Luke de Kock (4:19)

The fact that they put in the clip of her objecting to talking about their meet.

Dan Patrick (4:24)

Cute.

Luke de Kock (4:25)

Like if you're in the business, right, you massage sources and you can we talk about there's a not a quid pro quo but a negotiation that happens there. And you know, that stuff does not make it on screen. So the idea that they would show that and make it part of their interview suggests that like their producers, whatever their limit is, she went so far across it. And imagine like I love to think about the idea of UNC saying, oh no, we have another Jordan brand crisis. And here we are, he's not even wearing a UNC sweatshirt, right? He's wearing this navy T shirt or whatever it is with a hole in it. She's got a navy sweatshirt on. It's like you're going to embarrass us and you can't even represent the brand. Right. So I mean, it's just like even before we knew who she was or cared who she was, this whole thing has just been ludicrous. And now that we've got into this sort of off field, Instagram, media polishing, whatever you want to call it, it's just like there's not a big enough tent to throw over the circus right now.

Dan Patrick (5:29)

What is your biggest concern? Let just look at her role. You know, Bill is relinquished control and he was a control freak when he coached, you know, in the NFL. And let's just look at it football wise with this team. What, what concerns you here?

Luke de Kock (5:45)

Well, I mean that, you know, they've got sort of a average level college staff. They've got room for all of his, you know, his kids and Mike Lombardi's son is on the staff and former players. You know, I, I wrote that they're kind of looting Chapel Hill like Halliburton looted Baghdad. But the reality is UNC kind of asked him to do this. They gave him the giant bag of money. He's just spending it. It's just, it's hard to portray yourself as the 33rd NFL team. Like nobody's thought of this before when you've got all this other stuff going on, you know, and like, all right, they're going to practice without numbers on the jerseys and it's like they're acting like they just invented the steam engine. And it's just like, you know, college football is not a sport that's lacked sort of innovation or coaching introspection or over coaching. The idea that you're going to come in and just be smarter than everyone else. We certainly haven't seen that bear fruit yet. You know, they lost their best defensive lineman to the Portal. The quarterback they ended up buying in the portal is from South Alabama. Look, he may be very good. You know, certainly Cam Ward jumped up levels and other guys have, but you're still, it's still South Alabama and he's going up against now ACC future NFL cornerback. So there are a lot of sort of questions just on the football side of things. And there were from the moment he was hired. This is a program that hasn't won an ACC title in 45 years. Basically the age gap between him and Jordan is how long it's been since they've won an ACC title.

Dan Patrick (7:08)

You're killing it here, Luke. I like this. The. Are they going to do a Jordan brand logo with her? I think they've.

Luke de Kock (7:16)

My sense is, you know, the athletic had a story today about how the hard knocks thing felt, or really sort of the TikTok and not really a why or a how, but sort of that the hard knocks thing fell apart. My sense is North Carolina has spent more man, woman, person hours on Jordan Hudson related issues in the last four months than they ever possibly could have expected. Lawyers, PR people, athletic department people. I mean, I wrote a story, a column a couple of weeks ago about. They've got a dozen people listed on the UNC system staff payroll website who are identified as members of the football staff. This is sort of Mike Lombardi's team, the GM office, the front office, they're all identified as football people on social media. Unc, the athletics, they're not on the athletic department website. Their hirings have never been announced. And when I asked the athletic director's chief of staff what was going on, her response was, we're looking into it. So it's like Rocco Lampone building his secret regime and the Godfather. Nobody really knows what's going on. There's no oversight as far as anyone can tell. And this whole thing is kind of, you know, it's, it's like a Tesla on auto drive. You just don't know what it's going to hit first.

Dan Patrick (8:26)

Okay, the local media and their availability, or Bill's availability to you is what.

Luke de Kock (8:34)

About what you'd expect? We talked to him before the start of spring practice. We talked to him when he was hired. As far as I know, maybe, you know, Mike Lombardi has been available once on signing day. He spoke to the fans on their, their spring game. They did practice like a pro, like he used to do with the Patriots. He spoke to the fans, but not to the media. So it's, It. You know, it took him two months to do UNC's own internal podcast. So, you know, even the, the, the, the, the stuff that the school wants him to do hasn't exactly been easy coming, but I, I think we all expected that, right? Like this is. There's no NFL Access rules here. You're not required to meet after a OTA or a certain number. You know, he's, it says in his contract he has to fulfill media responsibilities, but there's absolutely no way to enforce that. So, you know, we may not even. Who knows, we may not talk to him after practices in August. We may not talk to him after games. We may only talk to him after games. That's, that's all up in the air right now. It's, it's. But in that respect, it's sort of been what you expect.

Dan Patrick (9:35)

Is Luke de Kock. He covers North Carolina football. He covers sports there in the Raleigh, North Carolina area. Raleigh News and Observer SPORTS COLUMNIST I wanted to be fair to Belichick in this situation. If I was in the chair, I'm interviewing him. She's interrupting like, she is becoming part of the story. But the story is supposed to be Belichick has written a book about winning football games. Not about her, but when does she become fair game in this story, in the CBS story, where you have to include her?

Luke de Kock (10:13)

That's a terrific question. And like, I have not written about her. I have not written a column about her. I may mention her when he got hired, that his, you know, girlfriend was sitting with these trustees to sort of push this higher through because it, you know, look, football coaches, wives, any coach's wife, any coach's husband, if you want to, you know, they have an impact on these things. But like, typically, you know, Matt Brown would always refer to, you know, Sally and I made the decision to come back and he genuinely believed that it was a team partnership there. But you didn't get a sense that Sally was vetting his interviews or watching film and at night and, you know, I mean, at this point, would anyone be shocked if Jordan Hudson post on Instagram? I'm so excited. Bill has decided to switch to a base nickel. This is going to be great for the football program. Like, no, no one would at this point. So when you start to do it, like, as I mentioned earlier, UNC's brand is at stake here. They hired Bill Belichick to sell tickets and put butts in seats and eyeballs on screen as much as win football games. And when it becomes a sideshow, when your athletic department becomes a Jordan Hudson management program instead of a football program, that when. That is when it becomes a story. And the fact that I haven't actually sort of put pen to paper yet is really a function of the fact that the Carolina Hurricanes are in the playoffs and we had a double overtime game last night, and that's soaking up a lot of my attention. But the CBS News interview, to me, where you start raising questions about what this meet cute that was supposedly established on the plane with the book, and now she's saying, we won't talk about that. And there are questions about, you know, who's actually in charge here. You know, I think that, to me, starts to cross that Rubicon of this becomes a football issue. You know, can Bill Belichick focus on winning at a program that, you know, has come close so many times under Butch Davis and Larry Fedora and Matt Brown twice? If he's, you know, promoting a book and doing all these other things, what's. What's Bill Belichick's focus and what's her role in directing that focus? The fact that a football coach doesn't know what's on social media about him, as he claimed in cbs, These guys care about what's on the monitors in the lunchroom. Like, they dictate every single aspect of a program. That's true in the pros. It's true in college. So there's a lot of sort of questions now that need answers. And to me, that's. That's the line you cross, right? That becomes not writing about his personal life, which, obviously there are people who write about his personal life for a living. But for me, as a sports columnist, when it sort of gets into decision making and who's in charge, what does this mean for the football program? You know, there is a line that's crossed there.

Dan Patrick (12:39)

Would you rather sit down and interview Bill or his girlfriend?

Luke de Kock (12:45)

I would still like to know from Bill why, you know, I asked him that at his initial press conference. At what point in your mind did you sort of switch from I, this is how I would run my next NFL program to oh, how would I run a college program? Is literally the only good answer he gave in that entire press conference. But I want to know, like, what possesses you at this age with a young girlfriend who you guys seem to be having the time of your lives out there, you know, even if she's calling the shots, he seems to be, you know, seems to be working for him in that respect. Why would you want to take on a program that is, you know, at a basketball school that faces huge structural hurdles? I mean, there's a reason why neither North Carolina or NC State or Duke has won an ACC title in football in 30 years when they've won national titles and gone to Final Fours in literally every other sport. Women's lacrosse, field hockey, women's basketball, wrestling, swimming. All three schools have been in the Final Four the last five years in men's basketball. So football has been this outlier, and we can go on forever about why that is. It has to do with so many football programs in a state, plus Tennessee and South Carolina and Clemson all skimming the cream off the top but the reality is, why would you take that on? You have a very good life. Wait for an NFL job to open up. Be a gm you know, write books about how you're the greatest winner and greatest leader ever. Don't go to this perennial sleeping giant football program. And plus, maybe, you know, maybe if someone offered me this much money to do it, I would, too.

Dan Patrick (14:14)

Over under 1 and a half years for Belichick at North Carolina, under.

Luke de Kock (14:19)

I thought you were going to say wins.

Dan Patrick (14:21)

That was going to push me. That's quick answer there, Luke.

Luke de Kock (14:26)

It's going to be a beautiful disaster, Dan. Like a Monkey flying a 737. We all know how it's going to end, but we don't know how we're going to get there.

Dan Patrick (14:33)

How about a round of applause for Luke's appearance? Thank you, Luke.

Luke de Kock (14:40)

Appreciate it. Thank you.

Dan Patrick (14:42)

Luke De Kock, he. His columnist for the Raleigh News and Observer, had it going. Yeah, he did. Well, yeah. Had some lines there. Yeah. At some point, she became the story. She didn't want to be the story. She became the story. And that's why, you know, when people will respond on social media, you know, what's this have to do with Belichick or the football team or his book? She made it. She made it part of the story. You. You can't ignore that. I wouldn't have ignored that. If I sat down with Belichick, and first thing I would say is, why are you wearing a navy sweatshirt like that? That would have been. It's right there, right in front of me. You represent North Carolina. You want product placement. I would think at all costs, reminding people I'm at North Carolina. But. And I'm. I can guarantee you North Carolina wants that, too. They're like, wait, what's he got on? He's got a navy sweatshirt on. But if she's interrupting and she's doing that, you know, repeatedly now, she's made herself part of the story, whether she wanted to or not. But she's in there watching the monitor, and then all of a sudden, she's just waiting to go. I object. No, we're not talking about that. And by all accounts, she was interrupting a few times. Now you've made yourself part of the story because Bill suddenly can't answer questions on his own. It's not a good look. It was embarrassing, I think, for Bill. He's waiting for somebody to tell him, can I. No, you can't. And he doesn't even know about social media. These pictures that he posed for, I. I love Love. But I don't love love that much. Yes, but he's. He's lying about some of that. I get that. The whole like, you know, insta face or Snap book or whatever. That joke was funny about 20 years ago. Everybody knows what social media is now. My grandmother was on it. You know, like, she's like, hey, did you check your ig? Everybody knows what it is. He's just trying to do like that cheap, tired joke.

Luke de Kock (17:09)

Folksy.

Dan Patrick (17:10)

You think he's trying to be funny here? I do. I think he's trying to be funny and like, too cool. Like, I don't even follow that stuff. Yes, you do, dude. You know exactly what everyone's talking about. I don't know. I don't know. I know he's a genius. The insta Snap book.

Luke de Kock (17:28)

What is it again?

Dan Patrick (17:29)

I don't even know. Yeah, dude, that joke was good forever ago. Well, Luke was quick to say over under one and a half seasons, and he was taking the under there. All right, we'll get your phone calls. There's prop bets, by the way, on Bill and his girlfriend and the football program, which lasts longer, his time at North Carolina or that relationship. Wow. Yeah, I said it. Yeah, you did. Our two poll question, bang. I mean, my youngest daughter is 26. If. If my daughter brought home some dude who's 73 or 74, I. I'd. I'd lose it. I'd be like, no, no, no, no. See ya. Hey, gramps, get the hell out of here. I don't care who you are. I don't care.

Luke de Kock (18:26)

He'd be older than you.

Dan Patrick (18:27)

Yes, he would be. It's like, oh, my God. Dang, dude, you know, that's messed up. Like, what are you doing? That's messed up. Would you question yourself at that point and be like, what? How did I raise you? What did I do? I would talk to my daughter. I'd say, molly, where did I go wrong, hon? Why do you hate me so much? And where. Oh, how did I go so wrong? See, when you, when you put it in, you know, we look at and go, all right, he got a 24 year old girlfriend. Then you look at it, you know, as a father and you're going, wait a minute, I got a 24 year old daughter. Todd, how old is your daughter? She 20. She just turned 20, so I think they met when she was 21. So your daughter next year brings home Bill Belichick.

Ross Tucker (19:14)

Will he let me wear the super bowl rings around?

Dan Patrick (19:17)

You have to think about it. No, that's Very, very weird. It is. It is. It's weird. But if you win football games, that's all anybody's going to care about. But when you don't, they're coming after you. Coach, coach. Tell us about the comeback again. Tell us, Tell us about. Okay, it's Atlanta, right? Who makes the decision there to keep going to James White? Let's take a break here. Let's take a break here. Ross Tucker, I mean, that's all you, right? I mean, that's you. You make all the big decisions, right? We're not talking about that. Let's take a break. Ross is going to join us. Charles Barkley will join us. More phone calls. Take a break. Back after this. Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in the nation. Catch all of our shows@foxsportsradio.com and within the iHeartRadio app. Search FSR to listen live. Hey, Steve Covino. And I'm Rich Davis. And together we're Covino and Rich on FOX Sports Radio. You can catch us weekdays from 5 to 7pm Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and of course, the iHeartRadio app. Why should you listen to Covino and Rich? We talk about everything, life, sports, relationships, what, what's going on in the world. We have a lot of fun talking about the stories behind the stories in the world of sports and pop culture, stories that, well, other shows don't seem to have the time to discuss. And the fact that we've been friends for the last 20 years and still work together, I mean, that says something, right? So check us out. We like to get you involved, too. Take your phone calls, chop it up, as they say. I'd say the most interactive show on Fox Sports Radio, maybe the most interactive show on planet Earth. Be sure to check out Covino and Rich live on Fox Sports radio and the iHeartradio app from 5 to 7pm Eastern, 2 to 4 Pacific. And if you miss any of the live show, just search Covino and Rich wherever you get your podcast. And of course, on social media, that's Covino and Rich. Hey, my name is Jay Shetty and I'm the host of On Purpose. I just had a great conversation with Michelle Obama, to whom much is given, much is expected. The guilt comes from am I doing enough me, Michelle Obama, to say that to a therapist? So let's unpack that. Former first lady Michelle Obama and someone who knows her best, her big brother Craig, will be hosting a podcast called imo. What have been your personal journeys with therapy? We need to be coached throughout our lives. My mom wanted us to be independent children and she would always tell me, stop worrying about your sister. Having been the first lady of the entire country and representing the country in the world, I couldn't afford to have that kind of disdain. What would you say has been the most hardest recent test of fear? Listen to On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Charles Barkley. In an hour, we'll talk to Ross Tucker here momentarily. BET Online has some prop bets for Bill Belichick, including will Bill and his girlfriend break up in 2025? What happens first, they get engaged or he's no longer the head coach? Also, let's see, what will the next Instagram photo feature be? Belichick and cut off sleeves. Bill in a suit. His girlfriend showing her belly button or Belichick and a ripped shirt. There's also this one. What will Bill do next? Get a tattoo? Dyes hair blonde? Have a mullet? Get a piercing or a man bun? Hairstyle. These are all pressing questions that you can bet prop bets with Bill Belichick. Let's bring in Ross Tucker, our good buddy Ross. First question, what's Bill Belichick doing?

Ross Tucker (23:07)

Dan? I have no idea. I mean, if you would have told me or any of us that played for the Patriots that it someday he'd be doing an interview and there would be anyone, you know, me, anyone, Forget it being how old she is, 24 year old young woman, anyone to the side kind of telling him what to say, what not to say, what topics they can talk about, what they can't. That is not the guy that, that we played for. Now that was a long time ago. That was 2005, 2006 for me. So it's like 20 years ago. But it's very, very surprising to see someone else having this level of control and, or involvement with what Coach Belichick does.

Dan Patrick (23:56)

How much of a control freak was he when you were in New England?

Ross Tucker (24:02)

Well, I don't know. On a scale 1 to 10, he was a 20. You know, I mean, picture this, Dan. You'll, you'll appreciate this. Okay, two stories. I'll tell you about Belichick and his desire for control. Every morning he would walk on the treadmill incline and he would read the clips of everything that was said about the Patriots and everything that was said about the opponent. And then the first time you meet with the media as a player is Wednesday at lunch. So in the Wednesday morning team meeting he would tell you exactly what the storylines were for the week, what questions you're going to be asked and what your response was to be. So we played Jacksonville in the 05 wild card round and was going to be really cold in Foxborough. So the first thing he said, he said they're all going to ask you about the weather. Weather is no factor. It's the same for both teams. I mean, he was by far the most conscious of and involved in media relations of any coach I was ever with, which I thought was fascinating that he cared that much. I didn't really understand why he cared that much, but he micromanaged any comments that any players made to the media. So it's really interesting that now see him on the kind of wearing the other shoe and now he's the one more or less being micromanaged with these media interviews.

Dan Patrick (25:32)

He's Ross Tucker. The Ross Tucker Football podcast also calls games for CBS Westwood One and you can check him out on social media @ Ross Tucker, NFL let's look at the draft here. How should Travis Hunter be used his rookie year?

Ross Tucker (25:49)

That is the million dollar question. I love that the Jaguars went up to get him, but you can't move up and give up that many assets unless he is going to play both ways and you feel like you have a good plan for him to play both ways. I know you know Dan, I did that Colorado, Colorado State game last year for cbs. I'm on record on my show and elsewhere saying he's the best college football player I've ever seen. So 40 plus years of watching college football, you know what the up tempo offenses he was playing over 120 snaps a game that is just nuts. And I'm fascinated to see whether or not he can play both at nearly as high of a level in the NFL. He has the chance. I'm not going to do the whole James Gladstone thing where like you know, a belief in football and I'm not going to give you the speech that the Jaguars GM gave, but he has the potential to be like the Steph Curry of football. Dan, you know how you go to like a 6th grade CYO basketball game now and these kids are all shooting like 25 foot threes because of Steph Curry. If Travis Hunter can do this, all these five star recruits are going to tell Ohio State and Alabama, I want to play both ways. I want to be on both sides of. I mean this guy might change the sport. The interesting thing in particular with Jacksonville, would you rather have a guy that's very Good at two positions or elite at one. And everybody agrees that you're better off being a full time corner and a part time receiver. But most people will also tell you he's further along as a receiver. I think the Jags needed a corner more than anything else. I think he's a full time corner. And they already have Brian Thomas from last year. He'll be a part time receiver who I think they feel like they'll get a lot of value out of, clearly.

Dan Patrick (27:51)

But I think that considering what they gave up to go get him, he has to play both positions. Like I have to get a Shohei Otani out there. I have to have people who show up and they want to see him as a receiver and a defensive back. I think that's, that's lost in a lot of people in how they assess this. Like, hey, I love him, I think he's great, but I also am in the entertainment business. I got to have him out there playing both, both sides of the ball.

Ross Tucker (28:22)

There's no doubt. And of course, he's from Georgia, played high school ball in Florida, so he's got the connections down there as well locally. I think that's how the Jaguars look at it. Number one, he gives them a tremendous amount of buzz with the new regime from a business perspective. But number two, I think what they would tell you, Dan, is yes, we gave up next year's first round pick. Guess what next year's first round pick is? Travis Hunter, the cornerback. This year's first round pick was Travis Hunter, the receiver. I truly believe that that's how they look at it.

Dan Patrick (28:55)

Okay, all right, give me your theory on Shador Sanders slide.

Ross Tucker (29:02)

Well, there's a couple of things there. Number one, I think the biggest thing then, and you know this, like the way you conduct yourself, the way you treat people, it matters, right? I haven't talked about this that much just because I don't think it's that big a deal. But it's a, it's a, it's a small story, right? So last year, I think, you know, I did that Colorado, Colorado State game for cbs. I referenced it with Hunter, right? But I was doing Bills, Dolphins on radio Thursday night for Westwood One. But I wanted to make sure I was locked in for the TV game. I flew out on Tuesday night to Denver. I was told that I could talk to Shador after Wednesday's practice for Colorado. I go to the practice, I'm in Boulder after the practice, I'm told, well, he got banged up against Nebraska. He needs to get Treatment can't meet with you, but he'll meet with you Friday at the production meeting. Okay, no problem. Go to Buffalo, do the game, fly back. Friday, production meeting. We talked to Dion, he was great. The coordinators? No, Shador, we weren't really given a reason, but we did not talk to Shadow at the production meetings, which, as you know, starting quarterback, especially high profile player like that, very unusual. I walk out of the hotel and there's a pickup truck in front of the hotel and Shador is just sitting in the back of the pickup truck. And I kind of regret not going up to him and just saying, introducing myself, hey, Shador, I'm Ross. Nice to meet you. Or ask him why he didn't do the production meeting. But it just made me wonder, Dan, like people asked me, NFL people asked me after that game, what did you think of Shador? And I said, I didn't get to talk to him. Maybe he's the greatest kid ever. Maybe he's a bad kid, I don't know. But I told them the story and they just kind of nodded their head. And it just made me wonder, Dan, how many stories are there like that in which Shidore did things that were not customary? He did things non traditionally. It certainly seemed like that was the deal with a lot of the combine interviews and meetings with teams, and especially at that position. I think it makes him very nervous that already in college he was getting out of things that you're supposed to be doing. What's he going to be like if he's a first round pick in the NFL draft?

Dan Patrick (31:21)

But if he had Cam Ward's talent, would we be overlooking all of this?

Ross Tucker (31:27)

If he had Cam Ward's talent, he still would have been a first round pick. I think that the Titans would have taken Cam Ward instead of him, meaning the intangibles, the way he carries himself, that stuff matters. But if he was that talented, I believe the Brown to the Giants at three, they would have taken him. Because also that's the other part of this. You're okay with having that level of attention if it's your top five pick, your starting quarterback that goes along with that. Once the Giants decided they like Dart more than Shador and the Saints decided they like Chuck more than Shador, which, by the way, a lot of people came on my show, the Raw soccer podcast, and said they had Dart ahead of Shador or they had shock head of Shador. So I can live with those. But once those three teams made that decision, then he was only going to get Drafted to be a backup. And we know this from Kaepernick, from Tebow. Nobody wants the most high profile player on the team to be the backup quarterback. Nobody wants a lightning rod, polarizing backup quarterback. And I got to tell you, Dan, no, I have no proof of this. I'm convinced that Aaron Rodgers told the Steelers, hey, I'm coming, I'll play for you, but don't take the Sanders kid because Aaron doesn't want to deal with that. Aaron doesn't want, the first time he has a bad game, people calling for the Steelers to put Shador Sanders in. Whether he said something or not, I will believe forever that Aaron Rodgers made it known to the Steelers he did not want Shador Sanders in that quarterback room and have to deal with that and what might be his last year in the NFL.

Dan Patrick (33:07)

I'll leave you with this. And the more I've thought about it, the more I'm surprised at this. They didn't have an agent for Shador. You have Dion, who is a big cheerleader for his son. His son is listening to his dad pump him up. His dad, during super bowl week is talking about, I've talked to teams and, hey, I might be steering him in a different direction here. All of this is going on. There's nobody really to tell him what reality is because you're there at Colorado with your dad. You, you're driving an expensive car. You get to do what you want. Like, that's not reality. This is reality. When you go to talk somebody and they want to know who you are, not who your dad is, they want to know, can you do this? What am I getting here as a person? And that's what really surprises me, that it doesn't sound like somebody was there to be that voice who was going to be the contrarian to say, hey, you didn't interview well. Hey, this is what I'm hearing because I think reporters were really nervous of giving the true story of what was going on. Because I think you had one who came out, maybe it was Todd McShay. And all of a sudden it's like, hey, I'm hearing he had a bad interview. And the blowback was, oh, now they're. Now we're coming out and going after Chador. I even said it on the show. It feels like there was a smear campaign going on quietly. And then all of a sudden it start. Now it's coming to the surface. But I kept thinking, where is this coming from? And then we finally found out there are some people attaching their names to what was going on. I'm just amazed they didn't have somebody who was going to play the bad cop to everybody's good cop in this situation.

Ross Tucker (34:55)

Well, and not only that, Dan, you just made a fantastic point because every guy with an agent they get prepped for the combine interviews. So not only is it the part where he could have had someone to tell him the truth after the interviews or during the pre draft process, it's pretty clear nobody told him how to conduct himself in those interviews and he failed them miserably. I've had people say that he went into those interviews, Dan, as if he had the leverage. Right. As if he was in control of the situation. Boy, that does not go over real well.

Dan Patrick (35:32)

Yeah.

Ross Tucker (35:33)

Those guys, imagine being you interview 100 guys at the combine, only one of them acts like his, you know what doesn't stink and acts like he can, he can control and say whatever he wants to say. He didn't have someone to prep him properly for those interviews and it cost him dearly. I mean we learned this spring how important the pre draft process is for quarterbacks, especially with see, I mean Quinn Ewers and these guys going down, shocking. Gabriel going up. What you do in the spring. Yes. After the season, it matters.

Dan Patrick (36:09)

Yeah, yeah. I'm just, I'm, I, I was told that, that there was this a scenario where Shador made the person people interviewing him feel like you got to recruit me.

Ross Tucker (36:23)

Yeah.

Dan Patrick (36:24)

Like I, I, I'm not sure if I want to go to your, your team. Why don't you tell me why I want to go to your team. There was that sense of entitlement. Now that was one situation. I don't know what happened elsewhere, but you're right, it does play, it did play a pretty big role here. Great to talk to you as always. Thanks for joining us.

Ross Tucker (36:44)

Of course. Great seeing you. Thank you, man.

Dan Patrick (36:45)

That's Ross Tucker, CBS Sports, Westwood One college football NFL analyst and host of the Ross Tucker Football Podcast. We'll take a break. Poll results coming up. We'll get to your phone calls Charles Barkley next hour. Back after this, be sure to catch the live edition of the Dan Patrick show, weekdays at 9am Eastern, 6am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app. Hey, my name is Jay Shetty and I'm the host of On Purpose. I just had a great conversation with Michelle Obama, to whom much is given, much is expected. The guilt comes from. Am I doing enough me, Michelle Obama to say that to a therapist? So let's Unpack that. Former first lady Michelle Obama and someone who knows her best, her big brother Craig, will be hosting a podcast called imo. What have been your personal journeys with therapy? We need to be coached throughout our lives. My mom wanted us to be, be independent children. And she would always tell me, stop worrying about your sister. Having been the first lady of the entire country and representing the country in the world, I couldn't afford to have that kind of disdain. What would you say has been the most hardest recent test of fear? Listen to On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Cause Ross Tucker brought up some interesting things. You know, when you get that firsthand information that you're waiting to interview Shador, you were told he was going to be available, then he wasn't. You were told he was going to be available, then he wasn't. It just felt like you're, you're not living in what is reality because you're on scholarship in more ways than one at Colorado. And, and I've said this before, we've never had him on the show. I've never spoken to him. We have asked if he wanted to come on the show. But, you know, you go to the NFL. That's why when they. People are trying to lump this in with Colin Kaepernick. Kaepernick was completely different. It should not be mentioned. And they say it's collusion. It's not collusion. They, they. I think everybody realized that this is not somebody you want to bring in unless he is a bona fide superstar. If he's going to be your guy and he's going to be your franchise quarterback, that's different. But if he's going to be the backup or the third quarterback, that's where you're getting questions constantly. And Kevin Stefanski is going to get this in Cleveland. Joe Flacco struggles or Kenny Pickett struggles or. When, when is Shador going to play? I mean, this is going to happen the entire year. When's he going to play? Why isn't he playing? Who gives you a better chance? Kenny Pickett or shoulder? You're going to face these questions here, but when you go into an interview and you're sitting with grownups and you're not used to being in this situation, like, explain this play to me. What happened on that interception you threw. He didn't want to talk about it. He didn't want to take blame. The nil. You got money, you're driving around in a Two hundred thousand dollar car. These guys are talking to me. Yeah. All right, well, they better tell me some good things because you know, I'll go elsewhere. It felt like it was probably a recruiting type feel for him. All right, couple of phone calls in here. Let's see. Sue in Denver. Hi, Sue. What's on your mind? Good morning, dp. Good morning, Danette. Hey, I was just, I hate to circle back on this, but just referencing going back to the Doc Rivers debacle this morning. I was listening to it and he kind of sounds a little bit like Kevin Harlan. So I was wondering if maybe Kevin Harlan could interview Doc on his chances.

Luke de Kock (40:40)

Of staying with Milwaukee.

Dan Patrick (40:42)

Okay, well, let's see. Let's go down to Kevin Harlan who is standing by with Doc Rivers.

Ross Tucker (40:49)

Doc, you've lost many playoff games. We all know the Clipper saga.

Dan Patrick (40:53)

And now it happened again.

Ross Tucker (40:54)

What is going on with you in playoff games? I don't know if it's. I got to do better, I got to do better. I'm not going to put it on my team. I got to be a better coach. I hope they give me a chance to come back next year. I love those guys.

Dan Patrick (41:06)

Excellent.

Ross Tucker (41:06)

This is the NBA on tnt.

Dan Patrick (41:09)

Thank you, Kevin. Excellent.

Ross Tucker (41:10)

And Doc wants to talk about it.

Dan Patrick (41:12)

Thank you, Todd. Your, your head is all red.

Ross Tucker (41:17)

Yeah.

Dan Patrick (41:18)

Feel a little lightheaded actually. Raymond in California. Hi, Raymond, good morning. What's on your mind? I'm a first time caller. Six two and 180 pounds. I just want to talk about the Bill Belichick. I want to come to his defense. Now look, Bill Belichick is in his 70s and he has a 24 year old girlfriend. How many older men out there pretty much really date women in their own, in their own age brackets? Not too many. So I have no problem with Bill belichick dating a 24 year old. No, no, but, but, but Raymond, you're missing the point. Yes, there are men who date much younger women. Absolutely. But this has to do with the control of a football program that his career. This is a business. Like if you're a billionaire and you're dating somebody younger. Is she running your company? Well, that's the situation you have with Bill Belichick and his girlfriend. By all accounts, she is in giving the appearance, she's running, running the show here. She's telling him what he can and cannot say. That's why this is a little more than, you know, a guy dating somebody 50 years younger than him. Okay, I don't, I don't think so. I saw the interview, and just because she said, look, we're not talking about that. That's just something maybe they. They just did not want to discuss. And doesn't mean that she's running him. I don't think she's running him. She just didn't want to talk about it.

Luke de Kock (42:41)

And.

Dan Patrick (42:41)

And Bill Belichick is a good coach, and I'm going to watch all of his UNC games, and they don't have nothing. I'm watching, too, but. And thank you, Raymond. She interrupted the interview multiple times. She delayed the interview. This is according to CBS. She delayed it 30 minutes. So she made it about herself while trying not to make it about herself. And if you're going to post photos of you posing on the beach as a mermaid and he's the Morton Salt guy, people are going to ask those questions. And then when she says we're not talking about it, this is real life. Yes. She's got him cosplaying, like, what do you want me to dress up like today?

Ross Tucker (43:32)

The role play.

Dan Patrick (43:33)

Yes. And I get it. All right, I'll do that. You know, you want me to be a fisherman. Sure. Please respect our privacy. Yeah, yeah. If you put those pictures out, people are going to ask about it. And if you interrupt the conversation numerous times, I would have said, either be in the interview or be out of the interview room. I wasn't planning on watching that interview, but then I was like, can't stop thinking about it. And you wear a navy sweatshirt. You're the North Carolina head coach. Could it have gone any worse than it did? Charles Barkley, final hour.