Finding Hope in Adversity

Summary

The Collage Podcast – Episode: Finding Hope in Adversity
Released on April 25, 2025
Host: Jeff Fair
Produced by Feed My Sheep, Temple, TX

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Introduction

In this heartfelt episode of The Collage Podcast, host Jeff Fair welcomes two inspiring guests, Beck and Kim, who share their personal journeys of overcoming adversity through faith and community support. Recording from Feed My Sheep in downtown Temple, Texas, the conversation delves deep into themes of loss, resilience, and the transformative power of hope.

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Guest Introductions

Beck: An entrepreneurial spirit, Beck runs a small security company and a boutique in Belton. Celebrating 28 years of marriage and recently becoming a grandmother, Beck embodies dedication to both her family and community. She shares her journey of stepping outside her comfort zone to give back, inspired by her husband’s encouragement.

• [03:02] Beck introduces herself:
  “I want to give back and get closer to who I am.”

Kim: Originally from Hallettsville, South Texas, Kim spent two decades as a nurse before opening "the Porch," a boutique in Belton that doubles as a community space for meaningful conversations. As a mother of four and grandmother to three, Kim opens up about the profound challenges she faced, including the loss of her son to brain cancer and her daughter’s struggles with addiction and homelessness.

• [06:51] Kim shares her background:
  “I moved here about 21 years ago as a nurse and now own a boutique called the Porch.”

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Personal Stories of Adversity

Kim’s Journey Through Loss and Healing

Kim poignantly recounts the heartbreaking loss of her six-year-old son, Kelton, to brain cancer ([10:01]). This tragic event propelled her into a role of supporting others facing similar pains.

• [10:02] Kim reflects:
  “I couldn’t make it better, but I could be by his side and do what a mom does.”

She also discusses her daughter Kate’s tumultuous path, battling addiction, homelessness, and mental health challenges. Kim’s struggle to reconnect with Kate after a year of estrangement highlights the complexities of familial love and the relentless pursuit of hope.

• [12:01] Kim describes her daughter’s condition:
  “I saw someone I’ve never seen before. It was like talking to a shell.”

Beck’s Commitment to Community

Beck shares her initiative to give back, stepping into a community role that was initially outside her comfort zone. Her dedication is underscored by her recent experiences serving on the line and fostering connections within her community.

• [05:07] Beck talks about her motivation:
  “I wanted to give my time to the community, and this took me outside my comfort zone.”

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Faith, Hope, and Resilience

The conversation seamlessly weaves personal anecdotes with reflections on faith. Both Beck and Kim emphasize how their beliefs provided a foundation for enduring and overcoming their respective hardships.

• [22:10] Jeff summarizes Kim’s experience:
  “You have all the faith and hopes of a miracle, but you also have to put it in perspective that he is going to die.”

Kim shares her faith-driven perspective on her daughter’s struggles, illustrating how spiritual beliefs can offer solace and a path forward amidst chaos.

• [24:36] Kim affirms:
  “I have a testimony coming out of this better than the trauma that is there.”

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Biblical Reflections: The Crucifixion and Mary

Jeff introduces a profound biblical analogy, comparing the guests' personal struggles to Mary’s experience during the crucifixion of Jesus. This reflection serves to highlight the nature of divine love and compassion in the face of unimaginable suffering.

• [29:08] Jeff connects their stories to Mary’s pain:
  “How does it feel to watch your son die without being able to do anything?”

Beck and Kim explore the depth of God’s goodness, even when life’s moments are dark. They discuss how faith can provide strength and hope, much like Mary’s unwavering presence at the cross.

• [36:33] Jeff elaborates on Mary Magdalene’s role:
  “She sees him as a gardener and realizes he is alive, symbolizing hope.”

Kim adds a personal touch by sharing her experience with her son's illness, drawing parallels to the biblical narrative.

• [62:40] Kim relates her experience:
  “I couldn’t take it away, but I could make him comfortable and be by his side.”

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Parenting Adult Children

Beck and Jeff delve into the challenges of parenting adult children, particularly when they face personal struggles. They discuss the delicate balance between providing support and allowing autonomy, acknowledging the emotional turmoil parents endure.

• [26:04] Jeff on parenting:
  “Raising kids to watch... they're going to go down this rapid and you're going to try to save them.”

Beck shares her recent experience with her son seeking therapy, highlighting the small victories and continued hope in nurturing their relationship.

• [57:34] Beck reveals:
  “I sent a message saying I prayed for you to seek God, and he was at church.”

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Conclusion: The Importance of Community and Service

The episode culminates with a reaffirmation of the podcast’s core message: every individual matters, and collective community support is essential in navigating life's adversities. Jeff emphasizes that through service and mutual support, they embody the belief that everyone has a purpose and place within the community.

• [73:13] Jeff concludes:
  “You matter. You may be part of the solution, but you may also be this or that or whatever, but you matter.”

Beck and Kim echo this sentiment, underscoring the transformative power of community service and shared humanity.

• [73:14] Beck adds:
  “You matter together, and we all matter together.”

As the episode wraps up, the commitment to serving the community remains at the forefront, reinforcing the podcast’s dedication to sharing stories that showcase the shared humanity of Temple’s residents.

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Notable Quotes

• Beck at [03:02]:
  “I want to give back and get closer to who I am.”

• Kim at [12:01]:
  “I saw someone I’ve never seen before. It was like talking to a shell.”

• Jeff at [22:10]:
  “You have all the faith and hopes of a miracle, but you also have to put it in perspective that he is going to die.”

• Kim at [24:36]:
  “I have a testimony coming out of this better than the trauma that is there.”

• Jeff at [73:13]:
  “You matter. You may be part of the solution, but you may also be this or that or whatever, but you matter.”

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Final Thoughts

The Collage Podcast episode "Finding Hope in Adversity" masterfully intertwines personal narratives with profound reflections on faith and resilience. Through Beck and Kim's stories, listeners are reminded of the strength found in community and the unwavering hope that faith can inspire, even in the darkest of times. This episode serves as a testament to the shared humanity that binds us all, illustrating that amidst adversity, hope can indeed be found.

Transcript

[Jeff]

Foreign. Hey, we want to welcome everybody to another edition of the Collage podcast. We are really excited. We're always excited to do the collage podcast. So it's kind of redundant to say that, but we are so today interested because y'all can't see it out there, but I can see it. I have two guests that have a slight fearful look on their face because they're not sure where we are going to go in this conversation, what we're going to talk about. So obviously they have not listened to the podcast because that is the normal. Like, we don't know where we're going to go and we don't know what we're going to talk about. And for all of you out there, if you're listening, you know that we are recording this from Feed My Sheep, and we're in a little place called Temple Texas. So that's kind of right in the middle of Texas. I say little whatever. It's not big. And we're recording this from a place called Feed My Sheep. And so it's in downtown Temple. And what we do is we work with a whole lot of the population of Temple. We provide a whole lot of stuff. So that kind of tells us about where we are and where this is coming from, if you're listening to that. So what we're going to do, like always today we have two guests. So what we're going to do is we're going to start and we're going to allow them to introduce themselves and tell us a little bit about yourself. I would not probably in it, maybe I wouldn't include my last name because this world we live in is crazy. And then we're going to kind of talk, and then we have to mention at the start of the podcast that for all of you out there, just an interesting tidbit as a precursor to this is I was told yesterday by a lady who has done a podcast on here, okay. That today. She told me this yesterday. She called crying. She told me yesterday that today I would get shot and I'm going to die. So I've got that going for me today. So she called and she was terrified that I'm not supposed to be going out and about today because she saw it with all clarity that I'm going to get shot. Okay, so have that. So, like, if it occurs, you might want to move away from me because you don't want to get caught in the crossfire. But this is a historic podcast because this might be the last one before I get shot.

[Beck]

I'm glad I could be a part of it.

[Kim]

Agree.

[Jeff]

So then. So it's a big moment in this. So how about we get started with this and introduce yourselves and tell us who we are visiting with today.

[Beck]

Okay. Who first?

[Kim]

Me.

[Jeff]

Are you here? That's not a good start.

[Beck]

Okay, so my name is Beck. B, E, C K. And today I'm here to actually flip the script. And we're interviewing Jeff Fair and he didn't know it.

[Jeff]

Bring it.

[Beck]

So we're here today.

[Jeff]

If you do, I will give you the A game. Oh, you don't even want to go there. She thought she's gonna make me flinch. Not a chance. Two on one. Still not a fair fight.

[Beck]

Darn. Okay, so my name is Beck. I am from this area. Been here almost my whole life. I've moved around just a little bit, but this is my community.

[Jeff]

Okay.

[Beck]

And I am a empty nester. So I have. My kids are all moved off.

[Jeff]

I know that.

[Beck]

And I run a small little security company and I also have a little side gig where I have a little boutique in Belton area in her shop. I'm sure she'll touch on that. And I'm a new grandma.

[Jeff]

Congratulations.

[Beck]

New grandbaby. And I'm married. Been married to my high school sweetheart for 27. This is our 28th year together.

[Jeff]

Okay. Where did you go to high school?

[Beck]

Went to high school in Troy. Oh, I know. Nothing to brag about.

[Jeff]

I'm trying to think. Okay, so I'm listening. I don't mean that for real, like so. But Troy, that's a little town just outside of Temple.

[Beck]

Right outside of Temple. And I had a kind of little, small town growing up. Great. I lived in Pendleton, which was a little town outside. Inside of Troy. Outside of Troy. And I've been there my whole life. I'm still there. I still have a house. I literally, I still have a house there.

[Jeff]

Okay. At the end of this, I'm going to ask you a name in Pendleton.

[Beck]

Okay.

[Jeff]

I'm not on the podcast.

[Beck]

Okay.

[Jeff]

Because I heard one of my high school buddies was living out in Pendleton.

[Kim]

Okay.

[Jeff]

And been there for quite a bit.

[Beck]

And the reason I'm here is I wanted to do in January. I never set a New Year's resolution. I just don't do that. And this year I decided to do it. But I wanted to. I didn't want it to be anything like health related, lose weight or anything like that. I wanted it to be given back and like getting closer to, you know, who I am and that kind of thing. And So I. My husband actually brought me here. He was here working on y'all.

[Jeff]

That's stuff.

[Beck]

And I had been telling him, I really want to do something. I want to give back. I want to. I want to give my time to the community. And this took me outside my comfort zone.

[Jeff]

Oh, yeah.

[Beck]

So he just happened to come the very, like, right after that and said, I met Cindy at Feed My Sheep. And I said, give her my number, please. I want to. That. That's my start. That was it. That was my end.

[Jeff]

Okay.

[Beck]

So he did, and I messaged her. And the next day I was here. Literally the very next day, I messaged her and came as fast as I could.

[Jeff]

And now you're doing.

[Beck]

And I have. I love it. And here I am on Jeff's podcast. Jeff's been the mysterious guy that you just never know what Jeff is gonna say or do or do. Right, Isaac?

[Jeff]

On. Yeah, it is. And. And I'm in that same audience. I don't know what. I'm like, what in the world is Jeff gonna do today? Don't know.

[Beck]

Yeah. But you never know. We served together last week on the line, and it was fun. That was fun. It was a good time.

[Jeff]

It was fun.

[Beck]

It's a really good time.

[Jeff]

And so, like, in that. And we're gonna look at this world and your world, but good. Okay. Introduction. There we go. And guest number two.

[Kim]

Yes. I'm Kim, and I did not grow up here. I grew up in South Texas in a little town called Hallettsville.

[Jeff]

I know Hallettsville.

[Kim]

Oh, my goodness.

[Jeff]

Down by Cuero and Yoakum.

[Beck]

And.

[Jeff]

Okay.

[Kim]

And I moved here about 21 years ago as a nurse, brand new nurse. And did that for 20 years. And then God had a different turn for me and open doors and closed doors for me. And now I own a boutique in Belton called the Porch.

[Jeff]

Okay.

[Kim]

And that is where Retta is set up and a lot of other little vendors that I do have in there. And I am a mother of a blended family of four girls ranging from 29 to 21. And I have three grandbabies. I raised two of them.

[Jeff]

Okay.

[Kim]

And I've been married for two and a half years, almost three.

[Jeff]

Okay.

[Kim]

Yes. And my first marriage, and we worked together, gosh, 13, 11 years before we got married.

[Jeff]

Okay.

[Kim]

So we've been together a long time, but just recently got married.

[Jeff]

Very nice.

[Kim]

And that is who I am.

[Jeff]

Okay. And give. Before we go down the path, shout out to if somebody wanted to see the boutique and to see something. So you got you can't pass up that opportunity. Yeah.

[Kim]

So I'm gonna shout it out. Shout out to the boutique at the Por Belton, located at 795 E. Central Ave, across the street from Chef's Barbecue. And it is open on Tuesdays through Saturday. Tuesday through Friday it's 10 to 5, Saturday it's 10 to 4. And you can we do lots of.

[Beck]

Porch talk in there? Yes, there has been some. We. It's like a really. It's not. I'm not saying it's a girl's girl kind of place, but we do. We. We do a lot of speaking about Jesus there. We have had many cries and laughs there with customers that come in that just said we were led here. We don't know why, but. And. And there's stories that come out and then her story comes out and my story comes out, and it's really cool.

[Kim]

The next thing you know, three hours have passed and we've made another friend and they keep coming. So, yeah, it's a. It's a cool Jesus meeting in there all the time. It's kind of cool.

[Jeff]

Okay, well, you know. Well, you don't know, but it'll be difficult to not hear that sentence and then to say. You said, well, my story comes out. Her story comes out and we just talk and we do this porch talk and think, okay, how can I not say what is your story?

[Kim]

Right. Yeah, yeah.

[Jeff]

So how can we say out of that seems like a decent launching point of where we're going to go. Tell me your story. What in the world does that even mean?

[Kim]

Absolutely. So my story starts, wow, let's go way back. Let's go back to my son. So I have a. I have three. I've had three kids.

[Jeff]

Okay.

[Kim]

I have a son who passed away. He was six when he passed. His name was Kelton. And from that I am able to share so many different testimonies to so many different people who walk in there. He passed from brain cancer, a type of brain cancer. And so when people come in and talk to me, I'm. I'm relatable. I'm able to discuss things I went through, things that I took a leap of faith on not knowing how it would lead me or go with and trusting and everything. Almost like walking on water. Just having that faith and being able to share that with people and able to give people hope when they're. They feel so lost. And so that's a. That's a really cool thing I do have. And he would be, oh, gosh, 22 now. So that's been a while since that happened, but he's still very close to my heart. And then my other story is, I have another one. I have a daughter who is took. Took a road, a different route than, you know, some people. And, you know, we raise our kids to the best ability that we can, but it doesn't matter how we raise them.

[Jeff]

That's right.

[Kim]

And, you know, they take their own path. They follow their own journeys. And her journey has been a hard one for everybody. And she's fought addictions and homelessness. Homelessness.

[Beck]

Hospitalizations.

[Kim]

Yes. Jail. Jail. And I just recently been able to talk to her, and she. I haven't talked to her in over a year.

[Jeff]

Okay.

[Kim]

And that journey's been a blessing, but difficult, if that makes sense.

[Jeff]

Oh, for sure.

[Kim]

I went to go try when she first got locked up. I tried to go see her. She refused it. I wasn't able to see her. So I left there going, why did you tell me to come? I know you led me to be here, but why did I walk in here and get turned down? And he goes. And he literally felt the tap on my shoulder. Honey, that wasn't for you. I'm like, oh, okay. So that seed was planted there for her. And I just had to back off and say, okay, well, Jesus, I'm not going back until you tell me to go again. So we're just letting you know that that was hard, you know. And so later on, he didn't send me. He sent her sister. And that was more recently, would you say? Maybe a couple months ago. Maybe a couple of months ago, one.

[Beck]

Of the story at the porch one day, we were sitting there, and it had just. All of this had just happened. She had just found out that she was in jail. She had been on the streets, and she's a beautiful girl. I mean, beautiful. She'd been on the streets in Waco and then went to jail. And we were at the shop and just going through it, talking about, you know, what her life will look like after this. Cause this is not what. And now she has her children, and she's raising her children for. And she wasn't happy about that. And we were at the shop, sitting on the porch, and this girl comes up, you know, the people that come to, like, sell bread or whatever. We were in mid conversation of this, and this girl comes up, what was she selling that day? Was it bread or was it.

[Kim]

She actually don't. I don't think donations.

[Beck]

It was the donation, but she had something she was selling, and she Was from a shelter, a group home, and. And it was in Oklahoma.

[Kim]

Yeah.

[Beck]

And she just happened to come through there. And we sat there for over hours talking, and she was giving us. And she had been an addict, and she had been a. You know, on the streets and all of this. And it was just like a little glimpse of. It was just. It was her. I mean, she literally said, just give her a chance and she's gonna. She'll be back around. Just stick with it and don't give up. And it was really cool. That was a cool day.

[Kim]

Yeah, that was a cool moment.

[Beck]

So ever since then you got back and that was about a year ago.

[Kim]

Yeah. And so I was able to.

[Beck]

And then just recently is when Kirsten got.

[Kim]

Yeah, Kirsten was able to contact her and says, I'm gonna send Mom. Like, I'm sending her. Like, don't think life is over. And. Because she had a lot of, oh, I'm never gonna get out. You know, just a lot of mental things going on with herself. And so she came and Kirsten came and talked to me, which is her sister, and said, mom, I told her I was sending you, so you gotta go. I'm like, okay, let's go. Yeah. So the next day, because visitation was Sundays and Mondays, it was on Monday. And so I drive up there and go see her. I don't know if I can see her or not. She's gonna let me see her or whatever. And I got to see her. And that was the hardest thing that I think I've ever had to do.

[Jeff]

Really?

[Kim]

Yes. I saw someone that I've never seen before.

[Jeff]

Tell me what that means.

[Kim]

That meant she never. She didn't look like the Kate I. I raised. I knew.

[Jeff]

Okay.

[Kim]

It's like she talked to me, but it was like talking to a shell. And then she would. It's almost like she became another person also. The shell was like her, but empty, lost, depressed. Then she would turn and it would be like a different person. And it almost looked very dumb sight.

[Beck]

Like demonic. That's the word.

[Kim]

I'm looking demonic. Looking very cold. Very. Like if I touched her, I'd freeze. You know, just very still. Eyes became very pinpoint. Just really. It scared me. But it scared me so much that I just said, I'm going to stop everything and I'm going to pray for you. We're going to pray right now. And I just told Satan, get on out of here, that this is not the place for you, that you can have her. You will not. And then we had another Conversation. But during that time she still was there. And she was. She told me that they're gonna kill me in here. They've told me they're gonna cut my face and put stitches in me and just a bunch of just very cruel, ugly things. And so. And I'm here. I am the mom who's never seen this side of her. Don't know what to do. And I'm like, oh, Lord, please let me hold myself together. Cause I'm supposed to be a strong one here for her. And I said, okay, Kate, I don't know. I said, where is this coming from? She goes, the vents. They're talking to me through the vents.

[Jeff]

Oh yeah.

[Kim]

And I was like, okay, okay. And then she just started talking. But when she talked to me, it didn't make any sense to me. It was very. Just weird, you know, Just nothing was made a whole sentence and nothing was put together. It was all just looked like a puzzle. And I was trying to figure it out. And I'm like, okay. And then our time ran out and I crumbled. I fell apart at that moment when she was gone and I knew that she wasn't going to see me. I was like, oh my gosh. I found out she was in solitude this whole year by herself in solitude. I was.

[Beck]

And hasn't. Hadn't even went to court yet. They couldn't get. Because mentally she wasn't really enough there to even go to court yet.

[Kim]

Has not gone to court yet.

[Jeff]

Still not.

[Kim]

Yeah.

[Beck]

But the good thing is, the good.

[Kim]

Thing is, praise Jesus, since this all has happened and mom has been on her knees and trying to figure out what can I do to help this girl get better. And I finally got into people I can talk to. Reaching out. Like I talked to her lawyer. I talked to the other lady that was in there that. That was head of Mhmr. And I was just trying to get information. What can I do? What can I do? And come to find out, this whole time she's been waiting pretty much for a bed at a hospital so they could level her levels out, get her back into what they call a cognitive state where she could go and actually get sentenced to the court, you know, and that has happened. She is actually in a hospital right now. And we're able to talk to her pretty much anytime we want to. We can call her and talk to her. She just told me yesterday. She called me yesterday and said, we're able to video chat. I just found this out. I said, well, well, let's do it. She Goes, okay, well, Monday, I'll set it up. I don't know what Monday was about, but I said, okay, that's fine. You can do that. And. But it was good to hear that. Now, a lot of the conversations we are having are more what I used to know of Kate, how she used to talk to me. She still has moments where she goes left field on me, and I'm like, I don't know how to handle that. I don't know what to do with that. I just pray for her over that and that, you know, she's released from whatever these feelings that she is having and whatever these mental. I don't even know what to call them.

[Beck]

It's more like breakdowns.

[Kim]

Breakdowns of what she feels is true to her, you know, but in reality, I know they're not true at all. Like, so, like, the FBI's after her and all of this stuff, and she didn't do anything bad enough for her to even be in there a year. She hasn't even done something bad enough for her to be in solitude for this whole time. It's just because she has mentally just had a complete breakdown that. So it's been a journey. It's been. But it's been a good journey where relationships have been working. I've actually got to be able to talk to my daughter after a year, and she's. Before that, before even the year of her just being on the streets and stuff, I never even had a conversation with her. I couldn't have a conversation with her because she was so mean. She was just rude. She was. So I wasn't able to have those conversations. So it's good to be able to bring back and her listen to me and talk to me and talk to her sister. Then we haven't had those relationships, and she asks about her kids and stuff, and I tell her that they're doing great and they're doing good things and what the future looks like, I have no idea.

[Jeff]

Okay. Wow.

[Kim]

Yeah. Wow.

[Jeff]

Now in it, there's so much to unpack in that.

[Kim]

Yeah. For real.

[Jeff]

So much interesting out there. Like, so first, people that could listen to the story that don't know and you're not and, like, that would go, oh, that is such a heartbreaking. Either piece.

[Kim]

Yeah, for sure.

[Jeff]

Lost a son.

[Kim]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

Okay. And so you'd go, oh, my gosh. And then have a daughter that's struggling and in the process, trying to figure out, do I get her back? Is she lost? Like, in this gray area of this? And you're Going, oh, my gosh. And then you said a sentence at the end here and you said, it's been such a good journey.

[Kim]

It is a good journey.

[Jeff]

Use the word good. And people out there who don't understand, possibly this faith component in it, and then this how God is. And I'm not claiming that we understand God because he is outside of our realm of understanding, but to be able to look at very, very, very. There's no doubting the moments are dark, the valley was deep. We're not discounting that. To be able to say the sentence, God is good. It's good.

[Beck]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

Okay. Because that as human beings, you would have a choice. Either God is good or he is not. He is a cold and hurtful God or he is good.

[Kim]

Yeah, I definitely could see how that could go both ways. Because I could definitely look at that and say, go. Why did you do all this?

[Jeff]

That's right.

[Kim]

Why are you being so hard on me? Like, why are you putting me through all this trauma? But I also know I have a testimony. I have something that's coming out of this better than the trauma that is there. Because it's not going away. It's just how you look at it and how you perceive it and what the good things you can see out of it, for sure.

[Jeff]

No, I agree. Like that one. So in this, like that, none of these things that have occurred in your life, they're not going away just because you want. Oh, no, no. Not going to think about that anymore. It's gone. No, it is in the framework that is you. It is part of this mosaic of life that is these tapestry that is all put together that will make an amazing symphony at some point. But right now we just see it note to note and you're like, no, dude, that's the wrong note here. This is the wrong. Because we don't know the whole score that's getting put together. And so then at the end, you would hope we would look back and you would go, amazingly beautiful. Beautiful piece you put together. I didn't really like these sad notes of the oboe over here when they were going on, but golly, it fit in the overall deal that's going on here. And like this so much, so much I can understand, like the raising of kids because I have some older ones that are grown adults. Same deal. I'm old. You would like, you know, you would like to go, okay, here's what you're going to do. Here's how you're going to do it. This is what I want you to do. Here's the decisions I want you to make.

[Beck]

That's the hardest thing. Hardest thing in the world.

[Jeff]

I agree.

[Beck]

Raising kids to watch. Especially raising adult kids.

[Jeff]

That's right.

[Beck]

The hardest job.

[Jeff]

Because at the end of the day game, you don't want it. Like. And so you're sort of a spectator, but you're not a spectator. And you have a vested interest because this is something you love. Because, like, I can't say it as much as y'all can. This was part of you. Like, this lived within you. This was. This is you. Yeah, okay. But it's so much more. And then they become this crazy adult.

[Kim]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

And then not crazy, but there's this crazy concept that whether we like it or not, they can do whatever they want to do.

[Beck]

And mine are 31 and 26.

[Jeff]

Okay. So we're similar.

[Beck]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

Okay. In the age range. So that in it. And been through the chapters of what the F are you thinking?

[Beck]

For real?

[Jeff]

You know what in the world. And then where this definition of what Loving a child is not always that easy.

[Beck]

It's difficult.

[Jeff]

For real. Very difficult.

[Beck]

I just had a big argument with my son this weekend. We were supposed to be having a sweet little Easter weekend, but I mean, of course we, you know, got through. Got over it. But. Yeah, it never turns out. Exactly.

[Jeff]

Agreed. And then love, you know, like, so mine. And we, like, that's a whole. Like, on this, you could look, loving somebody, if you truly do, it's not just sitting by idly and watching them go down the river and drown.

[Beck]

No, no.

[Jeff]

And you're not as a parent, you just don't go, hey, little Joey, love you. You know, you fixing go down this rapid and you're going to die down there. But before you do, just want you to know. Love you so sweet. I'm gonna sit over here and appreciate it. No, no, As a parent, you're not. That's not an option. It is an option. Okay, but it is not an option. And you're going. I don't care if you think you're all right in the river. I'm jumping in. I'm going to drag you over to the side over here because I'd rather hate you. You can hate me on the side, but I'm not going to allow you to die. And so my. My. Well, what I've had those discussions at this moment, you know, when a lifeguard jumps in to save you from the pool, you ain't really liking them a whole lot. But I'm not going to let you drown.

[Beck]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

And so that discussion, and then for me, out of both of these is, I think parenting, good or bad, gives us a small glimpse of how difficult it must be to be God.

[Beck]

Absolutely. I thought about that this weekend a lot.

[Jeff]

Think about that.

[Beck]

You really put yourself there. I could not even.

[Jeff]

Okay. And so then in it, you're going, I can't fathom it. And so like the book of Hosea in the Old Testament.

[Kim]

Yes.

[Jeff]

Okay. So I love that book. And we won't get into it. Some say there really was this. Some say this just a metaphor that talks about the chosen, the Israelites. And it impacts me a little bit more to think there was a Gomer and there was Hosea and there was. There was people in this love relationship. And I love in that one that it goes. Because this husband was asked to take a wife that was a prostitute, God said, hey, take this one. This is what you're going to marry. Okay? And he went and had some noble deal or whatever. I guess he thought he was going to save her or whatever, but didn't. And then time and time again she did what that person does. And he would go and he would go before all the people of the town and he would take her back. And then there at the end, she is in front of the whole community naked, because she got caught again. And this is her husband, he comes up and gets her yet again, knowing full well that she is going to do it again. And he goes up there and brings her out. And I love, as God talks about that, there's a passage in there towards the end that God brings it clear. And he says, looking at us at people. And he says, my heart overflows with rage for you. Like it burns. He said it overflows and you got this emotion. And the sentence could end there, you know, and we deserve exactly what we're going to get. And he says, I want to destroy you, basically.

[Kim]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

And it could end there.

[Beck]

I think, I think of Mary when I. Oh, I think of her like how hard it was for her as a. Because I'm a mom.

[Jeff]

Okay.

[Beck]

And her standing there watching and not able to do anything.

[Jeff]

Agreed. So we're going to talk about that because this one. So. But so we won't leave anybody out there on the God and the rage stuff. Okay. He doesn't end the sentence there. And he says, but I can't, I can't because my heart overflows with compassion and love for you.

[Beck]

I love that.

[Kim]

Yes.

[Jeff]

So it doesn't end there. Okay. We're going to take that because I have been spiritually at this place, okay? Because it's Easter. We're recording this. The Easter has just occurred out there. I don't matter where.

[Beck]

You just finished your lent. Feed my sheep. Lent. I followed it every day. Two days.

[Jeff]

Interesting. Interesting journey. Okay? But mine, where I got stuck here. Not stuck. The place I come to at the end because it is a journey, okay. Is here at the Crucifixion, because you just mentioned. So we're going way off. Okay? So we're way off script here, okay? So we're at the crucifixion, okay? Christ, we got all of these moments here. He's going to get betrayed and da, da, da. Okay, so not that. Okay, we're at the crucifixion, okay? And you just mentioned it. And so there's two Marys there with him. Okay? So we got Mary, his mom, right? So we got Mary Magdalene, who's also the one who loved him deeply, washed his feet with his with her tears and dried them with her hair, covered him in the burial incense. That was what he needed. Nobody got what was going on. Loved him deeply. Okay. Even there's some talk of whatever. We're not going to go down that path of what their love was. But there's no doubt she loved him deeply. Okay, Crucifixion. So historically, some. If you would look at how crucifixions occurred. Okay, I wasn't there. But historically, we can kind of look. And it looks as if he was way Jesus. He was way separated from everybody else, and he was up there. And you're kind of watching as a spectator from a distance, and he was way up here. And there's this great separation. A lot of historical stuff would show you that the crucifixion, the cross that Jesus was crucified on, Mary is at the base of it. Both the Mary's right. Okay. They're at the base of it right there. Jesus ain't way, way, way, way up in the sky. Okay. Probably maybe, maybe eight or so feet to the top of him. Like the cross is there. Mary. And them, the separation was they were at his feet, close enough to touch.

[Beck]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

And this dude is dying. So keep in mind Mary, the mother, Mary, she got pretty good inkling that God had done some incredible things through her in that son, still her son. And he is on that cross dying in front of her.

[Kim]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

Okay. Traumatic dying. And so we're hoping at this moment that the truth is that, okay, this was really God all She knows at this moment this is her son, that all she can do is sit by and watch him die. We don't know anything, okay? So we don't know at this moment of the story, okay? The other Mary, who loved him deeply, both of them loved. She's sitting and watching this person that she loves deeply just die. All the people that were following him, all the people that said they got it, all of these. One disciple was there, and Jesus said to him, hey, this is now your mom. Take care of her.

[Beck]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

Okay, so we got that, but pretty much all the other crew are gone. So we're just focused here. Because I've got two ladies in front of me here. Not that y'all are going to speak on behalf of them. It is to where I've gotten to on this one. I find it amazing. So he's crucified. He does die. They don't know he's coming yet because they're not. We got the. We got the Cliff Notes. We know the end. So we're like, whoo. He comes back. They don't know. So then we go. And he's taken to a tomb I love in the John passage. So we get to that one. Mary Magdalene standing outside the tomb. She's there, okay? She is the one taking care of the body. He is decomposing, okay? He is human. We cannot lose that fact right now. He has died a horrific death. He is in a place. He is decomposing, okay? And Mary Magdalene is in there taking care of his body.

[Kim]

Wow.

[Jeff]

Okay. We're at day two of this deal in this place. It ain't cold. She's taking care of his body. She's standing outside of his tomb. There's nobody else there. Okay? And so we'll get to. This is where I'm. I'm stuck to because this is where we come to. She's standing outside. She is the first one that got to see the miracle of all miracles the earth has ever seen. Okay? There is talk. We don't know for sure. We do know that at one juncture of her life, that. That Mary had seven evil spirits living within her. It is in the Bible that Jesus freed her from. Okay, so we do know that there's other texts that people would point that she might have been a repentant prostitute. She probably wasn't of the highest character. Like, this is a lady that's standing outside the tomb, looking in there. The other Mary right there with her. They're taking care. She's the one that looks in, and we're going to get to this. And that's because I think this would go to the love that people could have for others. Okay? So not Christ's love for us, because that's. I can't even begin to grasp that.

[Beck]

Right.

[Jeff]

Okay. Her love. She looks inside and she sees the angels. She sees first two angels in there, and they're there and the tomb is empty. Doesn't really understand what she's seeing. And basically paraphrasing, she says this. Where have you taken him? What have you done with him? Where is he? Because she's like, man, what the heck? You just. No, you took him. No. And she cries bitterly. And then Jesus. I love this in John. Cause this is. Everything ties in. Okay? So there's not a loose end in this story. We're not even going. So Jesus comes to her. She doesn't recognize it's Jesus. So the first one that Jesus even came to is her. And she sees him as a gardener. So I don't know. Let's just see, huh? Possibly, where do we need to be reconciled with. I don't know. Could that possibly be the garden? Huh. So how could you get reconciled. Reconciled with a whole fall is. Who would you say? Oh, a gardener fixes what occurs. Not saying that, but that's. It is. Some have made that. But she doesn't recognize it's Jesus. And all of this to get to this sentence, but I think is absolutely stunning. And we lose it. We don't even hardly speak of this, you know, is. So she sees this person. She thinks it's the gardener, okay? And she says, where have you taken him again? Tell me where he is and I will go get him and bring him back. This lady, okay? She doesn't know he's going to be resurrected. She doesn't know any of this stuff. She asked the gardener by herself, just all I need to know, I don't care where he is. I will go get him and I will drag him back here myself. That's love.

[Beck]

Yeah. I've never heard that. Put it that way.

[Jeff]

Yep. And it's the John, but like that, tell me where he is and I'll go get him. And then Jesus makes it so she could see who he was. And she says, teacher. And then Jesus says to her, okay, that I am. I'm alive and go tell everybody that I am living. And they passed a message to her to pass on to the disciples, okay? And I'm not picking on the guys. But then we pick up and think the show is all about them.

[Beck]

It's not right.

[Jeff]

It's not. Okay. No offense to that, but she did. He said, go tell him this. And she went. And then Simon Peter. And we get the Peter stuff. And we're not even gonna go down that path because that's where I am today in that. Cause then we get. And we'll get back to the story here. But then what? Peter gets asked. And that's a whole other podcast of. Oh, yeah, he got asked three times because that was the three times that he denied Christ. I can't ask for Christ what he asked or didn't ask. That could have been a coincidence. We lose so much of what goes in that conversation. And then there's questions you gotta ask on that one. Why was the last asked? Why did it grieve Peter so deeply? He answered it correctly, didn't he? Yeah, there must have been something else going on. Okay. The question couldn't have been the same because he didn't grieve on the first time he got asked. He didn't grieve on the second time he got asked. Third time he answered it correctly. And it says, Peter was grieved deeply by his response. Huh. So, like in. It's interesting because the whole thing. The whole thing, I'm not going to go down that path, so. But the whole thing Feed my sheep is based upon is John 21:17. Feed my sheep. Jesus said, then feed my sheep. That's what we're based upon. Which here's where I'm at, is 18. We'll get back to the podcast. But so 17 says this. So then Peter gets the answer correct. And then Peter was deeply grieved. And then Jesus says after his answer, which Peter said, you know I love you. And then he says, then feed my sheep. Okay, 18, here's interesting. This doesn't fit normal conversation. 18. Then Jesus says to him, in paraphrasing, okay, paraphrase Peter. When you were younger, you could go wherever you wanted to go, and you could do whatever you wanted to do. But I'm going to tell you this. When you get older, you will go, and I will lead you to those places you do not want to go at all. And you will reach out your arms and you will go, and you will come to a place that is the place you do not want to be. And then it says scripture, and Jesus did this to let him know how he would die. Okay? And then out of that, then the final thing Jesus says to him is, follow me. Okay. Interesting. Interesting context of watching this. Okay. To come back to Both Mary's and this love for another that doesn't fit within the realm of human understanding as we can even put it in words like tell me as a mother, and we can't speak for Mary the mother. And we're not trying to. We're not speaking for Christ. I'm just asking you because I don't claim to know. Okay. I would think you might have gotten glimpses. What is it like and how does it feel to watch? This is your son and there is nothing you can do. You're just left in this space of I pray and I hope that what God told me is true.

[Beck]

Yeah. That's all you can do.

[Jeff]

That's it.

[Beck]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

And I hope and I pray that this God that did all of these things is the God that he said he was. And I live in that truth.

[Beck]

Me too.

[Jeff]

The other thing I find interesting on those, Mary the mother. Okay. Not that we're going to go way off and. Well, yeah, I guess we are going to go slightly on another tangent is I find it interesting because you got to look at the whole picture. Everything that is occurring. The crucifixion just isn't an event that just happened over here. It fit within all of these things. Okay. What I love the book of Malachi. End of the Old Testament. Okay, so last book of the Old Testament, Malachi. God speaks to the church and the people that are running the church. Like so the church universal and he is, I can't speak, but disappointed in what it has become because they had at that time made it something it wasn't supposed to be. And so then it was a sacrificial system. So, like, if I committed a really bad sin, oh, that's two goats, you know. Oh, man, crud. Two goats. Oh, man. A calf. Oh, crud, you know. Okay, that's only. That's a four dove sin. Okay? So we don't have that system anymore because that's what Christ came to take away. But book of Malachi, the priest and the people that were running the church, somebody would bring their bestest sheep into the church. Guys running the church would keep the sheep and they'd bring in some junk. You want to sacrifice it? I'm going to keep the good one and I'm going to sacrifice this junk over here. God was not pleased with that. And he looked upon that and saw what it had become. And so then why I bring that back to Mary and then we'll get back out of that. God said to the people, done with you basically at that time, in the Old Testament, he spoke to people all the time. Like it would be normal. They'd walk and God, I mean, like, so I would be like, hey, did you talk to Kim the other day? Because, oh, she's got a pretty cool story. Because God talked to her.

[Kim]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jeff]

Like they communed. Like they walk, like, and it'd be normal. Like so nowadays somebody said, hey, God, talk to me. We'd be like, woo hoo, whacky whack. Like he speaks through the Holy Spirit to us. But back then he spoke and you would know relatives. Oh man. Grandpa, he saw the cloud of God. Yeah, like he saw that he. And so that's the world they lived in. And he told them, I will be with you no more.

[Kim]

Right.

[Jeff]

Gone out of here 400 plus years. So like we would be sitting in this room and we'd be like, hey, I can't really remember, but my grandfather's grandfather's grandfather's grandfather, grandfather, God spoke to.

[Beck]

Him and it was passed down way.

[Jeff]

Down there, but no communication from God. And what I love is how did he come back in? The first words that we see that he speaks back to humankind is not wrath, not anything. He speaks to a little girl and he says to her, basically, you're going to carry my son and he is going to be the hope for all humankind. And you go, what in the world God should. At least you would have thought for. Dramatic pause. You know, he would come up on a mountain and then, then we would be hearing about. And this thunder came and then this earthquake came and then all the lightning was everywhere. And then God spok like if we're making a movie. And it was this thundering voice of God and it was amazing. And all the buildings crumbled around and this cool thing occurred because he was that powerful.

[Beck]

I think it really did happen that way.

[Jeff]

He whispered in the ear of a young teenage unwed mother.

[Kim]

Young too.

[Jeff]

That's right. Like we would look, I'm not going to say the age, but there's much that. She was an early teen.

[Kim]

Early, yeah.

[Jeff]

Culturally, I mean, like this, you know, I learned that lesson. I got to go to Nigeria years ago on a mission trip. Their culture is very different than ours. Not better, not worse, just different. Right, okay. And they would be more attuned to that culture as far as the dynamics. And so like I would go through an interpreter. I was with a tribe called the Fulani. So we were in the middle of the bush and me like I was one of the first white people that this village had seen. So, like, my hair, amazing. The hair on my arms, like, they just couldn't. Out of that. But what was staggering on this, like, why I would think there's truth in what Mary. I would say, I've got a son. My son at that time was 13 and my daughter was 11. Okay. I've got a son that is 13. Oh, man. Oh, that's good. Because the men were so revered in that culture. Okay. Not, but. And they go, oh, do you like his wife? He's 13. And I'll explain. Well, in our culture, we don't get married that early. Okay. And so, and then I would say, and my daughter, she's 11. Oh, you know, do you like her husband? And does she have a child? She's 11.

[Beck]

Wow.

[Jeff]

Different culture. So at their, I mean, so whole other discussion. But you would see that culturally it ain't like what we see. Different world. And she was a young girl and God whispered to her, this is how I'm going to save all of humankind through you. So all of that to come. Let me ask you. So all of that to get to. Okay, as mothers, tell me about Mary the mother and how it must have been to be there watching Jesus. And then we're going to come to. I want to hear both of that and then tell me, what is all this discussion of being a mother? Teach you about the goodness and the loving nature in a small way of God. Okay, so first tell me.

[Beck]

Thank you, Jeff.

[Kim]

This was our trick question.

[Jeff]

There's your trick question.

[Beck]

This is the question that you set up. Okay.

[Jeff]

Because I'd be interested. Because like, mine is, is, is male. I, I, I, I look at God in this form because that's all I know, right? And I think everybody looks this way. No, they don't. I want to hear the crucifixion story from your eyes, how it looks. Mary the mother.

[Beck]

Okay, so this, and this is kind of what I was thinking about when on Sunday when I was, it was Easter, and it was going through my mind what she actually had to deal with and how that actually reflects. I mean, it's. So when my kids are going through something. I have two sons, so when they're going through something, I want to fix it and I want to, I want to take it away. I don't want them to hurt. I don't want. But I know that that's how they are going to grow and how they become, you know, men is through hurting and, and hard lessons and going through it. And so I just I just have to, I mean I pray for them. I just, I. And one of my biggest prayers is if they're not praying for themselves, let me be the one to pray for. Like I want, I want to pray for them and you know, because I have a good inkling that they probably don't because, you know, 31 and 26, they probably don't get up in the morning and pray for themselves. I wish they did.

[Jeff]

Well, because at that age, they know a guy at that age knows everything.

[Beck]

Right?

[Jeff]

I don't have to ask nothing for nobody. I know it all.

[Beck]

Just a little bit of what Sunday brought was the life. It's not live 360, but it's where I can see their location, you know, or I can see my, their location on their phone. On my phone and then I can see.

[Jeff]

What is the term for that? Snooping?

[Beck]

Yes, yes, that term. That, that's the. Right. That's the term. You know what's funny is I have them, but I don't have my husband. My husband don't have my location. I don't have his location, nothing like that. But I do have the two boys, right?

[Jeff]

Hey, you got the green light. Did you hear that out? She don't know where you are. I have no clue.

[Beck]

But what's funny is so. It's not funny. It just worked out. It like it worked out. So. And, and I hate checking it because it does seem kind of creepy. But my oldest son, he's 31, he's hard headed. I mean he, he's hard headed. He deals with a little bit of depression. He has the worst woman picker that you could possibly ever do. I mean the guy has the worst luck when it comes to girls, right?

[Jeff]

And so we're gonna leave his name out of this. And I'm not going to ask the question on behalf of the male population, which one of us has a good ability to pick?

[Beck]

I'm gonna go with, with none except your husband.

[Jeff]

Give him that.

[Beck]

Give him that. So he does. He has a great picker. If they would have just got that from him. But so.

[Kim]

So he started.

[Beck]

He has a new girlfriend.

[Jeff]

Right?

[Beck]

And I'm not your husband.

[Jeff]

Your son.

[Beck]

My son.

[Jeff]

Okay.

[Beck]

My husband better not. Okay, I'm getting his location. So he has a new girlfriend that we're not allowed to meet yet. Where.

[Jeff]

Because we, because you said he's got the worst picker of women. So I would, I would probably keep her in the, in the back wings.

[Beck]

And so on Sunday and he's not, he Grew up with my mom taking him to church and things like that. I. My mom didn't take me to church, but I think it comes later. Like now that I'm around my mom's age now, I'm trying to learn more and I'm, you know, reading the Bible and. And doing my questioning and. And all of that. And all of that. Okay. So my mom used to take him to church when he was young, and he was. He loved it, but for years, he's not, you know, he. He steered away from that and went down a rocky kind of road with a few girls, that kind of thing. Whatever. But anyway, so Sunday, I just. On the way home, I was thinking about Mary, and I thought how I could pray for him for. On Sunday. What can I. What does the. What does it look like? What, I want to see him, where he going? And he had mentioned to me over the weekend that he had had his first therapy session, which he doesn't normally do. So I think this girl kind of, you know, maybe helping him out on that, you know, kind of thing. So I just prayed that he would reach out, get closer to God, go back to the roots, whatever it was. And. And you can't say it to him because he. He's one of those that even if I'm at the table, we go out to eat and I pray. We pray before we eat.

[Kim]

He.

[Beck]

It's like he feels awkward about that. You know what I mean?

[Jeff]

So.

[Beck]

So he. He doesn't know. If I was to say, can you pray for. Will you pray for us? He would go, no, you do that. You know, that kind of thing. So anyways, I just said, I'm just going to pray that he seeks God. That's it. That's that. Maybe. Maybe this girl, he. He goes in that direction. I am not kidding you. When I tell you we're driving home and I was going to meet him for dinner. So I look at his location.

[Kim]

Where's this boy at?

[Beck]

Pull up his location. He's at church.

[Jeff]

And please tell me you did not tell me. I feel happy about you. No, you know what?

[Beck]

I did, but I deleted it.

[Jeff]

Okay, Good job.

[Beck]

I sent a message saying I prayed for you to be in. To not be in church, but to seek God.

[Jeff]

That's right.

[Beck]

And you're in church, and I'm so happy. And then I deleted the message because I thought, I don't want to be like, make this big party because then he'll go back in the corner and then, you know, whatever. But he was in church. And he was in the Church of Latter Day Saint Church, which was her. Is hers and her family's church. And it was like, oh, my gosh. Wow. So it was like a little answer prayer. That. And. Yeah.

[Jeff]

So as parents, like, so like that one you like, that's. That you would. I would want, like, that's a male. Okay. I don't know why. And I'm not saying this is my son. Any bump and bruise and anything, tough it up. I mean.

[Beck]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

Now my little girl. Oh, Caroline. I'm like, I'm in front of that one. And ain't nobody coming nothing near my girl, my granddaughter. And I don't want. And I don't want her to feel any hurt.

[Beck]

Same.

[Jeff]

I don't want. If man. Any guy break her heart, I'm gonna bury him. Okay. Not. I'm not.

[Beck]

I don't feel the same way. I think you have the same heart. I think men have. The dads have the same heart.

[Jeff]

But out of that knowing if I truly love her, I need her to feel these hurts, and I need her to experience happiness. I need her to feel hurt. And you have to sit. Lack of a better term. And you watch some of these things in slow motion and you're like, that's a terrible relationship. Terrible. No, no, no, no, no. It's a terrible decision. But you know that they have to go through this. And then if you stop them midstream, you didn't save anything. Matter of fact, they're going to hate you.

[Beck]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

And they get all bent out of shape. Okay.

[Beck]

So they're going to hate you at some point anyway.

[Jeff]

Agreed. That's a given. I mean, like, that. And they're going to write you out because we know nothing and. And rightfully so. I mean, so you look and go, huh? Almost like our faith journey. There's moments that you're like, man, God, don't know nothing.

[Beck]

Right?

[Jeff]

God was pretty solid idiot to me when I was 16, 17, 18. He didn't know nothing.

[Beck]

That's what I was saying. Like, when my mom, she. We wasn't raised in the church. She was a single mom, and we wasn't raised in the church. But as she got older, probably in her 40s, she was like, I'm gonna. She really got into it, and she would, you know, come with me to church. Come with me in church. And we were like, you need to stop. Just because this is your journey doesn't mean it's our journey.

[Jeff]

And then God stuff over there, like, plenty good right over there.

[Beck]

I hate to Even say that, but it kind of was. But it wasn't because I. I didn't want to know. I just didn't want to know from her.

[Jeff]

Yeah, fair.

[Beck]

You know, because. Well, you didn't ra. You wasn't. You didn't raise me like that. So what do you know? Fair kind of thing. My husband. My husband was raised in the church, though. My husband was. He was Pentecostal. His. All of his uncles, all of his.

[Jeff]

Family was solid church.

[Beck]

He was solid church. Yes.

[Jeff]

Yeah, The Pentecostals, they don't play.

[Beck]

They do not play.

[Jeff]

They don't play so good. But they know that's solid. Like, they'll. They'll flat bring it.

[Beck]

Yes, they will.

[Jeff]

You know, and so. Whole other deal on that one. Tell me, how do you think Mary felt at the cross? Tell me when.

[Beck]

How I think you felt it.

[Jeff]

Well, yeah, tell me about that.

[Kim]

Yeah, it's soul crushing. You know, Man, I go back and think about those moments of watching him lose his ability because the type of cancer he had, it affected his brain stem. So everything that goes through the brain stem tells you, it speaks to you. You know, move your finger, move your leg. That's how you operate. And when that's affected, you learn. You lose the ability to move your right arm, your right leg, because it's not sending that signal to tell you. So you lose the ability. And that's what happened to him is basically. It wasn't painful. I would say it was painful for me to watch, but painful for him. No, it was more just watching the. The person that you love incredibly the most. Right. You love your kids the most. And to watch that and not be able to do anything for him for it, I couldn't make it better. I could make him comfortable. I could make him happy. I could be by his side. I could do the things that a mom does to help cheer a kid up. I could do those things for him, but I couldn't take it away.

[Jeff]

That's right.

[Kim]

And so one day, I'll never forget this. We were sitting on the bed, and we were. I think we were coloring a picture together. And he looked at me and says, mama, I don't want to die. I said, well, baby, I don't want you to die either. I said, but guess what? When you do go, you got an incredible place to go to. And so that led me as a mom, to be able to tell a story about a place where he's going to go, you know, the pearly gates of heaven and the people that he'll get to see and meet and he'll be an angel. And he has a mansion up there waiting for him. And there's streets of gold that are so pure you can see through it. And I said, get up there and do a belly roll across the gold streets. I said, because you can't do that now. So do that. I said, you won't. You won't. You'll be able to walk, you'll be able to talk, you'll be able to do everything that you want to do there that you can't do here. I said, and I'll meet you there one day and. But that was the hardest conversation to have with your kid who you know is going to pass.

[Jeff]

That's right.

[Kim]

I mean, you have all the faith and you have all the hopes of a miracle. You know that he will be saved. But in the reality also, you have to put it in perspective that he is going to die. Are you prepared for it?

[Beck]

I don't know which is harder, planning for them to die or it being a straight.

[Kim]

I've asked myself this 100 million times. Like, was it easy? I don't think it's easier either way. I think it's just different.

[Jeff]

I will go on like, so I can't answer. Okay. Can't answer for a mother. And we're going to come back, we're going to end with the crucifixion deal. What you just said. I was a youth minister at a church for 18 years before I came to this gig down the road. But so I did that. I will never, ever, ever, ever forget. Had one of our mothers, she had lost her. He was 20 when he passed. He was 20 years old. Terrible, tragic accident. Out of the blue. He was a news anchor person and terrible deal. But whatever. They raised the antenna on the mobile van they were at and it hit a power line and he was in the van. He died instantly. Wasn't even sick.

[Kim]

Freak.

[Jeff]

Okay? Freak, Freak accident. Okay. And so out of that I'll never forget, Golly, his name was Matthew. In the funeral service. I've seen it twice now. The mother. There was a place of grief that I've never seen in a human being that I didn't even know.

[Beck]

I don't ever.

[Jeff]

I don't even know what the emotion was. And there was wailing. So like we see these words in the scripture and we just glance over them and like when you see that Mary, both of them were at his feet and they were crying and wailing like it's just heart wrenching. Hurt. And I've saw it. I'm going, oh, my gosh. I don't even know what that is, okay? And it broke. I mean, like, you, everybody, you're just sitting there and you're going, oh, my gosh. Okay? So all of that. So we would come to. And then somebody could be sitting there, go, oh, man. There's no such thing as a good God. Why would you send somebody into that place? Okay, interesting. Crucifixion Mary. Okay, back to both of them. They're there. They're at his feet. He is dying, okay? And he is in much, much pain. Make no doubt about it. He is man made flesh. He is hurting. He is dying. He is going to die. Yeah, okay? He knows that. I mean, he resolutely. And nobody took his life. We go back in. John, John, it says he laid his life down voluntarily, like this is occurring because he wished it so for us. They didn't take his life. I lay it down voluntarily, okay? His mom, she's at his feet. It's his mom, okay? She can't take it away. She is there. He knows she can't take it away. He does know the greater. Okay. She can't take it away. And she wants nothing other than to probably take it away. And any mother. I can't answer for them, okay? But she's probably sitting there. It's not fair. I should be up there instead of him. Okay? Can't do that. Can't do that. Okay? What I love and we lose in this story as well, possibly. I'm not saying we lost it because it's there. There is a verse that would say that, you know, Jesus, he says, my God, my God, why have you forsaken me? Okay? And we leave it at that. And then some would, in different passages, say, ah, look, he was saying the 22nd Psalm, okay? So that's a passage out of that he was reciting. We only get one little glimpse of it, okay? To show you the good nature possibly of God. His mother is laying at his feet watching him die. He knows that, okay? Culturally, we've lost it because it's not part of our culture. 22nd Psalm and Psalms were sung, not read. So it's not like this. They sang it. It would be songs. The 22nd song was a lullaby that mothers, when their children would be crying and hurting, a mother would hold them when their infants against the chest and they would sing or hum this psalm to them as a form of comfort in the midst. Can't answer for Jesus, but his mother is Right there. She can't take this away from him. She is suffering with him. Jesus sings a song that would bring a mother comfort.

[Kim]

Amazing, right?

[Jeff]

Amazing. That is the God that he knows how the story's going to be.

[Kim]

Be.

[Jeff]

He would done anything to take it back, but he couldn't because he needed it to be for us. And in the midst of that, does he feel her pain? Absolutely. Absolutely. And at that moment, he does this. He sings something that she would have found comfort in as she's sitting at his feet. They would have known this and they would have shared this intimate, intimate moment together. And he would have brought comfort to her and they would know.

[Kim]

Isn't that crazy?

[Jeff]

That's great. This is the God that we speak about here. This is the God that as we talk about his parents that watches us, okay. Wander off and does his heart break for us? Absolutely. We get tiny glimpses of us. We don't say we understand God. We're not saying we understand him because he is bigger, but we do understand his nature. And his nature is that he loves us unconditionally. And then the crucifixion brings us to the place while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us so that we shall have eternal life. And so we look at that. So here. Interesting. We got absolutely nowhere on your stories. Absolutely.

[Beck]

You know what that means?

[Jeff]

We got to do it again.

[Beck]

Exactly.

[Jeff]

We didn't even get your story at all. You hogged whole story meeting.

[Beck]

Next time I'm really turning the script on you.

[Jeff]

And bring it.

[Beck]

We are going to interview Jeff.

[Jeff]

I will go on record the next one. We can do you if you want to.

[Beck]

You bring assure you I will have you some questions.

[Jeff]

Questions you can think to bring.

[Kim]

No.

[Jeff]

So like this it is interesting because I don't understand this phenomenon. People from all over will listen to hear this because God and I don't know why or how, but that God, he desires and he decides who listens to and who doesn't on that. And out of this we would say we come back to this place because we got to go serve a meal today.

[Beck]

Yes, we do.

[Jeff]

But all of this we talk about everything that has occurred is because God said that people matter.

[Kim]

Yes.

[Jeff]

He said that he created man and woman and they were very good. They matter. And so all of these things we would say and then all that we do, we're going to go serve. Not because we think people matter, we say it, we serve. Because God said people matter in Psalm 139. And so we look at that and then. So then we would say, because here's what's sad about the world that we're in is there's people out there who maybe even listen to this today that don't think they matter to anybody or they don't think they matter to this God, that this God doesn't even know them. And that's not true. That's not true that every one of us, if you are a person, if you are listening to this, you are a person. If you are able to hear this, you are a person. And then we are stuck with this truth which is you matter. You matter. You may be part of the solution, but you may also be this or that or whatever, but you matter. And we all matter together and we have a place and a purpose and we come in together in this community and we all matter together.

[Beck]

That's right.

[Jeff]

So out of that, we're out of here. Let's go serve a meal.