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The Copywriter Club Podcast
Hosted by Rob Marsh · EN
Ideas and habits worth stealing from top copywriters.
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TCC Podcast #419: Writing on Medium with Thomas Smith
Oct 29, 202401:03:26Summary readyThe publishing platform Medium’s been around for years. But the company has made a few changes recently that might make you reconsider whether or not you should be writing on Medium. Our guest for the 419th episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast is Thomas Smith. I asked Thomas to share some of the reasons Medium has become a place for readers to find great content as well as a place for writers to not just share their thoughts, but also to potentially earn a respectable income stream by posting thoughts there instead of social media or your own blog. Why Thomas? Well, he’s earned more than $19,000 for a single post on the platform, and well over six figures over the past couple of years. So he knows a thing of two. And he shared it all on this episode. Click the play button below, or scroll down for a full transcript. Stuff to check out: Thomas’s Thrive on Medium Course How to Find Clients 36-page Mini-book The FREE Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground Full Transcript: Rob Marsh: It’s been said so often that it’s almost become a meme… there’s this idea that successful millionaires… or maybe its billionaires, I can’t quite remember, but successful millionaires have on average seven different streams of income. They may have a salary or income from a business they own, they earn dividends on their investments, maybe they have income from property they own, and so on. And people share this idea with the intention that those of us who hear it will also think about ways to add different potential income streams to our businesses. But as a content writer or a copywriter, you may not have access to investment that pay dividends yet. Or property you can rent out. Or many of the other more traditional ways these very wealthy people earn money. But that doesn’t mean that there aren’t options for us. In fact, some of these options may be easier for you and me, than for the Jeff Bezos and Elon Musks of the world to capitalize on. Hi I’m Rob Marsh and on today’s episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast, I talked with successful Medium writer, Thomas Smith. Thomas has been writing on and making good money with Medium. He recently released a course that shows how he does it. And I wanted to chat with him about the possibilities for content writers and copywriters to use Medium as a potential revenue source—especially for the kinds of writing we might want to do for ourselves instead of our clients. If you write for you… you may want to listen to this episode twice so you pick up on all the ideas Thomas shares about growing an audience and income stream using Medium. Before we get to that though… you hear me tell you about several resources that we’ve put together to help you build and grow a writing business. I’m going to quickly list a few of them here so you can get the help you need… we have a free facebook group called The Copywriter Club. You can find us on Facebook and request that we add you to the group where you’ll find seven years of threads about all kinds of copywriting and business questions. Obviously you know about this podcast. You’re listening to it right now and there are more than 400 interviews with successful copywriters and other experts in our backlist. Once you’ve listened to this episode, scroll through to find interviews with people like Seth Godin, Jay Abraham, Jereshia Hawk, Joanna Wiebe, Todd Brown, Kennedy and so many others. Honestly, it’s the best free library of copy, content and business ideas that you’ll find anywhere. And it’s at your fingertips. And right now you can get our free, 36 page mini-book called How to Find Clients when you go to thecopwriterclub.com/findaclient . I guarantee you’ll find at least one and probably 5-10 ideas you can use to find a client for your business. We’re here to help you build a business, so be sure to take advantage of all the free resources we’ve provided for you. And now, let’s go to our interview with Thomas Smith. Thomas, welcome to The Copywriter Club Podcast. I’d love to start with your story. How did you become a content consultant, a writer, creator, I mean, of your course, Thrive on Medium, which I should just mention right up front, it’s a course not just about writing for Medium, but actually making a living from it. So how did you get there? Thomas Smith: Yeah, so my background is actually in AI, going way back to before it was a thing. I have a degree in cognitive science with a focus on AI from Johns Hopkins University. I was studying that kind of technology when it was literally on a whiteboard. You were drawing neural networks with a dry erase marker. So it’s come a long way in the time since then, but that was my original background. And I’m also a professional photographer. So I combined those two interests. I launched a company that uses AI to help archives, understand what’s in their archives, find photos in their big collections, get those out there for people to use. Been doing that since 2010. And along the way, I really learned how to kind of take those two interests of AI and photography and combine them in my own business, but also to explain them to people because AI is super confusing and photography is very technical. It’s also creative. There’s a lot of things that people have to understand in order to do both of those. So I kind of developed an expertise, I would say, in explaining those kinds of complex technologies in fairly simple terms and started to publish articles about photography and about AI. And originally I was just writing for publications in the photography space. I was writing for some bigger publications too, like IEEE Spectrum and that kind of thing. And I came along Medium, found Medium, this was in 2019. And I can go into a lot more detail about exactly how Medium works, but it just felt like it was going to be a great home for my writing where I could Basically talk about these topics that I’m very passionate about and have a lot of real world experience in and explain them to people and kind of share how to, how to use AI and how to do photography and how to build a business. All the stuff I picked up along the way in a way that would be really helpful. And it turned into not only a successful kind of platform for me, but also something that helped me launch. a consulting component to my business, where now I’m not just doing photography and using AI and helping archives, but I’m actually helping other companies understand how to tell their story in that space, how to share what they’re doing on Medium and on other platforms. It’s turned into essentially a content consulting business. That’s now almost the size of my core business with photography and AI. So Medium has been a huge piece of that, not only direct earnings on the platform, which I’ll get into, but also the way it’s helped me kind of add that onto my existing business. Rob Marsh: That’s, yeah, that’s amazing. So as I hear you talk about this, I’m curious, and maybe this is where we get into how Medium actually works, but why Medium over, say, my own blog or Substack or some other publishing platform where I can share what I write? What’s so great about Medium? Thomas Smith: Yeah, so I think, you know, it probably makes sense to step back and talk just briefly about what Medium is. I think everybody’s probably aware of it, especially if you’re a writer, you’ve seen it, it’s out there. But basically to break it down to the very basics, it’s a subscription platform. So people pay $5 all the way up to around $15 a month. There’s different levels that people subscribe at. And in exchange for that, they get access to all of the writing on the Medium platform. And a lot of it is behind this Medium paywall where you have to be a paying subscriber to have access to it. At the moment, Medium has about a million paying subscribers. They’ve grown tremendously over the last few years. They were around 750,000, uh, coming out of the core pandemic time when people ...
SummaryTCC Podcast #418: Writing Your Story with Allison Fallon
Oct 22, 202400:50:41Summary readyWant to write a book? There are plenty of experts who will tell you how. But Allison Fallon has an approach that’s different from all the others—at least, that’s how it felt to be. Allison is the guest for the 418th episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast and when you hear what she shares about the process of writing, I think you’ll agree, she does this a little differently—and it might just be the approach that works for you. Click the play button below, or scroll down for a full transcript. Stuff to check out: The Power of Writing it Down by Allison Fallon Write Your Story by Allison Fallon Indestructible by Allison Fallon Packing Light by Allison Fallon Allison’s Website The Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground Full Transcript: Rob Marsh: As a copywriter or a content writer or someone who is thinking about exploring these career paths, you’ve probably toyed with the idea of writing a book. Maybe you’ve got a great story that absolutely has to be told. Or perhaps you’ve heard that a book is the best business card and can open doors with clients who then hire you to write for them. Or maybe you’ve got a screenplay you work on for a few minutes after your client work is done. More likely… you’ve thought about one or more of those things, but haven’t yet put pen to paper, or fingers to keyboard. I’m always thinking of ideas for books, some of which I have started, others I’ve put away for later. And to help me as I process these ideas, I’ve read several books about writing books… how to do it, what to include, all that stuff. Recently I came across another book about writing books that was very different in its approach. It changed the way I think about writing… books and other things too. Hi, I’m Rob Marsh, and my guest for today’s episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast is author and book writing coach Allison Fallon. You’ll hear me say it in the interview, but Allison’s book, The Power of Writing It Down, felt more like therapy than another book about putting together your book chapters in a particluar order or writing scenes or character development. After reading it, I wanted to talk with Allison about her approach and what it means, particularly for writers who might be writing to a non-fiction audience. I think you’re going to like this interview. Before we jump in with Allion… Last week I mentioned our special free report called How to Find Clients. And I want to share that again because it features more than 20 different things you can do, starting right now, to find your ideal clients. It also shares the 4 mistakes you absolutely can’t afford to make when looking for clients—if you do, you are dead in the water… and it also shows you five things you need to do before you reach out to the people you want to work with IF you want them to say yes. This isn’t some dainty one page PDF you’ll forget about in a day or two… it’s 36 pages jam packed with ideas that either we’ve used in our own businesses or we’ve seen other successful copywriters use to grow theirs. You can get your free report by going to thecopywiterclub.com/findaclient that’s all one word. Thecopywriterclub.com/findaclient. Get your free report now. And with that, let’s go to our interview with Allison… Allie, welcome to The Copywriter Club Podcast. I would love just to start with your story, and I know you’ve got a really great story, but how did you become an author, speaker, founder of Find Your Voice? Allison Fallon: Yeah, I have always wanted to be an author for as long as I can remember. I often tell a story about being in fourth grade, and that was the first time that I really realized that I had a teacher who pointed out a skill I had for storytelling. And I just remember feeling like, oh, I can like something and be good at something and be acknowledged for it. And so that kind of started the spark for wanting to tell stories and in a longer format, like writing a book. I just can, through my high school and college career was always very focused on that I would be a published author someday. And then, you know, when I was in high school and college, I also had a lot of really well-meaning adults in my life who would say, that’s a great thing that you want to be an author, but you also need a backup plan because writers don’t make any money. And so I, at their advice, got a master’s degree in teaching and started teaching in the public school system in Portland, Oregon, where I’m from, and taught for about three years. My plan was to teach and kind of do the writing thing on the side. I thought like, well, I have summers off, right? Like two months off every summer, which is a misnomer. I mean, for any teachers out there, like you’re saints and you really don’t get – you don’t get that much time off in the summer. You’re curriculum planning. You’re, you know, especially as a new teacher, you’re like setting up your classroom. Like there’s so much to think about and do. And you’re probably working a second job on the side because teachers also don’t get paid very well. And so when I realized my plan wasn’t going to work very well, I took this giant leap, which I write about in my first book. My first book is called Packing Light. And I took this big leap out of the teaching profession to do the thing that I had been wanting to do forever, which was to write a book. So I didn’t renew my contract for the following year. And I did kind of like a gimmicky, stunty sort of thing with a friend where we both quit our jobs. We sold all of our physical possessions. We packed our stuff into a Subaru Outback. And we spent almost a year traveling around the United States. We visited, we drove to all 48 states and then in the end flew to Alaska and Hawaii to kind of check those off the list and wrote a book about that called Packing Lights. So that was my first, you know, published, published work. That’s how I became an author. And there’s a lot more that I could say, but I’ll stop there. What questions do you have about that? Rob Marsh: I mean, first of all, hitting all 50 states is an accomplishment in itself. Now I’ve got to go back and listen to that book, because that sounds fantastic. But I’m curious, because as a writer today, what are some of the specific skills from teaching that translate directly into writing? And part of the reason that I ask this is, our audience is copywriters, content writers. There are actually a ton of people who have been teachers who move into writing for all kinds of reasons. And maybe one of the reasons is because, you know, copywriting selling in a huge way is actually teaching. Allison Fallon: It is. Absolutely. Yeah. I mean, capturing an audience’s attention, I will say, you know, as challenging as it can be to capture your audience’s attention in a book, or if you’re a copywriter, like in a sales sequence or something, it’s easier than capturing the attention of seventh and eighth graders. So yeah, so I took some of the skills that I learned in that teaching profession, I suppose, and transferred them to writing. Although, I will say since my teaching stint was short, it was just under three years that I was teaching. I think there’s a lot that I’ve learned as a writer that I could also maybe translate back to the classroom if I ever wanted to. But the biggest thing that I did, when I published Packing Light, And it hit the market, you know, as an author, a first time author, like you don’t have any idea what to expect. And so I went into it very blind. The book did really well. Like it’s sold, I think it’s sold somewhere around 30,000 copies now at this point. So it did well. It made the publisher happy, you know, it bought out my advance, all of those things that you want it to do. And what was shocking for me is that even though it sold really well ...
SummaryTCC Podcast #417: Partners Who Send You Clients with Dana Owens
Oct 15, 202401:04:43Summary readyIn the 417th episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast, I spoke with case study copywriter Dana Owens… and of course we talked in depth about writing case studies. But as we talked, Dana shared her connection secret for getting plenty of leads for the work she wants to do. It’s a great idea that any copywriter can borrow and use to grow their own business. But to get it, you’re going to have to listen. Click the play button below, or scroll down for a full transcript. Stuff to check out: Dana’s Tools for Case Study Writers The Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground Full Transcript: Rob Marsh: One of the client finding ideas I like to talk about is making connections with other service providers. Instead of thinking of other copywriters as the competition, think of them as business associates who can support you in all kinds of ways including by sharing leads. I’ve mentioned more than once that copywriters have shared leads with me that have resulted in more than six figures worth of business over the years. With results like that, of course you should connect with other copywriters and content writers. But there may be an even better group to connect with when it comes to getting clients. It’s just one of the things we cover on this episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast. Hi, I’m Rob Marsh, and my guest for this episode is case study copywriter Dana Owens. We covered a lot of ground in this interview including how Dana kind of stumbled on this perfect partner for leads in her busines. If you write case studies it’s a connection idea you can steal and use today. But if you write any other kind of copy, you can use this idea as well, you’ll just have to figure out who your perfect connection partner is. So stick around to hear more about it. Before we jump in with Dana… It’s been a little while since I’ve mentioned our special report called How to Find Clients that features more than 20 different things you can do, starting right now, to find your ideal clients. It also shares the 4 mistakes you absolutely can’t afford to make when looking for clients—if you do, you are dead in the water… and it also shows you five things you need to do before you reach out to the people you want to work with IF you want them to say yes. This isn’t some dainty one page PDF you’ll forget about in a day or two… it’s 36 pages jam packed with ideas that either we’ve used in our own businesses or we’ve seen other successful copywriters use to grow theirs. You can get your free report by going to thecopywiterclub.com/findaclient that’s all one word. Get your free report now. And with that, let’s go to our interview with Dana… Hey Dana, it is so great to see you. Welcome to The Copywriter Club Podcast. You know how this goes because you’ve been part of The Copywriter Club world for a long time, but let’s start with your story. How did you become a copywriter? Dana Owens: Well, first of all, I’m so excited to be here. I actually learned that copywriting was a real thing from the Copywriter Club podcast. Seven years ago, I remember taking a road trip with my husband. And that was like back in the day where I had to connect his iPad to the car through a USB cord. And I had like 10 episodes of The Copywriter Club Podcast downloaded. And throughout the road trip, we listened to the episodes. And that’s when I realized copywriting could be like a real career and a real business. And that’s when he also learned it. So the fact that I’m talking to you today is just like, I don’t know, a funny, funny, full circle moment. Rob Marsh: So that’s amazing. Dana Owens: Yeah. But I started, um, I got involved in copywriting. Like I wish I would have started so much earlier than I did, but I graduated with a journalism degree and became a journalist for one year. Um, I went to work for a local, I’m from Michigan. So it was like a local small town paper and was the police reporter into the police beat. I was so naive. I mean, I had my trusty journalism degree, but had no idea what I was doing. And it was kind of a bust that first year there. I have a lot of funny stories, but I realized I did not like journalism because basically, especially as a police reporter, all I was doing was reporting on bad news. And so I’m an optimist. I wanted to report on only good news. And I was like, Dana, you are so naive. Like, how are you ever going to get a job just reporting on good news? But what I learned through that job is that I loved interviewing people. So I took that. And then I actually went, I moved to Chicago and I started to work as a creative writer for an advertising company, just a little teeny advertising company. And, um, that’s where I kind of started to figure out that copywriting was actually a thing. Although it took me another, I mean, so several years to actually start to, um, start doing copywriting formally. and start to really turn my attention directly onto writing for sales and marketing. So I got my start indirectly through an entrance through journalism and advertising. But it was really when I had had my kids and was like, I’m looking for just a little something to do on the side that I was contacted by an old boss of mine who really was the one that pulled me into copywriting. And that was, gosh, 10 years ago. It’s only grown and grown and grown since there. Rob Marsh: So what kind of work were you doing in the agency, in the small ad company that you were working for as a writer? What were you writing? Dana Owens: I was primarily, this sounds so boring now, but I was primarily writing like website copy, but really product descriptions for, they were a professional photography company. And so every single thing that I was writing about had to do with some type of professional photography equipment. And that was, again, just so not for me. I’m super creative, and I want to be exploring big ideas and positioning things in a picture-particular way. And it was definitely not a position that I was going to be able to stick with long term, but it really did set the foundation for the work that I do today. But that was it. There was no way I was going to be a pro at professional photography equipment, but I started learning about the sales and marketing world in that way. So it was beneficial. Rob Marsh: Yeah. Especially when we talk about high-end equipment, you know, that you have in the, the, you know, the world of photography, like everything looks the same. Obviously it’s not the same. And so being able to sell one product over another does become a, I mean, that’s a skill and being able to identify how they’re different and who they’re for, I think could be incredibly useful. Dana Owens: Well, it, it, that is a really good point. And also it was so highly technical because the people that the audience that I was writing for, they understood the differences between the brands of all of these different lenses and all of these different light boxes. And they understood the outputs and all of this technical stuff. And so I really had to learn it myself and it was so boring to me at the time, but what it has really translated for me. in, you know, when I started in the areas of copywriting that I was really interested in was how to take technical information or complex information or even jargon from that that was well known, you know, in one industry and how to make it more palatable and understandable to different audiences. So now that you’ve brought me back to those days, like it’s it the connection is very clear that, you know, Having to specialize in an industry like I did for that amount of time, I think it was like four years I worked in that job, it really did start to build that skill of being able to communicate things, communicate complicated ideas and technical ideas in a way that people liked to consume it. So that was helpful. Rob Marsh: Yeah, I had a similar experience early on in my career. I worked for a day planner company, imagine writing about day planners for four years. It’s like, OK, well, this year’s edition of the day planner is blue as opposed to black, or this edition of the day planner has quotes. And yet it’s that repetition actually polishes your ability to connect with an audience and figure out what it is that they need to know about in order to buy. So, yeah, those It feels boring. It feels repetitive, but it...
SummaryTCC Podcast #416: Extending the Runway with Blair Sharp
Oct 8, 202400:59:31Summary readyStarting a business is hard. And having enough runway to get off the ground is a big part of whether you succeed or fail. Content creator and author of the Hey, Freelancer newsletter, Blair Sharp, is our guest for the 416th episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast. Blair shares how she made sure she had enough runway to figure things out when she launched her business. There’s a lot in this episode, including Blair’s story of giving up alcohol. Click the play button below, or scroll down for a full transcript. Stuff to check out: Blair’s website The Copywriter Club Facebook Group The Copywriter Underground Full Transcript: Rob Marsh: This podcast episode is all about what I like call runway. And maybe the best way to explain what I mean by that is a comparrison of your business and an airplane. It takes energy to get an airplane of the ground. The pilot needs to spin up the engines, the aircraft has to accelerate, the wing flaps need to be adjusted to get “lift” so the aircraft rises. And because all of this takes a bit of time… you need a runway to move down while it all comes together. Your business is a lot like that. Most businesses don’t take off like rocketships. They need runway while you figure a few things out and get the momentum to take off. It takes time… so having a long runway can really benefit your business. Hi, I’m Rob Marsh, and on today’s episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast, I’m speaking with content creator, part-time psychometrist and author of the Hey Freelancer newsletter, Blair Sharp. The way Blair has built her business is the perfect example of using a runway and time to figure things out, instead of just leaping into the unknown and hoping for the best. It’s a model that a lot of freelancers could benefit from. So stick around as she lays out how she’s made it work for her. Before we jump in with Blair… Tomorrow, October 9 is the day of our next members-only training on how to create a lead magnet that not only helps you grow your list, but attracts your ideal clients and buyers, not just people looking for a free download. Our guest Kennedy from Email Marketing Heroes will be sharing a totally new way to create lead magnets that create buyers. That’s how he describes it. If you want to build your own list or you want to be hired by clients who need help with emails and lead magnets for their own lists, you need to see this masterclass. And the best way to do that is to join The Underground at thecopywriterclub.com/tcu. As a member you’ll have access to dozens of expert trainings all focused on helping you attract more clients and get stuff done. I promise, you can use these trainings to build your skills and expertise so you can raise your rates and earn the living you deserve from your copywriting or content writing business. So jump in at thecopywriterclub.com/tcu today. And now, let’s go to our interview with Blair… Hey Blair, welcome to the podcast. We want to start out by asking how you became a content writer, actually also a psychometrist, I think is… Yes, you said it correctly. Blair Sharp: Most people don’t know what that is or know how to pronounce it. Rob Marsh: Okay, so psychometrist and you’re the author of the Hey Freelancer newsletter. Yes. And so yeah, let’s dig into that. How did you become all of these things? Blair Sharp: Yeah, right. Well, it’s kind of a long story. And whenever I tell it, I don’t really know, like, where should I start? We’ve got 60 minutes here. So I’ve been a psychometrist, which means I test people’s thinking. So I work at the Mayo Clinic. I’ve been there. I’m in Rochester, Minnesota. I’ve been at that job for just over 10 years. So I just hit my 10-year mark. And I started writing for a local parenting blog, just on a volunteer basis, in 2019. And really enjoyed it, just as a little hobby. I was doing a lot of essays, some things in the community. And it was kind of like a nice other mom. It was like a mom blog, basically. And so I started there. And then I slowly started like, dipping my toe into other kinds of writing and writing for other other places, just kind of one off things. In 2020. Then I decided to also go into Instagram a little bit more outside of my personal Instagram. And I created an alcohol free Instagram account, which is there’s a whole space for every kind of Yeah, content, right? Like online, there’s there’s a space for everybody. So there’s a whole like sober Instagram, a sober section of Instagram, I guess you could say. And so I quit drinking in 2018. That’s kind of like the background of that. But I started wanting to tell my story about that and just have it resonate with other people, because that’s kind of a hard thing to do. So I started doing that. And then that’s what led me into more mental health writing. And I connected with different brands and companies and did some essays and did some topics about alcohol and sobriety and mental health and things like that. So that kind of got me into that lane, I guess. Um, and I’m still working full time. I’m also a mom, so I’m doing all the things. Um, so it was a very slow, like it felt kind of easy now that I’m looking back at it. I think I was a little stressed at the time when I’m doing all these different things. Um, and Instagram was just for fun. You know, it ended up being, I did make a little bit of money, right. With like brands and things like that. Nothing too, too wild, but, um, I wrote an essay, I guess it was an op-ed for Scary Mommy, which is a parenting website about my decision to quit drinking back in 2021, I think is when I wrote that. And that was the first time that I was like, whoa, I could really like, like scared mommy’s a pretty big platform. So I was like, wow, I could really write for these big name brands and things like that. So that was my first like, aha moment, like, maybe I should try this a little bit more, like keep going and learn how to pitch places, learn how to um, how, how to be a writer today, you know? Um, and so I did, I did that again, slowly, just like one off things, um, started making a little bit of money. Told my husband how much money I was making to prove that, Hey, I could maybe like, you know, less than my hours at work. And so I did that again, slowly, um, here and there, um, my supervisor would let me have days off and things like that. And so I eventually wanted to go part-time at my work. And I put in for that. And it took about a year to actually go part-time. In that meantime, I was still kind of dropping my hours and working less. I was still writing and making money off of it. At some point in there, too, I started calling myself a writer. There’s that moment. I’m not formally trained. I have a psych degree, which is very good for writing, actually. And so I then once I dropped part time, which is about a year ago, so I’ve been doing almost a year, a year in October. Yeah. So now I kind of I feel like my day job is now my side gig is kind of what I feel like. You know, I have insurance, of course, like that’s a problem for a lot of, you know, small business owners, independent writers. So I have insurance through there. I have this dependable work. Um, just last week I worked an extra day just because, um, I, a few of my contracts ended recently. So I was like, okay, I’m going to come in tomorrow. And they’re like, all right, we can use you. So it’s really nice to have that backup as, um, Just in those times, just in case. Um, cause I’m not very, I’m not very risky anymore in my, you know, old age. Rob Marsh: Old age. Blair Sharp: I was a little bit more risky, hence the alcohol free story. But now I’m a little bit more risk averse, you know, a family and bills to pay need health insurance, which I could get for my husband too. But, um, you know, it’s just Nice to have that background just in case. Rob Marsh: Yeah. I love the way that you build your story or the way that this developed, because as we said briefly before we started recording, there are a lot of copywriters right now who are looking for something to augment what they’re doing with copywriting. It’s hard to find clients. And AI is a challenge in all of the things. That’s not to say that there aren’t tons of opportunities out there, because there are. But while you’re going after those opportunities, it’s nice to have a stable, you know, either a permanent client or an employer who can help with some of those hours. I like to think o...
SummaryTCC Podcast 3: Optimizing for Conversions with Talia Wolf
Jan 1, 201700:38:49Summary readyIn the third episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast, Kira and Rob interview Talia Wolf, a conversion optimization expert who just launched her first course on emotional targeting. Talia shares her take-aways from the launch as well as her thoughts on sky diving and Harry Potter (of course). There's a little background noise when Talia is speaking, but the advice Talia shares makes it all worthwhile. Take a listen by clicking the play button below, or scroll down for a full transcript. The people and stuff we mentioned on the show: Talia's Website Emotional Targeting Course Talia's post on Copyhackers Joanna Wiebe Angie Schotmuller Peep Laja Oli Gardner Harry Potter Luna Lovegood Talia's Twitter Kira’s website Rob’s website The Copywriter Club Facebook Group Intro: Content (for now) Outro: Gravity Full Transcript: RM: What if you could hang out with really talented copywriters and other experts, ask them about their successes and failures, their work processes and their habits, then steal an idea or two to inspire your own work? That's what Kira and I try to do every week at The Copywriter Club Podcast. KH: You're invited to join the club for episode 3 as we chat with conversion marketing expert Talia Wolf about emotional targeting, conversion optimization, the impact of speaking engagements on her career, and her thoughts about what makes a good copywriter. Hey Rob. Hey Talia. RM: Hey Kira, Talia. TW: Very well. How are you guys? KH: Good. Thanks for joining us here today. Talia, can you just start off by sharing briefly your story of how you got to where you are today, where you just launched a course, which we want to talk about in a little bit, and the path, how you got here? TW: Sure. I've been doing conversion optimization for I think around six years. I'm never really sure because I actually started doing conversion optimization before I really knew that's what I was actually doing. I started my own conversion optimization agency around six years ago. The conversion optimization agency, as an agency we worked with companies all over the world, helping businesses optimize their websites with a methodology that I developed called The Emotional Targeting Methodology, which I'm sure we'll touch on soon. I actually sold it last year, but during that time, while I was doing that, I was also teaching and doing a lot of workshops and speaking all over the world in different conferences, and teaching this methodology, helping companies everywhere. The past year I've basically been running my own conversion optimization consultancy business and training, and I love it. RM: An interesting career path. Lots of different things. Let's sort of cut to the chase with the training that you developed and a lot of the things that you focused on with your career. What is the deal with emotional targeting? TW: Basically what happened is when I started doing conversion optimization first, I was relying on all sorts of hunches, just guessing what I should optimize. I was optimizing based on blog posts and different articles that I found. I didn't really have a process set in mind. The one thing that I did notice is that everyone was paying a lot of attention to behavioral elements, such as geographical location or the age of the customer, or the browser that they were using, a lot of technical parts, but not enough information, not enough emphasis on the actual customer. For me, conversion optimization was a way of meeting and satisfying my customers' expectations and helping them with their challenges, so that they can actually solve their challenges and then I would increase my conversion rate. It's about understanding who my customers are and creating an experience for them. I set on this path to creating a methodology that would help me, A, understand better how to optimize the funnel, how to meet my customers' expectations, and, B, get to know my customers better and of course optim...
Summary