Austin Undercover: The Parking Lot Rendezvous

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Austin Undercover: The Parking Lot Rendezvous"

Podcast Information:

• Title: The Dating Detectives
• Host/Authors: Mackenzie Fultz and Hanna Anderson
• Guest: Austin the PI
• Release Date: June 9, 2025

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Introduction and Show Overview [00:01 - 05:16]

The episode begins with a standard disclaimer emphasizing the anonymization of names and events for safety and entertainment purposes. Hosts Mackenzie Fultz, a professional Private Investigator, and comedian Hanna Anderson introduce the episode with their characteristic humor and camaraderie.

Notable Exchange:

• Mackenzie [00:38]: “Happy Dating Detectives Monday.”
• Andrea [00:42]: “My voice sounds like I'm sick, but maybe that's sexy.”
• Mackenzie [00:45]: “Sexy. Okay. The S.E.C. the raspiness is the sexiness.”

They set the stage for introducing their guest, Austin the PI, highlighting the intention to showcase different private investigators with varying specialties.

Introducing Austin the PI [05:16 - 06:00]

Mackenzie and Hanna warmly welcome Austin, who identifies himself as "Austin the PI" on Instagram. Austin shares his background, having been a private investigator for nine years, initially working alongside his father—a former FBI agent—before establishing his own firm.

Notable Quote:

• Austin [06:00]: “I've been a PI for about nine years, and I got into that by working with my father. He was in the FBI and then started his own PI firm.”

Private Investigation Specializations and Techniques [06:00 - 11:35]

The discussion delves into Austin’s areas of expertise, primarily focusing on family law, criminal defense, and insurance fraud. Mackenzie probes into the ethical aspects of defending clients who may be guilty, highlighting Austin’s approach of presenting unbiased facts to the defense attorney.

Notable Quotes:

• Mackenzie [06:25]: “Why would you defend… What do you say to that?”
• Austin [06:43]: “I just present the facts, and it’s up to the lawyer to really take their defense into court.”
• Hanna [07:22]: “Everyone deserves it.”

Tools and Resources for Investigations [09:00 - 10:00]

Austin introduces digital tools like PIM Eyes, a consumer-level facial recognition software, and Cyberbackgroundchecks.com, which allows individuals to perform background checks. These tools democratize access to investigative resources, enabling users to verify the authenticity of online profiles and uncover hidden information.

Notable Quotes:

• Austin [09:01]: “PIM Eyes is this crazy software that now you can use facial recognition at the consumer level.”
• Hanna [09:27]: “It's crazy available to, like, Hannah's and normal people.”

Surveillance and Investigation Methods [10:00 - 14:00]

Mackenzie and Hanna explore the nuances between different investigative techniques. Austin explains his process in criminal cases, which involves analyzing police evidence, identifying investigative gaps, and conducting interviews with defendants and witnesses. This meticulous approach ensures comprehensive case coverage.

Notable Quote:

• Austin [10:00]: “I spend a good amount of time going through the discovery in the case, which is the evidence that the police collected.”

Misconceptions About Private Investigators [16:00 - 20:00]

The hosts and Austin address common misconceptions, such as the belief that PIs have effortless access to sensitive information or possess superhuman investigative skills. Mackenzie emphasizes the hard work and dedication required, dispelling the myth of PIs being all-knowing or using unethical methods.

Notable Quotes:

• Mackenzie [17:03]: “They just know everything. It's like, no, I just. I'm an asshole, and I'm competitive.”
• Austin [18:12]: “It's not that easy. We do the work.”

Austin's Undercover Story: The Parking Lot Rendezvous [27:00 - 50:00]

Austin narrates a compelling case where he surveilled a client’s wife, Melissa, suspected of infidelity. The investigation led to capturing incriminating video evidence of Melissa in a parking lot rendezvous with another man. This story underscores the challenges and ethical considerations in undercover surveillance.

Key Points:

• Client's Situation: Jim hires Austin to investigate Melissa’s fidelity after a separation.
• Surveillance Setup: Austin infiltrates a girls' trip to Panama City Beach, Florida.
• Climactic Moment [37:08]: Melissa is caught in a compromising position with another man in her Porsche Cayenne.
• Outcome: Austin gathers substantial evidence to support Jim’s case, highlighting the effectiveness of diligent surveillance.

Notable Quotes:

• Austin [37:38]: “They got back in the car and I'm in like a 45 or 50-mile-an-hour zone, like, at all times.”
• Hanna [39:02]: “So they're under this street light. And I mean, that might have been why they didn't walk by.”
• Mackenzie [41:00]: “If you out here in front of God and everybody showing you junk, then you don't have any concerns?”

Ethical Considerations and Emotional Impact [50:00 - 60:00]

The conversation shifts to the moral aspects of surveillance, including privacy concerns and the emotional toll on PIs when handling sensitive or disturbing cases. Mackenzie advocates for maintaining professional boundaries, while Austin shares experiences that highlight the emotional detachment required in the field.

Notable Quotes:

• Mackenzie [40:07]: “I'm someone who I will always air on the side of ethical, so I wouldn't pursue that.”
• Austin [52:56]: “I do not want to see you guys fight or get into it right in front of me.”

Safety and Risks in PI Work [60:00 - 61:35]

Austin discusses the inherent risks in PI work, including physical danger and confrontations. He recounts a harrowing story where a fellow PI was shot at during an investigation, emphasizing the unpredictable nature of the job.

Notable Quotes:

• Austin [60:19]: “He's talking to me like, hey, man, I heard you've been following me. And, like, I ain't cheating on my wife.”
• Mackenzie [60:22]: “So you've never been in like any threat of real danger or violence or anything?”

Pretexting and Social Engineering Techniques [61:35 - 63:29]

Austin elaborates on the use of pretexting and social engineering in investigations. He describes scenarios like posing as an appliance maintenance worker or ordering a pizza to elicit information or gather evidence discreetly.

Notable Quotes:

• Mackenzie [62:05]: “What are some pretexts that you use to get information?”
• Austin [62:21]: “So it's like, I'm going to someone's door as an appliance maintenance guy.”

Closing Remarks and Resources [63:30 - 69:35]

The episode concludes with Austin sharing his Instagram handle (@austinthepi) for listeners interested in more PI stories. The hosts encourage audience engagement through Patreon, inviting listeners to share their own stories or recommend other PIs for future episodes. They also promote upcoming events, such as a book club featuring Andrea Dunlop’s "The Mother Next Door."

Notable Quotes:

• Austin [63:47]: “I tell a lot of PI stories on Instagram, and it's at austinthepi.”
• Mackenzie [67:12]: “Let us know if you have a story or you are a private investigator or you just want to vent about a breakup, we're fine with it.”

Key Takeaways and Insights

• Diligence and Ethical Boundaries: Successful PI work requires meticulous effort and a strong ethical framework to navigate privacy concerns.
• Modern Tools Enhance Investigations: Digital tools like PIM Eyes and Cyberbackgroundchecks.com empower both professionals and the public to conduct background checks and verify online information.
• Emotional Resilience Needed: Handling sensitive cases can be emotionally taxing, necessitating the ability to maintain professional detachment.
• Risks Inherent in the Field: Physical dangers and confrontations are real risks that PIs may face, highlighting the need for caution and preparedness.

Conclusion

"Austin Undercover: The Parking Lot Rendezvous" offers an insightful glimpse into the life of a private investigator, blending engaging storytelling with practical information. Austin’s experiences underscore the complexities and responsibilities inherent in PI work, providing listeners with a nuanced understanding of what it takes to uncover the truth in the intricate world of dating and beyond.

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Transcript

[Hannah]

The following program contains names, places, and events that have been anonymized or fictionalized for the purposes of protection and safety. The following program is provided for entertainment purposes only, and any commentary from the hosts are strictly conjecture and should not be held as making any definitive statements about the truth or identity of any particular individuals or circumstances. If you or a loved one are involved in an abusive relationship, please call the National Domestic violence hotline at 1-800-799-7233 for support.

[Mackenzie]

Happy Dating Detectives Monday.

[Hannah]

Hi, everybody. How's everybody doing?

[Andrea]

My voice sounds like I'm sick, but maybe that's sexy. Cool.

[Mackenzie]

Sexy. Okay. The S.E.C. the raspiness is the sexiness.

[Andrea]

Our guest today said the same thing. He was like, sorry, I feel sick. And we were like, people love that.

[Mackenzie]

People love an accent. I mean, a sore throat. Can we make Mondays like, a national holiday? Like, Dating Detectives Month? And there's, like, every week have a national holiday, Double D Day.

[Andrea]

That sounds weird. Because of D Day. Never mind.

[Mackenzie]

Well, we're so excited for our guest today. Oh, my God. So you guys know that I. The whole reason that this kind of came about was because my McKinsey undercover stories and kind of talking about them online, and then it just kind of.

[Hannah]

Little by little, if you're miss.

[Andrea]

If you're new here.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah. And so now that's how Hannah and I got to connect, which I'm so grateful for. And then Molly, our producer, which is really cool. And I know that you guys have heard my stories for, like, two years, but we wanted to kind of introduce you to other PIs, because there's different specialties and there's different locations and different techniques. And so we want to know what you guys think about hearing other PIs techniques tell their stories.

[Andrea]

Yeah. Our idea. So today would be the first one. We are talking to someone who goes by Austin, the PI on Instagram, and he also shares some of his experiences. And we asked him for a cheating story because, like, I mean, that's what.

[Mackenzie]

Let's face it, you guys are heathens.

[Andrea]

I mean, we're not into cheating. We're pretty against it. But we were like, we want the tea.

[Mackenzie]

Everybody wants the cheating drama.

[Andrea]

Yeah. So he. He also does, like, some criminal case stuff that we got to talk to him about. What we're thinking is, like, today we got Austin undercover, but as the days go on, it would be fun to talk to other specialists. Like I was just saying, I want to talk to a PI that focuses on, like, financial scam and online tracking. Hacking type stuff, because that happens so much. And half the time we finish these episodes, we're like, how does somebody deal with, like, the fact that they just stole their money? Like, where did they even go? So that's the kind of stuff we want to learn more about from different perspectives. And I just also love, like, you're a PI So you get it. So you get to ask good questions.

[Mackenzie]

I. Yeah. And I think that you guys will really appreciate some of the other stories from other. Just different perspectives on PI. So I. I think it would be really cool.

[Andrea]

It's the detectives part of dating detectives.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Andrea]

Part of this. So. Yeah. So let us know if you like the idea. And Austin is awesome and such a sweetie. And it's just a fun. It's a silly little tale. You'll see what happens. Spoiler alert. There's a dogfish.

[Mackenzie]

And also little ears. Earmuffs. Yeah.

[Andrea]

PG 13.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah, yeah, probably that one.

[Andrea]

We'll get to it. Patreon, as always, sign up for Patreon. We love Patreon, you guys.

[Mackenzie]

We have a new tier, the $9 tier. So we had the $5 a month Patreon, which was like two bonus episodes, and then the live events in the book club and the forum and all the things. And then the $9. All of that and ad free listening experience.

[Austin]

Whoa.

[Andrea]

And so you guys have been saying that's it's going well and it's integrating easily. So let us know if you have any issues with it.

[Mackenzie]

But yeah, thank you for your support, our Patreon, and thank you just for listening to our show. We really appreciate it. We love when you guys share on your social media. We love when you send in your stories so you can send us your stories. [e-mail] and now if you yourself are.

[Andrea]

A private investigator or know a private investigator that has stories, send us those too.

[Mackenzie]

Put that on the subject. Be like, I'm a PI or whatever. Undercover.

[Hannah]

Yeah.

[Andrea]

And book club for Andrea Dunlop's book the Mother Next Door is going to be this Thursday at 6:00pm Pacific Time on if you want to join its Patreon. We'll. We'll share the link on Patreon. On Zoom. We're talking to Andrea, which is so exciting. She's also the host of Nobody Should Believe Me podcast. You should listen to that, read the book, or even if you just want to come chat, that's fine. And it's really good. And I'm just. She's awesome. So that'll be really, really fun. Thursday, 6pm Pacific, and it's $5 to join Patreon. If you just want to come for book club, just join for $5 and then you can cancel it. It's fine. We don't care. We love you anyway. But yeah, that's. That's an update. Anything else?

[Mackenzie]

I don't think so. I think we're ready to hear from Austin. What do you think?

[Andrea]

I am so excited. He was such a delight.

[Mackenzie]

He really is. Okay, let's do it. Okay.

[Andrea]

Austin the PI Austin the PI.

[Mackenzie]

Hi, Austin.

[Austin]

Hey, Nice to see you guys.

[Hannah]

I love that you put your name. Austin the PI is the name you.

[Austin]

Put into the system. That's how I identify.

[Mackenzie]

Now, Hannah, have we had. We've had another PI on the show before, haven't we?

[Hannah]

Or no, I don't believe so. I think.

[Austin]

Okay. I was wondering.

[Hannah]

I was our first guest PI.

[Mackenzie]

I'm so excited. This is so cool. Hannah's like, oh, no, I'm sitting with two PIs.

[Hannah]

No, I love. I can't wait to, like, pick your brain. In fact, before we get into your story, let's learn a little bit about you, like how long you've been a P.I. how'd you get into it, all that stuff.

[Austin]

Yeah, so I've been a PI for about nine years, and I got into that by working with my father. He was in the FBI and then started his own PI firm. Then directly out of college, I jumped in with him, and it's kind of been history ever since. So my specialization, I do a lot of family law, but kind of my main thing is criminal defense work, so I do that. And then also insurance cases, like insurance fraud, stuff like that.

[Mackenzie]

With a lot of criminal defense work for private investigators, you might. I'm. I'm certain you've heard feedback, like, why would you defend. Like, why would you try to, like, help. Help criminals? What do you say to that? And what do you love about doing. Doing that part of the job where you're actually trying to help prove someone innocent? I guess.

[Austin]

Yeah. Well, so my answer to that usually is like, I don't make the facts. I don't know if they did it or not. I just present that, and it's up to the lawyer to really take their defense into court. And so really, when it comes to defending someone, it's. It's like, if they did it, they did it. I'm going to tell the lawyer that. And it's just really presenting them an effective criminal defense. Like, you have all the facts before you Go into court. But, yeah, I used to feel a little bit scummy working for criminal defense, but as the years have gone on, it's. It's really like. No, I'm just. I'm just helping make sure that the facts the police got because they're so overloaded are actually correct.

[Mackenzie]

That's such a good point.

[Hannah]

Everyone deserves it. No, everybody deserves a factual case with whatever their case is. So I don't think there's any problem in trying to make that happen.

[Austin]

It's what the system is built on.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah. And it's true that no matter what kind of investigation you're doing or what side you're working for, it's still the same job. You're still investigating to get the information. And you have to do it ethically in a way that is, you know, sound and true. And you. You like. Either way you work, you have to do it.

[Austin]

Exactly. Yeah.

[Hannah]

So, Mackenzie, I know you say that, and maybe this is not the right way to put it, but you say you kind of specialize in surveillance, but is that. What other specializations are there? The two that come to mind are like, surveillance and then like, online stuff does that. Is that. What are the PI, like toolkit specializations? And which ones do you both do the most?

[Mackenzie]

So, like Austin said he does a lot of family law and criminal defense work, which Austin, I imagine that means a lot of, like, you're on foot, you're asking questions, you're interviewing, getting information.

[Austin]

Yep. Yeah. And. And so, like, you touched on it, Hannah. The online side of things. It's called open source investigations. So a lot of chasing down documents from court records, a lot of chasing down, like, if somebody has an online dating profile, because I'm sure, as you guys know and talk about on this podcast, those can be really difficult to find.

[Hannah]

And you guys just like creating fake profiles and swiping, like, on that kind of stuff.

[Austin]

But then there are also super cool tools that have come out in recent years. Like, have you guys heard of PIM Eyes?

[Hannah]

I have not.

[Mackenzie]

What's that?

[Hannah]

How do you spell that?

[Austin]

So it's P, I, M, E Y E, S. Basically, PIM Eyes is this crazy software that now you can use facial recognition at the consumer level. So I could put in, like, for example, my face, and it might tell me if I've got a Tinder profile or if I've got like an Ashley Madison profile, that kind of stuff.

[Hannah]

It's crazy available to, like, Hannah's and.

[Austin]

Normal people or anybody who wants to use it.

[Hannah]

I don't need a license to do that.

[Austin]

No. And you can actually, like, test it out for free. It's super cool.

[Hannah]

Is it really expensive? Because sometimes it feels like those things are really barred by. If you have the money, you can find anything you want.

[Austin]

So case by case, like, if you wanted to search one person and get all of their results, I think it's like 15 bucks.

[Hannah]

All right.

[Austin]

So, yeah, I feel like I'm turning.

[Hannah]

This into PIM Eyes ad. But no, not sponsored by PIM Eyes. But we are always talking about, like, what's it called? Blackbook.

[Mackenzie]

Blackbook online.info blackbook online.in but like, stuff.

[Hannah]

Like that for people that are dating that just want to be able to check the background of people they're starting to see. So it is valuable. And if they want to pay us, like, down.

[Mackenzie]

But obviously we don't want to spill all the, all the trade secrets because we still gotta.

[Austin]

That's true.

[Mackenzie]

We still want work. No, but so, like, where Austin might do investigations, where he's digging for information to collect data from different sources or whatever, he's on foot, he might be going. Do you go door to door and do, like, you know, on foot? Yeah. So you're collecting all this information just like the police would. Whereas surveillance, I kind of like, I, I, I do those things sometimes to obtain information if I'm not getting it, but the surveillance is just watching what are they doing, where are they going? And if needed, then I might talk to people and just try to find out a little bit more. But the, that's kind of, kind of the difference. There is more talking to people. You're on foot, you're not in the car, as opposed to just like observing for a while. Do you, do you do surveillance too? Don't you, like, just sit, like, you do a lot of surveillance?

[Austin]

Yeah, yeah. It's probably actually 50. 50. So I do, I do like, insurance and domestic cases, like cheating spouses, and then I do 50% criminal work. Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

Are there certain kind of criminal cases that you do or is it just. Does it run the gamut?

[Austin]

Yeah, honestly, it, it goes full spectrum. When I was working for my dad, it was mostly homicide and sexual assault, which is the more morbid stuff, of course, But. But now that I've started my own firm, it's really a lot of like, assault and assault with a deadly weapon, stuff like that. So stuff that's not quite as serious, but still like a serious enough charge. They're going to get some time when.

[Mackenzie]

You are trying to Find information or investigate a criminal case specifically. What's your typical process? Like, where do you start? How do you know what to do?

[Austin]

Yeah, so typically with those cases, they provide you the discovery in the case, which is the evidence that the police collected. And I spent a good amount of time going through that. And it's kind of fun because as you read it, like, unfolds what they've done. And then you also see, like, okay, well, why didn't they do this? And why didn't they talk to this person? And, like, they only have this person's first name in there, but they seem to have a lot of information. So, like, why have they not done a background on them? And, like, got me in enough information. So it kind of unfolds your priorities for you. And then you go on and you interview the defendant and then the witnesses in the case.

[Mackenzie]

Maybe think of it like kind of like a cold case, where if you get a different set of eyes, it kind of brings new light to the. It's like a. Yeah. You know, everybody's brain is different. You think differently. And so just having a new perspective, that seems would be really helpful there. When you're.

[Hannah]

And you're. You're not looking for anything in particular, you're just looking to present the facts as you find them, Right?

[Austin]

Yeah. And, like, the facts that are in that case, they're going to present themselves as like, okay, this is a glaring issue that I need to highlight for the attorney, and this could be an arguing point for him in court, or this is a glaring issue for this defendant, and they are guilty as sin, and this attorney needs to know that. So don't get blown up in court.

[Hannah]

Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

Now, is this with your clients, Austin, especially with the criminal defense cases, if you. Do you say, man, this is for real. Like, this guy did this, or is that something you kind of keep to yourself? Like, do you let them make that decision?

[Austin]

So sometimes it depends on the attorney. Some are, like, just down to earth, good old boys, and they want to know what it is. But then some get really, like, they buy their own Kool Aid. You know, they're drinking it, and so you don't really want to tell them what's going on because they want to keep that, like, that psyche of their innocence so that they can live with themselves. Which, honestly, that's kind of sad when I meet an attorney like that. Like, just be honest with yourself. If they're guilty, they're guilty. Like, you're just doing your job. Like, they're still entitled to you to take their. Their stuff into court, kind of have to feel it out.

[Mackenzie]

That's a good point that you make. Like, you. Even though they're charged with the crime, everyone is still entitled to that. To the. To the.

[Hannah]

You're entitled to an attorney.

[Mackenzie]

You're entitled to be defended in the justice system and be proven guilty. So that's the weight of the prosecution is to prove that you did something wrong.

[Austin]

Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

And that's why they say innocent until proven guilty.

[Austin]

Exactly. It was. So it reminds me, I had a case just recently where the guy was charged with some larceny charges, but then he had an additional weapons charge put onto his case that the weapon wasn't even his. He didn't know the weapon was there. Nothing like that. And so it was really cool to see this attorney is like, they're both admitting that he's guilty of this. This original charge, but then he's still fighting for him to get less time on additional things that the court was trying to put on him. So it just goes to show, even though you might be guilty, they might be trying to tack on extra time that you're not entitled to all that.

[Mackenzie]

Kind of stuff, because that always looks better for the. The. The prosecution side. Like, it always looks better the more charges they can get. And so sometimes they try to trump the charges or whatever.

[Austin]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

We also. We just had a guest who. Their dogfish. I'm sure Molly introduced you a little bit, but we created the term dogfish, which is kind of like catfish to the extreme. Okay, so catfish. You are using a fake picture. Dogfish is like, we've been dating for three years, but I didn't tell you. I had a. Another family. Like, they're committed to the bit. So this last guest's dogfish was a sad case. He. I mean, somebody else. He basically killed an ex. He did, yeah. And then his sentencing was way less than it should have been because they were able to prove that what he did wasn't directly the result of the murder. And. But then there was, like, his dad was very wealthy and friends with the judge. It was one of those situations where it was a messy, systemic issue in our opinion. I'm sure that having an additional set of facts for some of those cases where it's like, you can't necessarily control all the other elements of the case. And like you said, like, it depends on the lawyer. Sometimes it depends on the judge. It's just, like, the way it is. It's, like, nice to know that you can have a backup set of people fighting for you if you need them.

[Austin]

Yeah. And the cool thing about that is, and a lot of people don't know this, when you're arrested for a crime, if it rises to a certain level, the state will actually pay for you to have an investigator. So.

[Hannah]

I did not know that.

[Austin]

Yeah. Most of these criminal defense clients that I work for, they don't actually pay for me as an investigator. The state pays for it. And so it's really just getting your connection with that lawyer and then setting up your relationship, and then their clients have an additional investigator working for them.

[Hannah]

Wow. Well, I hope nobody that is listening gets to a point where they're in that position. But it is good to learn about how it goes down, and I appreciate it. I'm curious also, the both of you, and I know a little more about MacKenzie's experience, but what's a misconception that people have about being a PI?

[Austin]

Ooh, mackenzie, what's yours?

[Mackenzie]

I think a lot of people think you just know everything. It's like, no, I just. I'm an asshole, and I'm competitive. Tell me, Austin, tell me PIs are not competitive as crap, and we cannot sleep until we know. Tell me. They are.

[Austin]

They are. And, like, honestly, they are very territorial, too. Like, so. So if you meet each other, like, I'm not saying me and you, but people in my area do not want to talk to me. They do not want to.

[Mackenzie]

Like, I've seen other surveillance investigators on surveillance, and a couple times I've caught them on my surveill.

[Hannah]

Is it because they want to, like, beat you to finding the answer or.

[Mackenzie]

No, it's your work. Together, it could be two different clients that both hired for this, for different. Like, not knowing that. And so I think a misconception would be that, oh, PIs just have access to, like, really. But we don't. Like, we work hard to get the information. Like, we have to dig and dig, and we are relentless. But everybody just thinks, oh, it's just so easy for you. Type a name in, and there's that. It's not that easy. And I think that's a huge misconception. Like, no, we do the work.

[Austin]

Yeah. Yeah, I would definitely agree with that. Like, I think people do think you just have access to phone wiretaps, and you have people's phone records, and you just, like, type it in or.

[Mackenzie]

Psychic.

[Austin]

Yeah. Or, like, I. I'm a hacker. Like, I can get into someone's computer or something like that. When in reality, like, Mackenzie is saying that stuff takes Digging, like, it takes hours to get the information that we're looking for.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

And it's probably not as glamorous as we all think. It's not like Sherlock Holmes, like, being all sleuthy sometimes. Yeah. Maybe you're swiping for a while to find somebody or sitting in your car at 5am and they don't show up. Like, it sounds like it's a lot of work.

[Mackenzie]

And, Austin, you can attest to this, too. It's not like you see in the movies where they're just sitting there. The lens is very long, there's no tinted windows, and they've got the window down all the way.

[Hannah]

You guys don't wear trench coats like, every day.

[Mackenzie]

I mean, don't ruin that for me.

[Hannah]

Don't ruin that image for me. Mackenzie's in Florida wearing her trench coat every day.

[Mackenzie]

Could you imagine? Like, no, I. Oh, Austin, I've been playing on my social media with, like, wigs, and everybody's like, do you wear wigs? You wear disguises? Do you ever wear disguises?

[Austin]

So I do a little bit, but it'll be like, shaving my beard or, like, wearing a hat, wearing some sunglasses. But people think that. That I will, like, literally tape on a beard and change my entire period.

[Mackenzie]

It's hilarious when they think that stuff.

[Austin]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Well, I feel like people don't need to. Like, we don't notice nearly as much as we think we notice. Like, if you shaved your beard and put a hat on, half the people you know would not think twice and not notice you.

[Austin]

Exactly. Well, and I've seen a lot of people that are starting to get into the profession think about that kind of stuff, and it's like, you're trying way too hard. No one is.

[Hannah]

Maybe you should have taken an acting class.

[Austin]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Hannah]

That might have been what you needed.

[Austin]

Yeah. Really? Just, like, try. Try not to be seen. You don't need to be, like, doing all that.

[Mackenzie]

And also another one. And, Austin, I want to hear your opinion on this. People say if you were investigating me or if you were doing surveillance on me, I would totally know. No, the hell you wouldn't. No, you wouldn't.

[Austin]

And I've got a good. A good, like, kind of scenario for that. One of the towns I used to live in was a military town, and it was special operations everywhere. So these are the most highly trained people in America, and so they're always cheating on their spouses. And so we would get hired pretty regularly to watch these guys, and they never had any kind of clue like the most highly trained people. Like if you were following me, I would have no idea for base because I'm not looking behind myself.

[Hannah]

You don't think about it. You don't assume that's happening. Especially if you're the type of person that feels like is in a powerful role, maybe at work, and then also feels like they can get away with an affair, then you think you're getting away with it.

[Austin]

Yeah. You're not watching behind you. Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

This episode is sponsored by Delete Me. You guys know that as a private investigator I have shared with you that information is really out there all willy nilly hanging out on the world wide web. Delete Me makes it easy, quick and safe to remove your personal data online at a time when surveillance and even data breaches are super common and they can make you really vulnerable. So Delete Me basically does all the hard work of wiping you and your family's personal information from data broker websites. Hannah, do you know what a data broker is?

[Andrea]

Kind of, I mean, tell me again.

[Mackenzie]

Okay, so data brokers are basically the guys who they go and find the information and then they compile it on their website and then you buy it from them.

[Andrea]

And how are they getting it? Is it like whenever. You know how when I buy something online it's like optional phone number or whatever, does that go to them?

[Mackenzie]

Yeah. So this is, it's basically public records that they are compiling for you. So it's information you could get, but people don't know where to find it or how to get it. And so what the data brokers do is they collect that information, compile it for you, and just charge you to get it super easy. So what Delete Me does is basically Delete me knows that your privacy is worth protecting. So you can sign up for delete Me, tell them exactly what information you want deleted, and they have experts that will take it from there. They'll send you regular personalized privacy reports. They'll show you what they found, what kind of information, where they found it, what they removed. And it's not just a one time service. It's always working for you. So it'll constantly monitor, remove the personal information that you don't want on the Internet. I love that because it's not.

[Andrea]

Yeah. And it's like a step, right? It's not like you're deleting yourself from existence on the Internet. It's more just like if you don't want your phone number out there, it might be out there and you don't even realize It.

[Mackenzie]

It's an option to help keep your information a little bit safer or at.

[Andrea]

Least to know what's out there. Like, it's. It's nice to know.

[Mackenzie]

That's a good point also, and just make it maybe a little bit harder for someone. I mean, public records are public records, but if it's harder for someone to get your information, then, you know, I think it's a little better. So take control of your data. Keep your private life private by signing up for Delete me now at a special discount for our listeners. Get 20 off your Delete Me plan. When you go to JoinDeleteMe.com dating detectives and use promo code TDD at checkout. The only way to get 20 off is go to JoinDeleteMe.com Dating Detectives and enter code TDD at checkout. That's JoinDeleteMe.com dating detectives, code TDD. What's your favorite type of case to work? Like, do you. Are you like, oh, the cheating cases are so interesting. Like, what's your favorite?

[Austin]

I mean, so cheating cases are really interesting. I think the most. Like, the most fun for me is when someone challenges me to find something online or, like, a record that they think I can't find, and then I find it. That's.

[Hannah]

Ironically, I feel the same. I know I'm not a licensed PI And I do not cross the boundary, but I do love finding a guy my friend met in the bar and only got a first name.

[Austin]

Exactly.

[Hannah]

Is beautiful. Yeah, it's magic.

[Austin]

Yeah. The other day, I had a case where it was a federal case, and I needed to find this witness, and they only gave me a first name, and it was really gonna be difficult, and they told me it was gonna be difficult. And so I did my work and found the lady, and it was one of the best feelings I can imagine as a P.I.

[Hannah]

Aw. Okay. That made me think. And then I'm excited to hear your PI Undercover Austin Undercover story.

[Mackenzie]

Me too. I'm so excited.

[Hannah]

I know. Knowing what you know about infidelity and people you've followed. For anyone who's dating right now, do you have any safety tips for them or ways to. To. To check on someone?

[Austin]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Legally and respectfully.

[Austin]

So one thing I do on. On my page a lot, and MacKenzie's seen it a little bit, is I try to provide resources that people that everyday people can use, like PIM Eyes, and, like, there's this. This website called Cyber background checks dot com. And so as private investigators, we use databases like TLO and idi, CORE and They're these data aggregators and they're super powerful. Like, you can get someone's Social Security number, their first and last name, their home address, phone number, background information, all that kind of stuff.

[Hannah]

MySpace from 20 years ago.

[Austin]

Oh, yeah. Wow. Yeah, you can get a ton of information on people, and it's a small cost, but only private investigators can use those databases. So I try to provide these free or low cost resources that people can use so they can do backgrounds on people that come into their life. Because you have no idea if somebody's using a fake name and a fake picture. But if you put that picture on PIM eyes, you might have an idea. Or if you search them on cyber background checks where you can search their address and phone number, all that kind.

[Hannah]

Of stuff, you see a mug shot pop up that does match the picture.

[Austin]

Oh, no. And it belongs to a different name, and it's not them at all. Like. Yeah, you know, like, you just never know. So I think doing your own background research or even hiring a PI to do a background for a hundred bucks, like, it's. It's easy, and it's also a really good way to make sure you're safe online. Yeah. Wow.

[Hannah]

I mean, we don't want. We talk about this all the time. Like, and I'm sure you agree, like, we're not trying to make everybody live in complete panic, but it's just like, you know, protecting yourself, and that's an okay thing, especially in this world. It's like, you're not crazy if you want to just double check that they don't have a criminal record. A hundred percent, you're not crazy. Let us be the first to tell.

[Austin]

You, especially with all these tools. Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

There's so many questions that I have, and I know our audience is gonna have some. So if you guys have questions for Austin, I would love for you to send them over, and I wanna see if he'll answ some, maybe follow up on the Patreon or something. I think that'd be really cool.

[Austin]

Totally.

[Mackenzie]

Do you want to get into a story that you want to tell us? I'm super stoked for this. I would love for you to get into it. Are you. Are you ready to tell us?

[Austin]

Totally. Yeah.

[Hannah]

Let's go, let's go, let's go. Tell us, tell us.

[Austin]

Okay. Okay. So this was when I worked with my father's company, and so we were hired by a husband named Jim. Okay. So Jim hired us because he had just recently separated from his wife, and it was because that she was growing distant and they were arguing and so they needed space. Right. But he wanted some insight into what things were going on.

[Hannah]

Can you give me. I love a visual. What ages are we talking? Where do we live? Who are these? Who are these lovely characters?

[Mackenzie]

Do they have kids, all this stuff?

[Austin]

Yes. So they had two kids. They were in Tallahassee, Florida. And Jim was, I want to say like 37. And then Melissa was his wife and she was probably around the same age, maybe 35, 34, something like that.

[Hannah]

Right.

[Austin]

And Jim.

[Mackenzie]

Nuclear family.

[Austin]

Yeah, exactly. I forget what Jim did for work, but Melissa owned a nail salon and so she had like a lot of autonomy. I don't want to say free time because she's a business owner. She like had a lot of stuff going on, but she had this girlfriend that wanted to go to. On a beach trip to Panama City beach in Florida. So two hours away.

[Mackenzie]

How old are the kids?

[Austin]

The kids I think were like three and seven.

[Mackenzie]

Okay, so she wants to go on like a weekend trip.

[Austin]

Yeah. So he called us and he's like, hey, I know there's a girls trip this weekend. I want to see what she does. Here's a full retainer, plus some. Go do your thing.

[Andrea]

Go to the girl.

[Hannah]

Go on the girls trip.

[Austin]

Yeah, exactly. So that means, like, I'm going to be getting a hotel. I'm going to be doing the girls trip with them. She. They don't know I'm there, but I'm there. You know what I'm saying? So I.

[Hannah]

This is going to make people want to be a PI because they're like, I want to go to the beach.

[Austin]

Oh yeah. And this is like a glamorous story. Do not get me wrong. This is a fun one. So I start at the nail salon and I'm waiting for her to get off work. She's going to get off on Friday night and we're going to go to Panama City.

[Mackenzie]

So you start like doing surveillance there, waiting for her to leave.

[Austin]

Yeah, exactly. Like 4:00, 4:30. I'm waiting for her to get out. So I'm picking her up at work at like maybe 5:30 or so, she gets off work and we make our way to the highway and we're booking it down the highway.

[Mackenzie]

So it's to make it clear. Sorry to interrupt. That's. That's PI speak for we picked her up. Meaning that we started surveillance at this time.

[Austin]

Yes.

[Mackenzie]

She didn't pick her up. I know somebody's gonna be like, wait.

[Austin]

He picked her up.

[Hannah]

That's Weird.

[Mackenzie]

So when we say we pick something, somebody up, it means that we went there, did surveillance and started following them. Like mobile surveillance.

[Austin]

Yeah. So it was me and another investigator. She comes out, gets in her car, we're going down the highway, and this lady is like, I don't know what her rush is because, like, he's going to be there if you are 30 minutes late, whatever. She's going like 95 down the highway the entire way there. And so it's just me and him trading off because I'm worried I'm going to get a ticket. So I'm like, bro, you got to get in here at some point. And. And we switch it off. And I think it was like Memorial Day weekend as well. So there's just like the big surveillance. Thousands too. Yeah, thousands of people on the road. Yeah, it was crazy.

[Hannah]

That's when people get up to stuff.

[Mackenzie]

That is the. That is the number one top surveillance weekend across the board is a holiday weekend.

[Hannah]

I guess that doesn't surprise me. Yeah, girls trip weekend. A boys trip weekend, whatever weekend.

[Austin]

Yeah, girls trip.

[Hannah]

So, okay, so you're like, almost getting pulled over.

[Austin]

Yeah, exactly. Get her going, like I said, 90 miles down the highway. And then we finally get to Panama City and we pull up to the Marriott and she goes in, and then she's just with her girlfriend at this point, so I don't see anything unusual. She meets the girlfriend at the hotel. They go up to the room. But then I call my boss and I'm like, hey, we're here at the Marriott. You want me to just wait here? And he was like, go ahead and get a room. Get set up. You're chilling there for a while. They're going to be out tonight, so, like, find a good spot to get behind them. And so there's a parking garage, and so I can't really watch their car and be ready to go. So I had to literally wait in the lobby with my dslr just ready.

[Mackenzie]

To, like, explain what a dslr.

[Austin]

Yeah, sorry, sorry. My is my point and shoot camera. Okay, great. Yes.

[Mackenzie]

Splay it like we're five, Austin.

[Austin]

Yeah, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. So I'm. I'm just hanging out. Hanging out in the. In the lobby with my camera. And meanwhile, this lady is, like, asking me what I do for a living. I. Because I have my camera with me, and I'm like, yeah, I'm a photographer. And she's like, trying to book an appointment with me. And I'm like, I'm here for another.

[Hannah]

Reason I don't do that. So that style of portrait, different kind of photography.

[Mackenzie]

I do self photography, self portraits.

[Austin]

So six hours later, they come down the elevator.

[Hannah]

Wait, you're sitting in the lobby for six hours? Does anybody say, like, bro, what are you doing?

[Austin]

No, no, just the lady trying to get me to take pictures of her.

[Mackenzie]

If you act like you belong there, nobody bothers you.

[Austin]

Yeah, they might. They might be like, this guy's been here for a while, but yeah, not a big deal.

[Hannah]

Just bring a book or something.

[Austin]

Yeah. So they come down the elevator and then the two ladies walk out. And sure enough, two dudes come out. Now it's two ladies and their boyfriends, both here. And we make our way to the car and they get it. They all get in their one car and we make our way down to Harpoon Harry's, which is like a restaurant in Panama City.

[Mackenzie]

Oh, wait. I have a question.

[Austin]

Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

When you're at the hotel, are you. So oftentimes it's not as easy as you guys think? Like, they got in the car and I got in my car. Usually you're parked different. He had another investigator. Is that why you were able to do. To follow them successfully?

[Austin]

Yeah. So when we got there, he went in the lobby and made sure that they didn't leave or like immediately go somewhere. And I went around the parking garage and got their vehicle information, and I parked near her car. But it's kind of risky, like you're saying, like, so they, they met the guys there and she met her girlfriend there. So that's potentially three different cars that we have to follow now.

[Mackenzie]

And you have no idea what's going to happen, so go home.

[Austin]

I have no idea. Yeah, so I have to follow them out of the hotel and get them to the car. And my car has to be close enough so that I can, like, run over there and get behind them. Yeah. So.

[Mackenzie]

But it works hard. It's hard.

[Austin]

Yeah. So. So I just risked it. The only vehicle that I knew was hers, and so I parked near hers and luckily they all piled in her car, which is a like, cherry red Porsche Cayenne. So really easy to keep track of.

[Mackenzie]

Wow. Okay.

[Hannah]

Yeah. Okay, good. You don't miss that one.

[Austin]

Really easy to keep track of. But like I said, she goes fast in that thing.

[Hannah]

She probably has really high insurance.

[Austin]

Yeah, she probably does.

[Hannah]

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[Austin]

So they all pile in her car and we make our way down to this, like, it's a big shopping center in Panama City. And then like, the Harpoon Harry's is right there. So we park by the Harpoon Harry's and they all make their way in. And typically I would go in and eat dinner with them and watch and see what they're doing, take pictures and stuff. But for some reason I just felt like I should probably stay out in the parking lot. And so I stayed out because it's like a really big.

[Hannah]

Describe that.

[Mackenzie]

That's a decision you have to make in the moment when you're like, okay, what are my surroundings? And you have like all these thoughts going through your head, like, what do I do? Should I go in or stay out? And you have to decide that right then.

[Austin]

Yeah, well, so part of it is like, it's super busy. It's Memorial Day weekend, so there's everyone and their mom here, and I barely found a parking spot. And I. I don't know, I just felt like it's going to be really complicated to get in there and get good video when I know I can get good video of them at the car. Like, I've got a great viewpoint and I know I'll get good video that way. And that's part of the deliverable. You want to make sure they have good video to watch because if not, it's just me writing a report. It's just words on a page. So I get out there and it's maybe like 8 o' clock at night. And so they're going in and eating dinner. It's already starting to get dark. And I wait until about 1130, 1145, and all of a sudden I see my girl and her boyfriend walk out of Harpoon Harry's and start walking to their car, and they are just sloppy drunk at this point. Yeah, at this point.

[Hannah]

Have you gotten any visuals of them being, like, smoochy, smoochy or not quite?

[Austin]

I got, like, his arm around her waist, and that was about it, because all I saw was them going to the car at the hotel and then coming back out at Harpoon Harry's. So it's not much action at this point, but we're about to get some. Yeah.

[Hannah]

Oh, boy.

[Austin]

So they start walking out to the car.

[Hannah]

Yeah, you're muffs.

[Austin]

Yeah. Yeah. Seriously, if there are kids listening, definitely hide the kids for this one. So they. They walk out from Harpoon Harry's and they go to her car, which is directly under a street light. And, like, across the parking lot, towards the back of the parking lot, they go over and they open the trunk, and he lifts her up like Prince Charming, and they literally just get after it right in the middle of this parking lot.

[Mackenzie]

On the car.

[Austin]

On the car. Like, oh, boy. The car is just open. You can see everything. Yeah.

[Hannah]

Wait, I'm not going to ask you for, like, but I'm going to ask.

[Mackenzie]

You for the height of those.

[Hannah]

The highlights. Like, are we talking running the bases here? Are we talking just.

[Austin]

We're talking home run with this. Yeah, yeah. And, like, with the door open, Shelby's wearing a skirt. He. Yeah, there's. And they're. Keep in mind, they're really drunk, so you can see a lot. Like, a lot is happening. And they're not, like, great at concealing. Yeah.

[Hannah]

So they're breaking the law, too, as well as getting caught.

[Austin]

Oh, yeah. Yeah.

[Hannah]

Oh, my God. Melissa. Okay.

[Austin]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Okay.

[Austin]

Which, I mean, in one sense, it's like, okay, that's really, really sad that I'm gonna have to break the news to this client that way, that now you've got video of your wife being intimate with another man. And on the other hand, it's like you've got the best evidence you could possibly hope for in this case to take into court. Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Austin]

There's no getting out of this one.

[Mackenzie]

Okay, so just to be clear, they were in the Porsche, and he was.

[Hannah]

With the trunk wide open.

[Austin]

Yeah, yeah. Like, she's spread eagle. Everything's going on. At first it was far away, so I was like, is that what's happening? And you know my super zoom. And I'm like, wow, that is what's happening right now.

[Mackenzie]

Like, our cameras zoom in. Like, it's like a 90 times zoom. Okay. And these and by the way, you said it was a Porsche Cayenne, right?

[Austin]

Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

So these Cayennes are like, it's. It's a little suv. And so when you have that hatch open, like, you know, you open a hatch, like maybe change a baby's diaper. So I imagine that she's laid down.

[Austin]

Yeah, yeah.

[Hannah]

And no one walked by. We didn't have any close calls.

[Austin]

That's what I'm saying. There were. There were probably 300 cars in this parking lot, and not one person walked by. And they're under this street light. And I mean, that might have been why they didn't walk by.

[Hannah]

That is crazy.

[Austin]

Because they see.

[Hannah]

Yeah. Maybe people were like, let's go the back way.

[Austin]

Yeah, I'll just walk this way.

[Hannah]

Nah, that's wild. I mean, they lucked out, except for the fact that you were videoing the whole thing.

[Austin]

Right.

[Hannah]

So they thought they got away with it. Mackenzie has also shared some stories with some similar themes. How do you feel filming it? Are you like, this is so creepy, or are you like, this is the job? I'm not, you know, like a doctor take isn't looking at it in a creepy way. You know what I mean? Like, it's your job.

[Austin]

Yeah. Mackenzie, what would. What would you say to that?

[Mackenzie]

Well, so listen. If you. Listen, if you out here in front of God and everybody showing you junk, then you don't have any concerns? I don't have any concerns. And can nobody say, oh, they're privacy. There's no expectation of privacy. Privacy.

[Hannah]

Public.

[Mackenzie]

Exactly. Now, if you got. If you pull the blinds closed and there's like an inch that. Where the blinds aren't touching, then obviously it's like, you know what they clearly wanted or attempted to conceal what they were doing it personally. For me, I'm someone who I will always air on the side of ethical, so I wouldn't pursue that. But if you're out here, we're gonna videotape it and there's. What do you want me to do? I. I don't know what to tell you. My client's probably a grown up. So you gonna get grown up video.

[Austin]

I would agree with that.

[Hannah]

Like, you're like, say less.

[Austin]

Yeah, it's.

[Mackenzie]

If I can see it from a public viewpoint, a public vantage point, then I can see it. Sorry. That's what my video is going to see.

[Austin]

Not only from like an infidelity standpoint, but also like consideration of other people that are eating at this restaurant.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Oh, my God. Yeah.

[Austin]

Yeah. So I'm like, I'm filming that all day long.

[Hannah]

Yeah, you're doing. You're doing a civil service. Yeah, for all of us.

[Austin]

Exactly.

[Mackenzie]

Sorry. I mean, I'm not gonna, like, zoom in to this giblets and like, be like, oh, you. I don't. You don't need to see the P and the V. Like, you could see what's happening without zooming in. But you know what I mean?

[Hannah]

What do you say? If the cars are rocking, don't come and knock it. Yeah, yeah. All right. Got it. Thank you for phrasing, taking us into the mind of the. The PIs on the case, because we're all curious. Because I would be like. I probably wouldn't be able to keep. Like, I'd be like, ah, no. Like, I get caught. I'd get busted.

[Austin]

I would say, like, the first time you film something like that, it is weird because.

[Mackenzie]

Did you feel like a creep?

[Austin]

Yeah. Yeah. It's like I'm. I'm sitting in my vehicle purposefully capturing this. And yeah, it's weird, but at the same time, like, you have a responsibility. That client hired you to find that.

[Mackenzie]

And also, it can be embarrassing, like, if they see it in court. But listen, you big enough to get in it, you better be big enough to get out of it. This ain't my problem. You the one that's out here throwing your willy nilly all around.

[Austin]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

My parents always said, everything you do, imagine it's on the front page of the newspaper.

[Austin]

Exactly.

[Hannah]

Gave me a bit of a complex. And now I'm in the entertainment industry. But that is another story. It's true. Okay, so you're catching them doing the dirty.

[Austin]

Yeah. So they. They do their whole thing. They hit their home run and they seal the deal and close up the. The Cayenne again. Make their way back into Harpoon Harry's.

[Hannah]

You're kidding me.

[Austin]

No, no.

[Mackenzie]

That they wash their hands. Good Lord.

[Austin]

Well, and here's my thing is, like, they went there as two couples. So what did they tell the other couple they were doing? They're staying at a hotel together. Like, why do you have to do it at the parking lot?

[Mackenzie]

Gross.

[Austin]

That's the part that always kind of confused me. So they go back in there. Yeah. And they. They meet their couple friend. They hang out for, like, another two hours or so and then make their way back out to the car. All four of them, sloppy drunk. All four of them. And the. Not my girl's guy, but the other guy got in the driver's seat and was driving.

[Hannah]

Oh, I Don't like that. Yeah, I don't like that at all.

[Austin]

Yeah, like, definitely no Uber or anything like that. But they. They got back in the car and I get behind them and we're in like a 45 or 50 mile an hour zone, like, at all times. And they're going like 30 miles an hour all over the road. Like, you can tell they are just.

[Mackenzie]

Oh, my God.

[Hannah]

Oh, God. So are you nervous? Like, is there any part of y' all that is thinking you need to call somebody or, like, Austin, at what.

[Mackenzie]

Point would you call the law for. For a matter of public safety, for instance?

[Austin]

Well, so it was different for me back then because I was working for a firm. So I called my boss and I was like, they're going to kill somebody. What do you want me to do? And he's like, until you see them really get into something that's. That's pretty close, don't call. But then pretty soon after that, they almost hit somebody, and he was like, okay, call the police. And so I called the police and they stopped them on the way back to the hotel. But then they were in the hotel the next day because I had to. I had to, like, watch them again. Yeah. So.

[Hannah]

Okay.

[Austin]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Well, you did what you could. All right. That's not fun.

[Austin]

Yeah. So followed them back to the hotel, and I did wash a little bit that night, basically. What did you, like? I. I stayed in the hotel lobby is what I mean. Oh, yeah, yeah. So they basically went back.

[Hannah]

Don't put it past them. They do it in the parking lot. They might as well do it in the lobby, too.

[Austin]

That's true. There might be something going on in that pool. But they went back up to their hotel rooms and stayed in there all night. From what I could tell, like, I didn't see them come out at all. And after that, I waited down. The next morning, they said their goodbyes, got a few kisses in, and then they headed back home. So it was like a really short rendezvous at the beach.

[Andrea]

But yeah, hold on, I got.

[Mackenzie]

Hold on. I got so many questions. Was there any information that you were able to obtain about the dudes?

[Hannah]

Oh, good question.

[Austin]

Oh, that's mainly. I found out that he lived in a different city closer to the beach where we were at. But as far as, like, employer or anything like that.

[Mackenzie]

No, I mean, like, like, was it. Did he. Like you said, one of the guys had a car.

[Austin]

Yeah, they had a car there.

[Mackenzie]

Did you get the tag number or anything or trace it back or do the thing?

[Austin]

Yeah. So I got. I got the tags on. Everybody was there and, like, was able to identify them. The only real kicker out of that was the client knew the guy she was cheating with.

[Hannah]

Oh, how? How?

[Austin]

He was like, a family friend of hers. So he had met him a couple of times, and they didn't work together or anything like that. But. But he definitely knew of him and had heard of him. He didn't suspect him. I remember. He specifically did not. He didn't know who she was cheating with. But then, sure enough, like, that was the guy.

[Mackenzie]

Now, at what point do you decide, like, who the hell is this guy? I want to know more. Like, when do you decide to do more digging and let it go? Because me, I'm not letting it go. I want to know who his mama is. What color pant is she wearing? I want to know everything he married, what's his story?

[Austin]

Yeah, so typically I. I'm letting them know that. And I might do a little bit of, like, cursory social media research to see if I see anything public online. But if. If they're not asking the question of who this is, I don't usually go too much further because Austin said, I.

[Mackenzie]

Ain'T getting paid for it.

[Hannah]

I ain't me.

[Mackenzie]

I'm like, I will not sleep in until I know. That's funny.

[Austin]

And I. I do wish I was more like that sometimes, because it's like, that can be really helpful to the client, but in reality, it's. It's like, if I don't know that it's going to help the client, I. I usually don't spend my time delving down into that. That area.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah, that is so interesting, because that's. I am totally the opposite. I will tell the entire store. Like, I will. I will not stop at just what the client wanted. Like, we gonna know more.

[Hannah]

I feel like getting the information, but if I was the client, there's a world in which I'd be like, don't tell me anymore.

[Mackenzie]

Like, I don't want to know 100%.

[Hannah]

All I need to know is that she was cheating. But it depends on. On what's good for their blood pressure.

[Austin]

And I think that might be part of my history working with attorneys, because a lot of times if the attorney has not asked for it, they do not want to know. It's not just like, they're not going to pay you for it. It's also like, I specifically did not ask for that, and I didn't want to know that. So, yeah, it's a tightrope yeah.

[Mackenzie]

But also I find and tell me if you have experiences. Also some. The clients don't know what they don't know. And so when you share more, they're like, that explains so much. Or that opens a whole other. Or that helps me. Whatever.

[Austin]

Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

But I wonder if that's the difference between males versus female investigators. Like, guys are so simple. Like, guys are like. You're like, hey, I saw my. I saw my friend today. And you're like, oh, what's going on with him? Oh, he's getting divorced.

[Austin]

Oh, why?

[Mackenzie]

I don't know.

[Hannah]

I don't know.

[Austin]

I didn't ask what.

[Andrea]

Like.

[Mackenzie]

And so I wonder if that's also, like, a difference between guys and girls as far as investigation goes. Like, that's so. It's so interesting how there's so many different, like, perspectives on it.

[Hannah]

And also guys and girls, as far as being a client.

[Austin]

Yeah, definitely. Yeah. Yeah. Like, as far as investigators go, I always say, like, women have it, like, baked in. Like, you guys are just true.

[Mackenzie]

It's true. Yes.

[Hannah]

Trust your femme tuition. We say it's because you have to. Unfortunately, like, I think we're in a world where we have to have our head on a swivel a little bit. A little bit more.

[Andrea]

Not.

[Hannah]

Not entirely.

[Mackenzie]

But when a lot of guys, when they say, oh, my ex is psycho. She ain't. She ain't psycho. She was just smart enough to find out the information that you.

[Austin]

Yeah, she's an investigator. Yeah.

[Hannah]

God forbid. We love a little journalism every now and then.

[Mackenzie]

Okay, so you. You finish the surveillance, you go to the hu. You obviously take this back to this hub to the husband. Did you take it back that day or what happened when you.

[Hannah]

Yeah. How do you decide how to share bad news? Yeah, so I always wonder about that.

[Austin]

So practically, no, I don't tell anybody anything. Same day. Because that's like a security issue on my part. I'm not going to tell them. Yeah. I'm not going to tell them where I'm at. I'm not going to tell them what's happening. I don't. Like you were saying, their blood pressure. I don't want them getting heated in any type of way until I know that, number one, I'm back where they're not going to be around me. And number two, the person I'm watching, I don't know where they are. So I can't even share that information. So I took it back maybe two days later, and I said, like, hey, man, here's a full report. Here's what happened. And it was. It was kind of sad. Like he just kind of resigned himself to the facts of the case.

[Hannah]

Did you do it in, like, in person, in public? How do you have these meetings?

[Austin]

Typically, if I can, I'd like to do it in person, but logistically, a lot of times I can't. Like, he was out of state at that time, so I couldn't.

[Andrea]

Oh.

[Austin]

Oh, yeah. I couldn't even share it with him in person.

[Mackenzie]

Everybody wants to do everything virtually now because it's so accessible too.

[Austin]

Yeah, yeah. So I shared it with him over the phone and you could just hear that he was. He knew what was happening and he was really sad about it, but at the same time, like, he was not surprised. Yeah.

[Hannah]

And you did tell him the identity of the. Of the, you know, their boyfriend, the fella?

[Austin]

Yeah. Oh, yeah, definitely.

[Mackenzie]

The Willy Nilly fella.

[Austin]

Yeah. And at that point, I hadn't done too much as far as, like, looking into him, looking into the other guy. But. But I. I told him, like, do you want me to look into this person? He's like, I know who that is. Like, yeah.

[Hannah]

Oh, God. And so do you email him all the videos? Like, that's the way you do it. You just say like, I sent you a file.

[Austin]

It's. It's either I send it to him or I send it to his lawyer. And in that case, I sent all the videos to his lawyer because he didn't want to see him. He said, yeah. So he saw the report. Yeah. With all the pictures, but he didn't see the details.

[Mackenzie]

Do you know what happened with the case after that? Like, do you have any details? I normally don't know. They don't. I don't ever. I'm never privy to that crap. People want. They're like, well, so what happened? I'm like, I have no idea. Not my problem.

[Austin]

After that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Once it's all said and done, they don't want to talk to me anymore. Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

They write you a check and you are gone. Like, there is. I'm not lying when I say you don't get closure. Like, they're like, okay, thanks, here's your check by.

[Austin]

Yeah, yeah. Exactly.

[Hannah]

How do you deal with that?

[Mackenzie]

Yeah, how do you deal with that? Do you have. Do you struggle with closure or you're just like, no, I don't care. I don't get paid.

[Austin]

No, it's not that I don't care. It's just that the reality of it is they're not going to share it with me. And so I kind of just resign myself not to know. And usually I'm on the next thing anyways. Would I like to know? Of course. Because some of my clients, I really like them, they're cool people. I want to know what's going on in their life, but at the end of the day they're not gonna call me up and share it with me. Yeah.

[Hannah]

And are you able to like, look at their Instagram? Like there's no law against that, is there? Maybe ethically, but yeah, I can.

[Austin]

Yeah. Typically I don't. But I, I like, I respect that. Yeah. I think I try not to get too emotionally evolved, especially with these criminal cases. Because like, so there was a criminal case a while ago that I was working and is this 15 year old kid and he had, he had been arrested for indecent liberties. And indecent liberties is basically when it was indecent liberties with a child, where you are sexually harassing a child or touching them inappropriately. And so.

[Hannah]

Oh God.

[Austin]

Yeah. It's obviously one of those cases that are, they're just disgusting. But at the same time, this kid, he's 15 years old, he was abused himself. He was like, he came to America for more opportunities and then he was deported. And so like, you know, you, you get too emotionally evolved in these cases. And like once he's deported, I haven't heard from him since and it's been like five or six years. So if you get too involved in that, it's like it kind of tears you apart after a while. You don't really want to keep getting involved in that kind of stuff.

[Hannah]

Have you ever had a client bust in when they shouldn't have when you're on surveillance?

[Mackenzie]

I know, yeah. Have you? Because that's a bullshit.

[Austin]

I've got another story. This is a juicy one. Okay, so this, this one drives me nuts. Basically, we got hired to follow this guy and his wife thought that he was going and picking up prostitutes at. Yeah. Which is like, oh man. But she thought he was picking up prostitutes and taking them to. He was a business owner and he was really close to the highway where all the hotels were. And so he would go over there pretty regularly for work and she thought that he was picking up prostitutes and going to those hotels. And so we followed him for like maybe two weeks and we saw nothing. Like he never went to one of those hotels. He never showed any kind of inclination.

[Hannah]

To do that kind of thing.

[Austin]

Yeah, yeah. Except he was just going to work, he was doing his thing and yeah, he worked a lot, but he was at work. So she called me, like, intermittently. And you can tell she's. Her level of frustration is just getting more and more and more. And one day she calls me and is just livid, super frustrated that I have not caught him. And I'm like, I can't make him do something. Like, I'm sorry, but he's just like.

[Hannah]

Do you want it to be true? Yeah, she wanted him to get. Be doing that.

[Austin]

Exactly. And so she. She's talking to me, and she's screaming at me. Then all of a sudden, she puts her husband on the phone.

[Hannah]

What?

[Austin]

Yeah. I'm like, what the heck are you doing? And so he's. He's talking to me like, hey, man, I heard you've been following me. And, like, I ain't cheating on my wife. And. And I'm just like, what?

[Hannah]

Why would she do that? Was she saying, like, hey, talk to him and ask him. He'll tell you. He's been doing this the whole, like, what does she think?

[Austin]

I have no idea what the goal was because that was the last time I ever spoke to her, because.

[Mackenzie]

Oh, my God.

[Austin]

Because, like, okay, number one, you just ruined everything. Like, he's. We're not gonna catch him now.

[Hannah]

He's not gonna do it now. Yeah.

[Austin]

And number two, you're putting both me and you in danger.

[Andrea]

Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

This is a liability.

[Austin]

Don't ever tell somebody you hired a private investigator unless you were like, clear out of there and don't tell him my name. Why would you do that?

[Hannah]

Oh, my goodness. That's awful. So did you get paid?

[Andrea]

I hope you got paid.

[Austin]

Oh, yeah, we take it up front.

[Hannah]

Great. Good. Because, like, that's crazy. And also, you should be able to, like, step back from any mission at any point that it gets bad.

[Austin]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

But I'm sure that's, like, part of your agreement.

[Austin]

It is. Definitely.

[Andrea]

Y' all.

[Hannah]

If you hire a PI, don't intervene. Let them. They know what they're doing. Let them do their thing. Let them do their job.

[Mackenzie]

Honestly, I've had. They. They. I have had several cases where the client comes busting in like, the damn Kool Aid, man. And you're like, get the fuck out. I'm driving a feel. Like, I got this, and they do not care. Like, they're just like, I don't care. I told you. I told you that I would bust you, and I caught you. And now you're in the middle, and you're like, oh, my. You're embarrassed that everybody's in bear. It's wild. And then now if this person finds out who you are and you're like, oh, my God. That's why I. Another thing I do is I make it a point not to update in real time as much as possible. There's some clients where I'm feel. I feel comfortable with it. I won't update in real time. Like, I'll be like, he. She's with the guy right now. Like, I won't.

[Andrea]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Because then they'll. They'll try to find it, especially if it's somewhere like you were following this guy at his workplace. Like, they know where that is. It's not like you're at a random place. They couldn't meet you.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah, that. I. Not. I don't. I don't. I'm not interested. Like, I know. You can wait. I'll let you know what I find out.

[Austin]

Yeah. I do not want to see you guys fight or, like, get into it right in front of me. I'm gonna tell you tomorrow what happened today. Yeah.

[Hannah]

What's one thing that people often forget to hide? If they're trying to hide an affair or cover up a crime or something that you guys notice people don't realize maybe is public.

[Mackenzie]

They. Their social media status. They're like.

[Hannah]

They're.

[Mackenzie]

They tried. You got to put it on private, dude. Because we could see everything that. And people forget. Like, they'll be. We can see who liked it. We can look them up. Like, you need to. You got to get on lockdown.

[Hannah]

It's crazy to me that people don't realize that I'm, like, so hyper aware of that.

[Austin]

Yeah. The amount of. The amount of things that people put online is insane. It's wild.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Austin]

Like, so I had a murder case a few years ago, and it was basically, we. We did so much social media on this murder case, and they just had, like, pictures of them selling drugs on social media, posting with guns, saying, like, I'm going to murder this person on social media. All that kind of stuff. I mean, it's ridiculous.

[Mackenzie]

Stupid. It's so dumb. They implicate themselves. It's ridiculous.

[Austin]

Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

Austin, have you ever gotten busted following someone to the point where they've, like, threatened you? Have you ever been in danger? These are questions that I get a lot, so I want to mention you, too.

[Austin]

Yeah. Oh, I definitely get these questions a lot, but I've been busted before, but I've never felt like I was in danger from that. So there was this one time where I was following someone And I had just started following. This is my first time ever following them. I got the case like the day before and so I hop behind them and within like 10 minutes they know I'm back there. And I'm like very confused because I'm like 500 yards back. There's no way that they actually should know that I'm following them. And it turns out that the client didn't tell us that they had hired two PIs before us.

[Mackenzie]

Every time I get busted, it's because they did not tell me there was another investigator that was already on the case every time.

[Hannah]

So they're already looking for everybody.

[Mackenzie]

And that investigator got busted, which is why you're there now.

[Austin]

Yeah. And when you're looking, it's not hard to tell if you're being followed. Like, it's not like I'm not invisible. So like you, you will see me. But in reality most people just aren't looking and that's why it's effective. But yeah, if they're already looking, then yeah, for sure you're going to get caught.

[Hannah]

So did they? What did they do?

[Austin]

So that time they, they pulled some like crazy evasive maneuvers and was like they were going around all these medians in the road, like breaking all kinds of traffic laws. And so I'm like, okay, obviously they know I'm back here and at that point I'm not staying with them because there's nothing to be gained. Yeah. So I just go home. Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

Well, at that point they can also, if once you get busted by a subject, they can actually say you're harassing them. Because if you're chasing them and they know you're there, you're not doing a discreet investigation. Now you're just harassing them. Like now you're just following them. So you cross that line.

[Austin]

Exactly. Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

So you've never been in like any threat of real danger or violence or anything?

[Austin]

No, I have PIs that I've worked with that have been in some real nasty scenarios.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah, it's bad.

[Austin]

Like, so one of the first times I ever was training with anyone to be a private investigator, the guy I was training with, he was a 30 year veteran and he's telling me these stories and he told me one where he's following this guy on a worker's comp case and the guy figure figures out that he's back there, tries to trap him in a cul de sac. And my PI friend gets away from and then the guy pulls out a gun and starts shooting at his car. And Shoots.

[Mackenzie]

At least he pulls the trigger.

[Austin]

Yeah. Yeah. He literally. Yeah. So he shot out his back window. And so my PI friend pulls out his gun and shoots the guy's tire out. Like, that is some serious skill to be able to shoot somebody's tire while you're driving. Yeah.

[Hannah]

Oh, my. But the guy was in the car.

[Austin]

Yeah. Yeah, they were both driving, like, down the highway.

[Hannah]

That's like some fast and furious James Bond.

[Austin]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

That's scary. I'm glad to hear that. That's not, like, a typical Tuesday for y' all, because it's not.

[Mackenzie]

It. It happens. It's not horrifying. I don't think it's normal.

[Austin]

Yeah. Yeah. I don't think. Really? I don't think PIs getting caught super often is normal, but in reality, yeah, it does happen.

[Hannah]

Is there anything we didn't ask you that you want to share with people about your experience?

[Mackenzie]

Oh, I have a question. Sorry, you guys. I'm sorry.

[Hannah]

Do not apologize. I love the questions.

[Mackenzie]

So there are times for, like, when you have to pretext and kind of use some information that may or may not be true to get information that you need.

[Austin]

Oh, yeah.

[Mackenzie]

What. What are some pretexts that you use to get information? Like, have you ever had to pretend to be something totally crazy to get information?

[Austin]

Oh, yeah.

[Mackenzie]

Did it. Did it work?

[Hannah]

Social engineering. I've heard this term from MacKenzie.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah, social engineering.

[Austin]

So it's less the social. Social engineering aspect that I've used, but most of the time, it's like, I'm going to someone's door as a. Like, an appliance maintenance guy, and I'm trying to see if. If someone is in the house. And so I show up with a clipboard. I knock on the door. I've got, like, just a nondescript polo on, and I'm like, hey, I'm. I'm looking for wrong apartment number or this person, and I just want to see who comes to the door. That's all I'm looking for.

[Hannah]

Yes.

[Austin]

And they'll tell you, oh, this is 304B. Like, you're at the wrong apartment. And I'm like, okay, thank you.

[Mackenzie]

And, like, sometimes they. You're sitting on surveillance for so long, and you're like, is anybody even there? And you have to knock on the door and be like, okay, let's get it. Let's get a feel. But you don't want to do that too soon because you don't want to burn your face, which means you don't want them to see your Face if it's not necessary, because then you might have to follow them and then they'll see you again.

[Austin]

Exactly. Or I might just, like, order them a pizza and see who comes to the door then. And what is golden is, like, there have been a couple of times where you order them a pizza and the boyfriend, like, the guy she's cheating with comes to the door and you can see her on the bed behind him or whatever.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Austin]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Oh, my gosh. That's. I mean, if you're gonna get caught, at least you get a free pizza out of it.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah, right?

[Austin]

Exactly.

[Hannah]

Wild.

[Mackenzie]

Oh, my God. Oh, my gosh. This was so fun.

[Hannah]

Do you want to plug your. Where people can find you if they want to hear more about PI stories?

[Austin]

Sure. Yeah. So I tell a lot of PI stories on Instagram, and it's at austinthepi.

[Hannah]

Great.

[Mackenzie]

Go follow Austin on the Instagrams, because.

[Hannah]

I know everybody here loves. Loves the PI stories.

[Mackenzie]

A lot of them through that.

[Hannah]

So, yeah, if you need more. Also, a couple people have been messaging us. They're like, we're caught up. Up on all the episodes. What do we do? And it's like, okay, there's other places.

[Mackenzie]

Surveillance. So funny. Thank you so much, Austin. I appreciate you so much.

[Austin]

Yeah, of course, guys, thank you so much for having me. If you do want to do the. The Patreon follow up, I'm down. Let's do it.

[Mackenzie]

It'd be fun. I think we'll have so many questions. I'm so curious what kind of questions everybody has. So, yeah, we'll. We'll be in touch with you. Thank you again, so, so much for.

[Hannah]

To meet you guys. Nice to meet you.

[Mackenzie]

Thank you.

[Austin]

Have a good rest of your day.

[Mackenzie]

Thanks, Austin. Bye. That was such. How fun was that? Oh, my God.

[Andrea]

I love talking to him.

[Mackenzie]

I have so many questions. It's so cool to hear from other PIs.

[Andrea]

I love. Oh, my God. No. And at one point you were like, sorry, I'm getting so excited. And I was like, no, I'm just sitting here with popcorn like, I'm learning so much.

[Mackenzie]

Like a child.

[Andrea]

Half of us are like, in another life, we would want to be PIs.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Andrea]

And might be too late for us. Might just not be the. Not be. Be the thing for us in this lifetime. So we get to live through you and we get to sit in parking lots and hear about the weird stuff that goes on there.

[Mackenzie]

We. The weirdest things happen in parking lots.

[Andrea]

Were you surprised at all when he was like. And then they just started Doing the whole shebang. You were like, well, that's what I.

[Mackenzie]

Was saying was that, like, when you do surveillance for so long, like, I've been at this 20 years. So if someone does something in a parking lot, I'm like, okay, yeah, just another day. Dum dee dum. Like, it's nothing to me. And that's why people are like, tell your stories. That's why it took me 20 years to tell my stories, because I always thought they were dumb. I was like, nobody's.

[Andrea]

You haven't seen people like, this is.

[Mackenzie]

Every day for you in a parking lot. Yeah. And it's interesting to hear someone else's point of view.

[Andrea]

I also think, you know how like. Like therapists. So there. You have to find the right fit for you. People don't think about that with PIs, but it makes sense, certain things. It might be better to have a woman. It might be better to have a different specialty, or it might just be better to have, like, somebody that vibes with you in a certain way.

[Mackenzie]

And there's certain areas, like VH1, I think, or no bet or VH1 had reached out to me. They wanted me to do one of their. Their reality TV shows. They wanted me to be the PI, but their demographic was a black community, and so they were going into black nightclubs.

[Andrea]

And I was like, you're like, I might stand out.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah. So I was recommending to them, like, different black PIs that I know. You know, there's different ways to integrate different people just because you want to blend in. So I think it's really cool, and I'm excited to hear from other PIs in the future.

[Andrea]

I can't wait. I want to hear if you guys think that we should talk to more PIs, and also if you want more PI stories, obviously dating or are down for some that are not specifically dating, because I think they're all interesting. And also just I learned from a lot.

[Austin]

He.

[Andrea]

I wrote down PIM eyes, P, I, M, E, Y E S. And then cyberbackgroundchecks.com were two resources I wrote down. I'm gonna ask every single PI that comes on, what are your dating tips?

[Mackenzie]

Yep.

[Andrea]

Because we all need them. And I. Whether or not they're talking about dating, I think that'll be helpful. But, yeah, let us know. And then if you have a story or you are a private investigator or you just want to vent about a breakup, we're fine with it. Send us an email.

[Mackenzie]

Absolutely.

[Andrea]

We want. What's the email? Girl?

[Mackenzie]

The email address is [e-mail] Send us your stories. We'd love to have you.

[Andrea]

If you have ever seen anyone doing the nasty in a parking lot, I'm curious about that.

[Mackenzie]

Did that surprise? I wouldn't know if that surprised anybody or if they were like, yeah, it happens now. Like, I'm not surprised.

[Andrea]

They were, like, making out. I am surprised that JJ oh, willy nilly just.

[Mackenzie]

Oh, my God.

[Andrea]

She's just like, oh, God. I don't know. That doesn't even sound that fun. I'd be depressed. I'd be like, someone's gonna walk by.

[Mackenzie]

It would give me so much anxiety, for sure.

[Andrea]

I don't know. Okay. Anyway. And she has two kids anyway. At least close the trunk. Like, just close the trunk.

[Mackenzie]

Get up in there and close it.

[Andrea]

Patreon. $5 a month for all kinds of fun things. $9 a month for all those things, plus ad free. And then this Thursday is book club. You get access if you join Patreon. And we read the Mother Next Door by Andrea Dunlop, which is about Munchausen by Proxy. And it's really interesting because Andrea, who's been on the show, has a lot of personal experience with Munchausen by Proxy, unfortunately. But she wrote it with a detective who worked on the cases she's talking about who, like, solve them.

[Mackenzie]

Pretty cool.

[Andrea]

It's really cool. And she is joining us, so we'll talk to her over Zoom. So you guys should come Thursday at 6pm Pacific time. And we love you, and we hope you're happy and having a lovely day, and I can't think of anything else.

[Mackenzie]

Go to the social media and tell us what you think about. Yes, the. The new kind of. What would you call, like, our little.

[Andrea]

The Undercover series? Beta two.

[Austin]

It.

[Mackenzie]

Not McKenzie Undercover.

[Hannah]

Yeah.

[Andrea]

Not MacKenzie Undercover.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah. So keep the conversation going. We love you so much.

[Andrea]

Thank you, Austin, for being here.

[Mackenzie]

Absolutely. And as always, trust your fem tuition.

[Austin]

Sam.