Hour 2 – Brendan Sorsby’s Agent Keeps Scandal Alive, Jon Wertheim

Summary

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The Dan Patrick Show – Hour 2

Episode Title: Brendan Sorsby’s Agent Keeps Scandal Alive, Jon Wertheim
Date: June 18, 2026
Host: Dan Patrick
Notable Guests: John Wertheim (Sports Illustrated, 60 Minutes)

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Episode Overview

This episode centers around the ongoing controversy involving quarterback Brendan Sorsby and his agent’s public statements about NIL contract disputes and gambling violations. The conversation expands into broader topics, such as the challenges facing college sports in the NIL era, the pressures of young stardom (including profiles of Levine Yamal and Caitlin Clark), implementation of sports gambling regulations, and the evolving infrastructure of leagues like the WNBA. The show maintains its signature tone—irreverent, informed, and conversational—with live updates on the US Open, World Cup surprises, poll results, and listener questions.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Brendan Sorsby NIL/Gambling Scandal

Timestamps: 02:34–08:42; 22:43–26:47; 36:08–37:27

• Background: Sorsby, the former Texas Tech (and Cincinnati) QB, has been entangled in controversy regarding NIL contracts and reported gambling activities.
• Main Issue: Sorsby’s agent, Ron Slavin, reignites the scandal by publicly blaming Cincinnati for allegedly knowing and hiding Sorsby’s betting, despite a pending lawsuit over his NIL contract.
• Quote:
  • Ron Slavin:

    “If anybody should be questioned or be catching heat, it should be Cincinnati because they knew for two years and never said anything and didn't do anything about it.” (05:22)

• Dan Patrick’s Perspective:
  Dan criticizes the agent’s public approach:

  “You want to talk, great...but my advice to the agent and Sorsby is don't do any interviews. Certainly not until after your pro day…Let it go quiet.” (06:18)

• Details on Disclosure:
  A source reveals that Sorsby's gambling was actually discovered through a sportsbook law enforcement tip to the NCAA—not by the schools. The NCAA began its investigation after receiving the tip on March 11 (23:00–24:11).
• Analysis by Guest John Wertheim:
  Wertheim frames this as a predictable but troubling evolution in the NIL and gambling era:

  “You don’t bet on your own team. And yet, here we are... At the same time, wasn’t this the most predictable thing ever?” (24:36)

• Broader Concerns: Dan and John discuss the risks of young athletes with money and easy access to betting, noting the unique vulnerabilities of the 18–24 age group.

2. US Open & Shinnecock Hills Coverage

Timestamps: 02:34–10:37; 43:43–47:18

• Live updates from Shinnecock Hills, emphasizing the difficulty of the course.
• Fun Stat:

  “Only three [players] have ended up under par for the tournament [at Shinnecock].” (09:42)

• Conversation about the exclusivity and challenge of top golf courses, with listeners sharing plans for bucket-list golf trips to Pebble Beach and discussions of St. Andrews and Sawgrass.
• Quote:

  “You can have a bad round, but not a bad day at Pebble Beach.” (44:14)

3. Knicks Championship Parade and NBA Letdown

Timestamps: 09:13–11:54; 13:19–13:56

• Listeners and Dan debate if this Knicks team can win again after their long-awaited championship.
• Listener Input (Chris from Syracuse):

  “Everything lined up just right…that will not be the case in years to come…and most importantly, the Knicks were 100% healthy and rested when it counted.” (13:19)

• Parade coverage includes comedic discussion of backroom staff attending shirtless, poking fun at parade logistics.

4. World Cup Surprises & International Sports

Timestamps: 11:54–12:39; 15:03–16:14

• Congo earns a shock draw with Portugal—a “March Madness” type moment as underdogs get opportunities due to the expanded format.
• Quote:

  “That’s the fun part of this — you get that March Madness kind of feel.” (12:39)

• Discussion on the global expansion of the NFL, with listeners speculating about ‘academy’ systems abroad. Paulie notes existing partnerships but Dan reiterates it’s mostly for branding, not player development.

5. Pressures of Young Stardom – Levine Yamal & Social Media

Timestamps: 26:47–30:36

• John Wertheim discusses profiling Barcelona and Spain phenom Levine Yamal for 60 Minutes, emphasizing the difference in European talent development and the overwhelming nature of instant fame in the social media age.
• Quote:

  “I got the feeling this was one of the few real sit-down interviews he’d ever given.” (27:52)

• Dan remarks on how Messi and Ronaldo’s youthful fame pales compared to today’s constant spotlight.

6. Caitlin Clark, Nike, and the WNBA’s Growing Pains

Timestamps: 31:52–36:04; 40:59–43:29

• Nike’s delay in releasing Caitlin Clark’s signature shoe despite early NIL deals becomes a talking point.
  • Wertheim:

    “Why Nike? …why it took till June of 2026, when you’ve got Caitlin Clark on your roster and you are paying her, is just…one of the great sports marketing missteps.” (33:33)

• Wertheim and Dan agree: Clark was “100% ready” for the spotlight; the WNBA as an organization was not.
• Quote:

  “The infrastructure [of the league] is so lagging. The infrastructure of the league is not worthy of the players…” (35:19)

• Anecdotes about being guided by Clark’s camp to keep her profile about women’s basketball generally, not just herself.

7. Listener Questions, Polls, and Moments of Levity

Timestamps: 09:13–09:42; throughout

• Poll Results:
  • 88% do NOT wish to be at the Knicks’ parade.
  • Most respondents would prefer to win the US Open over being the ninth person on the moon.
• Dan discusses the anxiety of preparing for his daughter’s wedding dance and speech, sharing an emotional family moment involving “Unchained Melody.” (17:17–18:49)
• Discussion about Scottish football (soccer) fans drinking Boston bars dry, with the crew joking about Irish-Scottish drinking prowess. (40:15–41:43)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Sorsby Scandal:

  • Dan Patrick: “He’s not a sympathetic figure...just go quiet. The best you can do for all involved is Sh. Don’t say anything.” (06:18)
  • John Wertheim: “At some level, this is a new sort of...we’ve entered new territory here. And...wasn’t this the most predictable thing ever?” (24:36)

• On Underage Gambling and NIL:

  • Wertheim: “Look, look at these sportsbooks and look who their target is...all your biometrics...the ability to impact games. What did you think was going to happen?” (25:52)

• On Young Soccer Fame:

  • Wertheim: “I don’t think I’ve ever seen a level of athlete fame quite like this. Combining age 18...this might be the most prominent athlete in the world right now.” (29:06)

• On WNBA Infrastructure:

  • Wertheim: “The infrastructure is so lagging. The infrastructure...is not worthy of the players. And I’m hoping, you know, you hope that changes.” (35:19)

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Important Timestamps

• 02:34–08:42 — Sorsby scandal discussion, agent’s comments, Dan’s advice, listeners chime in
• 09:13–09:42 — Poll results
• 13:19–13:56 — Knicks parade and skepticism about back-to-back championships
• 22:43–26:47 — Exclusive source info on Sorsby betting discovery; John Wertheim interview segment
• 26:47–30:36 — Young stardom, Yamal, and European vs. American sports development
• 31:52–36:04 — Caitlin Clark, Nike's slow response, WNBA infrastructure
• 40:15–41:43 — Scottish fans overrun Boston pubs
• 43:43–47:18 — Bucket-list golf courses, Pebble Beach vs. others

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Episode Tone & Style

• Engaged, quick-witted, and direct. Dan balances journalistic skepticism with humor (“Let it go quiet,” “I’m Irish and Scottish, so I’ll be two-fisted”). The entire crew brings in lighthearted banter, personal anecdotes, and audience interactivity that keep the show lively even when discussing serious or technical topics.

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Summary Takeaway

This episode is essential for fans following the intersection of NIL, gambling, and college sports, illustrating both the predictable pitfalls and unpredictable fallout the NCAA and athletes now face. The conversations with John Wertheim add depth to the discussion of sports marketing, international fame, and league readiness, while regular updates and listener interactions keep the tone fresh and entertaining.

Transcript

[Dan Patrick]

This is an iHeart podcast.

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[Dan Patrick]

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[Dan Patrick]

It's called football.

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[Fox Sports Radio Announcer]

You are listening to the Dan Patrick show on Fox Sports Radio, Hour two

[Dan Patrick]

on this Thursday, after a two hour delay due to fog, the US Open is underway at Shinnecock Hills on Long Island. We'll update when we need to, if we feel the need to tell you, alert you to anything. This is normally kind of a quiet time in our world because the NBA Finals is over. You do have baseball, but it's baseball in June. That doesn't really matter. Hockey is over, but it feels busy obviously with the World Cup. You got the US Open, you got the NBA draft coming up next week. And I'm kind of curious what the Wizards are going to do. They're on the clock and I saw where the odds, the updated odds. AJ Debanza is the odds on favorite, overwhelming odds on favor to go number one. But Darren Peterson from Kansas I think reportedly said he's only working out for the Wizards and nobody else that could be a problem. And then it's Cameron Boozer, Caleb Wilson and Darius A. Cuff Jr. This is odds to be the number one pick in the draft. Good morning. If you're watching on Peacock, thank you for downloading the app to watch this program. We also say good morning to our radio affiliates around the country. IHeartRadio Fox Sports Radio as well. We've talked a lot about Brendan Sorsby, the former Texas Tech quarterback. He'll have his pro day coming up in a couple of weeks. And I thought, okay, we've moved on. Let's have everything settled down. You have your pro day, maybe you go into the supplemental draft. And I was told that the reason why the Brendan Sorsby and his agent, they didn't have a definitive date until yesterday was because they had to get clearance from the NFL that he was going to be able to be in the supplemental draft. So they're saying, well, wait, if we decide we're going to have you in the supplemental draft now, you can have your pro day. Now teams, you know, can try to scramble to see if somebody is going to draft you. Well, Brendan Sorsby's agent, Ron Slavin, he was on A radio station 105.3 the Fan in Dallas and had this to say on who's to blame for this situation.

[Ron Slavin]

You have to be careful of some things just because of all the people involved and the people I feel worse for besides Brendan is Texas Tech and I know they might have. You know, they, I think where they, where they messed up was they talked too much and. But they never, they didn't. Nobody knew any of this about Brendan. Nobody knew when he was in the portal this was happening. I mean, Brendan probably should have gone in the draft in January, right? If we would have known. But nobody knew. So the people at Tech have been great, very supportive. Joy Maguire, I think is one of the best human beings on the planet. He's, he's a lot of head coaches are transactional. He is not. And they didn't do anything wrong here. If anybody should be questioned or be catching heat, it should be Cincinnati because they knew for two years and never said anything and didn't do anything about it.

[Dan Patrick]

Okay, there's your headline right there. Because Cincinnati has a federal lawsuit pending against Soursby in Ohio accusing him of breaching his nil contract following his transfer to Texas Tech. And I think there's a million dollars at stake. But if you're the agent for Brendan Sorsby, why are you bringing this up? You're not going to. He's not a sympathetic figure. Okay, Just go quiet. Let this kid go to his pro day. Hopefully he is on the road to recovery, understanding that this is day to day, every day, the rest of his life. And maybe he can play in the NFL. But you start doing the blame game, is Cincinnati going to be saying something that maybe is going to hamper your, your client's ability to latch onto a team you did leave. And Cincinnati, I think reportedly once its million dollars back, but now you're in the headlines again and it's not a good thing that you're in the headlines for now. Look, it's content for me. You want to talk, great. We've invited Brendan Sorsby on my advice to the agent. And Brendan Sorsby is don't do any interviews. Certainly don't do any interviews until after your pro day. And maybe you're going to showcase your talent. And you do have talent. My source said to me yesterday, if I just go on the Cincinnati tape, he's a first round draft pick. And if you said, you know, is he Fernando Mendoza? He's not. But he might have been the second quarterback drafted in my source's opinion. He's got that talent. He can run, you know, he's got confidence that borders on maybe arrogance. But now at Texas Tech, you were there for a pit stop. Now I would just let it go quiet. The best you can. The best thing you can do for all involved is Sh. Don't say anything.

[Dylan]

Yes, Dylan, do you think they're going to battle with Cincinnati in particular because his future is so uncertain from a financial standpoint, like nothing. Him playing in the NFL is still not guaranteed.

[Dan Patrick]

Okay, but why don't you do it privately?

[Dylan]

I agree, but I'm just wondering if that's why, like why even do this in the first. I mean, I know he's his nil agent, right? They get like 10% or something.

[Dan Patrick]

I don't know what they get. But he's reportedly getting his 5 million dollar nil from Texas Tech and he's not even going to play there. And if you want your keep your million dollars from Cincinnati. And are you blaming Cincinnati that Cincinnati knew about this? Is Cincinnati the ones who leaked this when they lost you to Texas Tech? Just worry about your client. Don't worry about Cincinnati. Do that privately. But now it's back in the headlines. Yes. Marvel.

[Marvin]

The thing about the Pro Day is most scouts were like, we're not even worried about what you can do on the field. It's really what you do off the field. Scott Satterfield, the Cincinnati coach, talked yesterday and he said coaches have been reaching out. They're not asking me about him on the field. They're asking me just strictly about him off the field.

[Dan Patrick]

Stat of the Day brought to you by Panini America. The official trading cards of the program. Good morning. If you're watching on Peacock, we say good morning to our radio affiliates as well. Dylan, poll results from the first hour. And what are we going to go with? Second hour. Yeah.

[Dylan]

Dan, do you wish you're at the Knicks championship parade today? 88% say no. Does this Knicks team win another title? 86% say no. And then would you rather be the ninth person on the moon or win the US Open? 67% say win the US Open.

[Dan Patrick]

Wow.

[Dylan]

And I agree.

[Dan Patrick]

No, we're talking about this US Open on this course.

[Dylan]

Then even more so, I'd rather win any U.S. open.

[Dan Patrick]

Well, no, no, it's just this one. Because the point is there are only three players in the. All the times that Shinnecock Hills has hosted, over 650 golfers have played this course during a US Open. Only three have ended up under par for the tournament. And I thought 12, 12 men have walked on the moon. Three broken par at Shinnecock. Yes, Paul.

[Paulie]

I think our audience would rather win the Houston Open than walk on the moon.

[John Wertheim]

I mean, Rando.

[Dan Patrick]

Yes, Dylan.

[Dylan]

It is funny when you see these courses just absolutely, like, eat up these golfers and then you realize just like regular old dudes are members at Shinnecock, like, they go play this course regularly. I mean, obviously it's not going to be in championship conditions and layouts, but that doesn't seem like a fun course to belong to, to just go play golf on a Wednesday.

[Dan Patrick]

It's prepared differently.

[Dylan]

Yeah.

[Dan Patrick]

For, you know, a major.

[Dylan]

But is it ever an easy test? Even when it's playing?

[Dan Patrick]

They don't want it to be an easy test. They want it to be a fair test of golf. That's the tricky part with this. This is going to be a real, real challenge. The parade is underway and it rained earlier this morning. And of course, we have two backroom guys who were there. I don't know where they are. They said they were having a hard time finding a spot along the parade route. I don't know if we have like, a tracker. I have one of those on my phone for my wife.

[Paulie]

Yes.

[Dan Patrick]

Like, I know where my wife is and I don't know what it's called. She calls it creepy and stalking. But I said no, I just want to make sure I know where you are hunting. Yes. Dylan.

[Dylan]

What about, like, the New York Marathon bibs that, you know, you can track those. We put a couple of those on them.

[Dan Patrick]

Well, they have their shirts off.

[Dylan]

You can tape it onto.

[Dan Patrick]

And by the way, they said they couldn't find body paint because I said they had to have N and Y and they had to paint each other in front of people. And I'm going to make them. Since they couldn't find it, they have to paint each other tomorrow when they come back here into the studio. Yes. Yes.

[Paulie]

Paulie. The players are streaming in right now. Carl Anthony Towns and others with the trophies. The coaches. I don't see beverages early. Maybe it's a little early. It's 10am But I don't see players with beverages.

[Dan Patrick]

It's probably a good thing. Yeah, it's probably a good thing. Okay. World cup yesterday, Ronaldo held scoreless. You had Congo tying Portugal. Ghana wins Colombia. Austria, England with Harry Kane. He had a bracelet. Do we have the call with Congo tying Portugal? Marvin, here we go.

[Marvin]

And they've got a point. The full time whistle has gone. They'd lost every game they played in the World cup finals. Until today, they'd never scored a goal. Johan Whistler scored. They get a point. One of the favorites drops points in the opening match. Martinez with things to think about. It's finished here. Great game. Portugal won. TR. Congo won.

[Dan Patrick]

That's awesome. And I liken it to March Madness. We've expanded March Madness. We're making it even bigger. World cup did that, went to 30, from 32 to 48. Now you get countries who wouldn't have qualified before they get their opportunity. You get to go against the big boys. That's all you want. Cape Verde, all they wanted was an opportunity. And we saw what happened. Congo, that's all you want. Hey, we'll take on Portugal, we'll take on Spain. Just give us that opportunity. And that's the fun part of this, is you get that March Madness kind of feel. Chris in Syracuse leads us off second hour. Hi, Chris.

[Chris from Syracuse]

Hey, thanks, Dan. Yeah, I want to comment on one of the poll questions. And as far as Anthony and Rob, I know they couldn't find the body paint, but maybe along the route they could find a roll of duct tape. That should do the trick. And I wanted the poll questions. I don't see the Knicks winning another title with this group. It's hard to win Championships. Hence 53 years and everything aligned this year for the Knicks. Indiana star was out, didn't have to go through Boston or okc. Caught the spurs group in their infancy, young and untested. That will not be the case in years to come. And most importantly, The Knicks were 100% healthy and rested when it counted. Everything lined up just right.

[Dan Patrick]

Well, thank you, Chris. Yeah, they're all good points. And it's not hating against the Knicks. It's. The odds are not in their favor of repeating. I mean, it's been 53 years for them. We've had eight consecutive years where we've had a different champion in the NBA, James in New Mexico. But you know, by the way, everybody thought OKC is going to go on a roll and they still might. You know, they got banged up. Had they been healthy, they might have won that series and they might have won the title. Hey, James.

[James from New Mexico]

Hey, debris, thanks for taking the call. I was just kind of giving curious about since NFL is becoming a bigger landmark in internationally, could you foresee that the NFL teams doing kind of what the European soccer leagues do and kind of having like programs over there in their sister city or what have you to like bring that talent back over to their team? And then one more other quick thing. When you talk to Rebecca Load, do you think that if she can like chime in, do you think like Messi and Ronaldo or like those soccer players care about the goat debate as much as it is so big for here the player stateside?

[Dan Patrick]

I don't Know, if it's A Jordan and LeBron and you know, who carries the title, who is perceived as the goat? I would think they would. I mean, just the ego. And Messi has to feel he's better than Ronaldo, and Ronaldo has to feel he's better than Messi. But I do think that's a fair question. Do I think there are going to be academies for like the Kansas City Chiefs or Pittsburgh Steelers? I don't see it. Because that's why they're doing flag football, because it's difficult to be able to form a league. The equipment, like everything that goes along with this with flag football, it's, you got flags and you got a football and then you just mark off a field. That's all you need. And I, I would say, no, I haven't heard anything about that because the global expansion is playing international games. But also it's flag football. Yeah.

[Paulie]

Paul, on the NFL.com website, there are partnerships with NFL teams in certain countries, like the Steelers in Ireland or the Arizona Cardinals in Mexico. So there are partnerships. Formal partnerships.

[Andrew from Bakersfield]

Yeah.

[Dan Patrick]

Well, I don't know how much of a feeding system you'll have because you actually have to have, unless they're playing rugby. And we've seen that in other countries where some rugby players come over here. Andrew and Bakersfield. Hi, Andrew. What's on your mind?

[Andrew from Bakersfield]

Hey, Dan and Dan.

[Dill from San Diego]

That's.

[Andrew from Bakersfield]

This is the first time I've called, but I've listened quite a bit. Number one, I agree with the first caller this hour. Maybe they can get some duct tape, because you can get some clean lines with some duct tape. But number two, as far as the speech you're giving at your daughter's wedding, I'm blind, but I, I could see in 2018. And I saw a father of the bride. But I don't remember if Steve Martin gave a speech, but if he did, it was probably funny. And my advice is, you got this. Just don't try and sound like a voiceover or an ad read. And, you know, if you need to close your eyes, take a deep breath, take a sip of water, you got this.

[James from New Mexico]

Thanks, guys.

[Dan Patrick]

Andrew, I haven't brought this up in a couple of weeks now. It's now you're in my head. I'm in the kitchen two days ago, had a dream the night before about the wedding song with my daughter. Well, we don't have a wedding song picked out. And I said I had a dream that Unchained Melody by the Righteous Brothers was going to be our song. So I Put it on Spotify. We started dancing. And then she goes, wait, this sounds a little weird, Dad. I go, yeah, I don't, I don't think it's father daughter dance. But, but I, I had a dream about this. She starts crying, I start crying, and my wife goes, you gotta stop. And I do. I have to stop. I, I have a rehearsal before the rehearsal, and I'm a mess. But I don't. I, I'm, for some reason, the Righteous Brothers. That song, that voice. My God. Awesome. Unbelievable. But I don't, I don't think it's appropriate for a father daughter dance. I don't think so.

[Marvin]

Didn't they play that in Ghost?

[Dan Patrick]

I have no idea. Well, Demi Moore, Patrick Swayze. Did they?

[Marvin]

Oh, let's Get Romantic. That's not the song.

[Dan Patrick]

Well, didn't they have the song in Top Gun, the other song that the Righteous Brothers did? You've Lost that loving feeling. Yeah, but they butchered that song in that movie. They ruined that song for me.

[Paulie]

Ice and Maverick.

[Dan Patrick]

That was terrible. All right, let me take a break. We're back after this Dan Patrick Show.

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Stigots here. I have a podcast empire. It continues to grow and I have brought it here to iHeart. I'm also doing a live radio show from 3 to 5pm Eastern because my wife wanted to kick me out of the house. It's called Stugac company Live, which is available in podcast form right when the show finishes every single day. Some of the biggest names in sports, a lot of phone calls.

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I love you guys show. It's one of my favorites.

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A lot of interaction, guys not taking themselves too seriously. Those are just some of the things that you can expect from Stugats Co. And Stugatson Co. Live. So listen to Stugats Co. Live and our original podcast. Please subscribe, rate and review Stugats Co. And God bless football. Taylor's livelihood depends on it. Do it today and you can check all of those out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

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[Ray Porter]

I really had to make a decision because I caught myself getting that frog in my throat and starting to get teary as I'm narrating some of these sections. And it's like, okay, yo, yo, yo, is this indulgent? And I really thought about it. I was like, no. At this point it would kind of be betraying the trust the author and the listener have in telling this story if I don't go through it. But there's places in this book that that deeply, emotionally affected me. And I left it on the mic. That's great because it served the story. People will say like, oh my God, I cried at the end. It's like, yeah, dude, me too.

[Kal Penn]

Listen to Irsay the Audible and iHeart audiobook club on the iHeartradio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

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[Dan Patrick]

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[John Wertheim]

I hate to say it, but I don't trust much of anything.

[Dan Patrick]

It's the rage bait. It feels like it's trying to divide people. We got clear facts. Maybe we can calm down a little.

[Sports Commentator]

NBC News brings you clear reporting. Let's meet at the facts. Let's move forward from there. NBC News reporting for America.

[Dan Patrick]

More phone calls coming up. 877 3DP show keeping an eye on the leaderboard. You got a couple of players under Par so far, that probably won't last, but we'll keep an eye. A two hour delay, fog delay at Shinnecock. I just got this sent to me by a source because we've been thinking about Cincinnati's role with Brendan Sorsby. What role did Cincinnati play? And maybe exposing the gambling problems when he went to Texas Tech. They still want their $1,000,000 back. Nil. My source said Brendan Sorsby's gambling was discovered through a sportsbook law enforcement tip to the ncaa, not because his school independently uncovered it first. This, according to court filings. March 11, NCAA received a tip from an ongoing gambling book that sportsbook reportedly had been informed by law enforcement about Sorsby's gambling activity. The NCAA then opened and advanced its investigation. April 14, the NCAA notified Texas Tech it was investigating Soursby. And then Sourceby's agent comes out and starts pointing a finger at Cincinnati. What did Cincinnati know? Did they have a known gambler on their roster for two years before he went to Texas Tech? Well, this sounds like something John Wertheim from 60 Minutes would be diving into. Are you guys looking into this? John?

[John Wertheim]

Yeah, I mean, it's, it's a fast moving story, as you know, but we've done a few pieces on sports gambling and this is obviously a new wrinkle. What a. I mean, at some level this is a wild story. I mean, right. We think there's some red lines even as we talk about the wild west of college sports and transfers and nil seems pretty indisputable. You don't bet on your own team. You don't. And yet, and yet here we are. But I, I don't know. I mean, it's some, I don't know where you want to take this, but, you know, at some level we're talking about competitive people and kids and sports and money and did nobody anticipate this? But yeah, I also, I was laughing at that. I mean, I'm sure you talk about this, the, the judges ruling, the now, now mood, of course, but any suspension would deprive him of the collegial atmosphere of the locker room and training facilities. And you sort of say, yes, yes, that's what consequences tend to look like. I, at some level, this is a new sort of, we've entered new territory here. And at the same time, like, wasn't this the most predictable thing ever?

[Dan Patrick]

Yeah. I'd been saying all along, all these commissioners, everybody was against this. You're gambling all you can't. I mean, now we have teams in Vegas now they've opened, you know, the doors, you know, to the bank vault and every. Everybody's okay with gambling. I keep saying the 18 to 24, that is the age group you really got to keep an eye on because you're away from home, you got maybe a little bit of cash or maybe you're exposing yourself that you now need a little extra cash. Here's a kid who had nil money. I just think it's, you know, this a really, really slippery slope.

[John Wertheim]

Yeah, look, look at these sports books and look who their target is. And we talk about the frontal cortex of the, of the male and we talk about not understanding personal finance. Now a, you have this subset that actually has money in their pocket. Now B, these are inherently competitive people anyway and they have inside information. They have the opportunity to affect outcome. We're talking about, maybe you talk to people who are casual observers and they talk about point shaving. And you sort of have to explain. We're not talking point shaving. We're talking about whether Jontay Porter gets off the bench with a bogus eye injury for 11 minutes or whether the, the third pitch of the second inning is in the dirt. It's a really bad sort of set of circumstances. And you, you put it all together and you've got sort of, you know, you've got young men and everything we know about them with, with money in their pocket, the ability to impact games, this inherently competitive strain anyway, and sort of what, what you think was going to happen.

[Dan Patrick]

I saw that you profiled Levine Yamal on 60 Minutes this past Sunday, and he's 18, I think 19 next month. And I was curious, how do you go about picking him? Obviously a bright future, but you focused on an 18 year old who by all intents and purposes is the future of the sport.

[John Wertheim]

Yeah, I think the last time the World cup came around, we did like Panini trading cards. That was our big World Cup. We said, you know what? Let's pick an actual athlete this time. So this was, you know, several months in planning. My dear producer, Dragon Mihailovich. I mean, I'm. Full disclosure, I'm not the world's greatest soccer fan. My buddy Grant Wall would always take me to bars and games. It was like, I was like, it was like opera. Like, I know I was supposed to like it and just. It's on me. It's my shortcoming. It just didn't. But no, we went over to Barcelona and we found this kid. He was 18 years old. He was the star of the Euros two years ago. We figured he was going to have a big impact on World cup. And it was, it was wild. I mean, it was a great window to me on sort of the difference between developing talent in sports in Europe versus the U.S. i mean, he had been cited by Barcelona by, It's like if the Mavericks found Cooper flag at like age 9 and said, hey, come, come move to Dallas and we're going to, you know, we'll feed you, we'll train you, you learn our offense, we'll monitor your, all your biometrics and we own you. And so it was funny because I got the feeling he was so sheltered. He actually liked being interviewed. I mean, usually you know this better than I do. I mean, usually a lot of these athletes, they've, they've done their media training, they've done a million interviews, they've been asked the same questions. You sort of, it's, this was like, wait a second, this is kind of fun. I'm having a conversation and getting to explain myself. He was that shelter that at 18. I got the feeling this was one of the few real sit down interviews he'd ever given.

[Dan Patrick]

I don't know if you can compare Messi at 18 or Ronaldo at 18 with the fame, but I don't remember Messi being famous famous and no social media, no Internet back then. So I'm guessing Ronaldo and Messi, I don't know when they became worldwide famous, but now an 18, 17, 16 year old on big stage like this and that's, that's a lot of pressure.

[John Wertheim]

Yeah, I mean, I think you're right. I think the social media is the great accelerant. I mean, ironically enough, Messi at roughly the same age, played for Barcelona, actually. I mean, I don't, I think we got it in the story where the mom Laminate's mom won a raffle when he was a few months old and you got to, you got to pose with a Barcelona player and they actually got messy. So there is this photo. The photographers, like I didn't think anything of at the time, of course, but now it's like, hey, it's, it's Michael Jordan in Whatever, 1984, 1985, posing with baby LeBron. I mean, it's just a phenomenal coincidence, but. No, Messi at that age played for Barcelona and people sort of knew who he was, but you weren't on your phone watching clips of these insane goals he was scoring. I, it's funny because I was thinking about that in terms of, you know, the Knicks and the Parade that Goes on. On as we speak. And Jalen Brunson. I mean, Jalen Brunson's level of fame is like one tenth of this kid, and he's 18 years old and all that comes with it. And I've just. I. I don't think I've ever seen a level of athlete fame quite like this. Combining age 18, he's very much sort of a flashy, you know, guys. I mean, he. He's a. A bit of a look at me kind of in a great way. But, I mean, he's. He doesn't shy from. And soccer in Europe is just a completely different level as even the NBA finals and you sort of add it up together. I'm not sure. I think you could probably make the case. This might be the most prominent athlete in the world right now. Certainly top five, top ten.

[Dan Patrick]

You were in Europe during the NBA finals?

[John Wertheim]

Yeah, I just came back. I was in Europe for, like, three months. Man, I didn't think of Paris as a. I'd been living there for a few months and then did the French Open for tnt. And, man, Paris was like a lot of adjectives to describe Paris. You don't think of it as a sports town. This is like, suddenly it's like Charlotte, North Carolina. They're like screens everywhere. They love their Wemby. They've got this. This psg won the Champions League for the second year. I mean, they're coming. Even when the Olympics were happening, you got the feeling it was a little bit like, you know, Paris. You know, Paris didn't need the Olympics. They were doing a solid to the ioc. We're kind of getting the train back on the tracks. This was not like the great sports town. Paris has now turned into, like, one big sports bar. Wemby, obviously, a big part of that, but, yeah, they. They suddenly. I don't know if there's a Paris basketball team. Gianca Splitter actually was with a coach last season. And you go to this basketball gym and they're, you know, on a Tuesday night, there are 10,000 Parisians going crazy for European basketball. They. They love their Wemby. There's an NBA store in the middle of St. Germain now. It's really funny to watch. Sort of sober, serious. Paris thinks very highly of itself, but they. They like watching NBA basketball as much as anyone.

[Dan Patrick]

He's John Wertheim, Sports Illustrated senior writer and, of course, correspondent for 60 Minutes. I brought this up last hour. I was surprised, bordered on shock that Nike is just putting out the Caitlin Clark shoe. John, she's been signed up since she was a junior in college.

[John Wertheim]

I was gonna say, have you heard about Caitlin Clark? You know, she's just a standing player. You might want to keep an eye on her. Yeah, I don't know. Dan Wetzel wrote a great piece I would point everyone to about that. It's always been a bit of a mystery, especially as Nike's fortunes have gone in the direction they have been, why they wouldn't jump all over this. And it's kind of mystifying, isn't it? I mean again, Nike was giving Caitlin Clark and nil. I believe I have this right. When she was like a sophomore, a junior. Nike, very quick to act. I mean there was, you know, the, the French Open played out last weekend and literally the segment after match point of the women's final, Nike had already teed up Its tailor made 30 second spot about the winner. This is not a company that tends to act slowly and cautiously when it comes to its own athletes. Yeah, I would love. I mean, I've heard suspect you have as well. There's a lot of speculating inside, in, in Beaverton at the inside Nike about why it took so long. There's a culture war component to this. But yeah, you've got Caitlin Clark on your roster. Would you not be like building the shoe as she was running down court

[Dan Patrick]

when you profiled her, I think two years ago, did you get the sense she was ready for all of this? You can be a star in Iowa now on a, on a global basis, 100%.

[John Wertheim]

She got it. She understood the. Now that the statute of limitations have lapsed, she said she would agree. I mean, I think I'm okay. She said she would agree to the story, but she wanted it to be about more than herself. Let's make it about the wnba. And you sort of said kind of an interesting take. She understands the political dynamics to all this, the race dynamics, the women's sports ascendancy. She doesn't want to be better than the. She was completely ready for this. And I thought she was. She was a lot of fun to talk to. She's good company. She's very cool. She, I mean, you know, you're here, you're Mason, Ohio. I mean, you know, you and I grew up fairly close to it. She was a very familiar figure to me as someone who grew up in the Midwest and she understands the landscape, she understands all the landmines. But again, why Nike? Especially at a time when, you know, go look at Nike stock over the last five years. Why it took till June of 2026, when you've got Caitlin Clark on your roster and you are paying her, is just. We're going to study this as one of sort of the great sports marketing missteps.

[Dan Patrick]

But, you know, you bring up that she was 100% all in, ready for this. The WNBA was not ready for this. That. That's the disconnect. That's. That's like Tiger going to the PGA Tour. And I remember talking to a veteran player and he's like, yeah. When Tiger said, well, I didn't have my A game and this got this pro, he was like, oh, my God, did you hear what this kid said? And I saw him years later and he goes, I don't. Don't do it. Don't bring it up. Don't give me the A game stuff. And he goes, I know I made a mistake there, but the WNBA really miscalculated this on a variety of fronts, unfortunately.

[John Wertheim]

I noticed you were using the past tense. I don't. Yeah, my experience with the wnba, and I know a lot of people have had. When you actually get to the players themselves, they are awesome. This was before, but I did a piece on super, like, for. I mean, these are athletes you want to cheer for. They get it, they're cool, they're self aware. I mean, these are everything you want in athletes. But the infrastructure is so lagging. The infrastructure of the league is not worthy of the players, put it that way. And I'm hoping, you know, you hope that changes. You understand this is a fast growing league. But you're totally right. You have the feeling like Caitlin Clark was there and the structure around her was not. And you just hope it catches up.

[Dan Patrick]

Great to catch up with you again, John. Thank you.

[John Wertheim]

Anytime. Good seeing you.

[Dan Patrick]

That's John Wertheim, Sports Illustrated senior writer and correspondent for 60 Minutes. Yeah, we have more. Dan Wetzel, I think, is going to join us. Top of the hour. He had a deep dive into the Caitlin Clark. They're getting her shirt or getting her shoe out now in October. I'm like, boy, did we miss a big window of opportunity. It feels like he'll join us. Coming up. And once again, the Sourcebee stuff. I didn't know if Cincinnati is the one who leaked this, but according to my source. I'll read it to you again. Brendan Sorsby discovered through a sportsbook, law enforcement tip to the ncaa. Now, that doesn't mean somebody didn't tip off the NCAA and then tip off the sports book. I don't know that. And I can ask. Well, my source is listening so I'm asking now. The school independently did not uncover it at first, but it was March 11th. The NCAA received a tip from an online gambling book. So the sports book reportedly have been informed by law enforcement about Sorsby's gambling activity. Then the NCAA acted. All right, more on this coming up. Top of the hour. We'll take a break. We're back after this.

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[Kal Penn]

Hey everyone, it's Kal Penn. I'm the host of Irsay the Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club. This week on the podcast I am sitting down with Ray Porter, the narrator of Andy Weir's audiobook project Hail Mary, Massive sci fi adventure about survival and science and what happens when you wake up, wake up alone, very far from Earth.

[Ray Porter]

I really had to make a decision because I caught myself getting that frog in my throat and starting to get teary as I'm narrating some of these sections. And it's like, okay, yo, yo, yo, is this indulgent? And I really thought about it. I was like, no. At this point it would kind of be betraying the trust the author and the listener have in telling this story if I don't go through it. But there's places in this book that deeply, emotionally affected me and I left it on the mic. That's great because it served the story. People will say like oh my God, I cried at the end. It's like yeah dude, me too.

[Kal Penn]

Listen to Hearsay, the Audible and iHeart audiobook club on the iHeartradio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

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[Dan Patrick]

turned off news altogether.

[John Wertheim]

I hate to say it, but I don't trust much of anything.

[Dan Patrick]

It's the rage bait. It feels like it's trying to divide people. If we got clear facts, maybe we could calm down a little.

[Sports Commentator]

NBC News brings you clear reporting. Let's meet at the facts. Let's move forward from there. NBC News reporting for America.

[Dan Patrick]

From what I'm seeing on TV with the parade, it looks relatively calm, knock on Wood. Although 10,000 New York City police officers can help that. But it looks like everybody is playing nice. We haven't had our two back room guys check in in a while, Rob and Anthony, but they are somewhere there in the parade. Stat of the day brought to you by Panini America. The official trading cards of the Dan Patrick show. By the way, the Scottish have taken over Boston. The Scottish may take Boston, Scotland in Boston and these fans.

[Dill from San Diego]

Wow.

[Chris from Syracuse]

Wow.

[Dan Patrick]

Even Dylan's impressed.

[John Wertheim]

Yeah.

[Dylan]

Boston is not known as being a slouch in the drinking department as a city either. And they're being run dry by the tartan army.

[Dan Patrick]

They are, they're, they're drinking out a bar. They're, they're running out of supplies in certain bars in, in Boston with the Scottish.

[Paulie]

Yeah, Paulie, this one pub reported that the Scottish fans drank three times what they usually sell on St. Patrick's Day, which is their busiest day of the year.

[Dan Patrick]

That's a shot at the Irish here.

Wow.

Okay, we should go up there and settle it. Yeah, that's.

[Paulie]

You first.

[Dan Patrick]

Yeah. I'm Irish and Scottish, so I'll be two fisted. Double fisted. Yes. Yes. Dylan.

[Dylan]

I saw, I think it was like the, the main Sam Adams tap room

[John Wertheim]

ran out of beer.

[Dylan]

I'm like, shouldn't that be effectively a limitless supply?

[Dan Patrick]

Hottest rookies, biggest superstars, the all time greats. The only place to collect them all. Panini trading cards, the official trading cards. The Dan Patrick show starter. Continue your collection now. Paniniamerica.net Interesting story. John Wertheim is 60 Minutes. He profiled Caitlin Clark a couple of years ago. And with the caveat now he was having a hard time getting in touch with somebody. He had actually talked to Paulie, like, I don't even know who to talk to here. And it's basically parents and an agent. And they didn't want to do a profile. And I think they agreed to a profile in 60 minutes. They were trying to tamp down all the spotlight on her. They wanted it. She said, according to John, hey, I'll do it. But it, this should be on the wnba. And if you look at the profile, they, they were certainly kind of guiding the profile that way. But she had had all the attention. That was part of the problem. She had too much attention. But the shoe thing, I'm baffled. And Dan Wetzel wrote a column for the Mothership and he'll join us coming up. I'm really curious about why it took this long for one of the biggest, you know, stars certainly in the United States to get her signature shoe. Asia Wilson got her shoe. Sabrina Ionescu got her shoe. Unless they said, you know what, let's kind of stagger this. Let's, Sabrina's got her shoe. Let's let Asia Wilson, four time mvp now we can have Caitlin Clark roll out her shoe. I would look at Caitlin Clark the way Nike looks at Michael Jordan. This is completely different. This is more than just a shoe. This is a lifestyle unveiling. Yes.

[Ron Slavin]

Marvin.

[John Wertheim]

Yeah.

[Marvin]

The confusing part for me is you signed her her junior year in Iowa. I thought you'd be like, ready by the time she got to the wnba.

[Dan Patrick]

Yeah. Dylan in San Diego. Hi, Dill. What do you have for me?

[Dill from San Diego]

What's up? BP talking about the U.S. open. My golf group is actually celebrating its 10 years next year, and we're headed to Pebble beach two weeks prior to the the U.S. open. And there's a couple of guys that are part of this group that are really crying about the fees. So I tell them it's the bucket list. So in your opinion, is there any other course on earth where the history and the views actually justify the price tag more than Pebble? My second question to you is if we have a spot to fill, are you ready to join the Cooch cup

[Dan Patrick]

vp Man, I'd love to, but I got to plan a wedding. I got to plan a speech or I'd love to. I love Pebble. I know it's expensive. It's a one timer. Do it. And I've said this many, many times, you can have a bad round, but not a Bad day at Pebble Beach. It's, it's, you'll get done. You'll sit out there on the patio overlooking 18. You'll have a beer and you'll go, you know what? There's no other place like this. People are great.

[Ron Slavin]

And

[Dan Patrick]

I hope to get out there again and play. But yeah, that is a real, real steep. I don't know what it is now. Might be 700, but, you know, do it, do it. Bite, Bite the bullet. It's worth it. Yeah. Dill.

Yeah.

[Dylan]

I feel like it's almost like restaurants where when it's worth it, even if it's expensive, you're like, you're happy paying it, but if you, you know, it's an expensive meal and you're like, eh, like, I know. I think Shadow Creek in Vegas is like $1300 greens fees or something. And like it's a nice course and all, but 700 at pebble looks like a pretty good deal, man.

[Dan Patrick]

I don't know if Pebble's 700.

[Dylan]

I think it's in that. It was in the 6, 700 range at least, like last year.

[Dan Patrick]

Okay. After my daughter's wedding, I'd like to go to Pebble. And it was my wife's suggestion. She said, you know, you're going to need to relax after this wedding. I go, oh, I know. I'm also going to have to get another job to pay for this. But she goes, well, why don't we go to Pebble? And I go, all right. That's my girl. That's my girl.

[Dylan]

Not bad.

[Dan Patrick]

Yeah. Shadow Creek is a tremendous golf course. It's, it's, it's, that's worth it too, if you get that opportunity. I got a chance to play there a few times. It is gorgeous. And it's designed. I think it's a Fazio design where you're on a hole, you don't see anybody. On the other holes. There can be people out there playing, but the way it's designed, you're just playing on, you know, that hole unless there's somebody in front of you. But when I played there, you don't see anybody. There are people out there. And I know Michael Jordan played there a lot. And I know that they had some, some, you know, big time gambling matches out there.

[Paulie]

Yes, Paulie, for most golf fans, St. Andrews, the Old Course, is that in Europe? Is that available to the public to go up?

[Dan Patrick]

It is, yes, but I think it's a handicap requirement. I think you have to be a 15 handicap or better. I Believe. I don't know the cost of it. I don't know if you walk up and say, hey, I got one good eye, that they would give you a, you know, dispensation.

[Paulie]

Right?

[Dan Patrick]

Yes.

[Dylan]

Dylan, have you played sawgrass? Because I know price wise, that's in the ballpark of pebble beach, and I

[Dan Patrick]

would say that's worth it. It's not pebble beach, but people are going to want to go there because they want to play the Island Green.

[Dylan]

And if the. If the players wasn't hosted there, would it still be worth it? Because I feel like that's really what makes it. I mean, obviously it's a great course, but.

[Dan Patrick]

Well, there's a place in Coeur d'. Alene.

[Dylan]

Yeah.

[Dan Patrick]

Idaho. I mean, that's a beautiful course as well. There's so many of them. And I haven't gotten to Bandon Dunes yet, but I want to. But, Dylan, good luck with. With your trip there. Bill in Utah. Hi, Bill.

[Chris from Syracuse]

Hey.

[Dill from San Diego]

This Bill actually is in Houston, but that's okay. Hey, quick comment and a question for all of you guys. My thought was, I'm going to channel my inner Paulie today because I haven't watched much World cup coverage, but after yesterday's results, I think I'm gonna.

[Dan Patrick]

And then my question to all you

[Dill from San Diego]

guys is, if in your sports lifetime, what championship parade would you like to have attended? If you could have.

[Dan Patrick]

There's no parade I would want to go to, because you only get to, like, the parade comes by. It's not like you get to up and move and then go, I'm going to watch the whole parade. You get to see the parade for, I don't know, seven minutes, and then that's it. I mean, if I want to say, hey, I was there at the parade.

[Stugots]

Great.

[Dan Patrick]

I don't know. I. I might have been a Cincinnati Reds parade in downtown Cincinnati when they won the World Series. I might have. But then I might not have been in good shape to have remembered that I was at the Reds parade back then. But no, I don't. I don't want to go to a parade. I'd rather watch on tv. It's like when somebody says, hey, you want to go watch this golf tournament?

No.

No. Now, going to Augusta is more than watching a golf tournament.

[Dylan]

That.

[Dan Patrick]

That is a. An event, social event. But that's where I usually. If I go to Augusta, my friend puts two chairs on the 16th green and I'm able to watch everybody come through. But you don't want to be following somebody that's a lot of work. Alrighty. Two hours in the books on this Thursday. Keeping an eye on the US Open in Shinnecock. Looks like Shinnecock's playing nice right now. More phone calls coming up. Who's in the confessional? Paulie is back after this.

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Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. I don't know if you knew this but anyone can get the same Premium Wireless for $15 a month plan that I've been enjoying. It's not just for celebrities. So do like I did and have one of your assistant's assistants switch you to Mint Mobile today. I'm told it's super easy to [e-mail]

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[John Wertheim]

Who's moving me to the couch with Domino's?

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[Dan Patrick]

It's a long term contract with no

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[Dan Patrick]

This is an I heart podcast, guaranteed human.