Hour 1 – Knicks Back in the NBA Finals, Vincent Goodwill

Summary

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The Dan Patrick Show – Hour 1

Episode Title: Knicks Back in the NBA Finals, Vincent Goodwill
Date: May 26, 2026
Platform: iHeartPodcasts and Dan Patrick Podcast Network

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Overview

Dan Patrick and the Danettes dive into the New York Knicks’ ascension to the NBA Finals for the first time since 1999, analyzing the pivotal series against the Cavaliers and speculating on potential Finals matchups. With insights from ESPN’s Vincent Goodwill, the episode spotlights narratives around Knicks’ legitimacy, James Harden’s legacy, the concept of “quitting” in sports, and LeBron James’ future. The discussion features classic Danette banter, basketball history, and reflections on what “success” means in New York sport.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Knicks’ Historic Dominance and Finals Expectations

• Opening Thoughts ([02:01]):

  • Knicks sweep the Cavaliers; Jalen Brunson named series MVP.
  • Knicks now wait for the outcome of the Spurs vs. Thunder (tied 2-2), debating which team is a better Finals matchup.

• On the Cavaliers’ Collapse ([03:07], [16:28]):

  • Cavaliers labelled as having “quit” in the series; Dan prompts listeners: “We gotta come up with a softer word for quit.”
  • The Knicks’ domination in second-chance points (32 to 5) is highlighted as evidence of superior attitude and effort.

  “That’s just attitude. That’s wanting something more than the other person does.” — Dan Patrick (04:18)

• Jalen Brunson’s Emerging Legacy ([05:47]):

  • Brunson could be “the greatest New York Knick of all time” if he wins the title and Finals MVP.
  • Emphasizes importance of bringing in “winners,” pointing to Brunson and Josh Hart’s Villanova pedigree.

  “He has a chance to be the greatest New York Knick of all time... Jalen Brunson is doing what you want in a great player.” — Dan Patrick (05:47)

2. Analysis of Cavaliers’ Downfall and James Harden’s Role

• On James Harden ([05:55], [07:28]):
  • Harden’s play heavily critiqued (“more turnovers than field goals”).
  • Despite being a Hall of Famer, he is not viewed as a playoff solution:

    “Sometimes you’re the problem because you played with a lot of talent.” — Dan Patrick

  • Harden’s own postgame remarks:

    “I can’t even answer that question honestly... I do feel like we are the better team, series wise. You know, I didn’t show it.” — James Harden (07:28)

  • Dan likens Harden’s career arc to regular-season specialists who falter in the postseason.

3. Finals Matchup: Spurs vs. Thunder — Who Should the Knicks Want?

• Poll Question:

  “If you’re the Knicks, who would you rather see in the Finals, the Spurs or the Thunder?” — Dylan (09:26)

• Dan’s Breakdown ([09:38]):

  • Prefers facing the Thunder due to their health issues, despite their experience and MVP talent.
  • Keeps things in perspective: “You can’t be choosy here.”

• On NBA Officiating and ‘Foul Merchants’ ([11:05]):

  • Dan discusses SGA’s (Shai Gilgeous-Alexander) reputation for drawing fouls, comparing it to Harden in his prime.
  • “Blame it on the officials, don’t blame it on SGA... he’s mastered it.”

4. Knicks’ ‘Team’ Ethos & Run’s Significance

• “Are the Knicks likable?” is debated ([12:26]):

  • Dan praises Brunson, Josh Hart, OG Anunoby, and the contribution of role players.
  • Emphasis on the ‘glue guy’ archetype in NBA championship teams.

• The Stakes:

  • Marvin Pauley and Paulie discuss what a Finals loss would mean:

    “I don’t think you get a consolation prize. You got to win.” — Dan Patrick (16:11)

  • High expectations in New York:

    “That’s what New York’s all about. ...We got embarrassed in the World Series against the Dodgers.” — Dan Patrick (16:36)

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Interview: Vincent Goodwill, ESPN NBA Senior Writer

Start: [21:34]
Key Topics:

• Were the Knicks’ Finals Hopes Legitimate Preseason? ([22:03])

  • “Everything was laid out for the Knicks... could not have predicted them bludgeoning these teams.”
  • Feels “more like 1994 than 1999”—unexpected but built on tangible opportunity.

• Finals Matchup Preferences ([23:04]):

  • Knicks would prefer the Spurs, referencing previous regular-season win against them and their ability to manage Wembanyama.
  • Health—especially fatigue of young Spurs/Thunder rosters—will be key.

• Does This Run Deserve Celebration if Knicks Don’t Win it All? ([24:21])

  • Dan: “No consolation prizes in New York.”
  • Vincent: Pushes back; celebrates the journey after years of futility:

    “When you ain’t never been no Damn where for 25 years... they’re going to remember the journey.” — Vincent Goodwill (24:47)

  • Franchises like Celtics/Lakers have different expectations than the long-struggling Knicks.

• On the Cavaliers’ Sweep and Organizational Issues ([28:13], [30:08]):

  • Cavaliers “aren’t that good”—emotionally and physically spent after back-to-back 7-game series.
  • Critique of Kings/Sacramento’s ownership as an impediment to sustained success.

• LeBron James’ Future ([31:14], [31:51]):

  • Money and fit prevent a Cleveland return:

    “The Cavs don’t have the money. ...LeBron has not taken a discount since coming back to Cleveland in 2014. ...You got to make that make sense.” — Vincent Goodwill (31:51)

  • Dan floats the “storybook” angle of LeBron returning; Vincent is pragmatic.

• NBA Parity and Finals Prediction ([37:34]):

  • Goodwill remains skeptical of Spurs stamina, sees OKC as likelier West champion but notes Shea Gilgeous-Alexander must deliver a true MVP performance to go the distance.

    “June belongs to no one. And that’s what we are finding out in these playoffs. ...Nobody would have expected the New York Knicks... to be the team that breaks everybody else.” — Vincent Goodwill (38:54)

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Listener Calls & Analysis

Start: [43:56]

• Listeners suggest “deflated” as a softer synonym for “quit."

• Knicks fans reflect on roster construction, with thanks for choosing Brunson over Donovan Mitchell and building a true contender.

• Praise for the Thunder’s depth and front office savvy.

• Jalen Brunson’s impact and contrast in playing style to SGA.

  “Brunson didn’t even play in the fourth quarter again last night. I mean, they’re just hoping for a seven-game series at this point.” — Buddha in San Francisco ([45:59])

• Criticism of Mavericks letting Brunson leave in free agency and getting nothing in return.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Quitting vs. Fatigue:

  “Maybe a more accurate word than quit — maybe deflated.” — Chris the caller ([43:56])

• On Harden’s Playoff Reputation:

  "At the end they take the mask off the bad guy and they see who it really is. Every team takes the mask off James Harden at the end of the season..." — Andrew the caller ([48:10])

• On Knicks’ Priorities:

  “You gotta win. That’s what New York’s all about.” — Dan Patrick ([16:36])

• Vincent Goodwill on Knicks’ Journey:

  “When you ain’t never been no Damn where for 25 years, Dan, like people are going to remember this night...” ([24:47])

• On Modern NBA Stars:

  “There’s just trees you don’t bark down, that’s all I’m saying.” — Vincent Goodwill on Scott Skiles taunting John Thompson ([37:06])

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Knicks Sweep Cavaliers, Harden Fallout: [02:01] – [08:01]
• Poll Question (Knicks/Spurs/Thunder): [09:26] – [11:05]
• Knicks’ Team Effort & Legacies: [12:26] – [16:11]
• Interview with Vincent Goodwill: [21:34] – [39:36]
• Listener Calls Start: [43:56]
• Best/Worst of the Weekend & Harden’s Rep: [45:16] – [48:10]

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Summary Table: Knicks’ Finals Opponent Pros & Cons

| Team | Pros | Cons | |--------|--------------------------------------------|------------------------------------| | Spurs | Knicks’ regular-season success, manage Wemby | Spurs healthier, Wemby unguardable | | Thunder| Depleted by injuries, deeper roster | SGA, reigning champs, more experience|

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Conclusion

This episode provides an in-depth, often humorous but always insightful analysis of the Knicks’ breakout playoff run. The hosts and guests weigh the meaning of “success” for a historically downtrodden franchise, dissect crucial X’s and O’s, and highlight unique quirks of modern NBA stars, all while keeping the stakes and legacy implications in sharp focus. The passionate New York narrative is balanced by cautionary tales from Cleveland and Sacramento — and the segment with Vincent Goodwill offers realism, historical savvy, and poignant reflections on basketball culture.

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Transcript

[Bethany Frankel]

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[Dan Patrick]

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You are listening to the Dan Patrick show on Fox Sports Radio.

[Dan Patrick]

Hope you had a great weekend. Everybody. Gang's all here, ready to go in the man cave. Fritzy, the minister of humor, Dylan in the back row, Marvin Pauley, yours truly. You at home or on the road watching on Peacock, our streaming partner. Thank you for downloading the app. And we say Good morning to iHeartradio, Fox Sports Radio and our radio affiliates around the country. We'll talk about basketball, what happened last night, what could happen tonight? You got spurs at the Thunder. Thunder Favored by five and a half, the Knicks will be waiting a long time to find out who they will face in the NBA Finals. 8773-DP-SHoVE Email address dpdanpatrick.com Twitter handle @DP-SHoVE Stat of the day is always brought to you by Panini America. The official trading cards of the Dan Patrick Show. We weren't here yesterday, so we will take your phone calls. Best and worst of the weekend. Tyler sitting by at 8-773-DP. Show the Knicks roll the Cavaliers. Jalen Brunson is your MVP. And now they wait since the spurs and the Thunder are tied at two games apiece. When you think about the Cavaliers, because normally what we do before we move on to talk about the team that advance, we talk about the team that didn't. And for the Cleveland Cavaliers, they brought in James Harden. They took a swing. The reason why they didn't win a game or they didn't advance is not on James Harden now. He's part of the problem, not part of the solution. And at his age, he's no longer that offensive machine. And you saw that throughout this series. And I think we got to come up with a different word, maybe a softer word for quit. Because Charles Barkley, the Inside the NBA guys talked about the Cavaliers quitting. And I don't know what that word is because I think it's, it's dangerous to throw that word out. They are professionals. They get paid a lot of money to play. And how do you just decide to quit? Like, is it said? Do you talk about it? Because it was a team then that quit. And I don't know if it's kind of systemic that all of a sudden you see somebody not really hustling. And I look at second chance points and this is what the Knicks dominated, you know, 32 to 5. And to me, that's just attitude. That's wanting something more than the other person does. Now you might say, well, they're down three, zero. Okay, go back to the first game. There's no excuse for that. And if they win that game, does that change anything in this series? Like, are the Knicks that much better than the Cavs, that the Cavs had their moment, lost their moment, and then never found their moment again? And I talked about that loss after Game one. I said, some losses are more than just one loss. And you saw that because it kind of permeated through the Cleveland Cavaliers. And I felt bad for Donovan Mitchell. He's trying to fire up his team. You're in the Eastern Conference finals. You should not need to be. You should not need a cheerleader. And that was what was surprising there. So if you have a suggestion on a different word for quit, I'm all ears for that. We'll have a poll question. Play of the day, stat of the day. All of that forthcoming first hour brought to you by Liberty Biberty, Liberty Mutual Insurance. Why pay full price when you can customize and save? Switch to Liberty Mutual. They'll customize your home and auto insurance so you only pay for what you need. I know I'm saying this isn't about James Harden, but I do have to mention a couple of things. Once again, more turnovers than field goals. And if you start to look at the players he's played with, he's first battle hall of Famer. We know that one of the great scores of all time he's played with Kevin Durant, Russell Westbrook, Chris Paul, Joe Allenby, Tyrese Maxey, Kawhi Leonard, Kyrie Irving, Donovan Mitchell. Sometimes you're the problem because you played with a lot of talent. But there are certain guys who are built for the regular season and certain teams that are built for the regular season. And then you got guys who were built for the postseason. And it's always interesting when you see, you know, like John Smoltz for the Braves was probably the third best pitcher on his staff behind Maddox and Glavin. Get into a postseason. Maddox and Glavin were average. John Smoltz became a Hall of Famer. Kurt Schilling, good regular season pitcher, put him in a postseason hall of Famer, in my opinion. Jack Morris, really good pitcher, regular season, postseason, became a Hall of Famer. This is where legacies are defined. This is when we look back, we'll look back on Jaylen Brunson's career probably with this season in mind and rightfully so. He has a chance to be the greatest New York Nick of all time. If he wins the NBA Finals, he wins the mvp. Well, it's a short list, but Jalen Brunson is doing what you want in a great player. Maybe SGA does this again. If Wemby has to do this, we'll look back and say, man, he won a title at 22. And if you get Knicks in the spurs in the NBA Finals, everybody is a winner. All right, Dylan, what's poll question? By the way, one more item with James Harden. He was asked this question after yesterday's loss. How much better if they're better are the Knicks than than you guys?

[James Harden]

I can't even answer that question honestly, you know what I mean? Like, yeah, it was 4. 0, but I don't think we gave. We had a chance as far as our best shot, you know, from, from a standpoint of the circumstances, you know, obviously they just, they, they dominated us four zero. But, yeah, I don't know if I can necessarily answer that question just because genuinely, I do feel like we, we are, we are the better team, series wise. You know, I didn't show it. So tough question. Answer.

[Dan Patrick]

I get it. You know, you just lost. It's embarrassing. And you're asked, you know, are they better than you? How much better? I guess the easy answer would be 4, 0. That's how much better. Because you have to have clarity and be based in reality. If you're the Cavaliers moving forward now, it's not incumbent upon James Harden to be like, you know, what we should be doing in the off season. I did wonder this when the game ended and not to make this about him. LeBron James, does LeBron see the opening here? You get rid of James Harden, LeBron comes in, you bookend your career, and maybe, maybe you're able to do something one more time. I did think that because we do have LeBron kind of in limbo, I still feel like the money is too great that he'll stay with the LA Lakers. But I did wonder that if they had gone to the Finals, I don't think LeBron would be entertaining the Cleveland Cavaliers and vice versa, no matter what happened. Because they might say, hey, we're right there. I mean, this isn't like Kevin Durant, where you, you're going to beat the Golden State Warriors. No, you don't. You guys collapsed. Now I'm going to join the Golden State Warriors. At this point in LeBron's career, I did wonder about that. Does this outcome have anything to do with what his immediate future is going to be? All right, Dylan, poll question today.

[Dylan]

Yeah, Dan, we got a couple. If you're the Knicks, who would you rather see in the Finals, the Spurs or the Thunder?

[Dan Patrick]

I would probably rather see the Thunder because they're not healthy. Even though they have the mvp, they have the experience. They. They won the title. I, I think Wemby is. You just don't have an answer for Wemby. And I think they're a little healthier than okc. Now. OKC is deeper, but I would probably look at maybe OKC just because it's some injuries that they have. But I. It's pretty close. I mean, the Knicks are on A historical roll. I mean, they're. They're blowing people out. They're not just winning. They're embarrassing teams. And I don't know if they. Now you're going to have the rest versus rust, but you got this Knicks team that's going to be sitting and waiting and waiting. And then, I wonder. It almost feels like no matter what happens, whoever gets to the finals, the Knicks will lose Game 1 because they're going to. You know, Cleveland should have won game one in this series, too. Yes.

[Marvin Pauley]

Morv, if you're the Atlanta Hawks, you're like, man, we had a really good season. We beat the Knicks two times in the postseason.

[Dan Patrick]

I know. Yes.

[Paulie]

Paulie, imagine being a Knicks fan today, and your issue is, who do you want to face next in the Finals?

[Fox Sports Radio Announcer]

Golly.

[Dan Patrick]

Yeah. It's a nice dilemma to have. Yes. Yes.

[Dylan]

Dylan, it does seem like you're getting a little bit of a raw deal, though. It's like you're whoever. Kind of your poison, really. Right. With the Thunder and the Spurs, I mean, it's not. You know, it'll be their toughest test by far.

[Dan Patrick]

So.

[Dylan]

So far.

[Dan Patrick]

Yeah. Well, you can't be choosy here. You got to take who is ever in front of you. But I would just say I'd probably rather face okc. Here's another thing that happens a lot of times. We'll watch a sport, we might not watch a team, and then you're forced to watch that team. And then when you watch that team, you go, like the spurs when they were winning championships, you weren't watching during the regular season, but you had to watch during the postseason. And then you go, oh, they're not very exciting. No, they weren't. They were just great. Okay. See, you don't watch them during the regular season, but now you're forced to watch them. And then you're watching sga, and then you're going, golly, does he flop? Yeah, for the last couple of years, he's been doing that, but you haven't been watching. Now you're forced to watch. And then everybody is outraged that he gets these calls. I don't blame him. Now you can say, oh, you're a basketball purist. Would you have a problem with this? No, no. Whatever I can get away with. I mean, blame it on the officials. Don't blame it on sga. If they stop calling, he'll stop flopping. Right. That's what happens. So I'm going to blame the NBA for sga, but if I'm sga, I take advantage of everything, anything. I want an edge. Oh, you know, the route that you're taking, you know, that's not basketball worthy. That's not, you know, MVP worthy. But now you're forced to watching, and now you're watching all the place, not just clips. Oh, I don't watch the NBA because they flop. Well, how do you know they flop without watching? But I'm curious how things will be officiated in the NBA finals. Because you want to have the best game on display. You don't want it to be, oh, look at this. You know, like we would watch soccer for years and I would go, oh, I hate watching it. All they do is flop. Well, that's because you're watching highlights, maybe, and not the full game to give it full context. But yes. Does sga. Is he a foul merchant? Yes, he is. He's mastered it. It's a master class. Harden used to do this. Mastered it. I mean, Pete Harden was all about initiating contact, and you are the one that gets called for the foul. But that's what's going to be interesting. You're going to be able to see this Knicks team and you're going to get this question, are they likable? I heard that a couple of times over the weekend. Hey, do you think the Knicks are likable? I go, yeah, like, they, they play hard. Great home court advantage. Your star acts like a star. It's a team effort. I love watching Josh Hart. Cat has sacrificed. OG Anunoby has been great. They. They found a team. You know, Landry Sham it. Like, you're just. You find a team and if you look down through the years, you got to have a Josh Hart or Caruso. I mean, throughout history, there was always one of those guys, Andre Iguodala. Like, you got to have that guy who. He's kind of the glue. What do you need? I'll do it. Not everybody can be a star. And just about everybody was a star when they were in college or high school. Here they have a true team effort. And I think that's what's really incredible about this run. And it starts with Brunson. He's going. He is going to give you everything that he possibly has. And I think because of that, it's. It kind of just trickles down. And I do believe there is something about bringing in players who win. Josh Hart and Jalen Brunson won in college, you know, the Villanova Knicks. I do think that that's really important to have winners, guys who know what it Takes they won before. I think that's really, really important. And you're seeing that it's an incredible run by the Knicks. But you got to win the title. You got to win the title. Yes, Marvin.

[Marvin Pauley]

I think they're kind of in a win win situation. So say if they win the NBA title, obviously, unbelievable. One of the greatest runs ever. But if they lose, people will always remember this run. Say if they go to six or seven games against the spurs of the Thunder, people will look at them just like you do the 99 or the 94 Knicks. You're going to look at them that way.

[Dan Patrick]

They don't even think about the 99 Knicks because the spurs were so much better and you had, you know, Ewing injury. And I don't think they, they go, oh, remember the 99 season.

[Marvin Pauley]

If you're a Knicks fan, you do, because we say, what, for the first time since what, 1999, now 1994. John Starks comes back to a great ovation every single time he's in the Garden.

[Dan Patrick]

You got to win the title.

[Marvin Pauley]

Oh, of course you, you have to.

[Dan Patrick]

But I don't think you get a consolation prize. Boy, look at what we did against the crappy Hawks team, a crappy Sixers team and a Cleveland Cavalier team that maybe quite. Hey, we got to the NBA final. You gotta win. Gotta win. Yes, Paul.

[Paulie]

I would agreed with Marvin if the Knicks hadn't been rolling the past three weeks and dominating the past three weeks. They really upped the expectations dramatically.

[Dan Patrick]

Yeah, you gotta win. That's what it's. That's what New York's all about. Nobody talks about, boy, the Yankees got to the World Series against the Dodgers. It's. We got embarrassed in the World Series against the Dodgers. Yeah.

[Marvin Pauley]

Yes, Mark, but we're talking about the Knicks, not the Yankees. The Knicks have two NBA titles, not 27. So it's a different animal.

[Dan Patrick]

You think a Knicks fan is going to be okay with this and go, hey, we made it to the finals and we took the spurs to six games after that?

[Marvin Pauley]

No, but in hindsight, they'll always remember this run.

[Dan Patrick]

Yes, Dylan.

[Dylan]

Also the, the 94 Knicks. The Rangers won the Stanley cup that year, so they got overshadowed in their own building.

[Dan Patrick]

How about we take a break? Vincent Goodwill, our good buddy, big time Vincent Goodwill of the mothership covering the NBA. Reggie Miller. He'll be on the call for tonight's game at okc. He'll join us later on as well. Take a break. Just getting started. Back after this.

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[Dan Patrick]

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[Kal Penn]

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[Dan Patrick]

Probably not the first time you'll hear this music as it relates to the New York knicks. Yes, it's 1999 when the Knicks lost to the San Antonio Spurs. Vincent Goodwill Vincenzo Goodwill Jr III, ESPN NBA Senior Writer he was there for the Game 4 Eastern Conference Finals between the Knicks and the Cavs. If I would have told you in October the Knicks would be in the NBA Finals, you would have said what they better be.

[Vincent Goodwill]

That's what. That's clearly what the edict was going to be late even before James Dolan said it on January 5th. You know, in October, everything was laid out for the New York Knicks. Dan no, Jason Tatum. And we didn't know what Jason Tatum was going to look like. We knew there was no going to be no Tyrese Halliburton, who got hurt in the opening minutes of Game 7 of the NBA Finals. Everything was laid out for the Knicks to get to this point now how and all the other ways could not predict it, couldn't have predicted them bludgeoning these teams and doing it in the manner that in which they've done it. But as far as getting to the NBA Finals, I would say this is more, this feels more like 1994 to 1999.

[Dan Patrick]

As far as predictability, Vegas source told me that if the Knicks played the Thunder, Thunder would be a pretty good favor. If the spurs play the Knicks, it would probably be a pick them. Who did the Knicks want to play?

[Vincent Goodwill]

I think the Knicks probably want to play San Antonio because remember if you go back a few months, several months, the NBA had that cup thing in Vegas and San Antonio was there and the Knicks were there and the Knicks won that that game. They corralled Victor when Benyama now granted completely different circumstance. Right. The Knicks were a much different ball club at that point and they still handled the spurs. But the spurs were a different ball club too. I think it comes down to a matter of who, who's healthier. If Shai Gilders Alexander shakes up out of this slump and gets Oklahoma City to the finals, where's Jalen Williams health? Like he's the second best player on this team. Like where's Chet Holmgren as far as his fatigue? Where's Victor Wembanyama as far as his fatigue? And all those guys, they haven't played this long like Dan, you know how fatiguing this is. The Knicks have had the benefit of beating teams coming out of very fatiguing seven game series. That's Philadelphia after their first round tilt with the Celtics coming down from 31 and Cleveland after going seven games with Detroit. And the Knicks have pounced on them. When the finals happen, there could be a three day break, but it's not one day and then game one and then you can't really get from behind the eight ball.

[Dan Patrick]

With the Knicks, this has been a historical run and we were just talking about there's no consolation prizes with New York sports teams, right? So you've come this far, you get to the finals. It's not a question of hey, if we win, you have to win. I think to, to come away from this saying I feel good about this season. Well, I can tell by your facial gestures you don't agree with me.

[Vincent Goodwill]

No, I can't say that. I used to be the person that says, well winning is only winning. But when you ain't never been no Damn where for 25 years, Dan, like people are going to remember this night people are going to remember that, that Sunday in Philadelphia, Mother's Day. Like they're going to remember the journey. They're going to remember the despair that they felt when they lost, when Tom Thibodeau was fired, when they lost to Indiana last year, man, we may not ever get back here again. And then you wind up getting to this stage so far. And I was telling a lot of people last night, yeah, Knick fans should celebrate. Not just because June is coming and you have no idea what happens there, but this has been a remarkable run up until this point, one of the more dominant runs in NBA history. It is really damn hard to get to the NBA Finals and it should be celebrated. Like for whatever reason, when baseball teams clinch their divisions, Chris, Their divisions, they have beer baths and celebrate and they do it in every round. And in the NBA, for some reason, it's like you can only win the championship or else. I no longer subscribe to that theory.

[Dan Patrick]

The Atlanta Braves won one World Series, but they were always in contention. Do you think that they came away going, hey, you know, we, we lost another World Series, we had a great year. It's about winning. The Knicks should be good. They should be good.

[Vincent Goodwill]

Dan, have you not seen the New York Knicks in the way that they have operated for 30 damn years?

[Dan Patrick]

No, this year, this year they should be good because last year they should have been in the NBA Finals. They should be here. Boston was wounded. People still were skeptical of Cleveland. We didn't trust the 76ers to stay healthy. How the Hawks got in and you know, took a 2:1 series lead, I mean, they should be here. They were, they were, they were a really good team this year.

[Vincent Goodwill]

They should be here. You're talking about them winning it. You're going against potentially. Let, let's just look ahead, okay? You are potentially going against the current, in theory, dynasty dynastic team in the Oklahoma City Thunder with a two time MVP and a reigning champion that could have very well have won 70 games this year if not for going 1 and 4 against the San Antonio Spurs. And that's the other team on the other side of this, another 60 win team with an alien that you have no answer for. So while I'm not saying the Knicks should be satisfied, I'm saying let's keep this all in perspective. Remember, Dan, remember this. Stephon Marbury, Amari Stoudemire, Carmelo Anthony, Phil Jackson. Hey, should we trade for Giannis? Maybe we should trade for Giannis. You traded five first round picks for Mikhail Bridges in their own way for the better part of 30 years. So to say, hey, this is the only thing that matters is winning this championship. If you're the Boston Celtics, yes. If you're the Los Angeles Lakers, yes. You know the phrase that we say sometimes in black households, we go somewhere new, act like you've been somewhere before. Don't embarrass me. That's what we say. That's what we should be saying to the Knicks. Act like you've been nowhere before. They've never been nowhere.

[Dan Patrick]

We're talking to Vincent Goodwill, ESPN NBA Senior Writer the Cavaliers got swept because

[Vincent Goodwill]

they're not that good. Like, let's sometimes the clearest answer is the answer that's in front of your face. For one, when they lost game one, that was it. I don't know what Kenny Atkinson is saying. I don't know if he shows up for game five. And what if they hang a banner for the analytical I don't know what the analytics said about last night. Right. But there comes a point in every playoff series, especially when you lose a game in devastating fashion. Like you knew in 2018 when, when J.R. smith didn't realize time and score in Game 1 of the Finals and that destroyed LeBron's best singular performance of his career. You knew the Cleveland Cavaliers would not win the game. When I'm going to take it even further back to you, Dan. The Memorial Day miracle of Sean Elliott. The San Antonio spurs, when they beat Portland in that game two, after Portland had a 20 point lead, you knew that series was over. Just like you knew this series was over. I predicted a sweep from the beginning. You can go check it. The Knicks were going to sweep this series because the Cavs were tired already at the two seven game series and then were emotionally worn out. And then we got the guy in James Harden who says, hey, is the series over? I will help with that. And he will then help with that with a turnover, with not getting back on defense. That's what last night looked like. That's what this entire series looked like.

[Dan Patrick]

I'm wondering what Sacramento Kings fans feel like today. They traded Tyrese Halliburton. He leads the Pacers to the Finals. They traded Dear and Fox, he's in the Western Conference Finals. They fired Mike Brown. He's now headed to the NBA Finals. The Kings are kind of like a AAA team, a feeder system here for some of these teams in the NBA.

[Vincent Goodwill]

Look, well, Vivek Ranadive. It just shows you that, Dan, this thing starts at ownership and the great NBA owners Routinely get out the way. The more we speak about your name, it's probably not in the positive context. All right. How many times have we said the name Jim Dolan outside of him saying we better get to the Finals? Outside of that he's been, he's been regularly quiet. But when you talk about the Kings and some of these other franchises and that can't get it right, it's usually because ownership can't stop meddling. Now Sacramento has had, you know, crossroads. Well, do we take Halberton or do we take Fox? And you wind up taking Fox and then that winds up going sideways after having a couple of good years with Mike Brown as your head coach, they have a mess that they have to work themselves out of. But good to great teams identify the marks that they can eat off the trough of. And Sacramento to large degree has been built, has been building NBA Finals teams for the better part of the past couple years.

[Dan Patrick]

I did think about LeBron James last night, as I always do. You know, Having worked at ESPN for 18 years, you always have to think of LeBron James.

[Vincent Goodwill]

You were thinking about LeBron James last night as you always do. You want to rephrase that, Dan?

[Dan Patrick]

Yeah. Well, not late at night, but just in the evening. I was thinking of LeBron because if the Cavs got to the Finals, I don't know if they would be entertaining the idea of LeBron or maybe Vice versa. The fact that you get embarrassed in the Eastern Conference finals, I don't know if it changes the percentage of LeBron going to the Cavaliers or staying in LA in your mind.

[Vincent Goodwill]

That's a great question, I think, Dan. It comes down to dollars and cents. Like the Cavaliers are the 1 NBA team in this very punitive second apron, which means they don't have the mechanisms to pay a player like LeBron James as their roster is currently constituted. And then you add on the possible or likely James Harden extension because you don't trade for James Harden at this age and trade a point guard who's 10 years younger for James Harden for a one year rental. Like you don't do that. Even if you think LeBron James is coming back. I think the most they can offer him is $3 million. Even though LeBron is no longer peak or prime. LeBron James, he's still an all star. He's still an all NBA capable player. As we've seen through these regular season in the playoffs. The Cavs don't have the money. And last I checked, LeBron has not taken a discount since coming back to Cleveland in 2014 to ask him to move his family to move that baby. That baby don't know nothing about Cleveland. That baby knows about Los Angeles. And to say we're going to move to Ohio, everybody and Ohio winners and we're going to take a, a 40 something million dollar pay cut, then you got to make that make sense.

[Dan Patrick]

Yeah, but the kids are out of the house and maybe, you know, it's one year. It's, it's, you know, like going on a winter vacation. You know, you're, you're going to be gone for a while. It'd be a cool story. He's already a billionaire. Now, I know you don't want to walk away from 50 or 60 million dollars, but what's LeBron playing for now? He's playing. He's playing for LeBron. So what is going to help you? Another good season with the Lakers. You're not getting through OKC in San Antonio. You can go to the east and your path might be less crowded.

[Vincent Goodwill]

Okay, let's also flip this, Dan. You ain't turning out a dime. You're not turning down a dime at this stage of your career. You think LeBron is. That's point one, point two. Did you hear Kenny Atkinson say, you know, analytically, we're up two games to one in this series. Can you imagine if LeBron James was on that team and that was his head coach saying that LeBron would lose the remaining follicles atop his head if he had to deal with support supporting all of that. I don't know if the Cavaliers are as close as this conference finals run has indicated. Like, we don't look at the Knicks as this historical great 60 win team. I look at them as a team that won a great historical run that had some breaks go their way. The Cavs win seven games with the Toronto Raptors. The Cavs went to seven games with the Detroit Pistons, who are going to be as bad this year as they will ever be for the next few years. They, that is a monster that is growing out out there. And I don't know if Cleveland with a one year LeBron rental, if that makes the most sense. And here's the other part. Retiring as a Los Angeles Laker and being a Laker for life or retiring as a Cleveland Cavalier and being a Cleveland Cavalier for like, which he's always going to be anyway.

[Dan Patrick]

Yeah, he's not going to be a Laker for life. He's not homegrown. It's just different. They might give him a statue or something. But feels like a lot of people are getting statues.

[Vincent Goodwill]

Shaq wasn't homegrown and Shaq is a laker.

[Dan Patrick]

Well, Shaq did bring him three titles, too.

[Vincent Goodwill]

I'm with you.

[Dan Patrick]

Yeah.

[Vincent Goodwill]

I don't disagree with you.

[Dan Patrick]

All right, I'm done. I just throw things. My job is to ask questions, Vincent. That's all. That's all. I just asked. I'm John Stockton. I just dish. That's all. Whatever you do with it after that, it's on you. I just dished. That's it.

[Vincent Goodwill]

I have a John Stockton take. I'm let it. I'm going to let that one ride. Because you had Isaiah on last week.

[Dan Patrick]

Yeah.

[Vincent Goodwill]

And I give you credit for having Isaiah on last week. I meant to text you about that. I give you much props for having Zeke on and not baiting him. Don't bait me today.

[Dan Patrick]

Sometimes you don't have to bait Isaiah. And did you hear him when I said, give me your all time starting 5? And he waited on Michael Jordan? He. I go, wait a minute. You pause. He goes, yeah. I was thinking Kobe. I was thinking LeBron. I went, Damn.

[Vincent Goodwill]

He was thinking of a team. For one, he was thinking of building a team. And for two, he put himself there. And he said, me and Michael Jordan played well together, which they did when they played together in All Star Games. I give Isaiah credit for maturity because then you want. You were trying to get him to the point to say something else. You were trying to get him to go viral.

[Dan Patrick]

Yep. Yeah. Just doing my job. That's it. That's all I do.

[Vincent Goodwill]

And you're very good at it, Dan.

[Dan Patrick]

I'm Scott Skiles. That's all I want to do. I just want to, you know, just 30 assists.

[Vincent Goodwill]

1991. Good, good job. I know, Dan. I like that.

[Dan Patrick]

I still like that. Skiles, when he was at Michigan State, is yelling at John Thompson on the sidelines to get somebody out here who can bleep and guard me. During the game, Skiles is dribbling over by the bench and he yells to Big John, get somebody out here who can bleep and guard me.

[Vincent Goodwill]

I don't know if that's the smartest move to be yelling at big John Thompson, who could flatten you without even moving the towel from his shoulder. I would say I would tell Scott Skiles to relax. There's a few men that I wouldn't mess with. Big John Thompson is one of them. The late, great Paul Silas is another one. There's just trees. You don't bark down that's all I'm saying.

[Marvin Pauley]

I get it.

[Vincent Goodwill]

I get it. You're feeling, you're feeling great. But you know, don't hurt yourself.

[Dan Patrick]

Yeah, play the long game. All right. So who comes out of the West?

[Vincent Goodwill]

Man, I still think the champs are the champs. And I got questions and I have questions about their health. I'm not sure about Jalen Williams's health. Like when you repeatedly hurt the same soft tissue that hamstring. That's a question for me. My biggest question is how much energy do the San Antonio spurs have left? I just saw the Cleveland Cavaliers run out of gas like one. They quit, right? Cleveland quit. I don't think San Antonio is going to quit. But I wonder how much energy do the spurs have at this point to go to a game 5, 6, 7. Playing every other day and asking Victor Wyama to carry this against this really good team and in Oklahoma City, that's just not playing well. And at this point, here's the other thing, Shea. Gil Alexander is a two time mvp. He's lived a pretty charmed life up until this point. He's going to have to show up, and not by showing up, by falling on the floor. He's going to have to give you a suitable for framing. Game 5, 6 Impossible 7 in this series. That's going to be required of him in the next five or six days. I'm anxious to see if. If he's up to it.

[Dan Patrick]

Suitable for framing. Seems like you've maybe written that before, haven't you?

[Vincent Goodwill]

N N the only thing I've said, Dan, is June belongs to no one. And that's what we are finding out in these playoffs. And you know, with all the parody in the NBA. So it could be the champs or it could be San Antonio's time because the league moves faster than ever. Quicker than ever. Nobody would have expected the New York Knicks, the team that routinely broke themselves every year because Tom Thibodeau drove them so hard to be the team that breaks everybody else. In game four, game six of these playoff series, the Knicks have broken their opponents. And I could not have predicted that. I don't think anybody could have predicted that.

[Dan Patrick]

Vincenzo Goodwill Jr. III, ESPN NBA senior writer. Thank you. We appreciate it, Vince.

[Vincent Goodwill]

Hey, happy belated birthday too, Dan.

[Dan Patrick]

Thank you, man. That's Vincent Goodwill. Always fun having him on. As. As you say, Marvin. We get in the crates.

[Vincent Goodwill]

Oh, for sure.

[Dan Patrick]

When Vincent's on, we get into the crates.

[Marvin Pauley]

Yeah, we dig in those crates.

[Dan Patrick]

Yeah, hint, history. All right, we'll take a break. Phone calls coming up Best and worst of the weekend and our play of the day next.

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[Dan Patrick]

Learn [e-mail] hey everyone, it's Kal Penn.

[Kal Penn]

I'm the host of Irsay the Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club. This week on the podcast, I am sitting down with Ray Porter, the narrator of Andy Weir's audiobook project, Hail Mary Massive Sci fi adventure about survival and science and what happens when you wake up alone, very far from Earth.

[Ray Porter]

I really had to make a decision because I caught myself getting that frog in my throat and starting to get teary as I'm narrating some of these sections and it's like, okay, yo, yo, yo, is this indulgent? And I really thought about it. I was like, no. At this point it would kind of be betraying the trust the author and the listener have in telling this story if I don't go through it. But there's places in this book that that deeply, emotionally affected me and I left it on the mic. That's great because it served the story. People will say like, oh my God, I cried at the end. It's like, yeah dude, me too.

[Kal Penn]

Listen to Earsay the Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club on the iHeartradio app or

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wherever you get your Podcasts Ryan Reynolds here from IT Mobile. I don't know if you knew this, but anyone can get the same Premium Wireless for $15 a month plan that I've been enjoying. It's not just for celebrities. So do like I did and have one of your assistant's assistants switch you to Mint Mobile today. I'm told it's super easy to [e-mail]

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Switch upfront payment of $45 for 3 month plan equivalent to $15 per month required. Intro rate first 3 months only then full price plan options available. Taxes and fees, extra fee full [e-mail] oh my God.

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The play.

[Dan Patrick]

The play is going.

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Play of the day, brother.

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Looks like I gotta play it and play it.

[Dan Patrick]

This is the play of the day. Check this out. Sven.

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Hang on to the puck. Santa Cross. Jarvis has to settle it. He'll get it right back. A chance. They score. They score. Andre Svetchnikov wins it in overtime and the Hurricanes have silenced the Bell center and have taken a 21 series lead here in the Eastern Conference final.

[Dan Patrick]

Courtesy of the Carolina Hurricanes Radio Network 99.9 the Fan the Canadiens had one shot on goal in the final almost 38 minutes of play. That's your play of the day brought to you by Tire Rack. They've been doing it for over 40 years. The right tires for how and what and where you drive ship fast and free back by free road hazard protection. Convenient installation options like mobile tire installation. Tirerack.com the way tire buying should be. Chris and Syracuse hi Chris.

[Chris]

Hey. Thank you Dan. Hey, I got a comment on the New York Knicks and the best and worst for you and also maybe a more accurate word than quit. Maybe deflated. Yeah. For the Knicks at this time last year they were beat up, unrested from the regular season and postseason and from Brunson a cat on down and they lacked in playoff experience. And this team is much deeper. Bench. They still have a long way to go. But as a Knicks fan you. You couldn't ask for a better setup. And with so many good young teams in the NBA, if the Knicks don't seize the opportunity this year, bad this group may not get another one. And my best Friday night, The Thunder getting 76 points. The bench, they're 11 or 12 deep. Amazing. And in years to come they set themselves up to enjoy that kind of depth. And yeah, just a great job of their front office. And my worst to Donovan Mitchell, the Cavs. He has to be wondering if this Cavs have reached their ceiling. And this is as Good as they're going to be, and it's just not good enough for a title. And he's a New York guy. Wanted to be a Nick coming out of free agency with Utah and settled for being a Cav. And the Knicks decided to go with and build around a guy named Jalen Brunson instead, who was a lot less expensive than a Donovan Mitchell. And with the money they saved, they were able to put the pieces around him to build a title contender. If they had gone without a Mitchell, they maybe would have been in the same boat as the. As the Cavs are.

[Dan Patrick]

Thank you, Chris. You know what's not getting enough attention? And it should. We can talk about Nico Harrison and trading Luca and a bad deal. What you got in return for him? Jalen Brunson left and you got nothing for him. I mean, at least you got some bodies for Luca. You didn't get anything for Jalen Brunson. Now, we didn't know Jalen Brunson was this Jalen Brunson, but he still was a really, really talented, you know, teammate for Luka Doncic. And now you look back on that, you didn't get anything. You let him go in free agency. Buddha in San Francisco. Hi, Buddha. What's on your mind?

[Buddha]

Happy Tuesday, boys. Let's party like it's 1999. Britzy. Dan, watching the Cavs yesterday, aside from Don and Mitchell, I saw a group of empty players who looked like they were given a straight season desist. Man, that was sad. And when the playoffs started, dp, I thought. I didn't think the east had a great chance of winning the title. I mean, the west is just too deep. But these Knicks are gonna be rested, they're hungry, and you can just get a sense that they believe, man. And Brunson didn't even play in the fourth quarter again last night. I mean, they're just hoping for a seven game series at this point. But best of the weekend, Dan, watching Jalen Brunson play basketball. I mean, in this current, like, polarizing state of the NBA, he's the opposite OSGA in terms of how he plays the game. I mean, his footwork is immaculate, he's not a flopper, and he's fun to watch, man. And question of the weekend, I don't know if it's the best or worst, but Jacob Mizaroski hitting 100 miles per hour on 57 different pitches.

[Chris]

What?

[Buddha]

I mean, that just blew my mind. I'm not sure if I want to see that all the time. It's Very entertaining. But when I think about what that does to your arm over time, not good.

[Dan Patrick]

It's not a question of if, but when you have Tommy John, it feels like. And I still wonder. I know we fall in love looking up at the, you know, the, the jugs gun, the radar. Oh, how, how fast it was that. Oh, it was 103. It's not throwing. You gotta still pitch. And that's the only thing that I would caution any of these young pitchers be able to pitch. You're, you're a pitcher, not a thrower. Learn how to get the batter to get himself out. Maddox did this and I know nobody's come close to that kind of. I, I think Pedro Martinez was similar. Like, get, have them help you. And that's why Maddox was like, man, if I throw 92 pitches, I don't care if I'm topping 93 miles an hour. I want to make you get yourself out. Andrew in Washington. Hi, Andrew, what do you have for me?

[Andrew]

Good morning, Dan, Dennis, thanks for taking my call. I got a best and worst and a stat and a little receipt to take. But the worst was James Harden in a conference finals. It's sort of like the Scooby Doo show. And at the end they take the mask off the bad guy and they see who it really is. It's like every team takes the mask off James Harden at the end of the season. They still see that Houston James Harden and, and where he missed all the shots in game seven of that series. So he's never been any better. My best in New York Knicks closing out a playoff series this year with a record third series clinching 20 point win in a single postseason. So that's excellent. I do think you're right. The Thunder would do better against the Knicks. They're five and own their last five games. Where the Knicks have won three out of five against the spurs in the last five games. But my receipt is this. A while ago, the Cavs started the season with a huge winning streak and I said they were the Washington Wizards of opening winning streaks to start a season. Well, I think that take has come full circle and now they look like the Washington Wizards of the Eastern Conference finals.

[Dan Patrick]

All right, thank you, Andrew. Update the poll results. New poll question coming up. Reggie Miller will be on the call for tonight's game five in OkC. He'll join us in the final hour of the program. If you're watching on Peacock, I'm heading into the confessional hour two right after this.

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[Vincent Goodwill]

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