Helen Undercover: The Strip Mall Secret

Summary

The Dating Detectives (Dear Media)

Episode: Helen Undercover: The Strip Mall Secret

Release Date: December 29, 2025

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Overview

In this special year-end episode, comedian Hanna Anderson and professional private investigator (PI) Mackenzie Fultz welcome fellow PI Helen, business partner to fan-favorite Ken, for a juicy deep-dive into one of Helen’s most memorable cases: uncovering the real identity and double life of a woman in a long-distance relationship. The trio explores what it’s like to be a woman in the PI world, uncovers the messy truth behind dating app deceptions (“dogfishing”), and shares wild behind-the-scenes stories from the front lines of relationship investigations.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Introducing Helen & The World of Female PIs

• The hosts reflect on the importance of representation in the PI field, noting that being a woman can be both an asset and a challenge in private investigation.
• Helen describes how she got started: a cold email to Ken turned into a partnership and a 5-year PI career sparked by a lifelong love for true crime ([05:02]-[07:04]).
  • Quote – Helen: “I literally just googled LAPIs … cold email Ken … a week later, here we are five years later.” [06:10]
• The conversation touches on licensing requirements (in California: 3,000 hours with a criminal justice degree or 6,000 hours without) and the self-starter nature of the job.

2. Case Recap – The LA ‘Dogfish’ & The Strip Mall Secret

• Client: Out-of-state woman dating an LA local for a year, feeling something "off" in the relationship but unable to put her finger on it.
• Red Flag Moment: At dinner with the subject’s (girlfriend’s) family, a supposed uncle reveals he only owns one business location, contradicting her "multiple locations" tale ([10:46]-[11:17]).
  • Helen: “That’s when the femme-tuition comes in … if she’s lying about this, what else?” [11:18]
• Client’s request: Full spectrum PI work — background check, surveillance, and reality check to see if she’s being deceived.

The Stakeout: Discovering the Truth

• Armed only with the subject’s car model and address, Helen embarks on tricky LA surveillance.
• By luck, Helen spots the BMW leaving the high-rise. After hours of tailing, the PI witnesses:
  • The subject entering a massage parlor in a strip mall — suspicious, considering her supposed managerial day job ([13:20]-[15:06]).
  • The parlor is listed on "Rub Maps," a directory for illicit massage locations. Helen witnesses a string of male clients, cash transactions, and one especially memorable moment: a plumber, post-visit, using baby wipes to clean himself in the parking lot.
    • Quote – Helen: “He pulls out his schlong and starts cleaning it … all 9:30 in the morning.” [16:44]
• Helen confirms the subject’s number is registered to an escort website, solidifying suspicions ([21:10]).

Telling the Client

• The PI delivers a detailed, factual report (not interpretive, just observations).
  • Helen: “I don’t make assumptions … I just give the facts. Eight men in two hours, all with cash.” ([24:22])
• The client, originally planning to move to LA and uproot her life, decides to break things off … momentarily. Helen, following the subject on Instagram, later spots the couple together at a Bad Bunny concert — proving that knowing the truth doesn’t always mean a clean break ([26:12]-[27:27]).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Downtown LA, but a high rise … good luck.” – Helen on the challenges of urban surveillance [13:20]
• “The first thing we did was Google her number, and it came up to an escort page … step one, Google who you’re dating.” – Helen on due diligence ([21:10])
• “I have burner Instagrams. I need the tea.” – Helen, on keeping tabs even after cases wrap [22:02]
• “You see the ugliest parts of people … when they don’t know they’re being watched.” – Helen, on human nature ([30:16])
• “Everybody lies.” – Both Mackenzie and Helen, summarizing a hard lesson from PI work ([43:18])

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Important Segments with Timestamps

• Helen’s PI origin story: [05:02]–[07:04]
• Explanation of PI licensing and requirements: [07:04]–[08:17]
• Start of LA dogfish case: [10:02]
• First red flag/family dinner: [11:00]–[11:26]
• Surveillance logistics in Downtown LA: [12:29]–[13:33]
• Massage parlor discovery / Rub Maps reveal: [15:06]–[16:44]
• Parking lot post-massage antics: [16:44]
• PI advice on client red flags: [35:02]–[36:05]
• Debate: Should you background-check your date? [37:08]–[39:39]
• Women’s superpowers as undercover PIs: [40:36]–[41:55]
• Staying positive & trusting people as PIs: [42:23]–[44:14]
• PI advice for dating & meeting people online: [37:08], [44:25]–[45:38]

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Bonus: Quick Fire “Craziest Things Seen in Parking Lots”

• Helen recounts the plumber cleaning himself after a massage parlor visit ([16:44]).
• Mackenzie recalls someone pooping and brushing their teeth outside a Barnes & Noble before heading to an office job ([29:49]).

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Advice for Listeners

From Helen & Mackenzie (Paraphrased):

• “Always Google who you’re dating — check their number, social, everything.”
• “If you’re serious about someone you met online, spend a couple of hundred bucks on a background check. It’s cheaper than moving for the wrong person.”
• “If someone acts offended when asked about a background check, they might have something to hide.”
• “PI work is often solitary and best for self-starters — you have to investigate how to become a PI, just like you’d research a case.”
• “Don’t depend on mutual friends as a guarantee of safety or honesty.”

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Final Reflections

• Even when faced with clear evidence, clients sometimes choose to ignore red flags and continue problematic relationships.
• PIs, especially women, use empathy, intuition, and even traditional gender stereotypes to blend in and gather intel.
• Ultimately, honesty is rare — and in the dating world, caution is more than justified.

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For new and longtime listeners alike, this episode is both a cautionary tale about the perils of modern dating and a fascinating glimpse behind the curtain of modern private investigations — with plenty of wild anecdotes and hard-won advice from professionals who have seen (and heard) it all.

Transcript

[A]

The following program contains names, places, and events that have been anonymized or fictionalized for the purposes of protection and safety. The following program is provided for entertainment purposes only, and any commentary from the hosts are strictly conjecture and should not be held as making any definitive statements about the truth or identity of any particular individuals or circumstances. If you or a loved one are involved in an abusive relationship, please call the National Domestic violence hotline at 1-800-799-7-7-7233 for support.

[B]

Happy Dating Detectives Monday.

[A]

I believe it's the last Dating Detectives Monday of the year.

[B]

Of the whole year. Can you believe it's been almost. What? Almost three years?

[A]

In April, Right? Came out in April three years ago. Wow.

[B]

We're so grateful for you guys. Thank you so much for giving us another amazing year of the Dating Detectives and being part of our community. We love you so much, and we.

[A]

Wanted to end the year with a fun episode. We love PI Undercover episodes. Obviously, Mackenzie Undercover episodes are just have a special place in our heart. And then if you haven't listened, we've had some guest PIs come and share their stories. Ken. Ken is a.

[C]

You guys is a highlight.

[B]

Ken. Oh, my God. Everybody loves Ken so much.

[A]

He's so funny. But a lot of his last episode was talking about how it's, like, so important to be the right PI for a case so that you.

[C]

Because you can do different things if.

[A]

You'Re a man versus a woman, different.

[C]

Races, whatever it is.

[B]

Yes. You have to fit in, you know?

[C]

I mean, you.

[A]

I still think you're the perfect PI because I would truly tell you everything about my life if I met you on the street.

[C]

Like, all you would have to do is.

[A]

You are.

[C]

You're so bubbly.

[A]

I'd be like, here's my Social Security number.

[C]

Do you want to be my best friend?

[D]

That's so funny.

[C]

I love it.

[A]

But we also love Helen, who's another PI and she's here today, and she is Ken's business partner, so they work together.

[B]

I love her.

[C]

I love her, too.

[A]

She's very cool.

[B]

She's so cool. Like, she's so chill. Oh, my gosh. You guys are just gonna love her, and you're gonna love this story so much.

[C]

Well, I loved hearing you both talk about being women in the PI world.

[A]

And this case is fun. Is. Well, it's not fun. You know, there's a dogfish, but it's.

[B]

Still fun to hear. Hear PI stories nonetheless. And also, I want to give a special shout out to our Patreon, thank you so much for joining us on Patreon. We have. We added the nine dollar tier this year.

[C]

The.

[B]

We had the five dollar tier, which is like the, you know, you get the two bonus episodes every month and then you get the. The book club and all the. The live, the chats with me and Hannah and all the things. But then the $9 tier is just like ad free listening to all the episodes and the bonus episode. So that's kind of fun. So please join our Patreon if you want to start next year with the Patreon. We'll put the link in the show notes. And we're so grateful for you listening and for joining the Patreon. Thank you for joining us on these PI journeys and these PI stories and also thank you for supporting our guests.

[A]

And I have one more shout out the thing I texted you about. Oh, yeah, we want to shout out to a listener. Her name is Brittany. And I. I don't even remember when. A couple episodes. Not a couple years ago.

[C]

It's been years.

[A]

At this point. We were talking about dating apps and I said that on Bumble because women have to message first in like with guys.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I sometimes would just say, you may speak now as my opening line because I thought it was funny. It's dumb, but she used it.

[C]

A guy thought it was funny too. And guess what happened this past week?

[D]

They got engaged.

[B]

They got engaged. She said, you may speak now.

[C]

I love that I like this girl.

[A]

I'm just very happy for them. And it kind of was like a crazy.

[C]

It's just crazy that this little podcast, it helps you maybe figure out what.

[A]

Relationships are not good for you.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Or maybe what relationships are good for you.

[A]

You know, my little romantic heart was freaking out. Love is real.

[B]

I love it. I know Hannah was losing her mind for sure because, you know, she's. Well, we both love love, but Hannah especially loves like the romance and the happy ending, so. Yay.

[A]

Thank you for updating us.

[B]

Brittany, Congratulations. Love it.

[C]

What a way to end the year.

[B]

I guess. Shall we get into it because. Well, I'm really excited to hear from Helen. Let's get into it. I know everybody's telling. Shut up. I want to hear the story. Helen. Yay. Hi.

[D]

Hi.

[B]

I'm so excited to have another female, another PI here.

[D]

So exciting. I know.

[B]

We're so glad that you're here.

[C]

Tell us how you know Ken and how he became a PI. Give us the intro.

[D]

So it's kind of hand in hand. I got into the industry by just. I'd always wanted to do it. Growing up, it was kind of my dream, like, always.

[B]

How did you even want to be a P.I.

[C]

How'D you know it was a job?

[D]

I don't know. I. Originally, I got into it. I'm into the true crime. I'm into all that. In sixth grade, I saw 60 Minutes on the Zodiac, and that kind of started.

[B]

Yes, okay.

[D]

The obsession. I guess I thought I'd do forensic psychology, then cross criminal profiling, but I was like, nah. I thought law enforcement, not really fun. As a woman. I'm, like, 5ft tall, so I'm like, I'm not gonna be able to do much. My mom nearly had a heart attack when I was like, I'm gonna go into law enforcement.

[C]

She was like, please don't.

[D]

Please don't, and was like, maybe I'll go private sector. So I went to school, I went to college, got my criminal justice degree. After that, I did the family business, and then Covid hit, and we shut down the business. And my partner was like, you should try to do the PI thing now. And I, like, couldn't rip the band aid off. I just didn't know where to start. It's kind of like everyone's like, you don't know where to start. She's like, cold email someone. Yep, cold email Ken. No one and only guy. And then I think we met, like, a week later. I literally just googled Lapi.

[B]

That's not how normal math works. Just letting y' all know that is not. You have to give your number to 100 dudes in a bar if you want one of them to call you. This one's like, I just called him, and he just hired me as fast.

[D]

I thought, like, a man of all people's not gonna hire me. Like, who am I? At the time, I was like, in my mid-20s, you know, I'm like, they're not gonna even look at me.

[C]

Well, what's the, like, intro process, the interview process of being a PI or was he just like, what did you say?

[D]

Were you, like, emailed him? And I was like, hey, I'm trying to get into the industry. Are you hiring?

[B]

Yep. That's so cool.

[D]

I think he responded with. Didn't answer my question. He's just like, what do you think a PI is? And I was like, I know it's not tv. I know I'm gonna sit in the car. I know I'm gonna piss in the car. I know I'm gonna have to do all this hot heat all this stuff. And he's like, let's meet. And we met, I think, a week later, and here we are five years later.

[C]

Wow. So you have to do. I know from MacKenzie, you guys have to do a certain amount of hours.

[B]

Or something once by state, what do you have to do here in California?

[D]

You have to. Depending on your degree, I think it's like 3,000 hours, which is equivalent to two years or so if you have a degree. And then if you don't have a degree, it's 6,000 hours, which I think is four years a degree.

[B]

Oh, that's similar to Florida in anything.

[C]

Like my film degree.

[D]

No, it's got to be criminal justice, police science, something in the criminal justice department. Yeah, it's either AA or your bs. Like, it depends. But I'm sure it's similar across states. You have to get a certain amount of hours. You got to get signed off by a mentor or somebody else.

[B]

It's kind of like an internship, essentially.

[D]

Yeah. You got to take the test. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then that's it. And you're off and going.

[C]

There you go.

[D]

Yeah. My story's not fun. I literally just emailed.

[C]

Oh, I thought you meant the story you were about to tell us.

[D]

Oh, no, my story. Getting into the industry is not fun, though.

[C]

And there's a lot of people that don't realize what the job is, and obviously some of them romanticize it and then hear about your stories and are like, oh, I don't want to pee in the car. But a lot of people, right, you and us, that they want to try.

[B]

Well, a lot of people that ask me in the car, how do I be a PI? You tell me how to be a PI, and that will tell me if you're going to be.

[D]

Exactly.

[C]

That makes sense.

[B]

Because you can't figure it out. It's like, how do you be a PI? Well, PIs aren't just like, hey, here's a PI location on the Google Maps. Go here. Like, no, you got to do some research. You got to look up associations. You got. If it's a network, like, there's a whole big thing, like, you actually got to do the work and investigate and research to learn how to be a PI.

[D]

Exactly. I'm like, if you can't do that.

[B]

If you don't, like. I mean, you can ask me how to be a PI, but I'm. That's your first job. Find out how to be a PI.

[C]

Exactly.

[B]

Figure it out. Then you should at least.

[D]

Exactly.

[C]

Well, a lot of it seems like you guys having to do, it's very self starter type job. Like you're alone making decisions, deciding how much energy to put in, how much.

[D]

Some people like that. Some people want to be on a team. I personally, I like to be independent. And I think that's one of the best parts of the industry is you don't have to deal with anybody. And opd, which we call other people drama, is the best. There's nothing, it's free tv, other people, drama, gossip.

[C]

When it's not your involvement.

[B]

Yeah, that's why people love the ice and that's why it was funny. We were just talking before we started recording and Helen's like, I, I don't know if my story's interesting. And we're like, you have no idea. That's what I say every time I tell a PI story. I'm like, this one's stupid. And everybody's like, what did you say? And so I thought that was funny because we both.

[C]

Yeah, I was like, everyone says that, especially being a PI in Los Angeles, I imagine is wild. We heard from Ken a little bit that it's wild.

[D]

It's a challenge, that's for sure.

[C]

So that alone will make it exciting. But I don't know if we have any other questions or if we just wanna get into the story.

[B]

I'm excited to get into this not interesting story.

[C]

Pour us to tears, Helen.

[D]

I haven't told this one before.

[B]

So Covid was like five years ago. So you've been a PI for about five years. Yeah. Okay, That's a good amount of time. Yeah. That's a couple stories I bet you've racked up.

[D]

Definitely. Yeah.

[A]

So.

[D]

So this one was fun. We got a call from this chick, she's like, you know, I live out of state, I'm dating this girl in la. I see her every weekend and we've been dating for maybe a year, but something's off. She couldn't say what. So she knows that this person's real because they've met. She's obviously the chick in the pictures, you know, and this subject is very la, so I can see why this client was into her. You know, fake boobs, bbl lips, nose, like the whole shebang. She's got it all. So the first red flag for our client was she met this chick's family. And the subject told our client, I work for my uncle, he owns this company and I kind of handle his whole thing. Successful company. He's got multiple locations of this company.

[B]

He'S got running just to Just real quick to interrupt. When Helen says subject, she means the person who is the subject of the investigation. So this is your target, the person that you're doing the actual surveillance.

[D]

So the client is obviously the one that hired us. The subject is the one we're watching.

[B]

Yes.

[D]

So clients at dinner with the subject and her family and they're chit chatting and the client says to her family member, I'm so happy for you that you're so successful that you have all these locations of business. And the uncle looks at her and he's like, what the hell are you talking about? I only have one.

[B]

No.

[D]

So the client's like, weird, like what a weird lie. And that's when you kind of. The femme tuition comes in. You're like, why are you lying about this?

[C]

And if this, then what else?

[D]

Exactly. So I think that kind of started it in her head and maybe she started thinking, maybe I need a PI you know. And the subject, her girlfriend to her says, oh, it's this, it's that, you know, like makes up bullshit essentially. And you know, denial's not just a river in Egypt. She's like, really? Just doesn't want to believe it does believe it, but it's like this cognitive dissonance where you're like, you're telling me this, but I'm seeing this, you know. So she's like, I need a PI essentially. Not to mention she's out of state, so she's only down here for weekends. So she calls us and did she want to.

[B]

Did she want to hire a PI to get information like a background check? Or did she want a PI for surveillance or did she just want help figuring out what she was?

[D]

All of it, just everything. She just wants to see if she's getting dogfish. She's like, is this bullshit? Is everything a lie? She's obviously a real person, but what's the story? You know? So we get started. She tells us where she lives, what she drives, or so what she drives. And we. All we know is she's in a high rise in downtown la. And doing surveillance in downtown LA is a nightmare.

[B]

Downtown la, but a high rise, the high rise.

[C]

How would you find them?

[B]

You gotta sit out, find the car of a garage.

[D]

Usually I think we only had the type of car. We didn't have a plate, we didn't have color, we just had like BMW, SUV or whatever.

[B]

You have to like, have you ever had to walk into a garage on a high rise and try to find this vehicle and find all the cars that Match the description.

[D]

This was one of the ones that you couldn't even do, that you couldn't even get in. So we're kind of just like, hoping for the best. So we get there really early because her work hours are whatever, nine to five. We're like, let's get there at six. Let's scope out the area. Let's get comfortable.

[C]

You and Ken.

[D]

It was just me at the end.

[A]

Just you?

[D]

Yeah. We worked at a couple days and Ken joined a little while after. But day one, we're kind of just getting a feel for it. You've said you kind of come the first day, you get a feel for it. See what you can do, what you can find, if you even get anything. And I'm thinking, like, high rise. Good luck.

[A]

Yep.

[D]

So we got super lucky that I get there and as I'm pulling up, a BMW is pulling out. I was like, no fucking way. No way. Of course windows are tinted. You can't tell.

[B]

Wow.

[D]

People who drive BMWs are assholes. Always. They always speed. Especially in LA. They're known for it. They use the horsepower for sure. So we get on it immediately. I'm just like, I need to know if it's her. I can't not go. We drive for an hour from here to another county.

[B]

Are you running the plate while you're driving?

[D]

Yeah. So we run the plate, we find out it's her or it was under a family member's name or something. So we're already. Things are kind of weird and.

[C]

Are you in contact with your client at all? No, not at all.

[B]

You're.

[D]

Yeah, not at the moment. Because we've had some incidents where we are in contact and the client will come and blow it.

[C]

Sure. We have. I've told a couple of truly nine episodes.

[D]

I actually have a really funny one about that at the end. Okay, that one's a quick one.

[C]

I'll make a note.

[D]

So we're going. We're driving. She goes to Walmart, she goes to 7:11. She gets a Starbucks. I'm like, looking at the way she's dressed, and she's dressed like schlubby, just regular, you know, house clothes. I'm like, she going to work? Where's she going? You know, you can just tell with the way someone's dressed, what they're taking, what they're carrying, what they're doing. So after some driving, we go to this random huge plaza and there's like an ITT Tech or whatever, some like community college nursing thing. There's something here there's something here. And I'm like, I don't know what's around here. I don't know where she's working. It's definitely not her uncle's company. So she gets out of the car, she's got a bag full of crap clothes, she. Shoes, whatever. And you can see it's like a big bag. And she goes into this hole in the wall. And after a little while, I walk past and I see on the door, it says, whatever. Massage parlor.

[B]

Oh, no, I've done it.

[D]

And I was like, no way.

[B]

Blessed redeemed my Lord. No way.

[D]

I'm like, this is not a masseuse. So a little while goes by, and after some online sleuthing and everything, we find out it is a massage parlor, but it's also on another site that's called Rub Maps.

[B]

I'm sorry, Rub Maps.

[D]

Maps, Correct.

[C]

Like rubbed maps.

[D]

Like rubbing a map.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

So we're like, what's about to happen? You know, it's like, I have a guess. 9:00am, mind you.

[C]

Wow.

[D]

So. So it's 9:00am It's 9:00am we're like, you know, these kids are going to nursing school. And then this chick is, like, going into suite A over here.

[C]

Do you see anybody else coming in and out of this parlor?

[D]

So we're there.

[C]

Eric, School.

[B]

She's going to suite A.

[D]

So the plumber's truck pulls up. And I was like, is someone's pipe, like, broken? What's going on here? You know, I can't. We're gonna start this one over. This dude comes out of the car in his full uniform. He's in his work truck. And before he gets to the suite, you see him pull out two 20s. I was like, okay. You know? Yeah. He's getting a massage. It's nine o'.

[B]

Clock.

[D]

It's stressful. He walks in, I want to say, 15 minutes later, 20 minutes later, get his map rubbed. Yeah. He comes out and he's got a smile on his face. His shirt's untucked. And the best part is he goes back to his work truck. And I'm set up in a way that I can kind of see everything. It's like a big parking lot. He goes back to his work truck. He opens the side door, he pulls out baby wipes. He pulls out his schlong. And then he starts cleaning. Cleaning it.

[C]

You've seen so many things in parking lots between.

[B]

Now he's out here in the parking.

[D]

Lot all 30 in the morning. I've already seen penis. I've already seen, like, you know, just days done.

[B]

Time for lunch. Let's go home. Right?

[A]

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[D]

Dude leaves. I want to say, two minutes later, another car and this guy that. This kid that comes out, he's like, young dude to me, looks like he's never kissed a woman before.

[B]

Oh, blessed.

[D]

Just like, very typical. Yeah, he's in there for maybe 10 minutes. That's when I'm like, he's obviously never.

[B]

They can get a lot done. Like, they can bang out some clients.

[A]

Yeah.

[D]

So we did that.

[C]

I want to make it clear here.

[A]

That we are not laughing because she's a sex worker. We're laughing because she's a cheater and a dogfish. And I also think we would be talking about the story differently if this was survival sex work. But she's living the high life like this is just lying to her partner about this.

[C]

And I like why.

[D]

A couple of guys walked in. They had wedding rings. So I'm like, oh, man, that's a.

[C]

Whole other ball game.

[D]

One dude walked in, was so pissed that he didn't have cash because it came out huffing and puffing. He looked through his car. I could hear him, like, pissed off. He left. He came back, and then he had cash. I'm like, this dude went to an atmosphere or to somebody to get cash to come back for 15 minutes. He could have been 15 minutes.

[B]

Venmo would have been killed. Well, no.

[C]

Cause she would get caught.

[D]

I think in the span of three hours, there were over eight guys, all men, which I thought was hilarious, given our subject is gay.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

So that was day one.

[B]

So Dave said he's in a gay relationship.

[A]

Correct.

[C]

But also on rub maps.

[D]

Correct.

[B]

Rubbing out. Not, not. Not gay bodies.

[D]

I mean, her wrists had to be sore. Something had to. That was a lot of guys in the span of a short.

[C]

Well, at this point, though, you don't know what's going on in suite A or whatever.

[B]

It don't take a rocket.

[D]

Right.

[C]

But as a PI, where are you now in terms of, like, what, you know, what you assume, what you tell your client, what you do next?

[D]

I mean, I'm assuming the worst. I mean, eight in two hours.

[C]

The worst for you.

[D]

Exactly. I mean, everybody's pulling out cash before they go in. I'm like, maybe it's a cashless or a cardless massage spot. But shockingly, on rub maps, they give you a lot of detail. Oh, names, reviews, pricing. If it's cash, they got Yelps. Yeah.

[B]

Oh, okay.

[C]

That's the first I saw it by her name.

[D]

So, yes and no. She was. She had a pseudonym, I guess. Which reminds me, the way that we kind of had an idea that maybe something was up was the number that she gave the client. The client, I guess, never Googled that number, which is like, step one, Google who you're dating. Especially if you're online dating. Google them. Google their name. Google their number.

[A]

Google their address.

[C]

10, 15. Don't start at page 2 or 1.

[D]

Go on their Facebook. Check profiles with the same names, do it all. So that's the first thing we did, is we googled her number and it came up to an escort page.

[C]

Well, there you go.

[D]

Like, literally the first post escort page. So we already had it in our mind, you know, like something escort page. And then now massage parlor. So we worked it two days, and both days she did the same thing. Like Walmart 7 11, Starbucks.

[B]

And this is only on the time because the partner lives far away and would only come on the weekend. So this was during the week.

[D]

This was during the week. Yeah.

[B]

9Am on a schmooze day. And we're okay.

[D]

She left her spot at 6 in the morning. She had to get there, get all her stuff. And I personally have a couple of burner Instagram accounts And they're well established. So it's not like the fake.

[B]

It doesn't look like a lot.

[D]

Yeah, yeah. So I was following her during. I've been following her after I've been following. Cause I'm just. I need the tea. I need to know.

[C]

I can't wait.

[A]

Don't tell us yet.

[C]

But when we get to the end, I can't wait that you have that wait.

[B]

But what does the partner think that this person does for a living?

[D]

She just works for her uncle's company and that's just a manager. And she does well, she has money, she lives in a high rise, she's got money, you know, she's got a boob job, bbl, crazy long hair. She's very typical, like la, plastic la. And I can see why the client not being from LA would be so intrigued by, you know, big booed Betty's like, you know, so we told the client and the client was kind of like, whoa.

[C]

How did you tell the client?

[D]

Just over the. Over email or over the phone? I don't remember.

[C]

That's different to me.

[D]

I'm like, I think it was over email.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

You know, here are your receipts. This is how many men. And kind of like get tested, you know, get tested and be careful.

[B]

But like I have a question with that type of case. Like, obviously when you do, at least for me in my experience, when every single surveillance that I do, every single case, every single person that comes across, I am writing this, I have a template and this is what my report looks like and it says this is what I was asked to do. These are the dates and times that I did it. This is what happened during those dates and times. Did you do the same type of thing?

[D]

Similar, but not as official. We didn't like type up a report. We kind of like have a summary in a sense, if they want a report. Absolutely.

[A]

Can you.

[D]

Okay, absolutely. We do the objective, the summary, the timestamps.

[B]

So in your summary do you say just to kind of help our audience understand like how you say that? Because for me, at least in my experience, that's why I love hearing from other PIs. You don't wanna say, oh, they were going in and getting their Willy Nilly's day of their life and they brought. So when I would write a report, I would say, this person arrived at this place and during that time eight different males entered. And this male at this time arrived and he pulled out cash and he came outside and when he came out, he grabbed what appeared to be a wet Wipe and cleaned his genital tools. And it's very, very, like, specific. Like, these are the actual words that we're using. Like, is that.

[D]

Yeah. I don't make assumptions. I don't say he went in there and got his dicks off. You know, I don't say anything like that.

[B]

I was just wondering, like. And because you can't, like, how do you prove it?

[D]

I can't. I didn't go inside, so I can't prove that that happened. But one could assume they don't take a rocket. Dude is on the clock. He's obviously on his lunch. He's here, he's happy now, and then he moves on.

[C]

What was her response to that?

[D]

I mean, she was obviously bummed.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

You know, like, well, I guess I'm going to end it. Like, thank you. Because the whole thing for her was she was going to move to la, so she wanted to find out if this is a move. She's got businesses, houses, property.

[B]

She's. She was going to change her whole life.

[D]

Exactly. So for her was a couple of thousand dollars on surveillance to prove or not prove. Cause even if she got what she wanted to know, great, now you know, you can trust this person, you know, they met online. So that was the whole thing. You don't know who. You don't know who you meet. Even in a gay relationship, you don't know.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

So she was obviously bummed, you know. Oh, okay. Thank you, guys. Thank you. And kind of that was the end of it. What she doesn't know is I also follow her on Instagram. I just need to know, you know, if I can have a conclusion, I will. But I'm not going to go out of my way. I'm not going to ask them. I'm not. If they don't know, they don't know. What does it matter?

[C]

Sure. So when did this happen? When was this case?

[D]

It was earlier this year. It's actually very recent. So I've been following the subject for. Since we started. And you know, online. It's funny because you'll see her posting stuff online and I'm like, I know where you are. Like, I know what you're doing to the world. It seems like I'm at my office job. Like, no, you're not.

[C]

Like, you're like, you banked that photo.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Changed your shirt a few times in that location and are just always going, yeah.

[D]

So obviously she's still doing her massaging. And so a couple months after we worked it, I see on her Instagram that The client's with her. And I was like, get the fuck out of here. They're in la, they're at, like, a Bad Bunny concert. And I'm like, what story did she tell her? How did you. You had the pict. We sent her all the video. You know, we sent her all the pictures. Counted 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7. Like, they were still together. And I was tempted to be like.

[A]

What the hell are you doing?

[D]

Literally, like a couple months later.

[B]

That's so common. More times than not, in my 20 years of experience, more times than not, they will stay together. That's why knowing more is frustrating as much as, like, not knowing more. Because then it's like you want to be like, hey, wake up. Like, I got. Why did you spend the money to do this? But some people just want to know. And.

[C]

Well, maybe, yeah, it opens up that conversation. And the girl can be like, this is what I do for a living.

[D]

Yep.

[B]

And. But I would be butt hurt. Like, how. I mean, at least you're not cheating on me with girls.

[D]

I guess, maybe.

[C]

There's strict boundaries and it's.

[D]

I guess. I don't know. But I still check every once in a while. They're not together anymore.

[C]

No. Okay.

[D]

They're not together anymore. I told myself that they went to that Bad Bunny conc. Because the client probably bought the tickets ahead of time. Just.

[C]

They already had the tickets.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And they're.

[C]

I told myself, so they're still friends.

[D]

I was like, they're. They're going to be friends forever.

[A]

There you go. Okay.

[C]

So maybe that's all.

[B]

So there was no U haul involved after all.

[D]

No. Thank God you helped me out.

[C]

Wait, so. And then her Instagram just. She never. She never posted any. The client's Instagram. Never posted anything with her?

[D]

No, not anymore. With her. Like.

[B]

So it sounds like they've broken up.

[D]

They did. Because the subject has, like, another girlfriend.

[C]

Of course.

[D]

Because I still watch because I'm just. It's so entertaining. I love that.

[C]

Do you? I mean, I don't. I don't think there's anything wrong with it. Do you? I mean, like, we're all public.

[D]

It's public.

[C]

Yeah. Public information.

[D]

And if it's private and they've accepted my request, that's on them.

[C]

Yeah, totally.

[D]

I'm not using it. I'm not using their video. It's just for my own.

[B]

You're not sharing their information? Yeah. Using it against them, calling. It would be unethical at that point to be continuing to follow this person. And then call the client and say, guess what they're doing now. I just wanted to let you know that would be highly unethical.

[D]

Yeah, that's just.

[B]

It's not illegal, but probably just unethical. But still, that's not. That's. Oh, boy. I don't know what I would. I don't know what sucks more, like not knowing or continuing to know and not being able to say shit about it. Both seem so. Both are so frustrating.

[D]

That's what I'm wondering. I'm like, did she confront her or did she just not tell her and just. No. Like, as long as I get tested every week, I don't even know how often.

[C]

Keep it at first base or something. And.

[B]

Or maybe she's like, well, she is making good money, so it's fine.

[D]

Right?

[C]

She's like, charged the men more.

[D]

I don't know.

[B]

Like, I'll be your manager, I guess. You mean set up your schedule for you? What do you do?

[C]

I'm still just thinking about how, like, all of the village people were walking in the parlor. It sounds like you just had the.

[D]

Plumber and the walking in all willy nilly random people.

[B]

I love how the very first thing was, like, this plumber walks up.

[D]

It was the first guy.

[B]

So funny.

[D]

And dude, it's his lunch. It's literally his lunch.

[C]

What are the craziest things y' all have seen in parking lots on cases? I know you've seen someone poop outside of Barnes and Noble or something and.

[B]

Then brush his teeth and then leave his mansion. Poop, brush his teeth in the parking lot, and then go off to his nine to five job where he's making like six figures and you gotta go, you gotta go.

[D]

Apparently the guy wiping his junk off in the parking lot was a new one for me. That, yeah, that one might take the cake.

[B]

Don't you think it's interesting? You do not realize what people will do when they think no one is watching.

[D]

That's the biggest thing for me is I love the human nature of it. Where they don't. When they don't know you're watching. You see the ugliest parts of people.

[B]

When people don't think anybody's watching y', all, these folks don't got no shame. Y' all think everybody's better than you. Ain't nobody better than you because you do not know what goes on behind closed doors and sometimes out in the public all willy nilly in the parking lots, wiping with the baby wipe. Mm mm.

[C]

Wait, what's the Story with the client that you told.

[D]

Oh, so that one's a funny one. So this client thinks her husband's cheating, right? Just typical cheating. He's cheating with a coworker. He's been caught four times and I wanna catch him for the fifth. Whatever.

[B]

Oh, okay. You're like, give me all your money.

[A]

Whatever.

[D]

We get him holding hands and whatever with his girl, co worker, girlfriend, mistress. Right. We get him at work. So they're cute, they're like giggling and obviously there's something going on. And then our client thought that they were having sex in their car in a parking structure. So we like set up hidden cameras in the parking structure in like McDonald's cups, like Super TV, where you like, put it in the corner, in this corner and whatever.

[C]

Sorry not to interrupt. Really quick.

[A]

Whatever.

[C]

Yeah. What are the recording laws in California?

[D]

So that's a good question. There's like privacy laws, obviously. Audio. It's a two party state. You have to have the other person agree to the audio. So none of our hidden cameras have audio.

[A]

Okay.

[D]

But what we say is, like, if a mailman can go there, if it's kind of open to the public. Reasonable. Yeah. There's no expectation of privacy.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

And for this case also, you know, she just wanted to see if her husband was sleeping with this chick in the car. So I'm like, yeah, let's see what we can get. So we were actively texting her that, yeah, he's leaving now, he's going to the parking lot with mistress. Right. And I wasn't directly speaking with the client. I was relaying it to Ken, who was speaking to the client. Cause I don't like to be out in the field and juggling. So I'm sitting there. I don't know what the client looks like either, right? So I'm sitting there. It's like midnight.

[C]

Mackenzie's face right now.

[D]

It's like midnight. And you know there's a homeless dude here. There's a homeless dude here. And I'm hunkered down in my car. And here pulls up this like, really nice Mercedes and this beautiful blonde woman comes out. I was like, what the hell is this woman doing here at this hour? And then she walks up to them and I was like, is he sleeping with two women? Like, what's going on? No, it's the fucking client.

[B]

Yeah, Kool Aid, man.

[D]

And then I was like, holy shit. And they're all like smiles at each other. And then when the client's not looking, dude and the girlfriend are smiling at Each other. And I was just like, what's happening?

[A]

Huh? Who?

[B]

Who?

[C]

So nobody's screaming?

[D]

No. Everyone's just chill. She was smiling at the girlfriend.

[B]

Yeah. Like, everyone's smiling at each other's up to the car, and she's like, hey, guys.

[D]

They weren't in the car yet. They weren't in the car yet. They were just in the structure, and I could see them through, like, the crack of the structure.

[B]

And so she sees him, and she's like, hey. And they're like, hey, hey, hey, hey.

[C]

How y' all doing? Yeah, what's up?

[D]

You know? Yeah, exactly.

[C]

And nothing happened. They didn't all get.

[D]

They just, like, walk off or whatever. And then we find out a little while later they have a threesome.

[B]

Oh, okay.

[D]

Dude couldn't get it up.

[B]

Okay.

[D]

So the wife and the mistress then go off and have their own thing.

[C]

She hired a PODC just to join.

[D]

She wanted to find a girlfriend, I guess.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Good for her.

[B]

That's wild.

[D]

That's crazy.

[C]

I don't know why she called you so many times. If she was, like, just trying to join or. Not you specifically.

[D]

She probably didn't want to join at first. And then she's like, wow, you're cute. This guy's an ogre. They're still together?

[B]

Of course they are.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

And so maybe the other girl is too.

[B]

What is your. Like, are you surprised? As someone who is not a PI, Are you surprised that people stay together as often as they do? Like, hearing all these stories, you're like, whoa. They stay together?

[C]

Yes and no. I think it. I mean, obviously, it depends on the scenario. I think I'm still wrapping my head around why this is. Don't take offense to this. Why people call PIs in the first place. Like, at what point in your relationship are you like, I don't want to leave, but I do want to call a professional to tail the person I'm supposed to trust more than anyone else. Like, yeah, obviously, I get it. With intentional litigation. Or if you really don't know for sure, Like, I think there are valid reasons to call, but, like, someone like this who's caught the guy cheating a lot ends up just joining in.

[B]

And why would you spend that money? Yeah, why would you call me to do a surveillance? Spend the money just to come blow my car?

[D]

Exactly.

[B]

Just like the restaurant. No, ma'. Am.

[C]

What are red flags of clients calling you that? You're like, I'm not taking that case.

[B]

Oh, yeah? Have you ever had one? You're like, I'm not working that.

[D]

I mean, you could tell when they're nuts. I feel like you could just tell right off the bat.

[C]

Tell us specifically because this. It feels like this doubles as dating advice too. How are they nuts?

[B]

It's a gut feeling, right?

[D]

Yeah, I think so. And a lot of times they start with the hacking and this and trackers. Everybody thinks they're getting hacked. That's a big red flag. If anybody talks about getting hacked, if they think their husband's hacking their phone or anything like that, it's an automatic red flag.

[C]

Interesting.

[D]

But as far as, like, I don't know.

[B]

We.

[D]

We don't know. We don't really know. You can kind of tell just based off the way they talk, the details they give. Sometimes it's interesting that you can tell that the client's the cheater.

[B]

Yep. Yes.

[D]

And they're projecting.

[B]

That is so true. Yes.

[D]

We have had a lot of those where we know the client's the cheater.

[C]

That is just by your gut. Or you'd like, find out that they are both.

[B]

They'll say something that you're like, wait a minute. That's not what you said before. Or something just won't align with something that was said before. Or something that you're will trigger in your head that you didn't think of. And then they'll say something and you'll be like, wait. And it's like it triggers something that connects something else.

[D]

You're like, oh, yeah. I mean, we had a guy calling us who when he would go out of town, he wanted to check on his mistress. But, like, his mistress was his therapist that was supposed to help with his marriage.

[B]

No.

[D]

And then starts sleeping with the mistress. That's so common too.

[C]

I was gonna say, unfortunately, even I've heard that before.

[D]

And he's like, should I leave my wife? I need to know that my mistress is faithful before I leave my wife.

[C]

Who is the mistress's. Oh, my God.

[A]

Yeah.

[D]

And she was faithful.

[B]

He probably still didn't leave the wife.

[D]

I doubt it.

[B]

No, they.

[D]

I doubt it. That one, I don't know.

[B]

Well, if she was a really good therapist, obviously he want to make sure his mistress is faithful before he decides he's going to leave the wife that he's cheating on to be with her. Yeah. That has happened so many times. Yeah.

[C]

All right. I think in their minds, it makes total sense. I like to ask this of PIs, and I mentioned dating advice. You also mentioned some red flags early on dating advice as a PI apps, first dates.

[D]

What would you tell people, do your due diligence if you're a woman. I mean, men too, but woman. What does it take to get a background check? A couple hundred bucks. You know, if you're gonna meet someone online, what's a big deal? Spend a couple hundred bucks, see if they're a sex offender. See if they.

[B]

Before you waste months of your time.

[C]

Well, the way you put it earlier, I'd like to. I guess going back on why someone hires a PI, it's like, yes, it seems expensive, but it's a lot cheaper than moving to LA per person.

[B]

It's true.

[D]

You're gonna go on dates, it's gonna cost you money. It's gonna add up quickly. Why waste that when you can just know for certain this person's legitimate or not, or they're married or not.

[B]

I would like to point out that when someone hires someone for a job, they wanna know, is this person worth the salary I'm about to pay them to do this job that they may or may not be lying about having experience with? And what do they do? They say, submit your application. We're gonna do a background check.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

And what is a more important job.

[B]

Than the love of your life?

[D]

Exactly. You should be their number one driver.

[B]

If you're gonna kiss them, you need to know their background. No, but I do feel like if you're someone who says, I want to normalize people, saying, hey, I really like this person. Let me hire a PI to find out. That being said, and it's. It's normal. Like, if you're like, I'm doing this legally. I want to find out. There is a stigma behind that, because if they ever found out, then they'd be like, I can't believe you hired a PI on me. Blah, blah, blah.

[C]

That's where I'm like, oh, my gosh. It just feels like something you're.

[B]

It feels. But also in today's world, like, back in the day, I'm 41 years old. Like, we used to go outside and play until the street lights came on. My mom never knew where we were. Now my son is not leaving my front yard because he gonna get snatched up by. By the ice cream van. Whatever. I'm not trying it. You know what I mean? Like, it's a different day.

[D]

Times are different.

[B]

Yeah, times are different.

[C]

But we also have so many more resources.

[B]

And we also, if we have the resources, use them. And if someone is not okay with you hiring a PI to look into them, like, I would commend you, but I'm also in the industry, so it just depends on what kind of person. But if you say, hey, I just wanna let you know, you know, I would like to hire a PI to do a background check on you. People would. A lot of people are gonna take offense to that. But if they don't, well, you have.

[C]

Your people, they offense because they have something to hide.

[D]

That's what I'm saying. Like, if you got nothing to hide, what's the big deal?

[C]

And if you explain where your fears come from.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

And if you have specific traumas or insecurities that you want reassurance about the right person, if you.

[B]

If you would let an employer do a background check on you because you're like, well, that's the only way I'm gonna get a job. They need to verify me. I feel like people should be able to do that in personal relationships too. But then you're the asshole who, you know, says, I'm gonna hire a P.I. so, Helen, as a female P.I. i imagine there have been. There's always a stigma behind that, because even today, as we've grown as a society in general, I think some of us are still stuck in the past. Like, my professor was like, you'll never make it as a PI because you're a girl. So as a woman, I feel like sometimes there is that stigma. But have there ever been times in working with Ken or whatever, and he's like, hey, I need a female on this, because a female's gonna fit in. Ken's told us. He's like, hey, I'm a white guy. If I go into this cultural market or an area where there's all African American people, and I'm a white guy that walks in, I'm gonna stand out. And so sometimes you need a female PI and there have there been cases where you're. He's like, hey, you're a girl. Like, you could do this better than me.

[D]

I feel like that on every single case.

[C]

Thank you. You're like, yeah, in fact, I am objectively better 100% of the time.

[D]

I mean, Ken's a draft, right? So. So anywhere you go, he's above everyone. You see him.

[A]

Yeah.

[D]

I'm five two on a good day, so I can hide behind a planter if I need to. And it's not weird. Cause, like, if anyone asks me anything, oh, I'm just the idiot girl. Oh, I'm so lost. Or I don't speak English or whatever. What do you mean?

[B]

I don't know.

[D]

Yeah, I use a lot that I Was supposed to meet someone here to buy a Mac. That's my excuse. I'm supposed to buy a Mac. I'm supposed to meet David just with Marketplace. And everyone feels bad for the idiot girl getting scammed. So that's, like, always my cover.

[B]

That is, you make yourself a victim, and then everybody wants to be the hero.

[D]

They want to help you. They'll tell you, they'll talk to you. You know, you just give them a compliment. Oh, my God, your hair is great.

[B]

Next thing you know, you change the subject, and they don't know what you do.

[D]

I remember a case. We were looking for a missing couple, and I went to a hotel that we knew that they were staying at, and Ken gone up and talked to this guy and said, hey, can you give me some information? He would have been like, get the fuck out of here.

[B]

Who.

[D]

Who are you? They're not gonna give information. I show up. I'm super nice. Oh, my God, your hair is whatever, you know. And he gave me all the information, and he shouldn't have, obviously, but I'm like, thank you. Bye.

[B]

It's that intimidation factor. And it's like. I hate to say it, but if you're. And in Helen's case, like, you're very small in stature. I'm not as small, but I'm still. I'm just a girl. I'm literally just a girl. I don't know.

[C]

You bat your eyelashes.

[B]

You bat your eyelashes. You put your chest out there. Or you just kind of, like, act dumb. You smize. Tyra Banks taught us to smize on America's Next Top Model. Like, we flirt a little bit. Like, you can act, you can do whatever.

[C]

How do you maintain the ability to trust people? Seeing what you see? How do you stay a little bit positive?

[B]

Yeah, Helen, how do you stay positive?

[D]

I don't trust anybody, period. Period.

[C]

How do you balance that with, like, not waking up every day being like, I hate all of you? Like, you still have to make connections.

[D]

I just do that every day. I hate all of you.

[C]

Okay, great, Great, everybody.

[B]

No, it does not. And all. It does not get better. It does not. Because when you start to see. Yeah, I. I think, like, how do.

[C]

You guys make friends?

[B]

Like, do you just like, no, I don't want friends.

[D]

I don't make any friends. I'd like to believe that since we watch so many people, we see the human nature. So I think if you see genuine characteristics, I guess, in someone. Yeah. That'll. You'll feel more comfortable and know you can trust.

[C]

I Just was like, I'm going to keep pushing this question until I get something, some evidence that I could believe in humanity.

[B]

It's true.

[D]

Everybody lies. Everybody lies.

[B]

Yeah. Whenever you see people every day, your job, if someone's hiring you to follow or watch somebody or get information on someone, there's a reason. And that reason is because this person has shown some indication that there's deceit, there's something there. And so you automatically have that in your head that this is what you're looking for. And in the beginning, for me, I was like, oh, not everybody's a liar. Everyone's nice. It's just, we'll see what happens. But when that becomes your everyday life, you just start to see that, like, everybody's a liar. But we did have the authors of the book Big Liars on our show, and they are lying experts, and they say that people in general are not.

[C]

Liars, are not big liars.

[B]

They're not bigger. But when you're someone who. All the people that are the liars are the people that we see every day. So it's like, we don't trust anybody because in our mind, that is everybody. Everybody.

[D]

Yeah, man.

[C]

Guys, I'm gonna make you background check every single date I go on, every single person I meet and for.

[B]

And if anybody wants to know how much a background check is, before you get a background check, try to find out as much information as you can using your public resources, the social media machine, the Google machine, anything on the www. Like, look it up yourself. There's so many different websites out there that you can look it up. But before you do a background check, try to find out as many counties as possible that this person has been in. Try to find the counties.

[C]

Yeah, I also like at this point, and I. This could be generational, but like, everyone my age and younger has a social media trail. I don't really go out with anybody that I can't find a mutual friend of a mutual friend on some social website. Like, it's very rare that I can't find any kind of connection or I see, oh, they went to Tulane. Let me call my friend Alex who went to Tulane. Do you know this guy? Oh, yeah, I know a guy that was in the same fraternity. He's kind of a dud.

[B]

I'm like, shocker. It's a comfort when someone can vouch for this person.

[C]

But I won't go on the date if I can't find something. And that doesn't mean that they're not still a serial killer.

[D]

But yeah, but I've seen, like, a lot of people are trusting of that mutual friend, and then they'll still go out. It could be a lot. Yeah, exactly.

[C]

I back it up.

[D]

I don't trust anybody.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

All right.

[C]

Well, on that note. No, I do appreciate it, because I think having that kind of caution is not a bad thing to have. But we know love exists, and you just have to ask a lot of questions.

[B]

We're going to need you to share more stories. I love. I love. I love having other Ken. I love you to death. But it's so cool having another female PI that can share her story. It's just nice to see a different perspective. Movies and TVs. You see the man holding a big, long camera. That's not what. And so it's kind of cool. So thank you so much for sharing.

[D]

Thank you.

[B]

So nice to meet you.

[D]

You as well.

[C]

Oh, well, I hope that masseuse is.

[A]

I don't know.

[B]

She is working hard.

[D]

She's working hard.

[B]

She's working somebody hard.

[D]

Something hard.

[B]

Someone hard. Work. Sam.