From Fast Growth to Total Crash: A Real Estate Comeback Story I Episode 109

Summary

The David Greene Show — Episode 109 Summary

From Fast Growth to Total Crash: A Real Estate Comeback Story

Podcast: The David Greene Show
Host: David Greene
Guest: Amy Dills, Minnesota Broker
Date: January 18, 2026

---

Episode Overview

This episode dives into the roller-coaster career of Amy Dills, a Minnesota real estate broker whose journey spans rapid early success, a business-killing crash, and a resilient comeback. Amy and David strip away the fluff, candidly exploring building wealth, creating momentum, managing risk, the realities of brokerages and teams, and how partnerships and mentorships work in the industry.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Amy’s Entry Into Real Estate

• Amy recounts graduating in 2010, pregnant, uninsured, and motivated by the $8,000 Obama-era tax credit for first-time homebuyers.
• Early bad experiences with agents prompted her to get licensed:

  “If that dinkus can do it, so can I. And that owning where you live is the single most important foundation to wealth building.” (Amy, 03:11)

• Bought a fixer HUD home with an FHA 203k, learned on her feet, pocketed $13,000 when selling after three years—more than she’d ever had.

2. The Importance of Homeownership for Wealth

• Amy and David agree that owning your residence builds financial control, equity, and steady confidence through DIY projects and repairs.
• Emotional benefits: each completed task builds “mastery and ownership.” (Amy, 06:51)
• David ties this to a broader principle:

  “You’re supposed to suck. You don’t know anything when you start... Your goal is to build momentum and confidence.” (David, 08:38)

3. Investing vs. Agent Work: False Dichotomy

• Amy cautions investors not to get licensed just for MLS access—market knowledge and deal flow are the true edge.
• “If you’re just like, I just want to get the MLS and save myself on commissions, I think you’re going to ultimately end up not getting your home sold as effectively and efficiently.” (Amy, 13:40)
• Both agree that specialization yields better returns—and that professionals should expect to pay for expertise.

4. Rapid Growth: The Thrill and the Pitfalls

• Amy built a successful solo practice, then her own brokerage, which ballooned to 20+ agents during the pandemic.
• Highlight of leading, learning, and winning together:

  “Some of my favorite years in real estate… it’s not giving me that thrill of the chase that I was getting before. I found for myself that I get that more when I get to see my agents winning.” (Amy, 20:08)

• But as growth compounded, problems did too: cliques, COVID disrupting in-person culture, and Amy getting overextended with multiple major projects.

5. The Crash: Overextension and Market Shift

• 2022–2023: Rising rates, project delays, and lender pullouts caused a perfect storm; Amy's business, finances, and even personal home projects were all threatened.

• “I cannot do everything well at the same time… it was like the biggest, best learning thing that has ever happened to me.” (Amy, 22:23)

• Lessons learned: necessity of reserves, focusing on fewer projects, and preparing mentally/financially for sudden market shifts.

[Key Segment: The Crash Begins: 22:00–29:20]

6. Rebuilding: Cautious Growth and Partnerships

• Having “burned it down,” Amy focused on stabilizing her finances, then shifted toward partnership models—both in investing and on her real estate team.
• Amy now prioritizes collaboration and leverage, learning that shared risk and support is more sustainable and rewarding.

7. Partnerships and Mentorships: Winning Formulas

For the Junior Partner:

• Show up, follow through, ask for help—don't expect trust or leads by default.
• Trust builds through small, reliable actions:

  “You have to be the person that shows up. What can I do? …And then you actually go do it.” (Amy, 33:40)

For the Senior/Alpha Partner:

• Expect only a minority of agents to truly commit—so pour energy into those who take initiative.
• Meet new agents where they are, not where you want them to be.

• “Let’s see where you are… one little thing to work on until you got it. Then we add it up. It’s the same as that stacking small wins with homeownership.” (Amy, 50:39)

8. Market Realities & Agent Mindsets

• David criticizes “body shop” brokerages that sell the dream but offer little true support, fueling entitlement and churn.
• Agents and teams, both say, must face the work honestly:
  • “Go find the business, serve your clients well, and sharpen the ax—and do them all, every week, to win.” (Amy, 40:15)
• Both host and guest are blunt about the poor outcomes for agents acting entitled or relying on handouts rather than skill-building and genuine service.

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Momentum & Confidence:
  • “You’re supposed to suck... Your goal is to build momentum and confidence.” (David, 08:38)
• On Overextension:
  • “While I can do anything, I cannot do everything well at the same time.” (Amy, 22:31)
• Reality Check for New Agents:
  • “You have three jobs as a real estate agent… find the business, serve well, sharpen the ax.” (Amy, 40:15)
• Partnership Wisdom:
  • “If you expect that 30% of real estate agents are never going to do anything... it gets easier because you’re just like, ‘oh, okay, you’re in the 30%.’” (Amy, 46:05)
• Mentoring and Loyalty:
  • “It’s that unscalable, human—be a person—thing… the more you can lift people up with you, the rising tide lifts all the boats.” (Amy, 54:00)

---

Timestamps: Important Segments

| Timestamp | Topic / Moment | |-----------|--------------------------------------------------| | 02:40 | Amy’s first home purchase story | | 05:27 | Emotional impact and empowerment via ownership | | 10:20 | Getting into sales—building momentum | | 13:01 | Investor vs. Agent roles | | 17:55 | Working with (and outsmarting) undertrained agents | | 19:29 | Building a team and the thrill of leadership | | 22:23 | The crash: overextension and market turn | | 25:45 | Market psychology and how everything crashed | | 33:35 | Partnership roles and establishing trust | | 40:06 | Reality of real estate work and expectations | | 46:05 | Leading a team—understanding agent ratios | | 54:00 | The “unscalable human thing” builds loyalty | | 57:49 | Jocko’s decentralized command & practical mentoring | | 59:03 | Where to find Amy and her brokerage (Brick & Banister) |

---

Summary: Takeaways for Listeners

• Growth is nonlinear: Success often gives a false sense of security; market shifts are sudden and unforgiving.
• Specialize, but collaborate: Being an expert, working with pros, and leveraging partnerships bring better results than going it alone.
• Momentum generates confidence: Each small win—owning your home, closing a deal, helping a team member—fuels your climb.
• Reality beats fantasy: Cut through the “passive income” hype; winning in real estate takes relentless activity, skill-building, and serving others.
• Mentorship and community matter: True learning happens in relationship—meet people where they are, help them rise, and loyalty will follow.

---

Connect with Amy Dills

• Website: brickandbanister.com
• Instagram: @amy_renae
  (“Usually digging in the dirt, playing with poultry, or running my mouth.”)

---

A must-listen for agents, investors, or anyone determined to build wealth or a business—full of practical, hard-earned wisdom.

Transcript

[A]

Welcome to Real Talk Real Estate, the show where we cover how to build wealth in real estate with no fluff, no BS, and no sales pitches. I'm David Green, and I've been doing this for over 10 years. I've seen the ups, the downs, and everything in between. This is the show where we pull back the curtain and show it to you, too. So if you want to build wealth through real estate or you just love learning about it, you found your home. What's going on, everyone? Welcome to Real Talk Real Estate. I'm David Green, and I'm here with a Real Talk Realtor episode. Got a great one for y' all today. Before we get into this thing, just a reminder. Thank you for listening to this. If you're a real estate agent, I think you're going to love today's show. And if you're not a real estate agent, you should still listen, because today's guest has some really good advice when it comes to mindset, approach and actual practical tactics to grow a business, whether you're a real estate agent or not. But if you happen to wander into the podcast form and you're like, what's this talk? Why are we talking about real estate agents? Well, we put out three shows a week. We have Mortgage Monday where we talk about the mortgage industry. We have Real Talk Realtor, where we interview agents about how to be better at their jobs and how to grow a successful business and help people build wealth through real estate. And then we have the David Green show, which is for real estate investors. I'm joined today by Amy Dills out of Minnesota, who's a real estate broker that runs a team out there. And she's got quite the story, from doing well in real estate to hating it to having it collapse, rebuilding it, finding herself in the process, and being a better version of herself and a real estate agent in that process. And she is gracious enough to come on today and share with everybody else what she learned to hopefully speed up their own learning curve and their own success. Amy, thanks for being here.

[B]

Thanks for having me.

[A]

David, did I miss anything in your intro there that you think should have been covered?

[B]

I thought that was a pretty cute intro. Thank you for that.

[A]

Well, I am nothing if not cute. Okay, let's talk about your story. What was it like? How did you get started? Where did you go? How did it fall apart? What is the story of Amy Dills?

[B]

Oh, so good. Well, I'm going to try to really focus on this because I got lots of stories and I'm A chatty girl. But I got into real estate in two, officially I would say in 2010, not as an agent, but this was way back in the day where being pregnant was a preexisting condition. And when you graduated college you got kicked off your parents insurance. And so I found myself graduated from college and expecting my first child and without health insurance and my brain went to the place that is, well, where am I gonna live? And at the time Obama was giving us $10,000 to, or $8,000 to buy your first house. So I was like, well yeah, I.

[A]

Remember that this is around like what, 2012 or so.

[B]

Yeah. And so I visited a midwife because I couldn't get insurance and she, she said that my baby was going to cost $4,000. So I was like, great, I'll just buy a house then I'll get $8,000, I'll pay for this baby and we'll have a place to live. So that was like really how it started. I was very young, I did not know what I was doing and I had a terrible experience. I had like probably four or five real estate agents that we burned through. This was like not like Zillow was a thing and we had iPhones in our hand. But the real estate agents were carrying around paper and they were showing me listings. I wasn't like perusing the Internet. I had no money. So I bought a HUD house which sucked the least. I got that tax credit and I also got a bunch of money from because I had lead based paint and I did an FHA 203k loan which I have not run into anyone else who's done that. And this whole experience really taught me that if that dinkus can do it, so can I. And that owning where you live is the single most important foundation to wealth building. So I bought that house, I lived in it for three years. I had that baby there. I figured out how to be a grown up and pay bills and do a budget and all of that. And I used to take that screaming baby on walks around the neighborhood and I would watch these houses go up for sale and I would see people buying houses for $250,000 and think how did these people get so rich? So you know, when it came time to sell that house after three years so I wouldn't have to repay, I got a check for a $13,000 and it was literally the most money I'd ever seen in one spot. And I thought I better go do this again. So I started calling up real estate agents and A mean boy opened a door for me and he told me that I couldn't do it. And I immediately signed up to get my real estate license after that because he just kept telling me, no, you can't buy this house, no one's going to give you money. So I borrowed some money from my now husband to take my real estate classes and got my license and sold 19 houses in my first six months just to sort of tell that mean boy that he shouldn't tell a cute girl that she can't.

[A]

Now Amy, you mentioned that owning where you live is the best. I believe you put it foundational piece into building wealth. Do you mind just take a minute to explain for the realtors who don't own a house or someone listening who wants to buy investment property but they've never thought of owning their primary residence as to how that puts you in control of your financial destiny, your housing expenses, builds equity that you can use to get into investing, etc.

[B]

Yeah, I think it's really important and I think a lot of people today are focused on oh, kids these days will never be able to buy a house. And I just think it's not true. We sell so many houses to first time home buyers and what happens is they get into their house with a very low down payment in most cases. Although I've had a number of 22 year olds this year who have their 20% down. So I'm actually super proud of, you know, the Gen Z's coming up that everyone likes to complain about. But it, it works in a couple of ways. First of all, now they control their housing so they are not finding themselves in positions where their landlord wants to sell or hike the rent or they won't fix anything. So they are now controlling where they live. Their house also usually becomes sort of like a part time income for them when it comes to appreciation. So we always talk about let's go find the house that you know, probably isn't very cute and it might smell a little bad, but if we scrub it down, you feel good about showering and cooking food there and then you're going to move in because this is what we got to do to get into an affordable home. And there really is something magical that happens when you paint your first bathroom or swap out a light fixture. It. Go ahead.

[A]

No, I'm sorry, I just really like what you're saying there and I was preparing for a follow up question of what changes emotionally when you do those very same things. So keep going.

[B]

Okay. So every home buyer loves to shit on the previous owners and be like, they did such a bad job at this and they messed this up and they did right. And sometimes that like puts them in this kind of, like, I don't know, disadvantaged position. But a lot of times what it does is it builds sort of mastery and ownership. I figured out how to change this light fixture. I read the Internet, so I know this is wired properly. And every time we accomplish something and complete something, even if it's a tiny little task like that, we're teaching ourselves that we are people who can do things. And I think those little wins add up, especially in home ownership. You know, stuff's going to break and you're going to have to fix it. What do you do when the garage won't open because the power is out? I don't know. I've never had this problem before. So getting into home ownership as a young person gives you a lot of opportunities to stack those small wins up. And in the meantime, your home's appreciating, you're paying down your mortgage, you're building that equity, et cetera, et cetera. So when you go to sell, you probably made a little money and, you know, a lot of people are doing the roommate thing again.

[A]

One of the themes I'm noticing you're describing here, actually two of them, are momentum and confidence. That's what I'm hearing. A lot of people, I'd say almost everybody that hasn't already sort of scaled a form of a mountain underestimate how important momentum is. So those that are experienced in doing this, they look at a problem. Like right now, I'm launching a property management business for short term rentals across the country, coast to coast getaways. So I'm trying to look for people that have a property that they want someone else to manage. And I've been talking with my staff who are like, well, you're David Green. People are just going to run to us and hand us the property. And I'm like, not right now they're not. Everyone's hurting. Properties are not doing well. Short term rentals are struggling. So the momentum is going to kick in. When we get owners of properties that we manage to tell their friends, hey, these guys did a great job. They increased the revenue, they took everything off my plate. They had some really good ideas. You should go with them. You don't start off crushing it. You actually have to earn the right to get there by word of mouth, by referrals, by the confidence that you build. Success comes from momentum and Successful people strive to build momentum and then they go tackle the big challenge of taking a million dollar listing or selling a hundred houses or whatever they're looking to. I love that you highlighted because new people need to hear this. You're supposed to suck. You don't know anything when you start. The people you talk to can tell you're scared. You're not hiding it that good. They're not going to let you sell their house. Your goal is to build momentum and confidence. And what you just mentioned leads to confidence. I can tell from talking to you, you're very confident woman. You know what you're doing. If I had a house to sell in Minnesota, I'd be like, yeah, Amy probably 90 chance. I don't even need to hear her presentation from the way she speaks. She knows her stuff. She's the person that you want to hire. But nobody starts that way. And so having a house helped build the confidence. You tackled the projects. You painted the thing, you fixed the garage door that wouldn't open because there was no power. You taught yourself you can figure out how to solve problems and that's not something that can be bought.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

Yeah, that's really good stuff. Okay, so you kind of had, you bought your HUD home, you got the Obama refund because at this point nobody wanted to buy houses. So this was the Fed government's way of trying to get buyers back into the market after the foreclosure crisis of 20, 20, 10. This is actually the same time that I got into investing in real estate myself. But I didn't have a license at that time. I didn't sell houses. What came next?

[B]

Yeah, like I said, when I, after I sold that house, I went to go again. So then that did not go very well. I ended up getting my license and I joined a real estate team. That wasn't the right fit for me at the time, but it's kind of interesting being where I am now to look back and see where I was being a hard headed 20 something. But at the time they were telling me we've been doing it this way for 25 years, so that's how you have to do that. And I was just, I wasn't having it. So I focused on what I felt like was the right thing to do and I tried to bring people along with me. So at that time it was Facebook. I also thought I was a genius at the time because of course the market, I got my license in 2014, so the market was coming up and people would just call me. Yeah, so, so friends from social media reached out. I was hosting open houses so people would walk in and see them. And I really just talked about real estate with everyone I knew. I told my story about, you know, I made $13,000 just by owning the house I lived in. Right. Like, a lot of people don't think about it like that. Most people would struggle to increase their income by $13,000 in a year if you have a regular job. But if you own your house and you live there for three years and it made you 13k, that's pretty sweet, actually. I've never left a rental where they paid me 13k. So I was really kind of passionate from the beginning that people needed to buy houses. And I also had my very first big real estate problem that I had to solve, which was my first year as a real estate agent. I had a tax bill that was higher than what I had earned in income the previous year. And so I kind of freaked out because I had to write a big check to the irs. And that led me down the real estate investing path. And so I started thinking, like, okay, maybe if I buy a rental house or do some flipping, I can figure out how to avoid this tax bill. So I really started going down the. I'm going to earn commissions as a real estate agent and put that into my real estate investments. I'm going to do a better job getting those homes prepared for an end buyer or a tenant, because I'm out here with real buyers every single day telling me, oh, I love how they did the bathroom. Oh, let's make an offer, because this kitchen is so cute. Then I can just literally make my kitchen exactly like they told me they wanted it to be. And so I did a fair amount of that over the years while I was growing my own real estate sales business.

[A]

Did you find that you had to pick do I want to be an investor that builds wealth or real estate agent? Because I hear this question come up all the time, do I want to do sales or investing? I hate the question. I think they're meant to synonymously or, sorry, synergistically, complement each other. And that's how it was for me. But yet the question's always asked, what's your thought on the person listening to this that's trying to figure out if they should be an investor or an agent?

[B]

I think you, if you want to be a real estate investor and you want to get your real estate license just so you can get the mls, you are wasting your time and your money and your energy. I Think if you want to be a real estate investor and you want to have an edge over other local investors because you have local market knowledge, you are meeting with sellers all the time, and very frequently you end up in a seller's house that you might just be like, hey, man, I'd buy this house right now, today. Or you can give sellers an option. Hey, I could write you an offer like this. We could find you another investor off market, or we could list your home on the mls and this is what that would look like. So I think if you're an agent who is open to learning the traditional sales and working with traditional buyers and sellers, you are always going to be a better real estate investor. And if you're just like, I just want to get the MLS and save myself on commissions, I think you're going to ultimately end up not getting your home sold as effectively and efficiently. You're going to pay a lot more fees to the MLS dues. And now you are tied down to continuing ed.

[A]

Our favorite thing, every Realtor loves continuing education. We throw parties. We have big shindigs when we get to sit down and study things that have nothing to do with the job job at all. But government regulatory bodies will force you to do it anyways. Yeah, that's a great point. It's odd logic, isn't it? Because I've never heard a person say, I'm going to go and become a mechanic so I don't have to pay mechanic fees when my car breaks. I'm going to go get a legal degree so that I can represent myself in court when I'm sued. But everyone will say, I'm going to get my license so I don't have to pay commissions.

[B]

Yeah, I just think it's. I think, you know, and agents look at this when they are shopping for a broker too. Right. They're looking for the cheapest deal or the lowest fees. And sellers are doing this, hey, I want, I don't want to pay any commission because I want to make the most money. My dollars are more important than everyone else's dollars. And I just think you're missing the bigger point, that when you work with a professional who does this every single day, how. I don't know, how many listing appointments have I been on so far this year? 75 or something like that. I'd have to check the dashboard. Right. But like, if I go on 75 listing appointments and if I show, call it a hundred homes a month, do you think I know a little bit more about the market than you do homeowner who's just simply lived in this house for 25 years and might I be able to market your home more effectively than you would and negotiate on your behalf and all of that. So I think it's the same with investors, with agents, with homeowners. Like, you really always want to work with someone who does this every day if you want to get the most money.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It's the same thing I was talking about with the short term rental management company. Anybody can do it. I just gave a presentation a minute ago to a person who's going to be having us do it. Shout out to you, John, if you're listening to this and I describe, like in the presentation, I talk about what we do different and there's a lot of things, but two big ones were we look at the pricing every single day, every day. And we tinker it up when there's a lot of demand and if no one's booking your cabin at all, we drop it down to get you some revenue coming in and that. We look at our phone all day, every day. If a guest says, hey, I'd like to book this property, I need to know, does it have a downstairs bathroom? Or what's this the incline of the hill like? Or how far is the walk to the beach? They're not sitting there waiting for you to finish your lunch before they look at the next place they ask it, they're on to the next house. If you don't see that inquiry, come in and respond to them immediately and then say, would you like to book it? It also has this other thing that's loss. Somebody else gets that. So can you manage your own property? Of course. But how much money did you just lose when you missed out on a 3, 500 booking because you have a job or you like Dancing with the Stars or that sandwich was really good and you didn't want to put it down. When you do it yourself, people tend to think about what they're saving. They don't think about what they're losing. That's just a good piece of advice. Overall, a lot of people suck. A lot of agents suck, A lot of property managers suck. I'd even say the majority of them suck, in my opinion. I don't know your thought on that, Amy, but I'm imagining listening to you talk that you frequently have to do transactions with other agents that don't know that much and they make it really painful for you. Find the one that's good.

[B]

I think they actually make it really, really Great for my client. I love it when one of those agents writes an offer on my listing or is on the other side of our offer because I know that we are going to get some big wins.

[A]

When you're representing the buyer or sorry, when you're representing this. Yeah, either way. Really. When you recognize it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

The frustration I have is when the agent on the other side can't explain to client that this is normal. Yeah. There's a couple roof shingles that are worn or the hot water heater needs to be replaced. That does not mean that the house is worth 10,000 less dollars. When they can't communicate basic things. And now the buyer gets scared and wants to back out and the agent doesn't know what to do. That can make things tricky. But I will say to your point, and I used to talk about this a lot on bigger pockets, we would destroy the other agent when they didn't know what they were doing. A lot of the time in my day it was like the Redfin agents, the discount ones that just got handed an online buyer or something and they're like, yeah, we'll give you back the commission. And I would just eat them up. Massive, massive discounts. And the sad thing to me was the client on the other side had no idea that that didn't have to happen. Had they hired a halfway decent agent, they would have saved so much money. But the minute you can smell that that agent on the other side doesn't know their stuff, you know that you're just gonna eat them alive. And the client would never know. All right, so you are now selling houses. You're explaining real estate. You're basically doing the really good job that I tell everybody. If you got to talk about it to everyone, you know and project confidence so that they pick you, how did it, how did your business go from there?

[B]

Once I. Well, I was. Like I said I was on a team and then I moved to a discount brokerage because the team was like not a good fit for me. And the discount brokerage was fine. It was what I needed it to be when I was there. But they had this really big problem which was they did not have direct deposit. So every time I had a closing, I had to drive an hour to get paid. And that just was not working for me. So I decided to start my own company and literally only so I could cash the checks. I had no greater long term vision or plan than that. But what happened was I was talking about it on the Internet and pretty soon agents started showing up and they said, hey, I saw what you've been doing. I want to do that too. Can you teach me? And when we started the brokerage, it was really cool, really fun. Like, I think a lot of sort of startups are. I don't. I don't really consider us a startup, but people were excited. We were figuring stuff out, we were adding new things, we were getting together, we were learning together, we were watching them win. And, man, they're some of my favorite years in real estate doing that. Because there does come a point where you're like, okay, cool, I know how to sell a house. I can sell a house. I like some pieces of it. And it's not giving me that, like, thrill of the chase that I was getting before. And I found for myself that I get that more when I get to see my agents winning. So I really loved that time. Our office got really big. Up until about the pandemic, I think we were 20 or 22 agents in our office. And then we started having some new problems, which was, how do you get 20 or 22 people's schedules to line up, especially when they're real estate agents? And so things were kind of, you know, there were like little clicks and clusters forming. And then it was Covid and we couldn't get in person. And some people didn't want to do Zoom. And it just, it wasn't really that fun. And we got very divided. And at the time, I was in the middle of many projects. I was doing my own sales. I always sell, you know, about the same amount of houses every year. I had a. An Airbnb cabin that I was rehabbing. We bought 25 acres of land, and my husband and I built this house that I'm in right now, like ourselves, with our hands. So that was a whole two year project that we were working on. And I was doing a commercial development. I started working on a fundraised boutique hotel project that was supposed to be 3 million and got up to like 16 million before we killed that deal. And I really figured out that while I can do anything, I cannot do everything well at the same time. And so I was handing off deals to my agent so I could be out here doing construction. I was trying to rally the team on this commercial project, and that was getting, you know, this person's running with that and that person's not doing anything. And this is. Right. It just, it turned into a mess. And at the same time, the market started shifting. This is like 2022, 2021, right? And so there was A day that I got a phone call from the commercial lender and said, hey, our office just said, we're no longer lending on hospitality, so you have to go find some new financing. And our construction lender was like, hey, it's been a year. Your house isn't built. This mortgage is due in full. And the traditional lender who was going to give us the end mortgage was like, hi, rates have come up and you can now no longer afford the house which you have been building for two years. And so it was. And I think our house that we were living in was on the market and it wasn't selling. And so it was just kind of this, like, climax of like, oh, shoot, all of these bad things are happening at home. Once I haven't sold a house, what are we going to do? And untangling that was really hard. Like, really scary, right? There are days where it was like, oh, my gosh, I need to actually physically stop and breathe through this wave of panic. And it, man, it was like the biggest, best learning thing that has ever happened to me. Like, not a single thing in my life has made me more confident that I am able to figure out how to solve whatever is put in front of me than that experience. So we got out of the commercial development, canceled that, dug out of that debt. We finished our house, did some real strong negotiating with those lenders. Our other house sold at the last possible moment, and we moved into an incomplete build, finished it up in. We moved in in March, we finished it up in June, got the refi, and then took a deep breath. And then I had to decide what I wanted to do with my real estate business from there. So that was a total pivot, regroup, start over. We have effectively burned it down. What do I want to build next moment? And that was in the middle of 2023.

[A]

Okay, let's unpack this. When everything went wrong at the same time. Because I'm not a super old man, but I've been around for a while, and I've noticed there is a pattern with feast or famine, with real estate in general. Whether you're selling, whether you're owning it is a momentum market. And so when everything's going good, there's a temptation to say, well, I can't get my license, that I can sell that too, or I can start this business also, I can jump into that asset class. How much different can it be than whatever else? And I don't know that that's inherently wrong. It's just tempting. That's the point. I want to make. It's so tempting to be like, all right, I want a bunch of buoys in the water. And it seems like real estate never just slowly, like, slows down and you see it coming, it just crashes. You're just crushing it. And then, boom, you hit a wall. Can you explain what kind of happened in the market? Whether it was interest rates, whether there was tax changes, whether it was a local thing to where you are in Minnesota that led to that crash, and why you feel like so many things went wrong at the same time so people can know the dangers of getting overextended like this.

[B]

Yeah, I think, you know, some. I mentioned at the beginning how I thought I was such a genius because I was selling all these houses when I got started. And I think it's a little bit of that, too, right? Like, during the pandemic, at first, we freaked out. Everyone was like, oh, my gosh, we'll never sell another house. And then I started listing and selling homes that I'd never even been to. We just, like, had someone leave a key, and we sent a photographer, and, like, we were selling hundreds of homes every year, which was really fun, and. But then you're again in this position where it's like, okay, I have all this cash. What am I going to do with this cash? And of course, you're like, I need to invest it in real estate. So I don't think that was the wrong move by any means. I just think that I was personally running three very large projects at the same time. And I think when our focus gets split, you let things slide, right? And you're used to solving problems with money. So then when money dries up, right, because interest rates did go up, when would they go up? 21, 22. It was mother's Day weekend. I remember I had put it. I put a couple of listings on, like, two weeks before, and they sold in a day, and they had all these, right? And then I put two new listings on Mother's Day weekend, and we had one showing. And I remember just feeling this chill of, like. Like, oh, what's gonna happen? Right? And we were back to that, yeah, I'll never sell a house again. What do we do? And you really then are like, you should be okay. Stop the bleeding. Right? Is what you should think. But you're in this headspace of, like, we solve problems with money around here, and it really took a while to kind of catch up. So I think, like, if there's one takeaway from that about, like, how humans work Is like, when things are volatile, people freeze. Right. So rates were. I. I don't remember. 5. Something when they went up and everyone freaked out, and they continued to freak out for about six months. After about six months, people usually get tired of waiting. And so if they're going to move, they're going to move. Right? And so that's kind of the pattern that I've seen happen is like, anytime there's some kind of major shift in the economy, in the markets, in interest rates, people will, like, chill for like, six months. And so now we kind of plan for that. Right. Like, what do we need to have for reserves? How many projects should we take on at one time? What would we do if everything went wrong? And I think it's really important. And I simply was not thinking that way then because I had only ever always won since 2014.

[A]

Yeah. And you don't see it coming and you can't predict it. And why would you think that things are going to go wrong when nothing's ever gone wrong? So my personal perspective is we're too hard on people when they're crushing it and they're like, I'm going to keep going. We're like, yeah, you were arrogant. You should have known. But to that logic, the person who never gets in the game and never does anything because they're like, well, I don't want to overextend myself. They probably lose way more money than they like by not doing something. Then they would have lost if they did something, and then they got caught when it goes badly, and we always highlight the arrogance or, why did you think you could do that? Or whatever the case would be? But, man, I know a lot of people that were waiting for a crash that didn't come. They lost out on hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars of equity or money because they didn't get into real estate. The cautionary tale here is just, no, it's a lot like musical chairs. You don't know when the music stops, but when it does, it's sudden, it's immediate. And you got to have a plan, like you said, of where you're going to go put your butt so that you're not out.

[B]

Right. And actually, I think I've swung really hard the other way in reaction to that. And so that's like something new that I'm grappling with. Right. When all of that was said and done, I was like, okay, we need to shovel out a debt and make sure we can pay this exorbitant 6.626% mortgage now. Right. So that was like my sole focus. And I did, I dug out of debt. I paid off my last whatever thing in August actually just like a couple months ago. And now I have found myself in this place where it's like, okay, I don't want to go there again. I want to make sure I'm not being too risk averse because I do strongly believe in real estate and real estate investing. So what is the right move and what's too much and how do you avoid getting to a position where you're over leveraged? And for me, it's really been more about partnership now. Right. What I was doing before, it was Amy running all of these shows and at the end of the day, it was all on me at the end. And so now I have really seen so many wins and so much actually more fun when you bring it into a partnership model. And I think as being an agent, it's so much more fun to sell houses and learn and fail and struggle when you have partners learning and failing and struggling alongside you. And it's the same thing if you get into an investment.

[A]

Okay, let's get into this partnership idea because there's two components to it depending on where the listener is in their journey. There's the person who knows less than an Amy and they want a partner because they're going to gain experience, they're going to maybe gain some leads, they're going to gain the boost of their reputation being partnered with a person that has a good reputation in the community and it's kind of like fuel on the fire of their success. And then there's the person in the alpha position which would be like you right now, that's partnering with somebody who's probably less experienced than you because they're going to take on some of the work and they're going to do some of this stuff because you can't be everywhere at once. Two part question. When you're the person who's in the beta position, so you're like the junior partner here. What does that person need to understand about how to make this successful? And then same question for the person who's in the alpha role.

[B]

I love it. I think the thing that makes partnerships work have to do with who's got my back and when. So you know the Jocko book, Extreme ownership, he's got a thing in there called cover and move and that when you apply that to your team and to your partners, it's incredible, right? So there. And you can't immediately have Cover and move. Like, I can't be like, okay, I can't show this house today because something happened with my kid. David, will you take my buyers out and do a great job? Like, I expect you to like my clients, right? Because we haven't built that yet. Right? But if you and I, David, every morning are like, okay, every single morning, we're going to hop on Zoom and we're going to do a training or practice something or go over stuff for 30 minutes every morning on Zoom. You and I are starting to build trust, right? Like, it starts with, you did what you said you're gonna do. You're gonna show up to this meeting every day like I asked you to. You're gonna have your camera on. You're gonna answer questions when I have them. Okay, so do I trust you to do what you say you're gonna do? A little bit? Yeah. Right. Okay. And now we're gonna build that next. Okay, I'm gonna bring you in my car with me. I don't really like having people in my car with me. I like to listen to my podcasts. I like to eat snacks. And if you're here, I feel like I sort of have to entertain you and train you. Right? But I'm gonna bring you in my car with you. If you're gonna show up on time in the location and be ready to go, maybe you have your notebook. You're gonna, like, take notes. I'm gonna take you out on showings with my clients. I see you over there taking notes and listening, right? Like, I. You're now telling me that you're here, you're present, you're owning it, and you got my back. So now when I'm like, hey, David, can you please take these clients out to see these five houses tonight? I trust you. Right? We've built that. So I think if you're a new agent and you're trying to be useful and take advantage of the leverage that an experienced agent can give you in partnership, that's who you have to be. You have to be the person that shows up. What can I do? What do I do? And then you actually go do it. And even before that, you have to be the person who's like, okay, you told me to make these 25 phone calls, and I made. I'm on my third one, and somebody said this. What do I do? What do I say? Right? Like, I need to hear you asking me for help so that I know that you're actually over there listening and doing. That's how we Build that trust and relationship. And I know you got my back, and you know I got your back because I'm over here kind of like clearing the path for you along the way. And each step along the way, we've built that trust a little bit stronger, and we know each other a little bit better. And I think that's really where the best partnerships come from between a new agent and an experienced agent.

[A]

So this is the advice for the newer agent is, I mean, do you think that when somebody turns their camera off on zoom or they don't ask questions, or they say, I want to lead, I want to lead, I want to lead, give me leads, but they aren't proving that they're trying to become excellent at the job. Do you think they perceive it as in they're telling you you can't trust me?

[B]

No, I don't think they do.

[A]

Yeah. Like, how do you think the new agent is looking at that scenario?

[B]

The new agent is looking at it as they deserve it or they are entitled to it. Like, it's my job to give that to. And I think that's why partnerships fail. And actually, I think that's why new agents fail because they shop for brokerages and teams on who's got the best split and who's going to give me the most leads. And then they get trapped in these terrible deals and they do nothing and they get handed all these leads. And then when the leads drive up and someone calls them up and says, hey, I'd like to buy a house, they stand there with their mouth open and don't know what to say because they've never had the experience of saying, oh, great, I love that. How'd you get my name? Oh, super. Where are you trying to buy a house? What areas are you looking in? Is this your first house? Like, they don't even know how to, like, ask the first question in a conversation because they've only been fed bad Internet leads?

[A]

Yeah, 100%. This is. Folks, this is why you're listening. This is real talk. These are conversations that successful people have behind the curtain that you usually don't hear. We're getting into how the industry got to be this messy in the first place. And I'm curious, Amy, if you would agree. Part of the entitlement that, like, the new agent has, it's very similar to the entitlement that, like, the younger generation would have. I know during COVID you couldn't get anyone to work. Nobody wanted a job. So companies with throw perks at people, like, begging them to come to work. Well, if you're looking to hang your license somewhere, the brokerages act like body shops. They just want as many people in there as they can get to collect the desk fee and become a loss leader for their other businesses, their title and their escrow companies, whatever they're doing, and they pursue you, they make you believe, we really want you, you have value. We were like, like a guy dating a girl. Like, please, please date me. I really want to be with you. And the agent doesn't realize they're not looking to commit to you. This is a person looking to use you. And you can't tell the difference because you're new, you're young in this scenario. And I think it creates this attitude that they deserve exactly what you're saying because they've been pursued. But if they were sitting in the boardroom meeting of the brokerages that are doing this, the discount brokerages, I call them the body shops, because they just want as many bodies as they can get. You would be horrified to realize they don't love you. They are not committed to your success. They do not want to mentor you. They are giving you a great marketing and absolutely nothing. Just like the guy who's dating you because he just wants fun. And he's doing the same thing to 500 other people because it's a numbers game for them. If you disagree with me, please, you could share it. But I'm curious as to if you think that has a lot to do with where this entitlement comes from. And then what's important is why the agents are not becoming successful because they have that attitude.

[B]

I fully agree with you. And I. I kind of think where it comes from is actually W2 mindset. So when you go to get a job at a regular place where they're going to employ you, it is very much a, oh, I got the interview. Oh, I got the second interview. I have to show up and look pretty. They're going to pick me out of a bunch of other well qualified candidates. It's like a scarcity thing. And then I'm gonna show up and they're gonna tell me what to do all day long. You have to do this and this and this. You have to go to this meeting you have. Right? Like, that's what people expect work to be. And I think that's what people expect being a real estate agent is. And so when I'm a new agent, this is exactly how I ended up on the team that I ended up. They were like, I think we have Some space on our team for you. I was like, oh, you picked me, right? And like, whatever. I. Everyone likes to feel pretty. Like we just do. So I think that's like, strike one, right? And so every time someone calls me up and they want to, you know, talk about what we have going on on our team and if we're a good fit, I always ask them what they expect of the company. Right. And what they expect being a real estate agent is. And this is kind of the second thing is, like, most people who are just getting done with their real estate classes, when I ask them what they expect the life of a real estate agent is, they say, oh, we're showing houses and going to closings. And I'm like, okay, great. Yeah, see, that's the fun, sexy part that we're all trying to get to, right? And so I always make it really clear to real estate agents, like, okay, I love that. That's actually my favorite part of the job too. We all love looking at cute houses. Everybody loves going to closing day and putting on a cute dress and, you know, whatever. But actually, when you're a real estate agent. Yeah, right?

[A]

Yeah. Getting your picture for the gram where you get to put. So happy to help my clients with this big thing. And they trusted me so much. And that's the part everybody do not see.

[B]

You crawling in the gross hole to see what's going on in the basement, Right? No, but so I always try to make it really clear to real estate agents at the beginning. Like, hey, dude, your. You have three jobs as a real estate agent, right? And we got to do these three jobs consistently, every day, every week. And then we will win. And you'll probably be better than like 90% of the other real estate agents because they don't do it. We got to go find the business, right? We got to lead, generate. We got to serve our clients well. And so if you don't have real clients yet, you probably got to get out there pretending, right? Like, if you wait to go show a house until you have your first buyer, guess how bad you're going to be at showing the house the first time, right? So we got to do the actual activities of being a real estate agent whether we have clients or not. And then we gotta sharpen the ax, right? Like, we gotta become a better real estate agent. And if you do those three activities consistently, every day, every week, you're gonna be a great agent. And then a lot of agents will follow that up with like, cool.

[A]

Yeah, great.

[B]

Cool. Yeah, great. I'm so excited. Let's go. And, you know, some of them do it. Some of them do. But I think most people are just like, where's my leads? Where's my business? I showed up once or twice. It didn't work. I called somebody asking if I could host an open house. Two times. They both said, no, I'm done. And, like, I think real estate agents fail. Even experienced agents, like, fail to understand the sheer volume of activity that is required to win in any market. Right? And it does change. It used to be easy. I don't think it's hard now. It's just different things that I wouldn't have done when I was a new agent. Like, when I was a new agent, somebody handed me their list. This is every home I've ever sold in 25 years. And I, like, kind of scoffed at it. I was like, why would I want to call your people? These people don't know me. Now. If somebody handed me that list, I'll be like, thank you for giving me $8 million in business this. Right? So, right. Like, I used to be like, I'm not gonna smile and die. And now I'm like, I am in a smile and dial, because guess what? Everybody else who's calling is an AI or a robot or a spammer, and I'm a real person. And so when I call someone up and say, hey, I saw you were looking at this house online. I'm actually headed over there to check it out. Do you want to come with me? Should we go take a look? People are like, wait, what? You're. I was on your website, and you're calling me? That's so weird.

[A]

You know, but you got to do that, right? And I can make you a logical case why? What you're saying is 100 true? Because I know some. Someone listening doesn't like that. Like, that's not true. Why should it have to be hard? If it's right, it'll be easy. If it's meant to be, it will fall into my lap. That's the way it's supposed to be when you're the client. You don't care that the agent has the goal of getting weekends off and not holding open houses. You don't care that they want flexibility in their schedule. You don't care about any of the goals they have. You care about what they can do for you. Are you the best? Are you confident? Do you have something other people don't have? Did you care enough to keep calling me? Did you pressure me in the right way? That Made me think that I'm safe with you. That's all you're thinking. If I want a taco, I don't say, what's the most mediocre taco shop in town that has an owner that wants passive income so I can go support his dream. Never in the history of humans has a person thought, I want to go give my money to something that's not that great because it's their goal. We asked the same question. What's the best taco in town? And then you get there, and if the line's out the door, that's the realtor that doesn't call you back. Maybe you go to the second best taco in town, and then you get a hold of that person. Everyone's looking for this. We're all look, no one's paying more for the house than they want to because they want the seller's dream to come true. Who has ugly countertops and they didn't prep their home for the the market or has Pepto Bismol pink somewhere? We don't care. If we could just understand. Your clients feel the same as you do about everything, and they're looking for their best option. The only way you succeed is you become the best option, which is hard. You want a really good body, you got to work out really hard. You got to have a really strict diet. You want to have a good relationship, you got to be with the other person's looking for and support them. You want to be good at your job, you got to be what the client is looking for. And to your point, the agents that come in that don't want to do that, if you did hand them steaming pipe and hot, amazing leads fresh out the oven, they want to buy, you'll just fumble it. They'll sense that you right in the trash.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

They don't want to buy with you because you don't sound confident. You need the momentum that we discuss. This is very similar. My whole career was agents want to work with me because they want my leads. I'm like, do you understand that a lead that comes to me has such an insane high expectation? They want David Green to sell him a house, but you're an extension of me, and your effort is so much lower or your expectations and entitlement are so different than mine. The client will be so disappointed. You should not want to lead from me. You. You need a lead from a person that has a bad reputation that you might have some chance of being able to close. So I'm so glad we're able to have this talk, and it's not to discourage people. It is to encourage people to think about how to serve the client and be willing to go through everything that you just said to be the junior partner and earn the right to build the trust with the person who has the resources that you're trying to accumulate. Now, the other part of this question. What does the person in the alpha position need to know? The person who wants to build the team, the person that wants to partner with other people to help them, what do they need to know about what people are looking for and how you could be a better leader?

[B]

I think that's an important piece of it because I. Man, I talk to a lot of real estate agents who used to have teams or real estate agents who have given up on their teams, and it makes me really sad and a little disappointed because they all say things like, I just got tired of running around with agents who were disappointing me, and so I'm just gonna do my own thing. I. You know, I'm so tired of getting my expectations trampled on, and I think that is giving away the ownership, right? Because what I have found. And I used to do this, so I'm not like, I'm so perfect. I know everything. I used to be like, come on, real estate agents. I can do it, so can you. Let's go, guys. Just, you know, do the thing right. And you felt like you were always just pulling people here with you. And I think when you're leading a team and when you're bringing agents with you, if you expect that 30% of real estate agents are never going to do anything, even if they tell you they are, it gets easier because you're just like, oh, okay, well, you're in the 30% who told me you were going to do something, and then you never did, right? And then you expect, like, this chunk in the middle. Like, let's Say out of 10 agents, three of them are going to do nothing. Maybe five of them in the middle are going to be, like, too busy all the time, but maybe, like, their cousin wants to buy their first house. And so now they're like, I got buyers. Give me all your attention and help me get through my first deal. Because I haven't showed up for anything, and I really need a lot of hand holding now. Like, I expect that five of those 10 agents are going to be like that, right? And then there's like, what's the math? We got two left. We got two agents left. These two agents are going to be the ones who are like, hey, what do I say when this happens? Or, you know what? I got my first listing appointment. I'm really nervous. Can you just come and sit and, you know, if I. If I fumble it, can you catch it and get me back on track? I expect those ratios. I also expect that, like, about 30% of real estate agents are just going to quit at some point because they're going to get broke. They're never going to sell a house. So when I come from that place and as a team leader now, when that happens, it doesn't hurt me at all, because I knew it was coming, right? So I can withstand that. So now I can really focus on, all right, who is the person who's going to catch this ball when I toss it to them, and who's the one who's consistently tossing that ball back to me? How can I pour into them more? And those people who are in that, you know, maybe I only sell for my friends and family. Is there anyone in there who I can see might be open to learning and growing? And then I really need to focus on what's the thing that will help that person win. Some people, it's helping them change their own stories, right? We work with a lot of real estate agents who've been in the business for a long time, and they'll tell you things like, this doesn't work, or the market's bad, or when I used to do it like this. And as their team leader, it is your responsibility to tell them to stop. Please stop saying that. We don't say that anymore. That's not working for you. Are you selling houses when you say that? No. And so you have to help them kind of move their language and their activity and their skill set up to what is working now. Right? You got to catch them up. They didn't figure it out on their own. They need. They need your help. And with the new agents, you actually have to tell them, don't tell anybody you're a new agent, including yourself, because every time you say that, you're giving yourself a pass on why this isn't working. So rather than telling ourselves you're a new agent or it takes some time to get your first deal, just like, change that expectation of, actually, I could sign a buyer today. I could sign a buyer today, and that buyer that I signed today could have a lease that's ending in 45 days, and I could tell them a house this weekend, and then I could have a closing next month, even though I'm a new Agent, like, all that stuff is made up. And I think it's our job as a team leader to manage that in others because they don't know yet what it is. And I think sometimes we're. We want to fire hose them, right? Let me tell you all this stuff. I know. Let me turn you into a little junior me so I can replicate myself. And I think what works better is, let's see where you are. Let's, you know, watch you do some activity and get in and go. And then like, hey, let me give you this one little thing to work on until you got it. And then we add it up. It's the same as that stacking small wins with homeownership thing where it just gets easier. Every time you win your first cold call, you're gonna be sweating. You're gonna like, really hope they don't answer you. Like, definitely don't want to leave them a message, right? And then someone's gonna answer and be right here next to you. And I'll be like, ah, say this, say that, right? Like, that's how you get them to win. And that magic that happens when they're like, oh my gosh, I just booked a buyer consult. What do I say right now? It's like, now we actually have something to work out with. So I think, you know, that agent really has to focus on where is this person and where do they need to get to and how do we get there? One step at a time.

[A]

This is super good. All right, last question I want to ask you for today. And then I'm hoping that we can get you back on again to talk about strategies like you're discussing right now for the newer agents of specifically what they can do to get better at their job, which will lead to more houses being sold as opposed to just where can. Who's got the crack, where do I get the leads, how do I go close them? As a person who is successful at this, I would presume you recognize certain people will want your training, want your attention, want your mentorship. And then when they get it, they're going to leave and go to a discount brokerage. They're going to go, want to do their own thing, and they're not always honest about that. You don't get new people that say, can you mentor me? As soon as I learn how to do what you're doing, I'm going to take off and go be your competition, or I'm going to go do it and not help you. But your position wants to know if I invest in this person and build them up. We are going to be business partners of some sense moving forward. Can you just frankly share what are some of the things that you notice from your position that would disqualify someone from being a good fit for mentorship? That the people listening recognize some of the maybe toxic traits that they're showing to the person that they want commitment from and change how they're thinking about it to more successfully garner mentorship from those in the business that are better.

[B]

Yeah, I think that's an interesting question. And I think my specific, one of my very specific avatars that I always tend to attract, whether it is a buyer or a real estate agent, is the she. Women with man problems. Okay, she's got a baby daddy. She doesn't like getting divorced.

[A]

She wants to prove to the world she can do it on her own and she doesn't want to depend on someone else, right?

[B]

No, she's not there. She's not there. That's where I want to get her to be.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

But she's the victim. She doesn't really believe in herself. She's always putting everyone else's needs first. She knows she's got more in there, but she doesn't know how to get it because like the world has kind of on her a lot, I guess, is how I. That that literally that's who I end up with like all the time. Lately I've started getting these really cute 22 year old young men and that's kind of interesting and really fun. But most of the time I think about who am I attracting and where can we get them to, right? So when I get these people who want to work with me who are that person, I know that there is a strong, independent woman in that shell. And if I can get them to a place where they feel empowered and leadership, not like necessarily they're leading a team or running their own business or whatever because honestly a lot of people don't do that. But getting that person from someone who feels like they need someone else to take, take their hand and show them what to do and they just want to help, but they don't know what to do, to a place where they are now a leader in their family, in their home, in their community, I think that creates the stickiness, right? When people I work with know that I believe in them and I trust them and I am willing to do the unscalable things. Like I don't know, dude, you're not doing well and something bad happened and nobody's there to sit with you and talk with you through it. I'm willing to do that. That's not my job. I don't need to know your baby daddy drama. But, like, if you're in a moment and you need some help with it, I'm here to talk you through that. Right. In the same way that, you know, if your sink is leaking, I'm going to be like, okay, first, let's shut the water off right now. Let's find the plumber. It really is that same skill set, but it's applied toward your people. And I think when you can be with people in their struggles and listen to them and not necessarily try to solve their problems, which is like, be there for them, it does create that kind of loyalty and stickiness. And the more you can lift people up with you, grow together, the rising tide lifts all the boats or whatever, I think you're gonna get that loyalty. And I think it used to be that people would be like, this is my proprietary system. You know, give me your money and I'll teach you it. And then, you know. Right. And I don't think that's it now. I think, like, people who want to be on your real estate team want to be you. They want to do what you have done. They might want to climb ahead of you, maybe. And actually, you should encourage that. Right? Like, you're not here to be the top dog and sell all the houses. You are here to get people to, you know, outpace you, outrun you, and shorten their learning curve. And so when you recognize that and are like, okay, here's what I did. Here's what works. Is that going to work for you? Let's try it. Right. I think it's that. It's that, like, unscalable human, be a person thing. And it seems silly to have to say, like, how can I be more of a person for you today? But I think we're so surrounded with like, okay, click this button, fit in this box. Do this exactly this way. You know, click yes if you want that. That when you can just be like, hey, actually, tell me more about that. How can I help? It goes really far.

[A]

The theme I'm seeing you say is with new people, rather than telling them everything you know or trying to turn them into a you. You kind of got to meet them where they're at and help them tackle the challenges that they are facing, not the challenges you face and preparing them for something that they're not ready for yet. Is that accurate?

[B]

Totally.

[A]

It's really good advice. I'm thinking as you're talking of times with my team members when I would sit down and teach them high level real estate, real estate stuff. And they were fascinated, but it's probably useless to them versus the time I was like, look, guys, I'm going to show you how to find the house in the MLS quickly without wasting time. That is going to work for a house hacker. You look open to the page. Look at this, look at this, look at this. If the days on market is above this, don't even bother. Click backwards in the picture. If it doesn't have another part of the house that can be developed, skip it, move on to the next one. And they were like, oh my gosh, this is. Saves me so much time. But I never would have thought that that's what I needed to be doing because I assume that they're going to learn that like I did a long time ago. But that's really a great point, is meet them where they're at. That gives them the feeling that you're a person who cares about what they're doing. Build that loyalty and then you can pour into them without hesitation that they're going to leave and they can garner the investment that they need from you without worrying about being taken advantage of. And that's what you need to have a good partnership.

[B]

Totally. This is Jocko's decentralized command, right? Like if you are the leader, you are not out there throwing bombs. You are telling the person, I need you to go throw a bomb in this spot. And then you let the people who are on the field figure out how best to get the bomb to the location. Right. So if you're a real estate agent. All right, dude, you got a. This negotiation to do for this inspection. What's the situation? Right. I'm actually just asking them questions one question at a time. You give me the answer, I ask you another question. You give me the answer, I ask you another question. And by doing this, I'm allowing the agent to come to the conclusion or the path or the next step forward on their own. And so now they can really own it. And a lot of people don't do that for people. They just tell them what to do. And I think it's really unfair, actually. And it doesn't give people an opportunity, opportunity to grow and figure things out on their own. And I think that's really what we all want to do.

[A]

Really good advice. This is fantastic. I'm definitely going to have you back and get into the weeds of Some of the specific details of what you just described at a more practical level, for those that are hearing this that are like, oh, my gosh, Amy's great. I want to talk to her more. Where can they go to find out more about you?

[B]

You could find me on our website. It's brickandbanister.com all spelled out 1N in Bannister. When you name your business, don't make it really long. That's stupid. And I'm also on Instagram. Amy underscore Renee. That's R A N A E. So sorry, I also spelled that wrong. But I would love it if you reached out.

[A]

Yeah, but you're smart enough to spell it out. A lot of people don't. They're like, yeah, it's Hiven Weister Meester. And then the person has to go try to figure out how to find them. We get that every once in a while.

[B]

So long, handle Brick and Banister dot. We work in Minnesota and Wisconsin. If you're a real estate agent looking for a great team to partner with, we would love to talk to you. And I'm on Instagram, and usually I'm doing silly things like digging in the dirt, playing with poultry, or running my mouth. So come find me.

[A]

And if you had any doubt at all that Amy is good at what she does, I would just direct your attention to the fact that she hid her Minnesota and Wisconsin accent for the entire time that we were recording. No small feat. This is somebody who could work in the CIA if they needed to. She can definitely sell your house. Amy, thank you for joining me today. We'll do this again and have you back on. I appreciate it.

[B]

Can't wait. Thanks, David.

[A]

My pleasure. All right, folks, that is our show for today. Thank you very much for joining. And remember, as always, today's show is sponsored by the one brokerage. The one brokerage that can do any kind of loan you could ever need. Check us out at the1brokerage.com or go to davidgreen24.com and use the chat feature to reach out and get connected to me directly. And I will figure out about the kind of deal you're trying to refinance or buy and get you connected with the best person, even give them a little bit of advice of how they can serve you better. And we will help you build your wealth of real estate together. I'll see you guys next week on Real Talk. Realtor.

[B]

Sa.