Trump Brags About Secret “Discombobulator” Weapon Amid Global Epstein Fallout | Jon Shenk and Marcus Capone

Summary

The Daily Show: Ears Edition – Episode Summary

Title: Trump Brags About Secret “Discombobulator” Weapon Amid Global Epstein Fallout | Jon Shenk and Marcus Capone
Date: February 6, 2026
Host: Michael Kosta
Guests: Jon Shenk (documentary director), Marcus Capone (Navy SEAL veteran)
News Team Contributors: Desi Lydic, Marcus Capone, John Schenck

Episode Overview

This episode, hosted by Michael Kosta and The Daily Show news team, dives into a chaotic stew of recent headlines: President Trump’s wild claims about a new military “discombobulator” weapon, the worldwide fallout of the Epstein Files (especially for the British Royal Family), and Trump’s ongoing beef with the NFL. The latter half is a compelling interview with Navy SEAL Marcus Capone and filmmaker Jon Shenk about their Netflix documentary In Waves and War, which chronicles the use of psychedelics to treat PTSD in veterans.

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Key Segments and Discussion Points

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1. The Discombobulator: Trump’s Cartoonish Secret Weapon

Time: 00:10–04:05

• Headline: President Trump tells the New York Post the U.S. used a secret weapon—the "discombobulator"—to capture Venezuelan ex-leader Nicolas Maduro.

• Comic skepticism:

  • Kosta likens the name to a cheap amusement park ride:

    “The discombobulator. That sounds like the worst ride at Six Flags. Don’t go over there, dude, somebody puked on the discombobulator.” (01:36, Kosta)

  • Questions how a weapon with such a silly name could be advanced, or even real.

• Trump’s loose lips:

  • Kosta jokes Trump can’t keep secrets, referencing what he’d do if aliens landed:

    “This dude cannot keep a secret. This is how you know there’s no aliens. Because day one, Trump would have been like, ‘I’m not supposed to say anything, but they have three boobs.’” (02:11, Kosta)

  • Later, Desi Lydic reports a Senior US Official thinks Trump is conflating various tech into an imaginary weapon (03:56).

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2. Epstein Files: Royals, Emails, and International Fallout

Time: 04:05–11:20

• Highlights from the Epstein Files:

  • Prince Andrew evicted from his Windsor home by King Charles due to Epstein links.
  • Kosta teases the royal family for inbreeding and mocks the idea of Andrew’s “punishment”:

    “Oh no, not a cottage on the private estate. Only two butlers. And are we sure we want Prince Andrew far from the public eye? That’s kind of how we got into this mess.” (05:20, Kosta)
    Suggests a 24-hour webcam for Andrew “like a pregnant giraffe at the zoo.”

  • Sarah Ferguson’s (Andrew’s ex-wife) emails to Epstein praising him after his 2008 conviction reveal her “worst taste in men”:

    “‘You are a legend. I really don’t have the words to describe my love… just marry me.’ Wow. That is the worst thing Fergie has ever written. And yes, I’m including the Let’s Get Retarded song.” (06:17, Kosta)

  • Fergie’s charity shuts down in the fallout:

    “Sorry kids. The duchess emailed a pedophile, so no mosquito nets for you.” (08:45, Kosta)

• International Impact:

  • Politicians in Slovakia, the UK, and Bill Clinton in the US are embroiled in the scandal – but notably not Trump.
  • Kosta’s frustration:

    “I guess everybody in the damn files is gonna face consequences. Except for Donald Trump.” (09:47, Kosta)

  • Trump surprisingly expresses fondness for Clinton, confusing the team (“What? He likes Bill Clinton now? Game recognize game moment.” 09:55, Kosta).

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3. Trump vs. NFL: The Art of the Altercation

Time: 12:29–18:17

• Trump’s Grudge:

  • Trump repeatedly slams the NFL for being too “soft” and complains about new safety rules:

    “Football’s become soft... Got a little ding on the head. No, no, you can’t play for the rest of the season. What used to be considered a great tackle, a violent head on head… it’s become weak. And you know what? It’s boring.” (13:08, Kosta as Trump)

  • Desi Lydic satirically explains why viewers “watch football for the love of the sport. And also the butts. Mostly the butts.” (13:28, Lydic)

• NFL Beef Origin:

  • Trump’s decades-old resentment driven by failed bids to buy NFL teams and the downfall of his USFL venture:
    • Stephen A. Smith reveals:

      “He [Trump] called me in 2014… ‘If these mother***ers get in my way, I’m gonna get them all back. I’m gonna run for president. That’s what he said.’” (16:51, recounted by Marcus Capone)

• Super Bowl Antics:

  • Trump complains about the “ridiculous kickoff rules” and expresses puzzlement over Bad Bunny as a halftime act.

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4. Interview: Jon Shenk & Marcus Capone on In Waves and War

Time: 20:54–33:13

Marcus Capone’s Journey

• SEAL for 13 years, struggled with “hidden wounds of war” (PTSD).
• Antidepressants failed him for 7 years; wife Amber helped organize an ibogaine therapy session in Mexico.
  • “I grew up in New York. I went to Catholic high school. For me, this was extremely foreign.” (21:23, Capone)
  • “Go down to Mexico, do a psychedelic, and you’re going to get better. So that’s kind of how this got presented.” (22:04, Capone)

Jon Shenk on the Film

• Drawn to story: “Navy SEALs tripping balls… there’s just got to be a story there.” (22:17, Shenk)
• Film uses animation to visualize ibogaine experiences—a “life review” common in veteran testimonies.

The Psychedelic Therapy Experience

• Ibogaine is a long, intense 6-8 hour trip, likened to compressing years of talk therapy into one night.

  • “They call it the grandfather of psychedelics. It’s a very difficult experience… Think of taking five to ten years of talk therapy and literally putting in a couple hours in a night.” (25:22–25:36, Capone)

• Highly controlled, clinical setting with medical oversight.

The Mental Health Crisis in Veterans

• Kosta: “Military members are committing suicide almost four times more here in the United States than combat deaths over there in war. … What are civilians missing about when you come back?” (22:52, Kosta)
• Capone: “We lost roughly 7,000 killed in combat since 9/11. Today, we have over 150,000 veterans that have died by suicide.” (23:21, Capone)
• Urges US-based research and approval; laments veterans must go overseas for care.

Surprising Impact

• Ibogaine often helps veterans work through childhood traumas, not just combat:

  “They very often get under the influence of ibogaine and are reliving experiences… they’re starting to think about why did I become a soldier in the first place. … This is not just a story for veterans. It’s a story for so many people who are walking around with trauma.” (31:17, Shenk)

Advocacy and Access

• Capone’s nonprofit, VETS (Veterans Exploring Treatment Solutions), has helped over 1,200 veterans access ibogaine treatment, covering costs ($10,000–$12,000 per participant).
• State and federal sabers are starting to rattle in favor of law reform and research funding.

Advice to Future SEALs

• “Take care of yourself. If you need to take a pause, take a pause… our systems, they’re just not made to go 1,000 RPM consistently.” (32:11, Capone)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Michael Kosta on the "discombobulator":
  “If I’m shot by a laser that liquefies my organs until they leak out of my eyes, I don’t want to tell my family that I was dinky Zoinked to death.” (01:40)

• Desi Lydic on the NFL beef:
  “Are you seriously watching football for the violence? Because the rest of us are watching it for the love of the sport. And also the butts. Mostly the butts.” (13:28)

• Stephen A. Smith’s Trump warning:
  “He said, ‘If these mother****ers get in my way, I’m gonna get them all back. I’m gonna run for president. That’s what he said.’” (16:56)

• Marcus Capone’s homecoming:
  “I walked around the corner and [my wife] said you could just see this glow… I didn’t have this dark look anymore.” (29:43)

• Jon Shenk on trauma:
  “This is not just a story for veterans. It’s a story for so many people who are walking around with trauma in this country and around the world.” (31:46)

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Episode Timeline & Timestamps

| Segment | Start | End | |---|---|---| | Trump & the Discombobulator | 00:10 | 04:05 | | Epstein Files Fallout | 04:05 | 11:20 | | Trump vs. NFL | 12:29 | 18:17 | | Interview (Capone and Shenk) | 20:54 | 33:13 |

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Summary Takeaways

• Satirical edge: The episode is filled with the team's signature barbs, sarcasm, and irreverent banter about serious topics—demonizing ridiculous secrecy, mocking the royal family’s privilege, and lampooning Trump’s perennial NFL feuds.
• Documentary insight: The interview with Marcus Capone and Jon Shenk is moving, candid, and practical—a rare, respectful pivot into the prospects and lived reality of psychedelic therapy for trauma.
• Key impact: Listeners get both a comedic spin on the disarray of politics and a hopeful, human look at veteran healing.

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Resources Mentioned

• In Waves and War streaming on Netflix
• VETS (Veterans Exploring Treatment Solutions): vetsolutions.org

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This summary captures the essential discussions, key quotes, and signature comic moments from The Daily Show’s February 6, 2026 Ears Edition episode. For listeners and non-listeners alike, it brings the tone, humor, and heart of the episode to life.

Transcript

[Michael Costa]

This episode is brought to you by.

[Marcus Capone]

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[Michael Costa]

You're listening to Comedy Central. From the most trusted journalists at Comedy Central. It's America's only source for news. This is the Daily show with your host, Michael Costa. Oh, yeah, baby. We got a good one tonight. Welcome to the Daily Show. I'm Michael Costa. We've got so much to talk about tonight. Jeffrey Epstein's a royal pain. There's a big beef at the super bowl this weekend, and the US Military has a new top secret weapon that Donald Trump can't wait to tell us all about. Hey, let's get into the headlines. It's been a month since U.S. forces captured Nicolas Maduro right out of his Venezuelan compound and sent him to Brooklyn to serve out his life as a barista in Bushwick. And if you're wondering how a military run by these two geniuses were able to pull off that operation, turns out they had a little help.

[Desi Lydic]

President Trump just told the New York Post that a secret new US Weapon was used in that operation that captured Maduro to shut down Venezuelan equipment. He said the discombobulator.

[Michael Costa]

The discombobulator. That sounds like the worst ride at Six Flags. Don't go over there, dude. Somebody puked on the discombobulator. Personally, I don't think our most advanced new weapons should have whimsical names. If I'm shot by a laser that liquefies my organs until they leak out of my eyes, I don't want to tell my family that I was dinky Zoinked to death. Can anyone follow up with the President about this weapon? You talked about the weapon, the discombobulator. Discombobulator. Well, I'm not allowed to talk about it. What does it do? Let me just tell you. You know what it does? None of their equipment works. That's what it does. Okay, so you said you're not allowed to talk about it, but it kind of feels like you talked about it. This dude cannot keep a secret. This is how you know there's no aliens. Because day one, Trump would have been like, I'm not supposed to say anything, but they have three boobs. But thanks.

[Marcus Capone]

Yeah.

[Michael Costa]

Three boobs. Hell yeah. Hell, yeah. Hell yeah. I love this audience. But thanks for the lowdown on the discombobulator. By the way. Who the came up with this name? It was my name. I'm very proud of the name. Yeah. And it's is a great name. Mr. President, it does not sound like a weapon in Paw Patrol at all. But still, can you be a bit more specific about how the discombobulator discombobulates? Like, is it a laser beam or electrical pulse? Everything was discombobulated. It was, you know, practically a shot. Wasn't, you know, they were ready.

[John Schenck]

Right.

[Michael Costa]

And when we came. You saw this on the video. You could tell Tom it discombobulated everything. Tom, you idiot, what part of discombobulator don't you understand? Do you think I'm just talking nonsense here? This is almost unbelievable. Trump is announcing a secret weapon that disarms the enemy and ruins their equipment and disables their soldiers. This sounds too good to be true.

[Desi Lydic]

A senior US Official tells US Senator that Trump may be conflating several capabilities into a single weapon that doesn't actually exist.

[Marcus Capone]

Okay, okay.

[Michael Costa]

So I'm starting to think the President might have walked in front of the discombobulator. Let's move on to the story that's been discombobulating the entire world. Everybody is still binging the latest season of the Epstein Files. So let's get into all the fallout in another installment of the very normal and not shady handling of the Epstein files. It's pretty boring stuff. For the past week, people have been pouring over the Epstein files and learning all the connections he had to the rich and powerful. Few people have been as disgraced as former Prince Andrew, but somehow this next batch has made him even disgrace.

[Desi Lydic]

Ier former Prince Andrew has moved out of his longtime Windsor home.

[Michael Costa]

His brother the King, evicting him from the royal estate over his links to Jeffrey Epstein.

[Marcus Capone]

Oof.

[Michael Costa]

Wow. Kicked out by his own brother, who is also his second cousin and his fifth uncle, 12th removed. The point is, there's a lot of incest in the royal family. I'm glad he's getting evicted. And I think we can all agree it is much funnier when a British pedophile has to go door to door in their new neighborhood. Like, oi, Governor, I'm a pedo, innit? Cheerio. Anyway, let's check out the shithole that former Prince Andrew is being sent to. Andrew has moved to a cottage on the King's private estate in Sandringham. Far from the public eye, Sandringham is a sprawling estate. It sets on 80 square kilometres of grounds. There are multiple houses and concret that are on this site. Oh, no, not a cottage on the private estate. Only two butlers. And are we sure we want Prince Andrew far from the public eye? That's kind of how we got into this mess. If you ask me, he should have a 24 hour webcam on him like a pregnant giraffe at the zoo. How is it that it's impossible for any regular person to affordable real estate? And they're giving away fancy cottages to alleged pedophiles? Next time I go to an open house, I'm going to be like, honey, tell them you're 12. Look, nobody's going to shed a tear for a prince who has to downsize to the bad palace. But the ones that I truly feel bad for are the spouses. Imagine being Andrew's ex wife, Sarah Ferguson, right now. How devastated she must be to learn that her husband had so many links with Jeffrey Epstein. The former prince's ex wife, Sarah Ferguson is back in the headlines for her links to Epstein. The latest files revealing emails she sent to Epstein after he was found guilty of soliciting a minor for prostitution in 2008. She wrote, you are a legend. I really don't have the words to describe my love. Gratitude for your generosity and kindness. Kiss, kiss. I'm at your service. Just marry me. Wow. Wow. That is the worst thing Fergie has ever written. And yes, I'm including the let's Get Retarded song. You wanted Jeffrey Epstein to be your husband. Really dodged a bullet, Fergie. He could have said yes, and then you would have ended up married to a huge pedophile. Oh, wait. Either way, I am very happy to present Sarah Ferguson with this lifetime achievement award for having the worst taste in men. Congratulations, Fergie. Better luck next time, Cheryl Hines. Hey, hey. It's hey, hey. It's an honor just to be nominated. So. Yeah, this isn't a good look. And based on what happened to Andrew, I assume Fergie would be facing some sort of consequences on her own. On Monday evening, Ferguson's charitable foundation, Sarah's Trust, announced it will shortly close. For the foreseeable future, the charity is shutting down. That doesn't seem fair. Sorry, kids. The duchess emailed a pedophile, so no mosquito nets for you. Now. Look, nobody enjoys watching the British Royal family squirm more than me. I'm still mad about that whole stamp tax thing, but if we're talking about fallout from associating with Jeffrey Epstein, I think there might be someone else who should be facing some consequences.

[Desi Lydic]

Hmm.

[Michael Costa]

Like not a royal. More like a politician. In Slovakia, a top advisor to the Prime Minister has resigned after emails showed he met with Epstein in 2018. No, no, not some minister in Slovakia. It's not even a real place. When I said certain politicians should be held accountable, I meant, you know, like someone running a country.

[Desi Lydic]

There's a world leader facing a political.

[Michael Costa]

Crisis over the Epstein files.

[Desi Lydic]

That's British Prime Minister Keir Starmer.

[Michael Costa]

No, no, no, no, no. Not Great Britain. That's not even a real place. Look, I'm gonna be very clear about this. The President of the United States. Someone needs to demand answers from the U.S. former President Bill Clinton agreed to.

[John Schenck]

Testify in the House Oversight Committee's Epstein probe.

[Michael Costa]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Not a former. You know what?

[Marcus Capone]

It.

[Michael Costa]

Okay. I guess everybody in the damn files is gonna face consequences. Except for Donald Trump. And on top of that, he must be so happy that his nemesis, Bill Clinton is getting in trouble for this. It bothers me that somebody's going after Bill Clinton. See, I like Bill Clinton. I still like Bill Clinton. What do you like about him? Uh, I liked. Well, I liked his behavior toward me. I thought he got me. He understood me. What? He likes Bill Clinton now? Hmm. Either Trump just wants to get on Clinton's good side before he testifies about Epstein, or this is just a game recognize game moment. I'd like to acknowledge that we are standing on sacred land where Bill Clinton got a hummer from an internal. Props to the OG. I can barely wrap my head around all the twists and turns in this story. Trump is in the Epstein files maybe more than anyone, but Bill Clinton is the only one who has to testify about it. But instead of being happy about that, Trump is upset. I feel like I'm losing my mind. This whole thing, it just. It has me, I don't know. Discombobulated? Exactly. That's what I was looking for. That's the word. When we come back, Trump takes on the NFL. Don't go away.

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[Michael Costa]

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[Michael Costa]

Welcome back to the Daily Show. Super bowl licks is this Sunday, but President Trump won't be attending. He says it's because it's too far away, but there's actually maybe a deeper reason behind it. For more, we turn to Desi Lydic in our ongoing segment, the Art of the Altercation.

[Desi Lydic]

Donald Trump approaches conflict like a professional athlete with focus, dedication, and a team of neurologists ready to lie for him. So it's no wonder that one of his greatest beefs is with the National Football League and he can't shut up about it.

[Michael Costa]

Football's become soft. These new and very much softer NFL rules. Concussion. Oh.

[Marcus Capone]

Oh.

[Michael Costa]

Got a little ding on the head. No, no, you can't play for the rest of the season what used to be considered a great tackle. A violent head on head. Violent. It's become weak. And you know what? It's boring.

[Desi Lydic]

Are you seriously watching football for the violence? Because the rest of us are watching it for the love of the sport. And also the butts. Mostly the butts. Yeah, she gets it. She gets it. Also, football is still. Are we sure he's even watching football? The games are so boring now. It's just five gay guys helping people turn their lives around. And what the hell is going on with Karamo? No aspect of the NFL is safe from Trump's ire. Over the years, he's threatened to fire their players. He uninvited the Eagles to the White House. He told the commanders to go back to the racist name or name their stadium after him.

[Marcus Capone]

Look.

[Desi Lydic]

Same thing. And who could forget his worst offense of all? Calling Rihanna's halftime show an epic fail. Are you kidding me? I'm sorry, did I miss the Lee Greenwood halftime show where he rocked the super bowl while pregnant? What's that? Oh, I did. Oh, it was in 1981. And he looked stunning. Okay, my bad. And there's one other gripe he has with the NFL that he just can't let go of.

[Michael Costa]

And speaking of football, maybe we can get the NFL to drop that ridiculous kickoff sit. What the hell are they doing? What is that? I watched a game the other day. I said, what the hell happened? They just kicked off and nobody moved.

[Desi Lydic]

Okay, that was the day before the election. His closing argument to the voters was, they don't kick the ball from where they used to kick the ball. It is such a stupid argument. That it took him all the way to the White House. But Trump didn't always hate the NFL. As with most of his enemies, he's angry because it rejected his advances. Starting in the 80s, Trump tried to buy a bunch of teams, but he never quite sealed the deal. He bought a knockoff from the United States Football League. The USFL was like the NFL's dumb cousin, but not like a. Not like a hot cousin. More like a weird cousin who's desperate to kiss you because you're the hot cousin. Darren. And Trump let the NFL know he was coming for them.

[Michael Costa]

Are you at war with the NFL? The answer is we are in a.

[Marcus Capone]

Form of war right now with the NFL.

[Michael Costa]

There's no question about it.

[Marcus Capone]

So we're gonna be around for a long time, fellas.

[Desi Lydic]

Oh, you hear that, NFL? The USFL is coming for your ass. Cause Trump always wins.

[Michael Costa]

The league collapses. With many critics pointing the blame directly at Trump.

[Desi Lydic]

Like I was saying, Trump always wins at collapsing the thing. He puts his name on this. This guy was playing 3D football. After almost destroying the NFL, Trump sat out a few seasons, and then his pathological thirst came out of retirement. And unlike his past attempts, this one had consequences that no one saw coming. Well, no one but Stephen A. Smith.

[Marcus Capone]

He called me in 2014.

[Michael Costa]

He said, Stephen A. I'm trying to buy the Buffalo Bills.

[Marcus Capone]

If these mother get in my way.

[Michael Costa]

Talking about the NFL ownership, these mother get in my way, I'm gonna get them all back. I'm gonna run for president. That's what he said.

[Desi Lydic]

First of all, thanks for the warning. Stephen A. Smith. How is this the one thing you heard about and didn't immediately say on camera? And what the NFL. We're on the brink of nuclear war over Greenland because you wouldn't let him have the Buffalo Bills. This is the worst the NFL has ever done. And I'm including the time Brett Favre sent dick pics while wearing Crocs. Which brings us to the super bowl this weekend. And Trump's already been pre complaining about the Bad Bunny halftime show.

[Michael Costa]

I never heard of him. I don't know who he is. I don't know why they're doing it. It's like, crazy. While we're at it, I'd like them to change the kickoff rule, which looks ridiculous. Oh, my God.

[Desi Lydic]

Shut up about the kickoff already. Just watch soccer. So who will ultimately win the Altercation Bowl? Donald Trump or the NFL? No one knows for sure. Well, maybe Stephen A. Smith knows. Hey, Stephen, next time, call us.

[Michael Costa]

Thank you, Desi. When we come back, John Schenck and Marcus Capone will be joining me on the show. Don't go away. Desi Lydon.

[Desi Lydic]

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[Michael Costa]

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[Marcus Capone]

And finding your way in life's next chapter.

[Michael Costa]

Big Age stars comedy legends Jennifer Lewis, Cedric the Entertainer and Niecy Nash Betts. Big Age follows recently retired couple Dot and Butch Watts reluctant relocation to their new Floridian home, Sunset Gardens, a senior community that is anything but relaxing. In Barris Retirement Community, Dot and Butch encounter a parade of unforgettable personalities who.

[Marcus Capone]

Push their 50 year marriage to the limit.

[Michael Costa]

There's Butch's flirtatious ex flame Ethel, played by Nash Betts, spiritually possessed neighbors, pesky pill pushing couples and the ferociously competitive Stevenator. Through its blend of outrageous comedy, Key Party anyone and touching revelations, Big Age explores what it means to grow older without growing old at heart. Listen to Kenya Barris new laugh out Loud Audible original comedy Big Age starring Jennifer Lewis, Cedric the Entertainer and Niecy Nash Betts. Big Age Age does funny things. Go to audible.com bigage series to start listening today. Welcome back to Daily Show. My guests tonight are behind the Netflix documentary that explains Navy SEALs using psychedelic drug therapies to combat PTSD called in waves and war. Please welcome Navy SEAL veteran Marcus Capone and director John Schenck. One of you is a former Navy seal. One of you is a film director.

[John Schenck]

Guess who's who?

[Michael Costa]

Marcus. Thank you for your service. Thank you. Thank you for all that you've done for this country. Thank you for having me.

[Marcus Capone]

Thank you.

[Michael Costa]

Tell us, tell us a little about your story and how we ended up here.

[Marcus Capone]

So we'll just start. I spent 13 years on active duty. As you mentioned, I was a Navy SEAL and enjoyed every moment of it. Towards the latter part of my career, started experiencing, I call it the hidden wounds of war. And in 2010 I started seeing some doctors and I got prescribed my first, antidepressant. And from there I was on them for seven years. And as we know now, antidepressants fail about 50% of the people who are prescribed them. And I was one of them. And so I wish had someone gave me a lifeline earlier. But for me, it was seven years of failed treatments. And lucky for me, my wife Amber is working in the background. A few doctors and organized me to go down to Mexico and do an experimental investigative psychedelic drug called ibogaine. Most people never heard of it. I never heard of it. I grew up in New York. I went to Catholic high school. For me, this was extremely foreign.

[Michael Costa]

Also, normally people go to Mexico to do drugs and they don't tell their wives.

[Marcus Capone]

Exactly. This was the opposite. Go down to Mexico, do a psychedelic, and you're going to get better. So that's kind of how this got presented.

[Michael Costa]

John, how did you end up making a film about it, and why is that important for you?

[John Schenck]

Well, Amber and Marcus started talking about this amazing treatment that he got in Mexico in 20. I think it was 2017. We heard about it a couple years later, and we thought, Navy seals tripping balls. There's just something. There's got to be a story there. In all seriousness, we met Amber and Marcus and they told us their story, and we were just immediately hooked. And in the film, you see their backstory, you experience it with them. And then in the film, you get to go kind of inside their heads because we do this animation that simulates the ibogaine experience.

[Michael Costa]

Beautiful animation. We'll talk about that in a second. But one of the things that blew me away is military members are committing suicide almost four times here in the United States, more than combat deaths over there in war. And it's wild to me. We think about the lives over there, but we almost forget about the lives here. And I just. What are we missing? What are the civilians missing about when you come back?

[Marcus Capone]

So, Michael, to put it in context, we lost roughly 7,000 those killed in combat since 9 11. Today we have over 150,000 veterans that have died by suicide. And many people don't know that number. That's a huge number. And so, like, what are we doing? What's wrong? You know, is it the system? Is it the individuals? Like, nobody has the answer right, but it's happening, and we need to do something about it. We don't need to keep sending people to Mexico to do an experimental drug. We need to have research here and do it here.

[Michael Costa]

It feels like there's boot. And I'm a civilian. I played college tennis. So just forgive me for not knowing the terminology, but there's boot camp, there's training to go in, but what happens when you come out?

[Marcus Capone]

There's not a lot of training. There are some programs set up, but they almost look like they're a check in the box for many. And most of us, especially in the special operations community, kind of go out and we try to do it on our own. You know, we did it on our own with teammates while we're in, and we try to do the same thing while we're out. It's very difficult transitioning, running around the mountains of Afghanistan. And next thing you know, you're in a shirt and tie, working in downtown Beverly Hills, you know, on a private bank team. And so very. Two different environments.

[Michael Costa]

One of the parts of the film that was so moving was you're. You're sharing combat stories and then 48 hours later, your families are talking about. You're sitting at the dinner table, but it looks like they're gone, they're not there. And I'm thinking, how the hell do you go from combat in Afghanistan to sitting with your family having dinner? What was. And I don't even know if I'm using the right word, but what is the experience of taking the medicine or the drug actually like? You share it very well in the film, but explain to us how that goes down.

[Marcus Capone]

I tell most people who watch the film, John and the team did an extremely good job in showing what the experience was like, except for being like on the drug itself. Right. But it was a, it was a long experience. Ibogaine is a, it's a long duration. It's about six to eight hour peak experience. Wow. It's not fun.

[Michael Costa]

It's not fun.

[Marcus Capone]

It's very difficult. They call it the grandfather of psychedelics. It's a very difficult experience. And the more garbage that you have that, and that those, those things turn up during these experiences. And so think of taking five to 10 years of talk therapy.

[Michael Costa]

Yeah.

[Marcus Capone]

And literally putting in a couple hours in a night.

[Michael Costa]

Gosh.

[Marcus Capone]

And so there's a lot. And you gotta prepare and so you get filled with and get rushed with all these different.

[Michael Costa]

Are you alone? Are you with people?

[Marcus Capone]

No, you're with everybody. It's extremely safe. You're with a whole medical team and you do a ton of blood work before you can screen out. It has a potential heart risk. So you do ekg, you can't have any stimulants in the system. You can't have any alcohol. So it's a very clinical medical procedure. But once you go in the experience, the individuals are watching you. Usually there's a therapist there, there's nurses there, cardiologist is there.

[Michael Costa]

The animation's amazing. I mean, you feel like you're in their brain. Did you have to coach the animators on that? Did they get it? Because most animators do a lot of drugs anyways. How did that go about and what was it like seeing your experience animated?

[John Schenck]

Well, we interviewed dozens of special operators who had been down to Mexico to do the treatment. And one thing that always comes up after ibogaine is they describe it like seeing a movie or a slideshow of your life. It's kind of this life review. And we knew right away we had to put that on screen somehow. And we were lucky to work with these incredible animators in England that ended up doing this thing where you're kind of in the present tense, but you're sort of watching scenes that happened from your life and you're suddenly able to get insight into that kind of psychological perspective that you might have had difficult getting before the ibogaine. That's really the magic of the drug.

[Michael Costa]

Yeah. What was it like seeing your experience animated? Have you even seen the film, Marcus? I haven't.

[Marcus Capone]

You're in it.

[John Schenck]

I have.

[Michael Costa]

You're in it. Is it good? No, it's great. I don't watch myself.

[Marcus Capone]

We worked with John and Bonnie, who just incredible award winning filmmakers for, you know, for years on this. So we were part of the whole process. And I think initially it was over four hours and got cut down, but I think they completely nailed it. I was extremely happy. And it premiered at Telluride and so the team went to Telluride and we were so nervous watching it because we didn't know what the audience, how they were gonna react. And after the movie was over, we showed it twice, two standing ovations. And I kind of just put my head in my lap and was just like, oh, you know, like it was received well. And I think we did and got across the message we were trying to.

[John Schenck]

Get across the day they came to San Francisco, where we're based, to see the rough cut for the first time was one of the most nervous days. Sure, it's so pretty, you know, you're putting on screen just the most intimate scenes from these people's lives.

[Michael Costa]

But that is what connects about the film. As I'm sitting on my couch watching these heroes, these men shedding it and crying and sharing the experiences that we civilians on the other side, we prefer to not think about what's actually happening over there. So tremendous job. The irony isn't lost on me that American veterans have to go to a different country, not this country, to get help. You've been showing the film for some legislators, right? Some state legislators. Tell me a little bit about that.

[John Schenck]

Yeah. You know, as you probably know, the zeitgeist around psychedelics is changing. You know, it's not the 1970s anymore. We realize that these drugs should not be scheduled one, the most dangerous.

[Michael Costa]

You know, it's labeled as scheduled one, which is the most illegal in this country.

[Marcus Capone]

High ability for abuse with no medical piece to the drug.

[John Schenck]

And we're realizing, as Marcus often says, that the opposite is kind of true. Right. There's clearly some value here. And in the film, you see the Stanford team studying ibogaine in particular. But yes, in Texas, in California, in South Carolina, there's starting to be movement. States are passing laws to funnel money from opioid abatement programs over to ibogaine research because the drug can be so effective with addiction issues. So we're starting to see some movement and we're hoping the federal government changes laws as well.

[Michael Costa]

Tell us. Yeah, Marcus, tell us. Tell us a little bit about vets, veterans exploring treatment solutions.

[Marcus Capone]

So when I came back from my treatment, Amber, I saw her immediately and she can just tell. She just said, I haven't seen this in 20 years.

[Michael Costa]

You came back?

[Marcus Capone]

I came back from the trip and.

[Michael Costa]

Your wife said she met me. I can tell something she said.

[Marcus Capone]

I walked around the corner and she said like you could just see this glow. And I didn't have this dark look anymore. And I didn't say I was okay.

[Michael Costa]

They are just wiser, always paying attention.

[Marcus Capone]

I wish we could listen to them a lot earlier.

[Michael Costa]

Right.

[Marcus Capone]

But you know, she's always right. And you know, I didn't say I'm better, we just kind of hug, embraced and I just said, this is it. This is exactly what the guys need. I said, we just need to figure out a way to pay this forward. And that's what started our, you know, our work.

[Michael Costa]

So your work helps other veterans go down and do this.

[Marcus Capone]

So I tell everybody with glue and tape, we put together a non profit. We didn't know what we were doing, but we wanted to pay it forward just like it was for me. And we started, we received our charity status in 2019 and to date now we've put over 1200 individuals fully paid for, for treatment. But we've helped Thousands now through the movie and through word of mouth. And so the word's getting out there. And what is it?

[Michael Costa]

What does it cost? And what's the time commitment for something like this?

[Marcus Capone]

It's quite expensive. You know, we have to have insurance coverage in the Future. It's roughly 10 to 12,000 per individual. But when you think about what that does for generations, that's like a small.

[Michael Costa]

I tell you what, I've definitely spent that on talk therapy.

[Marcus Capone]

100%, exactly.

[Michael Costa]

Yeah.

[John Schenck]

When you think about kind of an upfront cost versus an expense that goes on for years and years and years, it's actually a relatively cost effective thing to do.

[Michael Costa]

If people are feeling pain, you want them to feel better. And one of the things that was so interesting was I expected through some of these medicine drug experiences that they would be reliving combat experiences. But for some of the subjects, they almost were reliving childhood trauma. That was unrelated.

[John Schenck]

That was the big surprise for Bonnie and me as we went through this when we started interviewing folks ahead of time who had done the treatment. Of course, we talked to Marcus and Amber about this, is that they very often get under the influence of ibogaine, and they are actually reliving experiences that are trauma relived from their childhoods. And they're starting to think about, why did I become a soldier in the first place? These are very kind of deep, profound things and the kind of things that might come up in 20 years of talk therapy. Right, right. And that was really kind of the big picture lesson for us is this is not just a story for veterans. It's a story for so many people who are walking around with trauma in this country and around the world.

[Michael Costa]

Excellent film. Thank you for making it. Last question, Marcus, what advice would you have for a younger Navy SEAL or someone starting out now, entering the path that you've already been down?

[Marcus Capone]

What would you say if I had to do it all over again? I'd still do it. Many football players have head trauma. They'd still go out and play football because it's your love, it's your passion, it's what you want to do. And I'd say, go do that. But I'd say, take care of yourself. If you need to take a pause, take a pause. If you want to go back into fighting, go back into fighting. If you want to get out and do something else, do something else. But, you know, just be mindful of how you feel. Because our systems, they're just not made to go 1,000 RPM consistently and for many, some of my friends, 20 and 30 years, you know, over 15 combat deployments, they're on that red line forever. And so, you know, sometimes you just need to take a pause.

[Michael Costa]

Thank you very much for making the film. Thank you for sharing your story. In Waves and War is available to stream on Netflix. For more information and Marcus organization, go to vetsolutions.org Marcus Capone and John Schenck we're gonna take a quick break. We'll be right back after.

[Desi Lydic]

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[Michael Costa]

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[John Schenck]

This has been a Comedy Central.

[Michael Costa]

Podcast.

[Desi Lydic]

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