The One That Got Away

Summary

The Dating Detectives - "The One That Got Away"

Release Date: July 7, 2025
Hosts: Mackenzie Fultz (Professional Private Investigator) & Hannah Anderson (Comedian)
Guest: Megan
Duration: Approximately 87 minutes

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1. Introduction and Trigger Warnings (00:01 - 03:37)

The episode begins with a standard disclaimer emphasizing the anonymization of names, places, and events for safety and privacy. Mackenzie and Hannah introduce the episode, acknowledging the gravity of the story ahead. They provide trigger warnings, highlighting topics such as murder, abortion, violence, physical abuse, stalking, and drug use. Both hosts stress the ethical approach of the podcast, ensuring respect for the victim and their family while aiming to educate listeners about red flags in the dating world.

Notable Quote:
Hannah (02:07): "Yeah. Well, okay. So, yes, there is a murder in this episode... we want to hold a lot of space and respect for the victim and their family."

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2. Megan's Story: The Beginning of the Nightmare (04:13 - 08:49)

Megan shares her harrowing experience dating a man named Randy approximately 25 years prior. At the age of 23, she met Randy through a referral from her best friend. Initially, things seemed normal—double dates, barbecues, and movie nights. However, within three months, Megan discovered she was pregnant. Hoping to stabilize the relationship, she asked Randy to move in.

Shortly after moving in, Megan noticed suspicious behavior—bags stored in the garage and a lack of personal items from Randy. Driven by unease, she decided to search through the bags, uncovering documents that revealed Randy's father was incarcerated, indicating Randy had lied about his identity. Confronting him led to a violent altercation where Randy physically assaulted Megan, prompting her roommate to intervene with a butcher knife and call the police.

Notable Quotes:
Megan (05:43): "I end up pregnant. So. Oh."
Hannah (05:42): "Oh, boy."
Megan (07:15): "His name was fake. He had not given me the true full name."

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3. Escalation of Violence and Stalking (08:49 - 25:23)

Following the initial confrontation, Megan's gas tank was sabotaged with sugar, causing significant damage to her vehicles. Randy's persistent and harassing phone calls intensified, leading Megan to realize the extent of his manipulative and violent nature. One night, while Megan and her roommate Kelly were watching a scary movie, Randy attempted to intimidate them by knocking on the door, leading to a series of terrifying events:

• House Fire: Randy set Megan's house on fire using a Molotov cocktail, forcing her and Kelly to flee while their cars and garage were engulfed.

• Police Involvement: A vigilant fire chief named "Barney Fife" investigated the case, eventually identifying Randy through fingerprints found on threatening letters Megan received. Despite multiple threats and violent acts, the local district attorney offered Randy a plea deal, resulting in a relatively light sentence.

Megan details the prolonged stress and fear of Randy's potential release, emphasizing the inadequacies of the justice system in fully addressing her ordeal.

Notable Quotes:
Megan (13:10): "He had dumped sugar in our gas tanks... our cars are like, dead in the driveway."
Mackenzie (17:29): "Okay, so how do we know he did this?"

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4. Legal Battles and Continued Fear (25:23 - 35:45)

Despite Randy's violent actions, the legal proceedings did not hold him fully accountable due to the initial plea deal. Megan describes her annual interactions with the parole board, expressing fear over Randy's early parole after serving three years of a seven-year sentence. The constant threat of Randy's release perpetuated Megan's anxiety and PTSD, forcing her to adopt stringent safety measures to protect herself and her children.

Notable Quotes:
Megan (30:24): "It was traumatizing. Just a sense of relief... I can't say it's a win or lose."
Hannah (31:03): "Mental health is real. Mental health is health, you guys."

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5. Long-Term Impact and Personal Growth (35:45 - 57:21)

Twenty years later, Megan reflects on the long-term effects of her traumatic experience. She discusses her subsequent marriages, divorces, and her journey as a single mother raising two children. Megan emphasizes the importance of recognizing red flags and taking accountability for her choices without self-blame. Her experiences have led her to advocate for victims' rights and awareness, inspiring her to start her own podcast, "Got Her Back Podcast," aimed at supporting women through similar struggles.

Notable Quotes:
Megan (36:24): "I have to start listening to your red flags. You literally have got to start listening because you tend to listen or see a red flag and let it hit you in the face and just keep on going."
Hannah (56:09): "And trust your femtuition."

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6. The Murder of Jane Doe and Systemic Failures (57:21 - 70:49)

Megan delves deeper into Randy's criminal history, revealing his involvement in the murder of a woman known as Jane Doe. Randy's manipulation extended beyond Megan, as he falsely implicated himself in Jane Doe's death to evade full accountability. The case highlighted systemic issues within the justice system, including biases that prevent certain victims from receiving the attention and support they deserve. Megan and the hosts discuss the concept of the "perfect victim" and how societal prejudices influence the investigation and prosecution of crimes.

Notable Quotes:
Megan (42:23): "He admits he's responsible for Jane Doe's death... tied to asphyxiation."
Hannah (69:26): "We're conditioned to take it less seriously. It's an awful."

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7. Coping with Guilt and Empowerment (70:49 - 78:36)

Megan addresses the complex emotions of guilt and empathy she feels as a survivor. She emphasizes the importance of using her experiences to help others, advocating for awareness and vigilance in dating. The conversation shifts to the balance between taking personal responsibility and not blaming oneself for being a victim. The hosts and Megan encourage listeners to trust their intuition ("femtuition") while acknowledging the personal nature of each individual's healing process.

Notable Quotes:
Megan (58:31): "If it can help one woman, then that's how you give back."
Hannah (77:21): "It's growth. Every day I make a bad decision. We all do."

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8. Conclusion and Call to Action (78:36 - End)

The episode concludes with the hosts commending Megan for her bravery in sharing her story. They emphasize the importance of community support and encourage listeners to reach out with their own stories. The conversation touches on the significance of resources like VINE (Victim Information and Notification Everyday) and the need for comprehensive documentation to support victims' cases. The hosts also highlight Megan's podcast, "Got Her Back," as a platform for women to share and find support.

Notable Quotes:
Mackenzie (84:53): "Keep the conversation going... Your voice becomes your weapon."
Hannah (83:59): "Thank you so much to Megan for sharing her story."

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Key Takeaways:

• Red Flags in Dating: Megan's story underscores the importance of recognizing early warning signs such as inconsistencies in personal information and controlling behavior.

• Impact of the Justice System: The episode highlights how plea deals and systemic biases can fail victims, allowing perpetrators to receive lighter sentences for severe crimes.

• Mental Health and Healing: Emphasizing the significance of mental health support, the hosts advocate for resources like BetterHelp to aid in the healing process.

• Empowerment Through Sharing: Megan's journey demonstrates how sharing traumatic experiences can empower both the speaker and listeners, fostering a supportive community.

Notable Resources Mentioned:

• VINE (Victim Information and Notification Everyday): A service that provides victims with information about the custody status of offenders.

• BetterHelp: An online therapy platform offering accessible and flexible mental health support.

Guest's Podcast:

• Got Her Back Podcast: Hosted by Megan and her best friend Carrie, focusing on women's issues, divorce, co-parenting, and recognizing red flags in relationships.
  Recommended to listen for further insights and support.

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This episode of The Dating Detectives provides a poignant exploration of the dangers that can lie beneath seemingly ordinary relationships. Through Megan's courageous storytelling, listeners gain valuable lessons on vigilance, the importance of support systems, and the complexities of navigating trauma and healing.

Transcript

[Hannah]

The following program contains names, places, and events that have been anonymized or fictionalized for the purposes of protection and safety. The following program is provided for entertainment purposes only, and any commentary from the hosts are strictly conjecture and should not be held as making any definitive statements about the truth or identity of any particular individuals or circumstances. If you or a loved one are involved in an abusive relationship, please call the National Domestic violence hotline at 1-800-799-6-7233 for support.

[Mackenzie]

Happy Dating Detectives Monday.

[Hannah]

Hello. Hello, Hello. How's everybody doing?

[Mackenzie]

It should be like a weekly holiday. National.

[Hannah]

Yeah, Monday, Dating Detectives Day, International.

[Mackenzie]

Whatever. Anyways, happy Dating Detectives Monday.

[Hannah]

And at this point, when this episode comes out, happy belated birthday, Mackenzie.

[Mackenzie]

Oh, yes. Thank you so much. I'm 41. I'm 41. And I think this year is going to be amazing. Thank you to everyone who I have gotten so many gifts from. People, like, everyone knows gifting is my love language. And so people are, like, Amazoning me packages and, like, my P.O. box is loaded. I love it.

[Hannah]

That's so sweet. Well, it's an easy.

[Megan]

So excited.

[Hannah]

Well, one present you guys can give us is signing up to Patreon. Whoa, look at that transition.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah, we do our Patreon. A lot of people join the $9 tier. So we had the $5 tier, which you get the two bonus episodes a month. Du. Everybody wants that. And then the live streams and the book club and the forums and all that jazz. And then the $9 tier, so just $4 more. You get the ad.

[Hannah]

Free listening experience for all episodes, so. And plus everything else. So do that if you want to be part of the crew. It's such a great community. And I do think that after this episode, you will need a bit of community. I'm not gonna lie.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Our conversation, I mean, we'll get into it in our dogfish debrief at the end. Gets bleak. It's so important, but it's a tricky one.

[Mackenzie]

There is some trigger warnings. One of them is they're doing a murder. That's a trigger warning.

[Hannah]

Yeah. Well, okay. So, yes, there is a murder in this episode. And we do want to acknowledge. Yeah. That this is a lot. And there's a loss of life, and we will be talking about the relationship that came before that tragedy. But we do want to hold lot of space and respect for the victim and their family. And it's not about sensationalism. It's about educating and reflecting and being aware. And that's why we share Stories like this. But we also want you to know we're going to anonymize the victim. We're going to anonymize the dogfish, and we are in contact with the victim's family.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah. And in the true crime category, we want to do things ethically. So this is ethical true crime. We want to do things the right way by everyone. So thank you guys for understanding. And it might be a little heavy for some, so I'll go through the.

[Hannah]

Trigger warnings now because I do have a list. There's a lot murder. And we'll give you another little heads up when there's a graphic description of this crime. So if you want to skip ahead in the moment, we will let you know how to do that. There's also talk of abortion and violence and physical abuse, stalking, some mention of drug use. And if I forget anything, Mackenzie or Molly, let me know.

[Mackenzie]

Because that's, if I'm being honest, the stalking thing really hits. Like, there's so many people who have experienced that, or at least some form of it. And it's scary even in the smallest amounts. And so things like that, like, you never know what's going to trigger someone. So anyways, we just want you to show up on these episodes as ethically as possible. So thank you for understanding.

[Hannah]

And yeah. And also, we haven't had this in a while. At one time, someone DMed and was like, hey, I don't want to listen to that because of some of what it sounds like it's about, but I would love to know what happened. And we just gave them a rundown in the DMs, like, if you don't have to listen, like, just protect your heart. We understand it's a lot and we're here for you in whatever capacity we can be. So.

[Mackenzie]

Yes. I love it. Are you ready to go?

[Hannah]

We love our guest.

[Mackenzie]

Let's get into it. I'm excited for you guys to meet Megan. And let's let Megan take it away.

[Hannah]

Hi, Megan.

[Mackenzie]

We are so excited to have you here.

[Megan]

Megan, thank you so much. Thanks for having me.

[Hannah]

The story where seatbelts are on, because I know a lot is coming our way. If you just want to get going, jump right in.

[Mackenzie]

Take us away. I'm ready.

[Megan]

Okay. I'm going to show my age. I'm 48 now. So this happened like 25 years ago. This is where it started. It'll go all the way through to, like, current day. So it's kind of crazy. But what about 23, 24 years old and I was dating around, and I got a referral from my best friend that lived with me at the time. She was dating a guy. And I said, hey, does he have any friends? And she was like, oh, he says he has a roommate. Like, they were supposedly in college. And I was like, oh, my gosh, I would love to date him. Bring him over. Yeah, double date. Let's swim. Let's have a barbecue. All the things. And so Randy started coming over, and nothing out of the ordinary. Kind of a quiet guy. Worked at what I would call an electronic shop. Almost like an electronic shop for the 70s and 80s. I would go there and sit with them sometimes at work. Kind of a weird place, but didn't really, like, red flag at all. You know, we didn't go to, like, on crazy dates or anything. It was just a lot of hanging out, watching movies, swimming at my house, barbecues. We did a lot of double dating since he was a referral. So there was like four of us doing it. So three months, gets down the road, and I end up pregnant. So. Oh.

[Hannah]

Oh, boy.

[Mackenzie]

Fast.

[Hannah]

And he's in college still, you said.

[Megan]

Yeah. And at the time, I was 23, 24ish. And he had supposedly had his 21st birthday. When we were together, we had a whole party and a cake and all the things. And yeah, I was like, real fast. No honeymoon period. It just was wham, bam, thank you, ma'. Am. Right? I end up pregnant. I'm young, and I'm thinking, okay, I'm gonna do the right thing. I tell Randy, I think the best thing is you need to move in here. To my. I owned a house. I was like, I think you need to move in.

[Hannah]

At 23, you're a badass.

[Megan]

Oh, you're sweet. Thanks. Seriously. Well, I mean, I had a roommate, and her daughter lived with me, as well as my best friend from college, so don't. Anyway, it is an accomplishment for sure. But he moves in, right? And a few weeks into moving in and, I don't know, something just started. I felt uneasy. He had all these bags in the garage that he just didn't bring in. He didn't bring any furnit furniture. He didn't bring, you know, basically was like, clothes. Probably a Nintendo at the time or an Xbox.

[Mackenzie]

Cool.

[Megan]

Back then, some kind of game, right? And then he had all these trash bags sitting in my garage. And so one day, I don't know, something said, megan, go through those trash bags. And I don't know if I was just being nosy or if it was A red flag. But I go through those, start digging through those trash bags and I find out that his dad's in prison. Which you know what? I wouldn't have even. Whatever. Okay, but tell me, you know, tell me that.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah, yeah, maybe that'd be something nice to share.

[Hannah]

How did you find out? In the trash bags, I was like.

[Megan]

All these documents and the dad had the same name. And at that point I realized he had given me the wrong name. So his name was fake. He had not given me the true full name. His date of birth, he had lied about that. He was not really 21. He was actually like more my age. 23, 24 at the time. And I was like, well, this is weird. So then the red flags really start, like, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. Like, okay, if he's lying about his age, his name, I knew, who is he? Michigan. Right. And so I was like, okay, it looked like that was true, but the first thing that popped in my head was he's done something in Michigan and he's fled to Texas where I lived to hide from it. That's the first thing that came into my mind. So 23 year old Megan and 48 year old Megan are not too much different. But I was quite the hothead back then. I'm so still could be quite the hot head. So I literally called him at work and said, hey, you got one hour to get your and get it. I'm putting it outside. And I'm like, you're not living here anymore. This is crazy. You've lied about all these things. Like, I don't even know who you are and I'm pregnant with your baby. So an hour passes, he doesn't show up. So I just start getting the trash bags and getting the clothes and literally put them on the front yard. It's like a yard sale. I'm like, free for all. I don't care. Get out of my life. Yeah. In my head I'm like, I'm never talking to you again. I don't know how that was going to work with being pregnant with a baby, but I just was going to figure it out. I just, I wanted nothing to do with him.

[Hannah]

Did he have any excuse when you confronted him?

[Megan]

No, we just started screaming.

[Hannah]

Oh, great. Always goes well.

[Megan]

Yeah, of course. It's like, it's your fault. Why were you digging through my stuff? My private stuff? You shouldn't have done that. And I'm thinking, well, buddy, what's your name? Joe Boss.

[Mackenzie]

What is it? We don't know.

[Megan]

I don't know, you know what I mean? Like, how old are you really? So, I mean, I was pretty freaked out. And so a few hours go by, I'm talking to my best friend about it and we're kind of just freaking out. He doesn't come that night at all to get his stuff. So I mean, okay. I was 23 and lived in an older neighborhood. Like it became a free for all. I mean, people thought it was a garage sale. They just start picking his stuff up, which was probably not the nicest thing for me, but I just didn't. So I think it pissed him off pretty good because the next day I'm just a girl. Yeah. What were you supposed to do? Yeah, he came to the door, my dumbass opened it and he was just on one. He pushed me immediately. Like I had a split level house and he pushed me and it had these old banisters on the wall and I just remember whacking into the banister and it hit my side and here I am. I mean, I'm early on, weeks pregnant. Four, five weeks pregnant. And it made a huge bruise on my side, like huge. And so my best friend roommate at the time, she was maybe 5, 4, I'm 5 11. So she's itty bitty thing. She went in the kitchen and got a butcher knife and got in between us and was like, it's time for you to go now. I'm calling the police. Back then we had home phone still. So she had the home phone in one hand and the butcher knife in another. Yeah, so it was pretty. Like, you know, she's pushing them back. Yeah, it was pretty, you know, she.

[Mackenzie]

Was ready to stab him to death.

[Megan]

Yeah, she was ready to get it for sure. I will tell you, dynamite does come in small packages, especially when it comes to her.

[Hannah]

She sounds like a ride or die.

[Megan]

Yeah, that on her any day of the week. So I was feeling like I was probably in good hands with her.

[Mackenzie]

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[Megan]

A couple days pass. We go out to go to work, and my gas tank, the door is open to it. And I thought, this is weird. And so I start investigating. I think I'm like the FBI I around, and I'm like, kelly, it's sticky. It's sticky. What is going on? And so she goes, well, let me go look at mine. So she looks, and sure enough, he had dumped sugar in our gas tanks. And so I don't know if you know what happens back in the day.

[Mackenzie]

It would seize your engine.

[Megan]

Yeah, for sure. And you have to get your gas tank drained. You can't turn it on. If so, then you can ruin the transmission. Totally screw the engine up. So our cars are like, dead in the driveway. And we're like, what? Yeah. So we're already making an insurance claim due to that. So here's one insurance claim we've got to make. And so a couple days go by and we're on the couch at this point. And mind you, he's been blowing my phone up. Right Back then, you couldn't block anybody. I mean, the best thing you could do was like, star six seven. So someone didn't know you could call. Yeah, Call waiting. I mean, we're talking 25 years ago. So he just kept calling, and I.

[Hannah]

Would just click him to voicemail as he's calling you. Are you just like, this is a normal going, or are you scared? How do you feel?

[Megan]

Yeah, I think at this point, like, he's put sugar my gas tank. I'm pissed about it, but I'm not, like, thinking anything other than great. Megan, you've dated a winner. And I dated several winners in my life. We'll just say Megan's picker for Ben is not great. It's lifelong pickers off. Yeah, for sure. Like, my.

[Hannah]

A lot of people say that it is. It's like, you guys are not the problem.

[Megan]

But I get it.

[Hannah]

I get the feeling.

[Megan]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Wait. But that's also good context because once you've dated a few people that are. I think there is an element of, like, numbness to the behavior where you can be like, all right, another one being a jerk.

[Megan]

Yeah, pattern. And also, I like, as. I mean, as I've gotten older, I had to learn to look at myself in the mirror and be like, okay, what's wrong with you? Like, what point got you to this low in order that you would tolerate this kind of behavior? But at this point, I'm thinking like, okay, chicken, the gas tank. Yes, he lied about these things, but I have no idea. I can't even foresee what's going to happen in the future. My head had not even went there yet. Right.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Megan]

And so we're sitting on a couch watching a movie, and a loud bang goes off, probably around midnight. And then the lights go off. And I'm thinking, like, that's it. It's a scary movie 101. He's cut the lights. We're dead. What?

[Hannah]

Do you think it's him?

[Megan]

Oh, yeah, for sure. I'm looking at Kelly. She runs and goes and gets the butcher knife. And then five minutes later, the lights click black on. And we're like, o. Okay, I guess just the breaker was blown. Whatever. And then about 30 minutes later, literally, probably we're still watching this scary movie like dumbasses. We probably shouldn't have been watching any kind of scary movie at this point in our lives, but we were. And so we hear a knock, knock, knock, ring, ring, ring, knock, knock, knock on the front door. And we're like, that's it. He's here. He's taunting us. He's trying to get us out of the house. And so we go from the couch and ran upstairs and my master bedroom had a closet off of it. So you go through the bathroom into the closet. So my dad had given me a gun at this point. So I'm holding the gun. We've got the house phone. We've got her daughter, and she's got. And she's got the. She's got the butcher knife.

[Hannah]

How old is her daughter?

[Megan]

I'm gonna say she's four or five at the time. This is.

[Mackenzie]

Oh, my God.

[Megan]

Four or five. So what is scary is that my master bedroom closet sat over the garage. So take that picture and remember that. So we're in the closet facing out this way and calling. So we call 91 1, and we're like, look, we got a boyfriend. We think he's taunting. He's at the door. He's ringing the doorbell, trying to get us come outside. And she spouts off my address at the time. And she said, are you at this address? And we're like, well, yeah, thinking like, how does she know? And she's like, your house is on fire. That is your neighbor trying to get you out of the house. You need to get out of the house Right. Right now. What? Yeah. And so we were screaming. We're like, are you sure? If we come outside, we're still in the mindset that he's outside and he's going to get us. If we open the front door, they're like, yes, you need to get out of the house right now. So we run down the stairs, run out of the house, screaming. Both our cars are engulfed, and that garage is engulfed. And basically, we were sitting ducks because the wall was on fire behind us in the closet. And we had no idea because we just thought he was ringing the doorbell. And he. What he had done was set a Molotov cocktail on my truck, which set her car on fire, which set the house on fire. And it was just like. It was a mess. It was a mess. Oh, my gosh. I know.

[Mackenzie]

Okay, so how do we know he did this? Like, were you able to prove he did that?

[Megan]

Well, so the crazy thing is, in the moment, I didn't have a way to prove it, but I knew. Right. So this, of course, what I would call a Barney 5 firefighter, fire chief. He took a interest in me, and it's a small town on the outskirts of a bigger town in Texas. And so we're telling him, look, he pushed me down the stairs, and he put sugar in our gas tanks, and I just kicked him out. I'm sure this is him. And this is what he drives and he's like, okay, I'll be back. And so he calls me and he's like, megan, I found his car.

[Hannah]

So this is all in the same night?

[Megan]

Just same night. We're like.

[Hannah]

You're like, outside the house?

[Megan]

Yeah. Well, at this point, we're back. They've got the fire out. It's crime scene tape everywhere. Everything's roped off. We're back in the house because they stopped the house from catching a fire. Luckily, I mean, the house. Right. So we're inside, and he calls me and says he's fine, found the car. He's like, we're gonna stake this car out. And so about another hour comes, I get a bang on my door. And, you know, a little PTSD there.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Megan]

Yeah. And he has a Polaroid picture. And he said, is this him? And I'm like, yeah, that's him. And he was like. He had no shirt and no shoes on. He reeks of gas. And we got a dog. They have dogs to find, you know, bodies. They have dogs that can smell drugs, whatever.

[Mackenzie]

Gas.

[Hannah]

Okay.

[Megan]

Yeah, they have all he had. Dumped his shirt and shoes at the gas station dumpster down the road as he was walking. So he made a big loop. He went out of my neighborhood, went to the gas station, ditched that. I'm sure he got gas all over him, thinking, like, oh, I'm going to be smarter. And then went back to his car, and they were sitting there waiting on him. So he goes to jail, right? Okay, yeah, he goes to jail. And at this point now, I'm like, this is not good. I'm in a mess. He just set my house on fire and tried to kill me. And I'm pregnant with his baby. So I call my dad, and I was raised by a single dad, and I said, dad, you got to come to Texas, because this is not going to happen. And he's like, you can't be tied to him. If you have a baby, you'll be tied to a crazy person for the rest of your life. So at that point, I decided, like, it's. It's a no go for me. I can't move forward with this pregnancy. So I had my dad come down to Texas and take me in. And I was probably, like, five weeks right at the cusp of being at the minimum that you could even terminate a pregnancy. But I had to think about my future and what was best for me. And I didn't think, this is a violent person.

[Hannah]

And you don't know what he would do. To you nor your future child.

[Megan]

Right.

[Hannah]

That's really scary.

[Megan]

So I go, and back then, sometimes still today, but most of us don't turn our phones off. But back then, you go into the doctor, whatever. You turn your phone off. That was the thing to do. And then you turn it back on. Why? To flip phone. And so sometimes back in the day, if you turn the flip phone on, sometimes the voicemails. Remember I'd said earlier that I kept clicking them to voicemail because he called so many times?

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Megan]

Well, it popped up like, I'm on the car ride. I'm a little kind of out of it. My dad's bringing me back to the house, and my voicemail, it shows, like, 15 missed voicemails. And so I start listening to him. And at first, it's a woman on there, and she's saying, oh, I'm Randy's sister, and he loves you, and he doesn't want you to do anything to the baby. And then the next one is from, oh, I'm Randy's lawyer. And then the next one is him begging. And then I start realizing. I start listening to him over and over again, and I'm like, it's him. It's. It's him. He's disguising his voice to sound like a woman, to sound like a warrior. Yeah, it was him. And all 15 voices. Yeah. And so I'm like, okay, he is deranged. This is not good.

[Hannah]

That's also.

[Megan]

Isn't he in.

[Hannah]

Isn't he in jail?

[Megan]

Well, he is at the time, but this. You know, he'd made all those old voicemails. They had gotten stuck in my phone, and I wasn't listening to the voicemails. Right. And I didn't hear it until after the whole, you know. Yeah. So two weeks passes by, and he bails out. Someone bails him out of jail. And so I don't like white stuff. I have my whole life. I know this is weird, but I have this phobia of white things like milk, mayonnaise, sour cream, cottage cheese.

[Mackenzie]

Oh, I have a friend like that. Okay.

[Megan]

Yeah. And so it's, like, super serious. And so anybody that dates me or is close to me, I at some point tell them. Because if they eat mayonnaise or something around me, I freak out.

[Hannah]

No, no, no.

[Megan]

I cry. No. Like, it used to be really bad when I was young. And so one day I wake up, and by this time, it's two weeks later. We had insurance. Now we're on our second insurance claim. We had already Got our cars replaced. We had a good insurance company, so we're in new cars by this point. It all happened kind of fast in those two weeks. And I wake up one day and I had a pool in my backyard. And the whole pool is white. And I'm like, oh, my gosh.

[Mackenzie]

What do you mean the whole pool was white?

[Megan]

He threw a whole can of paint over the fence into my pool because he knew I didn't like white stuff. And so I thought, like, well, this is so weird. Why would he even do that? You know? But I knew, like, and he's just messing with me.

[Hannah]

Well, then, wait, how did you, like, react in that moment?

[Megan]

I was pissed. It made me mad. You know, what else are you gonna do? I just basically pay to get the pool fixed or whatever.

[Hannah]

And so did it, like, so you're. But your phobia was a little more manageable at that point, so.

[Megan]

Yeah. But, I mean, it's not like I'm gonna eat. I mean, he's eating. It was edible. I'm not eating the pool water, so. Right. It was just a way to get at me. And then a few more days passed by and I come out from work and at the time, I was bartending and I had my brand new Tahoe and I had gotten it from insurance claim. I already got a new car come out. It's keyed all the way around, all the way around the car. And so I'm thinking, at this point, I was not really thinking it was him. I don't know why I didn't think at the time. I just kind of thought, okay, I work at a bar. Somebody saw I have a new car. They're just being an, you know, like, yeah, keep my whole car. And then it was a few days later again, probably this is over another week or two's time all this stuff is happening. I get a letter in the mail. And at this point, Kelly has decided I'm going to go back to Oklahoma, where we were from. She was like, you know what? I have a daughter. This is a lot. He's trying to kill us. He set the house on fire. I'm like, rightfully so.

[Hannah]

I get that.

[Megan]

Yeah, you need to go back. Right. So I'm living in this house by myself at this point. My cousin, I think, came over and stayed for like a week. And there's crime scene tape everywhere.

[Hannah]

How was that? How did that feel?

[Megan]

Like everybody that walks by or drive by is rubber necking and going super slow. You know, you're like the talk of the Neighborhood, which is not so swell. It was just a mess. And so a few days pass and get this letter in the mail, and it's to Kelly, and it says that the person is from Arkansas. Well, she went to school in Arkansas for like, a year before we met in college in Oklahoma. So I called her. I'm like, girl, do you still talk to somebody that would send you a letter from Arkansas? She was like, girl, no. Open that letter. See who it's from. So I open it, and it's from Randy. And Randy's telling her, like, oh, she's a terrible friend. She doesn't like you. You shouldn't be friends with her. So he's trying to turn her against me in this letter. And so I call the fire chief that had taken the interest in me, And I'm like, look, he is sending threatening letters in the mail. He's like, did you touch it? And I'm like, well, yeah, I touched it. I opened it. He's like, don't touch it anymore. I'm coming over there. So he comes with a whole crime seat kit, picks up the letter. He's like, look, Megan, I'm gonna put somebody out and watch your house 24 hours a day. I'm going to.

[Mackenzie]

Oh, wow. Really?

[Hannah]

Wait, did he say not to touch it because it could be evidence or because he could have put, like, stuff?

[Megan]

Yeah, evidence. So he took the first letter. He went and tested it. They had his fingerprints, and the idiot didn't wear gloves. So they pulled his fingerprints off the first letter, and it was. I don't remember exactly what that letter said, but it was. Was threatening enough that they put another warrant out for his arrest. And so.

[Mackenzie]

Wow. Really?

[Megan]

Yeah. So they knew at that point that he was stalking after I'd said, well, he put paint in the pool, and then now he's doing, you know, so the stalking. He was like, okay, I'm gonna get him on a stalking charge. I'm gonna hit him with that.

[Hannah]

Yeah.

[Megan]

And then I'm gonna hit him. So if you don't know, it is a federal crime to threaten someone in the US Postal mail. So if you want to do it, not do it in that, because it's federal time. So he sets this surveillance out because they, of course, try to find him. They can't find him to arrest him again. So they put surveillance on me about another week later. He's like, if you get another letter, do not open it. Sure enough, get another letter. So I call the fire chief, and I'm like, look, I got Another letter, and this time it's addressed to me. He's like, don't touch it, I'm on my way over there. So he comes over, he opens it up, and this is when I knew I was probably in trouble. Literally all of the handwriting went. Not that the other things weren't crazy, but the words were like going up at an angle. They weren't even going like normal across the paper. They were written like a deranged person. Like, oh, no paper, like, you know, just. It was a mess. And then on the back it had a map of my backyard.

[Mackenzie]

What?

[Megan]

And it said, this is how I'm going to come over the fence. And this is where I'm going to jump over. And this is the door and the window. I'm going to come in to kill you. And then it had headstones for me, my roommate, her little girl, the baby that I was supposed to have, and my dog. And so he had wrote all of this out on this paper.

[Hannah]

At least he wrote it all out, I guess because now it's like, well.

[Megan]

So, oh my God, that kind of Silda's fate when it came to, you know, it's kind of crazy. And I get how women and men, you know, because not that it doesn't happen to men too, but I get how you kind of lose faith in our court system because yeah, all these things happen over like a two month period. And we went to go talk to the district attorney and they were like, well, we've already offered them a plea deal. You know, it's 20 years, 20 years sentence. And he was a first time offender that they knew of on this arson charge. Well, but now we can get them for this federal crime of the death, threaten them and then. But the max, you could get a seven to 10 years. And I'm like, yeah, what? So I was so frustrated. And they're like, well, we didn't really realize that he was doing all of these things to one person. And I'm like, so if you'd have been doing it to 10, is that okay?

[Mackenzie]

Fine. Like this is fine.

[Megan]

And also no big deal.

[Hannah]

So they're saying they already. Because they already dealt with the initial case.

[Megan]

Yeah, like offered him pleading. He took it then, you know, and so now they've got warrants out for him. They can't find him, I think because he was stalking me. He knew that the guy was sitting three doors down because it was a car that was not normally there.

[Hannah]

Oh, wait.

[Megan]

So about another month passes and I don't know if either of you have ever been stalked, but it's not a good feeling.

[Mackenzie]

Like, oh, oh my God. It's the scariest thing.

[Megan]

Yeah, it's so scary. You literally are constantly looking in your rearview mirror. You're constantly looking over your shoulder. I would drive all the time and just see if I could see him follow me. And it just became my norm. And I just.

[Mackenzie]

Stalking usually means that you are their entire focus of everything. And it, that's scary to.

[Hannah]

And that's the feeling they want you to have. Like a lot of it is power.

[Mackenzie]

Yes.

[Megan]

It was not a good feeling. It wasn't. And so I, I, I feel like I got lucky because I did have this fire chief that invested in me for whatever reason. I don't know if it was my country accent because I was originally from southwestern Oklahoma. And he just, he kind of talked like this too.

[Mackenzie]

I love that you called him Barney five. Like that gives like he, that's so cute. Barney five is so cute.

[Megan]

And, or I don't know if it was just like this was the biggest thing that had ever happened in his career, but for whatever reason in that I felt like, okay, he's invested in me. He wants to help me. He wants to make this right. He wants to make him pay. So probably another month or two passes and I get a phone call from Barney Fife and he's like, he's like, we got him. He got, he's fled to Michigan. He got pulled over on a routine traffic stop and I'm going to fly an extra dite him back. And it just felt like I could have a weight lifted because I knew once he got put back in jail, at least for a while, he wasn't going to get out this time because he had jumped Bailey. So he gets seven year sentence. He got the max they could give him on federal time. So he was gonna have to serve that day for day. But he did come up for parole, like at year three because it was the first time offender.

[Hannah]

How did you feel on the days that he was convicted for the crimes against you?

[Megan]

I think it was more for me the day he got picked up and got extradited back. Because at that point I knew, like, okay, he's gonna go to jail, but surely he's gonna get some kind of time. And then when he did get convicted, it was just a sense of relief. You know, it's a no win situation. You don't come out of it a better person or happy. There's no happiness to that. Like, I was traumatized. It caused a Lot of PTSD and anxiety in my life for years. And so the only thing was I just felt vindicated and I felt heard and I felt like, okay. I don't think it's really more of a win or lose in those situations. It's more of like, okay, for a moment, at least this brief moment, I can feel safe again.

[Hannah]

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[Mackenzie]

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[Hannah]

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[Mackenzie]

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[Hannah]

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[Mackenzie]

I'm just too lazy.

[Hannah]

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[Mackenzie]

It's too accessible not to reach out for help.

[Hannah]

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[Mackenzie]

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[Hannah]

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[Megan]

So he goes to jail. And I don't know if you guys know anything about the prison system, but you can get a victim's protection like a vine number and write the parole board. And so every year after year three, I would get notification in the mail and then I'd have to sit down and I'd have to write out, you know, this is why I don't think that he should be let go. And I'm afraid if he gets out, he's going to come back for me. And I just don't have a good feeling about this. And so I did that all the way up until the year before he was going to get out. So I just had to kind of pray about it. So like six years pass?

[Hannah]

Yes.

[Mackenzie]

Wow. Six years.

[Hannah]

What goes on in those six years for you? Just give us a little update on where you are.

[Megan]

So I'm married at this point. I've sold that house. I'm on to my next house and I'm, I'm.

[Mackenzie]

Did you feel safe at that point? Like what you were like, okay, he's in jail. Like I'm safe.

[Megan]

If when he was in jail, yes. But when I knew he was going to get out at the seven year mark, I became terrified again because I always thought, because of everything that I'd been through, I always thought he's going to come back for me, he is going to come back for me. And so I live with that mindset. You know, I had a son not his and was married and I did kind of for those years I did feel safe because he was in there and I knew where he was at. Right. So it's the year before he's about to get out and I just make a decision because of my anxiety and I just kind of prayed about it, it and I'm like, he's going to get out next year or not. So just leave it up to God. If he's meant to stay in there for this last year due to his behavior or whatever they see about him, let it be on the court system and not on you. Like, it was like my way of just trying to let go. And so he stayed in there the full seven years. I did get a letter and they were going to parole him back to my county. And I'm like, could you at least parole him back to the county next door. Like, does he have to come back to this county? This is crazy. So they did.

[Mackenzie]

Oh, my God.

[Megan]

Leading up to him getting out from his prison sentence, it was a lot of anxiety, it was a lot of fear. It was a lot of sleepless nights, a lot of PTSD again, because you're going back into what you feel like is, am I going to constantly have to live with looking over my shoulder? And I did that for a long time. Years. I'm not talking days or weeks or months. I mean, years. I had systems in place and things in place, and I'd gotten a gun and put in my house. I would always know where exit signs were. I literally. I would go put my son and I in the car. This is so bad. Do not do this. FYI, But I would always turn my car on in the garage with the garage door down and make sure that we were locked in the car before I would let the garage up. Because something in my head just always said, he's going to come back for me, and he's going to be standing outside the garage. And I just overthink everything. When you've been stalked and when you've had violent crimes, a victim of violent crimes, you just learn to think differently because, you know, if you don't, then you might not be alive to see the next time. You know what I mean? Like, you have to think differently. You have. You have to. You're forced to.

[Hannah]

Did you experience any judgment for that? Did people think you were being too much?

[Megan]

I think that that's the crazy thing is that I kept a lot of it to myself. I did. But then I confided in my husband at the time, and, you know, my husband. And when we divorced, I. I remember him making comments, which was also part of him trying to manipulate and gaslight me. Was like, you know, he made the comment to me of, it wasn't you, it was Randy. You know, it was your fault. You just made him crazy. Look what you're doing to me. You're trying to ruin my life because you're divorcing me. And it was you. You did everything to him. And so, you know, fast forward 20 years passes, right?

[Mackenzie]

Like 20 years. Oh, my God. Okay, Pass.

[Megan]

And I get a divorce. And I wasn't in the best marriage. I'd kind of repeated the cycle. And so I was in a long, tumultuous, terrible marriage, but I have two blessings from it. So I walked away from that thinking, like, megan, something's got to Change. You got to start listening to your red flags. You literally have got to start listening because you tend to listen or see a red flag and let it hit you in the face and just keep on going.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Megan]

And so it was rough, right? So I start dating again and I've got two kids. I'm a single mom. And a few times over the 20 years, I kind of get out of it. And I tried to look them up online. Yeah.

[Hannah]

Anything? Nothing.

[Megan]

Nothing. Looked at it four months.

[Mackenzie]

Just curious, like, wanting to know where things are.

[Megan]

Right. And I hadn't in probably seven or eight years. And so about six months ago, I.

[Hannah]

Was dating six months ago, like this year.

[Megan]

My divorce was just final last July, so I'm dating. And I don't know if you guys have it in your towns, but we have this women's group and it's. Are you dating the same guy?

[Mackenzie]

I knew you were gonna say that.

[Megan]

And so I'm dating and I'm on the apps mind. You dating is so much different than it was 20 years ago.

[Mackenzie]

Yes, it is.

[Megan]

And match and bumble and all the things. We didn't have any of that. And so I'm here. I'm like this 20 something year old kid in my head trying to learn how to date again because I've gotten a divorce. And so I'm dating a guy. And he. His initials were two initials. Okay. Tells me he lives in a suburb of Dallas and everything was fine and great when we were together, but if we weren't spending time together, then his communication got pretty sketchy. And so I just like my red flag. Just like it would only be texting. He would never talk to me on the phone.

[Mackenzie]

Oh, he has a wife. He's married.

[Hannah]

I don't know.

[Megan]

Right. And so then like, I asked him what the initials stand for and he tells me a name. And that name, like, I have systems because I'm an insurance agent. So I have. Where I can look up. Like, I can look up. If you have a background, I can look up what is your address and what is your driver's license number. So I'd asked him his date of birth. Right. And at this point, I'm dating multiple guys. Like, I'm trying to figure it out, you know, put yourself out there. Exactly.

[Hannah]

And there's nothing. I mean, if somebody has nothing to hide, they don't mind if you ask them like, hey, yeah, what's your name? Usually that's like a pretty okay question.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Megan]

I searched my systems and I have two pretty good systems and didn't find anything. And then I ran his phone number, and his phone number went to a random person's name, and I thought, hmm, this is kind of weird.

[Mackenzie]

Phone numbers are great because people don't change their phone numbers often. Like, I've had mine since college. I had my phone number for 25 years. So that's a great place to start, is with the phone number and when that's weird. Something.

[Megan]

Yeah. Well, you know what a text now number is? So if you don't.

[Mackenzie]

It's an app, right.

[Megan]

And so if you Google that and it doesn't even come to any close to the person, that it's probably a text now number. I mean, it's a number, but it's one that they've just got. It's probably not even to their cell phone, right?

[Hannah]

Yeah.

[Megan]

So I just keep having these kind of red. Not kind of these big red flags. I tell them, I'm not gonna hang out with you anymore unless you show me your driver's license. License. I asked, like, four or five other guys I was dating the same time. I'm like, hey, is it weird if I wanted to see your driver's license? And they all were like, ding.

[Hannah]

And like, yeah, because if you have nothing to hide, you're okay.

[Megan]

Right? And this guy would not show me his driver's license. And so what?

[Mackenzie]

Let me guess. He said, that's weird. Why do you want that?

[Megan]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

You're so intrusive and you're being sensitive.

[Megan]

101 gaslighter 101.

[Hannah]

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[Megan]

I'm sitting there and it's the evening Time. And it's a time where we're not together. I told him, I'm not going to see you again unless you show me your driver's license. I've got kids. I've got a five year old little girl. It's not happening. And so he's getting angry about it and I'm like, it's not happening when he keeps saying, can I come over? And I'm like, are you gonna show me that driver's license? So we're sitting there and I kind of go down a rabbit hole. It's like 10 o' clock at night, my kids are in bed. And something told me to google Randy. I don't know why, but it was just like I hadn't felt that gut feeling for 20 years, 25 years at this point. And something said, this guy is lying to you about his name. And it made me feel the same way Randy made me feel. And so I google Randy. And I went down a whole rabbit hole, you guys. So Randy got out of prison probably around 2010. And fast forward, she says he's now in prison again, but in 2015 he was going to commit suicide in jail. And he had wrote a note and there was a girl that had been missing for a year at this point. And he says in the note, I'm responsible for Jane Doe's death.

[Hannah]

What?

[Megan]

Yes, in this, this note that he left. Well, the jailer catches him trying to commit suicide, saves him, he doesn't die, and then confiscates the note. So then of course, the D. A comes in and they're like, okay, tell us about this girl that's missing. And so they knew the girl. And here's where it gets a little crazy. In parallel, the year before that, she'd been missing since December of like 2013. So like around 24, just from my timeline.

[Hannah]

When did he go to, when did you he go to jail?

[Megan]

2010. So he got, he went in like 2003, was in to like about 2010. Okay. He, he paroled out. So he probably was on parole at least a year or two and then wasn't even out another year or two. And when I knew him, I mean, not that I knew everything about him, of course I didn't. In three months, clearly I didn't know near enough. But he had gotten into trouble for drugs. And so he was actually serving some prison time for drugs in 2015 and then rats himself out when he's gonna commit suicide. Like, I'm responsible for this girl's death.

[Hannah]

Hi, guys. Really Quick. From this point on, we are gonna be describing more detail of this murder. It's graphic. And if you don't wanna hear that, all you need to know is that Randy did kill her. And you can skip ahead 2 minutes and 43 seconds.

[Megan]

Seconds. Well, this Jane Doe, she had went missing the year before, and she had been missing for a year. And Randy had a sister. Now, remember I told you the dad was in jail? Well, he had a sister that clearly the whole family had issues. The sister was about to do some major time too, and they start questioning the family. There was a girlfriend that he had that he lived with, and this Jane Doe had come up missing, and Randy was the last person to see her. But he had always just said, well, she just said she was leaving my house because she had had a baby. She had just had a baby two weeks before she went missing. And the baby was in the nicu. Okay. So then the DA they start questioning Randy, and Randy says, well, she was into drugs and I gave her drugs, and I'm not responsible. I didn't kill her. She OD'd. And so they go and they start questioning everybody around them, Right? Well, they get to this sister and she was about to come up on some charges and do some hard time. And so she rats them. And she says, I went to his house the day that Jane Doe went missing, and he had something really big wrapped up in a comforter in his bedroom. I think you probably go check this animal farm that's like less than a mile from his house. Because his girlfriend keeps telling me that he always asks when she goes to visit him in prison if anybody's been to that farm or if anybody's discovered anything.

[Hannah]

So they girlfriend, his current girlfriend while he's in prison.

[Megan]

He says he tells the D. A When they're questioning him. He's like, well, I think that Jane does baby was mine. I don't know. I need to get a DNA test. And so I think. I don't know for sure, but I think probably what happened was he had a girlfriend. He was living with a girlfriend probably cheated on her and killed the Jane Doe because he didn't want his current girlfriend to find out about that baby that he thought was his.

[Hannah]

Oh, my goodness.

[Megan]

Yeah, this animal farms like a pig or a horse farm. And they find a piece of cement that was out of place. They dig it up and they find her, and she is hog tied. She had ropes like hog. Do you know what hog tied is? Like entire your hands together. She had tape all around her mouth. Oh, no. Plastic bag over her head. And then just tape all around her body all the way up and down. And they did an autopsy, and I think this is how they got him. It was during COVID when he was going through trial all these years later during COVID like 2021. He didn't even get convicted till all this time later. And she came back and of course she died of asphyxiation. So he had killed her because the bag suffocated her, like putting it over her head. So yes, she did have some drugs in her system, but it was clear that she died from asphyxiation. So he. He lied. So they did get him on second degree murder. I feel like they should have got him on first degree murder. But I think, yeah, body had decomposed. It was. Was probably. It was too hard to get him for first. Right.

[Hannah]

See, to me, I'm like, but if he hid the body and buried it and.

[Megan]

And he admitted that feels like evidence. Yeah. I mean, come on now. Like, what if she truly died of a drug overdose? You would probably maybe call to get her some help. Like, let's call 91 1, you know? Or let's. Yeah, like let's.

[Hannah]

You also wouldn't hide the body. That's so awful. We. Okay. I want to hear about how you found all this out and how that felt, but keep going.

[Megan]

Yeah, I mean, it was the gut feeling. It was the gut feeling that the guy that I was dating, I hadn't felt that feeling in so long. And it was familiar. And I couldn't have looked up Randy for probably seven, eight years. I just didn't think about it. I'd stop thinking about it. Like, I felt safe in my marriage. I felt as far as being okay have a man in the home. I'd kind of forgot about it until I started dating again. And I felt. Felt awful. I felt awful because I thought, what if they would have given them the 20 years? I felt responsible some sort of way because I felt like, what if that happened? Then he would still been in prison.

[Hannah]

Wait. Yeah. So this is all public, like press coverage is how you're finding it all.

[Megan]

And yeah, everything is. Yeah. Google is your best friend. Right. And so I found everything. Literally. I probably looked at the pictures and I expanded them every which way for my cell phone because I was laying in my bed thinking, surely not. Like, surely this is not Randy. Right? No way. And so then I just start scrolling and reading and going down that rabbit hole and it's overwhelming. It's overwhelming. Because you're like, I right, I was right. I'm not crazy. So every person that thought, not that it wasn't bad enough, I mean, hell, he set my house on fire. Right?

[Mackenzie]

That's insane.

[Megan]

Come on, that's Dateline. That's.

[Mackenzie]

That, that's day 100 date.

[Megan]

Like, I mean, I already knew, but it was vindication. It was vindication because was. I doubted myself for a long time, but I was also just in shock. Like, I was literally in shock. And then I had to call. My first call was to Kelly, my roommate, all those years ago. Like, are you sitting down? Guess what? I googled Randy and he's killed somebody. And she's like, what? And I'm like, yeah. Like, was she surprised? No, because we lived it and we lived it together and nobody was ever going to feel the way that we did, you know? Yeah. And at that point, when I was googling, I found a Facebook group going down the rabbit hole and it was her family because she'd been missing for a year. And so.

[Hannah]

Oh my gosh.

[Mackenzie]

Oh my God.

[Megan]

And at the time, really it was her mom that was the voice for her daughter because she'd been missing for that year. And so when I reached out to this inbox on Facebook for this Facebook group for Jane Doe, I thought that maybe I was going to be talking to the mother and actually ended up being her sister. And she responded to me and she was super kind. And then I just said, I'm so sorry and this is what he did to me. And I. It was emotional. I know that they had a loss. I'm feeling for them. That's when she told me, you know, we've done a DNA test. We thought at one point that maybe her daughter was Randy's daughter because that's what he had said. But we've DNA tested her and she's not, thank goodness. So at least they're not having to deal with that for the long run because that would be like a double edged sword. Right. Like you're dealing with. He took her life and then now he's the freaking the father. Yeah. Like, that would have been really rough and tough. I would think. Think I would not want to be in that situation. And I was in that. Or I could have been in that same situation 25 years ago and I just chose not to be in that situation. I mean, I knew at the time that it was the best decision for me terminating my pregnancy, but I knew for sure six months ago. It kind of gave me some validation because you're always going to have that. What if in the back of your mind, like, maybe I shouldn't have took this route or did I do the wrong thing? And I actually had fertility issues. It took me six tries to get my daughter, and I ended up having 43 years old. And so I went through a rough patch, like, had a stillborn and lost my son. And I thought, man, is this because, you know, all these.

[Mackenzie]

You think you're being punished?

[Megan]

Yeah, Right. And God doesn't punish. But it felt that way. And I thought, well, maybe this is to teach me a lesson, you know, is to make it hard. It just was rough. It was a lot of feelings to get through. And talking to her family, I just said, look, I will always be a voice for your sister, even though I didn't know her, because I need to be a voice for both of us. And they were very thankful and very happy and proud that I would do that for the sister and the daughter, even though I don't know her. But, I mean, I feel like she's this. It's the same scenario just 10 years later. And it's almost like I feel like he did to her probably what he wanted to do to me because he's just so angry at me because I was not gonna let go until he got put in prison. Like, I just wouldn't let it go. I do feel a connection to Jane Doe, for sure. I do, because it's. I feel like it's parallel. Like, I was pregnant by Randy. She, I think probably in her head, probably died thinking she was pregnant by Randy, who her baby's father was. And so for sure, I feel like all the things that he said in the letter that he sent to my house that he was going to do to me, I feel like he did to her. So it's very parallel. It's very. Like I'm the one that got away and she's the one that didn't. So it's almost like you have some guilt of, like. Like, why was it her and not me?

[Mackenzie]

Yeah. Yeah. Survivors Guild, almost kind of.

[Megan]

Yes, for sure. It is. So sorry. And to think about, like, it's snow outside, and you're walking to go see your baby in the nicu, and you somehow just don't come home. Like, why didn't you just make that left turn to go see the baby at the NICU instead of that rack turn to his house? You know what I mean? It's just the what ifs. And I decided because I knew what a victim protection number was. I'd been in the VINE system before. It's actually ran by FBI if you don't know, and if you've ever been a victim of a crime, you can get a VPN number. And so that gives you updates, like when they're going to be released, because they only gave him 25 to 30 years. And y', all, he's been in since 2015. He's already served 10 of it. That means he's up for parole in 2035. Wow. And so he could get out again. And.

[Hannah]

Oh, my God.

[Megan]

You know, and so clearly he's been doing this since he was 23 years old. He's not going to stop. So I called the DA's office in Michigan, in that town, and she was this. So nice. I didn't know at the time. I thought I was calling the Victim Protection Services, and the lady answered the phone. I got emotional. I cried on the phone, of course, and just was like, look, he did this before her. He did this to me, and I'm the one that got away. Had he been convicted the first time on the first charge for setting my house on fire, maybe she would still be alive. Oh. I said, he's psychotic. And the DA said, megan, you're right. And I remember this case. I actually tried this case at that point. She was like, he is psychotic. And I'm like, yeah, it's clear. And to go look at his pictures and he's got this look in his eye. And looking back now, that was the one thing that should have been telling. He had this crazy look in his eyes. It was just this look. And he always had it on his face. It just was always this look. And that's the one thing that I missed. I missed until it became an issue. You, like, I. That or I just discounted it or I didn't. It wasn't really a red flag at the beginning, but now it's like, huge red flag because I just can look at his eyes and the pictures and be like. Scares me to death. Like looking into the eyes of a murderer, and if that became his life, that became his life. So I just told her family, I said, look, I applied for a vpn. The DEA didn't think that I would be able to because I wasn't the victim on that case. But. But then she sent me to the VPN services for the prison board, and the lady called me back within a day or two, and she said, yes, you actually can, and yes, we will notify you. So now I have a vpn even Though I'm not the victim on that. I'm a victim of his. And so since I'm a victim of his, I can write the parole board and I will write every year. I will write every year to be.

[Mackenzie]

Like, good for you.

[Megan]

Let him out. You know, because the next time it could be me. You just never know.

[Hannah]

Oh, my. This is six months ago.

[Megan]

Yeah. When I googled them. But I am a child survivor of a murder suicide. So my dad, my mother, the day they divorced and locked me outside and shot. Unloaded a gun in her five times and shot her in twice in the back of the head and then killed himself.

[Hannah]

Megan.

[Mackenzie]

Oh, my God.

[Megan]

So it's just the survivor skill. Like, why did he not take me in the house? Right. Like. Like, why was it me? And so then, I don't know. It's just. It's. I sometimes I'm like. I look at my life and I'm like, this is my real life, you know? But I tell people it could be the crazy crackhead on the street. I could have let my past define me, but I've chosen not to do that. We're not going to let our past dictate our futures.

[Mackenzie]

But good for you.

[Megan]

Yeah. But it doesn't mean that it's not tough. And I'm always labeled the strong one. And, you know, that's kind of tough. I went my whole life being the strong one because you're like, I didn't choose that.

[Hannah]

That.

[Megan]

Yeah. Also looking at my life and being like, okay, well, you didn't allow this to happen. But your childhood trauma has clearly affected you because it's like daddy issues. Right. Like, probably the daddy issues of what caused my poor choice in men and just wanting to be loved and the fear of abandonment from my childhood trauma and tolerating more just to have somebody there, which was a terrible path for me. Right.

[Mackenzie]

That is so interesting. You. I think so many people are going to relate to that. I personally relate to that.

[Megan]

That.

[Mackenzie]

And that's a good point you made. Tolerating more because you just want. You're like, oh, look, I'll tolerate more. I just love me.

[Megan]

Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

Oh, thank you for saying that.

[Megan]

Of course. Oh, my gosh.

[Hannah]

Yeah. Our hearts are with her family, too. And just. I think. Yeah. You sharing this story helps us see what's possible and help what is preventable and help so many people. So thank you for trusting us with that story and responsibility because, yeah, it's like, we don't. We don't have a lot of loss of life. On this show, and it's serious, because any story could get to. You never know what point. I think, yeah, like you said with this talking, when you get through it without something like, this wasn't that bad. And it's like, all of these stories could be that bad.

[Megan]

I think, too, because of my childhood and the past that I lived. Like, I don't put anything past anybody, you know?

[Mackenzie]

No, same.

[Megan]

And when my friends are, like, dating and. Or in the past, and I'm like, no, change your number, or, no, don't answer their call, because if my own dad can do something crazy, then anybody can do something crazy.

[Mackenzie]

And it's so easy to be like, no, it's fine. And then we had the authors of Big Liars on the show, and they were saying that for the most part, people don't lie in general. People are kind of honest. And so a lot of people just easily believe someone. Like, they'll be like, yeah, this is fine. And our first instinct isn't to go, oh, no, they're big fat liars. But over time, you start to see that people are capable of crazy things.

[Hannah]

Yeah.

[Megan]

You want. I think the natural human wants to believe that people are good, right?

[Mackenzie]

Yes. Yeah.

[Megan]

Believe that people are bad and do all these things that we see on tv, we don't want to believe. And sometimes I'm. I still. I ask myself all the time, like, is this my real life? Like, I have so many friends, like, you should write a book. And I'm like, you should if you want. But, I mean, it's a bit much, but, you know, like, you just. You just cannot put anything past anybody. Anybody is capable. Because if anybody. And here's the thing. I know when I'm angry, anybody, if they're human, can be pushed and pushed and pushed to where you can act out of character and do something that you wouldn't normally do.

[Mackenzie]

Yes.

[Megan]

Imagine if they're not right in the head, what they could be pushed to do on a bad day. So take you on your worst day and take somebody that's not mentally sane on their worst day. Nobody can do anything.

[Mackenzie]

Like, such a good point. Yep.

[Hannah]

I want to go back to that guilt you said you were feeling about whatever part you feel you may have played. How are you navigating that guilt?

[Megan]

I think it's, you know, it's just. It's the same kind of feelings when you have a stillborn, and that's super taboo and nobody really wants to talk about it. And anybody that knows me or that you guys have just Met me, of course. Right. But I'm super vocal. Like, I blog. I blog on my Facebook. I'm very open. So the more people I can tell and share my story with, if it can help one woman, then that's how you give back. That's how you make a change in life. You take what is bad that's happened to you and you take the guilt that you carry, even though maybe it's not your fault, but we're human. So anybody that's got any kind of empathy, you would not be human to think that it somehow wasn't your fault, even though it wasn't. Even though I know it's not my fault. But if you just have those what if moments, like, how could I have changed the true trajectory? You know what I mean? Like, how? And if I can't change it that way, then how can I make an impact? And how can I make a difference otherwise? And how I can do that is through podcasts or through blogging or just whenever I have a gut feeling to share, like, whether it's infertility or share this story, like, if I have a friend that's struggling dating, I'm like, well.

[Hannah]

Let me help you. Yeah, let me tell you something. You're not alone. Oh, I love that, because you just kind of reframed the guilt that comes with this type of experience as empathy. And, like, actually a really big, beautiful sign, because even if it's just cheating, like, so many people are like, oh, if I don't tell the next person, what if he does it to somebody else? Am I responsible for that? And it's like, yeah, you feel that way because you're empathetic. You feel that way because you care. And that sucks. But it's beautiful. I don't know. That was nice. I love that. So is this where it ends? Like, this is what we know or tell anything else with the family of Jane Doe?

[Megan]

Yeah. I mean, I tried to get the sister, of course, to come on, and I think that they don't want to be in the. The public eye. And so I just knew that, like, you know, her story needs to be heard, and we can be given a very tasteful way and do her sister some justice. And this story is going to help somebody. It's going to help, oh, 100% to avoid. It's going to help women to really pay attention. Like, well, crap. It is much more serious if a guy lies about their age or their date of birth or their name than what you think. It can go down. This whole rabbit yeah. You know what I mean? Like. Yeah.

[Hannah]

And you're not crazy for being nervous about it. You're not over dramatic.

[Megan]

No. If they, if they lie about little things, imagine what they're really hiding and what they're. Yes, you know what they're really lying about. So it's a fear of, of not knowing what you don't know. I think too, just for me and being in dating and trying to do all that is like I mentioned it slightly earlier, but it was really just taking a hard look in the mirror. Like I had to take some accountability because these are choices that I made. Maybe I wasn't the one making the really bad choices, but I made some bad choices over the years when it comes to men. So it's just I have to really like not so much like come down on myself or whatever, but I know that I have to change my path forward. Like I have a little girl. I have to have somebody around me or date somebody and date with intention. That's going to be kind and nice and all the things because. Because one day I'm not going to be here and one day my son and my daughter need to know what it's like to be in a healthy relationship. And if I was not a good example due to my poor choices, then that is what I've got to fix. Right. So I am happy to say that I'm in a very loving, caring, great relationship now.

[Mackenzie]

That's amazing.

[Hannah]

What changed about the way you approached this person? What changed about the way you verified him?

[Megan]

Well, I'd prayed for years even in my marriage, either let my ex fix himself and this get better or let me get out of this and let me find somebody that is truthful and loves me. Nice. And I fell for divorce four years ago and I took him back after like three months. And in that I like I'd been so done for so long in my head. I think that's kind of what women do. By the time we actually finally leave physically, we've been mentally gone for a long time. And so at that point I dated and I dated a guy four years ago and my ex wanted to go to marriage counseling. I'm like, no, we've been like five times, it doesn't help. And this guy that I dated at the time was like, no, you have kids with him, you need to go. He pushed me, like regardless if it's just going to be a co parenting situation or whatever. Well, I ended up taking him back and this guy never faulted me for it. He was so kind. But he kept keeping tabs on me through my hair girl. And when I left. Yeah, really, he was just checking to.

[Hannah]

Make sure you're doing well.

[Megan]

Doing. Is she okay? And he did that every three or four months. And she would tell me, like, hey, Steven's checking on you.

[Hannah]

Wait, that's actually really cute.

[Megan]

I saw him last year, and I was dating a different guy because I had filed at this point. I saw him at a bar, and he's like, well, why didn't you call me? And I'm like, like, I wasn't ready. And I told you the last time I talked to you that I would not call you back until I was ready. I needed to figure some things out. When you leave a marriage, especially when you've been with that person for 20 years and have two kids and been through a boss and all the things, you've got to work on yourself. You've got to heal. I was like, look, I was a mess. I cried every day, you know, even though I knew it was the right choice for me and my kids, I had to work on myself. Like, Megan, today, even one year or two years ago, is such a different. You know, I go and my. I go to work and my staff are like, you look lighter. And I'm like, oh, does that mean I look skinny? You know, Right. I'm not carrying all this heavy weight around. And so I don't know, three, four months ago, I just up and picked the phone up and I just called him and I said, hey, I'm ready. I'm ready to try. If you're not with somebody, as long as it's just me and you, and we've been together every day since, so it's just, you know.

[Mackenzie]

Wow.

[Megan]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

That sounds so cute.

[Megan]

I know. So. But they say, I will say you need to see somebody through every season, all four seasons. So I'm just trying to, like, live by that. That's dating.

[Mackenzie]

I like that, actually.

[Hannah]

It also makes you take your time, right.

[Megan]

And you need to, you know, can't be their words coming out of their mouth. They need to show you with action. And that for years, yes, I didn't pay attention to the actions. I would just. Just hang on to the words and just hope for change and hope that what those words were saying was going to make a difference, and they never did. It's always the actions. Pay attention to the actions.

[Hannah]

Will you tell us about your podcast?

[Megan]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, sure. I have a podcast called Got Her Back Podcast and Got her back. Yeah, got her back. Like, yeah, it's with my best friend Carrie, and we divorced at the same time. We filed for divorce, like, two years ago. So we started it, and we talk about all things women and all things girls, and. And it's been great. Like, it's been a great. Yeah, we keep it real to the 100, that's for sure. Like, the good, the bad, and the ugly. So we talk about current events and talk about Megan's dating scandals, clearly. And I love that. So it's good.

[Hannah]

That's good to have that, especially since it builds a community of. With us sometimes, you know, I'm like, well, anybody I date, there's an army of Mackenzie and dating detectives that. That you don't want to mess around with. Like, you don't want to end up on the podcast.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah. Honestly, go listen to Got her Back podcast.

[Megan]

We have about 70 episodes so far. And with. There's, you know, all things divorce. There's a good one on narcissism, There's a good one on co parenting, and there's a good one on red flags. That's kind of our thing. We usually have red flags and throwing up in the air, like, oh, that's a red flag.

[Hannah]

Oh, we have that. Wait, where's my red flags?

[Megan]

Yeah, so we. We do that. We throw red flags up in the air. One of us is like, is that a red flag? It's kind of a red flag. And just all things women, you know, anything that really. Like, how do you get through the trials and tribulations of divorce? How do you start over?

[Hannah]

That sounds awesome. Everybody has to go listen. And thank you so much, Megan.

[Mackenzie]

Thank you so much for sharing all of this. I. I'm getting. Oh, my God, that scares you. Just never know.

[Hannah]

I want you to also keep us updated on your new relationship. And then, of course, I mean, I never want him to get out of prison.

[Megan]

Yeah, I'll be. I'll be a pen pal to the parole board for sure.

[Mackenzie]

But, you know, I'm glad that you said that also, because I feel like a lot of people give up, and they think that their voice doesn't mean anything, but you just have to keep. Use your voice as a weapon. Just keep talking. Keep talking, because you never know when that letter's gonna get in front of the right person on the parole board. And they're gon to be like, you know what? This person is really serious. Like, this person keeps writing out. We need to listen to this person. You know, so you never know when.

[Hannah]

You could be that Right.

[Megan]

You're.

[Hannah]

You're doing this for a lot of other people through your podcast.

[Megan]

And thank you guys so much for having me on.

[Hannah]

I appreciate that. Oh, my gosh. I loved meeting you and I can't wait to go listen to more.

[Mackenzie]

Wow.

[Hannah]

Oh, my gosh, Megan. That was a lot. But let's start by talking about the Jane Doe victim.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah, let's talk about the murder victim. And. And just I want to acknowledge what her family has gone. I can't even imagine.

[Hannah]

So I looked up more about this. We'll still keep it anonymous. But I was curious about why the case took so long to get solved and they, for a year were fighting to get law enforcement to take the case more seriously. Cause it wasn't.

[Mackenzie]

It.

[Hannah]

It was like crazy to think that he was the last person to see her. He was suspected to be the father of her new child, which we know that it's usually the husband is a suspect or the baby daddy or boyfriend or whatever as primary suspect. And they didn't take it seriously until he wrote that letter. And so I think some of that is that there was drug use potentially involved and she wasn't the perfect victim. So I wanted to talk about.

[Mackenzie]

That sucks. And we've talked about that a little bit before about the perfect victim. And it's like, what is the perfect victim? Basically, people think that if you were on drugs or if you're short, you're too sure you deserved it or you whatever. And that's not. Not fair. It's not true. It's. That's awful.

[Hannah]

I saw something. You know me. I go on my rabbit hole. So Dr. Jason B. Whiting is someone. He describes the perfect victim as someone who's weak or vulnerable and involved in a respectable activity at the time of victimization. So the victim must be blameless in all aspects of the interaction with their offender. And that's kind of the ideal. And typically that means straight, white, cisgender woman who. Who is perfect and like, never does anything wrong. So in the case of drug use, in the case of sex workers, in the case of undocumented immigrants, in the case of any kind of person that is considered, I don't know, not flawed, like, just flawed.

[Mackenzie]

Exactly.

[Hannah]

We're conditioned to take it less seriously. I also wanted to use. This time we're going on a Hannah tangent.

[Mackenzie]

I like it. Keep going, Keep going.

[Hannah]

Did you know that there's a crisis of missing Native American people in this country?

[Mackenzie]

Yes, I did know that. That's such a. A lot of people don't realize.

[Hannah]

A lot of people don't realize. A lot of the cases go unsolved. And I do believe that that is because of this systemic racism and our justice system and society at large has that problem. And the media and the public give a lot more attention to missing white women. And cases involving women of color just don't get the same attention. And then same with this, like that drug use, that sex worker, whatever it is, it just doesn't get the same attention. And myself included, like, I'm including myself in somebody who's been conditioned to feel that way. And I think a lot of us are. And I'm not saying that to make you feel bad. I'm saying that because, like, we have the opportunity to change it.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah, I think it's. It's such a big thing that people don't realize that actually happens. But it's a numbers thing. Like people can say, nuh, that doesn't really happen. It's legitimately a statistic.

[Hannah]

There's like a crisis. Yeah, look that one up, up. And people will say, oh, it's lack of resources. Well, why is it a lack of resources?

[Mackenzie]

Exactly.

[Hannah]

Because if the media is talking about a case, then people put effort and money into it.

[Mackenzie]

Exactly.

[Hannah]

Like there's so many factors that we can acknowledge.

[Mackenzie]

That's such a good point. I'm so glad you brought that up. It's something that I think needs to be talked about more.

[Hannah]

I agree. And I think that that was probably a big reason why it wasn't taken seriously until he literally confessed in a letter. And even then they were like, well, second degree murder.

[Mackenzie]

But imagine what Megan must feel like. She knows it's not her fault. But also I can understand why there's guilt. I could understand how she could feel that it sucks.

[Hannah]

Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

I couldn't imagine living without.

[Hannah]

That's the part of our conversation at the end where we try to, you know, give resources and talk about these things and make people feel better. But there's sometimes where it's like, no, this just sucks.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah, Yeah, a hundred percent.

[Hannah]

And it sucks that she has to live with this. Because as you've talked about living knowing that you've been stalked or could be stalked again, it is.

[Mackenzie]

That's a feeling. Hell, it is a feeling like you have no control of anything. Anything. And it's so terrifying because this is a living human being that literally is unpredictable. That's why I don't like frogs, dogs. It's unpredictable. You never know if they gonna jump. You never know.

[Hannah]

I know where you're going with that.

[Mackenzie]

I'm sorry, but I'm trying. They are unpredictable, and you don't know what's gonna happen. You can't control this person, and so you never know. Are they going to be unhinged? And just like in a previous episode, the stalker came into her house and just turned a pillow upside down.

[Hannah]

Or just to scare you.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah, just to scare you. Or is this someone that is gonna come after you and try to hurt you and try to be violent? Like, it's. It's awful. I can't.

[Megan]

Can't.

[Hannah]

I can't either. She did talk about vine, which is a resource if you are a victim of someone who's incarcerated. So victim Information and notification every day. It's a free service that gives you updates on offenders in custody. It can notify you if they're changing their status or released or transferred, which at least gives you a little bit more information if you're in that situation. And I. I just, like, I can't believe he. He's basically got away. He didn't get away with it, but he got away with a lot.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah, he did. And sometimes there's a situation where, like, okay, they go to jail for something else, but you still want them to be held accountable for what they did to you. You know what I mean? And so at what point do you, like, you should have access to all of that. And so that's why I appreciate Vine. But how terrifying must that be if you're a victim of someone and they only, like, the justice system isn't always as. Just as we want it to be. And so you're terrified that this person's going to come out and hurt you. And then, you know, you. You have.

[Hannah]

Too late.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah, it'll be too late.

[Hannah]

It's scary, the part about writing everything down. Like, part of what did help her get access to, having that information to be able to write the letter to keep him locked up as long as she can, is because she had previous incidents.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

And had reported and stuff.

[Mackenzie]

So her advice was legit.

[Hannah]

Yeah. Write everything down. Send timestamped emails to yourself. Right. That's another way to. I mean, do both, like, physically write it down. And also have digital, I think, tell people if you can.

[Mackenzie]

Yes.

[Hannah]

Just so that you have someone that can verify your story. And then I also was thinking about just the reasons why people do not want to report to law enforcement, which are understandable. The P. DID Case going on right now. I watched one of those documentaries, and the woman was in the Middle of a custody battle that was already messy. And she was like, I don't want to call the police and potentially complicate my custody battle and lose my children.

[Mackenzie]

Yep. There's other things going on. Like, it's not just. It's. It's not everything's like in a vacuum.

[Megan]

Right, Right.

[Hannah]

And people might be afraid of discrimination, whatever. This perfect victim thing. Like, there. I know it's easy for us to be like, call the police. Call the police. And a lot of people don't for valid reasons.

[Mackenzie]

And that sucks because if they do, it could affect them in one way or another that we're not aware of. So it's. It just becomes so nuanced and so tricky.

[Megan]

And.

[Hannah]

So what do you think? Should they just write it? Like, is the best advice to just write everything down?

[Mackenzie]

Keep a journal. Like, even if. Okay, so. And a lot of people say, well, you could make it up. Like, yeah, sure you can. But if you write everything down that happens like you are die diary, journal at this date, at this time, this is what happened. This is exactly what happened. This is my account of what happened. This is how I felt. This is how I responded.

[Hannah]

And I told this person about it. It.

[Mackenzie]

Yep. This is who I.

[Hannah]

Which I know is hard everything.

[Mackenzie]

But then if they say, well, you wrote down. Why didn't you call? You can actually write down and be like, I didn't call because this person, like, threatened me. Or perhaps like, I just, I didn't have a. Whatever.

[Hannah]

What about an episode or two ago where the guy had ties in the law, in the justice, like he knew the judge. Like, that might be a reason you don't want to report because you know that they're tied in with the freaking.

[Mackenzie]

Billion dollar daddy war books. And what are you supposed to do? How do you get around that?

[Hannah]

Yeah. Or maybe they're a cop themselves.

[Mackenzie]

Exactly. Yeah. That's terrifying.

[Hannah]

I don't know, guys.

[Mackenzie]

We're.

[Hannah]

I wish I could just snap my fingers and solve this whole problem.

[Megan]

Terrible. But.

[Mackenzie]

But I'm. I'm so grateful to Megan for sharing her story. Because, you guys, we say it all the time. The more you share, the more we talk about it. It brings awareness and so don't stop sharing. Thank you so much to Megan for sharing her story. And thank you to all of you guys who are emailing us and sharing your stories, discussing. Yeah, keeping the conversation going on social media and just continuing to talk about it. Your voice becomes your weapon. We've. I know we've said that several times.

[Hannah]

Speaking of discussing things. I want to pose a topic to the community, you included. So you know how she kept saying the same thing that so many people have said, like, my picker's broken.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah. Oh, yeah. My.

[Megan]

Yeah, my picker's broken.

[Hannah]

And we kind of talked about. And I love that she said this. Like, she was like, I do want to take accountability for things that I can do and learn about myself through choosing a pattern of bad partners.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

And I struggle with the balance of taking responsibility without excusing the abuser.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

And I know that we've had listeners that have said, why don't you guys tell your guest that what they did was kind of not the right move and they did put themselves in harm's way, and that's not what we are here to do. But I am curious how y' all navigate taking accountability while still not blaming yourself because it's hard.

[Mackenzie]

Well, and there. But there's. So it becomes a matter of perspective. You can say, oh, man, if I were to see something like that again, this is what I would do differently. Without saying, oh, I just. This is my fault. Whatever. Yeah, I'm an idiot. Because hindsight's always 2020 every time. And so if you can go back and say, okay, next time, I think I'll do it this way. And like you said, it's growth.

[Hannah]

Yeah. And we just have to be grateful for the experience.

[Mackenzie]

But that's what life is, right? Every day is an experience. Every day is learning. Every day is an experience. It's all growth. So it's hard to hear our guests who say, oh, I felt so stupid. But it has nothing to do with how smart or stupid or, you know, bad decisions. Like, every day I make a bad decision. We all do. But we're all just humans having a human experience.

[Hannah]

You know, that's why I love the word femtuition, because it implies that you have to make your intuition personal. Because femtuition, one, it's like suggesting that in your. Like, you have a specific type of intuition if you are a woman or have a feminine or minority experience, that's like. That shapes it. And then on top of it, you have to factor in so much of your own life to hear your own specific feminine femme tuition talking to you.

[Mackenzie]

Yes.

[Hannah]

That's where I brought up. And I think the reason I brought up relationship ocd is because I just had this conversation on the Rat Girls podcast, if anyone wants to listen to it, because the host of that show, Abby, we were talking about, like, okay, how do you Actually, listen to your femtuition. And she has ocd. And it made me think about how, yeah, while I might be somebody who can say, okay, listen to my inner voice, voice that probably isn't going to work for her, whose inner voice is a different brain that's telling her a compulsive, intrusive, potentially dangerous thought. And so her relationship to her femme tuition has to be developed differently than mine.

[Mackenzie]

That's so true. My femme tuition is constantly saying, did I make the bed this morning? When really, it's like, you're in real danger. Like, you and different people. You're absolutely, absolutely right.

[Hannah]

It's different. And I think, yeah, it just. Just got me thinking about how there's not one size fits all advice. So I know we're. We're like, we always say, trust your femtuition. That's one size fits all. But what that looks like to you, it's to consider your own experience.

[Mackenzie]

No, that's such a good point you make. And that. I really like that. But it's. It's the same thing. It's your. Whether you listen to God or your femtuition or whatever, there's. It. It becomes difficult, especially for me. And I'll just give an example, because I'm a private investigator for 20 years, so I don't trust anybody already. And also combine that with my experience with dating and friendships and relationships where people leave me. I get left. I have abandonment issues. And so when someone finally does come into your life that says, hey, I'm gonna be here for you, or whatever, you don't believe them. And so your instinct, like, your first initial instinct is to be like, nope, I don't believe you. They could be totally telling the truth, but your gut is saying, no, no, they're lying to you, because that's your. Your experience. And so then it becomes difficult to determine. Am I fearful of recreating the same experience I had before, or is my gut telling me something? And that's where I think people falter.

[Hannah]

You got to learn your. Mine is like. Like with anxiety. I know I describe my anxiety as, like, jittery.

[Mackenzie]

Okay.

[Hannah]

And when I have a legitimate concern, it often feels a lot more grounded.

[Mackenzie]

Okay.

[Hannah]

You know what I mean? Like, I'm able to kind of sit with it. This is just me. But I had to learn that where if I'm, like, feeling really jittery and, like, I need to lash out or I need to, like, be emotional right now, that usually, to me is. That's probably something going on in my head a little more than reality.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah. It's kind of like. What do you call it when the impulse. It's kind of impulse.

[Hannah]

Yeah. Well, it's impulsive, for sure. And then when it's more calm, I'm like, okay, that feels like your femtuition telling you to trust it. And that's, like I said, just me. And I'm only figuring that out honestly, within the last. The last, like three months. So it's a journey. Yeah.

[Mackenzie]

It's a conversation that we need to keep going. So let's keep talking. And also, I will say, the more we talk about femme tuition, how many people have come on and said, you guys kept talking about femtuition. And then I just started thinking, what is my femtuition? And then they're like, my femtuition spoke up. And then it's like, wow. And you kind of see that, like, you've got the. You've got the femtuition. You just have to be willing to listen to it or at least give it an ear. Maybe not follow through with it if you're not ready, but you know what I mean?

[Hannah]

Totally. Oh, yeah. Sometimes we're gonna be like, shush. I really want to hook up with this guy. And you know what? That's life. And we're gonna be okay.

[Mackenzie]

Yeah.

[Hannah]

Wow. Okay. So you all have to go listen to Megan's podcast. That's another continuation of this conversation. It's called Got her back.

[Mackenzie]

I like the name of that too. That's really cool.

[Hannah]

Totally. And the fact that they're both friends who are. Are going through divorce, I feel like will appeal to many people who might want to gap about that.

[Mackenzie]

It's nice to know when you're going through something like that. Whether it's a divorce or a breakup or a job situation or a friendship, it's nice to know that you're not alone and just know that other people around us also have these feelings of sadness or anxiety or, you know, going through something. And you're not alone. So sometimes it's nice to know you're just not alone.

[Hannah]

I loved her. She was great. And I'm so happy she's okay. And we're sending so much love to all of the people affected by this asshole. And I hope he stays behind bars because forever and ever and ever. Sounds horrifying. The drawings that he sent her, which. Oh, yeah, sending threats through the US Postal service is a federal crime.

[Mackenzie]

Oh, fun fact, you guys, I'm dying because it's True. And if you lie to someone, if.

[Megan]

You mail a letter to someone and.

[Mackenzie]

You'Re, like, lying about something or you mail a check that, like, you have no, like a kiting check. That's a. That's mail fraud fraud. And that's a bad idea.

[Megan]

Okay, Fun fact.

[Mackenzie]

So if you, like, you know how we talk about if you. If someone borrows money from you, they're like, oh, I just need to pay my car, but really, they went and bought drugs or something. That's a crime. You're not allowed to do that. And if they write it in a letter and mail it, then it's a crime, and it's a mail fraud.

[Hannah]

So keep your mail.

[Mackenzie]

I just think that's so interesting.

[Hannah]

It really is. I had no idea. I had no idea. Hey, every day's a school day, especially at the everyday.

[Mackenzie]

I love that every day is a school day.

[Hannah]

I say that all the time. I love it because there's so much. I don't know. I'm constantly like, what? But that's why I love this. Is there anything else that you want to touch on before we bid everyone farewell? This is a dense story.

[Mackenzie]

When you guys share your opinions and thoughts on social media, any kindness that you have to offer, we always like to offer that to our guests as well. So please keep the conversation going. If you have a story you want to share, email us. Our email is Investigate the dating detectives podcast.com. email us your story. We would love to hear from you and make sure you join our Patreon. The link will be in the show notes. The five dollar a month or the nine dollar a month tier? The $9 one has that ad free listening we were talking about in the beginning.

[Hannah]

We love you so much. We look forward to continuing this conversation. As hard as it may be, it's a lot easier with you guys guys. So thank you and thank you, Mackenzie and I.

[Mackenzie]

You guys are so awesome to talk to. Our audience is literally the best. So kind and respectful, even if there's differing opinions. And you guys are just amazing. Thank you.

[Hannah]

On a lighter note, I am going to read you one comment we got from someone who I assume is not a listener. I think it's a dude. I just. It was on an old video. Just. Y' all let me know if you understand what this man is saying. He said, these girls not leave the house. Like finding out of your favorite coffee show going down the street where you live.

[Megan]

Live.

[Hannah]

I'll read it again. These girls not leave the house. Like finding out your favorite coffee show. Going down the street where you live. So if anyone has any thoughts on that, I'm so.

[Megan]

I love it.

[Hannah]

I'm still thinking about it. I saw it.

[Mackenzie]

That is my favorite comment we've ever gotten.

[Hannah]

Like, did he sit on his phone and accidentally comment on it? On it. Gave it to his toddler maybe. I'm fine with it. And gave engagement's engagement.

[Mackenzie]

Something about coffee is disgusting. So already it's a negatron atom bomb.

[Hannah]

Yeah, it's gotta be something weird. Anyway, I just thought put that out to the audience, see what you think we should do.

[Megan]

We should do a social media post.

[Mackenzie]

And say you guys check out our reviews and then just post that comment and this is the best review we've ever gotten. Yeah.

[Hannah]

That was so funny. It made me think. Really made me think. We love you. We love you guys.

[Mackenzie]

And as always, you guys, trust your femme intuition.