Scandals, Stocks, and Surveillance | Ronan Farrow

Summary

The Daily Show: Ears Edition – Episode Summary: "Scandals, Stocks, and Surveillance | Ronan Farrow"

Release Date: November 20, 2024
Hosts: Jesse Lydick and Desi Lydon
Guest: Ronan Farrow, Pulitzer Prize-Winning Journalist

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1. Introduction

Timestamp: 02:34 – 03:01

The episode kicks off with hosts Jesse Lydick and Desi Lydon setting the stage for an evening filled with political scandals, market reactions, and a deep dive into surveillance issues. Jesse introduces the major topics, including Matt Gaetz's Broadway debut, Mike Johnson's controversial moments, and the looming question of Trump’s potential bid for the White House.

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2. The Matt Gaetz Scandal

Timestamp: 03:01 – 10:23

Overview: The hosts delve into the allegations against Congressman Matt Gaetz following President Donald Trump's nomination of Gaetz as Attorney General. Multiple women have accused Gaetz of soliciting sex in exchange for payments, with one alleging he engaged in sexual activities with a minor.

Key Points:

• Allegations and Evidence: Two women testified before the House Ethics Committee, claiming Gaetz paid them for sex and travel. One woman stated, “Representative Gaetz having sex with a minor,” observed during an encounter with a 17-year-old (Timestamp: 03:24).
• Committee's Evidence: The committee possesses Gaetz's Venmo and PayPal transactions, suggesting financial exchanges for illicit activities. Text messages indicate coded language, such as “party favors” (Timestamp: 03:57).
• Gaetz’s Defense and Speaker Johnson’s Stance: Speaker Mike Johnson argues against releasing the Ethics Committee’s report post-Gaetz’s departure from Congress, citing concerns over privacy and the potential for abuse in targeting private citizens (Timestamp: 05:46).

Notable Quotes:

• Jesse Lydick: “Has this guy ever heard of cash? Come on. At the bare minimum, an attorney general should know how to cover up his own crimes.” (Timestamp: 04:16)
• Desi Lydon: “My office is going to be known for trust and transparency and accountability.” (Timestamp: 05:51)

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3. Precedent and Historical Context

Timestamp: 07:03 – 10:59

Discussion: The hosts compare Gaetz's situation to former Congressman Bill Boehner’s ethics scandal, highlighting the inconsistencies in releasing ethics reports based on political convenience.

Key Points:

• Bill Boehner’s Case: Boehner faced financial impropriety allegations but successfully transitioned to a mayoral role without releasing his Ethics Committee report (Timestamp: 07:28).
• Implications for Future Ethics Reporting: Lydick sarcastically remarks on the need for transparency, questioning Speaker Johnson’s reluctance to release Gaetz’s report despite historical precedents (Timestamp: 09:02).

Notable Quotes:

• Jesse Lydick: “Who’s been digging?” (Timestamp: 12:48) – Illustrates the hosts' skepticism about the ethics committee’s motivations.
• Desi Lydon: “Everything's fine.” (Timestamp: 12:10) – Highlights the dismissive attitude towards serious allegations.

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4. Market Reactions to Political Developments

Timestamp: 16:37 – 21:39

Overview: Jesse Lydick transitions to a segment on financial news with a humorous take on how political decisions, especially those related to Trump’s potential presidency, are influencing market trends.

Key Points:

• Private Prison Stocks: Stocks of companies like Geo and CoreCivic surged by over 56% following Trump’s selection of Tom Homan, an immigration hardliner, as Secretary of Borders (Timestamp: 17:23).
• Clean Energy vs. Fossil Fuels: Solar companies see declining stock prices as climate change initiatives face political setbacks (Timestamp: 18:33).
• Dental Care Supplies: Henry Schein’s shares rose by 7.5%, speculated to be influenced by RFK Jr.’s tenure as Health and Human Services Secretary, potentially affecting public health policies like fluoride removal (Timestamp: 19:40).

Notable Quotes:

• Michael Costa: “Prison stocks are booming, and I'm a buying.” (Timestamp: 17:23)
• Jesse Lydick: “What else can we expect from President T. Rump?” (Timestamp: 18:44)

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5. Interview with Ronan Farrow on Surveillance

Timestamp: 24:17 – 35:28

Introduction: Ronan Farrow, a Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist and producer of the HBO documentary "Surveilled," joins the show to discuss the pervasive issue of government surveillance.

Key Discussion Points:

• Personal Experiences with Surveillance: Farrow recounts being targeted during his reporting on Harvey Weinstein, facing both traditional and high-tech spying methods, including geolocation tracking (Timestamp: 25:07).
• Global Implications: The use of advanced spyware like Pegasus by various governments to monitor political dissidents, activists, and journalists, leading to suppressed democratic expressions (Timestamp: 26:16).
• Technology’s Double-Edged Sword: While intended for national security, surveillance technologies often get misused, equating their potential danger to weapons of mass destruction (Timestamp: 28:45).

Notable Quotes:

• Ronan Farrow: “Surveillance means shrinking space for democratic expression.” (Timestamp: 26:58)
• Jesse Lydick: “There is this sort of prevailing attitude in America of, you know, if I'm not doing anything wrong, who cares if I'm being spied on? What's misguided about Americans having that attitude?” (Timestamp: 33:13)

Solutions and Recommendations:

• Public Awareness: Farrow emphasizes the importance of documentaries like "Surveilled" in raising awareness about surveillance.
• Regulatory Measures: Calls for stricter regulations to prevent misuse of surveillance technologies.
• Practical Advice: Recommendations for individuals to protect their privacy, such as restarting phones regularly and supporting journalistic integrity.

Notable Quotes:

• Ronan Farrow: “We need legislators to regulate this technology.” (Timestamp: 32:19)
• Jesse Lydick: “Watch the movie and restart your phone every day.” (Timestamp: 31:37).

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6. Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Timestamp: 35:28 – 36:33

The episode wraps up with a tease for Ronan Farrow’s upcoming documentary "Surveilled," encouraging listeners to watch the film to understand the depths of surveillance issues. The hosts reiterate the importance of supporting journalism and staying informed about the societal impacts of political decisions and technological advancements.

Notable Quotes:

• Ronan Farrow: “I’m really proud to be able to do the work of journalism at a time like this.” (Timestamp: 34:37)
• Jesse Lydick: “For the love of God, watch the movie.” (Timestamp: 31:37)

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7. Closing Remarks and Promotions

Timestamp: 36:33 – End

The episode concludes with standard promotional content for other shows and sponsors, which was omitted from this summary as per the guidelines.

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Key Takeaways

• Political Scandals Impact Transparency: The Matt Gaetz scandal underscores the challenges in maintaining ethics and transparency within political institutions.
• Market Sensitivity to Political Changes: Financial markets are highly reactive to political appointments and policy shifts, reflecting underlying societal tensions.
• Surveillance Threatens Democratic Freedoms: Ronan Farrow’s insights highlight the urgent need to address the expanding scope of government surveillance to protect individual freedoms and democratic processes.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Jesse Lydick: “Has this guy ever heard of cash? Come on. At the bare minimum, an attorney general should know how to cover up his own crimes.” — [04:16]
• Ronan Farrow: “Surveillance means shrinking space for democratic expression.” — [26:58]
• Desi Lydon: “My office is going to be known for trust and transparency and accountability.” — [05:51]
• Jesse Lydick: “For the love of God, watch the movie.” — [31:37]

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This comprehensive summary captures the essence of the podcast episode, highlighting the major discussions on political scandals, their broader implications, market reactions, and the critical issue of surveillance as explored by guest Ronan Farrow. The inclusion of notable quotes provides direct insights into the hosts' perspectives and the guest’s expertise.

Transcript

[Narrator]

See Gladiator 2 only in theaters November 22nd. This film delivers action, an emotional and compelling story, and performances and spectacle on a scale unlike anything else. Gladiator 2 stands out with its immersive visuals and a gripping character driven narrative. The film stars an extraordinary cast including Paul Mescal, Pedro Pascal, Denzel Washington and Connie Nielsen. Reprising her role as Lucilla, get ready for an epic experience made for the big screen. Gladiator 2 only in theaters on November 22nd.

[Dr. Joy Hardin Bradford]

This is Dr. Joy Hardin Bradford from Therapy for Black Girls. You know that Amazon has millions of books, so you can find one that gives you just the reading feeling you're looking for. You know, like if you're looking for a relaxed feeling, like with a beach ready, Amazon has got it covered. Or if you're looking for more of a terrified ah with evil twins or things lurking in the woods or something, Amazon's got you. I mean, even if you want an aw teen romance, Amazon has it covered too. Amazon Books. That reading feeling awaits.

[Pets Best Insurance Representative]

The following ad is sponsored by Pets Best Insurance Services. Your pet is your bestie, your therapist your preferred match. It's easy to love them, even when they sneak your snacks. It's easy to protect them, too, with pet insurance coverage from Pets Best because it's all fun and games until they chew on something they shouldn't. With perfect timing, Pets Best helps protect your furry friend and your budget from this imperfect world. Get up to 90% on eligible vet bills for less than a dollar a day. Find your Perfect [e-mail] Pet insurance products offered and administered by Pets Best Insurance, Services, LLC are underwritten by American Pet Insurance Company or Independent's American Insurance Company. For all terms, visit petsbest.com backslash policy.

[Desi Lydon]

You're listening to Comedy Central from the most trusted journalists at Comedy Central. It's America's only source for news. This is the Daily show with your host, Desi Lydon. Welcome to the Daily Show.

[Jesse Lydick]

I'm Jesse Lydick. We've got so much to talk about tonight. Matt Gaetz makes his Broadway debut. Mike Johnson tries to hide his boner, and the end of democracy is sad. But could it also be profitable? It can. So let's get into another installment of Trump 2.0. Coming for the White House.

[Desi Lydon]

I'm going to come.

[Jesse Lydick]

Last week, Donald Trump made his insane yet predictable pick for Attorney General. Matt Gaetz, Florida congressman. And if wraparound shades were a person, critics have been asking, does Matt Gaetz know enough about the law to be Attorney General and every day, we're learning that he has lots of experience with.

[Desi Lydon]

CBS News has learned that two women.

[Ronny Chang]

Told the House Ethics Committee they were.

[Desi Lydon]

Paid to have sex with Gates and to travel with him on multiple occasions. One also says that she saw Gaetz having sex with a minor. She observed, to her right, Representative Gates having sex with her friend, who was 17 at the time.

[Jesse Lydick]

Your future attorney General, everyone. It's always the people you most expect. And if you're wondering how they found out, it's a case of he said, she said, he has a paper trail.

[Desi Lydon]

The committee has gaetz's Venmo and PayPal transactions that allegedly show payments for sex and text messages where he refers to illegal drugs in code words. Representative Gates would use terms like, can you make sure that there are party favors present? Or who's in charge of the party favors?

[Jesse Lydick]

Party favors. Clever. Can't crack that code. And they said he paid for sex with Venmo. Has this guy ever heard of cash? Come on. At the bare minimum, an attorney general should know how to cover up his own crimes. Now, according to this lawyer, it wasn't all just sex and drugs. There was also theater.

[Desi Lydon]

The lawyer claims in 2019, then Congressman Gaetz paid the women to travel to New York to watch his appearance on Fox News, attend the Broadway show Pretty Woman, and have sex with him.

[Jesse Lydick]

Taking two prostitutes to see Pretty Woman, It's a little on the nose, wasn't it? I guess. High. The worst part is that he apparently took them to watch him on Fox News. God, I hope they charged him extra for that. It's $1,000 for butt stuff and 2,000 if I have to look at Brit Hume. Now, the House Ethics Committee looked into all these allegations, but there's a debate about whether they should still release its report now that Gaetz has left Congress. Unfortunately for Gates, the Speaker of the House took office with a very, very clear philosophy.

[Desi Lydon]

My office is going to be known for trust and transparency and accountability.

[Jesse Lydick]

Transparency, Yes. I love it. Here is a guy who understands how important it is that people hear the truth about their next Attorney General. So, Mike Johnson, hand over the report.

[Desi Lydon]

Speaker Mike Johnson says the report should stay sealed. I would be concerned about opening the Pandora's box and saying that the House Ethics Committee, with its vast resour unlimited power, effectively could investigate private citizens and release reports about them.

[Jesse Lydick]

Mike Johnson, seriously, your argument is that if they can investigate Matt Gaetz for having sex with an underage girl, then they can investigate anyone for having sex with an underage girl? And is that really what we want as a country. Yes, yes, we want that.

[Dr. Joy Hardin Bradford]

We want that.

[Jesse Lydick]

That is what. Also, you're violating your principle of transparency to defend the guy accused of throwing sex parties. You, a man who wears a blindfold during sex so that he doesn't accidentally see his own penis. What are you so worried about with.

[Desi Lydon]

Regard to the report? There's a very important reason for the tradition and the rule that we always have, almost always followed, and that is that we don't issue investigations and ethics reports on people who are not members of Congress.

[Jesse Lydick]

Okay, is it me, or did that almost seem like a tell? What was that about?

[Desi Lydon]

So he's saying it would be a terrible precedent to release this report. He's warning against it after a member steps down.

[Ronny Chang]

But keeping him honest.

[Desi Lydon]

The House ethics committee has done this before, most notably in a financial impropriety case for former Tennessee congressman Bill Boehner.

[Jesse Lydick]

Who left the House to become mayor of Nashville. Yep, that is right. There is precedent for releasing an ethics report because of a guy named Bill Bohner, not to be confused with Boner Bill, which is what Matt Gaetz venmos at the end of a sex party. Bill Boehner had an ethics scandal in the quaint scandal days when your scandals were financial and not pubescent. And after finding that out about him, forgive me, but I went down a bit of a Boner hole. I. I discovered some old news clips that after leaving Congress, Bill Boehner did some amazing work as the mayor of Nashville.

[Desi Lydon]

You might not recognize this man who called himself Bob until he removed his disguise. Then you know it's Mayor Bill Boner. And the disguise was worn when he went undercover last April to buy illegal drugs and to learn just how bad drug trafficking is on Nashville streets.

[Jesse Lydick]

Impressive disguise. Usually you just hide a Boehner with a math textbook, but you gotta give Boner a hand because it worked.

[Desi Lydon]

These are pictures of the drug transaction in which Boner bought $40 worth of cocaine in northeast Nashville. One of the guys that we bought from was by the name of Big daddy. One Big daddy may be out of the drug selling business in Nashvill, but if these bumper stickers that are going around are any indication, there may be other big daddies in town.

[Jesse Lydick]

It's good. It's good. But I think there's one thing that bumper sticker needs. Yeah, there you go. Foolproof. But why did I spend two and a half minutes talking about Bill Boehner? Because it's a fun little escape. Yes, but also, this is the precedent. Mike Johnson can have to release the House ethics report. So, Johnson, listen up. In times of need. Look to Boehner for more on this debate on whether to release the House ethics report. Let's go to Capitol Hill with Ronny Chang. Ronnie, Mike Johnson claims that if the Ethics Committee releases the Gaetz reports and they could dig up any dirt on any private citizen, isn't that a ridiculous argument?

[Desi Lydon]

Uh, no, he's absolutely right. We should leave Matt Gaetz alone. Back to you, Desi.

[Jesse Lydick]

What? No. Why would we leave this alone? Gaetz is a public official accused of going to underage sex parties.

[Ronny Chang]

Yeah, yeah.

[Desi Lydon]

So? So what? Yeah, what, they're gonna investigate every party now? It's a slippery slope. Okay, like what? So no one's allowed to get together with friends and get a little wasted and have an argument that gets out of hand? What? I barely pushed him.

[Jesse Lydick]

What are you talking about?

[Ronny Chang]

I'm talking about precedent, okay?

[Desi Lydon]

Today is Matt Gaetz, and then tomorrow they're gonna go after innocent civilians outside a forest in New Jersey on a Saturday night who are totally innocent.

[Jesse Lydick]

You said innocent twice. New Jersey. You're being weird.

[Desi Lydon]

No, you're being weird. Everything's fine.

[Jesse Lydick]

All right, well, let's get some additional reporting from Josh Johnson. Josh, what can you tell us, huh?

[Desi Lydon]

Tell you what? I didn't say anything. I wasn't even with Ronnie in that force.

[Jesse Lydick]

No, Josh, I want to know what the Justice Department officials are thinking.

[Desi Lydon]

Oh, right, right, right, right, right. Okay, well, I spoke to multiple people inside the Justice Department, and they have no idea we were even near that forest, so it's all good.

[Jesse Lydick]

No, no. Matt Gaetz. What are they saying about Gaetz?

[Desi Lydon]

Oh, department officials are nervous about sex offender representing them, and that's bad. And it was a long time ago, just like Saturday night was also a long time ago, so best to just leave both things alone. Back to you, Desi.

[Jesse Lydick]

Wa. What is going on with you guys? You were in a forest together in New Jersey last Saturday.

[Desi Lydon]

No, no, of course not. Absolutely not. We weren't burying anybody in a forest. I don't even own a shovel. Josh, shut the up. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm so scared I'm gonna throw up.

[Jesse Lydick]

I'm starting to suspect that something's going on here. Let me just go out to Grace Kuhlenschmidt. Grace? Grace, where are you?

[Desi Lydon]

Grace, why don't you go back to the. Because I can't stop thinking about what we did. Ain't no Ain't no weed. Don't show Desi. Grace. They have nothing.

[Jesse Lydick]

Grace. Grace, why do you have a shovel? Digging? Who's been digging?

[Desi Lydon]

I didn't say anything about digging. Ronnie did most of the digging. Oh, God. Grace, shut the up.

[Jesse Lydick]

Okay, guys, guys, guys. We're gonna get to the bottom of this. But first I'm gonna turn to Jordan Klepper for more on Gates.

[Desi Lydon]

No.

[Pets Best Insurance Representative]

Because Jordan.

[Desi Lydon]

Jordan is. He's. Oh, he's been on vacation, baby. To the Bahamas.

[Pets Best Insurance Representative]

He said to tell you he was leaving for a few days and to never contact him ever again.

[Jesse Lydick]

Okay, you know, I am not stupid. I see what's going on here. Saturday night, New Jersey, digging in a forest. You guys were gardening without me?

[Desi Lydon]

Oh, yeah. Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Ronny Chang]

You caught us. We're so sorry, but if you could.

[Desi Lydon]

Say that you were with us until.

[Pets Best Insurance Representative]

Like 2:45am that night, that would be great.

[Jesse Lydick]

Yeah, you got it. Ronny Chang, Josh Johnson. And gracefully. When we come back, we'll find out how did you make Trump work for you?

[Narrator]

See Gladiator 2 only in theaters November 22nd. This film delivers thrilling action, a compelling story, emotionally charged performances and spectacle on a scale unlike anything else. Only Ridley Scott could pull off a cinematic marvel at this scale. With sweeping storytelling and relentless action, Gladiator 2 stands out in the modern cinematic landscape. With its immersive visuals, incredible score and a gripping character driven narrative. The film stars an extraordinary cast including Paul Mezcal, Pedro Pascal with Denzel Washington and Connie Nielsen reprising her role as Lucilla. The fate of Rome rests on an uneasy alliance between Lucius and Macrinus who need each other to further their ambitions. Gladiator 2 is a complex political chess game, action packed revenge story with a beating emotional core. You will be on the edge of your seat as you experience the unexpected twists and turns throughout the film. Get ready for an epic, immersive, visceral experience made for the big screen. See Gladiator 2 only in theaters on November 22nd. Don't miss it.

[Dr. Joy Hardin Bradford]

This is Dr. Joy Hardin Bradford from Therapy for Black Girls. There are millions of books on Amazon so there's a reading feeling for everyone. So if you're after that excited haha feeling, like when you discover you have a lot in common with Vikings or something. Amazon has books for you. Or maybe you enjoy the sort of nervous haha that comes when the hero barely escapes the zombies. Or maybe you like the smuggler that comes when the villain gets what he deserves. You know Amazon has it all. Amazon books. That reading feeling awaits.

[Pets Best Insurance Representative]

The following ad is sponsored by Pets Best Insurance Services. Your pet is your bestie, your therapist, your preferred match. It's easy to love them, even when they sneak your snacks. It's easy to protect them, too, with pet insurance coverage from Pets Best, because it's all fun and games until they chew on something they shouldn't. With perfect timing, Pets Best helps protect your furry friend and your budget from this imperfect world. Get up to 90% on eligible vet bills for less than a dollar a day. Find your Perfect [e-mail] Pet insurance products offered and administered by Pets Best Insurance Services, LLC are underwritten by American Pet Insurance Company or Independence American Insurance Company. For all terms, visit petsbest.com.

[Jesse Lydick]

Welcome back to the Daily Show. If you want honest and rigorous financial news, then go eat a dick. But if you want to get rich, then you want Michael Costa in another installment of Costa Doing Business.

[Desi Lydon]

Hey, everybody, I'm Michael Costa, and this is Costa Doing Business. All right, big shout out to our sponsor. Cocaine. Cocaine. It's not illegal if you're white. Now, now that we know who our next president is, we're tracking a whole lot of movement in the market. So how can you get rich off a Trump presidency? Hit me. Private prison stocks rose overnight after Trump selected immigration hardliner Tom Homan.

[Ronny Chang]

As his.

[Desi Lydon]

Borders are two big private prison companies, Geo and Corecivic, both went up by more than 56%. And the chairman of Corecivic said, this is an unprecedented opportunity for them. They expect to make a lot of money in the coming months. Lot of money. Prison stocks are booming, and I'm a buying. All right, if profits off prisons are a crime, well, then lock me up. And if being filthy rich is a crime, then throw away the key. And if vehicular manslaughter is a crime, oh, I guess I'm in a lot of trouble. Uh. Oh. Honestly, being in prison seems like fun. I mean, shooting hoops all day, drinking toilet wine all night, and in the friendships, you know, I mean, what can I say? It's actually hard making male friends as an adult. I mean, shout out to my only true friend, Rick. You're my ride or die, my man. Oh, moving on. Let's go. What else can we expect from President T. Rump? We all know he got that ass. We also know that he ain't gonna do shit about climate change, which means it's time to make that climate. Ch, ch, ch, ch. Change.

[Ronny Chang]

We've seen clean energy companies like solar companies see their stocks relatively lower, and in many cases, absolutely lower compared to oil and gas. Stocks.

[Desi Lydon]

Bye bye solar. Hello, superstorms. All right? And that means a category 5 cash a cane are coming. And my bank account is about to be flooded, okay? And to capitalize, I'm buying any company that makes raincoats. All right? Rain hats, galoshes. Rule of thumb, if Paddington wears it, I'm buying it, all right? Because let me tell you people, it's gonna rain. It's gonna rain. It's gonna rain. Look, I'm in the middle of a divorce right now, and I hid a lot of my assets in Chili's gift cards. Um, we're having a serious custody battle and I'm just hoping I can get my baby back. Baby back. Baby back. Seriously though, it's getting really ugly. And it's said, of course, the market isn't just reacting to Trump. It's also reacting to his cabinet picks. Hit me.

[Jesse Lydick]

Shares of dental care supplier Henry Schein rose Yesterday, up by 7 and a half percent. It's the best day since 2022. Investors are of course speculating that RFK Jr, Donald Trump's pick for Health and Human Services Secretary, might push to remove fluoride from the US Water supply.

[Desi Lydon]

Open your mouth and say, ah. Yeah, look, if you're not buying dental supplies, your totally mental. My guys, I'm talking drills, tiny mirrors, and the third best cane, Novocaine. All right? It goes, it goes cocaine, Michael Caine and Novocaine. And yeah, yep, yep. And yeah, I've had all three on my gums before, so I know what I'm talking about. What's that? You want another bump, Trump, to make your wallet plump? I'm talking woke signage stock. Give me that thing. Because the libs are gonna be spending a lot of money on cute little signs in their window because they don't stand for hate. Meanwhile, I'll be standing on a yacht in Monaco with my buddy Rick. Look, we're not. Look, we're not gay, but we do travel well together.

[Jesse Lydick]

All right?

[Desi Lydon]

Now, last but not least, here's one more stock tip to make that cheddar drip. I'm talking about something every American is going to need these next four years. Kleenex. Libs are crying in them because they lost. Trumpsters are jacking off in them because they want. And I need Kleenex because. Gimme them. Because I get a lot of nosebleeds for some reason. It's crazy. Now look, thanks for watching and as always, if you lose all your money because of me. Hey, hey. That's just the cost of doing business. Hey, Rick. Come into the line back there. Woo woo.

[Jesse Lydick]

We come back. Ronan Farrow will be joining me on the show, so don't go away.

[Narrator]

See Gladiator 2 only in theaters November 22nd. This film delivers thrilling action, a compelling story, emotionally charged performances and spectacle on a scale unlike anything else. Only Ridley Scott could pull off a cinematic marvel at this scale. With sweeping storytelling and relentless action, Gladiator 2 stands out in the modern cinematic landscape with its immersive visuals, incredible score and a gripping character driven narrative. The film stars an extraordinary cast including Paul Mescal, Pedro Pascal with Denzel Washington and Connie Nielsen reprising her role as Lucilla. The fate of Rome rests on an uneasy alliance between Lucius and Macrinus who need each other to further their ambitions. Gladiator 2 is a complex political chess game, action packed revenge story with a beating emotional core. You will be on the edge of your seat as you experience the unexpected twists and turns throughout the film. Get ready for an epic, immersive, visceral experience made for the big screen. See Gladiator 2 only in theaters on November 22nd. Don't miss it.

[Dr. Joy Hardin Bradford]

This is Dr. Joy Hardin Bradford from Therapy for Black Girls. There are millions of books on Amazon, so there's a reading feeling for everyone. So if you're after that excited haha feeling like when you discover you have a lot in common with Vikings or something, Amazon has books for you. Or maybe you enjoy the sort of nervous haha that comes when the hero barely escapes the zombies. Or maybe you like the smuggler that comes when the villain gets what he deserves. You know Amazon has it all. Amazon Books that reading feeling awaits.

[Pets Best Insurance Representative]

The following ad is sponsored by Pets Best Insurance Services. Your pet is your bestie, your therapist your preferred match. It's easy to love them, even when they sneak your snacks. It's easy to protect them too with pet insurance coverage from Pets Best because it's all fun and games until they chew on something they shouldn't. With perfect timing, PetsBest helps protect your furry friend and your budget from this imperfect world. Get up to 90% on eligible vet bills for less than a dollar a day. Find your Perfect [e-mail] Pet insurance products offered and administered by Pets Best Insurance Services, LLC are underwritten by American Pet Insurance Company or Independence American Insurance Company. For all terms, visit petsbest.com.

[Jesse Lydick]

Welcome back.

[Desi Lydon]

To the Daily Show.

[Jesse Lydick]

My guest tonight is a Pulitzer Prize winning journalist at the New Yorker and producer of the new HBO documentary Surveilled. Please welcome Ronan Farrow.

[Ronny Chang]

Hello.

[Jesse Lydick]

Oh My man. Right here.

[Ronny Chang]

How you holding up?

[Jesse Lydick]

Oh, you know, lots of self soothing.

[Ronny Chang]

What, did something happen?

[Jesse Lydick]

Oh, I can't remember anything in the past week.

[Ronny Chang]

Can you. Something, something, something. I could have asked or I could have talked to any number of governments spying on your phone, you know.

[Jesse Lydick]

Oh my God. There's no telling.

[Ronny Chang]

There's no telling.

[Jesse Lydick]

I'm so happy, happy to have you here. You are incredible. You won a Pulitzer Prize for your reporting on the MeToo movement. And now you're working on this documentary, surveilled, which is terrifying, mind you. And I don't want to sound paranoid, but who's watching? Do you think we're being recorded right now?

[Ronny Chang]

Nah, this, this totally private.

[Jesse Lydick]

Okay, good. Okay, good. Thank God. Thank God. No, it kind of shook me to my core to watch it. Yeah. And you were actually the target of COVID surveillance when you were doing your reporting on Harvey Weinstein. What happened? How did you know about that?

[Ronny Chang]

I was. And that was a mix of old fashioned human surveillance, like dudes staking out my apartment and. And some high tech. They're tracking my geolocation data through my phone. And look, that's mild stuff in comparison to the technology. It's cartoony.

[Jesse Lydick]

Almost like they were sitting in a white van eating cheesesteak.

[Ronny Chang]

Yeah. Old gum shoes. This is scarier, more insidious stuff. Technology like Pegasus is the example we use in the film where I get cameras into where it's coated and I look at the impact on the ground around the world where in one Western democracy after another, you know, Spain, Poland, Greece, we're seeing this being used against political dissidents, against activists, against journalists. So my own experiences being trailed and fearing my reporting was not gonna come out because sources would be intimidated really gave me this little window into this much larger issue where I just know that surveillance means shrinking space for democratic expression.

[Desi Lydon]

We.

[Ronny Chang]

And we've all got to worry about that.

[Jesse Lydick]

And this is a growing trend. This technology is only. It's becoming more and more booming as time goes on. So walk us through the process of how this type of technology works and who's using it.

[Ronny Chang]

It's a booming multibillion dollar industry. And the biggest companies like to claim that they sell this only to governments. So you have governments, whether they're repressive regimes in the developing world or they're western democracies that just don't have the capacity that say a CIA has that are buying this up. But the interesting thing is also United States government offices are buying this up. And actually in recent months we saw, for instance, ice, our immigration enforcement agency, buy a really powerful Israeli private spyware made by a private company, a company called Paragon. So they've got that now. We don't know how they're gonna use that. Donald Trump is coming in, and privacy law experts and immigration lawyers I'm talking to are saying there really aren't clearly defined restraints on whether that just turns this country into an Orwellian surveillance state where, you know, any text could be a thing that gets you retaliated against. Maybe if you're someone the government doesn't, like, deported, if you're someone awaiting an immigration hearing. This is frightening stuff that could really affect lives.

[Jesse Lydick]

There was a part of your documentary that stuck with me. You were speaking with a US Government official for the State Department, and he was saying he believed very much in the use of Pegasus and was saying it serves great purposes in terms of national security. But in the same breath, he said that you cannot put the technology back in the genie bottle, and anything that can be used for nefarious reasons will be.

[Ronny Chang]

Look, there are legitimate law enforcement applications for this kind of tech, certainly theoretically, in practice. I've seen cases where I get the argument, but the dangers are so great. It really, it is a case where we can't put the genie back in. And in that sense, it's like nukes. It's like any kind of weapon of mass destruction. And in fact, in fact, people at various companies that make this kind of spyware would make that comparison over and over again. Well, you know, we're just like a new kind of arms dealer. It's not our fault that there's not a Geneva Convention equivalent for this kind of technology. You guys regulate it. We're just, like, living by the rules of the game, selling this stuff. But what we see over and over again is when this crops up, like in the film, I go to Barcelona and I find a big community of politicians and activists, peaceful people who are just expressing themselves, who were spied on by the Spanish government. What we see over and over again is it's linked to violent crackdowns. In that case, there were arrests around this. We've seen more extreme cases, like Pegasus was found on phones around Jamal Khashoggi, the journalist who was murdered in Saudi Arabia. So I think this is something where you might think to yourself, like, it's not going to affect me. They don't want my nudes, like, what, you know, what is on my phone.

[Jesse Lydick]

Well, that's true. No one does want money. I've tried to push them on people and no one wants to.

[Ronny Chang]

Well, we are going to work on that self esteem issue. You know, you're going to get that validation probably from a Western government that's been corrupted by surveillance technology. They will want your nudes.

[Jesse Lydick]

I'll take it where I can get it.

[Ronny Chang]

But the thing is, you could fall into one of these dragnets. In the film, there are just innocent bystanders we talk to who aren't political at all. And suddenly they're getting hacked. And like maybe they're a doctor and it's their patient sensitive information and you don't know how that's going to be weaponized by people with nefarious intent. So the thing that I'm working on a new print piece on this right now for the New Yorker where I write. And the thing I've been saying, never heard of it. It's a, you know, a cute little publication called the New Yorker. An example, by the way, of the dying art of journalism. Please support journalism, everyone, please.

[Desi Lydon]

It's important.

[Ronny Chang]

Right now, we need it. The New Yorker does great work. And I just keep getting told by experts in this technology, if our government doesn't curtail the use of this, and there's a lot of skepticism that this incoming administration will, you won't know if you're on some target list. You won't know if your phone is being hacked or how that data is being used. So I think it's easy to see this as a distant issue, but what we're seeing around the world is it can come for anyone. And we should really worry about it because it does shrink the space for democracy. If we can't express ourselves freely without being watched, if reporters can't guard their sources at a time when Donald Trump is threatening to imprison reporters who protect their sources, if it's much harder for me to do my work, that's a much worse environment for the will of the people being expressed.

[Jesse Lydick]

Yeah.

[Ronny Chang]

So I'm hoping people see the movie and they get like, okay, this is actually something we should freak out about a little bit.

[Jesse Lydick]

Yeah, for the love of God, watch the movie.

[Ronny Chang]

Watch the movie and restart your phone every day. That's why. One practical piece of advice, because a lot of forms of this kind of spyware will be foiled by a reboot as benign. That seems so banal, but it really is a good step to keep everything updated is the other thing. That's also what I mean. That seems obvious.

[Jesse Lydick]

So things that people can do at home, regular citizens can do at home, turn your phone off every day, throw your smartphone in the river and use a flip phone.

[Ronny Chang]

Put it right in the microwave, get that Adele flip phone. And honestly, if you care about this issue, write to your representative, call in and say, hey, legislators, we really do need this to be regulated.

[Jesse Lydick]

There was a part in your documentary where I literally watched a guy wrap his laptop in tin foil.

[Ronny Chang]

Yeah.

[Jesse Lydick]

Like, I thought that was just something that people said, but he was literally. He was wrapping it like a baked potato and transporting it. Is that where we're at right now, or are we going to have to start doing that?

[Ronny Chang]

Truly, that is what activists are doing in some of these places now. You know, experts vary on exactly how effective the whole tinfoil approach is. I'm not saying you can really rely on that for security. We need better policies, not just better tinfoil.

[Jesse Lydick]

Right.

[Ronny Chang]

That said, you know, it is supposed to theoretically create a Faraday cage. Like, you get in an elevator when you lose reception. And in that case, in the film, there are these investigators racing to find a live example of an infection so they can reverse engineer this particular kind of spyware. And it did actually work. They were able to get the data off that laptop and engineer a patch to foil that spyware company, at least momentarily.

[Jesse Lydick]

Incredible. There is this sort of prevailing attitude in America of, you know, if I'm not doing anything wrong, who cares if I'm being spied on? What's misguided about Americans having that attitude?

[Ronny Chang]

Well, like we just talked about, this is a set of policies that affect all of our rights. The moment that journalists can't do their work without their sources in the government being exposed, you wouldn't have the Pentagon Papers, you know, you wouldn't have Watergate. The moment activists can't say, hey, I object to a policy without potentially being spied on, like they have been in a lot of these Western democracies I look at in my print reporting and in this film, you don't have dissent, and you have authoritarians with a firmer grit on power. So regardless of what side of the aisle you're on, you should want dissent and the ability to resist freely without interference. That's born of surveillance. And we've just seen the story over and over again. When this technology encroaches, it's not fine. It's not just your nudes. It's your safety. People are getting targeted and they're getting hurt, and discourse evaporates really rapidly.

[Jesse Lydick]

You are doing such important, brave work. I can't even imagine the level of stress that you must experience day in and day out. What do you do to escape to like take care of yourself? Do you binge watch old episodes of West Wing or what do you do?

[Ronny Chang]

Just throwing that phone right in the river like you proposed my little Anne Hathaway. End of Devil Wears Prada moment. Just whoop in the fountain. I wish sometimes. But you know, I'm really proud to be able to do the work of journalism at a time like this, when we have a leader coming in who has threatened to lock up journalists who don't reveal sources. We need journalists who won't reveal sources and we need sources who will continue to. And I'm very lucky. And I write for a place that believes in that, that supports that. You know, HBO's putting out this documentary, so there are still people telling these stories and I want to be a part of that. And, you know, to de stress, I'll just have to play a lot of Mario Kart, you know.

[Jesse Lydick]

Well, there you go. That's what we have. Well, we are so incredibly grateful for your work. Thank you for all that you do. We are beyond grateful. Thank you for being here today.

[Desi Lydon]

Thank you so much.

[Ronny Chang]

Thank you everybody.

[Jesse Lydick]

The HBO original documentary surveil debuts November 20th on HBO. And Max Ronan Farrow, everyone. We're going to take a quick risk.

[Pets Best Insurance Representative]

And we'll be right back after this.

[Jesse Lydick]

That's our show for tonight. Now here it is, your moment of.

[Desi Lydon]

Zen can Trump what happens if he loses Gates?

[Ronny Chang]

Does it, does it leave a stink?

[Desi Lydon]

I don't think so. And I also don't think Gaetz doesn't get it because of a sex scandal. I think Gaetz specifically doesn't get this because he's an asshole to people and people in the Senate don't like him. Explore more shows from the Daily show podcast universe by searching the Daily Show. Wherever you get your podcast, watch the Daily show weeknights at 1110 Central on Comedy Central and stream full episodes anytime on Paramount plus.

[Dr. Joy Hardin Bradford]

Paramount podcasts.

[Narrator]

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