David and Tamala Mann Reveal the SECRET to A Successful Marriage

Summary

The Deep End with Lecrae

Episode: David and Tamela Mann Reveal the SECRET to A Successful Marriage

Date: January 30, 2026
Host: Lecrae
Guests: David Mann, Tamela Mann

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Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the story of David and Tamela Mann—acclaimed entertainers and beloved Christian couple—who open up about their 38-year marriage, the real-life challenges they have overcome, and the keys to sustaining love amid adversity. Lecrae, known for creating a safe space for vulnerable conversations, guides the Manns as they candidly share their journey from humble beginnings, blended families, public struggles, and personal traumas to national stardom. Their conversation offers both practical wisdom and powerful testimony, delivered with humor, raw honesty, and deep affection.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Origins and Genuine Friendship

• Meeting and Early Years
  • David and Tamela met as teenagers (18–19) and began as close friends before progressing into romance—spending long hours together as part of their musical circle.
    • “We were just friends, homeboy. Like, we literally...her and my brothers hung out a lot. Like that’s how cool she was with my family.” —David [07:21]
  • Tamela was even present at the birth of David’s oldest child, evidence of the longstanding platonic bond before romance.
• Transition from Friends to Partners
  • Their romantic journey was rooted in friendship, honesty, and mutual support, allowing them to weather storms together.
    • “I think our friendship is what has kept our relationship because we were so deep of friends.” —Tamela [21:31]

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2. Handling Past Luggage: Blended Families and Early Marriage Struggles

• Navigating Stepchildren and “Baby Mama Drama”
  • Tamela supported David in co-parenting, despite the fact that his children from previous relationships entered their marriage years later.
    • “Just imagine having your wife come home and you got another child.” —David [29:45]
  • Tamela admitted it was hard but stressed the importance of prioritizing the children and not blaming each other.
    • “It was a hard place...but our love has really covered a multitude of fault. And our friendship.” —Tamela [30:45]
• Financial Hardship and Sacrifice
  • Early marriage included periods of poverty, including nights without electricity, but Tamela responded by building up David rather than tearing him down.
    • “She took that moment and built me up...‘When you can do better, we gonna do better.’” —David [24:22]

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3. Shaping Their Marriage without Role Models

• Breaking Generational Patterns
  • Both lacked healthy father figures, experienced poverty (including “dumpster diving” as children), and witnessed abuse at home, forcing them to define marriage and family for themselves.
    • “We were figuring it out because we both...Neither one of our fathers were in our lives. We both had stepfathers, which was crazy.” —Tamela [17:10]
  • David’s vow: to love Tamela the way he wished someone had loved his mother.
    • “I wish I could have found somebody to love my mama like I love this woman.” —David [20:23]

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4. Keys to a Lasting Marriage

• Commitment to Growth and Refusing to Quit
  • Divorce was “taken off the table” early on—conflict meant working through, not walking out.
    • “We decided that divorce was not an option. We took it straight off the table.” —David [22:24]
• Communication and Accountability
  • Tamela stressed gentle communication, avoiding words that wound deeply.
    • “You say stuff in our beginning years just like you saying stuff that just really pierces...So as the years went, it’s like he started seeing it, seeing himself and me, us kind of just talking through the things.” —Tamela [21:31]
  • Developing skills to apologize meaningfully, identify root causes of conflict, and maintain peace in the home.
    • “If we’re gonna apologize, let’s talk about what we’re apologizing for so we don’t continue to repeat these same things.” —David [51:06]
• Mutual Support and Selflessness
  • Valuing each other’s victories equally; David often prefers to be behind-the-scenes, actively supporting Tamela’s career.
    • “When she makes it, I’m in the background. Like, we done. We made it.” —David [69:56]

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5. Maintaining Faith and Resilience in the Public Eye

• Surviving Sudden Career Upheavals
  • When Kirk Franklin disbanded the “Family,” the Manns were devastated but pivoted to a new opportunity—leading to their break with Tyler Perry.
    • “The worst thing that happened to us in our career was the best thing that happened to us.” —David [42:16]
    • “Change can make you fearful, but change is not always bad.” —Tamela [39:21]
• Handling Fame and Legacy
  • They see their achievements—hit records, sitcoms, movies—as blessings, not the goal itself. It’s about service and impact.
    • “We was just trying to eat...to step back, and I was telling her...to be a part of a number one album, radio, sitcom, movie...there’s not a lot of people that can say that.” —David [68:17]

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6. Mental Health, Depression & Vulnerability

• David’s Battle with Depression
  • David describes hiding his depression behind work, afraid to show weakness as a public figure and family provider.
    • “Some people drink it away...I say, let's work and just keep my head down. Nobody will know. They knew something was going on.” —David [55:06]
  • The breaking point came when he confessed his struggle to his family; this was liberating, although he suffered in silence for a long time.
    • “Thousands of people got to watch me drown every day...the only true way that they were going to know I drowned is when I was gone.” —David [58:12]
• Tamela’s Perspective as Spouse
  • Tamela expressed regret she didn’t “catch the cries” and now makes a point to check in deeply, not just at surface level.
    • “It was a stab to the heart because I felt like I should have saw or I didn’t take heed enough...I didn’t catch the cries.” —Tamela [58:43]
• Therapy and Spiritual Support
  • David credits therapy and prayer (his therapist opened sessions with prayer) for his recovery, and says it’s not unspiritual to seek help.
    • “Prayer with the therapy helped me.” —David [63:47]
  • His therapist’s advice: “You gotta learn to be a little more selfish,” which challenged his upbringing and ultimately helped set boundaries and improve his wellbeing.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On enduring love:
  “Our love has really covered a multitude of fault.” —Tamela [30:45]

• On blended families:
  “He was a nice ho. That’s what she wanted to say.” —David, joking about his youthful relationships [15:37]

• On trauma and healing:
  “Two sick people don’t make a healthy person.” —Lecrae, therapeutic insight [21:01]

• On public persona vs. personal struggle:
  “I’m Superman...I gotta take the S off my chest and tell the people that I’m the strongest to...I’m weak, I’m vulnerable.” —David [57:35]

• On giving grace:
  “The grace that you don’t show is the grace that you’re going to need.” —Tamela [65:07]

• On supporting each other’s callings:
  “When she make it, I’m in the background...Her name, it’s deliberate. Call her name. I want to be out of the spot.” —David [69:56]

• On faith and overcoming hardship:
  “Change can make you fearful, but change is not always bad.” —Tamela [39:21]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Origin Story, Friendship to Marriage: [07:14]–[10:44]
• Blended Family/Co-Parenting Challenges: [26:56]–[34:00]
• Defining Marriage Without Role Models: [17:08]–[20:23]
• Poverty and Resilience: [24:22]–[25:52]
• Making It in Entertainment, Tyler Perry transition: [37:07]–[42:33]
• Marriage & Public Life, Sharing Success: [46:08]–[51:06]
• Mental Health and Recovery: [54:38]–[63:47]
• Faith, Therapy, and Healing: [63:47]–[65:07]
• Legacy, Humility, and Supporting Each Other’s Shine: [68:16]–[71:26]
• Upcoming Projects/Love and Relationship Tour: [73:56]–[75:53]

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Upcoming Projects Mentioned

• Mama Mann’s Kitchen (YouTube): Cooking show and seasoning line—“Another part of me that you get to see.” —Tamela [73:56]
• Love and Relationship Tour (April 2026): A mix of music, comedy, and real talk about marriage and love. —[74:39]

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Conclusion

David and Tamela Mann’s story is one of authenticity, faith, perseverance, and deep-rooted friendship. They embody marriage as an ever-evolving partnership—one that thrives not because of a lack of challenges, but because of grace, communication, and unshakeable commitment. Through humor, honesty, and spiritual grounding, they offer a powerful testament for anyone determined to love through life’s deep waters.

Transcript

[David Mann]

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[Sophia Bush]

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[Tamela Mann]

Bill Clinton is my dad. I ate ham. Sorry. I knew it. I was like 40 something.

[Lecrae]

Rumor has it you was in them streets.

[David Mann]

Wasn't no rumor. That's fact. Fact happened.

[Lecrae]

You wasn't scared.

[Tamela Mann]

David was with the girls, y'. All, but he wasn't disrespectful as a nigga.

[David Mann]

What? She wanna be street, but she said he was a nice ho. That's what she wanna be.

[Lecrae]

This could be so ghetto if y'

[David Mann]

all wasn't who y' all were.

[Tamela Mann]

And it still is ghetto. It don't matter.

[David Mann]

It's ghetto. Imagine having your wife come home and you. They would ask me, are you okay? I'll figure it out on my own. That was literally killing me. Thousands and thousands of people got to watch me drown every day. And the only true way that they were going to know that I drowned is when I was gone. I'm thinking about ending myself. You'll just pray it away. Your faith ain't strong enough. I have strong faith. I went to the altar several times.

[Lecrae]

What I've read is the people who struggle the most with mental health are the people they're married to.

[Tamela Mann]

I should have stopped. Was a stab to the heart.

[David Mann]

That get me just thinking about it.

[Tamela Mann]

I didn't catch the cries. And to find out later that you were right there at the break of. Like you would have left me. Why did you leave me? Because to me it wouldn't be no me with God because of Dave.

[David Mann]

This is the deep end with Lecrae.

[Lecrae]

All right, ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls. I know we got a special one today. You know what I mean? Not if it's not special to anybody but me. It's special to me because I am. I was raised in the faith on who I have sitting here with me today. I know them from a million different types of worlds. I don't know how you found out about him. I don't know if it was through old school Kirk Franklin projects, if it was Tyler Perry plays or movies, or the incredible career as a solo artist and comedians or reality tv. You know, I don't know. Maybe you just had the seasonings and the spices. But however you've come in contact with David and Tamela, man, you were blessed for it. And I have them here with us today. Thank you.

[David Mann]

Thank you for having us. Thank you.

[Tamela Mann]

That was a sweetie.

[David Mann]

But you know what? You forget you've done all that stuff. It's like, oh, yeah, we did do reality tv. Yes, you did.

[Tamela Mann]

We pulled you into the house.

[David Mann]

I was watching. Thankfully.

[Lecrae]

It was good stuff.

[David Mann]

All right.

[Lecrae]

So, yeah, no, I. I am a fan, you know, and I. And I give credit to my wife. My wife introduced me to y'.

[Tamela Mann]

All.

[Lecrae]

You know what I'm saying?

[David Mann]

Thank you.

[Lecrae]

Yeah, she introduced. Cause she was like, you know, we was living in Memphis, this is early 2000s, I believe it was. And we drove to see a play

[David Mann]

that y' all was in. Yes. Wow.

[Lecrae]

And it was like. She was like, no, we gonna drive. We drove two hours to go see y'.

[Tamela Mann]

All.

[Lecrae]

Cause she was a fan. And I got introduced. I said, oh, that they are amazing. Cause I, you know, I was kinda.

[David Mann]

I'm not gonna see no play.

[Lecrae]

I was gonna see a playful men do that.

[Tamela Mann]

So the ladies are the ones who

[David Mann]

really do buy the tickets. And we will call them out sometime and say, you really didn't wanna come, but now you're having a good time. They'll be, yeah, I am.

[Lecrae]

So, yeah, I'll be sitting in my car.

[Tamela Mann]

This is your granddaddy.

[David Mann]

Do you know that is one of the things that will never. And it was. It was something to mess with her. Okay. That was when you seen it on the video, is when I made it up. Wow. I made it up to mess with her. And I asked her the dumbest question. Have you ever met him? No, you've never met him. He's dead. And I started singing to her, and it stuck, like, 20 years later. It's still here.

[Lecrae]

That's crazy.

[David Mann]

Like, wow.

[Lecrae]

Yeah. Y' all legacy is out of control. Like, some of the stuff that you know. And I think what it is is y' all are just so authentic and real. You know, it's like, it ain't. You got people in church world who kind of, like, put on an air like, yes, I have it all together. And Jesus made me like this. But y' all came out the gate like, look, Funky town, Fort Worth.

[David Mann]

This is what it is.

[Lecrae]

That is what is what you get.

[Tamela Mann]

That's right. That is weed. Funky town. Yeah.

[David Mann]

What you see is what you get.

[Tamela Mann]

This is it, man. But it's just really a blessing for us to even be sitting here with you today. Thank you so much, and we're honored to be sitting with you. But we're also proud of you, of what you've done and accomplished. So it's like we're watching you. We're watching. We don't talk every day, y', all, and all that, but it's like you have. You pray. We're praying for you as well as, you know, we're doing what we're doing. But we want the Lord to just bless in many ways, to draw all men unto him, man. So that's what it's all about for us is any way we can sneak it in.

[Lecrae]

Yeah, yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

Get it in. Lord like to leave that nugget to point people to him. That's what it's all about.

[David Mann]

And we realize. We.

[Lecrae]

We.

[David Mann]

We always a work in progress. Men are. Tell people we are work in progress. You know, what you see with our marriage is. Is not perfect.

[Tamela Mann]

That's right.

[David Mann]

It works for us, our family. We're work in progress, right?

[Lecrae]

Speaking of marriage.

[Tamela Mann]

Huh?

[Lecrae]

Y' all is. What is 37.

[David Mann]

We going on 38 this year. Be 38 in April 26th.

[Tamela Mann]

The 26 would be 38 years.

[Lecrae]

That's crazy.

[Tamela Mann]

But we've been friends and together for 40 years.

[Lecrae]

Okay, so wait, how old was y' all when y' all met?

[Tamela Mann]

18 and I turned 19.

[David Mann]

Okay.

[Lecrae]

Now, the rumor has it you was in them streets.

[David Mann]

It wasn't no rumor. That's fact.

[Lecrae]

Okay.

[David Mann]

Fact have it.

[Lecrae]

So you was in them streets back

[David Mann]

in the day, Deep in the streets.

[Tamela Mann]

Well, you in the streets.

[David Mann]

I wasn't in the streets. I was. See, let me tell you this. I wasn't deep in the streets. I've never smoked. I've never drank. I didn't like to party.

[Tamela Mann]

He liked girls.

[Lecrae]

He liked the girls.

[Tamela Mann]

He liked girls.

[David Mann]

That's what I was talking about. The female streets.

[Lecrae]

That's what I was talking about.

[Tamela Mann]

Okay. Okay.

[Lecrae]

So what made you, like. How did you pull Tamela? What was the.

[David Mann]

Well, it wasn't. She was my friend. She knew all the dirt. She knew all the boxes.

[Tamela Mann]

I knew all the girls.

[David Mann]

All the girls. So we were just friends, homeboy. Like, we literally. Homeboy. Homegirl. Like her and my brothers hung out a lot. Like, that's how cool she was with my family. She was just our friend.

[Lecrae]

Okay.

[David Mann]

Hey, can you pick my brother up from school? Yeah, we gonna go hang out. You go. She called. Let me tell you. This is what happened with. They had a surprise birthday party for me. And as my friend, she could have called and told me what was going down.

[Tamela Mann]

I didn't know who was invited. Honestly, that time I didn't.

[David Mann]

You should have told me.

[Tamela Mann]

But when you walked in that joint,

[David Mann]

I was like, why would friends tell friends what's going on? I didn't know who I walked in the party with.

[Tamela Mann]

And it was a house party.

[David Mann]

I walk in the party with this girl, and inside is another girl I'm talking to. And guess who's standing at the door My Lord this one standing at the door My Lord didn't it rain? Didn't lookin at it all go down Like I look like oh, God, he

[Tamela Mann]

didn't stay long and too. She was a y' all. And she happened to be another nationality. So of course, coming in with us, a whole bunch of black girls.

[Lecrae]

Uh huh.

[Tamela Mann]

It's like, you coming in with this Mexican, you know, we like everybody, but we was like, you gonna bring her over here? Oh. And I was like, boy, you shouldn't have did that. And he was like, man, why y'? All?

[David Mann]

But that's what. You know. And we started. We were friends.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[David Mann]

And I just started to see our friendship grow. Like we were really friends. Like, we would talk on the phone. Girl, let me tell you what happened. That kind of stuff. Like.

[Tamela Mann]

But, you know, we started singing together.

[Lecrae]

Yeah. Okay.

[Tamela Mann]

We was teens singing together. And that. That turned into the friendship of. And me and David. It was Kurt, Darl Blair, Kirk Franklin, Darl Blair and then David and us, David and myself. And actually, it was them three first.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[David Mann]

Oh, we were local famous.

[Tamela Mann]

They was.

[David Mann]

We were local famous.

[Tamela Mann]

They really were, y'.

[David Mann]

All.

[Tamela Mann]

They, they, they people.

[David Mann]

We were known all over the city,

[Tamela Mann]

Dallas, Fort Worth area. But it's like, it was really a blessing. But these guys. I came in kind of like the big sister. Cause I was. I was the oldest of all four of us.

[David Mann]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

So. And then Kermit Wells was playing, and we had another little guy that played drums with us. I'll just shout him out. John. John. But it was like we all. It was Such a blessing to it to I guess how it happened. But then our friendship, like he said, kept growing. And David, I just thought just started

[David Mann]

like, hey, make sure y' all take care of her. Is she good? She good.

[Tamela Mann]

He did. He was very protective of me, like.

[David Mann]

And it was like all of a sudden, matter of fact, let me tell you how cool we were. She was at the hospital when my oldest child was born. She was there at the hospital. People don't believe this, but we were friends. We were okay. I told you, you ain't gotta work tomorrow. Just come to the hospital, chill. And you don't got. You don't have nothing to do. So she stayed at the hospital with us, what, 20 hours? 21.

[Tamela Mann]

21. 21.

[David Mann]

I remember just at the hospital chilling. And then so I just started to see who she was as a person. And one day, I don't know what, out of the blue, you know, you stay away from that because that could get serious. And I ain't ready for that. I gotta keep my player card and fool around and kissed the girl on the mouth. And what did we do that for? Why would you do that?

[Lecrae]

So you had. You thought he was cute then.

[David Mann]

Of course she did. She would never say that he was

[Tamela Mann]

a looker and he was real fine. But I wouldn't just. I didn't tell him that he was fine, but he was fine.

[David Mann]

She wasn't him.

[Tamela Mann]

And they was all cut up. I mean, he was, you know, he was a little. Had his little different kind of haircut.

[David Mann]

I had a Mohawk. That's why she didn't want to mess with me. Cause I got you from work. She was a church girl, so she didn't want to mess with me with that Mohawk.

[Lecrae]

The Mohawk is crazy.

[Tamela Mann]

And David, you know, like in how they was still in high school, they was cutting hair. So once he left school, he went to beauty school.

[David Mann]

People don't know I was a hairstylist. Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

So it's like it just kept going.

[Lecrae]

What is your life?

[David Mann]

I. I've done everything.

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[David Mann]

Yeah.

[Lecrae]

So, okay, hold on. Rewind the tape. Y' all are singers around Fort Worth. Y' all just friends.

[David Mann]

Yeah.

[Lecrae]

You at the hospital with his baby mama and you like I kind of feel her. Well, that was down the line.

[David Mann]

That was later. Cause it was just like we were literally spending 10, 12 hours a day

[Lecrae]

we started to fall for without realizing. This is literally my wife and I, same story. That's what's crazy.

[David Mann]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

But he cannot let Me. Let me dab a little bit deeper for you because of. After the baby was born. And then it's like by him not staying with the. With the mama, you know, they kind of broke apart. So I became the in between for him to see the baby.

[David Mann]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

I think that's what broke. Broke the.

[Lecrae]

Because you were still cool with her.

[Tamela Mann]

I was still cool with her, and I actually knew her before he did because she lived in this town where my brother lived, and I would go there, like, for the summer, and my nephew went to school. It's crazy, but how the dots got all.

[David Mann]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

Clothes got put together.

[Lecrae]

You wasn't scared?

[Tamela Mann]

No, because it wasn't. I. I was going in with my heart. Was going in for the right reason.

[David Mann]

Okay.

[Tamela Mann]

It wasn't going.

[David Mann]

What do you mean? What, she was scared? Like.

[Lecrae]

Well, I'm just thinking, like, you seen him do all this dirt all.

[David Mann]

But he was.

[Tamela Mann]

But David was with the girls, y'. All. But he was not, like, a bad actor with women. He did. Wasn't disrespectful.

[David Mann]

Let me tell you what she want to say in the real.

[Tamela Mann]

He wasn't disrespectful as a. What she wanted, I will say if

[David Mann]

she want a pie. But she said he was a nice hoe. That's what she wanted.

[Tamela Mann]

See, I just said. See, you didn't even have to say that. But I. But I was.

[David Mann]

That's what she wanted.

[Tamela Mann]

But he was really nice to his girlfriend, so he was.

[David Mann]

I mean, I wasn't disrespectful to anybody.

[Tamela Mann]

I just had friends or degraded. I mean, it's like. Even though the things. It's like he tried to keep it separate. He did. It was truly a player's card. He was trying to keep everybody divided and separate.

[Lecrae]

I love all y' all just different ways, right?

[David Mann]

I like your hair and you dress nice. Oh, my gosh.

[Tamela Mann]

But I knew. But I think that's what really drew him to me, is I was helping him with her.

[Lecrae]

Okay.

[David Mann]

And I started to see all the traits that I wanted to spend the rest of my life. Cause, you know, my deal is when I, like, locked in on somebody, I'm like, hey, this is it.

[Lecrae]

Okay.

[David Mann]

So she started to see. Before we really hooked up, she started to see me kind of like, all right. I mean, I just started making everybody go away, and we just started spending all the time together. Like, days and hours. You're just hanging.

[Lecrae]

So if the average person looks at y' all and, like, admires y', all, I can see the Young girls, like, man, that's what I want. Da da da, da. Because they don't see the storms or the trauma or what made y' all who y' all are today. If we go back in time to like yalls households, before y' all got married, did y' all have a picture of what relationships should look like or was y' all having to figure it out as you go along?

[David Mann]

You'll fool around and make me cry.

[Tamela Mann]

Yeah, we figured out. We were figuring it out because we both. Neither one of our fathers were in our lives. We both had stepfathers, which was. That was crazy. So a lot of our story is the same when you just make us think about it. Cause it does kind of bring tears to the heart. Because it was a struggle. My mom, you know, I just, you know, it's crazy, but my mom, you

[David Mann]

see how she tried to do that. Because it'll really take you somewhere.

[Tamela Mann]

Yeah.

[David Mann]

To where? Like, it wasn't.

[Tamela Mann]

It wasn't an easy put together. Like you said, it was some rough people look at now. But you don't know the then it was some really rough points in our lives where I'm talking about y'.

[David Mann]

All.

[Tamela Mann]

Where I tell. Well, he did it for me. How growing up, the man in my married. We wind up dumpster diving. We think if we're going into a better situation, but the situation got worse. So it's like.

[David Mann]

And you don't for. Don't tell them. For those that don't know what dumpster

[Tamela Mann]

diving is, Dumpster diving is when you actually go to the grocery store. You know the dumpster that they go and throw when the dates go out, they throw that away. We were in. Going in the dumpster, taking that, rinsing it off and putting that in the refrigerator.

[David Mann]

And imagine being a teenager doing that.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

So. And it's like me and then a couple my nieces and nephews was with us. And it's just. It was just really. It was really, really rough. But I'm really grateful to God. It's like, I didn't hold that against mama. I just. As I got older, I was like, well, I guess she was just doing.

[Lecrae]

Trying to figure it out.

[Tamela Mann]

Trying to figure it out.

[Lecrae]

She got a story too.

[Tamela Mann]

Like, what was her child. Yes.

[David Mann]

Right. Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

So I just. But then it like that was rough. So I didn't really see. Besides, you know, my church people, my church home. Thank God for church. Because church and singing is what saved me. So my church family, I got to see what a real family. Like two parent Home look like. So that's my part of the story.

[David Mann]

My situation was I seen my mom abused. Like, whether it was mentally, physically, verbally, I seen all of that. And so it turned me into a little vicious machine, like, to where I can remember as early as 3 years old saying, I'm not gonna let nobody hit my mama. I'm not. And so it just caused me to have this hatred for men, like, for a long. When we got married, she knew she was my calm because my hatred for men, by the way they had treated my mom, it was like I was ready to fight. All you had to do was say boo to me. Let's go roll.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[David Mann]

You know, a woman could say anything, you know, but men and it. And it caused my relationship with a lot of men to go sour. Until one day I just stopped and said, wow, you gotta fix this. And going into marriage, that's why when I said I wanted to make sure that when I got a one, one person that they know what it felt like to be loved. Because I always tell people when we are, if it's one thing, you know, when you make it big, I wanna buy my mama house. I wanna buy my mama a car. I wish I could have found somebody to love my mama like I love this woman. That's what I wish I could have bought my mama. And that's the crazy thing.

[Lecrae]

Oh, that's actually beautiful.

[David Mann]

But it's like, I wish I could have found somebody to love her, to show her how I love this woman, to love her like that.

[Lecrae]

So, yeah, yeah, I relate. You know, I. Same type of situation. I was abused by my mom's, you know, ex, and just seen her struggle so much. But then when my wife and I started having issues, I went to therapy, and the therapist was like, tell me about your family. And I tell them. She's like, you know, I talk about my dad being on the streets, and then my mom and them not working, and she said, you know, two sick people don't make a healthy person.

[Tamela Mann]

Wow.

[Lecrae]

So I was like, oh, that was good. I didn't realize that. So I had to think about myself. So I'm just. When I see yalls marriage, it looks so beautiful. But what. What were the trials and tribulations that made y' all strong? Like, especially coming from these backgrounds, you

[Tamela Mann]

know, I think what made us strong is we were trying to triumph over what we saw, Right? We was trying to give our kids what we didn't have, so. And I'm trying to give each other

[David Mann]

what we didn't have. Yeah. What we didn't see.

[Tamela Mann]

So it's like. Like you say it wasn't a perfect journey because me learning as even with 37 years, to become a better communicator. Because to me, I love if I always been there. And I think our friendship is what has kept our relationship because we were so deep of friends where it's like, really, we came to each other. Even though in the times of, like, when it get rough, I kind of walk away so I won't learn to say things that are piercing. Because I used to tell him, I said, you say stuff in our beginning years just like you saying stuff that just really pierces. So it's kind of hard to forget. So as the years went, it's like he started seeing it, seeing himself and me, us kind of just talking through the things. Because we were. You know, we decided that divorce was not an option.

[David Mann]

We took it straight off the table. It's not an option because we see. We had seen it so much, you

[Tamela Mann]

know, so it's like, we're gonna work through the troubles because we know that, you know, you know, things are gonna happen. You go, you're not gonna always agree. But I think us in our friendship and I love one another and that we can show or be an example of what we would like for people to, you know, it's like, we want to be an example for somebody to come along and see that you can work through these things.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[David Mann]

We were always willing to try to figure it out, whatever it was. I told her yesterday, and I was telling someone yesterday that she's never pressured me to perform. And when I say pressured me to perform, she's never pressured me. Like, you know, they got a new car and they got a new. You see her ring? It was always like, hey, if we can't do that, I'm okay with it. And to make me feel like, you know, she's. She's very instrumental in building me to this dude.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[David Mann]

Like. Cause I can give you one instance. This is. This is crazy. We're in the middle of winter, and I tell the story. We're in the middle of winter, and it's cold, freezing. We come home and the lights are out. New baby, new baby, lights are out. I was like, well, maybe everybody's lights are out. No, you just didn't pay the bill. And, man, I was so hard on myself, so down on myself. And it just devastated me till I just sit there and really just talked myself into being the sorriest man that you ever Want to. You know, this is terrible. You can't keep the lights on. You can't. And she took that moment, and she could have taken that moment. Like, yeah, you're right. It's cold. We got this baby and all of this. She took that moment and built me up. Like, when you can do better, you're gonna do better. So let's just lay down. Let's wrap the baby up. Lay down. She went and took a shower, a cold shower in the cold, and got into bed, and she said, when you can do better, we gonna do better.

[Lecrae]

That's a real one.

[David Mann]

That shaped.

[Lecrae]

That's a real one.

[David Mann]

What that. And so what that did to me, it lit a fire early on in our marriage to, like, now, by the way, I go overboard with lights now. Oh, no. Literally, when we're building something, she has to tell me, stop with the lights, sir. Stop with the lights. No more lights.

[Lecrae]

No more lights.

[David Mann]

Stop with the lights.

[Lecrae]

You need some lights.

[David Mann]

Cause I swore to her I would never have her in the dark again.

[Tamela Mann]

And we have no.

[David Mann]

So we take. You take little stuff like that, and it's just like, you walk in our house, if you have covered, you'll see, like, okay, there's too many lights in here. It is too many lights. Put a can light. I want can lights coming out the floor.

[Tamela Mann]

We didn't do that. We didn't do that.

[David Mann]

But it shaped me as a man to hear her speaking to me that early. It lit a fire. You know, some people take that kind of moment, and it could just. It turned me into, like, this beast for her.

[Tamela Mann]

Cause it's like, the thing about it, y' all and ladies, is it was night time. I said, either we can go to your mom's house, or we can stay here. So I did. We wrapped up. Wrapped the baby up. And I say, it's night time, so it's time to go to bed. So let's just go and go to bed.

[David Mann]

I couldn't sleep. I stayed up on side of bed.

[Tamela Mann]

He sat up on side of the bed. But my thing is, why beat somebody up when they're already down?

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

And to me, I wouldn't want anybody to do it to me. So I. It just. I don't know. It's. Honestly, I just think, honestly, the Holy Ghost, God, whatever you want to call it, has really, truly been my guide.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

I mean, my mother was a very, very peaceful, quiet, like, lady.

[Lecrae]

Okay.

[Tamela Mann]

And she showed.

[David Mann]

Until she's playing diamond love.

[Tamela Mann]

She showed a lot of. She showed a lot of love. But I really. The Lord has really groomed me to be a wife.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[David Mann]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

So, I mean, and it's like, again, I've always remembered do unto others. That has really stuck with me my whole life. Even with just people in general. I believe in giving two and three and second. Second chances. I believe in second, second, and third chances with people.

[Lecrae]

So as you say that I'm. This is one of the stories that y' all have told, and I want y' all to feed it back because this would make me say, oh, they. I trust them because they done been through the ringer. So, you know, y' all was talking about this, but y' all give me, like, the movie depiction of it because y' all tell these baby stories, but, like, I'm imagining y' all just sitting at the house chilling, and then you get a knock at the door.

[David Mann]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Lecrae]

So.

[David Mann]

So this is a case. This is a case of stuff you've done in the past. Coming back to meet your future. And literally at the house chilling, and it was. Hey, how you doing, constable? What child? You've been served? Served for what? Dinner. What you mean serve? You have a child.

[Lecrae]

How far into Yalls relationship is?

[Tamela Mann]

Five years.

[David Mann]

Wow. Into marriage.

[Lecrae]

Into marriage.

[David Mann]

Five years. So just to clear up the record, because, you know, out there on the meme streets of the Internet, he had a baby on her while he didn't be.

[Tamela Mann]

But I knew the girl. Yeah, I knew that. Just to give you some.

[Lecrae]

Before y' all had got married, before

[Tamela Mann]

we got married, he was. I knew he was. Well, they was fooling around. And I knew of that because we were singing together then. So, I mean, as time went by,

[David Mann]

then we get the knock at the door. So mind you, she had nurtured the first oldest girl. And when I get this. So how do you tell somebody when you get home, like, hey, how was your day? It was good. I mean, we good. We got a new baby. Baby. They came with a new baby. You don't like that?

[Tamela Mann]

Yeah, I was not. I didn't go off and cuss or nothing, but I wasn't for it.

[David Mann]

She say, okay, you gonna deal with that by yourself?

[Tamela Mann]

I did.

[David Mann]

And I was like, I did. And I instantly felt this alone. I felt this alone, like, deal. And I was like, for like a couple days went by, and I was just like, you just gonna leave me out here by myself? And I was like, so you did that? I didn't do that. You did that.

[Tamela Mann]

I said, I don't accepted one. I ain't. I ain't doing that. So as time went, you know, a few days went by, and this is really what l really, I think drew

[David Mann]

us close, cemented us together. Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

David came and he did the Spock move this thing.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

He say, it's me and you, and then it's them, it's everybody. So it. You know, what make. What. What gave me comfort is I'm thinking as a woman, like, okay, this chick is coming in this other mama, and then she going to be getting all this attention and stuff was, you know, I don't know what's going to happen with you and her and the baby. So I. I didn't want to mind.

[David Mann]

She's already dealing with. Okay. Nurturing the. The relationship with me and the other baby.

[Lecrae]

Knows her.

[Tamela Mann]

Yeah. And I knew her.

[David Mann]

But the thing is, she knew both of them.

[Tamela Mann]

We grew up in the same.

[David Mann]

That's what I'm telling you. It's a movie.

[Tamela Mann]

We grew up in the same neighborhood.

[Lecrae]

Going around the cck.

[Tamela Mann]

We grew up in the same neighborhood.

[David Mann]

Wait a minute.

[Tamela Mann]

But me and her grew up in the same neighborhood, two streets down. I knew her because. Well, anyway, I'm not. Can't put up business. Street.

[Lecrae]

This could be so ghetto if y' all wasn't who y' all was. Like you.

[Tamela Mann]

But it still is ghetto. It don't matter.

[David Mann]

It's ghetto.

[Tamela Mann]

It is, but it's just.

[David Mann]

Imagine having your wife come home and you got another child.

[Tamela Mann]

But I never knew that they was. Cause Was gonna hook up. Who would have thunk it?

[David Mann]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

But I just said after that, and David did the thing. He says, me and you, and then it's everybody else. It comforted me that he wouldn't leave me. So it gave me a good cushion.

[David Mann]

Reassurance.

[Tamela Mann]

Reassurance that we are who we are and what we've begun. It's still gonna go on, man. And after that, I was like, okay, let's do this.

[Lecrae]

You can weather any storm after that.

[Tamela Mann]

Yeah, I was.

[David Mann]

And I always have to remind her. Now my daughter, I have to remind her. You do know that it's my daughter and she's not. Cause they'll get on the phone. They'll get on the phone, both of them. They'll get on the phone and just. I'm like, hello, I'm here. So the other day, they talking. I said, I am your biological father now. That's the running joke.

[Tamela Mann]

Yes, but.

[Lecrae]

Yeah, but I like her better.

[Tamela Mann]

Yeah, but it's just. It's such a. It was a hard place. I Mean, we've been had some hard, hard places, but our love has really covered a multitude of fault.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

And our friendship and our friendships. I think.

[David Mann]

I think our friendship, it is. Being friends was the best thing that we could have done.

[Lecrae]

It kept y' all tight.

[David Mann]

It kept us tight. Cause, man, we were like.

[Lecrae]

But I know. Hold on. I know it had to be some ghetto moments dealing with the baby mamas.

[Tamela Mann]

Oh, yes, it was. Cause with her, it was harder with the first one. She. Me and her never really had a. We had one. One bumpy one bone.

[Lecrae]

Like, I had to throw hands.

[Tamela Mann]

Not hands. Whatever. Don't do that. Don't put me out there like that. Somebody may come try me. I do pack a gun.

[David Mann]

Yeah. Hallelujah.

[Tamela Mann]

No, but I. But me and her, the first baby mom, we didn't have. No. We had this one. It was just at the beginning of, like, she was little, and I just want to establish.

[David Mann]

Was, like, you probably was trying to get him all the time anyway.

[Tamela Mann]

And I was like, you know what? You trying to make it be about me and you and you and him. But it's not that. I said it's about the baby. It's about these kids being taken care of, that they don't feel like they abandoned, and they're not a part of what the family is. So I'm. That was my argument to her and to her mom at her mom's house that day.

[David Mann]

Now, what?

[Lecrae]

It was a story about the post office or something? Was that the. I think you and one of the baby mamas at the post office or something?

[David Mann]

I don't know.

[Tamela Mann]

Maybe.

[Lecrae]

Maybe that was just online, probably.

[David Mann]

Online? Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

It wasn't no post office, but I. But that. But even, you know, with the second mom we did. Because it's like, I think she was trying to show her dominance of. That she had a child. And it was. Yeah, she was really trying to. To me, it felt like she was trying to bring division. That may not been her intent, but that's what it felt like.

[David Mann]

And the thing is, we were all young.

[Tamela Mann]

We were.

[David Mann]

That's what I'm saying. So you look at it. You look at it like we were all, you know, young 20s, early 20s and stuff. And so it's just like, y', all, we were just doing too much.

[Lecrae]

Yeah, y'.

[David Mann]

All. And I won't say y'.

[Tamela Mann]

All.

[David Mann]

I will say me. I was doing too much. Cause, you know, it put my kids, and I always tell them it put them in a bad position, like, to have to go. You go here for Christmas. You go here for Thanksgiving. Oh, can you come? Two weeks. Can you come stay over here? It just put them in a bad position. And I apologized to him. I said, look, I apologize for putting y' all in a bad position, putting y' all moms in a bad position, putting her. And I was just like, you know, let's figure out how to work through it. And that's where she came through to just like, let's figure it out, let's work through it. Now I can't say that first couple days, that first couple days, it was heat. It was like. So you're not even gonna talk to me? I said, you do understand this is not about that. Yeah, this was before you. She told me, that's your business. You do that. And when I tell you the feeling of alone, which in marriage I never wanted to feel like, I'm the kind that once I said, I do you in there. I'm in there.

[Lecrae]

Locked in.

[David Mann]

I'm locked for life.

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[Lecrae]

How does it work? Talk me through this story of y'.

[David Mann]

All.

[Lecrae]

Y' all got this new marriage, y' all singing together, y' all trying to figure out making ends meet, and then y' all end up in entertainment. Like, how does this. How does this all come together? Even to the point to where you working with Tyler Perry? Like, how does that. Does it. How does it go from A to B to C to D?

[David Mann]

Well, the whole thing started with Kirk Franklin.

[Lecrae]

Okay.

[David Mann]

You know, because we. It was Kirk and the family. Kirk Franklin and the family. Kirk, call us to meet one day. I want to meet with y'. All. That's how he talk. He want me so he.

[Tamela Mann]

Don't do that to him. Don't do that.

[David Mann]

That's my brother.

[Lecrae]

He didn't stutter enough,

[Tamela Mann]

what he doing?

[David Mann]

And so he met. We had a meeting, and he said he was going to go on a sabbatical. I had to go look it up. What sabbatical mean? He wanted. He was gonna take a break. And it was like, does that mean we coming back and see? We had just bought a new house. We just really getting going. And he said, no, the family's not gonna be anymore. And we. I was crushed, Devastated.

[Tamela Mann]

I could cry right now.

[David Mann]

Devastated.

[Tamela Mann]

I was out of there. I had just took a shower because we met at a restaurant. We had got dressed and took a shower. I had went there. I came back home after that meeting, him saying that, got back in the

[David Mann]

shower and just started singing.

[Tamela Mann]

I was crying and she was crying.

[David Mann]

Not only was she crying, she did a full concert in the shower.

[Tamela Mann]

I started singing, and I never really. I'm not a singer.

[David Mann]

I didn't know she started singing.

[Tamela Mann]

So I'm sitting there, I started saying, I love you, Lord and I lift my voice to worship you oh, my soul, rejoice Take joy, my king, in what you hear Let it be a sweet, sweet sound in your ear. And then I just kept on and made a praise medley. And after I finished that, I say, lord, give me peace. So when I see my brother, I'll still look up on him the same way and not have any spite against him. Because what happened? I asked for peace, and God gave me peace through. Just through worship, honestly. And then David, he was like, I heard you singing.

[David Mann]

I didn't know whether to go get something to record her, because it was that sweet in the shower. It was like a moment. I'm standing there listening to her in the shower. I'm crying because, like. And I said, should I record it? I can't record because I don't want to miss it. I didn't know what to do.

[Tamela Mann]

So it was a moment, but that was the end of the family. And we've learned. And I actually can say we learned this through Kirk when he used to say, change, you know, change can make you fearful, but change is not always bad. And I'm looking, I'm thinking, like, this is horrible, what we about to do. Go ahead.

[David Mann]

Right now, back up. We had some wonderful. We got to travel the world.

[Lecrae]

That's why she was crying.

[David Mann]

I was.

[Tamela Mann]

Cause I was like, this is what I do. And that's what I told him at the table. I was like, I stand behind you and pray for you. I'm not just back there jumping around and dancing. I say, I'm praying for you. Asking God to bless you as you standing before his people. I say, who gonna do that?

[David Mann]

We were devastated because we loved it. And we loved him. Yes, we still love him. It was just like, what are we doing?

[Tamela Mann]

Why?

[David Mann]

What did we do right? And so that season ends, and so I'm like, I gotta. I gotta take care of my family. What are we gonna do? So I had. I didn't have time to be angry. You know, there was a. You know. You know, about the lawsuit and all that stuff. We chose not to participate. I said, I don't have time to participate in being angry. I got mouths to feed. I don't have time for that. So I reached out to a promoter that we had done. We had done a Play.

[Tamela Mann]

But he actually. He was a part of the promoters from when we were two or two.

[David Mann]

Yeah, we. We're doing tours, and we did the play with Kirk back in the day, and I remember him, and I just called him, I said, hey, man, I need some work. I need to figure out where I'm going now. We're no longer with the family and all of this. He said, I got this guy I want you to go meet in Chicago. It's this guy. He's a playwright. He's writing plays up and coming. Playwright. Just want you to go check him out. I use my frequent flyer miles to fly from home to Chicago and met this guy, and I said, well, I want to audition. Okay, let's do the audition. We did the audition. It was this guy named. This guy. Nobody knew. I don't know if y' all know him now. His name is Tyler Perry. And so I went to Chicago just to audition for this play, this guy that's just doing plays. And I told him, I said, well, you know, I come as a package deal. You know, my wife, she don't act, but she'll sing. And he was like, well, just bring her. And she was, like, terrified. She was already terrified. She was like, mm, mm. I don't know. I don't act. I said, well, I already told him we come as a package.

[Tamela Mann]

Right.

[David Mann]

You know, I did the audition and I auditioned for this character that he had at the time. I don't know if y' all know this character's name, Mr. Brown.

[Tamela Mann]

Audition actually was just Brown.

[David Mann]

Brown. Brown. Yeah, it was brown when we put the mist down and never could have imagined. So the worst thing that happened to us in our career was the best thing that happened to us.

[Tamela Mann]

Wow.

[David Mann]

That's why change.

[Lecrae]

There's a message. There's sermon in there right now.

[David Mann]

It was the worst. It was the most devastating thing because now we're trying to figure out what are we going to do, how are we going to pay bills? That's what I was. I was worried about feeding family. And it was the best thing that ever happened to us.

[Lecrae]

So he brings y' all on, and then does it just take off like

[David Mann]

a rocket ship, or is it a. Okay, so, you know, we on the chitlin circuit. Nobody cares.

[Lecrae]

I remember seeing him on a Southwest flight one time in the airplane.

[Tamela Mann]

We did fly some at the beginning. We did, yeah, quite a bit.

[David Mann]

And it went to where we were doing the play. Now, the first play, we were not the stars. Madea. Mr. Brown, Cora. Were not the Stars of the play. There was someone else. Somebody else that was the star of the play. They didn't come.

[Tamela Mann]

The pool. Yes.

[David Mann]

The star didn't come. So it's us three misfits on stage. Nobody knows us. So we're scared that we're gonna get booed. We're like, they about to kill us. These people. We're in Chicago. They gonna kill us. If the star don't come. We got away with it. I think it was a Tuesday night or Wednesday. We got away with it. That's, you know, that's the weekday craft. We got to the weekend, and still it's like the person didn't. Tyler literally. You know how, like, back in the day, you playing satellite football. Okay. Doing the plays on it. Okay. We're gonna go here, and you're gonna go right here, and you'll say this, and then we're gonna do this, and we'll just take her lines and we'll put them over here. That's the way he did.

[Tamela Mann]

They both took the line.

[David Mann]

Just split the lines up.

[Lecrae]

Wow.

[Tamela Mann]

But for. I mean, but for the chemistry to take off like it did.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

I think that's the kicker. And the scary part of it.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

Is people took to these characters, and it's like by the time the Weeknd got there, it was like the audience

[David Mann]

was doing standing ovations.

[Tamela Mann]

And we couldn't believe.

[David Mann]

We were scared.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

We couldn't believe how it just. I think what they were doing between him, between TYLER and him, Mr. Brown, David, they didn't. It's like they didn't miss a beat. So to me, it's like you forgot that somebody else was supposed to be coming out because they kept them going. And that's what. And David was coming up. That's. He came up with the ashy knees and act, you know, the clothes and all. Even with him in a wig. He was playing with a wig, and. And Madele used to set this wig actually on fire with her lighter. So in order for her to stop doing that, David one day just took a water bottle and just sprayed the wig down.

[David Mann]

He could not light the wig on.

[Tamela Mann]

He kept trying to light it, and it's like. And then he came in, like, Soul Glow, and he was just shaking the hair, you know?

[David Mann]

Cause that was Mr. Brown's toupee.

[Tamela Mann]

Yes.

[David Mann]

And to have that to go from, like, plays until people start recognizing. It's like, wait a minute. This is more than chitlin Turkey. Cause we were cool. We're just riding under the radar as Long as we were under the radar, nobody messed with us. We wouldn't mess with nobody.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[David Mann]

Oh, but the word got out and

[Tamela Mann]

we haven't sold our shoes.

[David Mann]

Yeah. And it just started to just. There are still some records that we have in some of these theaters for attendance.

[Tamela Mann]

And we were going back, like, weeks. It's like you would go and say, some of them stay in three weeks.

[David Mann]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

It's like you leave and you go back and you still make. They do just. They did just as well. It's like us learning, like, now it's like you really see it now that we've been in the business so long, you kind of see how things go. But it was amazing how even with the other cast members, how all of us came together and it was just. It was some good cast.

[Lecrae]

Now rumor has it. Rumor has it that in. In all of that success, in all of that stuff that was going on, that Tyler was generous with the success.

[Tamela Mann]

Yeah, it was.

[David Mann]

Yeah. You know, and we. We have to joke with some of the cast now. They get in the kinder, gentler Tyler.

[Tamela Mann]

They are.

[David Mann]

They get the kinder, gentler because, you know, we were all learning this business and learning this thing.

[Tamela Mann]

Yeah, he was. I say you sweet now. You so sweet.

[Lecrae]

Like, I got a little more money. I can relax.

[David Mann]

Well, we were all early 30s and just trying to figure this thing out. And me and him bumped heads a lot to you. A lot, A lot. And we, you know, we were talking about recently in a. We did an interview. It was just. I passed trauma. We found out I passed trauma with men. Made us like. Because I told you early on, it was like, all you had to do is say boo to me. And his was the same way. And we didn't know that early on. Now it's just like, brother, all we are saying, we just want people peace at this age. It's just like, man, it's just peace and, you know, generous. I think that's an understatement. With him. People do not know you hear all the stuff that you hear on the Internet, but us being on the inside, we know, like, you didn't have to do that for that person. Well, I won't tell anybody's business, but I know there are some instances where he didn't have to pay some people. Cause they couldn't do certain things. But he paid them. He just paid them anyway. Cause it was the right thing to do. He just. Yeah, just go ahead. Just take the money.

[Lecrae]

Yeah, I couldn't.

[David Mann]

Another.

[Lecrae]

Another thing I'm curious About is. Is the. The dynamic of y' all being married and having to work in all of that chaos.

[David Mann]

Yeah.

[Lecrae]

How does that work?

[Tamela Mann]

Well, I pray for it. Honestly, guys, I. I prayed and asked God for somebody to be in the. Was just singing then to do the same thing I did. Well, I wouldn't have to explain all the time because it's like, you know, you coming in late from church, from a musical or something, or you in the studio and you coming in late. It's not like you've been out hanging out with a partner, but you actually been. You've been working.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

So to have someone with me and understood what. What was happening has made my life easy.

[David Mann]

Okay.

[Tamela Mann]

So much easier. Because, you know, and it's so funny, I had to always say, deal. Hugely. We do it. How in the world can y' all ride to work together? You go to work together. Yeah. I just can't do that with my wife. I say it works for us, right? And it can work for someone else. Because when we get to work, we treat each other like, you know, we at work. It's like, we don't go in like, you my husband, you my wife.

[David Mann]

Now you gotta get paid arguments before work. And we realize that our energy can affect and infect the whole crew. So we definitely make sure we know, like, look, we're going to leave this at the door, and we'll handle it when we get through here because.

[Lecrae]

Well, what about when you are. Both of y' all have been working all day, all night, y' all both tired, and y' all get home, and y' all both got to be on for kids. And, like, how does that work?

[David Mann]

Oh, man.

[Tamela Mann]

We've just. I think we just kind of learned how to separate it. It's like we still.

[David Mann]

We learned later how to separate it.

[Tamela Mann]

How to separate it. I mean, but, you know, we would have words. But I still think, you know, we would have words, but you think our kids sing big cabangs or arguments.

[David Mann]

That's. Cause we didn't like to do. I don't like no yelling.

[Tamela Mann]

I don't like to argue.

[David Mann]

I don't like yelling.

[Tamela Mann]

But I will.

[David Mann]

Cause I came from. I came from that. I go, so I don't. I don't like. I don't. I just don't. It makes me nervous.

[Lecrae]

Soprano, like, I might choke somebody.

[David Mann]

Stop the yelling.

[Tamela Mann]

I'm beamed up on soprano.

[David Mann]

I'm being. You know, one thing that we had to learn because we were so early in the game, we were always on the grind. We Were all always on the grind. So when we would get home, we made sure to give them our undivided attention.

[Tamela Mann]

So we couldn't be a bunch of energy on a disagreement. I mean, we disagree. We disagree a lot, but it.

[David Mann]

Not especially during menopause.

[Tamela Mann]

Yeah, especially do that. I don't say that cycle time we did, but I don't have it no more. But still. But he have it too. Y' all men have it. Y' all just don't. You know, Here we go. But, you know, but menopause was a big change for me. But, I mean, but us agreeing to disagree. Because sometimes it's like I don't like the weight of. I don't like really arguing. It's like I. I say. That's why I said communicate. Because I was woman of short words. I'd be like, no, you good?

[David Mann]

Whatever.

[Tamela Mann]

You know, I just. Real quick. Okay, I'm good. Yeah, Okay.

[David Mann]

I get it now. She will say, I'm sorry, but it's like, for what?

[Tamela Mann]

But I. Cause it's like, you just. Who won't? Sometimes it's like pick and choose the battle.

[Lecrae]

I ain't never heard my wife say. I can probably count on one hand how many times she said, I'm sorry.

[David Mann]

I would tell her, she would say she's sorry.

[Tamela Mann]

But I did mean it.

[David Mann]

Yeah, but it was like, tell me what you're sorry for. What. What are you apologizing?

[Tamela Mann]

I apologize. Cause I just first thought for us to be where we are right now, even to an argument.

[David Mann]

Cause sometimes she wasn't wrong. So what are you apologizing for? You're not wrong.

[Tamela Mann]

Cause I just want the peace to be in the air.

[David Mann]

And so I started this thing where, like, look, if we're gonna apologize, let's talk about what we're apologizing for so we don't continue to repeat these same things over and over. Cause who wanna talk?

[Tamela Mann]

Who gonna do all that talk?

[David Mann]

She was like, I don't wanna talk. But now she's very loquacious. Oh, very.

[Lecrae]

That's college words.

[David Mann]

Yeah, okay.

[Lecrae]

College loquacious.

[Tamela Mann]

I'm learning to be more to express myself. When you feel it, I mean. But my thing is trying to say it in the right way. Because a lot of times it can be said. Not a lot of times it's not what being said. Well, we're missing how you say it. It's like how you say it. Not what you're saying is wrong. But a lot of times in most relationships is how we send it to each other not what you saying, but

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[Lecrae]

I've gone through a couple seasons of, you know, mental health struggles. Right. And I know you've been. You've shared about that as well. A lot of times what I've read is the people who struggle the most with mental health are the people they're married to.

[David Mann]

Right.

[Lecrae]

I'm curious how you navigate it. First, how did you navigate depression? And then how do you deal with somebody who's struggling with depression?

[David Mann]

You want me to go first? How I navigated was hidden very well. I did, you know, some people drink it away, Some people go smoke it away, Some people sex it away or whatever. I say, let's work and just keep my head down. Nobody will know. They knew something was going on.

[Tamela Mann]

Cause it's like I would ask. I said, you good? You good? He was also, I'm cool. I'm good. I'm good. So I didn't read in between the line of it. So now after that approach, after all that went on and he brought it out to us, the family, because for

[David Mann]

a while, I told nobody. I just suffered in silence. I just literally said, I'm good to drown myself.

[Tamela Mann]

So I cried.

[David Mann]

I'm just like, I'm not gonna tell nobody. And one thing too, I was embarrassed because when you're in a public eye and a public figure and especially somebody that make people laugh, people always expect you on, let's see you do something funny. This is your grand singing. And it's just like, I just. My heart is hurting. I'm sad. And it wasn't the usual suspects that got me in depression, you know, financially. Oh, we struggled. It was the most money we had made in that season marriage. We were in a great place. It was. I had taken the weight of everybody else on, and I was concerned how. How is that person gonna make it? How is that person?

[Tamela Mann]

And it started. That's doing of COVID right? Like, doing. It started at the end of COVID because the weight got so long, and then it went so long. You know, it's like we thought, okay, we're gonna go through this for about three, three months, and then we're gonna be good. But then it wound up being like a year. So he. Because the whole time we didn't lay nobody off. We didn't tell. You know, it's like we just kept right on paying everybody. Even though it wasn't a work.

[David Mann]

I'm just sitting there juggling everything.

[Tamela Mann]

But we just kept telling everybody, oh,

[David Mann]

baby, need to pair of shoes.

[Tamela Mann]

I didn't. You know, it's like, you. You cool. And during that time, it's like I had. Had my knee surgery. So I was doing a lot of walking, like, up. And I was walking. We have a gym, but I was walking on the street. So to me, to have the open air and to be able to just. I think that's what sustained me. But him, he was in the office a lot, like, in front of the computer and knowing. Trying to figure it out. Yeah. Cause it's like the weight of it.

[Lecrae]

How did it come out? How did you finally just break?

[David Mann]

Finally, I just. You know what broke me is just telling my family. It actually. I was embarrassed and ashamed. I literally was ashamed to tell my family. It's just like. Cause I'm Superman. And so, I mean, I gotta take the S off my chest and tell the people that I'm the strongest to. And I'm weak, I'm vulnerable. And what I really needed to tell him is like, I just need y' all help. Not like, I need your help. Financial. I just need y' all help is just take some of this weight. Because it was heavy, man. I explained it as if, you know, thousands of people, thousands and thousands of people got to watch me drown every day. And the only true way that they were gonna know that I drowned is when I was gone. I was completely gone. And I thought about it. I really. I was gonna do it, but it was like, now it was the kind of thing, like, if I do that, then what about everybody else? Here I go again. I'm worried about what everybody else is gonna do, think or say. And so, man, once I talked to my family, they were like, why would you go through something like that alone?

[Tamela Mann]

For me, it was. It was. First of all, it was a stab to the heart because I felt like I should have saw or I didn't take heed enough to do. It's like warnings, but it's like people giving you little stress cries. But I didn't catch.

[David Mann]

I didn't get me just thinking about.

[Tamela Mann]

I didn't catch the cries. And to find out later that you were right there at the break of. Like, you would have taken your. I said you would have left me. I said you would have left me. And then I would been trying to figure out, why did you leave me? Because, like, to me, it wouldn't be. No me was God, but because of David. So I'm like, I would just. So now it's like when he give me. I ask, like, you Say, how am I dealing with it now? It's like when I truly ask him, how you doing? And he said, I'm good. And then now I go to the.

[David Mann]

I really ask other people that I'm good.

[Tamela Mann]

Then I'll do the. I do the silence. Say, how are you up here? You know, and it's like, that's kind of the way the Lord has given me to. Even to other people around me, it's like, well, how you doing upstairs? You know, just to not make it beat you guys, beat you up because you've dealt with it. Because it's like, I just want you to know that I'm with you through it. I mean, I'm here with you while you going through it. I mean, I can't carry the whole burden, but I can carry some of the weight with you if you let me know. And that's what we have to do. If people. If you don't tell your wife, if you don't tell a good friend, how are we going to know? Because it's like, this dude right here is really good. He sees. He really pays attention to a lot of detail and most that I have never really seen nobody do, but he really sees a lot of things in people. And I say, he knows when we're not right. And it's like, I'm learning that now and learned that I can tell, like with my kids, like, right off, I can hear in their voice if something is wrong. But it hurt me that I didn't catch it with him, because it's like, he really was. It's like, we get Superman. I was like, that's my word. It's like, you've been my Superman and he is my Superman. So it's like, you know, come on now. Just. You can't allow kryptonite to take us down, you know, so it's just. But I just want people to know that we have to be more loving and standing in gap for each other, you know, truly asking and kind of just warring on it and pushing on it. No, I don't feel like something is right. It's okay to go back in and ask, is it really okay? Because, you know, and now that he knows that and I grew and, you

[David Mann]

know, I come from there. I'm almost 60. I come from an era. What happens in the house stays in the house. I'm not about to go to no therapy. And I went to therapy and it freed me. So, yes, I found that the first thing that the therapist had me to do when I Left therapy that day. He said, I'm going to tell you, the first thing you got to do today is you got to learn to be a little more selfish. And it was like, no. Me be selfish? He said, you gotta learn to be selfish. And it threw me. Cause I was like, do you?

[Tamela Mann]

That's not what you're taught.

[David Mann]

That's not what I do.

[Lecrae]

But if you ain't good, you ain't good for nobody else.

[Tamela Mann]

That's right.

[David Mann]

Let me tell you.

[Tamela Mann]

You realize that.

[David Mann]

Now, the first thing, I went to Chick fil A and usually I get my food so I can go be around everybody. I want to go. I ordered, and I just simply took my food and sit down and ate by myself. And just.

[Tamela Mann]

He's not a loner.

[David Mann]

I'm just not a loner. I sit down and ate lunch by myself. And I was like, this is not bad. I'm okay. I'm okay. So we have a ranch outside. We have a ranch right outside of town. And I went out and spent the night by myself. I have never lived by myself. I've never been by myself. I moved straight from home. We got married. I went and spent the night by myself. And she called you good. I think I'm okay. I survived the night by myself. And that was part of me just learning to be a little more selfish and not being afraid to say no. It's like. And set boundaries for people. Cause I'm like. I'm the kind that's like, oh, what's wrong? You fix it. You okay? Even with my kids, don't worry about it. Take care of it. Daddy will handle it with her. She has to be afraid of what she says to me because she can casually say something. And when she get back home, oh, it's done. She's. I didn't mean for you to make that happen right now. I was just mentioning it. Yeah, don't mention it. You know, that's just the way I am. But I learned that therapy helps and it works. You know us, we come to church. Back in there, you'll just pray it away. Your faith ain't strong enough. I had strong faith. I went to the altar several times. I was like, lord, I say, I'm thinking about ending myself. I'm thinking about it, and I'm down at the altar.

[Tamela Mann]

But you still need to pray. Now.

[David Mann]

You still. No, no, wait a minute. I'm saying I went and prayed, but I understood that God has given that therapist wisdom.

[Lecrae]

That's right.

[David Mann]

And my therapist was a believer. The first thing we did was pray when I got there. So I was like, prayer with the therapy helped me. And she woke me up at 2 o' clock one morning, probably about 2 or 3 o' clock in the morning. And when I tell you this woman prayed and she prayed, she prayed till I fell asleep and I woke back up and she was still in prayer. Oh Lord, she got along one tonight, but she prayed me through it. And it was. We just walked through it together.

[Lecrae]

That might have been one of the most beautiful stories. Scenarios like, y' all don't understand the jolt of encouragement that ran through my body to see like, I'm just like yalls connection. Yalls depends on like just stay. Whatever God doing do, keep it up.

[David Mann]

Keep it up.

[Tamela Mann]

That's the. That's the plan.

[Lecrae]

That is.

[Tamela Mann]

That is truly the plan until we get out of here. I mean, to death do us part. But we just really want to share. And even with being here, sitting here to let people know that it's possible, it really is possible to work through whatever situation. And love really does cover a multitude.

[David Mann]

A father.

[Tamela Mann]

I mean, because you going to make mistakes. Now. I'm not saying run out there and just go to just doing stuff, but to really be forgiving and have a forgiving heart. Grace and showing grace.

[David Mann]

Because that's my word.

[Tamela Mann]

The grace that you. The grace that you don't show is the grace that you're going to need. So we just want to be gracious unto each other. You know, even us. Us as a community. I just want us to be gracious.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

Unto each other. Even with supporting.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

Each other. I just feel like we could be so much further along if we would support our own. You. We wouldn't have to go outside the boundaries because we could support our own.

[Lecrae]

Because there's enough kingdom people each other down.

[David Mann]

There's enough people in the kingdom. If we, if we simply supported our. Our own man.

[Lecrae]

Yeah, we.

[David Mann]

We would be great.

[Tamela Mann]

That's right.

[Lecrae]

I. I want to. I got like, you know, as we move toward the end, I'm curious about something else though. Y' all have seen all the success, right? You got the. Just stuff popping off the movies, the plays, the. What is it? Was it different? Was it a different kind of rocket ship when the hit song happens for you, was it the same? Was it just like, wow, look at the Lord still doing something, or was

[Tamela Mann]

it like it was a process? Because even Take Me to the King, you know, it's like when you do a song, it takes it a while to get to circulate. Okay, so what. Take me to the King actually helped put. Put us on. Put us out there. Because really, it's like, we had already been out there for a year. But it. It really is important to the song, y', all, to the artists that are watching and whoever. It's like the joke or the. The. The. The scene that you get for his acting. I mean, that. That role. So it's like that song actually put me on the map. I would say, take me to the King. And even to this day, the young man out there, it's like everybody's like, take me to the King. I was like, yeah, but I got so many other good songs. I mean, please just don't put me in a box. But it did skyrocket. And to me, the most part of it, Lecrae, is to have hard dudes come up to me and say, man, that's my joint. Or, man, you know, I just, you know, my mom, you know, introduced me to it, and it's. I. You know, it's really helped me. That is what it's all about for us, you know, to. To be able to be a blessing and for it to prick the heart, to hopefully direct someone to God. Because otherwise it's just nothing. Nothingness. It's just a bunch, just things. But it's not about the things to us. So I'm just so grateful to God that he's blessed us along the way. But to be able to connect with so many people again along the way, to just be a light.

[David Mann]

Yeah, we could have never imagined this, man. We couldn't. You know, and we don't. We just, like I say, when we got into this, we were trying to feed our family, but to step back, we were getting honored. The icons of the culture deal. And we've been grinding. We just working. We wasn't trying to be famous. We wasn't trying to be rich. We was trying to eat. We were trying to pay some bills and to step back. And I was telling her. And she don't read none of it.

[Lecrae]

She.

[David Mann]

So she. You could tell her, you know, you got the number one. And she said, oh, really? But to be a part of a number one album, have a number one radio, have a number one sitcom, be a part of a number one movie. I said. I told her. I said, there's not a lot of people. We're not talking about just gospel artists. There's not a lot of people that can say that they have experienced that. And I was like, lord, it's no goodness of Our own.

[Lecrae]

And the thing I love the most because if anybody who recognizes y' all for all of the things that y' all have done, y' all are the salt of the earth, people. You know what I mean? Like, it ain't never been. No. Like, I don't know.

[David Mann]

We just love people, man. We love. We just love people. We both come from big families. We come from big families, and we just love people. I just. I'm always looking at somebody, and I would tell it, like, grace. Like, she was saying grace. I'm not looking at what you've done. I look, I'm trying to see what you can be. And I told her, even going through the depression, part of it was because I love to make people better. One of my superpowers is, I guess, okay, if you tweak that, kind of like a coach. If you tweak that, get your touchdown. Yeah. You know, even bringing her along, it's just like, you know, people see Tamela, man. Tamela, man. And I'm just sitting in the back, just like, yeah. Cause I understand when she make it, I'm in the background. I'm like, we done.

[Lecrae]

We made it.

[David Mann]

We made it. Her name. It's deliberate. Call her name. I want to be out of the spot.

[Tamela Mann]

And that's why I'm like, come with me.

[David Mann]

I'm like, we literally at the Grammys, arguing. If you go back and look, she won the Grammy. They called Tamela, man. And we're in the aisle. Come with me. I said, no, this is not my moment. This is your moment. You gotta come with me, girl. Going through. They called your name. So she's standing. No, I don't want to go by myself. People's laughing, people laughing. And I'm like, I'm not going. I don't want to be up there. This is your moment. So she finally talked Kirk into coming up there with it. You come with me. I was like, no, when it's your moment to shine, it's your moment to shine.

[Tamela Mann]

But. But I don't mean I don't mind sharing it.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

I just feel like. And what we do is so the pie is big enough for us all to have a slice.

[Lecrae]

It's just so funny. Y' all are the. Like, when people say marriage is, like, 100 0, it's not 50 50. Y' all are a picture that's like,

[David Mann]

I'm gonna give 100.

[Lecrae]

You give a hundred, we're gonna have 200.

[Tamela Mann]

Right?

[David Mann]

That's how y'.

[Lecrae]

All. It's like, no, y' all don't want to shine. You get to shine.

[Tamela Mann]

No. Get some shot. And we've learned to. And I think that's why would really have kept us with both being in the light. It's like we don't mind sharing the light.

[David Mann]

Right.

[Tamela Mann]

And it's just like across the board. I don't mind sharing the light.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

Because I feel like if it's shining and we all in it because it's like, you know, when you take a picture, if we out the light hit you, that means somebody see you.

[David Mann]

Yeah, yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

But if you out outside the light, don't nobody see you. I'm.

[David Mann]

I'm good with being outside.

[Tamela Mann]

I want him in it. I want him in it. I do. And it's just because I know I'm

[David Mann]

in the, I'm in the background. Like I tell her, she said, what are you doing today? I'm working for you.

[Tamela Mann]

He do.

[David Mann]

I said, I'm working. What are you doing up at three o'clock in the morning?

[Tamela Mann]

It's not me though. Don't just make it sound like it's just for me.

[Lecrae]

No, I get it.

[Tamela Mann]

But he's pivoting.

[Lecrae]

He's been in the front and he knows the front and he's like, I could do that. But I also get joy. Cause that's how I am. It's like I get joy out of seeing my other artists thrive and just pushing stuff. They're like, come on, do the thing. I'm like, I want it.

[David Mann]

I'm good. Yeah, I'm good in the back.

[Lecrae]

I get it.

[David Mann]

I, I moved toward this, started directing. So I'm directing some of the sitcoms for assisted living. I started getting that, directing videos and doing that. And I'm like, I'm cool. I'm cool being in the back.

[Tamela Mann]

And I want him to really, like, I want him to do a stand up special.

[David Mann]

She pushing me to do a special.

[Tamela Mann]

I want him to do a special. I want him to do his shorts because he's.

[Lecrae]

You gotta break dance if you do it.

[David Mann]

I told myself, she told me the other day, no more of that.

[Tamela Mann]

But he can do that. Well, I just know more splits.

[David Mann]

Okay.

[Tamela Mann]

Yeah. Because I love to see him dance.

[David Mann]

No, no.

[Lecrae]

Kevin Hart was gone for two for six months because he doing too much with it.

[Tamela Mann]

Yeah. I just, But I, I said, I said you could dance. Because the people. I love to see him dance and the people love to see him dance. I say, so dancing is cool. But when you go to doing that, jumping and standing on your head, I was like, sir, yeah, come on. You.

[David Mann]

You. You know, you start at me saying, okay, can I still do it in my 30s? Okay, can I do it in my forehead?

[Tamela Mann]

It's like on the. On the tour.

[David Mann]

I'm in the reunion tour. Can you still do it on my fifth? That was that dog on Ty Trivet

[Tamela Mann]

and Kirk Franklin every night and Isaac, they was like, every night. Come on, Dave, you gonna do it tonight?

[David Mann]

I was like, yo, like an idiot, I did it. Yeah.

[Lecrae]

Chiropractor.

[Tamela Mann]

Like, yes, help me.

[David Mann]

Well, I don't have no neck, so. I don't have no neck, so it just helps you. That helped me. That helped me.

[Tamela Mann]

But, I mean, I'm just. And it's just, you know, I just. I just want to be. Even if a lot in the. In the industry, we're like the aunt and uncle just to give a good hug.

[Lecrae]

Yeah.

[Tamela Mann]

And I've learned, like, from David, a good hug goes a long way.

[David Mann]

That's another thing for me with therapy. You hug somebody with your heart. I always tell my grandkids, did you hug me with your heart? Because don't just hug me with your arms. You're not. That don't mean anything. Hug me with your heart so I can feel it. And you will be surprised how that

[Tamela Mann]

helps you and help people.

[Lecrae]

Okay, before we go, what should we be expecting from y'?

[David Mann]

All?

[Tamela Mann]

Well, I got Mama Man's Kitchen that I'm doing on you on YouTube, on our Man TV channel, Man Family Man. Family dinner. I have the. The spices that I just released. Mama manskitchen.com go check it out. But I'm really proud of these seasonings. I mean, it's something. Another part of me that you get to see that. Because when I see people eat or just cook for people, it just gives me such a cook, too.

[Lecrae]

She's from Texas.

[David Mann]

Three things she can do. She can cook. She from Texas, she can sing.

[Lecrae]

Yeah. All right, now. Hello. Hello.

[Tamela Mann]

What's the third one?

[David Mann]

Huh? What's the third what? We doing a tour.

[Tamela Mann]

The Relationship Tour.

[David Mann]

The Love and Relationship Tour coming out

[Tamela Mann]

starting in April of 26. You can go to tillymanmusic.com to get more information, ticket information.

[David Mann]

So we gotta tell them what the Love and Relationship tell them.

[Tamela Mann]

What is it, brother?

[David Mann]

So the Love Relationship Tour is we. We're doing music together.

[Tamela Mann]

Yeah.

[David Mann]

So we. We have a love album, Us against the World. So we do music together, and then we come out and we invite some of our friends. Hint, hint, lrae to y' all come and sit down and Talk about love and marriage and relationship and how y' all survive. And we do that. And then Tam and I go off and we do. I do stand up about love and relationship. So I come. If you come, make sure you come with your boo. And don't bring your side piece. Cause I may ask somebody.

[Tamela Mann]

It may ask you a question.

[David Mann]

I may ask you a question.

[Tamela Mann]

Knowing David, he's probably gonna. And it's like he can see in the audience, y'.

[David Mann]

All.

[Tamela Mann]

That's the craziest. That's the crazy thing.

[David Mann]

I'm comfortable. I see everything.

[Tamela Mann]

That is so funny.

[David Mann]

So that's part. And then Tam brings us home with some of your favorites. Whether it's Take me to the King, only imagine this place. You know, change me, change me. God provides. She's going to be doing all of those. And that's the love and relationship to her. It's just us sharing how we've survived this. Whatever. For 38 years.

[Lecrae]

Amazing.

[David Mann]

38 years.

[Tamela Mann]

Deserve to win.

[Lecrae]

Amazing.

[David Mann]

Yeah. Deserve to win. You all right with me after you get more love tonight. Oh, I love y'. All.

[Lecrae]

We love y'. All. Thank you, the world. Love y', all, man. Thank y' all for being here.

[Tamela Mann]

Thank you for having us.

[David Mann]

Thank you for having us.

[Tamela Mann]

I hope this helps somebody out there.

[Lecrae]

Guys, help me. I'm about to run through a wall.

[David Mann]

Well, you gotta come. You gotta come to the man family dinner and have dinner with us.

[Tamela Mann]

Let's wrap. Let's wrap around some dinner.

[Lecrae]

I would love to. Let's do it.

[Tamela Mann]

Great.

[Lecrae]

Thank y' all again, man. Appreciate you.

[Tamela Mann]

Thank you.

[David Mann]

Appreciate it. Appreciate it. This is the deep end with Lecrae. Hey, bourbon lovers, listen up. Commonwealth Causes is making waves with its exclusive monthly raffle.

[Lecrae]

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[David Mann]

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