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- [00:00]
Christy
Hi, this is Christy from Back to the Bar. You've probably heard about GLP1 weight loss medications and the side effects that can come with jumping in too fast. That's why I love Noom. Makes getting started easy. Their microdose GLP1 program begins with a smaller dose and gradually scales up based on how your body reacts. The Noom GLP1 microdose program starts at $99 and is delivered to your door in seven days. Start your microdose GLP1 journey today at noom.com that's n o o m dot com Noom micro changes big results. Average weight lost eight pounds in first month. Meds and personalization based on clinical need and not available to all individuals. Medications are not reviewed by FDA for safety, efficacy or quality. Pricing based on first month only. Mom I saw Dylan's dad make dinner like actually cook and it was straight fire. He said it was Blue Apron assemble and Bake. All the ingredients showed up pre chopped and he just laid it out on a baking sheet and no cap. Dinner was on the table like 25 minutes. Apparently it's chef designed and it has like over 40 grams of protein. That's a lot, right? So maybe we try it. Just saying. You can be the next Dylan's dad. Blue Apron get $50 off your first two orders plus free shipping with code STIR50. Terms and conditions apply. Visit blue apron.com terms for more Amazon.
- [01:17]
Michael Wolff
One Medical presents Painful Thoughts do they ever actually clean the ball pit at these kids play gyms? Or is my kid just swimming in a vat of bacteria catching whatever cootie of the day is breeding in there? A cootie that'll probably take down our whole family.
- [01:36]
Commercial Announcer
Luckily, with Amazon One Medical 24. 7 Virtual Care, you can get checked out for whatever ball pittitis you've contracted. Amazon One Medical Healthcare just got less painful.
- [01:49]
Michael Wolff
Venezuela is a perfect example of this. He wants to create conflict, which puts him at the center of attention, which distracts from other issues, which means people are wholly focused on this conflict. Conflict. But he doesn't want the conflict to actually create danger. But then if you contrast that to yesterday, the Russians fired a missile with nuclear capabilities. Now this is an existential situation in the world that Donald Trump may well have to address. What happens? It's unimaginable how Donald Trump would respond to this.
- [02:31]
Podcast Host
Michael Joanna, I'm already exhausted. We've only been back one week. I can't keep on top of it.
- [02:39]
Michael Wolff
No. Kind of. It really is extraordinary. I mean I'm completely. I mean I was. I was insane looking at this stuff out of. Out of Iran this morning, and I was thinking, what a relief. Something that does not involve Donald Trump, although I'm sure he's thinking, how can I become the center of what's going on?
- [03:08]
Podcast Host
Well, how can he claim credit for it? Right.
- [03:10]
Michael Wolff
Or claim credit. Yes, absolutely. But meanwhile, he can't. And it is happening independently from Donald Trump, which is quite a relief.
- [03:21]
Podcast Host
And also fantastically brave and sort of very exciting, actually, in a way. I mean, you see people ripping up pictures of the Ayatollah to light their cigarettes, and you think, gosh, this is so brave. And the women in particular, marching without headscarves. Very moving to watch it, and I hope it ends well.
- [03:37]
Michael Wolff
This is just coincidentally, really not related to this at all. I just have. I picked up a couple of weeks ago this current book about Iran, actually Iran in the Revolution, 1979, called the King of Kings. And it's fantastic. And it is one of those things, you know, there's that wholethat old Hollywood expression, nobody knows anything.
- [04:05]
Podcast Host
Yeah, yeah. What's his name? William Goldman.
- [04:08]
Michael Wolff
Yeah. The beginning of his memo to virtually everything, and especially in 1979 when the revolution happened, which nobody foresaw, especially the United States State Department, and then the takeover of the US Embassy, which nobody foresaw. Again, that lesson. And that lesson applies to so much of what is going on. And we can go to the New York Times sitting in the Oval Office, which also had that sense of nobody knows anything at all. It all just happens by some set of principles unclear to virtually everyone.
- [04:59]
Podcast Host
Well, and the assumption is that somehow, somewhere out there, there is somebody who knows. And that's. I love that phrase. It comes from the first line of William Goldman's memoir. And it's so good. And I always try and remember it when I'm in a situation where I feel like everybody else is the smartest person in the room and I'm, as usual, the least smart person in the room, because people pretend to know things, and it's not helpful. And it's certainly not helpful in the times we'rein. The times we're living in now.
- [05:32]
Michael Wolff
Yeah. No, and actually, you know, Donald Trump, I think he. Many of the. He is actually responding to this and taking advantage of the fact that nobody knows anything. So he can go in, we do this Venezuela thing, and that's. And suddenly, I mean, literally nobody knows what to think about this. Nobody knows what he's doing because actually he's not doing anything. And it is the thing he gets to fool everyone. I mean, and let's go this, we have invaded Venezuela. He has announced we are taking over the country. We are essentially reverse nationalizing their oil industry. None of that is going to happen. We are not taking over the country. We are leaving the country. Absolutely. As is. We are not taking their oil. We have all these oil guys coming, coming to Washington, Command performance. They've, they've there and they're going to, you know, they're going to look at.
- [06:34]
Podcast Host
Their shoes like, well, can you imagine being one of the CEOs of the big oil and gas companies and having to sit opposite Trump and nod, you know, seemingly enthusiastically as he explains how he needs you to invest billions of dollars in venezue to ship out some oil in a country which is clearly going to be unstable. And we heard when one of the New York Times reporters asked Donald Trump how long he was going to be in Venezuela for and he was like, I don't know, years.
- [07:03]
Michael Wolff
Years because he's going to be there years because he's not ever going to be there.
- [07:07]
Podcast Host
Right.
- [07:09]
Michael Wolff
So, and then, and then the oil, there's this other oil things which must be perplexing to virtually everyone in the oil industry. Is that his desire, wish, hope, plan is to get oil down to $50 a barrel. This is again, it's like, what, that's, what is that about? First thing, nobody, no oil company is going to invest anything at $50 a barrel. Plus, it's this other thing that he first, it's not going to go to $50 a barrel. It is just going, he is just saying, saying, you know, this is to voters, we're going to bring oil down. This is, you're going to see this at the gas pump. Everything is going to be great instead of actually, if that happened, everything would be kind of a catastrophe, but it doesn't matter. And also, I am taking over the economy. That's this other thing. I am going to run the American economy, which I am not going to do, but I'm going to say I.
- [08:11]
Podcast Host
Am going to do well, his grandiosity and his, the fact that he appears to be the only thing he thinks about came out. I'm only halfway through the, the New York Times, the daily podcast with the wonderful Michael Barbara.
- [08:27]
Michael Wolff
But, and then just, and I think it's good you pointed out to me as we were just, just coming on, that the Times reporters got there at five o' clock and they left at nine o'.
- [08:38]
Podcast Host
Clock.
- [08:39]
Michael Wolff
So four hours, Four hours of listening to him.
- [08:44]
Commercial Announcer
No, no.
- [08:44]
Michael Wolff
And that's been my, my own experience is when this happens, when he lets you into his presence, he doesn't let you go. I mean, you are a captive audience just listening to him, and he goes this way and he goes that way. It's unplanned, it's unscripted, it's, it's revealing in, in, in its own way. Although nothing that he says is necessarilyis necessarily true or related to reality. So you don't really know what it's revealing of, except a person who has a desperate, desperate need to talk.
- [09:25]
Podcast Host
Well, and also, he's just sort of spinning a narrative that has no, I mean, you know, hour 2 may have nothing to do with what he said in hour one. Hour four may have nothing to do with what he said in hour three. I mean, it's just, it's sort of words coming out that in theory make sense, but don't really make sense. We have Anthony Scaramucci on Sunday, the Daily Beast podcast that he came in and we were in the studio yesterday, and he was remembering something that you have talked about often, which is what it's like to be on Trump's rota of calls when he calls you late at night and he's already talking and you hang up and he's still talking, and he's probably dialed the next person and he's just talking, and people come in and out of the phone call. It was just sort of hilarious. And you could see the panic across.
- [10:19]
Michael Wolff
It's this very interesting thing when you're on the phone, when the President of the United States calls you up, you're on the phone with the President of the United States, and you assume it's just something that clicks in into you. Is that. Is that this is an incredibly busy man and he is going to get off the phone with you as soon as he says what he's going to say. Not true. In the end, you're kind of prompting him to get off the phone because the world is, you know, the world may need something, and he doesn't. It just opens up another thing. And I can't tell you how many occasions this has happened. And Trump's voice is, you know, I mean, how can you resist? You just put it on the speakerphone and everybody in the house is, well.
- [11:11]
Podcast Host
And you're part of a live recording, right? The whole thing is like live entertainment. What are your best lines for getting someone off the phone when they call? And you're. I always try and say something like, goodness, well, you must be very Busy. I can't take up too much more of your time. But do you have lines to get rid of people? I'm trying to think of what you do. If I ring up and I want to talk to you and you're in a hurry, I think you just say, I can't talk to you.
- [11:35]
Michael Wolff
It's very hard if you have a determined person. The most determined person that I know is a well known Hollywood screenwriter and director now somewhat past his prime. And he calls and this happens often. And now I have to say I can give you 30 minutes. 30 minutes. You have to, at the outset of the call, 30 minutes, that's it. Because otherwise it will go on indefinitely.
- [12:09]
Podcast Host
Well, it's always difficult when there's a power differential too. Right. Because when you, when it's the President of the United States, the leader of the free world, you would expect him to have more interesting things to do.
- [12:20]
Michael Wolff
No, completely. It's just kind of complete. I mean, you feel you're in some other. You've entered into some other universe in which there is only you and the President of the United States, which leads to kind of a little bit of a sense of panic.
- [12:36]
Podcast Host
Well, panic and perhaps power and flattery. I mean, one of the interesting things Antony was talking about was how you get this Potomac fever of being close to power, but you don't recognize it in yourself. And it was just a curious conversation. Anyway, I'm directing people to it on Sunday.
- [12:58]
Michael Wolff
Everybody's relationship with the president of the United with Donald Trump is odd. And everybody knows it's odd and everybody is bewildered by it. And everybody thinks that somebody else knows what's going on. We can come back to this. But nobody, nobody knows.
- [13:18]
Podcast Host
Nobody knows. Well, another man who didn't know and who called in the middle of the New York Times interview with the president of Colombia, who had been trying apparently to get hold of Donald Trump for some time now, heard that he was next on the threat list and called. And amazingly, Trump decided to take the call, summoned in little Marco and JD Vance, who suddenly back onback on our radar, JD Vance having been absent for some time.
- [13:46]
Michael Wolff
Well, but I think we have to challenge this a second.
- [13:49]
Podcast Host
Do you think it was all performative?
- [13:51]
Michael Wolff
I would assume that was a setup. Matter of fact, I'll guarantee you that was. That was Amy.
- [13:58]
Podcast Host
Well, also suspiciously, the Times said that they'd had their reporters in with the president of Colombia just before he'd called Donald Trump. So it was a good setup for them, too, because it made it look like they werethey were everywhere all the time, and they certainly had four reporters sitting around the president. But you think it was a setup?
- [14:20]
Michael Wolff
Absolutely.
- [14:20]
Podcast Host
Okay, well, he's now coming to. He's coming to D.C. i think, next week. He sounded, he sounded very excited in the subsequent videos I saw of him. Not on the call with Trump, but.
- [14:32]
Michael Wolff
I'm just trying to think of how you respond to that. First thing, you're suddenly put into the headlights and you're suddenly the center of everything. And. And so you have to think, oh, my God, the world is going to cave in on me, or this is an incredible opportunity. I'm the center of the world. I am adjacent to the guy who is at the center of the world. And what do I have to do? I mean, I suppose it must be sort of evident to everyone. The world leader community must know that there is a. There is. They. Maybe they have a. They have a little.
- [15:23]
Podcast Host
Well, even a little.
- [15:24]
Michael Wolff
A little chat group. And they just say all you have to do is flatter Donald Trump. There's nothing, nothing else is required here, just flattery. What did Maduro do wrong? Well, he didn't flatter. And in fact, the worst thing, he ridiculed.
- [15:42]
Podcast Host
He ridiculed him and did his kind of crazy dance. Although I will say the premier of Greenland appears to be somewhat belligerent and bellicose in his statements to Trump. He's not bowing down to Trump and neither is the premier of Denmark.
- [15:58]
Michael Wolff
Cost him. Although I don't know what it would cost him. I mean, I expect that Donald Trump will announce that we have taken over Greenland. We won't have taken over. Nothing will change. But he will make the announcement.
- [16:16]
Podcast Host
Right. And what are we going to do? Say, no, we haven't. I mean, we've had several people have written to us to say there are direct flights from Newark to. I don't know how to pronounce it. Nouk, I think it is the capital of Greenland, I think, which is where we should go to do a podcast. I've since discovered that, in fact, they're not direct in the winter. They're only direct in the summer. We may have to go via Iceland, but we need to get on it.
- [16:41]
Michael Wolff
Well, we could go to Iceland. That sounds.
- [16:45]
Podcast Host
Sounds kind of fun, doesn't it?
- [16:46]
Michael Wolff
I'd much prefer to go to Iceland than to go to Newark.
- [16:51]
Podcast Host
Well, I think we would go to Iceland and then get another little plane to Nuuk. And I want to do a podcast from one of those beautifully painted little huts that they have, their houses anyway.
- [17:06]
Michael Wolff
Okay. Well, Are we set up?
- [17:08]
Podcast Host
I will set it up. I will set it up. And before we do, I've got a question for you because I'm missing a word from the mocha test. This morning I sat down and our producers challenged me to remember the five words. I've got four of them, but I wonder if you can remember the missing one. Can you remember the four legs?
- [17:24]
Michael Wolff
Well, I can do legs. Cotton.
- [17:30]
Podcast Host
Where do your kids go during the day?
- [17:32]
Michael Wolff
Oh, school. Thank you. Legs. Cotton. School. I can only do legs and cotton.
- [17:39]
Podcast Host
Well, I couldn't do cotton. I'd forgotten cotton. I got leg school. Tomato. White. But I totally forgotten cotton.
- [17:47]
Michael Wolff
White. White. Of course.
- [17:49]
Podcast Host
So you see these things. Maybe he did ace it. And maybe these tests aren't quite as easy as we. As we mock.
- [17:55]
Michael Wolff
No, it could turn out in this. In the. In the world down this rabbit hole that, you know, Trump is the.
- [18:03]
Podcast Host
Trump is the only sane one, and we're all insane. I think that's true.
- [18:07]
Michael Wolff
He's the genius that he says he is.
- [18:10]
Podcast Host
Well, he did say I'm just.
- [18:14]
Michael Wolff
Again, we live in a world, Donald Trump's world, in which everything that is supposed to be is not. Everything that he says is, certainly isn't. And. And everybody, including four New York Times reporters, are left kind of flummoxed all of the time.
- [18:38]
Podcast Host
Right? Well, it is. The emperor's got no clothes, and it's very difficult to challenge him. There was a moment where Katie Rogers, one of the reporters who actually wrote a very good piece about the Daily Beast last year, asked him really, you know, did he believe in international order, et cetera, and he ends up saying that the only thing that really stops him from doing anything at all is his own morality, which, again, is just sort of. It was an interesting insight into his psyche, anyway.
- [19:10]
Michael Wolff
Well, I don't know what it's. Is it an insight. What does that even mean? What is his own morality from a guy who has demonstrated over and over and over again that he certainly has no conventional morality? I mean, we don't have any judge. What is Donald Trump's moral morality? Jeffrey Epstein, I would say, defines Donald Trump's morality. So, again, what. What does he mean? What is the. Is he talking about what the Times, you know, and we come to the limitations. Yeah, they come to the limitations of journalism, which is. Which is. The New York Times can't say that they somehow have to treat everything, their four hours with the President of the United States as basically rational when it is not. It is the opposite of that makes no sense.
- [20:03]
Podcast Host
Well, it makes sense in terms of his own grandiosity. If you think that he's the beginning of what certainly runs as a strain through his family, which is dementia, that grandiosity and the belief in self, and self above all else and one's own reality is actually a symptom of dementia. And yet he appears very coherent.
- [20:26]
Michael Wolff
This is too tumbled around for me. So he's his proves his rationality is that he is irrational. Yeah, okay. I kind of, I guess I get that.
- [20:39]
Podcast Host
People who display symptoms of dementia frequently live in their own world. They have their own truth, their own reality. It's different to everybody else's. Theirs is right. They're paranoid. He's completely paranoid that we're, you know, going to be invaded by other people or that we have insecurity on our borders, et cetera, and grandiosity, that they are the center of all things. And he's definitely displaying grandiosity.
- [21:03]
Michael Wolff
Well, without question. But then that comes back to the limitations of journalism. The New York Times cannot say headline should be President Demented President may be demented.
- [21:15]
Podcast Host
Well, we can say that. We can discuss it. But interestingly, given again, his grandiosity and his, his moaning that he didn't get the Nobel Peace Prize despite having ended all sorts of wars that neither he nor we have heard of, the Nobel Peace Prize committee came out this morning and said that as they put on the bottom of invitations these days the prize is non transferable. So Marina or Maria Corinna Marchedo, who won it this year or last year, cannot share it with Donald Trump.
- [21:50]
Michael Wolff
To that we might say, duh.
- [21:53]
Podcast Host
Indeed, but, but the fact they had to come out and make a statement about it, I thought was kind of interesting.
- [21:58]
Michael Wolff
As I have pointed out before that I once met the, the head of the Nobel Peace Prize committee at Jeffrey Epstein's house. So it could have been something that Donald Trump had. You know, it's a missed opportunity for.
- [22:12]
Podcast Host
For Donald Trump, missed opportunity. And it's going to be very difficult for them to give it to him now because they've been, they've put their stake in the ground. Anyway, I was very excited to see that his own morality extends to buying JD Vance and Marco Rubio new shoes. Did you see this detail?
- [22:30]
Michael Wolff
I did. And here's something else that immediately crossed my mind.
- [22:35]
Podcast Host
Please don't tell me he bought you shoes when you were writing Fire and Fury.
- [22:39]
Michael Wolff
No, but the only person, adult person, outside of my family, even in my family, who has ever bought me shoes. And shoes are a strange thing to buy for Someone because, you know they fit. You know, if you don't try your shoes on, it's.
- [22:56]
Podcast Host
Yeah, it's weird.
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Michael Wolff
They're not, they're not like one size fits all. Quite the opposite. The. The only person who has bought me shoes is Jeffrey Epstein.
- [23:07]
Podcast Host
Okay, okay, okay. Tell me more. I thought you were going to say RFK Jr. When you were on your trip.
- [23:13]
Michael Wolff
No, no, it was Jeffrey. Jeffrey Epstein would find shoes that he felt were. Were comfort, particularly comfortable, and then he would buy them in all sizes. And then, and then you would come and it would be like when you arrived at his. His house in New York, it would be like a shoe store. What's your size?
- [23:32]
Podcast Host
And did you get to keep them or you could only wear them when you were at his house?
- [23:35]
Michael Wolff
No, you got to keep them. You got to take them.
- [23:37]
Podcast Host
And what was. Michael, what was the brand of shoe?
- [23:40]
Michael Wolff
I, you know, how could you not.
- [23:42]
Podcast Host
Know what the brand of shoe is that. Jeffrey Epstein?
- [23:44]
Michael Wolff
Well, actually, they were kind of unique brands of shoe at that particular moment. This was some time ago. Whatever. The, the, the sort of comfort shoe of choice was.
- [24:03]
Podcast Host
So bizarre, so bizarre that Jeffrey Epstein would buy people's shoes. I imagine that he would buy them made out of the skins of, of virgin goats.
- [24:14]
Michael Wolff
I thought you were going to say some other.
- [24:16]
Podcast Host
I know. And then I think you were going to say goats. I added goats because.
- [24:21]
Michael Wolff
So. But maybe it's a control thing, and maybe that's what Donald Trump sees here. I mean, if you buy people shoes, that's pretty, you know, it's pretty paternalistic. It's pretty.
- [24:36]
Podcast Host
Well, he then called them the kids, right? It was paternalistic. He said, oh, the kids. Marc and J.D.
- [24:43]
Guest or Additional Announcer
Yeah.
- [24:43]
Michael Wolff
No, I think it's a. It certainly sends a weird message to the people, to the people around you. It reduces everybody. Oh, shoes. Then you have to take off your shoes. You have to put the shoes on.
- [24:58]
Podcast Host
Also, do you remember how obsessed he was, I mean, crazily obsessed by his own shoes when he was shot at in Butler, Pennsylvania?
- [25:07]
Michael Wolff
And when he was what he said my shoes. And then some of the people with him said, well, that meant, you know, everybody. Well, you know, it's the lifts, right?
- [25:17]
Podcast Host
Well, I wondered if he'd put lifts in little Marco's shoes. If, for example, the reason he bought them shoes was because he wanted Marco to appear taller. That when he was assessing his performance on the stage.
- [25:29]
Michael Wolff
Usually he likes people to appear shorter because that makes him appear taller.
- [25:34]
Podcast Host
But doesn't it reflect badly on his central casting cabinet if he's got short people in there.
- [25:42]
Michael Wolff
I don't. I am. Well, that's a little bit of a contradiction there, but certainly he likes the were in, in Donald Trump's world, you can't be taller than Donald Trump. What, what is, what is James Comey's paramount sin?
- [25:58]
Podcast Host
Six foot, six foot. Six foot six. Interesting. It's such an interesting way of thinking about Trump. But of course, you're right. Why is he intimidated by James Comey? And he didn't say to him when he met him the first time, oh, my God, you're so tall. So tall.
- [26:15]
Michael Wolff
It's a very tall, literally a major, a major preoccupation.
- [26:21]
Podcast Host
Fascinating. Ok, so I did think now that JD Vance is back and was immediately trying to seize the moment in Minneapolis, how utterly charmless he actually is.
- [26:36]
Michael Wolff
Well, let's, I mean, we're having a nice discussion here, but I think we should change the tone because what happens, what has happened in Minneapolis is dark, very dark. And, you know, and it contrasts. You know, the president in the Oval Office with the New York Times was kind of, you know, in a good mood, jovial light. You know, he'd accomplished this thing. He obviously is looking to distract by lightening the mood. The good news, everything worked out. He invaded the country and nobody died. America is back. American might we prevail. And then in contrast to that, and no doubt he would like to distract from this, you have what happened in Minneapolis and you have this thing that happened in Minneapolis was, you know, I mean, how do you see it by as anything other than inevitable? You have a, you have an inexperienced police force with virtually unchecked powers.
- [27:50]
Podcast Host
You mean ice? Ice. Not actually a police force.
- [27:54]
Michael Wolff
No, no. In a policing force, a paramilitary force, actually by any other name, something is going to go wrong. They have weapons and they have power and they don't know how to use either. So. And it happened. Somebody died. Somebody who, you know very clearly in no frame of reference, deserve to die. And that's kind of crossing a line. I mean, I think it was a line that we could have looked forward to and say we're going to cross that line. But now that we have crossed that line and because it forces another thing, because this happened now, the people who have put this paramilitary policing force in place have to defend it. So it becomes in turn more righteous and more unchecked, which will then lead to more situations like this, more people killed in cold blood.
- [29:02]
Podcast Host
Right. And I thought a couple of things. One, of course, everything like this is now caught on video. So you have People pouring over the videos from people's cell phones that they've been posted. I couldn't stop watching it, trying to understand what had actually happened. There was a very good column by Monica Hess in the Washington Post talking about her just inability to stop watching it and trying to understand it and looking at it from all the different angles. And of course, there are lots of different angles and different versions of the same incident. And then you have Donald Trump sitting with the New York Times people going through the video and explaining to them what they were actually seeing was completely different from what he was seeing. And then you have J.D. vance and you have Kristi Noem getting up there. And the only thing they seem to care about is loyalty to Donald Trump, flamming on behalf of Donald Trump. And when this is clearly very bad for Trump and for ICE, you know, just what did J.D. vance say? This was a terrible event, but it was a terrible event of her own making.
- [30:12]
Michael Wolff
Yeah, okay. Okay. Well, we know that this is, let's be very, very clear that they have, they are just doing this thing. They are doubling down. It's their mistake. They have to defend their mistake. The way they defend their mistake is to amp up the, again, the righteousness and the unchecked power of ice, this policing force. And it goes to another aspect of, of Donald Trump is that there is never any guilt. There is never any rethinking. There is never any acknowledgement that something might have been done wrong or that something even could have done differently. I can even say, I mean, we can go back to other things, you.
- [31:02]
Christy
Know.
- [31:05]
Michael Wolff
You know, I mean, you know, I mean, Kent, we were on the, we were back in the 1960s the other day, and this is even Kent State during the Nixon administration. Well, they acknowledge that this at least should not have happened. We don't even get this acknowledgment out of, out of the Trump people. This is, they were righteous. ICE was righteous.
- [31:28]
Podcast Host
Right. And it's the victim, victim's fault. So blame the victim. So immediately they were saying she was an activist. This was an act of domestic terrorism. The idea that she was perhaps trying to run. Well, not even perhaps. They said she was trying to ram their word. One of the ICE officers, when. That's not what the video shows, Paul.
- [31:48]
Michael Wolff
I mean, she's a slow moving car of people trying to, she, you know, I mean, I would have read it that she's just trying to get away. Everybody, it's a bad situation. But fundamentally, fundamentally. And the only point that really matters is here, she's unarmed, right?
- [32:07]
Podcast Host
She's unarmed. She's not trying to run over the officer. And the only virtue here seems to be the volume of disinformation they are putting out. And it's how JD Vance and Kristi Noem show their loyalty to Donald Trump.
- [32:22]
Michael Wolff
And a word from our sponsors.
- [32:26]
Christy
Hi, this is Christy from Back to the Bar. You've probably heard about GLP1 weight loss medications and the side effects that can come with jumping in too fast. That's why I love Noom Makes Getting started easy. Their microdose GLP1 program begins with a smaller dose and gradually scales up based on how your body reacts. The Noom GLP1 microdose program starts at $99 and is delivered to your door in seven days. Start your microdose GLP1 journey today at noom.com that's n o o m.com Noom micro changes big results average weight loss 8 pounds in first month meds and personalization based on clinical need and not available to all individuals. Medications are not reviewed by FDA for safety, efficacy or quality. Pricing based on first month only.
- [33:13]
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Christy
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- [35:01]
Commercial Announcer
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Christy
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- [35:06]
Michael Wolff
Can I make my site firmer?
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Guest or Additional Announcer
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Commercial Announcer
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- [35:36]
Podcast Host
And Michael Wolfe and I are back inside Trump's head. And I thought Christine Noem was particularly vituperative against the woman who died, a mother of three who said that she liked poetry and music on her social media profile. And I thought, oh, she's auditioning for 2028. This is a woman who, you know, in December people were talking about her maybe being the first person to get cut from the cabinet. We know that he's been unduly loyal to his cabinet over the last year, the first administration. There were lots of changes. There haven't been those changes this time round. She seemed to be up for the chop and now she seems to have reinforced her power there.
- [36:24]
Michael Wolff
No, you reinforce your power by doing something that putting yourself in a situation which the public then finds appalling and the media finds appalling. Then the president has to to defend you. So this is a sure way to keep your job.
- [36:43]
Podcast Host
Yeah. And even Tom Homan said that he thought they should figure out what the investigation said before they rushed to judgment. But she was quite happy to rush to judgment.
- [36:56]
Michael Wolff
No, it's a good lesson. And the lesson is learned, of course, by, by her. Taught to her. By her. Do we call him her. Her.
- [37:06]
Podcast Host
I think we call him her special advisor.
- [37:09]
Michael Wolff
Yes. Her special friend Corey Lewandowski, who is a Trump hanger on from goes back to 2017, 2016 with, with, with Trump over and over and over again or people around Trump trying to get rid of Corey, and Corey yet hanging on. So he is the expert on how to remain firmly, implacably, inextricably in the Trump orbit.
- [37:45]
Podcast Host
Yeah. And of course, she was very much hoping that she would be a vice presidential candidate. She was, of course, the former governor of South Dakota. Very conservative. Believes in a federal ban for abortion, believes that life starts at fertilization. Extremely conservative. She's been banned from the reservations in her state by nine different Indian or Native American tribes.
- [38:15]
Michael Wolff
Least you forget the dog.
- [38:16]
Podcast Host
Well, no, no, I was coming to the dog. And of course, what ended up disqualifying her was her surprisingly frank confession in, I think, her second memoir, the second of two memoirs that came out within two years of each other, that she had shot her puppy, Cricket, after he disturbed the other dogs on a hunt they'd been on.
- [38:36]
Michael Wolff
Yeah, actually, that was not the thing that disqualified her. The. The thing that disqualified her before that was her relationship with Corey Lewandowski.
- [38:44]
Podcast Host
Okay. Well, that she did marry.
- [38:46]
Michael Wolff
He's married. You know, this is well known within. Within. I mean, it's actually, for a while, it was a, you know, a central topic in the. In the. In the Trump camp.
- [38:59]
Podcast Host
Well, she's denied that they're having an affair. I'm just putting that out there. She denies it.
- [39:05]
Michael Wolff
Yes. No, I'm.
- [39:06]
Podcast Host
But it's generally accepted they are special friends.
- [39:08]
Michael Wolff
Well, certainly within the Trump White House, there was no question about. About. About what was going on here, so that. That excluded her from serious vice presidential consideration.
- [39:20]
Podcast Host
But she grew up on a farm, and interestingly, she didn't finish college first time around because her father died in a farming accident. It's actually a sad story. I mean, she had to give up college and go back and run the family farm, which she added a restaurant slash cafe to, which, if it's open again, I thought that would be a good place for us to do the podcast. I think we might want to get sad.
- [39:43]
Michael Wolff
Well, what doesn't sound so sad? I mean, sad that.
- [39:46]
Podcast Host
Well, it's sad that you can't finish.
- [39:48]
Michael Wolff
Your degree, but having to drop out of college to, you know, take care of your family, that doesn't sound so sad. Sounds like.
- [39:59]
Podcast Host
Well, it sounds like life, right? Yeah, it sounds like what. It's what you're supposed to do. But nevertheless, she dropped out of college, went back to run the family farm, set up a cafe on the grounds of the family farm, and finished college in 2012, actually, which I thought showed staying power.
- [40:19]
Michael Wolff
I'm trying to think how to. How to respond.
- [40:21]
Podcast Host
Well, you don't, you don't need to.
- [40:23]
Michael Wolff
Respond positive about Kristi. No.
- [40:25]
Podcast Host
Well, the thing that's perhaps the thing that most stands out about her is she is the perfect example of the Mar A Laga makeover. She wears different costumes depending on what she's doing. She loves guns. She's been behind a lot of legislation in Dakota, in South Dakota to make guns more readily available. She loves being photographed holding a gun. And of course, she wears different costumes. She cosplays whoever she's out with.
- [40:53]
Michael Wolff
Totally. And again, it's just a kind of fascinating, you know, the Corey Lewandowski of it all is fascinating and inescapable that we are in a moment, in, in a Trump time for, for better or worse, when a senior level politician can openly have an extramarital affair. Great. I suppose. Is that progress? I don't know.
- [41:23]
Podcast Host
Maybe progress. It might be progress.
- [41:25]
Michael Wolff
You know, one of the things that I think it's against the whole, the Venezuela business and remember the Venezuela business is a, is a created crisis where there is no crisis. You know, and it's turning the wag the dog thing on its, on its ear. So you don't have to, you don't have to create a war to distract. You just can announce that you have done something. We've taken over Venezuela, a distraction from everything. Although we have not taken over Venezuela. We haven't done anything, anything. We will do nothing, nothing will be at stake or at issue. But then if you contrast that to a set of world problems at this time where there are real, very real issues. So in, in Ukraine, you know, just, I mean, I think, I think yesterday the Russians fired a, fired a missile with nuclear capabilities and clearly a warning shot, clearly a threat, clearly all of those things to indicate, no, this is an existential situation in the world that Donald Trump may well have to address. Can he address it? Would we, how would we feel about that? Of, of what happens? We can push this. What happens? Because the Russians certainly are perfectly capable of, of using a tactical nuclear device against Ukraine. What does Donald Trump do? You know, we're all, we're silent because there is no. We've then gone over the line of what is imaginable. Well, what's not only from it' swhat's imaginable, what's unimaginable is not thatis that they would do it, but it's unimaginable how Donald Trump would respond to this.
- [43:41]
Podcast Host
Well, and the thing we've been leaving out of this because as you're Always saying it's a government of one. Is the idea of Congress, that Congress has completely disappeared on this. And what would the US Congress say if.
- [43:55]
Michael Wolff
Well, I'm not even sure. Are they even relevant in this situation? It is not the US Congress in this situation. It would be for any president wholly on his shoulders, of course, but you're.
- [44:09]
Podcast Host
Still taking advice from wise people that you would have around you. You would be hoping. I mean, the anxiety with Trump is he just makes this stuff up at three in the morning on truth.
- [44:20]
Michael Wolff
Donald Trump.
- [44:21]
Podcast Host
Right, right. And is this a moment when Donald Trump would actually take counsel from other people? Would he admire Putin for doing this and thinking that, well, he wants to use a nuclear bomb, then if Putin can do it, he can do it? I mean, who knows what goes on inside that orange head? Well, that's what, that's what we're.
- [44:39]
Michael Wolff
Here is our job.
- [44:42]
Podcast Host
Of course that's what we're doing inside here.
- [44:44]
Michael Wolff
I think, I think we, we would. I mean, one of the things that goes on in Venezuela is a perfect example of this is he wants to create conflict, which puts him at the center of, of attention, which distracts from other issues, which means people are wholly focused on this conflict, but he doesn't want the conflict to actually create danger to him.
- [45:12]
Podcast Host
Right. And he also wants to appear as if he's somehow in control of the military. So it was a very well executed, as far as we know, operation in terms of extracting Maduro and his wife. So Trump gets the benefit of that. And now, of course, it'si mean not only have people slightly forgotten it because of what's happened in Minneapolis where someone did die, but as you say, really important events are going on around the world where Trump's attention is not, it's not focused.
- [45:40]
Guest or Additional Announcer
No.
- [45:40]
Michael Wolff
And the Iran thing is also, I mean, it's another yet a critical moment in a critical situation. Iran is possibly the most critical foreign policy, foreign foreign policy issue of the last several generations. And clearly at this moment it is. There is again the existential possibility that the, that this most oppressive regime could be pulled down. What does Donald Trump do? What is the. I mean, actually, I haven't heard anything. Any. The, the U.S. administration seems at this point to have been absent from whatever is happening there.
- [46:32]
Podcast Host
Right. Well, they're fiddling while Rome is burning. And then of course, while Russia is sending in enormous missiles to Ukraine and the Ukrainians are having to deal with their power down and people being killed. Donald Trump is faffing around with his new White House and Shalom Baroness. His new architect is putting out. Well, there was a hearing this week, a public hearing for the new White House. He's thinking of putting an extra floor on the West Wing. And. Well, what did you think of the plans? Did you look at them?
- [47:11]
Michael Wolff
What can anyone think about this? It's all Trumpian. It's all, I mean, A, it's clearly unnecessary and B, it's just about Donald Trump. His intention is to leave the White House utterly transformed by his presence there.
- [47:36]
Podcast Host
So one can never forget he was there. And indeed this is, you know, and.
- [47:39]
Michael Wolff
It'S curious because I remember in 2017 when he came into the White House and you know, and I was in the West Wing for much of that early, early period that would be always a refrain that the White House was a dump.
- [47:57]
Podcast Host
Well, it's not a fancy corporate office and deliberately so to remind the leader of the free world to stay humble.
- [48:05]
Michael Wolff
No. And I watched the transformation. Certainly the reception area that was one of the, of the West Wing was, was in the time that I was there, often sitting on the couch there, done over from a, you know, so it went from looking like a, you know, kind of like a, like a college admissions office to a, that's exactly.
- [48:27]
Podcast Host
What it looks like, a college admissions.
- [48:28]
Michael Wolff
Office to, you know, a Trump Hotel or cast off furniture from a Trump hotel.
- [48:34]
Podcast Host
Cast off furniture from a Trump Hotel. I noticed that the first lady's office was as far away as it could be from the Oval Office. It's tucked in the corner of the enormous new wing they're planning to put on with the ballroom on the second floor.
- [48:51]
Michael Wolff
You know, one of the interesting, the interesting things which I was a little confused. So there is a second floor to the West Wing and you know, it's.
- [49:04]
Podcast Host
Like, well, maybe he's trying to put the second floor on the colonnade right above them.
- [49:08]
Michael Wolff
I don't, I don't know. I mean I was. But you know, like Kellyanne Conway, a lot of, a lot of semi exiled people in the, in the, in the Trump White House had had their offices.
- [49:21]
Podcast Host
It's like a little warren and there are kind of weird little stairs up there.
- [49:24]
Michael Wolff
And it was always pointed out that Donald Trump had never once gone to the second floor of the, the, of the West Wing.
- [49:33]
Podcast Host
And I'm sure Melania hasn't been up there. You need to give us an update on what's happening. We know her office is being exiled to the far corner of the Trump Ballroom extension, which I think is going to be like a conference center. And they're going to charge people to attend. But but where are you with your.
- [49:51]
Michael Wolff
Legal suit and ever gratefully a commercial break.
- [49:57]
Christy
Hi, this is Christy from Back to the Bar. You've probably heard about GLP1 weight loss medications and the side effects that can come with jumping in too fast. That's why I love Noom Makes getting started easy. Their microdose GLP1 program begins with a smaller dose and gradually scales up based on how your body reacts. The Noom GLP1 microdose program starts at $99 and is delivered to your door in seven days. Start your microdose GLP1 journey today at noom.com that's n o m dot com Noom micro changes big results. Average weight lost eight pounds in first month meds and personalization based on clinical need and not available to all individuals. Medications are not reviewed by FDA for safety, efficacy or quality. Pricing based on first month only.
- [50:44]
Commercial Announcer
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- [51:04]
Christy
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- [51:13]
Commercial Announcer
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- [51:15]
Christy
Smart bed Can I make my site softer?
- [51:17]
Michael Wolff
Can I make my site firmer?
- [51:19]
Guest or Additional Announcer
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Commercial Announcer
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- [51:49]
Michael Wolff
Do they ever actually clean the ball pit at these kids play gyms? Or is my kid just swimming in a vat of bacteria catching whatever cootie of the day is breeding in there? A cootie that'll probably take down our whole family.
- [52:03]
Commercial Announcer
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- [52:18]
Podcast Host
And I'm back with the Donald Trump chronicler Michael Wolf. And we are where else inside Trump's head.
- [52:24]
Michael Wolff
After so many weeks of not acknowledging this lawsuit and then of, of strategically avoiding trying to service on this lawsuit, they are now responding to it. And I think that they have.
- [52:40]
Christy
I.
- [52:40]
Michael Wolff
Think that they have kind of woken up to the fact that they can't let this happen. The worst thing that could possibly happen to Melania Trump and Donald Trump and possibly this administration is for them to be forced into a deposition where they would have to answer questions about their relationship with Jeffrey Epstein. I think in some sense that brings the house down. So they can't let that happen. Therefore, they go, they are now and they have now begun the slow process of resisting this in every way. And remember, they have enormous capabilities to resist this. They have unlimited legal resources. They have vast influence over the federal government, courts. They have unlimited financial resources. Now thank God for GoFundMe and about 20,000 people who have, who have given me the resources to actually be able to fight this lawsuit or wage this, pursue this lawsuit against them. But my resources, theirs are truly unlimited. So anyway, so we are at this point, this slowly is clear what's happening there. And they have, they have, they have, we sued them in New York state court. They have moved this now. They have the, you know, just by saying she lives in a different state than I do, they can move this to federal court. And in federal court, they have now moved to have this lawsuit dismissed or if it's not dismissed then to move it back to Florida. Now.
- [54:38]
Podcast Host
So can I just ask you something because you're bringing this case against the first lady, the first time anyone has sued the first lady or a first lady because she threatened you with a slap suit in New York, you immediately threatened her back with an anti slap suit. Is it possible to get an anti slap suit in Florida?
- [55:01]
Michael Wolff
Yes, it is. It's just, it's more favorable set of laws in, in New York. But yes. And it's that we, she threatened, we sued. So that's, that's the pivotal distinction here. But now we will move back. We will say we will move to remand this case to New York and we get to do that if she actually lives in New York, which she does. So we now, we now will have the chance to prove that with we go through or we request the court for a discovery period to show that she lives in New York, something else which they probably can't let happen.
- [55:49]
Podcast Host
And so how do you prove that she Lives in New York. What is that? Is that cell phone records? Is it?
- [55:55]
Michael Wolff
Oh, yeah. All the whole, I mean, I mean there's going to be a whole, a whole, I mean, documents will show that. And then it's like, how many nights have you spent in Trump Tower versus how many nights have you spent at Mar A Lago? Scant few. How many nights have you spent in the White House? Scant few. So this is pretty straightforward. But the problem is, and then that wouldfor them is that, that would reveal that this is a marriage the likes of none other than we have ever seen in the White House.
- [56:31]
Podcast Host
Well, we've seen some pretty odd marriages in the White House. But if Melania Trump and Donald Trump refused to play ball, as it were, are you still able to depose other people about it?
- [56:46]
Michael Wolff
Yes, I mean, this, yes, of course. I mean, and they will have this, this, this moves forward, it creeps forward at a, you know, at a, at a, at a slow pace. But the point is here is we are in it for the long haul. The race is long and we're in it.
- [57:07]
Podcast Host
Well, the train has left the station, another way of putting it. Right.
- [57:11]
Michael Wolff
And I have a substack piece that actually, I mean, this is so complicated in this, you know, minutiae here and there and these moves. But I think it's, I think I explain it pretty well in the substack piece that's up today.
- [57:25]
Podcast Host
Well, I can't tell you how many supportive comments that are on YouTube about this. Lots of non supportive comments about your remarks on Mark Kelly, which I noticed Trumpian like you doubled down on. And people still haven't forgiven you for that. But a lot of people supporting this action against the first lady and a lot of people saying you're very brave. Ok, we've got some questions from people too. Here's one from in South Chicago. This is for Melania. Ask Melania, how were you involved with Donald Trump and Jeffrey Epstein's modeling agencies? Were you involved with recruiting girls and women from Eastern Europe?
- [58:10]
Michael Wolff
An elemental question right there. Yes.
- [58:13]
Podcast Host
Okay.
- [58:14]
Michael Wolff
And that is, you know, at the end of all of this and there, all of this wrangling, federal court, state court, this and that, you know, still there is that fundamental question. What was the relationship of these three people? Donald Trump, Melania Trump, Jeffrey Epstein.
- [58:32]
Podcast Host
Okay, well, there's a question here which I rather like from Robin C7669. Why has Melania lately taken to smiling so much as she appears next to Trump?
- [58:46]
Michael Wolff
You know, I think it has to do with, I Mean, Melania is in, is in a promotional phase. The pre promotion, we call this the documentary about her, which she was paid $40 million for and gets 70% of the back end and gets paid $10 million per corporate sponsorship. Hit debuts on at the end of.
- [59:11]
Podcast Host
The month, January 30th, I think, in theaters. Someone texted me saying that they'd be been in a theater and a trailer had come on for Melania, the movie, which as you say, is getting, I think a worldwide release on at the end of January. And the entire theater booed. So, yes, that, that doesn't bode well, doesn't it?
- [59:34]
Michael Wolff
Amazon deal. We should, we should point that out. This is Jeff Bezos currying favorite.
- [59:43]
Podcast Host
Well, I feel like Jeff Bezos is currying favor with one hand, paying Melania $40 million for her documentary and then slapping Donald Trump with his Washington Post with the other hand. So he's trying to have it both ways.
- [59:56]
Michael Wolff
I don't know. I mean, I see the Washington Post is a pretty docile player, certainly against, against the Washington Post. I think that, I think the Washington Post manages to get in a few licks because, you know, he doesn't pay too much attention. But were he to pay attention, he would.
- [60:19]
Podcast Host
Well, there's been some more robust reporting recently. They were the ones that reported that Pete Hegseth had given the order to kill the survivors left in the water after the boat strikes. That was a good story. Anyway, moving on. Question to Melania from very Anna Berry. Did Donald ever try to seduce Ghislaine? We haven't heard much from Ghislaine Maxwell recently. Do you remember? There was a sort of flurry of activity and it's gone quiet since the release of the Epstein files. Jeffrey Phillips, 7312 wants to know. Ask Wolf to ask Melania to detail what Trump's relationship with the Putin is and whether he is a Russian asset.
- [61:09]
Michael Wolff
A straightforward question, I suppose, perhaps. Perhaps too straightforward.
- [61:13]
Podcast Host
Perhaps too on the nose, that one. And then we've got another question which I like here From Chazzy B, 2025, Ask Melania, has she aced the MOCA test? And then Chazzy B says, I took it for medical reasons. I also slightly struggle with the five words. I suspect everyone does. And then from Janet Feindel, ask Melania if she helped Ghislaine Maxwell. Did she know why Ghislaine was recruiting girls from Mar A Lago?
- [61:40]
Michael Wolff
Again, I think that this is all the life they lived. Three of them is the primary topic of this lawsuit. The life they lived in the late 90s.
- [61:54]
Podcast Host
Okay, well, good luck with your legal case. For people who want to read more details about it, of course they can. Look at your substack Howl, named after the Alan Ginsberg poem, which is very wolfy and very New Jersey of you, because I know he came from New Jersey, as you're always pointing out, but.
- [62:10]
Michael Wolff
From Paterson, New Jersey, where I come from.
- [62:12]
Podcast Host
Right. And who else comes from Paterson, New Jersey? William Carlos Williams.
- [62:16]
Michael Wolff
Dr. Williams.
- [62:18]
Podcast Host
Dr. Williams. And where did Philip Roth come from? Was he Newark?
- [62:22]
Michael Wolff
Newark, where I don't want to go.
- [62:24]
Podcast Host
Anyone else?
- [62:25]
Michael Wolff
Well, Alexander Hamilton didn't come from there, but he. He took note of the. Of the waterfall, a very impressive, impressive waterfall in Patterson, which then powered the. The growth of the silk mill industry.
- [62:43]
Podcast Host
Okay. Is it still going, the waterfall, or has. Has it been dried up by climate change?
- [62:47]
Michael Wolff
No, the waterfall is. Is still going. The silk mill industry is not.
- [62:54]
Podcast Host
So on that note, I think we should thank people if they've been watching or listening. Please leave us your comments on YouTube. I read them all the time, in fact, if I ever have.
- [63:03]
Michael Wolff
She does read them, because then she reads them to me.
- [63:05]
Podcast Host
Yeah. And if I have a spare 20 minutes, I often go in and try and leave emojis and comments for people. Not as many as I would like. In fact, if there's anybody out there that knows how to do this better, other podcasters listening, I would really like to know how you handle the response, because it's so nice to be able to respond to people personally, but it's difficult. Anyway, don't forget to subscribe to the Daily Beast. Please subscribe to this podcast. We are independent media, so we appreciate your support.
- [63:36]
Michael Wolff
Joanna and I will be live together, unfiltered, at the 92nd Street Y in New York City on Lexington Avenue and 92nd street, on January 21st, one day after the first anniversary of the second Trump term. And that is www92NY. And we'd love to see you there. I think it will be fun.
- [64:11]
Podcast Host
Well, I think I'll be a little bit filtered when you say we're going to be unfiltered. But also what we've just discovered is you will not be filtered. Right. You will be unfiltered. It'll be like Gauloise. It'll be like Gaul was. And Gitan. And I will say that we've just discovered you can buy virtual tickets so people can join us live from home. We have lots of viewers and listeners, actually, all over the world. Huge contingent in Australia, New York City.
- [64:41]
Michael Wolff
On the Upper east side.
- [64:43]
Podcast Host
Yeah, you can join us virtually. There are virtual tickets to buy so www 92nd what is it? 92ny.org Great. Do you know what you're going to be? Well, you'll be wearing a suit, won't you?
- [64:59]
Michael Wolff
Yes, apparently wearing a suit.
- [65:04]
Podcast Host
And maybe shoes bought for you by Jeffrey Epstein. I would like you to turn up in them. I need to examine them. This is a whole new detail of horror I didn't know about.
- [65:15]
Michael Wolff
Extraordinary. Yes, but anyway, we will be there. Joanna. Hi. Just a second. I have to tell you about something that we're obsessed with. I'm Kevin Fallon. And I'm Matt Wilstein and we are hosting Obsessed, the podcast about all the TV shows, movies and entertainment newsmakers that we're all obsessed with. So make sure you subscribe to us on YouTube at the YouTube channel. Make sure you follow us wherever you get your podcasts. Just search for Obsessed the podcast and we will see you there.
- [65:48]
Podcast Host
Big shout out to our bebeast level members. Yvette Johnson, Methinks Betsy o' Farrell Mills and Lynns Shell B. Max Quibbett, David Sherry, Thomas Moore, Maria Voltaine D. Kujawatt Sinja Lund, John H. Overocca Deb K. Ostrander Sandra Clark Travels With Carl Andrew Beaver Capernator Harry Clark Dawn McCarthy Daniel dog lover M. Griner Dice Stone Fulvia Orlando Herbie Andrew Mellor Tattnall, Val Love, Francisco Will Hutchison, Andrea Hodel Bocock D.C. sharon Shipley, Connie Rutherford, Karen Wright and Heidi Riley.
- [66:28]
Michael Wolff
Devin Rachel Ryan, Heather and Heather.
- [66:33]
Podcast Host
Our team is growing. It's very exciting.
- [66:40]
Michael Wolff
ACAST powers the world's best podcasts. Here's a show that we recommend.
- [66:47]
Guest or Additional Announcer
We all have bad days and sometimes bad weeks and maybe even bad years. But the good news is we don't have to figure out life all alone. I'm comedian Chris Duffy, host of ted's how to Be a Better Human podcast. And our show is about the little ways that you can improve your life. Actual practical tips that you can put into place that will make your day to day better. Whether it is setting boundaries at work or rethinking how you clean your house, each episode has conversations with experts who share tips on how to navigate life's ups and downs. Find how to be a better human wherever you're listening to this.
- [67:22]
Michael Wolff
Acast helps creators launch, grow and monetize their podcasts everywhere. Acast.com.