The Time Traveling Dogfish: Part 1

Summary

The Dating Detectives – “The Time Traveling Dogfish: Part 1”
Aired: March 2, 2026 – Dear Media
Hosts: Mackenzie Fultz (A), Hanna Anderson (B)
Guest: Claire (C)

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Episode Overview

In this gripping two-part episode, Mackenzie and Hanna sit down with Claire, a Canadian single mother, who candidly shares her harrowing experience with a “dogfish”—their term for deceptive, manipulative romantic con-artists. Through Claire’s vulnerable storytelling, listeners follow the dizzying six-to-eight week saga of emotional manipulation, love bombing, and ever-intensifying chaos. The hosts interweave education, empathy, and analysis, providing valuable insight into how trauma and mental health—especially Borderline Personality Disorder—can heighten susceptibility to romantic exploitation. The episode ends on a suspenseful cliffhanger, promising more revelations in Part 2.

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Key Topics and Discussion Points

1. Mental Health and Vulnerability as a Framework

• [02:00] Mackenzie opens with empathy for those with invisible struggles, specifically explaining Claire’s diagnosis of Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD):
  • “BPD involves intense emotions, deep fear of abandonment, difficulty with emotional regulation, and sometimes unstable relationships… their vulnerability is not a weakness. It’s never consent to being exploited.” – Mackenzie [03:29]

2. Claire’s Background and Pattern Recognition

• [05:07] Claire discusses her challenging upbringing and the resulting patterns in relationships:
  • She internalized the lesson “to be loved, you have to earn it.”
  • “For most of my life… all I wanted was for the person that's supposed to love me to actually love me in all situations.” – Claire [06:44]
• Therapy helped her link early emotional neglect to falling for narcissists and charismatic partners who later became cold or critical.

3. Meeting ‘Ryan’ – The Dogfish

• [09:40] Claire joins Hinge, where she meets Ryan—initially not her type, but persistent, witty, and attentive.
• He seems invested: checks on her, brings thoughtful care packages, buys flowers for her and her kids, and even writes a (terrible) rap song about her recently deceased cat.
  • “He rapped? No. His music was the most atrocious … but the song was about my dead cat.” – Claire [18:53]

4. Early Red Flags Overlooked

• [15:32] Ryan is president of a commercial real estate firm (verified by LinkedIn)—or so it appears.
• He quickly inserts himself into her life, helping with logistical emergencies (ordering a fancy Uber for her trip, offering to pay for rides) and sharing details of his affluent lifestyle.
• He plants seeds of distrust toward his own mother and ex-wife, setting up an “us vs. them” dynamic.
  • “If you ever get a chance to talk to my mom or my ex wife, don't ever talk to them.” – Claire quoting Ryan [24:10]

5. The Escalating Series of Crises

• Housing and Family Drama: Ryan claims his lavish house is too big post-divorce, but soon asks to stay at Claire’s humble condo, citing “people watching” his house and trying to “get him.”
• Car Trouble: Multiple elaborate stories about driving a Tesla acquired from another province, but shows up in a beat-up car borrowed from his sick dad.
• Medical Issues: Ryan frequently becomes “sick,” especially with supposedly severe, recurrent kidney stones, requiring repeated ER visits (Claire sees him sweaty, out of it, in triage; [42:24]).
  • “He has got his baseball cap, like, pulled down over his eyes. It looks like he's barely conscious.” – Claire [42:29]
  • Bizarre behaviors are explained with convoluted justifications (e.g., storing snacks in the bathroom for long ‘kidney stone’ sessions).

6. Increasing Isolation and Crisis Bonding

• [53:05] The repetitive crises create an intense trauma bond:
  • “That urgency and that chaos… can mimic safety. Like, I didn’t think I was being lied to. I thought I was being needed.” – Claire [53:11]
• The hosts validate this phenomenon, noting how familiarity with chaos makes it feel comforting or even ‘normal.’

7. Implausible Emergencies and Suspicious Stories

• Car gets “shot at” en route to Claire’s house, but Ryan refuses to involve police: “Don't call the police. I might bring danger to your door.” [47:01]
• Frequent job drama: Sudden company mergers, threats to his presidency, secret property bids.
• Family emergencies escalate: Dad has a heart attack. Then, Ryan claims his own heart attack.

8. Accelerated Intimacy: Secret Wedding

• [59:17] Ryan asks Claire (over text, while she’s working a wedding) for a secret elopement so his allegedly terminally ill dad can see him married before surgery:
  • “It was so weird to feel multiple things at the same time… what a romantic story this is gonna be one day.” – Claire [59:55]
• Multiple logistical obstacles (lacking documents, lost wallet, expired passport, “divorce certificate without gold seal”) block a legal marriage, but they proceed with a symbolic ceremony.
  • He’s late, wearing an ill-fitting borrowed suit, father absent, vows unwritten.
• Afterwards, he resumes odd behavior: sits on the floor, seems detached.
• Claire is “glowy,” hopeful, and still rationalizes the chaos.

9. Host Reactions and Validation

• Mackenzie and Hanna offer non-judgmental support, highlighting the dogfish’s manipulation, not victim foolishness:
  • “You can’t see the forest through the trees when the trees are falling on you at once.” – Mackenzie [71:45]
  • “This is all about the perpetrator. It's not about [you being] dumb or smart.” – Hanna [78:08]

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Notable Quotes and Moments

• "Vulnerability is not a weakness. It's never consent to being exploited." – Mackenzie [03:29]
• "He rapped? No. His music was the most atrocious music I've ever heard in my life… but the song he wrote overnight that he sent me in the morning was about my dead cat." – Claire [18:53]
• "The urgency and that chaos… can mimic safety. Like, I didn't think I was being lied to. I thought I was being needed. And that crisis, bonding." – Claire [53:11]
• “You can’t see the forest through the trees when all the trees are falling on you at once.” – Mackenzie [71:45]
• “This is all about the perpetrator. It’s not about you being dumb or smart.” – Hanna [78:08]

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Timeline of Major Events

| Timestamp | Event/Quote | |-----------|-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 02:00 | Explanation of BPD and vulnerability in dating | | 05:07 | Claire’s background: upbringing, patterns of attachment and relationship failures | | 09:40 | Meeting Ryan on Hinge; care package, love bombing commences | | 15:32 | Ryan’s impressive LinkedIn persona, intense pursuit, lavish lifestyle stories | | 23:32 | Ryan’s stories about family and his “dangerous” mother and ex-wife | | 25:53 | Tesla/car confusion; begins borrowing dad’s beat-up car | | 31:02 | Hotel night, music bonding, mysterious health problems escalate | | 34:30 | Kidney stone saga legitimated by FaceTime with Claire’s friend’s husband | | 41:18 | Persistent, worsening kidney stones—become excuse for isolation | | 42:24 | Claire witnesses Ryan’s ER visit; dad sits far away | | 45:22 | Ryan shares live location for “transparency,” building trust | | 46:10 | Claimed shooting attack on Ryan’s car; refuses police, won’t come to Claire’s house “to protect her” | | 53:11 | Trauma/chaos bonding deepens—Claire internally justifies each new crisis | | 59:17 | Secret elopement proposal via text; all obstacles navigated (no dad present, no legal docs, vows unwritten, odd dress code) | | 70:52 | Non-wedding photos shoot is canceled last minute due to another “family emergency” (dad’s heart attack) | | 77:00 | Claire gets text from “David” (Ryan’s dad) claiming Ryan is now in the hospital with a heart attack | | 78:36 | Episode ends with hosts teasing next week’s resolution |

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Atmosphere, Tone, and Takeaways

• Language & Tone: Candid, empathetic, sometimes humorous, always validating. Hosts mirror the audience’s frustration (“Bless his heart”) and confusion, but firmly avoid victim-blaming.
• Educational Moments: Explaining BPD, trauma bonding, chaos as comfort, and how manipulative partners exploit both.
• Memorable Moments: The musical “ode” to Claire’s dead cat; the wedding-in-mismatched-pants; a running tally of invented emergencies.

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Next Episode Teaser

The chaos promises to unravel in “Part 2.” The hosts invite listener theories and support for Claire, emphasizing that healing comes from community and understanding—not shame or blame.

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Listener Takeaway:
If you’ve ever felt sucked in by the whirlwind of a charismatic partner only to be left confused and doubting your own judgment, Claire’s story will resonate. Mackenzie, Hanna, and Claire illuminate, with compassion, how these emotional manipulations work—reminding us all that craving connection is human, but exploiting it is not.

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For Support:
If you’ve experienced similar manipulation or abuse, the hosts encourage you to reach out, emphasizing you are not alone.

Transcript

[A]

The following program contains names, places and events that have been anonymized or fictionalized for the purposes of protection and safety. The following program is provided for entertainment purposes only, and any commentary from the hosts are strictly conjecture and should not be held as making any definitive statements about the truth or identity of any particular individuals or circumstances. If you or a loved one are involved in an abusive relationship, please call the National Domestic violence hotline at 1-800-799-6-7233 for support.

[B]

Happy Dating Detectives Monday.

[A]

Hi everybody. Mackenzie just left la. We got to record this episode in the studio together.

[B]

I know it was. I love when we can record together. It's so nice.

[A]

Well, we had fun. We were also guests on another podcast that we've mentioned on Instagram. But get excited because we are excited. We got to go be guests there.

[B]

I'm really excited for that. It's always an honor when you get to share with other really amazing podcasts. It's just growing the community and we love introducing you guys to other podcasts. And you guys also recommend other podcasts to us, which I think is really cool.

[A]

Yeah, we all have the same taste, guys. I mean, like, not exactly, but you know what I mean. So if you ever watch TV show or anything and you're like, that's dogfishy, feel free to DM us.

[B]

We're down and people are doing that. Like, they're like, oh my gosh. I watched this and this totally reminded me of the Dating Detectives. And I think that's really cool.

[A]

If anybody wants to talk about the traitors finale, my DMs are open. But for today, we have a wonderful guest named Claire. It is going to be a two parter, definitely a big story, heavy story. I. I don't like this dogfish. I don't like. I don't like it.

[B]

A lot of our guests share how vulnerable they were and I just. These dogfish just take advantage of such vulnerability. It drives me nuts.

[A]

Before we get into it, our guest has Borderline Personality disorder. And I did a little bit of research so that I could explain it better for our audience. And so we and our audience could have a better understanding of how BPD changes shaped her dogfish experience, how it made her specifically vulnerable in a way that's tied to that. So Borderline Personality Disorder is a mental health condition. It involves intense emotions, deep fear of abandonment, difficulty with emotional regulation. And sometimes there are patterns of unstable relationships. And people with BPD often feel extremely deeply, especially things like love and rejection and Connection and betrayal. And sometimes it's at a volume that can be so overwhelming. So I know we all feel deeply, but this is like it's a. It's a. It's an illness. It's like it's a part of you chemically, that is different. And many people with BPD also have histories of trauma, which can shape how they attach to people, how they trust people, how they protect themselves. It's complicated to navigate a world when you're going through that, especially in a world that doesn't necessarily understand why your brain is working differently than what we see as the average. And she talks about how it's like a later diagnosis for her. She thought it was just anxiety.

[B]

Yeah. Which is scary.

[A]

No kidding. We also want to just say, so clearly you never know what someone is carrying. So you never know their trauma history. You never know their diagnosis. You never know what's not diagnosed yet. You never know the invisible battle that makes them susceptible to this love bombing and gaslighting and course of control. Their vulnerability is not a weakness. It's. It's never consent to being exploited. So, as you listen, we just invite you to hold compassion for the guests, for anyone navigating something like bpt, and for anyone else who's been manipulated like this. Because needing connection is normal. Needing connection is human. Exploiting it is not human. Sorry, that's not normal. So that's. That's my little framework.

[B]

And again, we really appreciate everybody who writes into the show to share your stories with us, because you just help grow the community and help other people feel less alone when they've been a part of this. So thank you for emailing us if you ever want to send us your story. Our email address is Investigate the Dating Detectives podcast dot com. And also thank you to everyone joining the Patreon. We always get so many new subscribers to our Patreon and we're really excited for that. So thank you for that. So be sure to join our Patreon. Thank you to everyone who's already subscribed. We appreciate the support and we just appreciate everyone listening. Should we get into it? Let's give. Let's give Claire the floor. We would like to give the floor now to Claire. Will you please take us on your journey?

[C]

Yeah, absolutely. So I'm Claire. I am living in Canada. I moved here about 25 years ago and have been here ever since. I'm a single mom to two lovely, beautiful girls. And at the time of my story, they were 2 and 6. So my relationship journey in adulthood has not been a smooth one. So throughout adulthood, I ended up in a series of intense, unstable relationships. And I've learned through therapy now that I have borderline that it's most likely a result of my upbringing. So I, I don't want to talk bad about anyone in this episode. Like, I don't want to talk bad about anyone. But my, my mom was the reason for my issues growing up. I was often compared to other kids. You know, like, it must be nice to have a kid that does this or, you know, and I remember being told, oh, I feel sorry for whoever ends up with, remember these. Like, they had such an impact on me. And I spent the last 20 years kind of blaming that, blaming my bad relationships, blaming my tendency to fall for narcissists. So through therapy, I've explored this a lot. And what I learned was as a young child, you're formative years, your identity growing up is based on your immediate surroundings. And so if your immediate surroundings are not stable and you are having to prove yourself, you know, you're learning that to be loved, you have to earn it. So for most of my life, I would be with boyfriends and partners and I would be looking for somebody to be there for me because I didn't have that. And I think that shaped a lot of my adult relationships because all I wanted was for the person that's supposed to love me to actually love me in all situations. And I ended up dating a series of narcissists and people that were very charismatic in the beginning and very charming and very love bomby and thinking, this is going to be my person, I've been chosen. And then it would turn into, you're too sensitive. Or I remember one guy saying, you know, I came home and I had like a horrible day at work. Something bad happened and I was very upset and I'm like, I just need a hug. And he's like, well, I can't drop what I'm doing just to give you a hug. Like, I'm in the middle of a video game and you know, and that's

[A]

the least attractive thing I've ever heard.

[C]

Right, right, yes. So it was just this constant looking for someone. Like, not that I can't take care of myself. I'm very independent, I have my own business, I'm single mom. Like, I can take care of myself. But you want somebody in those moments where you're feeling less confident or the world is out, you know, yeah, you're allowed. And you just want somebody to give a shit and put you first. Because I didn't have that. And so I think that was the problem. I kept seeking that in relationships instead of finding it within, you know. And so basically we start the story with I had been single most of that year. I had been with somebody that honestly I thought was my person before this was probably about 10 months before this story begins. And we'd been together for a little bit and I thought he was my person. And then that kind of fell apart and I was really devastated and I just didn't want to date. I didn't want to risk being hurt again. I didn't think I would find anything like what I had found. That was like a once in a lifetime thing. And I was really not, not looking for anybody. And so I spent most of the year on my own with the kids and with my friends and. But I was lonely and I'm like, I'm a sensitive person, I'm a big feeler and I have a lot of love to give, you know, so. So I went back on the dating apps.

[A]

I always like to know which apps people are using.

[C]

Oh, I was on Hinge. I was on Hinge and there's a lot of crap out there, you know. Yes. And then this guy Ryan starts messaging me and he's. He's very much not my usual type of. And so I kind of didn't know what to do with him at first because I'm artsy, I'm creative, I am not into sports or like fishing and he's into sports and he's into rap music and he makes rap music. And I'm like, eh, this is not my usual type. But he was persistent. That was the word I used to at first, and not in like an annoying way, but in a more of a flattering way. He was, he was quick witted, like he was funny, he was very charming. He made me feel wanted. Like he really did. And he was divorced, he had his son part time. And so I was like, okay, well I'll give him a chance. Like we're gonna keep talking for a little bit. And this all sort of started happening right around the time that I was about to go to this concert. My oldest, the six year old, I was about to take her on her first trip, me and her together, we were going to a concert. Her first big concert. She was obsessed with the singer, I was obsessed with him. And he was only making one stop in Canada. So I was like, you know what, I'm gonna save up and I'm gonna take my daughter to this show. So I was going to be out of town for a few days, and I was absolutely slammed that week. Before I do photography, I had two weddings. I was shooting back to back. I was sick. I was so sick. I had to get my assistant to do all the talking for one of the weddings because I'm like, I have no voice. I can't stop coughing. It turns out when I got back from Toronto, I went to the doctors and I had acute bronchitis. Oh, my God. Foreign.

[A]

I loved my Daily look clothes.

[B]

Okay. I loved mine, too. I was really impressed.

[A]

I loved it, if you couldn't guess. This podcast is sponsored by Daily look, and it's the number one highest rated premium personal styling service for women. So with Daily look, you get your own dedicated personal stylist to curate a box of clothes based on your body shape, your preferences, your lifestyle. You fill out a really cute, like, a quiz. I honestly felt like it was kind of like a dating app. It was like a vibe of clothes, and you would swipe right or swipe left, and then you kept doing that until it kind of said, is this what fits you?

[B]

It's like a dating app for your clothes.

[A]

It's not an algorithm. It's a real personal stylist. So they send you up to 12 premium pieces per box. It comes right to your home. You save the time, you save the effort, and then you try on what you like. And if you want to keep it, then you buy it, and if you don't, you send it back and it's

[B]

a little bit like Christmas.

[A]

Yeah, every single time. It's free shipping both ways. That easy.

[B]

So I got leggings and a T shirt, which is my freaking uniform. Other boxes that I've gotten, they dress me like I'm an attorney going into a courtroom, or like a professional woman. And I try to tell them, I work from home, I do surveillance in a car. I do not want these professional looks. I want something casual. And finally, Daily Look. Got it. So I'm really excited.

[A]

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[C]

and so after the second wedding, before I left, he wanted to get together. And this was literally, I'm shooting a wedding, he's telling me he's still in his office. He works downtown. He was the president of this commercial real estate firm. And so I was like, okay, fancy. And I did look him up. I looked on LinkedIn and I found the company's LinkedIn page and they list him as being the president. And there's videos of him doing like interviews on changing the corporate culture and all this kind of stuff. So I'm like, okay, he's legit, right? And so he says he's still at the office and he's working late and it was close to the venue I was shooting this wedding at. And he wants to just meet me before I go on the trip. I'm like, I'm sick, I'm exhausted. I have to be up at 5 in the morning, I still have to pack. It is not the time. And he's Kind of like not taking no for an answer, Which I was like, okay, he's keen.

[B]

He likes you.

[C]

Yeah, he likes me, right? And he kind of insists. And so I gave in, and I was like, okay, you can come by. Like, I'm gonna be packing. I can't speak. You are gonna be out before 11pm Like, I can't stay up all night at all. And so he does. He comes over, and I had no voice. We end up watching a movie.

[A]

When you saw him, was he as charming as he seemed?

[C]

Yeah, he was. And actually, the next morning, before I left, he dropped off a care package. He brought, like, cough syrup. He brought flowers. He bought three bouquets of flowers. Actually, like, one big one.

[B]

Overachiever. Overachiever.

[C]

Two for my girls.

[B]

I love that, though.

[A]

That's cute.

[B]

He thought of the girls.

[C]

He thought of the girls. And I thought that was very sweet. And the weird thing was. Okay, so earlier that week, I had to put my cat down. And this cat I've had since she was baby babies.

[A]

This is the worst week ever.

[B]

For.

[C]

It was. Yes, right? So, like, my poor cat. And I was, like, bawling for days and days. My cat was 19. She was.

[B]

Oh, wow.

[C]

My kids loved her. Like, she's been around forever. And so I was sobbing for days after that happened. And this is when he shows up. And so anyway, we have this night. We kind of snuggle on the couch. Nothing happens. I'm like, I'm sick. We're not kissing. I can't even speak, really. Like, we just watched this movie, and it was just n. So the next morning afterward, he has sent me a bunch of videos throughout the night of himself.

[A]

What?

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Wait, like, sexy videos?

[C]

No, not sexy videos. No.

[B]

Oh, okay.

[C]

He had sent me videos of himself recording a song that he just wrote. Oh, that's a nice gesture.

[A]

Depends on the song.

[C]

And I'm a musician, right? I'm like, well, that's really cute, but, like, a little intense. Like, I just met you. But the song is. Okay, first of all, his music.

[B]

He rapped.

[C]

I'm gonna have to send you.

[A]

Be honest. You're anonymous. Just tell us he rapped it. Was it good?

[C]

He rapped? No. His music was the most atrocious music I've ever heard in my life. It was so bad. He rapped it so bad. Like, he's white guy dad rapping too. And, like, he thinks he's amazing, and it is.

[A]

Oh, my.

[B]

Bless his heart, right?

[C]

And I'm like, aw. Like, he put this effort in, but the song he wrote overnight that he sent me in the morning was about my dead cat. What?

[B]

Wait, what? What?

[C]

So it was kind of like. It was very strange.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

But I'm like, he's creative. He spent all this time doing this. It's very sweet.

[A]

Right.

[C]

So I'm slightly alarmed, but you. I also feel very touched by the effort. And then it's time for me to go on this trip with my. With my little girl. And so we fly out for this concert. I have booked a taxi from the airport to this place. It was a condo that we were renting and the ride was booked through the airport on the website. It's like if you need a ride, like book through here. So I booked this place and we land, we get to the city, she's all excited. And the driver texts me me to say that he's on his way. It's going to be about 20 minutes. So I'm like, okay, well, we're at this entrance or whatever. We'll be by the side of the road. And so we're waiting and we keep waiting and it gets to like 40 minutes, 45 minutes, stop. And I've got no. And I've got this six year old with me and I'm in this different city and our ride isn't here. And so I'm trying to message the driver and he says something about having a flat tire and he can't make it. And so I'm going to be connected with a new driver. And I'm like, well, how are they going to know where I am? And so I go on the website that I had booked it through and the only way to contact them was email. And I'm like, I'm here right now. Why is there no phone number? I don't have time to wait for email. Yeah. And so I'm basically stranded. The driver stops responding. And so Ryan had asked when we land to text to make sure that we made it okay. And so I'm like, well, this is the situation. You know, we're kind of have been sitting on the side of the road for almost an hour now, and I don't know what to do. And he says, why don't I just order you an Uber from here and get you guys to where you're going. And I didn't know you could do that from a different city. But he does. And he orders not just an Uber, but like a fancy one. And I don't know much about cars, but this was like very fancy.

[B]

Wait, why couldn't you Just order your own Uber.

[C]

That's a good question. I mean, I was panicking. I was also very poor. Oh.

[B]

And he was like, let me do this for you. And you're like, he's a city.

[C]

Let me help you. Yeah, got it. Gotcha. And so I let him do that. And yeah, we get this fancy car and it takes us to a place, and he says, you know what? Why don't I take care of your transportation while you guys are out there? And, like, you need a ride to the concert, you need a ride home from the concert, you need a car to the airport when you're coming back. Like, just let me get it so I know you guys are safe. And I just thought that was really sweet. I was like, he's looking out for us. He wants us to be safe. And, like, how much does he care about us? Like, maybe this is the start of things turning around. And so when my daughter is sleeping, we're texting back and forth and learning more about each other. And I'm starting to learn more about his background and his job, his family, like, that kind of stuff, right? And so I learned that he's president of this real estate company, and he's been there for a while. He's kind of worked his way up. He's the youngest president in the company's history. And bear in mind, like, I have looked it up and I've seen it on online, right? Like, it's legit. And he tells me about where he lives, and it's in this very affluent area of the city. Sends me pictures of it, of him and his son. And he's telling me about this custom wine rack that he built, and it's all very fancy. This is a mansion. Like, this place is insane. Is he kind of, like, raggy when

[A]

he talks about himself or is it subtle?

[C]

No, he's actually more like, I don't want to be here anymore. He's like, since the divorce and everything, this place is just too big. I, you know, I don't need all this room. I only have my kid every other week. So I'm looking to move kind of thing.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

But I'm like, well, it sounds lovely. Like, maybe I could see it when I come back, right? Maybe we could hang out at your place next time. And it all seems very legit. So then we start talking about the divorce and his kid, and he. He says he's really close with his dad, but that his mom took his ex wife's side in the divorce, and the two of them are like, kind of out to get him, and they're trying to get her, his own mom with the. Oh, okay. Which I thought was very strange. It was weird. And he said, if we get together when you get back, and if this becomes a thing, if you ever get a chance to talk to my mom or my ex wife, don't ever talk to them. And he started almost planting, like, these seeds of danger. Like later on when I got back and we had plans to stay at his place for that night or whatever, something would come up, and he was like, ashley, can we stay at yours? And I live in this home, tiny little condo. I mean, it's not glamorous. And I'm like, well, why? And he said, well, there's people watching and they're looking for me to. Yeah, he's like, they're looking for me to screw up because they're trying to get her, the ex wife, to get custody of the son.

[A]

Like a PI.

[C]

Yeah, he said that his mum basically parked outside once for three hours just watching to see if he brought anyone in or. Like, he's like, they're. Yeah. And so he's like, they're waiting for me to screw up. And so I just don't want them to see me bringing somebody else to my place because obviously that'll give them something to go on and they're all out to get me kind of thing.

[B]

Of course they are. Bless his heart.

[A]

And were your kids at home? Like, was that something where you were like, I don't want.

[C]

No, no, no, no. So I have my kids. 50. 50. So they weren't home, but I'm like, my place is not glamorous. Like, it's very small. And he's like, I don't care. I just want to be with you and, like, not have to worry about this. So we. We hung out at my place a lot, and he would bring over the same stuff every time. He had a laptop, he had a guitar, and he had a bag of his immediate belongings. That was it. Like.

[A]

And did he have, like, a nice car?

[C]

Okay, interesting. You bring up the car because he's telling me the story about this. This Tesla that he got from another province. I can't remember all the details, but he drove out to this other province to get this deal on, this Tesla and drove it back. And that's his car now. And that actually leads me to the next point in the story. Like I mentioned, I'm a photographer. I had a big family photo shoot booked, and I'm heading over there. I had Just got back from this trip. I. I've got bronchitis, but I'm like, you know, I have to make money. So I'm on my way to this photo shoot, and I get pulled over, and I'm. I'm cutting it close. Like, I don't have time for this, you know, Like, I've got this group of people that are going to meet me in, like, 10 minutes. And I get pulled over. And I had forgotten in my wedding's sickness, new relationship kind of haze to renew my insurance.

[B]

Oh, no.

[C]

It was literally two days. It was like two days without it. That's so frustrating. So I get pulled over, and the officer, he's like, do you know why I'm pulling you over? I'm like, I don't. I'm not speeding. I have no idea. And he's like, you don't have active insurance. And I was like, oh, my God, I forgot to renew it. And he's like, I can't let you drive the car. I'm like, I'm on my way to this shoot. I have to be somewhere in literally six minutes. And he's like, I can't let you drive the vehicle. You have to leave it on the side of the road. So I get my own Uber. I get my own Uber this time, and with my camera bags, leave my car on this random street and text Rya. And I was like, this happened. I have no idea how to get home afterwards. I don't know what I'm gonna do. I just have to do this shoot. And he's like, I'll come pick you up afterwards. Don't worry about it. I'll come get you afterwards. We'll drive to renew the insurance. Like, we'll go back and get your car. It's going to be fine. And suddenly.

[A]

Okay, okay.

[B]

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[C]

So I do the shoot, everything's fine, and then he shows up afterwards. But he's not in his Tesla. He's not in this car that he talked about. He's in this old car.

[A]

Let me guess, is the Tesla in the shop?

[C]

Well, he tells me that he was with his dad and not in the city because his dad was sick and waiting for heart surgery. Oh, and he's been spending a lot of time with his dad. Dad is also moving to the city. Ryan's been helping him move all his stuff so he's Been spending a lot of time with his dad. So he said he just borrowed his dad's car. I was like, okay, whatever. Right?

[A]

Okay.

[C]

So drives me. We go get the insurance. It's very expensive. And I've had, like, a day, right? I've had a week. And he's like, you know what, do you just want to get a hotel tonight? Let's just chill out. And I'm like, that sounds amazing. So we. We stop and we pick up some drinks. We bring guitars. We get this hotel, and we just spend the evening making music and connecting and laughing, and it's a really fun time. It's just lovely.

[A]

Even. Even with his, like, rapping, were you able to kind of be like, he

[C]

didn't rap that night? Yeah, no, he could play. He played guitar. And I was like, okay, he can play an instrument. Like, he doesn't have to raffle, okay. And so we're making music together. I'm singing. He's complimenting me. Like, we're connecting about stuff, and it's lovely. It's really fun. And later that night, we try to sleep together. He can't perform, so I assume he's had too much to drink or stress or whatever. I'm like, it's okay. Don't worry about it. So we go to sleep. And then the next morning, he is very, very sweaty and hard to wake up. I'm trying to wake him, and he is not waking up. And I'm like, is he sick? Maybe he's sick, right? Maybe he caught what I had. I don't know. And so when he comes around, he apologizes for not being able to perform the night before. And he says that he has this really bad pain in his stomach, and he thinks that it's from hauling all this furniture and helping his dad pack and move stuff. And maybe he's pulled something. I was like, oh, that's. That sucks. It's okay. Don't worry about it. You know, I'm just, like, reassuring, right? Because if the guy can't perform, it's, like, not great on the ego, right? He told me it was the best night, but he's just in a lot of pain, and he had to go and help his dad again that day. And so I went home. This is October at the time, so it is almost Canadian Thanksgiving. And it was the same weekend that he had to have his dad moved out of the house by. So my friends and I always have a friendsgiving kind of event. You know, we have a little potluck. And so this year it was at my place. And so this was going to be the time that he was going to meet my friends. And by this point, he has told me that he's been to a doctor about his stomach and about this pain. And. And he said it's not. He hasn't torn a muscle. He is not, like, strain. He actually has kidney stones. And so I'm like, oh, no. Like, for a guy, right, that.

[B]

You hear that?

[C]

That's like, childbirth, right? It's just terrible. So I'm feeling very sorry for him and my friend who arrived. We're cooking. We're, like, putting food together and everything. And he FaceTimes, and he is lying on the floor at his dad's place, and he says he's been passing kidney stones. He's bleeding. He's been in the bathroom for over an hour. He can barely move. And I'm like, oh, this explains why he was all sweaty in bed the other day. Like, this. This makes sense now. And one of my friends who was over her husband came, too. And he's had kidney stones in the past. And he ends up on the FaceTime with my friend's husband, who gives him advice. And then Ryan gets back on the phone with me, and he's like, oh, my God, I feel so validated. Everything he said he experienced is exactly what I'm experiencing. What nice people. But I'm not gonna be able to make it. I'm in too much pain, right? So he tells me to come there after the friendsgiving potluck.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

So we have our friends friendsgiving thing. I'm worried about him. Obviously, my friends are kind of like, yeah, he seemed like he was in a lot of pain. We can just be done, and you can head over and take care of him kind of thing. And so he's at his dad's place, which is about 20 minutes outside the city, and I find him lying on the floor, and he's groaning and sweaty, and he's like, I have to get my dad's stuff packed this weekend. He has to be out this weekend because the new people are coming in. So, I mean, a lot of it was packed up, but I felt bad. I'm like, well, this guy can't move. He's dealing with so much pain. Like, what can I do to help? It's now my job to help. And his dad. I did meet his dad, David, because I ended up staying there that night. He said he was sleeping more at his dad's just to make sure that nothing happened in the night before this surgery, like, he was coughing a lot. He was, you know, like, he didn't want him to have a heart attack and be out of town.

[A]

And did you talk to his dad about the surgery? Did you talk about the heart condition?

[C]

Okay, so that's verified. He had a date for this procedure, like, a few weeks from that point. But Ryan was like, I just want to stay here. Like, what's the big house in the city like, when my dad's sick? So he asked if I would be okay staying there with him. And 75% of the house is packed up at this point. There's no food in the fridge. There's one chair that his dad was sitting on watching tv. Like, it was pretty bare. And so he's like, okay, well, let's just, like, sleep on the floor. And there's blankets. And we just grabbed a bunch of blankets and we spent the night, like, we were playing music and just bonding over that and watching a movie. And his dad was very sweet to me. And he went to bed, and you can hear him, like, coughing and coughing in the next room. I'm like, okay, this is why he wants to stay here, right?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

So we sleep on the floor. And the next morning, it was the weekend, and Ryan's still in a lot of pain, and. And there is still a lot to do. The kitchen hadn't been packed up. The place hadn't been cleaned. So I'm like, okay, well, I'll help. You know, I'll do.

[A]

You're sweet.

[C]

So I start cleaning this place, like, full on, like, deep cleaning. And it was gross. It was like. Like this old man had not cleaned the place in a while. And so I'm like, scrubbing toilets. I'm scrubbing baseboards. I am, like, cleaning the floors. And it's not great, but, you know, we threw on some good music, and Ryan's like, oh, you're killing it with a soundtrack. This is great. And, you know, everything is okay. He's not doing anything because he can't move. So I'm cleaning. I'm, like, packing stuff up. And I noticed that there was a spare bedroom, and it had this kind of gross old bed in it and a bunch of clothes in, like, laundry baskets kind of scattered around, and it would just look like a mess. Like, this room was just a mess. And so I didn't touch that room because he said a lot of his stuff was in there because he'd brought a bunch of stuff over because he was going to be spending time with his dad more, and he's like, I still have to pack all that stuff up and get it out of here before he moves. So like, don't worry about that room. And so I just do the rest of the house, right? And when I'm cleaning the bathroom,

[B]

I

[C]

thought it was weird that under the sink, because I was looking under the sink for like cleaning supplies, there was like cans of pop and like snacks in.

[A]

In the bathroom.

[B]

In the bathroom?

[C]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Under the bathroom sink. So like, I comment on it and he tells me, he's like, well, I'm in the bathroom for like an hour at a time with these kidney stones, right? And so I keep these like snacks and like sugary drinks in there so I don't pass out.

[B]

What?

[C]

Cause I'm like losing a lot of blood. And you know, I'm in there for like a really long time. So after the house is clean and I've like kind of put things in Rubbermaids and like put them in the garage, his dad isn't there, but he says, my dad really loved meeting you. He already thinks of you as his daughter in law. Oh, words. Whoa, hey, those were the exact words. He has seen me with girls before and he just thinks that you're this perfect girl for me and he could see how happy you make me. And he already loves you, but he thinks of you as his daughter in law. I mean, I mean, sweet.

[A]

That is sweet. Especially, I mean, you talking about maybe not feeling validated by your family. Like hearing that from a parent figure. Well, that's.

[C]

It must have felt good.

[A]

Really good.

[B]

But also a little weird, right?

[C]

A little weird. But I'm like going with it because it's really nice.

[B]

It's nice.

[C]

And so then the kidney stones keep getting worse and so wait, how long

[B]

does a kidney stone situation. Kidney stone. How long does it does an episode. Is it like ongoing or does it stop and then come back? Or how does kidney stone.

[A]

I don't know.

[C]

Well, what he told me was that it was like broken into a bunch of little pieces and like he would be passing like little pieces at a time.

[A]

Kidney pebbles.

[B]

Is this like. So is this like a weeks long situation most of the time or. Oh, okay, gotcha.

[C]

I don't know normally, but like, yes, it was.

[B]

For him it was a couple weeks. Okay. Okay, so go ahead.

[C]

So then his kidney stones, like, they're not getting better. He's spending more time in the bathroom. He is canceling get togethers. Like he's not doing good. And so he says he's gonna Go to the hospital. And so I'm like, well, let me come with you. I'll drive you. I'll be there with you in the waiting room. And he says, don't worry about it. I'll go with my dad. You've got the kids to worry about. It's fine. And tries to kind of discourage me from coming, but I end up going. And when I get there, like, I had my friend over so she could watch the kids while I kind of went to the hospital. And he's in, you know, the area where you go. I guess it's triage. Like.

[B]

Yeah. When you first get there. And they check you out when you

[C]

first get there, and you're, like, in this big waiting room, right?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

So he's slumped in a chair, like, near the front desk, and he has got his baseball cap, like, pulled down over his eyes. He is, like. It looks like he's barely conscious. And then I see his dad, like, four rows back. Like, he's not sitting with him. He's sitting not close, which I thought was really a bit strange. I was like, okay, well, there's a lot of family stuff happening. He's got this surgery coming. He's got this house. Maybe they were fighting. I don't know. Maybe there's something happening and there's an issue I don't want to.

[A]

They're like, I need some space, so.

[C]

Yeah, right, baby. I don't know. So they're not sitting together, but I end up sitting next to Ryan, and I'm like, what's going on? And he is, again, very sweaty. I keep saying that, but, like, he's, like, burning up. He is sweaty. He is really, like, almost, like, slurring his words. He can't sit up straight. He says he's in so much pain. And I'm like, oh, my God. Like, does he have an infection?

[B]

Does he.

[C]

You know, like, is something terribly wrong?

[B]

I just looked up on a Google machine, and it says that that is a sign of kidney stones. Is the fever. And basically signs of infection.

[A]

Oof.

[B]

The fever. Chill. Signs of infection.

[C]

So that's what I assumed was happening.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

And he ended up going up to the desk and speaking to the person there and coming to sit back down. And he tells me that it's gonna be a long time and that I should go home. And I've got the kids at home. I've got a babysitter. Like, he's got his dad. Like, I should just not have to not worry about it and go home. And I'm like, no, I want to make sure you're okay. Right? But he insists that I go home. And so I'm like, okay, well, text me what's going on. Text me what happens. Let me know how everything works out. And so I do go home. And then the next day, he is texting me kind of as normal. He's like, they gave me something to break apart the rest of the stones so they pass easier. And I was like, okay, great. Finally, like, you've had such a rough go. And so I just kind of accept that. And then I don't know if it was the next night or the night after he was going to come to my place again. And one thing that he had done this whole time was share his live location with me, like within a week. And he said that if ever I couldn't reach him or we were in different cities, then it would be a way for us to feel closer. That's what he. That's what he told me. And I was like, well, that's very sweet. That's kind of like. Like, I don't need to know where you are all the time.

[A]

But it definitely feels like somebody who's transparent, like, if they're sharing your.

[B]

Most people would kill for that. They'd be like, I would love it if someone was willing to share their location or whatever.

[C]

Yeah. I'm like. And so I'm like, okay, this is a very honest guy, you know, and that's very sweet. And so I can always see where he is driving. And so I see him driving to my end of town. And then he's probably about five, not even 10 minutes away. And you have to come down a main road to get to my place. And I see the vehicle stop. And then he phones me. And I hear briefly, like, what sounds like a guy yelling in the background.

[B]

What?

[C]

And I don't hear what is said. It just. It sounds like a guy is yelling. And then Ryan says, back off. And I'm like, what is. What is happening? And then the call cuts out, the call drops, hangs up, whatever. And I'm like, oh, my God. Like, what is happening right now? Is he being mugged? Like, what is going on? And so then he calls back and he tells me, and bear in mind, this is like 7:00pm like, it's not like late night or anything. This is normal time on a fairly busy street. And he says, someone just shot at his car. What? So he says that this guy, he's like, did you hear the guy? Did you hear him? In the background, he. He was shooting at my car.

[A]

Were you freaking out?

[C]

Of course I'm freaking out. Like, I'm like, oh, my God. Do you need me to call the police? Are you going to call the cops? Like, you're close. Just come over and we'll call the cops. And he. He refuses. He's like, no, don't call the police. And I was very confused because I'm like, he's close. Like, he's not far away. Yeah, yeah. Just come over the middle of nowhere. Like, this is 7:00pm you know, it's

[B]

not an unsafe time to be out alone.

[C]

Like, it's. Exactly, exactly. And so he says, no, don't call the police. And he's like, I can't come to your place right now because they might follow me and I don't want you to be in danger. And why?

[A]

Who would be following him? What did he.

[B]

He's just like, just another day. They're shooting at my car these silly willy nilly.

[A]

I'm not blaming the victim, but, like, what happened to get us to this point? Why is someone shooting at him? You know? Does he explain that at all?

[C]

No. It reminded me of in the beginning when he said, we can't stay at his place because people are watching him. He's told me this before.

[B]

And now they're shooting at him. Okay.

[C]

And now somebody's shooting at him.

[B]

Wild.

[C]

Okay. And anyway, so he's not coming to my place. He's five minutes away. And he's like, they might be following me. I don't want to bring them to your doorstep or anything. And he's like, I just have to, like, wait this out. And he's like, I don't know where to go. I'm like, you're on like a main road. You're fine.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And I'm looking at the map and he's like, on this main street, and I see this spot at the end past my place. Maybe five, six blocks past my place, the main road kind of turns more residential. And then it kind of gets more secluded. Like, there's trees everywhere and stuff. It's more like a park. And so I see this spot and he said he wants to hide. He wants to hide somewhere until they go away. What?

[A]

Why doesn't he want to call the police?

[C]

I know. And I'm like, I can call them right now. What can I do to help you? And he's just like, I'm just going to hide out for a bit and make sure that everything's safe. And so he drives, like, down the main road past my place to this park area, and just kind of camps out there for a bit. And I honestly, I'm like, I'm confused, but also I'm worried about him because I'm like, this poor guy, he can't catch a break. He's had kidney stones. He's like.

[B]

And now he's been shot at it at.

[C]

And now he's being shot at. And, like, he's just still trying to protect me. And I'm like. And I. I'm saying this now, and I'm like, in the back of my mind, I'm like, I hope people aren't judging me, because this sounds ridiculous. This sounds so ridiculous.

[A]

Well, yeah. So for people who have not been in that situation before, will you put us through, like, what was going on in your head in that moment? Because in the context, if you don't know what it feels like to be that confused and be that controlled by a new person, you really can't relate.

[C]

So I. Given my past kind of relationships and how tumultuous and narcissistic and eventually very uncaring they were, this felt like somebody that wanted to protect me from the beginning, and I was used to instability.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And so I.

[B]

That makes perfect sense.

[C]

Wasn't. It wasn't like, comforting chaos almost. It was almost like. It was like trauma bonding almost. It was like he was having such bad luck, you know, it was just like, oh, the two of us have such bad luck.

[B]

We have to.

[C]

We're gonna be there for each other kind of thing. Right. It was like us against the world.

[A]

It's like a lifeboat in the storm.

[C]

Yeah. And it didn't feel. It didn't feel chaotic or. I mean, it was, but I was. I felt like I was.

[B]

There's comfort in that. When that's what you're used to, that's your life.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And it's what you're used to.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And instead of this person bringing chaos and heartache, I get to be there for somebody. And, like, he was there for me when I was stranded on the road.

[B]

Makes so much sense, too.

[A]

It really does.

[B]

And especially in the moment, you feel connected to that.

[C]

Yeah. And I felt like. I don't want to say, like, chosen, but, like, I hadn't felt chosen or important to anyone, you know? And this guy had been giving me nothing but reassurance and want to protect you. And when he showed up with those flowers on the first day, like, it was this bouquet of, like, blue daisies for, like, mourning and then he said there was a white rose in the middle. Cause my cat's name was Rose. And like, it was just Rebirth. And, like, I was like, he's just so thoughtful. Thoughtful, right. And hearing, like, he's had all this bad luck. And I'm like, I seem to have bad luck. You know, it was just like a. I wanted to take care of him. And, you know, it was. Yeah. I mean, hindsight, like you said. But.

[A]

No, but that was great. Great description of just the feeling of wanting that connection. And then also just reminding. On this show especially, we go through all of the moments where things were bad, and we often forget to remember that there are some beautiful moments going on at the same time. Like you are falling, I assume, in love with him, perhaps, or at least big feelings. So it's like.

[B]

Well, because she's relating to him. And the more you relate to someone, the more you feel like you can love them and trust them. And she's relating to that because he's. It almost sounds like there's something always going on with this guy. And when you're someone who has always had that tumultuous kind of like you called them, issues with your feelings or whatever, and you've given us the background of the situation with your mom, and now all of a sudden, this guy has this chaos. There's comfort and safety in that. Cause it's familiar.

[C]

That's what I was thinking. That urgency and that chaos can. It's almost like it can mimic safety. Like, I didn't think I was being lied to. I thought I was being needed. And that crisis, bonding. And that's a statement. Adrenaline.

[B]

I didn't think I was being lied to. I felt like I was being needed. Oh, that's a statement right there.

[C]

Anyway, he does end up coming over later that evening, and he says he's exhausted and, like, we're just gonna kind of go to bed. Then we move on. To bear in mind that this entire story is about six, eight weeks long. Like, that's the time.

[A]

God.

[C]

Okay, so after this, his work comes up, and he says that the company is merging with another company and they're trying to force him out. They're trying to remove him as president. And he's. He's angry, he's stressed. He's gonna fight it again. He cancels plans for a few nights because he says he has to, like, prepare this presentation.

[B]

More chaos.

[C]

Why this is a bad idea and fight for his position.

[B]

More reason to feel sorry for him and support him.

[C]

Yes. Yes. And so I'm like, well, can I help? Like, I'm good at making presentations. And he's just like, no, no, no. I just, like, I just need to focus. I just. I'll text you tomorrow kind of thing. And again, it just. Just felt like emergencies bonded us, you know, it was just another thing of bad luck. And I'm like, oh, my God. Like, let's get through it together kind of thing, right? He tells me all of the stories. Like, stories about his co workers, about he gives names. And I remember looking up the company website because he says that he mentions this guy's name that's a good friend of his. And so I'm like, googling. And I'm like, okay, we'll see what he looks like. I don't know. I'm just.

[A]

You're one of us.

[C]

And lists the president as someone else. On the website, I find that this woman is listed as president and he's not on the website. And I questioned him on it and he said, well, they've already changed it because of the merger. And, you know, she's this acting president right now, so, like, that's why she's listed.

[B]

And.

[C]

And okay, this sucks. Like, how can I help you get through this kind of thing? He also, around this time, says that somebody wants to buy his house. And he hadn't listed it for sale. It wasn't for sale. Like, he says, it's a secret bid. And this sometimes happens with, like, very big properties. Like, then this was a $1.2 million home. And so somebody had made an offer. And he's like, it's perfect timing, especially if I'm being outed from the company. Like, I'm going to get this big chunk of money. I'll have this income. They're going to give me a severance package. I could put half of this away and, like, we could buy a place and it's still going to be really nice. And I'm like, it's a little. It's a little fast, but it's very fast. But at the same time, in the back of my mind, I'm like, I live in this shitty little condo. I've got a kid to take care of. It would be nice to have a nice house, you know, but it is very soon anyway, so that. Just dropping that in there, because that was around the same time as this whole work thing then he's so stressed. He's not seeing me very often because of this work thing. Says, like, he can't have any distractions. He just needs to, like, go in there and give this presentation. His kidney stones kind of come back. It's like. It was stress. It's the stress. Everything's happening.

[B]

Wait, so he passed the kidney stones? Like, the kidney stone situation was over.

[C]

And then it came out he had been okay. Yes. And then.

[B]

So he had more kidney stones?

[C]

Yes. Okay, so he had more kidney stones. So this was another reason he couldn't.

[A]

Yeah, we gotta ask the Google again.

[C]

Yeah. If they can come back, like, two weeks later. Yeah. So he's in and out of hospital, he says, and there's always a test result that we're waiting for or, like a transfer to another specialist or like another complication. And every time I stop questioning something, it's like another emergency would reset my emotions. It would be like, okay, well, how can I be there for him this time? Like this. Oh, this poor guy.

[B]

Because now he sees that he can. That you respond to it with help

[A]

because you're a wonderful, empathetic person.

[B]

Like, I hate how they take advantage of that now.

[C]

So his dad had this appointment for his heart surgery coming up, and so we're getting to that point where it's going to be a week or two away. And he's telling me about this procedure that his dad's going to have. And it's like, something to do with one of the valves. And they're going to put, like, a stent in, but it's going to be very major, like a quadruple something. I don't know what, but it's like a big, big surgery.

[B]

Oh, my God.

[C]

And he says the odds aren't very good he's gonna die.

[B]

Like, he's.

[C]

He's. Yeah.

[A]

Oh, man.

[C]

He thinks that his dad's like. Like a 30% chance he's gonna make it. And so I'm obviously feeling bad. I'm like, I've met this guy. He's very sweet. He doesn't think his dad's gonna make it. So he. And again, I'm gonna say, like, please don't judge me, girl.

[B]

We. There ain't no judgment here. No, ma'.

[C]

Am. So he suggests a secret elopement so his dad can see him happy in case. Before he dies, in case he doesn't make it. And basically talks about it being like, okay, well, we're not going to tell anyone. We can have a real wedding later, like, in a year or two. And we're just. For the dad to be. This is just for the dad. We're not going to, like, announce it or tell anyone. And we're just going to do it. And. And dad can see him happy before he dies.

[A]

Basically, when he asks for this, is it like, I'm imagining him, like, very emotional and just like. What was that? Conversation over Text.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

We weren't actually. Hannah and I were just talking about, like, proposals and fun, cute little ways, and we didn't think about even, like, text proposals, a new thing.

[A]

I was.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Quick and to the point.

[C]

I was working. I was shooting a wedding, and he texts me, and I'm at the dinner table.

[A]

Oh, my gosh. He's like, oh, speaking of weddings.

[C]

Wow.

[A]

So what went through your head in the moment?

[C]

It was like. It was so weird to feel multiple things at the same time. You know what I mean? It's like, on one hand, you're like, this is insane. On the other hand, you're like, what a romantic story this is gonna be one day, right? Yeah. And I'm like, if it's gonna make his dad happy, like, we could probably do it. And, like, nobody's gonna know anyway, so nobody will judge us. You know, we'll just do the real thing later. And I love this guy, and he loves me, and I know it's fast, but, like, it's one of those stories, you know, it's romantic. We look back 50 years from now, and it's like, okay, well, this was the crazy way it happened. But, like, look at us now. And I thought it was gonna be, like, very romantic.

[A]

I mean, you hear stories of couples that meet and get married really fast and are the happiest people forever. Like, it's not impossible.

[B]

I imagine if you're someone, like, if Claire had a lot of money, then I would be like, hmm, I wonder if he. But, like, what. What would she cost?

[C]

His angle?

[B]

Yeah. Like, she. Claire, was there ever a point when you were like, oh, is there a specific reason? Or you were like. Were you just like, I don't have anything to offer? So it's not like he's doing this for any particular reason? Like, basically.

[C]

Well, yeah, I could see how you'd

[B]

want to, like, do that for the dad. Cause you're like, well, he's. I mean, he's not after me for money or any else. Like, what could he possibly. What could be his angle?

[A]

Right. What can you.

[B]

This gotta be Take from me.

[C]

So, yeah, I believed it. And so I said, okay. And I had like.

[A]

Did you, like.

[C]

Yeah, over text.

[B]

Good for you. Yeah.

[C]

Over text.

[A]

Use, like, the dignity.

[C]

Thumbs up. Yeah.

[B]

Or just respond with the letter K. K. Okay.

[C]

Cool. I can't remember what my response was, but no. So he's all excited about this. I'm kind of slightly thrilled. Like, I think, how exciting. Like a secret elopement, you know? It's very romantic. And I had this dress that I had bought years before, and.

[A]

Sorry, I totally forgot. I think we should remind everyone that you had a broken engagement coming up to this. So this is when you want to talk about unmet needs, right?

[B]

And you're like, oh, this is my opportunity to go, to follow through me,

[C]

chosen me, you know, like, somebody is gonna get stability, you know? And so I had this dress that I had bought on Boxing Day years before, and I was like, one day, maybe I'll wear it. Like, it didn't. It wasn't a traditional wedding dress. It was from, like, a department store, but it was off white, and it had, like, this pretty kind of sequins and gold kind of beading at the top. Like, it wasn't, like, a wedding dress.

[B]

And you're like, this idea sounds great. I have the perfect outfit.

[A]

Yeah, look at that.

[B]

I do.

[C]

I have the perf outfit. I don't have to buy anything. I love any money.

[A]

I love when dresses are kind of like.

[C]

You find it a little untraditional.

[B]

Yeah, I do. I do, too.

[C]

Yeah. So I work weddings, so I have connections, right? So I'm. I know who to call for, who can be our officiant, who can be our photographer. So I bought some, like, hair extensions off Amazon, and. And I bought him a ring and some jewelry. Jewelry for myself to wear and booked my hair appointment and everything. And we were gonna do it on. And he. We had always stopped at this little spot when we were driving out to his dad's place. Like, his dad's lived kind of in the country, and it was October, so everything was orange and yellow and, like. Oh, and there was this little spot on the. This curve of a road, and it was. All the trees were, like, kind of equally spaced. Like, it looked really pretty. And we had stopped there and, like, taken selfies a few times, and he's like, what if we just did it here? And I'm like, it's so pret. Like, absolutely. Let's do it. And so I write vows, and I'm getting very excited, right? And this is set for, like, two weeks from now. And so we book a photographer, we book the officiant, and we go to this shop. It was a flower shop. And I knew the owner because I had done her daughter's wedding.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

And she Also sells marriage licenses. So I was like, okay, cool. I know this woman. Like, she can help us out.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

So we go. And she's like, do you have your documents? Do you have, like, have either of you been married before? You've got id that kind of thing? And so I've got all my stuff ready. He doesn't have his documents, so he doesn't have valid id.

[B]

What?

[C]

Because he said he had lost his wallet and was. Also. There was some unpaid parking fines, and they wouldn't give him a new driver's license until he paid them, and he couldn't pay them because he didn't have his wallet. Okay, okay. Stay with me. Stay with.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[C]

And so I'm like, well, what about a passport, right? He's like, it's expired. But I have a buddy that works at the government, and I can go down and probably get him to expedite one this week. He did it for my friend. He can probably get one in, like, two, three days.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

And he can't find his divorce certificate because he said all his stuff is mixed up with his dad's stuff with this move, right? Like, he'd been spending so much time there. Some of his. His stuff was there. Like, some of his clothes, his documents, and he had to figure out where these divorce papers were.

[A]

It was his idea to get married.

[C]

So I know, right?

[B]

Like, what you do.

[C]

Why do you have your stuff to do it? I know. So I'm, like, slightly disappointed, right?

[B]

But same.

[C]

And he explains it all the way, and then again, I can see his driving location, right? We remember he's sharing his location with me. Yeah, yeah. And so he. He says one day he's going to the law courts to get a copy of his divorce certificate. And I see him drive down there and stop at the building and assume that's what he's doing, right? And then he sends me a picture, like, a selfie of him in the car holding this divorce certificate. He's like, got it. We're on, baby. Like, I'm gonna head to the florist and, like, go get this marriage license.

[A]

He's, like, driving around, and we're. We know he doesn't have a valid driver's license, right? He's like, come on, buddy.

[C]

That's also a good point. That's also a good point. And that will come up again. Like, the driving thing. It will come up again. So he goes to the florist and gives this document, and they still won't accept it because it doesn't have the gold seal on it.

[B]

Oh, blessed redeemer.

[C]

Apparently he just got it from a clerk at the desk and they just gave a copy, but it wasn't like a notarized copy and that's what we need. And he's all pissed off and like, I'm like, it's okay, it's okay. And the officiant had told me, she's like, even if you don't get the documents in time, we can still have a ceremony. It's not going to be legal, but we can give you like a stand in certificate and you have 30 days to produce those documents. Yeah, okay. Okay. I'm like, okay, well, that's what we're going to have to do then, right? So the day arrives. I'm all dressed up and I go get my hair done. And it's like the perfect day. It's calm, it's not cold, it's pleasant. Everything's orange and yellow and beautiful and comfortable and just, it's very lovely. And so I show up at this little spot on the side of the road and the officiant is there with her witness that's going to witness the thing. And then the photographer arrives and he's not arrived yet. And so she starts giving me instructions. She's like, okay, well we're going to have this first look moment, you know, where we'll get him in position and then we'll get you to stay in the car until he's like facing away. And then you're going to come up behind him and he'll turn around and we'll get that moment captured, right? So I'm in my car and then she's texting me. Like that's how she's kind of arranging this. She's like, he's arrived, he's here. We're just gonna get him in position. And so they put him in the middle of these trees, whatever, and they're like, you can come up behind him now. And I'm so, I'm super excited. Like, you know, and I. We had talked about, like, what he was gonna wear and he said he was going to wear like he's a business guy, right? Like he's a CEO. He has suits. And so he was gonna wear this really sharp, like, navy suit. And he told me everything about the tie, everything he was gon. And he's wearing this, like, he's wearing a navy suit jacket and these like massive baggy black pants what don't fit

[A]

him, what kind of pants?

[C]

And he's late he's late. He's like, 10 minutes late. So I'm like, what the fuck are you wearing? What is this? And I'm kind of like, laughing. I'm like, what is this? And he says again, all of his suits are packed because now he's selling the house. And he's also got stuff mixed up with his dad's stuff and the move, and he had to borrow his dad's pants. And so I'm like, okay, this is gonna be part of our romantic story one day, right?

[B]

There's like a Walmart nearby or something.

[A]

I was like, yeah, you can pick up a pair of slacks at TJ

[B]

Maxx a hundred times.

[A]

Pretty easy.

[C]

Is his dad there? His dad is not there.

[A]

Wasn't that.

[C]

Wasn't that kind of the point? That was.

[B]

Yes, okay.

[C]

Yes.

[A]

Where's dad?

[C]

Dad is not there. We'll get to that. Okay, so we do the ceremony. I've got my vows. I'm reading them. He hasn't written anything down. He's, like, winging it. And he's like, I don't need to write anything down. This is going to come from the heart, baby. You know, like, oh, is he going to rap?

[B]

Clearly, he.

[C]

Thank God he didn't rap. No, he didn't.

[B]

Praise the gods. He did not rap.

[C]

But anyway, going back to the ceremony, we have it. We get this little certificate, and the officiant and her assistant sign it, and it just basically says that it took place on this day, blah, blah, blah. She says, we've got 30 days to provide these. So we know it's not a legal document, but we know it's coming. So then we go for our photos. We go to the. This. It's like an indoor giant conservatory. Like, it's all plants and tropical stuff,

[B]

and it's, like, really beautiful, kind of.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

And so we have pictures there. It's really pretty. The sun's setting outside. We go onto my friend who's an artist and has, like, a studio in a building with a rooftop. We go on the rooftop and have pictures after the sun goes down. And we just have, like, the best photos. Right?

[A]

Are you like, can we do waist up? Because I don't want his sweatpants in

[B]

there because his pants look at ocean.

[C]

And I remember telling him, I'm like, I can Photoshop them, so they might.

[A]

Yeah, Photoshop.

[C]

I told him. I'm like, I can. Don't worry about it. I can take care of it afterwards. So we go back home and we order fancy takeout and we're just like at my place and we're like, we did it. And we're just kind of like, glowy. But he's. He takes the pants off. I remember this really vividly. He sits on the floor. He takes the pants off and, like, sits on the floor and eats this meal on the floor. It was weird. Like. Yeah, I just thought, okay, like, it's been a very big day. Like, he was late. He obviously had something going on and. Yeah. So didn't think anything of it. And I know it sounds so stupid.

[B]

No, no, no, there's no stupid here.

[A]

You can't see the forest through the trees when all the trees are falling on you at once.

[C]

Yeah. Yeah. So then a couple days later, we wanted to get some like, non wedding pictures together because we didn't have any, like, nice pictures. And we weren't going to, like, tell anyone about this secret elopement. Right. And so I know photographers because I'm in the industry. And so we hired somebody that I know very well. We spend the day texting back and forth about, like, outfits and what we're gonna wear. And I was showing him pictures of, like, dresses. And he's all excited and encouraging. He's like, you're gonna look so hot. And I remember this was gonna be at like 5 or 6pm, like right before sunset. And as I'm leaving the house, like, I'm getting into my car, it becomes another canceled plan. So at this point, his dad has had a heart attack attack ahead of his surgery. He sends me the screenshot of a text from his aunt, like the dad's sister, asking him to come and that he's fallen down the stairs. And now he's like, having a heart attack and it's an emergency and he has to be there, like, right away.

[A]

And does dad know that you guys got married? I for.

[C]

I'm sorry, did we resolve that at this point? Okay, so I had asked if we could. Could send dad the pictures, like, and let him know.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And he's like, his health is so fragile right now. It's just gonna, like, put him over the edge. Wait, which I was like. He was the whole point. He was the whole point. And so I'm like, well, what am I gonna say? This guy's health is fragile. Like, I can't. Okay, all right. This is what it is now. And so now he's got this emergency and dad's having a heart attack. So shoot. Is canceled. I'm kind of pissed off because, like, I'm like, well, he's with his aunt. Like, why aren't they just taking an ambulance? Like, yeah, why do you have to go? But like. And I'm like, have to let my friend down who's booked this time to like, do photos of us. And anyway, so I'm like, okay, well, do what you gotta do. Hope he's okay. And that night he's. He's not texting until late, late, late in the evening. He says they're doing emergency surgery. The surgery he was supposed to have like a week from now. And he was there with him the whole night. In the morning he's like, they put the stent in. Like, he's doing. He's already doing so much better. He said he's like so much more peppy already. He said he'd spent the night at the hospital. And I said, well, he's probably going to need stuff. Like, does he need groceries for when he comes out? Like, he's probably going to be there for a bit. Like, can bring him anything or what can I do to help? And he refuses to let me go to the hospital. And he says that his brothers were there and remember I said, he's like, if you ever get a chance to talk to my mom or my ex wife or my family, don't talk to them because they're out to get me. Yes. And so he's like, my brothers are here and now that dad's had a heart attack, they're all like, showing up because their inheritance is in question. And there's all these. We're all fighting and I don't want you to have to see that. And I was like, hey, let me know when you're heading home, like, if I can do anything. But he reassured me that dad was already so very much improved and he would be going home within the next day or two. I was like, oh, I don't know anything about heart surgery. It could be the case. Right? I'm like, I don't know. So I feel a bit like, shut out. But he's also explained it away again, Right?

[A]

Right.

[C]

And I'm like, okay, family dynamics, stress drama, like tense relationships. Okay.

[B]

We've been together that long, quote, unquote,

[C]

married, even though now we're married yet technically, well, not. But yes. So I felt a little shut out, but I didn't want to rock the boat. I mean, obviously he was. So much stress going on. Like, dad's had the. This crazy heart attack. Like this brother's fighting anyway. I'm like, okay, whatever you need. If the way I can support is by just, like, backing off and just being here when you're ready. That's what I'm going to do. And so then we get to. It's about 10 days, I think about 10, 11 days later. This is the end of October. We're like the day before Halloween. And I remember this vividly because I'm like, this is the scariest thing that's ever happened on Halloween. And I love horror. I love horror, but this is like a living. Okay, so I get a text from David, Ryan's dad. He texts me saying that Ryan has had a heart attack at work. What?

[B]

Wow. That's a lot so far. Like, that's a.

[A]

That's a. I have some theories. I'm not going to say them yet, but I want to hear people's theories.

[B]

Yeah, let us. Let us know what you guys think of this, because I'm curious to know if. I'm curious to know how many of you, first of all, relate to something like this. Like. Like just that weird behavior. Like a confused mind says no. Right? So most people would be like, I don't know, I'm out. But also, I think a lot of people have a tendency to want to know what the crap is going on. So you might hang around. Do you know what I mean?

[A]

And if you're used to chaos, subconsciously more comfortable.

[B]

Oh, that's a good thing.

[A]

Chaos. Sporadic behavior like his feels like safety. Yes, I am worried. So, yes, next week, next Monday, we have part two. All will be revealed. But please, in the meantime, send any. Yeah, any responses. Support for Claire. How lovely is she? I love her.

[B]

I love. Isn't she so sweet? I really. I. I adore her and her cute little accent.

[A]

I love her. And she's very brave to share.

[B]

She really is. And she. She. You notice how she kept apologizing? Almost like she was like, oh, I. You know, I feel so stupid. Like a. It just reminds me of how many of our guests have said, oh, I feel so dumb. Or, I know I shouldn't have done this, but. And it's like, you're human, and this has nothing to do with dumb or smart. Like, this is all about. This is all about the perpetrator. It's not about.

[A]

You're exploited by a master.

[B]

Yes, by a master. By someone he knew what he was doing. Like, come on.

[A]

And we. Next week, we'll find out why he's doing it. And It's. Yeah, please DM US Dating Detectives podcast on TikTok or Instagram or Facebook and Email us if you have a story. Investigatedatingdetectivespodcast.com Comment on Spotify or Apple or wherever you listen. Like, whatever your thoughts are or your

[B]

we love your feedback. It's so valuable to us.

[A]

Yeah, it is. And like I said, if you have any messages of support for Claire or any of our guests, we really try to pass that along to them because remember, they're in this community, too. So thank you so much, Claire. We will hear more next week. Anything else we have to tell the people?

[B]

I don't think so. Just thank you again for listening. Thank you for supporting the show, and thank you for supporting our guests and being a part of the community. You're so valuable.

[A]

We love you guys.

[B]

And until next week, trust your intuition.

[C]

Sam.