Kara Swisher Doesn't Want to Live Forever

Summary

Podcast Summary: Kara Swisher Doesn’t Want to Live Forever

The Dan Buettner Podcast – April 30, 2026

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Overview

In this insightful and high-spirited episode, Dan Buettner hosts renowned tech journalist and commentator Kara Swisher to explore the cultural and scientific currents surrounding longevity, healthspan, and the growing biohacking movement. Swisher, whose CNN series critiques the billionaire obsession with living forever, dives into what she’s learned about the limits of science, the danger of narcissism driving the long-life craze, and practical (and often unglamorous) truths about what it actually takes to age well.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Kara Swisher and the Longevity Craze

• Not Actually Aiming for Forever: Kara jokes about the premise of “wanting to live forever,” clarifying that her real goal is a high-quality healthspan into her 90s—not extreme longevity through tech or biohacks.

  “No, probably into my 90s in a relatively healthy way… but not 100, not more than 100.” (01:48, Kara Swisher)

• Cultural Obsession vs. Reality: Dan cites that the realistic maximum life expectancy for typical genetics is 91 for men, 96 for women, debunking Silicon Valley’s more extreme ambitions (02:55).

2. Narcissism in the Longevity Movement

• Tech Elitism and Self-Interest: Kara critiques the self-centeredness among wealthy technologists pursuing radical life extension while ignoring broader public health needs:

  “The narcissism… wasn’t ever about everybody. It was about them individually, right? Not about helping the society at large…” (04:28, Kara Swisher)

• Dinner Party Anecdotes: She describes joyless, obsessively health-optimized dinner parties where the conversation revolves around the latest supplement or regimen.

  “Please, get me out of here… discussing every bite that went into their mouth, which made it joyless.” (05:10, Kara Swisher)

3. Pseudoscience, Misinformation, and Real Progress

• Rise of Charlatans & Influencers: COVID catalyzed an explosion of online health misinformation, with social media amplifying dubious claims by non-experts (06:00–07:01).
• Promising Innovations: Despite the hype, Kara recognizes genuine breakthroughs (e.g., mRNA technology, AI for drug discovery, CRISPR) that hold population-level potential.
• The Danger of Biohacks: Swisher is skeptical of most expensive interventions and “magic bullets” marketed to the wealthy, emphasizing the lack of peer-reviewed evidence for many trends (peptides, stem cell infusions, hyperbaric chambers).

4. Universal Healthcare and Social Determinants

• Economic and Health Arguments: Kara passionately advocates for basic universal healthcare, citing the economic irrationality of America’s spending and outcomes, and how non-insurance breeds stress and disease.

  “We’re paying double to be twice as sick. It just doesn’t make any sense… universal healthcare is even, at the bare minimum, economically idiotic [not to have].” (14:36, Kara Swisher)

• Lessons from Blue Zones: Dan shares Costa Rica’s success (low mortality, minimal spending, comprehensive basic care), emphasizing that simple, systems-level interventions often outperform flashy tech (15:40).

5. Why Do We Idolize “Innovators”?

• Celebrity Scientists & the Cult of the Silicon Valley Guru: Kara laments the belief that being a tech genius qualifies one to dictate nutrition or medical science:

  “We have an idolatry of innovators… because they're good at one thing, they're good at everything. And they become experts in it.” (16:46, Kara Swisher)

• Firsthand Example: Kara relays an early COVID conversation with Elon Musk dismissing her historically-based skepticism, underscoring the Dunning-Kruger effect among tech billionaires (16:50).

6. Responsible Approaches: What Actually Works

• GLP-1s and Boring, Effective Medicine: Swisher singles out GLP-1 weight-loss medications as a promising, scalable innovation, provided they’re paired with robust exercise and nutrition support.
• The Boring Truths: She notes that all the interventions shown to work—universal care, diet, physical activity, social connection—are “so boring,” yet vastly more effective than fads (19:55–22:07).

7. The Power of Social Connection & Community

• Loneliness as a Health Hazard: Kara warns about online-induced isolation, promoting community activities (e.g., game nights, mahjong, talking to strangers) as scientifically-proven health boosters.

  “There’s so much scientific… improvement to your body and longevity—like, social connection.” (45:54, Kara Swisher)

• Technology as Tool or Weapon: She describes ethical uses of AI (robotic dolls to reduce elder loneliness, exoskeletons) while expressing concerns about the technology’s social harms if misapplied.

8. On Death, Meaning, and Legacy

• Memorable Death Wishes: Kara humorously describes her ideas for her remains—to be cremated so her ashes can be thrown at her enemies, or a Viking funeral.

  “One of them is like, I’ll throw [my ashes]… and I was like, one of them’s like, that’s not very nice. And I’m like, yes, it’s not meant to be nice. I’m not here, so it doesn’t matter.” (08:32, Kara Swisher)

• Reed Jobs’ Wisdom: Her favorite interview subject, Reed Jobs, viewed death as “life’s greatest invention,” using it to inspire purpose rather than deny mortality (27:15).

9. Longevity “Scams” and Overblown Trends

• Biohacks with Little Evidence: Kara skewers the supplement industry, red light therapy, hyperbaric tanks, and electric vests as overhyped, under-proven wastes of money.

  “Red light drove me crazy… overpromised and underdelivered.” (30:05, Kara Swisher)
  “Supplements were where a lot of this stuff was… But like, one of the things, like fish oil for example, like, obviously it's good for you, but why don’t you just eat a piece of fish?” (32:11)

• Medical Dangers: She and Dan discuss prominent, wealthy figures who suffered serious complications from stem cell and peptide injections abroad (35:51, 36:33).

10. Her Own Health Changes and Takeaways

• Post-Show Changes: Swisher now runs regularly, practices intermittent high-heart-rate exercise, strength/balance training, puts her phone away more often, and prioritizes face-to-face interaction, community events, and trying new things.
• Diet Tweaks: She drinks kefir in the mornings, increases vegetable and legume intake, experiments with cooking new foods with her kids, and is attempting gardening.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the tech elite’s narcissism:

  “Do you care about anybody else? Like, what does that do for anybody?” (01:00, Kara Swisher)

• On RFK Jr.’s approach to health policy:

  “I think he’s murderous… it’s not about the health of people, or else he’d have more… it’s just so performative and ridiculous.” (10:28, Kara Swisher)

• On Twitter/X:

  “A Nazi porn bar is not where Kara Swisher needs to hang out… All I got was penises and Nazis and people calling me not nice names for ladies. And it wasn’t ‘bitch’ they were going for.” (29:09, Kara Swisher)

• On universal healthcare:

  “We’re paying double to be twice as sick… So why not give everyone a basic, decent level of healthcare where they don’t worry about being bankrupted?” (14:36, Kara Swisher)

• On supplements/biohacks:

  “Stop selling people all manner of nonsense… Like if you take this one pill, or if you have this $7,000 red light mat, you’re gonna be twice as beautiful… And I’m like, no you won’t. Stop it.” (30:05, Kara Swisher)

• On life advice via her grandmother:

  “After dinner, she’s always like, go walk after dinner. So many scientific benefits… Postprandial, most important thing to do… my grandmother knew 20 things that the billionaires completely miss because they’re not cool and they’re not hip.” (38:45, Kara Swisher)

• On connection:

  “There’s the eye contact, there’s—I noticed you for a second, which is really very enlivening to people… you can watch the health go between people when that happens.” (43:04)

• On the “banquet” of life:

  “Life is a banquet. Most poor suckers are starving, so enjoy yourself.” (52:57, Kara Swisher quoting Mame)

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Timestamps for Major Segments

• Longevity goals & the joke of living forever: 01:34–02:23
• US healthspan statistics & limits of tech fixes: 02:23–03:18
• Tech narcissism & lack of public-mindedness: 04:10–07:01
• COVID-era misinformation & influencer explosion: 06:00–07:01
• Commentary on RFK Jr. & food pyramid politics: 10:19–14:31
• Universal healthcare as longevity infrastructure: 14:31–16:46
• Why cultural “gurus” gain undue authority: 16:46–17:34
• Scams and quackery in the biohack industry: 30:05–34:33
• Dangers of stem cell, peptide treatments: 35:51–38:02
• Genuine, “boring” solutions that work: 19:55–22:07, 38:31–39:39
• Community, social connection, and their health impacts: 43:04–44:39
• Kara's shifts in lifestyle post-series: 44:52–47:55
• Diet, kefir, and cooking with kids: 46:54–49:32
• Longevity as trend: is it waxing or waning?: 49:32–51:16
• Parting quote from Mame: 52:57–53:09

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Final Thoughts

Kara Swisher’s trademark candor, wit, and skepticism cut through the marketing noise around longevity to champion “boring” but proven strategies: prioritize basic healthcare, community, social engagement, minimally-processed diets, and physical activity. She warns against the narcissistic, self-serving visions of tech elites and advocates a shift toward public good. Ultimately, her call is for embracing mortality as motivation, not sorrow, and for finding joy—and better health—in connection, curiosity, and daily, grounded choices.

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For more, find Kara Swisher on Pivot, On with Kara Swisher, or walking a few more miles with her kids—just don’t expect her to buy the latest red light therapy mat anytime soon.

Transcript

[Kara Swisher]

Lemonade.

[Dan Buettner]

Amazon Pharmacy presents painful thoughts.

[Kara Swisher]

It's been a long, bumpy road dealing with yet another bladder infection and driving to the pharmacy to pick up meds.

[Julia Louis-Dreyfus]

I went over a pothole and a

[Kara Swisher]

little pee came out. So now I get to stand in line with pee pee pants. Next time, skip the pain and get fast free delivery. With Amazon Pharmacy healthcare just got less painful. We're the fattest, the deathiest, the, like, the most obese. So we're paying double to be twice as sick. And so why not give everyone a basic, decent level of health care where they don't worry about being bankrupted? That was particularly irritating because it wasn't ever about everybody. It was about them individually. Do you care about anybody else? Like, what does that do for anybody?

[Dan Buettner]

Is there anything out there that you came away saying, maybe I'd give that a whirl?

[Kara Swisher]

I think I probably.

[Dan Buettner]

Kiris is a special episode for me. This is our second season, and I've never not done an interview live, and you're the first one I'm doing now over Riverside. So you're special. We're pretty excited about CNN's Kara Swisher wants to live forever, a quest I've been on for about a quarter of a century. My.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. Well, good. Well, I'm glad I'm here to help you now. I'm teasing. You know a lot more about it than I do.

[Dan Buettner]

Well, I'm not sure about that. A certain. Certain branch of longevity. We're going to unpack today, and I think you know a lot more about me. But just to jump right in, Kara Swisher wants to live forever. How long do you actually want to live?

[Kara Swisher]

I don't actually want to live forever. It's a joke. I think I was taking off from these guys who have the don't die movement or, you know, that they want to move their brains into another sentient robot kind of thing. No, probably, you know, into my 90s and a relatively healthy age, you know, in a relatively healthy way. And, you know, there's a lot been written and said about this health span lifespan thing, and I think I'd probably like to have a health span gel with my lifespan at the same time. So into my. I have young kids, so it gets more and more every year. Right. But not 100, not more than 100.

[Dan Buettner]

You know, I'm mired in this stuff. And I would tell you in America, our health. Our health adjusted life Expectancy is only 64. So you're coming up on that fast.

[Kara Swisher]

I know I am. That's the health span, right? That's the.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah, yes.

[Kara Swisher]

That's when you start to really start breaking things.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah, yeah. You get a chronic disease or a major disability, and then we have 12 long years before we hit our life expectancy. So that's the delta we're trying to close.

[Kara Swisher]

But, yes, that's for you. Men, women have a little longer one, but, you know.

[Dan Buettner]

But still, you know that this whole live. I'm going to live to 120 is complete bunk right now. The average maximum life expectancy of the human species with an average set of genes, as you point out, about 96 for women. 91. 90, 91 for men. That's what we can really shoot for if you haven't won the genetic lottery.

[Kara Swisher]

Right.

[Dan Buettner]

But, you know, you spend years interrogating the power in tech. And by the way, when. I'll tell you, Kara, when I first heard you were doing this documentary, I'm like, why isn't she called me. But then when I saw it, I'm glad I dodged the bullet.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Next one. Next season. Next season we'll have you on and we'll shoot you with a bullet, and then you don't have to worry about living long.

[Dan Buettner]

There you go.

[Kara Swisher]

We'll just lightly wound you. Well, just lightly wound you so that

[Dan Buettner]

you can anger

[Kara Swisher]

and then not treat the wound and just let it lovingly graze me.

[Dan Buettner]

Yes. But, you know, you spent all these years interrogating the, you know, the power in tech, and then you kind of moved it into the power in the world of longevity. Did you emerge thinking there's some genuine science there, or is it mostly marketing bunk?

[Kara Swisher]

Well, a lot of marketing bunk. And I was particularly, you know, I'd already been covering misinformation for years and years and warning about it. And so it was. Obviously, I covered a lot of political and some of the more social issues, but you saw with COVID it started to get really crazy. And some stuff was accurate, some stuff was not, but it was all mixed together in this sort of toxic stew, as it is with antisemitism, as it is with politics, racial issues, everything else. And so you started to see a lot of it during COVID that sort of expressed itself in this sort of just terrible way that. And then you had all these influencers all over TikTok and everybody else doing all manner of nonsense, like traveling salesmen, you know, but. Except they had this incredible reach. So that was disturbing to me. At the same time, you had all these tech people who just exhausted Me with their. All their different plots and schemes to stay younger or whatever they were doing at any one time, you know, and it started off with intermittent fasting. I mean, it was before that was eat what they were eating. And then it was Soylent and then it was intermittent fasting. And then it was, you know, testosterone and nads and, you know, just I would be at these dinner parties and I just was like, please get me out of here. Like essentially, you know, discussing everything. Every bite that went into their mouth, which was. Made it joyless. They were already not the best dinner party companions, but this made it even worse. And then the narcissism that went with it was particularly irritating because it wasn't ever about everybody. It was about them individually, right? Not about helping the society at large deal with really persistent problems of obesity or vaccination rates or all manner of stuff that much of which is avoidable. Right? And they never wanted to fix that or pay for that or do anything else all about their own bodies. And I remember Larry Page had a pollution meter around his neck and he was judging pollution. And I was like, well, I need to know what's going in my body. I'm like, do you care about anybody else? Like, what does that do for anybody? And all the Google people at one point were doing full body checks and everything else. And, you know, it just was. It was a lot. And then at the same time there's all these promising things happening. MRNA technology, which was in the news this week, obviously pre Covid. I'd been talking to a lot of people who are doing vaccines for cancer and things like that. Obviously the use of AI for drug discovery and the slowing, the shortening of drug discovery, which is very more cost effective gene folding. I was super interested when they were doing that. And then the CRISPR people and I just was like, there's all this astonishing stuff that would help a lot more people. And then there's this fixation on narcissism, both, you know, within these wealthy classes and at the same time being sort of trickled down to not as wealthy people in this sort of charlatan circus that drove me nuts online.

[Dan Buettner]

Do you think it was narcissism or they got their money now and they want to be around to enjoy it or they didn't get laid when they were teenagers. And you know, maybe all of the

[Kara Swisher]

above, Dan, maybe not all of the above, but, you know, narcissism was at the heart of it. It's me, me, me, and what can I do? And they already had created lives that were more comfortable, whether, you know, going from the plane to the, to their beautiful homes, to their, their trainers, to their, their nutritionist to their this. So they already created that kind of thing, virtuous circle. And so they had the cream of the cream. And then at the same time, very few of them talked about helping people ever. Like, except for a couple of people, right, which would be like, mostly the women actually like Mackenzie Scott, who was giving money to the here and now. But. And then they were. Then they mobbed up with Trump and they started cutting all the all manner of stuff to really promising research. And so to get theirs to get whatever, whatever, whether they want to relief from tariffs or whatever. Meanwhile, Trump and his, you know, his hench folk are over at the hhs cutting things that were important to all of us just because they're mad about COVID or whatever it happens to be. And so it was just. It got really irritating to me. And when I'm irritated, I tend to try to say something, watch out, watch out.

[Dan Buettner]

One of my favorite lines from Kara Switch, who wants to live forever? Is you said when you want to die, you want to be cremated.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Dan Buettner]

Throw your ashes in the face of

[Kara Swisher]

people you don't like. Yeah, I have several. I have several different things and I'm discussing with my children. I have a lot of kids. And so we have various things. And one of them is like, I'll do it, you know, And I was like, one of them's like, that's not very nice. And I'm like, yes, it's not meant to be nice. And I'm not here, so it doesn't matter. So you'll have to deal with it. I have other ones. I have Viking funerals. Viking, where I'm on a boat and my kids shoot arrows into the boat and it burns down on the water. But they could miss. And that's an issue. So I think about these things. Another one is I was trying to track when Steve Jobs died, his sister, who was a well known novelist, who we met later in his life. Cause he was fostered, he was adopted, and he found his full sister. And she said when he was dying, he was surrounded by friends and family, which is lovely, and said, wow. Oh, wow. And it was like, what did you see? He always was famous for one more thing, and then he'd unveil it, but then he didn't unveil what the wow was. Damn. Damn. And so I thought I was gonna modify it. Die, like be on my deathbed all my Kids, grandkids, whoever happens to be friends and then go, oh, you've gotta be kidding. And then die.

[Dan Buettner]

Like, you gotta report that one, Karen. I know.

[Kara Swisher]

That would be the kidding. I can't believe this is what. And then like, that would be great.

[Dan Buettner]

Yes.

[Kara Swisher]

They'd be like, what did she say?

[Dan Buettner]

You know, I love the Tibetan ritual where old people's bodies are chopped up, brought to a mountaintop, and then eaten by eagles and hawks. What a great way to sort of repatriate yourself. Speaking of patriots. So you and Scott Galloway, who's actually a buddy of mine.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, I didn't know that.

[Dan Buettner]

We hung out in Ibiza last year.

[Kara Swisher]

Ibiza, last year. He loves Ibiza.

[Dan Buettner]

I know you guys cover a lot of politics and I wonder what you think of RFK Jr. Good for our longevity or bad?

[Kara Swisher]

I think he's murderous. That's what I think he is. I think, you know, on some of the stuff. Okay, some of the stuff, like eat an apple. You're fucking kidding me. RFK Jr. Thanks for that piece of information about whole foods and that. I, you know, that that's great to have the government say that. Okay, I'm gonna give him the, the one. Kudos. I'll give them, and that's it. But the idea of whole foods and healthy foods and more legumes and things like, I like that the food pyramid's just such a fucked up thing for many decades. So that said, he sticks animal proteins right at the top. And I was like, oh, great, you and your. And your raccoon penises are back again. And so that, that to me is like, oh, what is happening here? Like, it's this guy's, you know, he can eat as much as he wants. I don't really care what he does. But I thought that was irresponsible to be pushing something that was actually important, which is like an actual food pyramid that were proven diets are very clear, you know, these Mediterranean fast diets, you know. And I know the diet stuff has been all over the map, and so I appreciate some clarity. But then he like ruins it by sticking the animal proteins at the top, which is fine. And I love a burger. It's not that I don't love a burger, but come on, it's very clear when you and the American Cardiology association corrected him correctly recently. But, you know, everything else is done in distrust of science, which, listen, scientists make mistakes. There's a lot of bureaucracy, no question. But that's nothing to run on. Like to tell us something and clearing out bureaucracy and speeding up things is a good idea. That said, I also feel safety is critically important. And these people have these cockamam schemes that they don't have proof for. Right? They just don't. And I get it. I get the COVID thing really screwed with people. It really was a mind fuck for this country. And there were lots of mistakes and misstatements, but I don't expect everyone in science to be perfect. But I certainly don't think they're up to some crazy thing. Their fixation on pharmaceutical companies. Appropriate to a point, right? Appropriate to a point. And at the same time, there's just a. There's just a devil around every corner with these people. And I just don't. I know scientists, and I don't believe it. I don't believe it. Through reporting and the demonization of science people and researchers. I mean, any day of the week and twice on Sunday, I'd rather be with them over rfk. And, you know, honestly, he's conducted his life in a way that seems rather irresponsible on many aspects. And again, trying not to judge. You know, I live in San Francisco. If you want to marry a goat, I'm good with it. That said, I'm judging. Like, I'm judging. This guy doesn't have the finest character in the land, and he's obviously desperately thirsty to run for president, you know, and he's so far beneath his father that it's like he's subterranean. And just. The whole thing is just so performative and ridiculous. And it's not about the health of people, or else he'd have more. He'd have. If you want to have a debate, have debate, bring in lots of different voices, but not. People are going to rubber stamp you the other direction. And so I just. The whole thing is just. It sort of sticks with Kash Patel at the FBI, who is obviously incompetent, or Kristi Noem at Homeland Security, or any manner of these people. They're just not our best and brightest. And again, I'm willing to hear new voices and I'm willing to have people talk about different things and push the FDA and push all manner of things. Like, I didn't dislike psychedelics getting fast tracked, but I like the testing to be done right. I didn't like. But I don't want it because Joe Rogan texts the fucking president. Are you kidding me? Like, that's not how we get things done in this country. I'm sorry. It's just not. I'd like to text the president and get $25 minimum wage. I'd like text the president and get universal health care, which of course is the way we all get better. Universal health is such a, you know, instead there all manner of nonsense is going on rather than what actually works, which is a lot more boring.

[Dan Buettner]

Universal healthcare is worth about five extra years of life expectancy.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, but I want to get, let me just say, let me say it's economically idiotic. Like we spend double, we're 15k per capita right now or nearing 15k. There's 6 to 7,000 in peer countries and we're at the bottom of everything. We're the fattest, the deathiest, the like, the most obese, that like. So we're paying double to be twice as sick. It just doesn't make any sense. And universal health care is even at the bare minimum. And again look, rich people can pay more in those countries than they do. Great. Again knock yourself out. Rich people, they will anyway. So instead of griping about, you know, a basic level of healthcare, people being scared about being sick also contributes to health, you know, longevity issues, the stress and everything else. And so why not give everyone a basic decent level of health care where they don't worry about being bankrupted. The same thing with homelessness. It's just giving, give people affordable homes, give people a minimum wage. These are all health things. These are all health initiatives when you think about it. But of course, you know, I reported

[Dan Buettner]

on one of our blue zones in Costa Rica, okay, they, they have about half the rate of middle age mortality. In other words, they're about twice as likely to reach that healthy age 90 as an American does. And they spend 1 15th the amount we do on healthcare. And why is that? They not only have universal health care, every man, woman and child has the right to an annual visit from this basic health team that has your records that if it senses type 2 diabetes or depression or early onset cardiovascular disease, they get you into the clinic and that's what works. So here you have this nearly third world country running circles around America. Yeah, and, but why, you know, if I told you that eating a cup of beans adds four years to your life expectancy and there's actually decent epidemiology to support that. And a text borough told you of $50,000 infusions of stem cells does the same. Why is the world likely to believe the guy with the expensive needle?

[Kara Swisher]

Because we have a, we have a, we have a idolatry of innovators and we think because they're good at One thing, they're good at everything. I mean, and they become experts in it. I mean, I literally had an interview with Elon at the beginning of COVID And I'm not. I'm not a doctor, but I can read historical tables. And. And he was like, you know, Covid's gonna be over in a week and there's gonna be 15 people. And I go, you know, historically speaking, these kind of things tend to take a million people. If we're safe, if we're good about it. A million seems to be the number I'm seeing, like, if not worse. And he was like, you don't know. I read all the studies. I'm like, well, I'm not a doctor and you're not a doctor, so I don't understand what's happening with you, essentially. And it was just like that. He just. I've read all the studies. I know everything, et cetera, et cetera, which is exhausting.

[Julia Louis-Dreyfus]

Hey, it's Julia Louis Dreyfus from wiser than me, etc. Just popping in with a little reality check. Food waste shouldn't exist. There is no reason that our leftovers should end up in a landfill. But that's the final destination for about a third of the food we grow. Our ancestors would be confused. They use their food scraps as compost or as animal feed, or.

[Kara Swisher]

Or in weird soups.

[Julia Louis-Dreyfus]

All the stuff we did before garbage was invented. But composting is hard work. Living with a bucket of rotten food on your counter is gross. Most food goes in the trash because it's easy. And these days, we'll take any easy we can get. But now there's something easier. Drop your scraps in a mill food recycler. It looks like a kitchen bin and an iPhone had a baby. It takes nearly anything, even meat and bones. It works automatically. You can keep filling it for weeks and it never smells. When you finally empty it, you've got these nutrient rich grounds. Use them in your garden, pour them in your green bin, or have mill get them to a small farm so the food you don't eat can help grow the food you do, just like it should be. It's why I own a mill, why I invest in mill, and why I'm still obsessed with my mill. If you want to get obsessed too, go to mill.com wiser to get $75 off. That's mill.com wiser for $75 off.

[Dan Buettner]

Amazon Pharmacy presents painful thoughts. Of course I see my co worker in line at the pharmacy. Can you tell I'M picking up prescription hemorrhoid cream.

[Kara Swisher]

I'm probably standing weird.

[Dan Buettner]

Why is he smiling? He knows he's gonna call me Hemroid Lloyd tomorrow. I know it.

[Kara Swisher]

I gotta quit my job. Next time avoid awkward conversations and get fast free delivery with Amazon pharmacy healthcare

[Dan Buettner]

just got less painful. Of all the sort of biohacks you saw, peptides, stem cells, rapamycin, metformin, is there anything out there that you came away saying, well maybe, maybe I'd give that a whirl.

[Kara Swisher]

GLP1s I think, I think we should do extensive studies. I think it should go out to the broader population. I think there's all manner they're already doing them right and I think our government needs to get involved rather significantly because obesity and the cascading series of illnesses are really significantly expensive and significantly painful for people. It has to be accompanied by nutritional and exercise help too, like support to get people into the frame of mind of how to eat that cup of beans or how to eat that cup of beans or how to get availability to it. And so Yes, I think JLP1S is one area that I think are incredibly promising. You don't have to do it because you'd have to do expensive tests, but all the VO2 Max stuff to try to get you to exercise more efficiently is really important. The up and down the scale of the heartbeat shows real signs. Really interesting promising data. It's so boring. All the stuff that works is so boring. Obviously universal health care, that to me is at the top of the list. And then some of the stuff around AI and drug discovery MRNA technology again, which just showed some real problems in pancreatic cancer this week. The CRISPR stuff is worth pursuing and worth us investing in in that regard. Obviously I'd rather have them spend money on climate issues and things to bring people into healthier environments and to clean up air and water. Again boring, but works kind of stuff and you know, instead they're create, creating data centers, burning natural gas where the poor people live, you know, which Elon's doing in the south and putting people in health problems. Right. And that's leaving out all the mental health problems that people are getting from their affiliate, like doing chatbots and things like that and being lonely and that. And the last thing I would say, which was surprising was how much science there is between social connections and how deleterious the overuse of online is. And again, this is right in my wheelhouse, which I've been warning about when it drives people crazy and we're online

[Dan Buettner]

at the moment, but now.

[Kara Swisher]

I know, but that's okay. It's fine for tools. I like electricity. I just don't like electric chairs. Right. I like ships, I don't like shipwrecks. But it's how you use it and bring it out for the most people. So, like in an AI situation with the chatbots in Korea, they put AI into these dolls for elderly people who are lonely, which is a very. Loneliness is a health hazard, essentially, you know, in terms of lots of reasons. And they play with these dolls and these dolls react. They're not just. They're not just rote mechanical dolls. They'll say, they'll have a conversation, but there's safety and privacy and safety guards. So that doesn't, you know, degenerate into how would you like to commit suicide? It degenerates into really cool, interesting discussions for the elderly. And then they get together in person to talk about their dolls, which is like, doll playing is really fun as a kid. And these are very lonely older women. And I was like, this is a use of AI I can get behind or robotics with AI merged into these exoskeletons around walking. It changes these mechanical ropes, exoskeletons in a really helpful way. And so, sure, I'll take AI in that. So there's lots of things that if you use these, these things as tools, they're wonderful. But often they get weaponized and usually at the behest and for the benefit of the very wealthy, these tech people.

[Dan Buettner]

We had Peter Diamandis on the podcast.

[Kara Swisher]

Peter.

[Dan Buettner]

He asserted that three to five years we're going to have a AI driven innovation that's going to occasion a huge jump in life expectancy around this protein folding and mitochondrial efficiency. Did you have any feeling that, that such hope is around the corner?

[Kara Swisher]

Well, I don't love their timelines because, well, Peter's selling that stuff, right? So, you know that he's talking his own book. I like Peter. I like some of this stuff. But Peter, a couple years ago was telling me we were going to jump on a comet and, you know, or asteroid and take all their metals. And I'm still waiting for that to happen. Sounds cool. Sounds great. I don't know, often a lot of people go, you know, I was just at a media thing and they're like, A.I. and I'm like, well, how? And they're like, AI and I'm like, yeah, you're not being very specific. I need specific. How are you doing it? So I don't deny there's going to be AI is going to be critically important to drug development, like I said, or other things, or drug discovery or drug interactions, all manner of stuff. And I do think diagnostics, even though the record is still spotty, but eventually, like, the original Internet was pretty shitty, you know, it's only gonna go upwards and we're only gonna get stupider. So that's really kind of the. You can see the. Developmentally, these developments are really important. Like, I looked at something called face age that we didn't put in, but we did. We were putting up all the. Everything. All the interviews I did. Cause not all of them made it into the full show. But there's a thing at Brigham Hospital in Boston where doctors, you know, when they look at cancer patients, they kind of just eyeball them, right? Mm. Mm. You look kind of old to get this aggressive cancer, Pat. And instead this face age thing is using AI technology to look at these patients and find an age, their real age. And so this one woman was, I think, 76, but she had a face age of 68. And they recommended more aggressive. They used that along with other doctors. It wasn't just the AI that did it, because the AI was seeing other things. And she responded very well to more aggressive treatment. And so she would not have gotten that treatment or they would have thought she couldn't handle it because she looked kind of creaky. But she wasn't creaky. She was less creaky than they thought. And so I don't. I think that's great if it helps you in tools or ideas or. But it has to have a human AI interaction as a tool rather than taking over. And I fear that taking over will be the thing that happens, as we have done with, you know, maps or whatever we do. But the maps work pretty well, I'll be honest with you. Rather than a paper map.

[Dan Buettner]

You know, when you look at evolutionary biology, for most of human history, we lived in an environment of hardship and scarcity. And it's through stressing our bodies, whether it's not overeating or whether physical activity or saunas, that not only seems to contribute to longevity, Making that effort to meet a neighbor, walking place instead of getting in a car, doing your own housework. And where we get lost with AI, I think, is this notion that we're going to. We're going to unload all of our inconvenience on AI. It probably is going to take us to the wrong place. Unless, I would agree, our biology changes. And it doesn't look like our biology is changing anytime soon. I just want to remind listeners we're talking to Kara Swisher about Keras Wisher wants to Live Forever. Cnn. Great show. What's your favorite segment? If viewers haven't seen it yet, what episode should they go to? And what's your favorite episode or scene?

[Kara Swisher]

How about a moment?

[Dan Buettner]

A moment. We will go with the moment.

[Kara Swisher]

I go to my dad's grave because I talk about the impact of death. And there were several really interesting discussions about death. I had a great interview with Reed Jobs, who's the son of Steve Jobs, who I thought had the best attitude toward death, which was. It was life's greatest invention because it spurred you on. As opposed to, I want to live forever. I want to use death to inspire me in the short life I have. And he actually had a much too short life. But I thought Ree Jobs was one of these wonderful thinkers and, you know, a kid of these people, but is taking it in the ways his dad probably would have been very proud of. I think my favorite one was creating the Caratar. Cause a lot of the, like, this is the avatar of me. And so we used AI and it was sort of a 3D figure from a group that was preserving memories of Holocaust victims. But they moved into using AI in a much more robust way. Where it used to be, you just tape the answers and then they'd answer the taped answers. But now AI can spin up all manner of conversation because of stuff they put in there of me. I've done hundreds and hundreds and hundreds and probably a thousand or more interviews and writing and everything else. So you can get a sense of me, a facsimile of me. And I created this and had a really unusual conversation that I was quite troubled by how. How I thought it was pretty good, but it wasn't me. And so I thought that was. It made me think a lot about would I want my great grandchildren to see this? Maybe. That was cool.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah, I mean, it's. It's, you know, it's better than having to, you know, scroll through your Instagram feed or something like that. You know, actually, it's pretty good. I looked at it before. Before. Yes. 250,000 followers.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, there. Oh, yeah. I had 1.6 million on Twitter. I had 1 point and I left. I had 1.6 million On Twitter.

[Dan Buettner]

Good for you.

[Kara Swisher]

I thought a Nazi porn bar is not where Kara Swisher needs to hang out. So it was bad for my health. It is. All I got was penises and Nazis and people calling me not Nice names for ladies. And it wasn't bitch wasn't the one they were going for. So it wasn't good for my health.

[Dan Buettner]

You know, I salute you for realizing that, Kara. And also doing the right thing. I mean so many journalists out there will say and report any damn thing that'll get them clicks. And you've been a victim of it. I've been a victim of it.

[Kara Swisher]

Sure have.

[Dan Buettner]

And you know, I miss the good old days of Walter Cronkite and journalism where you covered both sides and it wasn't just all about getting the ratings, but in Kara Swish wants to live forever. What were some of the more egregious longevity or biohacks that were just scams? Like what was just made you crack up with stupidity?

[Kara Swisher]

Well, you know the, you know how they. Some of the things are good for a little bit of things like red light can be possibly good for implantation and some fine lines, but the science is still pretty thin. Some of those things. What bothered me was how they took them and made it the solution for everything. Like if you take this one pill or if you have this $7,000 red light mat, you're gonna be twice as beautiful baby skinned. And I'm like, no you won't. Stop it. Stop selling people all manner of nonsense. So red light drove me crazy. Cause it just over promised and under delivered, I think. And you know, it's. And everyone's hawking it without any scientific evidence. I mean there's some minor scientific evidence. Hyperbaric chambers drove me nuts. Except rich people are using them. So do I care? I don't. But I don't think the broad public should be jumping in a hyperbaric chamber. Unless they're maybe building the Brooklyn Bridge and they're down in the caissons, which. Oh, that's done. Which is where a lot of this bend stuff was in these chambers, these hyperbaric kind of chambers. But people get in them. And unless you have the bends or a wound really is not probably maybe some sports wounds they've shown some. Again, the science is so thin. But then doing it for like I went on a trip and it makes me feel better. I mean Joe Rogan does it and Brian Johnson recommended. It's just not true. It's just not. Don't do it. Don't do it. That drove me crazy. But. And they're expensive hyperbaric chambers. Like.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah, yeah, we have them all over here in Miami.

[Kara Swisher]

I know, but you know what? If you have the bends, great. You should rush right in there, you've

[Dan Buettner]

been diving at 500ft. You came up too fast.

[Kara Swisher]

Great, great. Highly recommend. And then some of the stuff, you know, just whatever it happens to be of the day, you have to do this. You have to. The other day the Times had a story about electric vests, you know, like that kind of thing. Like what? Like, I just think the science isn't there, but it's a trend. And so people do it and just buy it. And I think probably at the center of it is the supplement game, right? The, like, overselling of supplements. Now there's some, you know, like vitamin D or vitamin K, probably good for you. B12, possibly. You know what I mean? A good daily multivitamin. Fine. But like one of the things, like fish oil, for example, like, obviously it's good for you, but why don't you just eat a piece of fish? Like that kind of stuff. Do you need that? I mean, I guess, but you should be tested to see which ones you're deficient in. Like creatine. Not a bad thing. But it can be a problem for some people around their liver and kidney functions. And so if you're going to do it, you should do a doctor's recommendations. Not because some, some, some lady on the Internet tells you, like, I just don't get that. I don't get, like. And then says all manner of that it's going to fix you this way because they're selling something. And again, it's no different than snake oil sales. People that, you know, went around and just sold people cod liver oil and put it off as a solution to this and that. So that's sort of. That the sort of charlatanism drove me crazy. Supplements were where a lot of this stuff was. You know, some men use testosterone. If you're under doctor's care, maybe I do. I do hormone replacement therapy. But I don't think it's gonna, you know, take me home and do my laundry and put my kids to bed. Like, that's what, that's how they sell it, right? And so again, you. If you do it with a doctor's help, I'm all for it. Like, if you talk to, you know, a legitimate doctor. And again, it's this demonization. The doctors don't know. I was like, they kind of do more than you do. Like that. Kind of more than the lady on the Internet or the dude on the Internet. And then the overdoing of whatever happens to be the trend. Right. Like, the same thing happened in the diet industry. It's Grapefruit diet bone broth diet bone broth is good, but all the time, I don't know. And then the lack of focus on community like that, to me is. That drives me crazy. Like that the people are willingly isolating themselves mentally and physically, and that's really hurtful, as we've seen for both men and women. For relationships. These chatbot relationships I find highly toxic for most people, although lonely people, we do have to solve that problem. But, you know, there's always some charlatan selling to something.

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[Dan Buettner]

I, I, I'm looking right now. Show me my computer across the way there.

[Kara Swisher]

No, wine's good, you know that's good for you.

[Dan Buettner]

That's not far enough. Yeah, that's Fisher Island. That's the most expensive real estate in America. And I was invited to go to dinner over there to billionaire, and he didn't show up. And I'm like, what the hell? And his wife said, yeah, he went down to Mexico to get some treatment. He'll be back tomorrow, never came home. He got a stem cell injection which caused coagulation. And there's another really famous longevity influencer who will go unnamed here, who also got a stem cell injection, and he got a horrible infection that damn near killed him. We never hear about the downside.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, it's like that with Peptides right now.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah. Do Peptides work?

[Kara Swisher]

Not yet. Not. There's not. There's not much proof of it, and there's a lot of proof of danger, which is like a lot of Them that come from China, a lot of them are un. It's unclear how clean. How clean they are. A lot of things in them. And then you're injecting them and they act like, oh, we just. It's subcutaneous. I'm like, no, no, no sepsis. Welcome to sepsis or whatever it happens to be. And I just. Again, it's. It's doing your own medicine, right? And it, you know, I kind of am, like, I'm like, my dad was a doctor, and I don't believe I do surgery. Like, I just don't. Like, I'm not going to tell you to do things. It just. There's no. There's no clear evidence. And everyone's like, here's the evidence. I feel better. I'm like, okay. I don't feel like that's a medical determination. And again, like what you were saying before, in Paria, for example, everyone does get these annual battery of tests, blood tests, and I don't think. I don't believe in over testing. But an annual, you know, blood test to understand what you're. What you're deficient in, what you need to eat more of, et cetera is important. And maybe I would love to see AI work on. Like, fiber is something that's hard to get every day. It just is. No matter what you do. Even if you eat the fillii muscle. That's what they're called, whatever. It's just really hard. You have to kind of have oats in the morning with berries. Then there's all different kinds of fibers you need, which is absolutely true. So I would love some innovation in that. How do you get what's the best?

[Dan Buettner]

I'll give you some innovation.

[Kara Swisher]

All right.

[Dan Buettner]

On my website, there's a recipe for Sardinian minestrone with three beans in it. You eat a bowl of that for breakfast, you get half the fiber you need for the day. And 25 different strains of fiber.

[Kara Swisher]

Right, exactly. But people don't know that the strains of fiber you need, like, that's the kind of thing that's important to know. And how do you do that? I will make. I love a minestrone. My grandmother made a great one. She probably was an influencer back then, but it was delicious.

[Dan Buettner]

Well, your grandmother probably possessed. You take your grandmother's wisdom and you add it to, you know, even the woeful public health system we have right now, it adds up to probably the best longevity formula in the world.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, can I. Can I give you one? After dinner, she's always like, Go walk after dinner. Like, there's so much scientific. I'm like, postprandial school, most important thing to do. If you had to do one thing, and then you end up talking to your partner or your kids or whoever, your walker, your friend or the neighbor. So many benefits. Like, I was. I did a thing with all these kids, these younger people down in Brooklyn where they played game night, and I brought a neuroscientist with me from Harvard, and she was like, here's what's happening here. They're touching the tiles. They're talking to each other. They're challenging their brains, the cognitive stuff happening here. And they were so sick of. They were just having a community moment. But there were so many healthcare benefits from what was happening that I was trying to focus in on it. I did beat them at poker because they sucked at bluffing, but that's the way it's gonna go. I took all their fake money, but it's just that kind of stuff. You're right. My grandmother knew 20 things that the

[Dan Buettner]

billionaires completely miss because they're not cool and they're not hip. You seem to metabolize so much information. You do three podcasts a day or three podcasts a week, right?

[Kara Swisher]

Right now, four. Four a week. Four. You wanna stay with the Arnold on with Kara Swisher, which is an interview show, and Pivot with Scott Galloway. So we do two of each, and we're about to launch some others. We're trying to develop more talent and more hosts, like he's doing with Jess Tarloff with raging moderates or Ed Elson Prof. G. Markets and stuff like that. So, you know, we don't go forever. And so we're trying to sort of have these podcasts that have enormous amounts of factual information and are also fun to listen to, so. Or substantive, actual information. So, yeah, I do a lot, and I have a lot of children, so that takes up a lot of my time, too.

[Dan Buettner]

How do you. What's your routine? How do you stay abreast of all the news and metabolize it all to. To sort of package it up for the world?

[Kara Swisher]

Well, I use online to do that. I use online to give me sort of good information. I read everything online. I don't read a newspaper. I used to, but I don't like. I'll read the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal. I read medical journals. I have searches for things like, I'm really interested in MRNA vaccines right now. And so they'll come to me often. I definitely use my Phone quite a bit. I just am good. I only use it for information. I don't sit around dunking. I mean, sometimes when Kash Patel does something stupid, it's. It's irresistible. But, you know, I just sort of parse it out, you know. That sounds weird, but a lot of people bug me about it. I don't have an assistant. I do everything myself. I respond myself, and therefore, that's amazing. It limits things, though. I don't get over scheduled. I schedule myself. And so I have control over it. Obviously. I prioritize my kids. Like, this weekend I spent with my oldest son is working for a city council candidate in San Francisco. So we can't paint. We canvassed, and it was really fun. They met a lot of people.

[Dan Buettner]

I love that.

[Kara Swisher]

But that was really healthy. I felt great. We walked around and we talked to people, and we both felt great afterwards. And I spent time with my son, which is great, and had great conversations and had good food and stuff like that. So I, you know, whatever. My kids, I try to do something with all of them individually, and then as a group, we like to get together. And then I don't, I think.

[Dan Buettner]

Very blue zones, by the way.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, I am. I'm not a big party person. I'm just not like you and Scott, obviously. But I. I should. I wish I drank more. I know it sounds crazy, but I'm not interested. I like bars.

[Dan Buettner]

We can fix that.

[Kara Swisher]

I know, but I've recently been going to bars because I like the feeling in bars. Right. I know it sounds nuts, but it's just really nice to sit around with people. The weather's nice. You know, I just. There's something.

[Dan Buettner]

I always sit at the bar. Even if I'm with somebody, I sit at the bar. Cause you're at a place you're likely to, first of all, talk to the bartender, but also the person next to you on the next stool over.

[Kara Swisher]

Right, exactly. And I talk to people a lot, and I didn't do that. My oldest son is very friendly with people. And one of the things one of the brain scientists was talking about was talking to people you don't know, which is just as equally important as talking to people you do know. And one of the things my oldest son does just naturally is when anyone. He meets anyone, he goes, how's your day going? And he looks at them like he says it. He's just done it since he was a kid. I didn't teach it to him.

[Dan Buettner]

How lovely.

[Kara Swisher]

And he goes, how's your day going? And this is what happens with people, they go like this. They jerk their head up because someone's interested in them. And you don't have to have a nine hour conversation with people you don't know. And they're like, oh, well, it's hard today. They answered honestly, which I had a really hard day. And he's like, oh, really, what happened? And he sometimes has longer conversations, sometimes he doesn't. And he goes, well, thank you so much for what you did. And I have to tell you, you can watch the health go between people when that happens, because there's this, there's the eye contact, there's. I noticed you for a second, which is really very enlivening to people. And I just was like, I started doing it and I have to tell you, I feel better. You know, I've started to do more community stuff. Like Zeke Emanuel has this book, Eat yout Ice Cream. I love Zeke. And he made me dress up like a colonial figure in this thing. You'll see that coming out this week. And we marched. I never marched. Are you kidding? I think it's ridiculous. But I did it. And he was talking about, he does like, he learned how to make honey, he learned how to be a short order chef. He's doing ballroom dancing right now. So I started like I created, I had mahjong lessons and I invited 16 people I know that didn't know each other. Everyone had a fucking ball. Like we were like, the tiles, the movement, the sociability. People they didn't know. And it was. I have to say, every single person was like, I really feel better. Like it sounded silly, but it wasn't. So I try to do that more.

[Dan Buettner]

Is that the result of that you're wants to live forever? Have you changed anything else about your daily routine? How much you sleep or what you eat or what else have you changed sleep?

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, I do run now. After I did the VO2 Max, I was kind of like, that's a shitty number. And I raised it quite a bit by running. And I did the intermittent running where you get your heartbeat to a certain type, up the next step, up the next step, and then down again. So I monitor that and I think some data is good and some data is pointless. I always like 10,000 steps. What the fuck does that mean? But actually, when you monitor certain things, I'm much healthier in terms of that way. And the numbers are very clear. So I started running again. And actually then running is also meditative. I've always done strength training. So that was. That's important. I've always unbalanced training because I know the falling thing. I'm very aware of that. But it's like when I was a kid, we sat in the sun with baby oil and foil in front of our faces. We did it. We did it. Yeah, right? And now kids, they wear sunscreen. It feels like I'm compounding things now, like, okay, now I'm gonna, like, run again. So I've done a lot of that. I also put my phone away quite a bit more than I used to. I mean, I use it for work and texting and stuff like that, but I put it away a lot more than I used to. I tend to go out a little more. I'm not someone who likes to go out. I like. I'm a homebody, but I like. The other day, I have an apartment here in Brooklyn too, and I walked by a church today and I thought, I'm gonna go in next time I'm here. I'm not particularly religious, but it was something appealing. There was a group in there singing, and I'm like, I should just go. Like, just sit and listen to the music, maybe talk to some people. And I don't think I would have done that before this because I wasn't aware the scientific improvements to your body and longevity, like, social connection. So I think probably I'm making more social connections with people I don't know or experiences I wouldn't like, do. I was thinking of learning the banjo the other day, but I'm not going to do that.

[Dan Buettner]

It'd be fun. How about food? Any. Any changes to your diet?

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, I drink in the morning. I don't happen to like yogurt, and I know how good it is for you in the morning, especially with berries and various nuts and stuff like that. And I drink kefir. I like kefir, or whatever, however they pronounce it. I drink a cup of that every morning. I make sure I get not too much protein because, of course, the males are all protein, maxing on everything. It's always the guys. I had 900. I was like, you don't need that much. What is your problem?

[Dan Buettner]

Big mistake.

[Kara Swisher]

Big mistake. And. But you need enough, right? You need enough because. So I drink kefir in the morning, which I really like. I kind of have more standard food now. I eat. I have, like, much, many more vegetables, like, than I used to. And I like vegetables. I'm not a like. And I've different. I've. I've been doing more different vegetables because I Think I. You sort of get to like the vegetables you like. And so I'm trying a lot more different vegetables and seeing if I can extend my. My young kids hate vegetables. They call them revengeables. And so I'm trying to get my

[Dan Buettner]

kids, here, eat this.

[Kara Swisher]

I know. I feel like I'm a failure as a parent. Only one of my four kids loves vegetables, but my older son now likes them. But when he was a kid, I had one kid who loved vegetables. He was such a delight in that regard. I think I probably am eating a lot more than more whole foods. Definitely more legumes, for sure. And I found ways to cook them. One thing I've been doing is this sort of hits two things is with my daughter, I like to watch Instagram food videos because they cook things. I find them fun and I find them interesting. So we started to make a couple of them, and some are good and some are bad. But we started making butter from scratch, which was fun. We had a good time doing it in a jar, just shaking cream. And we're getting increasing. We're doing different versions of it now. I started to make bread, and I'm not gonna do it a lot, but it was delicious. I was sort of surprised. And we had a good time doing that. It was very tactile and fun and chitty chatty. And we did that. And we're gonna. We're making next week something with waffles, some waffle thing. So I've been doing a lot more stuff. Like, I don't. I'm a good cook, but not a. I don't do it a lot. So I'm just. If I have a little goal, I do it. I may start. My oldest son is doing a lot of gardening. Suddenly he just got interested in growing food, which is cool. And I was like, huh, I wonder if I could do that with flowers. I happen to like flowers. And so, you know, we're sort of. I have a house in San Francisco and, you know, you could grow anything there. It's so beautiful. But I'm gonna try to take a challenge of doing flowers in D.C. we'll see.

[Dan Buettner]

Yeah. So the final question, you know, with Peter Attia, who in a way was a godfather of this whole sort of longevity, and he's been taken down by his. His comments or in correspondence with Jeffrey Epstein. Do you think longevity as a trend is waning or waxing?

[Kara Swisher]

I think longevity, in a more healthy way to think about it, is waxing is becoming important. I think people do. I think parents, they like How? Especially because online feels so deleterious to health. Right? They get it. There's something deep, like something's wrong with my kids, staying inside, doing this, getting all these crazy recommendations. Peter is a complicated person because some of the stuff is right. Some of it I find very narcissistic and very like, only made for the top, top tiers. I don't think he's a man of a fitness man of the people. You know who I like? Jack lalanne. Go back and watch Jack, Jack and lalanne. His advice is excellent. You know what? Here's a broomstick, everybody. Let's like, he's not trying to sell you something. And I think the more the. Besides his emails with Jeffrey Epstein, which are just heinous, they just are. There's no way around it. And you know, with Peter, some of the stuff is good, but it's not meant for everybody. It's not meant. He doesn't want everyone to get healthy. He wants him and his elite groups. It feels like that. It has that vibe to it. And so I would, maybe he could just, just get a broomstick and not sell anything and teach people how to exercise without having to buy something from Peter Attia or whoever. Blank, blank, blank. And so, and I get you have to build a business. But on some level, I don't know, I just, I went back and looked at all the Jack LaLanne stuff and almost everything is accurate.

[Dan Buettner]

He had a famous line, if it tastes good, spit it out. Well, you know, how, how can people connect with you? What's the best way to connect with Kara Swisher besides your CNN show?

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, well, you know, we have the podcast. We like to have listeners write in all the time. We, we do all these listener shows where they tell us what they want interested in. And so that's really good.

[Dan Buettner]

You tell, tell us where we find

[Kara Swisher]

your, your podcast, the Pivot Podcast. It's on all the major platforms, you know, Spotify, Apple, blah, blah. And then on with Kara Swisher's an interview. I love suggestions from people for that. That's kara.swisheroxmedia.com you can send me ideas. I'm fine with it. I love ideas. And you know, people actually stop me in the street a lot. A lot more especially because I don't know if you've experienced this, but podcasts have made like Scott and I are sort of like, people talk to us because they have a parasocial and familiar relationship with us. We absolutely welcome it. We welcome it and like the suggestions. I love it. And again, it helps me when you're talking to me, and as long as you're not yelling at me. But I don't mind if you're yelling at me. It's fine as long as you're polite if you disagree. But just come up to me. Like, I just literally, this guy, this fireman, he's like, darren Swisher is going to live forever. And I was like, oh, hi, fireman. And he was like, what do you think of this? And I said, well, here's the science and here's a link and this and that. And it was a great interaction. So just ask me if you see me. If I'm walking about, just find me. I walk about a lot more. I walk four miles.

[Dan Buettner]

Well, Kara, I hope to run into the. I'm a little older than you, so maybe this is selfish, but I hope to run in the street when you're 100.

[Kara Swisher]

I'll leave you with my favorite quote, which is from Mame. And I love the. It's the play Mame, where she says, life is a banquet. Most poor suckers are starving, so enjoy yourself.

[Dan Buettner]

So eat up. Right?

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Dan Buettner]

All right, Kara, thank you very much.

[Kara Swisher]

Thank you.