, it will produce peace. History stands to the contrary. I pointed out there's a reason nobody studies at the Neville Chamberlain School of Foreign affairs. Like, appeasement doesn't work. And if you want to avoid war, the best way to do it is to be so strong that your enemies are terrified of screwing with you. And Trump is doing a fabulous job of doing that. And the difference between Biden and Trump is weakness versus strength. And weakness produces war, and strength produces peace.
- [33:59]
Scott Jennings
Yeah, I think this will be an enduring legacy for him. And, you know, we talk about war and peace a lot, and that's the phrase. We may just talk about peace and war because he is a peace president.
- [34:08]
Senator Ted Cruz
Yes.
- [34:08]
Scott Jennings
And he's for smart engagement, but he's not for adventurism. I think that's one. Number two, I mean, clearly he showed us how to enforce current immigration laws. That's a legacy. And number three, I think what they're doing on AI actually putting the United States in the position to win the AI race to produce enough energy to win it. That is going to be talked about 10, 15, 20 years from today. Did we do what we had to do to defeat China? I think we are. I think most of our tech companies think we are. And so if that comes to pass, those are three pretty great legacies.
- [34:40]
Senator Ted Cruz
So let's talk about the third one for a second. So on AI, AI is an issue I care about a lot. And I agree with you that we are in a race. AI is coming, and either the United States is going to win or China is going to win. And I think the world is much, much worse off if China wins, and it's much better off if America wins. I will tell you, the polling on AI is terrible. AI is unpopular in America. If you do almost any polling, you do it's about 70, 30 people are terrified. They're afraid they're gonna lose their jobs. They don't trust it, they're scared of it. And I get that. And in fact, I talk with a lot of the tech leaders and I say, look, if you don't engage on this issue, the easy political outcome, every Democrat and a number of Republicans are like, AI is horrible. We oppose it. And that if you look at the polling, that's the knee jerk response. I get that fear. I understand anytime you have economic dislocation, it is frightening, it is dangerous. But at the end of the day, I'm not a Luddite. I don't think you can stop technological advancement. I'll give you an example. If I could right now destroy every cell phone in America, I would. I think these are evil portals to everything harmful in the world. All three of us are parents. These things invite every horrible force to our children. But we don't live in that world. We can't end that. I'd also like a world with no nuclear weapons. Like if I could push a button and every nuclear weapon disappear, I would. But we don't live in that world. And if we're gonna live in a world with nuclear weapons, I sure as heck want to make sure the United States has enough that China and Russia and our enemies can't dominate us. I view AI in the same world. Even if you don't want it to happen, it is coming. And one of two outcomes will occur in five to 10 years. Either China will have won the race, in which case AI Worldwide will reflect China's values, will be totalitarian, will be controlling, will be censoring, will reflect the values of communist China. Or America will have won, in which case, hopefully AI will reflect American values of freedom, free enterprise, free speech. That is a massive shift between those two worlds. World two is much better, where America wins. Two questions. Number one, do you agree with that? And number two, if so, how does the politics change? Do you agree with my point that right now the politics is against AI and that is dangerous?
- [37:13]
Scott Jennings
Yes, I agree. First of all, on point one, I agree with everything you said about which world we want to live in. Number two, I agree with you on the polling and I think people have a healthy fear of how this is going to upend their life.
- [37:25]
Senator Ted Cruz
Reasonable.
- [37:26]
Scott Jennings
Which is a reasonable fear. And so the next iteration of this march towards AI is going to have to be not how it's going to make your life worse, how's it going to make your life better, how has any other technological evolution ultimately made your life better? And so that explanation has to come. And then point four is just going to be, how are we going to power it?
- [37:45]
Senator Ted Cruz
All right?
- [37:46]
Scott Jennings
And are we going to be able to produce enough energy to do what we have to do now?
- [37:50]
Senator Ted Cruz
Plus, what we have to do, AI is energy. And if we don't unleash energy, we cannot win the race for AI.
- [37:56]
Scott Jennings
One other issue on this that is on my mind is how are we going to build enough of these data centers to win this thing? I'm noticing in local communities, in a lot of places, folks are like rising up against data center development.
- [38:08]
Senator Ted Cruz
So the polling is terrible in most communities. But I will say, by the way, one of the few exceptions is sort of West Texas. You've got West Texas in the Panhandle, and you're seeing a ton of data centers coming in there. And Texans are like, all right, we want jobs, we want investment, we want billions in investment. And there'll be jobs for construction, there'll be jobs for running the data centers. Look, I think in dense urban areas, people are afraid. They're afraid it will suck power, it will drive up their electricity prices, it will suck water. And I get those fears. Look, anyone, if you're given a choice, do you want something that will make your life worse or better? People are naturally going to say, I don't want something that makes my life worse. And so. So I think I had a guy.
- [38:49]
Ben Ferguson
By the way, Senator, I had a guy the other day that said to me, in the AI industry, he said the hardest part for them now is overcoming what you're describing, because he says their polling data internally says that the fear in a lot of parts of the country right now are at the level of where they were with nuclear reactors back in the 80s.
- [39:07]
Scott Jennings
Yes, interesting.
- [39:08]
Senator Ted Cruz
And there's been a lot of demagoguery, but there's also. The demagoguery is there. But I will say the fears of AI are real and justified. All right, look, with every great technological change, there's been economic dislocation. So when the automobile was invented, the horse and buggy industry was decimated. And if you were in the buggy business, you were screwed. The difference with AI is twofold. Number one, the volume is greater. I think there are going to be more jobs that are going to be threatened by AI than have been in previous technological innovations. Number two, it's a different contour of jobs. So often in the past it's been blue collar jobs that have been at risk. Many of the jobs that are at risk with AI are white collar jobs. If you look at Mondami, part of what elected Mondami is you have young college graduates who have $200,000 in college debt who were told, I can go and be an investment banker, a consultant or an accountant. And they're seeing those jobs being eliminated as AI is replacing thousands and thousands of those jobs. That's a level of, I guess I would call elite discontent. That is politically complicated. And so, and I get that those concerns are very real. If you've gone and worked hard and you got a degree and you took out loans and you were told, this is what I gotta do, and then suddenly you come out and you can't get a job, you're pissed. Like, that's a very real concern. And so I actually think as policymakers, as people in elected office, we need to have real solutions to that problem, because that discontent is not illegitimate, but it is driving much of this resistance. And it's a very real battle.
- [41:07]
Scott Jennings
We got well, and you have now for many years, people teaching their children, here's the course you got to get on. Do well in school, go to college. You can get one of these white collar jobs. And for a few generations, we've been telling people, this is the path. It may not be the path anymore. We're going to have to reorient how we're educating kids, what we're teaching them to do. What other skills can we teach them to do? I agree with you on the white collar verse, blue collar issue. Also creatives, I mean, they're freaked out. I've seen AI apps in a matter of seconds, write songs that sounded like they had a whole team of musicians and writers over weeks putting them together in California. And it literally happened on my phone in a matter of seconds.
- [41:51]
Senator Ted Cruz
By the way, I'll tell you, in politics, it's interesting. I'll pull up AI and I'll ask something like, what has Cruz said on the following issue? And listen, I've been doing this a long time, so I don't remember every comment I've given in every newspaper interview 10 years ago. And in like four seconds, it comes out with, he said this here, he said this here. And it like traces. And it's like, it's insane. It is insane. The ability of power you have on your cell phone.
- [42:19]
Scott Jennings
Oh, yeah. I mean, and it's basically free. I mean, information for the first time in human history is basically accessible to all and free to all and instant. And yeah, I can see why the polling on this is bad. Now, the positive outlook here is how can we use these tools to make your life easier, make you more productive and maybe make you more economically successful. Maybe you haven't conceived of how that will work yet, but that's the challenge of these companies that are developing the technology.
- [42:48]
Senator Ted Cruz
Well, in past technological inventions that, that have increased productivity have created brand new jobs, have created brand new focuses. And so dislocation doesn't mean that people lose jobs forever, but it is complicated. All right, let me ask you this.
- [43:04]
Scott Jennings
Yep.
- [43:06]
Senator Ted Cruz
You're listening to this podcast right now. You're trying to decide do I buy Scott Jennings book? What's the 62nd pitch for why you right now should go on Amazon? As you're listening to this, click on and buy the book. What's the most powerful reason to buy the book?
- [43:24]
Scott Jennings
Because most of the political narrative and information narrative you get on Trump I think is totally misguided. A lot of it's false. This is a true inside account of how Donald Trump retook power, what he did with that power, how he overcame the interest to execute on the promises that he made. I think you'll see some eye popping quotes in here from people like Marco Rubio, Scott Bessant and Elon Musk who I interviewed on his 101st day in office. And I could tell by the way he was bent out of shape that day and really worried about the future of Western civilization. I didn't know he was going to have his dramatic momentary break.
- [43:59]
Senator Ted Cruz
But how quickly after your interview did that happen?
- [44:03]
Scott Jennings
Just a couple of weeks. Yeah, it was day 101 and of course he got bent out of shape.
- [44:08]
Senator Ted Cruz
So I was actually sitting in the Oval Office when Elon like really unloaded on Trump and unloaded on Twitter. And it was, I will say I was having a meeting with Trump on school choice where I had brought Byron Donalds and Burgess Owens in. And we were in the middle of the one big beautiful bill. And I was trying to make the case, Mr. President, there's nothing we can do that's more important in this bill than school choice. This will be a legacy. I said if we get this done, you will go down in history. Your critics will never acknowledge this, but you will go down in history as the greatest civil rights president of our lifetimes. We ended up getting it done. So we adopted the school choice provision that I wrote. But in the middle of that meeting, as I'm pitching it to Elon, sent, I will say, his most aggressive tweet against Trump. So Trump is actually not on his phone a ton. So when you're in the Oval, they will print out tweets on a piece of paper and they will hand it to him. And they handed it to him. And look, Elon is a very good friend. President Trump is a very good friend. And I will say, when that particular tweet came out, he was pissed. And our meeting was done. We were there for another half hour, but our discussion topic was gone because he was, like, unloading. So it was. And I'm very glad I spent a lot of time with both President Trump and Elon. I'm very glad that that acrimony has diminished substantially and that they've come back together, because I think they're both incredibly important leaders for the country. And I think we're better off if they're rowing together than if they're antagonistic.
- [45:46]
Scott Jennings
Yeah. The day that they had their break, I was on CNN when it happened, and I picked up a garbage can and I put my head in it live on the air to mimic how I thought all Republicans were feeling. Because when they joined forces, they worked together to do nothing less than begin the process of saving the West.
- [46:05]
Senator Ted Cruz
Amen.
- [46:06]
Scott Jennings
If we had not won the November 2024 election, we would be on a death spiral for the future of the West. Trump is our leader in this. Elon knows it. He's worried about our fiscal situation, the mass migration crisis, the birth rate crisis, and all these things converging to destroy the West. He knows that. I think Trump and the Republicans are the only vehicle to save it.
- [46:28]
Senator Ted Cruz
Yep.
- [46:28]
Scott Jennings
And so when they had their break, I mean, it was a vomit inducing moment, but it appears to me that they're.
- [46:35]
Ben Ferguson
And by the way, Charles, much better footing.
- [46:39]
Senator Ted Cruz
Seeing the two of them come back together was important.
- [46:41]
Scott Jennings
Yeah.
- [46:42]
Senator Ted Cruz
And listen, nobody who knows the two of them well thought that the bromance was going to last forever. So the first several months where they were just like bosom buddies, they're both alpha males. Every room they have been in for the last 30 years, everyone in the room has deferred to them and kissed the rear ends. And you didn't have to be the most sophisticated analyst of human nature to say, okay, that's probably not going to last forever. As a harmonious. When they're both used to being the. A dog that's going to end. I don't think any of us envisioned it would end quite so spectacularly in a technicolor manner. I think most of us figured, okay, there'll come a point where they say all Right, let's just go our separate ways and do our things. And the good news is it got really ugly. And by the way, I use the analogy that I felt like the children of divorced parents saying, I wish mommy and daddy would stop fighting. Cause it was painful. Because they're both. I admire them.
- [47:53]
Scott Jennings
Both agree I'm same way I've defended them both on television. And the attacks Elon faced for the sin of supporting a Republican and choosing to do public service, that was his only sin.
- [48:03]
Senator Ted Cruz
And by the way, Elon demonstrates the utter hypocrisy of the left. So the left, for a decade has been saying that climate change is destroying the world and nothing matters more. We should produce massive human poverty to stop climate change, because if we don't, humanity will be extinct. That's been their talking point for a decade. Sheldon Whitehouse gives a damn speech on the Senate floor every single week. For years, I have presided during those. They make your eyes want to bleed. They're so bad. Elon Musk has produced more electric vehicles than any human being who has ever lived. Like, if you actually believe their rhetoric about climate change, the left should be carving Elon's face into Mount Rushmore.
- [48:52]
Ben Ferguson
Instead, they were firebombing Tesla dealers. They were causing actual damage to the.
- [48:56]
Senator Ted Cruz
Economy because he supported Trump. And who cares? Like, every word they said about climate change was all garbage. If you support Trump, you must be destroyed. And it demonstrated the absolute hypocrisy of the left. And I gotta say, Scott, I commend you because you work on CNN every day, you swim in that hypocrisy. And what you do a nice job of doing is you're not mean or bitter about it. You do it with a slightly bemused, you're full of crap. And look, if you were mean and punching him in the face, it wouldn't work. But you do it more gently, and it is devastating and beautiful.
- [49:36]
Scott Jennings
These are the lessons of President Reagan. We're all happy warriors. We argue best when we argue with a smile on our face and a little bit of humor and a little bit of self reflection. And I found those debating tactics to be of great use on cnn. I think we're reaching people. I'll give you one other reason to buy this book. Everybody has a relative that's, like, totally lost to Trump derangement syndrome. I'll give you a piece of advice. You buy this book and wrap it up and put it under their Christmas tree. It'll be the most memorable Christmas you ever had.
- [50:03]
Senator Ted Cruz
All right, so this the book is a Revolution of Common How Donald Trump Stormed Washington and Fought for Western Civilization is by Scott Jennings. We are at the beginning of December. Christmas time is coming up. So I'm gonna say don't just buy one, buy two, three, four. Buy it for your crazy uncle Joe. Buy it for your kids. Go buy the book. It is a great thing. I will say it is almost as good. Before Ben Ferguson, the great Ben Ferguson, the previous co host of my podcast was Michael Knowles. His first book was what is It? All the Wisdom of the Democrats, I think is what it was entitled.
- [50:41]
Ben Ferguson
And the book is blank. An Empty Book.
- [50:44]
Senator Ted Cruz
The SOB has made hundreds of thousands of dollars selling a blank book.
- [50:49]
Scott Jennings
Empty book, genius.
- [50:51]
Senator Ted Cruz
And he continues to sell it. People go buy Michael every Christmas.
- [50:55]
Ben Ferguson
Every Christmas Michael Knowles gets a great check and I'm proud of that check he gets because people buy it for their crazy kid or their crazy daughter's boyfriend who's a woke liberal out there. I love it.
- [51:05]
Senator Ted Cruz
I will say the last book I wrote I did inscribe to Michael on the blank front page. I said, I apologize, but I did plagiarize this page from your book. Book.
- [51:17]
Scott Jennings
That's great.
- [51:18]
Ben Ferguson
Love it.
- [51:18]
Senator Ted Cruz
Buy Scott's book. Buy multiple copies.
- [51:21]
Ben Ferguson
Grab the book wherever you can on Amazon. Buy it for your family, friends. It's an awesome book. One thing I'll say about the book that I personally think you're going to really like is the fact that he talks about the cabinet members and what they had to say. I think it's going to go down in history is the most. The biggest secret weapon of Donald Trump is going to be this cabinet and how they work so well with him. You get a lot of what they had to say in the book as well. Because you sat down with those cabinet members, Scott. I think that's probably one of the coolest parts of the aspect of this book. So grab that as well. That's a really fun part to read.
- [51:51]
Senator Ted Cruz
And listen for our listeners. I will apologize. In the picture section of the book, Scott does include naked pictures of him in Nantucket. I'm sorry for that. But you know, look, you gotta do what you can to sell a book.
- [52:02]
Scott Jennings
Yeah. This photo shoot for that was actually quite amazing.
- [52:07]
Senator Ted Cruz
Speechless. All right. I want the record to record. I've never seen Scott. Jenny. Speechless.
- [52:12]
Scott Jennings
Yeah.
- [52:12]
Senator Ted Cruz
And I think for at least a half second you were.
- [52:15]
Scott Jennings
Yeah. We took those pictures on a warm day.
- [52:21]
Senator Ted Cruz
What is that out of Seinfeld? The water was cold. It was cold.
- [52:25]
Scott Jennings
Oh, it's great.
- [52:27]
Ben Ferguson
Don't forget we do this podcast Monday, Wednesday, Friday. Hit that subscriber auto download button. Grab Scott's book. He also does a great radio show as well on the Salem Network so you can you can listen to that as well and the center and I will see you back here in a couple of days.
- [52:42]
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