The Creative Penn Podcast For Writers

Episode 846: Writing The Shadow—The Creative Wound, Publishing, And Money

Host: Joanna Penn
Release Date: January 19, 2026

Overview

In this special solo episode, Joanna Penn shares selected chapters from her new audiobook Writing the Shadow: Turn Your Inner Darkness into Words. She explores the deeply personal process of engaging with your inner fears—your "shadow"—and how bringing it to light can transform your writing craft and creative business. Joanna also discusses the shadow sides of traditional and indie publishing, work, and money, alongside her own experiences and advice for fellow writers seeking growth and authenticity.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Facing the Shadow in Writing & Life

• Main Idea: Embracing the darker, hidden aspects of ourselves ("the shadow") is vital for creative transformation and authentic writing.

• Joanna likens the shadow to a neglected "seedling in a basement," something we hide but which also roots deeply into the foundations of who we are.

• Quote:

  “You don't need courage when things are easy. You need it when you know what you face will be difficult, but you do it anyway. We are authors. We know how to do hard things.”
  — Joanna Penn, [23:53]

• Practical Takeaway: Exploring your shadow may be uncomfortable but unlocks richer, more resonant art. Joanna encourages writers: “Delve into shadow. So I hope you will join me on the journey.” [23:44]

2. The Creative Wound and Its Impact

• Main Idea: Early criticism or shaming around creative work (the "creative wound") can have a long-lasting negative influence and often pushes our most authentic ideas into the shadow.

• Joanna shares her own experience: At age 11–12, she wrote a dark story inspired by a nightmare. Her teacher’s response, “You shouldn’t write things like that,” was deeply wounding and taught her to hide her darker creative impulses.

• Quote:

  "It wasn't appropriate…as if the only acceptable writing was the kind she approved of."
  — Joanna Penn, [31:08]

• Insights:

  • Many writers suppress their truest stories after being shamed, but “You cannot hold back the darkness. The night is dark and full of terrors.” (Quoting George R.R. Martin, [36:09])
  • Joanna later faced and embraced this shadow in her fiction, channeling difficult themes into her books.

• Reflection Questions (offered to listeners):

  • What did books and writing mean to you earlier in life?
  • Do you recall comments or experiences that might have become your creative wounds?
  • Have you written your nightmares into your stories?

3. The Shadow in Publishing

A. Traditional Publishing

• Shadow Side: The allure of status, validation, and financial success in traditional publishing can create unrealistic expectations and fail to deliver, leaving many writers disillusioned.
• Data: More than half (54%) of debut authors reported negative mental health effects from the publishing process (The Bookseller, 2023).
• Common Issues: Rejection, low advances, lack of support, disappointing launches, negative reviews, feeling like a commodity, and imposter syndrome.
• Quote:

  “There is a pervasive myth of success… perpetuated by media reporting on brand name and breakout authors, those few outliers whose experience is almost impossible to replicate.”
  — Joanna Penn, [49:08]

B. Indie Self-Publishing

• Shadow Side: The independence and potential of indie publishing come with overwhelm and ego-based comparison.

• Joanna notes, “Most authors, regardless of publishing choices, are a mix of massive ego and chronic self-doubt. We are human so the same issues will reoccur.” [61:39]

• Common Pain Points: Learning curve, burnout, team-building, negative perceptions of self-publishing, jealousy, and internalized doubts over legitimacy and worth.

• Advice: Take responsibility for your career, acknowledge the less-talked-about aspects, and proactively face your shadow to have a more empowering journey.

4. The Shadow in Work

• Main Idea: Our value in society is often tied to productivity. Being unable to work (due to illness or other factors) can make us question our worth.
• After Joanna endured long COVID, she faced the shadow side of equating worth with productivity: “Who am I if I cannot work? What is the point of me?” [67:38]
• Quote:

  “We need to reframe what work is as a society and value humans for different things.”
  — Joanna Penn, [69:33]

5. The Shadow in Money

• Main Idea: Deeply conflicted cultural and personal narratives about money (from “money is bad” to “money equals self-worth”) shape our creative lives and business choices.

• Joanna examines her own upbringing, phases of shame, and eventual financial literacy journey.

• She highlights that in the arts, “Many writers… have issues around money and wealth… You can’t make money with your writing… If you make money writing, you’re a hack… If you spend money on marketing, then your books are clearly not good enough to sell on their own.” [79:40]

• Notable Reflection:

  “Income is not wealth. You can earn lots but have nothing to show for it.”
  — Joanna Penn, [83:13]

• Practical Takeaway: Cultivating positive attitudes and financial education is crucial for a sustainable creative career. She recommends automatic, long-term investing and continuing to learn.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Reason to Create:

  “What if the thing that transforms your writing craft and your author business this year is facing up to your fears and leaning into the things that challenge you?”
  — Joanna Penn, [00:38]

• On Change and Uncertainty:

  “Trust in your own capacity to learn and adapt, rather than trusting that the environment will remain static.”
  — quoting Tony Robbins, [15:34]

• On Beauty in Books and Genre Boundaries:

  “If you love beautiful books in any genre, I think doing these types of campaigns… is so important. The more of us who create beautiful books in any genre, the more popular they will become.”
  — Joanna Penn, [04:46]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [00:24] Episode intro and context—on transformation and the “writing the shadow” project
• [04:10] Book boxes, Kickstarter, and the trend for beautiful books
• [08:28] Updates on AI, advertising, and author business trends
• [14:27] Tony Robbins on certainty, uncertainty, and adaptation
• [22:10] Beginning of Writing the Shadow audiobook sample—What is the shadow?
• [29:30] The Creative Wound—Joanna’s formative story and how shaming shapes creative shadow
• [48:58] The shadow in traditional publishing—expectations versus reality
• [60:19] The shadow in self-publishing—indie author challenges
• [67:38] The shadow in work—worth versus productivity
• [74:56] The shadow in money—cultural narratives, personal stories, and financial literacy
• [92:19] Concluding thoughts and reflection prompts

General Tone & Style

Joanna combines heartfelt vulnerability with actionable, strategic advice. The tone is supportive, honest, and encouraging, often inviting listeners to self-reflect and take responsibility, while assuring them that facing their darkness is a creative superpower, not a liability.

Final Thoughts

Through candid storytelling rooted in her own life and career, Joanna Penn invites writers to confront their shadows as pathways to deeper art and more rewarding author businesses. Whether grappling with creative wounds, publishing disappointment, productivity obsession, or money fears, she encourages digging in bravely and lovingly—assuring listeners, “We are authors. We know how to do hard things.” [23:54]

Next episode preview: Selling Books Live on Social Media with Adam Beswick.

Resources Mentioned:

• Writing the Shadow & special editions: creativepenbooks.com
• Money book recommendations: thecreativepenn.com/moneybooks
• Joanna’s webinars: thecreativepenn.com/live

Contact:

• Email: joanna@thecreativepenn.com
• Social: @thecreativepenn on X, Facebook; @jfpenauthor on Instagram

For more: Full episode, backlist, and show notes at thecreativepenn.com/podcast