SiriusXM Media’s Lizzie Collins on the power of podcasts for influencers

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Current Podcast – Episode featuring Lizzie Collins of SiriusXM Media

Release Date: October 23, 2024
Host: Damian Fowler and Ilyse Liffreing
Guest: Lizzie Collins, SVP of Ad Innovation and B2B Marketing at SiriusXM Media

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Introduction

In this episode of The Current Podcast, hosts Damian Fowler and Ilyse Liffreing engage in an insightful conversation with Lizzie Collins, the Senior Vice President of Ad Innovation and B2B Marketing at SiriusXM Media. Collins brings over 18 years of expertise in audio ad innovation, having been the first salesperson at Pandora back in 2006. Her current role focuses on expanding the largest digital audio ecosystem in North America, encompassing platforms like Pandora, SiriusXM streaming network, and a vast podcast network.

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The Power of Audio Advertising in 2024

Key Insights:

Lizzie Collins emphasizes the profound impact of audio advertising in the current media landscape. She highlights that audio formats command a significant portion of consumers' media consumption time—31-32%—yet marketers allocate less than 10% of their media investments to this format.

Notable Quote:

"Audio has such an important place in the consumer's life... marketers are only allocating somewhere between 8, 9, under 10% of their media investment to this format."
— Lizzie Collins [00:44]

Discussion Points:

• Unique Engagement: Audio advertising reaches audiences in environments where display or video ads are ineffective, engaging listeners through the "theater of the mind."
• Cognitive Impact: The reliance on imagination when consuming audio content leads to a deeper cognitive connection with the message.

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Growth of Programmatic Advertising in Podcasting

Key Insights:

Podcasting stands out as one of the fastest-growing digital channels. Collins discusses how SiriusXM and Pandora have leveraged programmatic advertising to scale and modernize podcast ad buying.

Notable Quote:

"Podcasting is not necessarily new, but the ability for advertisers to buy it at scale with maybe an audience-based buying strategy... has really been putting in place for the last two years."
— Lizzie Collins [02:13]

Discussion Points:

• Adswizz Platform: SiriusXM Media utilizes the Adswizz platform, facilitating audio ad delivery, serving, and tracking.
• Dynamic Ad Insertion: Enables precise targeting and audience onboarding, moving away from cumbersome show-by-show purchasing.
• Integrative Technology: Combining audio-first technology with programmatic transactions to enhance scalability and efficiency.

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Advantages of Programmatic Ad Buying on Audio Networks

Key Insights:

Programmatic advertising on audio networks offers reduced friction in the buying process, allowing for seamless transactions and advanced audience targeting.

Notable Quote:

"We're open ecosystem, so we will work with any third-party measurement vendor... allowing our clients to address their customers in this format in the most effortless way possible."
— Lizzie Collins [03:59]

Discussion Points:

• Effortless Transactions: Streamlined buying processes comparable to digital advertising standards.
• Flexibility: Compatibility with various measurement and targeting partners, including Comscore and The Trade Desk.
• Audience-Based Buying: Enhanced ability to reach specific demographics and interests without the constraints of traditional methods.

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Balancing Brand Building and Performance in Audio Ads

Key Insights:

Audio advertising is evolving beyond traditional brand-building roles to incorporate performance-driven campaigns, mirroring trends seen in connected TV (CTV).

Notable Quote:

"It's pretty effortless to build an audio ad... you can go from brief to a spec spot, 30 minutes or less if we're talking about AI-produced creative."
— Lizzie Collins [06:59]

Discussion Points:

• Creative Flexibility: Ability to adapt video-first creative strategies to audio formats, enhancing cross-device campaign effectiveness.
• Customized Solutions: SiriusXM’s in-house agency, Resonate, assists clients in translating their video messages into compelling audio content tailored to diverse campaign objectives.
• Targeted Campaigns: Options for mass reach, geo-targeting, and product-specific promotions based on campaign needs and budget considerations.

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Crafting Effective Audio Briefs

Key Insights:

Creating a successful audio advertising campaign begins with a well-constructed brief that considers the target audience and contextual placement of ads.

Notable Quote:

"Understanding the customer and letting us really help you determine contextually where they're showing up... is crucial."
— Lizzie Collins [06:59]

Discussion Points:

• Audience Insight: Leveraging data to define target demographics, such as women over-indexing in true crime podcasts.
• Contextual Relevance: Aligning ad content with the nature of the podcast, whether it’s true crime, sports, or comedy, to resonate effectively with listeners.
• Creative Testing: Utilizing A/B testing and third-party tools to refine and optimize audio creatives for maximum impact.

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Diverse Podcast Genres and Their Impact on Advertising

Key Insights:

SiriusXM’s expansive podcast network includes over 2,500 shows spanning various genres, each attracting unique audiences that offer distinct advertising opportunities.

Notable Quotes:

"We have the most shows in the top 50, but we also have great shows, middle and Long Tail."
— Lizzie Collins [09:24]

"True crime is problem-solving. It's like really detailed, trying to get to the bottom of what happened with the story."
— Lizzie Collins [10:15]

Discussion Points:

• Genre Popularity: High demand in genres like true crime, comedy, sports (particularly women's sports), and pop culture.
• Audience Engagement: Niche genres foster highly engaged and loyal listener bases, enhancing ad retention and effectiveness.
• Custom Targeting: Ability to target specific listener segments based on genre preferences, such as women interested in true crime narratives.

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Influencers and the Synergy with Podcast Advertising

Key Insights:

Podcasts offer a unique platform for influencers to deepen their connection with audiences, providing advertisers with authentic endorsement opportunities.

Notable Quote:

"They can riff about why they like the product, they can go deeper into the benefits of it... it's a super powerful way for advertisers to drive their KPIs."
— Lizzie Collins [13:27]

Discussion Points:

• Deep Storytelling: Influencers can provide comprehensive reviews and personal endorsements beyond the limitations of social media snippets.
• Audience Trust: Podcast listeners often have a higher level of trust in their favorite hosts, translating to more effective advertising.
• Omnichannel Potential: Integrating podcast ads within broader marketing strategies to enhance reach and consistency across platforms.

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The Role of AI in Audio Advertising

Key Insights:

Artificial Intelligence (AI) is revolutionizing audio advertising by streamlining the creative process and enabling self-service options for smaller brands.

Notable Quote:

"We're leveraging AI to self-service the creative process... allowing someone that might be stuck because they don't have the resources, how can we help them scale."
— Lizzie Collins [15:05]

Discussion Points:

• Creative Automation: AI facilitates the rapid creation of audio ads, reducing production time from brief to finished spot.
• Accessibility: Empowering smaller agencies and businesses to produce high-quality audio ads without extensive resources.
• Data Processing: AI enhances data analysis capabilities, improving targeting accuracy and campaign performance without replacing human creativity.

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Adoption of Audio Advertising Across Different Sectors

Key Insights:

Audio advertising has transcended initial adopter sectors like entertainment and consumer packaged goods (CPG), now finding relevance across diverse industries.

Notable Quote:

"There's no one vertical. I think just overwhelmingly it's just an underspent problem."
— Lizzie Collins [16:37]

Discussion Points:

• Broad Appeal: From healthcare to automotive, various industries recognize the untapped potential of audio advertising.
• Underspent Opportunity: Many sectors have yet to fully allocate budgets to audio, representing a significant growth area.
• Consumer Behavior Alignment: Audio advertising aligns with modern consumer habits, making it an attractive option for a wide range of brands.

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Educating Marketers on Audio Advertising and Measurement

Key Insights:

Despite its potential, audio advertising remains underutilized due to a lack of understanding around measurement and integration into existing marketing strategies.

Notable Quote:

"Most of that education is in and around measurement... how do we work together to make sure you're understanding where you're delivering impressions against what customers and how ultimately that's driving your KPIs."
— Lizzie Collins [17:20]

Discussion Points:

• Measurement Challenges: Audio ads don't generate click signals, necessitating alternative attribution models such as last-click or mixed-media approaches.
• Data Integration: Utilizing impression-level data and clean rooms to track conversions and effectiveness accurately.
• Value Communication: Educating marketers on how to incorporate audio into their measurement frameworks to avoid undervaluing its impact.

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Conclusion

Lizzie Collins articulates a compelling case for the expanded use of audio advertising, underscored by technological advancements in programmatic buying, AI-driven creative processes, and comprehensive measurement strategies. SiriusXM Media continues to lead in this space by providing flexible, scalable solutions that cater to diverse marketing needs. As audio consumption grows, so does the opportunity for advertisers to engage audiences in meaningful and impactful ways.

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Notable Quotes Recap:

1. On Audio's Investment Gap:

   "Audio has such an important place in the consumer's life... marketers are only allocating somewhere between 8, 9, under 10% of their media investment to this format."
   — Lizzie Collins [00:44]

2. On Scaling Podcast Ads:

   "Podcasting is not necessarily new, but the ability for advertisers to buy it at scale with maybe an audience-based buying strategy... has really been putting in place for the last two years."
   — Lizzie Collins [02:13]

3. On Creative Flexibility:

   "It's pretty effortless to build an audio ad... you can go from brief to a spec spot, 30 minutes or less if we're talking about AI-produced creative."
   — Lizzie Collins [06:59]

4. On AI Enhancements:

   "We're leveraging AI to self-service the creative process... allowing someone that might be stuck because they don't have the resources, how can we help them scale."
   — Lizzie Collins [15:05]

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This comprehensive summary captures the essence of Lizzie Collins' discussion on the transformative power of audio advertising, the advancements in programmatic buying, the importance of creative and measurement strategies, and the emerging role of AI in scaling audio ad production. For marketers and advertisers seeking to harness the full potential of audio, this episode offers valuable insights and actionable strategies.

Transcript

[A]

Damien.

[B]

I'm Damien Fowler.

[C]

And I'm ILI Slifring.

[B]

And welcome to this edition of the Current Podcast.

[C]

This week we're delighted to talk with Lizzie Collins, the SVP of Ad Innovation and B2B Marketing at Sirius XM Media, the advertising arm of SiriusXM, which includes Pandora, the SiriusXM streaming network, as well as the podcast network.

[B]

There are likely very few people who know more about audio ad innovation than Lizzy, who is actually the the very first salesperson at Pandora back in 2006.

[C]

As a leader at Sirius XM Media. Her focus is growing the largest digital audio ecosystem in North America.

[B]

So without further ado, we'll start by asking Lizzy about what advertisers need to know about the audio ad opportunity in 2024.

[C]

So, Lizzie, tell us, what is it that advertisers need to know about the opportunity to reach people on audio? Chann?

[A]

Yeah, and thanks for having me. I love what you said about I know everything about audio, but it's been quite a ride from 2006 until now. And I'd say that in this current moment in time, audio has such an important place in the consumer's life. 31, 32. Whichever number you want to get hooked to. Percent of time spent with media is the audio format. And yet marketers are only allocating somewhere between 8, 9, under 10% of their media investment to this format. So first and foremost, I want advertisers to know just the power of audio. It is an opportunity to reach customers in places where you can't reach them via display or video. It has the power to turn on their brain in a unique way because you have the theater of the mind that has to like, fill in the pictures and the faces. And so cognitively, it's just such a powerful way to message. And so when you match the power of the format with, oh my gosh, there's all this incremental time that I'm not messaging to them. We just think there's a real opportunity in audio in general.

[C]

So looking at podcasting at least, podcasting is one of the fastest growing digital channels. How have you been able to grow programmatic at Sirius XM and Pandora?

[A]

Well, podcasting I think we all love. We're here on a podcast. So this is very meta talking about podcasting on a podcast. So I love that. I want to point that out for the listeners. Podcasting is not necessarily new, but the ability for advertisers to buy it at scale with maybe an audience based buying strategy with all of the Tracking, tracking and targeting that they're used to in digital is what we've really foundationally been putting in place for the last two years. So what many don't know is that Sirius XM Media, Pandora, SoundCloud and all of our other partnerships operate on the Adswizz platform. And we are an audio first technology company. We built all of our own audio ad delivery, ad serving, tracking and whatnot. The opportunity to modernize the podcast space is what's really been the key factor for us to drive revenue in that space. And then specific to Programmatic without those pipes, right, without that ability to do dynamic ad insertion to target audiences, to onboard data and then digitally deliver those ads, you were going to have buyers doing what they were doing historically, one show at a time. I can't tell you the stories, the horror stories of going into the clients and saying, here's our spreadsheet where we're tracking the podcasts we think we should be buying based on Joe Podcast guy in the corner who just happens to know the most about podcasts. So the first step was putting that foundational ad tech in place. And the second step has been taking all of what advertisers appreciate in terms of programmatic transaction and bringing it to podcasting. And that's where IAB and others are referencing this significant growth because it's this bringing the best of two worlds together into this medium.

[C]

What would you say are the advantages to programmatic ad buying on audio networks? How is it? Audience first?

[A]

Well, I think overall you're seeing a big trend in advertisers, brands even within the client agencies, publishers wanting to reduce friction on the buy side and the transaction as a whole. So programmatic obviously has been that promise for, gosh, over a decade now, right, to create just an effortless buying transaction. And so when we think about audio more specifically and audience based buying, like we have to be able to connect all of those pipes and be able to not be this hard to buy product. And so we've, you know, I spoke to that in my last example. That's been so much of the work we've done the last two years. And then because of all of that, we're a little different than some other audio partners. We're open ecosystem, so we will work with any third party measurement vendor transaction partners like the trade desk, targeting partners like Comscore. And advertisers obviously have their own data and their own ways in which they want to measure. And so that's also been, you know, a huge breakthrough for us in terms of allowing you said audience based buying. I mean just allowing our clients to address their customers in this format in the most effortless way possible.

[B]

One of the things that's interesting about audio is how it's different from tv which has traditionally been a big brand building medium. Of course that's changing too because of ctv. But I'm interested to hear your thoughts on how Pandora thinks about its ad offerings in terms of the balance between big brand campaigns and performance.

[A]

Yeah, you know, it's interesting. I think what's hidden in this question is creative in general and trying to help brands understand the power of what audio creative can do. It can effortlessly travel cross device. Right. It can reach customers where they're not seeing a video ad or they're not seeing a display ad. It can get right literally into their ears. And I talked about the power of that. And so we, I would say do talk to our customers about different products drive different results. Of course you might want mass reach and super efficient for some effort that you're trying to push. Maybe top of funnel or you need something super geo targeted. You want to move specific product off a store shelf. Yeah, that can impact targeting and that can impact some of what we sell you based on price. But we spend a lot more time through our in house agency studio Resonate, helping to educate our customers on the right way to bring the video message into the audio format. If they're a video first creative agency and that starts with an audio brief, you'd be surprised how many agencies do a creative brief and it doesn't include audio as a way to interpret the brand or determine the call to action. And so once we get going in that direction, then we can take all aspects of their KPIs and build custom creative to meet the needs of, you know, whatever they're trying to get the consumer to do.

[B]

I love that. Can I ask a follow up question about that? What, what would you say are some of the salient points about building a good audio brief?

[A]

Well, first and foremost, understanding the customer and letting us really help you determine contextually where they're showing up. So women, for example, our podcast network is the largest podcast network for women in the United States. We beat everyone else and it's that type of insight and then the creators that are within our podcast network to say, look, Ashley Flowers is here. She's a massive star in the podcast world. She really has a tempo to her shows. It's true crime. These listeners are so leaned in that you don't need a music bed, you don't need to scream at the listener in that example, which might be more of a sort of traditional upbeat 15 second audio spot that might live in a music station. And so a lot of it is trying to understand the customer, then what is the context in which we're targeting. And then of course we have a million best practices about testing creative and we use a lot of third parties to come in and actually pre test creative. Of course, we have all of our own technology, which I mentioned. So will AB test creative. And again, what I love about audio is that it's pretty effortless to build an audio ad. I mean, you can go from brief to a spec spot, 30 minutes or less if we're talking about AI produced creative, which we can talk about too. And so to be able to have all that optionality for an agency to play with actually helps inform a lot of landing the brief. And then of course we have something to live with throughout a campaign to reach back to.

[B]

So it's getting a lot more nuanced. Now you mentioned creativity and that's very interesting.

[A]

It's getting more nuanced because look, you said I was the first salesperson at Pandora and I was. And we were only ever inserting a 15 or a 30 second spot in between your favorite song. Now we're talking about spoken word content, podcast, it could be sports, it could be country music you're talking about. And then in car, at home, mobile. So the good news is all of that signal capture we do on our end, that we can understand where ultimately this ad's running and then that informs how many creative options you need. But it's not like video, where that would take months to do. Right. This is copy to ad is quick.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

When it comes to being more nuanced, looking at podcasts, for instance, there's so many different types of podcasts. Like True Crime you brought up. I like those ones as well. Like Crime Junkie, for instance. What kind of audiences are they attracting and what does that mean for advertisers?

[A]

So the Sirius XM Podcast Network is over 2,500 shows. So you're talking about. We have the most shows in the top 50, but we also have great shows, middle and Long Tail. And so it's as diverse as everybody's tastes. I mean, everything from Vibe Check, which is three African American, gay, really outspoken guys that do the latest on news interpreted from their eyes and their ears. All the way into Crime Junkie, all the way into sports. We have shows about car racing. Right. So that's what's so special about podcasting, but what's unique about Sirius XM and our specific network is that you don't have to come in and buy one show at a time. You can come in and say, I want women over index in true crime. So that's gonna be a nice part of your buy. And that's something unique to what we offer.

[C]

Surprising to me. Women, true crime, for some reason, I know.

[A]

You know what? I think it's because so many women want to escape their day for a moment. All of our beloved housewives at home like commuting kids around, and it's very cerebral. What's really cool about true crime that I don't think a lot of people understand if you don't listen is it's problem solving. It's like really detailed, trying to get to the bottom of what happened with the story. And I think it turns the brain on in a way that is invigorating.

[C]

Yeah. On that note, is true crime like one of the most popular or what are some of those popular genres?

[A]

Oh, there's so many. Comedy is very popular. Team Coco with Conan O'Brien is within our network. Smart list is a really popular sort of mixed in with almost pop culture and comedy. Sports is growing fast and specifically women's sports, which is great. And what I think is fun about that is there's so much story to tell behind the scenes in sports, and I think podcasts can do that in a way that linear TV can't. News true crime, like we mentioned. And yeah, those would be like my tops.

[C]

Very cool. Why do you think women's sports is growing?

[A]

So I just think there's so much of a story to tell about a lot of the women athletes. And it's all over the news. Right. What's happening in women's basketball? Women's soccer is now a professional sport where you can make a career at it. I think there's just so much growth in terms of audiences leaning in and there's a bunch of commercial opportunity there. And so women want to tell. Women want to tell their story.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And you can do that in podcasting in a way you cannot do in other media types. That's why we're here.

[B]

Exactly, yeah. Now, according to your research with Edison, 66% of Gen Z podcast listeners say they listen to or watch podcasts to stay up to date with the latest topics. But only 17% say they trust the info they read on social media. Our podcast hosts, the new, more trusted social media influencers.

[A]

I mean, yes. Short answer Is, yes, but I don't think it's just podcasts. I think any influencer out there that is very invested in their craft and their trade and having a commercial opportunity and being an influencer understands the power of how podcasting and audio more specifically helps them reach their audience. So Ashley Flowers is a great example. She's on social all the time. Whether she's talking about fashion or her famous lip color or what shows are coming up next, different cases that she's researching. And so often see her listeners kind of go back and forth on social and that ultimately informs her show. And so this ecosystem connection is what these influencers are after. And I think the power of the podcast format is they can just tell deeper stories and therefore tell deeper, you know, wide buys for the products that are integrated. So some are probably more comfortable than others, but the audio influencer and the other thing to add is just like they're connected to their audience in a way off social media and into the podcast where they can just use more words, they can just describe something beyond the snippet based format that is social for all of us.

[B]

And why is that effective for advertisers? Why is that helpful?

[A]

I just think they can riff. It's just, it's again, outside of the 15 or 30 second window. They can riff about why they like the product, they can go deeper into the benefits of it or what is cool about it to them. So personal endorsement, I mean, that's what they're able to do in that space. And it's a super powerful way for advertisers to drive their KPIs.

[B]

You know, when it comes to that omnichannel experience, and you mentioned that you're part of this open network, it's good for advertisers to be able to reach their audience on the podcast, but beyond that, it can obviously drive an omnichannel campaign.

[A]

Yeah, and I'm glad you brought that up. We were so curious about what is the true incrementality of a podcast listener. And so for the last year we've been analyzing campaigns. We actually analyzed over 2000 campaigns to determine when we add podcasting to a streaming plan, how much more incremental reach. And it depends on the campaign, but the mean was 32% incremental audience was captured in the podcasting line, essentially being added to the order. And so without that, those customers would have never been messaged. And I think that's just a really good example of the power of what SiriusXM Media brings to bear Even in the audio space, we have such a multi channel opportunity for our marketers.

[C]

So I saw an interview with you last year talking about how advertisers can use AI to save costs. And that seems like a very common refrain in the industry right now because things have moved very fast on the AI front. How are you thinking about AI in 2024 this year?

[A]

Yeah, you know, there's a lot around AI, a lot of buzz and how does it ultimately land for each of us to make our lives easier or to augment what we're already doing? And one of the things that we see with smaller brands and smaller buys is that sometimes they feel like there's a barrier of entry if they don't have audio creative. And so we've done a lot of testing to leverage AI to be able to like self service the creative process. And so that's where we're leveraging AI, which is just to take a company that might be in media agency that's of one person, right, that kind of like kitchen counter digital marketer that might have a couple of clients, maybe they have a couple of car dealers or maybe they have a couple of doctor's offices. And so we have a really great product that they can use in our Audio Go, which is our self serve buying tool to just come in and quickly make an audio ad and they're off to the races. And so that's where we've tried to bring it forth is just where can we make someone that might be stuck because they don't have the resources, how can we help them scale? And so AI helps us do that. I think there's also a future of where we'll see AI show up and how we're just crunching numbers for our clients and how we're processing data. It's just about speed and scale. It's not going to replace our creators. There's no AI Conan coming anytime soon.

[C]

Is there a particular sector of brand that have been more friendly towards audio ads or have approached audio more enthusiastically than others?

[A]

No, it's at this point, gosh, I'm 18 and a half years into this selling audio business and I would say years ago, yes, it would be entertainment really understood the power of it. And maybe someone like CPG was like, ah, if I don't show the girl shampooing her hair, how's anyone going to understand how this product works? But we're so past that. There's no one vertical. I think just overwhelmingly it's just an underspent problem. And that audio and the consumer behavior and audio is outpaced the marketer's investment. So that's just a most of what we spend time helping them to understand.

[B]

Do you still think, given the big opportunity that audio represents, there's a lot more education to be done for marketers? And what does that look like?

[A]

Yeah, absolutely. And I think most of that education is in and around measurement. So audio is everything we've talked about on the show, all the reasons it's powerful, but it doesn't throw off a click signal. And most of what marketers have lived with in digital ecosystem for many years, decades, is last click attribution. Not to say that everyone's doing that now. Many of our customers are going to more of a mixed media model. And so it's just helping them to figure out where do you put audio in your measurement plan? How do we work together to make sure you're understanding where you're delivering impressions against what customers and how ultimately that's driving your KPIs. But it requires a conversation and education because they're not inherently, if they're not buying it, they don't know how to measure it. And they could be undervaluing it or giving value to a different partner because they weren't capturing the right data signal.

[C]

Yeah, how do you guys measure it?

[A]

So it depends on what they're looking for. Of course, there's many amazing third parties out there that we're integrated with to measure everything from stork traffic to attitudinal intent. But again, back to the fact that we own all of our own ad tech. We sit on the right data in a very privacy, safe place to be able to work with clean rooms or work with advertisers directly or partners to share impression level data or whatever is the right signal in order for them to recognize if that customer converted. So it's not rocket science. All of us that are in this space understand how it works. But because we sit on all of our own ad tech and we're open to working with anyone, we personalize it for whatever the customer wants.

[B]

And that's it for this edition of the Current Podcast. We'll be back next week, so stay tuned.

[C]

The current podcast theme is by Love and Caliber. The current team includes Cat Fessy and Sydney Cairns.

[A]

And remember, I want advertisers to know just the power of audio because you have the theater of the mind that has to like fill in the pictures and the faces. And so cognitively, it's just such a powerful way to message I'm Damian.

[C]

And I'm Ilise.

[B]

And we'll see you next time. And if you like what you hear, please subscribe and leave us a review. Also, tune into our other podcast, the Current Report.