← The Deep End With Lecrae
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- [00:00]
Lecrae
Everywhere I go, people are carrying trauma, anxiety, loneliness, grief, dysfunction. And they got questions that they don't know how to answer. And they need more than information. What they need is they need wise, compassionate people who can walk with them toward healing. And that's why I am excited to tell the world about Richmond Graduate University. So Richmond equips future counselors and ministry leaders with the skills and compassion to help others heal and grow.
- [00:26]
Judah Smith
And.
- [00:27]
Lecrae
And what I love is that they do not separate clinical excellence from spiritual formation. They integrate both advancing God's work of healing, restoration, and transformation in the lives of individuals, churches and communities. So listen, whether you are called to be a licensed counselor or serve in ministry, or help people process trauma, or just walk alongside others in seasons of pain and growth, Richmond offers master's degrees and in counseling, master's degrees in ministry, a doctorate of ministry degree, and a specialized certificates designed to help equip you for whatever that calling may be. So maybe you'd be listening to these conversations on the deep end and you felt like something is stirring in you and your experience healing for yourself. Or you wonder if God may use your story to help somebody else heal. Listen, if that's you, don't ignore that nudge. Like, if God is calling you into counseling or ministry, Richmond can literally help you take the next step. Trust me. Apply for the fall semester, July 1st. Use my promo code, Lecrae. Waive the application fee. If you want to learn more, go to Richmond. Edu. You got the power to change lives through your career. Richmont Edu this episode is brought to
- [01:47]
Judah Smith
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- [02:07]
Lecrae
You are on the Mount Rushmore of like current celebrity pastors and the assumption is y' all are lost in the sauce.
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Judah Smith
I have learned more about Jesus and more about God from Justin Bieber than I've ever taught him. At one point in my life, I told God, I said, if this doesn't work for Justin Bieber, this gospel and then it doesn't work.
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Lecrae
How do you feel about being misunderstood
- [02:35]
Judah Smith
if we think our current social economical moral dilemmas are bigger than ancient Rome or ancient Greece, we are arrogant and fools. We're talking about people that were having orgies out on the stages of their platforms. And you mean to tell me that our Jesus never Speaks to the White House. Having an orgy on the lawn is. Everybody's like, how can you not talk about what happened with the president? How can you not talk about this? Because I'm a root guy. I'm a Jesus guy. I cannot get distracted talking about these current modern moral issues.
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Lecrae
There is absolutely someone who heard everything you said and says, compromise.
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Judah Smith
Yeah. Yeah.
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Lecrae
Totally cheap way to go out.
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Judah Smith
Yeah.
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Lecrae
Does that bother you?
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Judah Smith
Yeah. And I think
- [03:24]
Lecrae
this is the deep end with Lecrae. Okay, ladies and gentlemen, I got my friend here. So I got my brother here today. But there's a lot of interesting things about him that even I had to learn. Like, for instance, every single day, from the time he was seven years old, his dad looked at him and said, people like you and want to hear what you have to say. Apparently it worked because now he's one of the most recognizable preachers in America. You know, I mean, there's all kinds of caveats. The pastor to celebrities, America's sexiest pastor, the. The guy the world met as Bieber's pastor. But this. I wanted him on the show because now at this stage and place of his life, I feel like he's super transparent, super open, super honest about himself. And he even says the scariest thing is that his critics may be right about him, which is like, pastors don't say that type of stuff. That's kind of crazy to say. But, yeah, we here on the deep end with my man, my guy, my birthday twin. That's right, My birthday twin, Judah Smith.
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Ashley
Oh, man.
- [04:45]
Judah Smith
Thank you for having me. That's the greatest intro anyone's ever given to me. Particularly the sexiest part. That. That meant a lot.
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Lecrae
That's what they say, brother.
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Judah Smith
Is that what they say?
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Lecrae
That's what they say, bro.
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Judah Smith
Even if that's not what they say. Thank you for saying that's what they say.
- [04:57]
Lecrae
Well, if they is me, then it's still I'm they. You know what I'm saying? So I'm a they.
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Judah Smith
Oh, man. But, bro, I'm already laughing.
- [05:07]
Lecrae
I just. For me, as I was even thinking about this, I was just like, man, it's just good to catch up with you. It's just good to, like, talk with you to be. I mean, there's. From my vantage point, and I'm just riffing, but from my vantage point, I feel like we have so much in common. There's so many similarities. There's so many bridges we cross, and there's, like, this unspoken connectivity, but at the same time, it's like there's a, a wide ocean probably of things that we just haven't even been able to like, share because it's like we're, we're moving, we're grooving, and then there's. You're a deep well. So it's like I can only get so much of the deepness. You know what I mean?
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Judah Smith
We're getting to that age too, that like, we've been friends for long enough now. It's like, I don't know if I can do that again. I'm getting to that, you know, Like, I don't know if I have enough days left to. To. To re up another friendship. So. I love you. I admire you. You have impacted my sons, you've impacted my children. I've always admired you. And yeah, we are very similar. We are both tall, dark and handsome, both athletic. So, yeah, I do. I feel like we share so many. Like, I feel like our like, suit coat sizes would be similar. Stuff like that. Like, I'm just like, oh, lecrae. Yeah, twin.
- [06:29]
Lecrae
Twin, period.
- [06:31]
Judah Smith
So dumb.
- [06:32]
Lecrae
Nah, bro. But I'm sitting like, because of course I try to like, I know you. So there's plenty of things my brain thinks of to like, oh, we could talk about, da da da da. But then I'm just like reading through some stuff and I'm just like, what? I never knew this. So like, even as we go all the way back to like, I didn't know you were a seventh generation pastor.
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Ashley
Yeah.
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Lecrae
Is that weird? Is that cool? Like, what is that?
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Judah Smith
It simply means that my family has more drama and trauma than probably anybody else's family. But it does go back to a circuit rided, circuit riding woman preacher who carried a Bible and a gun on a horse and rode through encampments talking about Jesus. So shout out to women preachers. That's how our family started. And, but, but there's a litany in my family, man, of real like, like, like dudes that didn't take themselves down the right path all the time. So we've got some preachers who also like to sleep with the women in the church and all that kind of stuff. And so, yeah, it's, it's, it's a weird feeling because oftentimes it's, it's, it's, it's painted as a really positive thing. But, but there's a lot of pain and a lot of darkness back there at the same time. I'm, I am very, very grateful of my, my heritage and my history. But the older you get, the more you find out too. Isn't that weird? You find out like, wait, uncle so and so, aunt so and so. Oh, so that's what I felt when I was a kid. Like they weren't totally, you know, doing their thing.
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Lecrae
Yeah.
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Judah Smith
So, okay, now you're.
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Lecrae
If you're really doing the deep work, you're like, do I have any of these traits?
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Judah Smith
Don't. Absolutely.
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Lecrae
So, so, so what? Talk to me about like, like your dad from what I again, I only have the Internet. So you know what I'm saying? I only have the Internet. I could have called it.
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Judah Smith
I only have AI.
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Lecrae
Yeah.
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Judah Smith
That's all I have.
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Lecrae
But is it like. So your dad is taking you around while he's preaching, and then you're like in the crowd, and then you have like, you're mouthing his sermons, do you know them by heart? And then he asks you to come up on stage or like, how does that work?
- [08:44]
Judah Smith
Yeah, pretty much. So my dad did this thing called the Dragon Slayer Seminar. And we went to every state in the Union except North and South Dakota. It was like a two and a half day experience. It was multimedia. We had like fake faux brick on the stage that was spray painted. And then he had in the middle a big old screen and it was a rear projection, which back in the 80s was crazy. And then we got Pat Boone people to narrate. Oh. And so my dad was just that guy, he loved all that stuff. And so it'd be like Pat Boone would come on and be like, there is a battle for a generation. Which way will they go? Sex, drugs, rock and roll or righteousness, peace and joy, the kingdom of God is advancing, you know, and it was like this whole presentation. And then my dad would come out, he had a manual that had like a dragon on it. And like, like, like a knight who was like the dragon and like book of Revelation, he will bruise your heel. You will crush his head. We're gonna defeat. And it was all on destiny and conquest and purpose and things. And so, yeah, for two and a half days you listen to your dad. Minimum of probably 110 seminars. And my job was on the Saturday, which was the final session. My dad would say, there is an attack against the seed. And my son, who's destined by God to be a preacher, almost died three times before he died. Almost died three times before he's the age of three. Son, why don't you come up? And I'm like 8, 9, 10. And I would tell my testimony. Almost died at birth. I Almost died choking on eggs. And I almost died on my. On my little horsey. And it went down, and my brain swole. And I would tell my story. I know it's crazy. I got this thing down. I could do the whole thing right now. And I would tell the story and my punchline that I always nailed because it'd be like, you know, most attendance was, like, 2, 000 people. This is not a Lecrae concert, okay? But I would hit my line, and my line was that my dad said, well, what do you want to be when you grow up? Or some would be a preacher, except I'm gonna be better than you. And everybody would laugh. But the cool thing is, like, I would get on my knees with my dad Saturday morning. We would pray together to, you know, so that God would use me and whatever. So I started doing revival meetings at 13, man. Like, I. To me, and that's a different day. You know, back then, we were just, like, doing. We grew up in church, so I did my first revival in Alaska when I was 13. Started traveling when I was 16. And, yeah, you know, started. Started a monthly tape ministry when I was 19. We had seven people, I think, on our monthly list. It was exhausting. It was overwhelming, to be honest, to have that many partners. But, yeah, I could go on and on and on. But what is the.
- [11:19]
Lecrae
Because on one side, one end of the spectrum, it's like, that's super cool. That's, like, formative and, like, you know, it's, like, very intentional, and your kid's involved, and it's like, I could see the powerful moment of the kid coming up on stage. On the flip side, I could see it being, like, almost, like, hard. Hard to know what's authentic to you and what is showmanship like, authentically. So how do you process that as you get older? You know, like, wait, is this me, or is this the script that's been handed to me?
- [12:00]
Judah Smith
And I think it's. It's so easy, I got to say it. I think there is a point in your journey, and all I have is the Internet and some of our conversations. But I think I resonated with you deeply. We're so similar in age. Share a birthday. I remember when I felt my perception of you was you were starting to question even some of your script, and the journey and the rise and your influence and impact was. Was astronomical. And then suddenly you were like, yo, I'm not gonna just sit here and not say what I need to say about who I am and what we've been through in this country, and I think. I think I resonated with that. I get chills when I talk about it right now, because, yeah, same. I think in my own unique way, by no means is it the same, but in my own way, realizing, like, okay, it was a little bit of a bubble. I really was down to use the script, and I enjoyed it. But hold on a second. Like, no, I'm not down with all of this at all. Like, and I can't actually blindly accept this, and I'm not going to just play the game, and I'm not just going to be like, pastor, you know, I'm. I'm not going to pastor on cruise control here. I'm not going to preach on cruise control. I'm not going to exegete scripture on cruise control. I'm not going to say what I'm supposed to say. I. I'm going to say what God told me to say and what I see that needs to be said. And, yeah, I mean, life changed after that for me, for sure. Like, it's never been the same. But my sons and my daughter know Jesus is very real to them. And ultimately, I was motivated, I think, hopefully, by that.
- [13:38]
Lecrae
I was going to ask you that for your kids. Now, what do you take from your childhood that you're like, all right, let me implement versus what's going to look incredibly different? Like, do you feel like you need to grab your. Your sons or your daughter and say you're going to be 8th generation? Or are you like, yeah, what do you do? How does that work?
- [14:01]
Judah Smith
Yeah, I felt like, I don't know, man. You know, suddenly I've got to talk about LeBron and Bronny, but, like, yeah, you just kind of like the best advice I ever got from. From somebody. Because I think every dad and every parent is like, yo, you want to do what I do? That's so cool. But it was, like, one guy somewhere along the line said to me, every kid is different. Don't buy into the whole mold and model. Every kid is different. Your own three kids might need a different way of being raised, in a sense. And so personalize it. Tailor, make it to your children. And that meant a lot to me. And so it just very much carried over into this concept of, like, yo, if they want it, it's here for it. I'll help them. Whatever. My daughter gave a speech two days ago at her high school, and she, like, didn't miss a beat, and I was like, whoa. She's like, she got done and the place was, like, stunned. Like, the principal. The teachers were like, yo, that was better than any of the faculty. And she got done. And she sits down next to me and she goes, I needed to make more eye contact. And I was like, okay, wow. She actually does get this. Like, that's coming to her natural. Because if there was one critique, which there wasn't, it was, I just need to look and make eye contact. And so it's in her DNA. Does she want it? Great. If not, no problem. But more than anything, I just wanted them to not struggle with what I struggled with, which was, do I know the Jesus I've been trained to talk about? You know, and do I care about what he cares about? And then I started to read about him and the people that he cared for. I felt like we overlooked the things that mattered to him. We made light of the things he never spoke about, we were made to preach about. And I was just like, wait, this is, like, my head spinning. Guys. Do you know that Jesus never spoke on that topic? And I'm being told I gotta do a series on it. And I. You know, all that stuff. In my early 30s, I was like, just old enough to go, nah, I'm not doing this. And God will. God will work it out. And I gotta. I really mean this. I got energy from you, seeing you in your way, which cost you publicly far more than it costs me. But watching you go, nah, this is who I am. This is who God made me to be, and this is what I'm gonna stand for. And I was like, okay, I'm not the only one. We, you know, we can. We can be men of conviction. Yeah.
- [16:13]
Lecrae
So when I'm younger, I'm not thinking about these types of things. I mean, life insurance felt like something that you get around to eventually. But then you become a husband, you become a father, you become a provider, and you start realizing that loving your family ain't just about being there today. It's actually also about preparing for what happens when you're not around. So for me, I spent years building a business, creating opportunities, trying to leave something meaningful for my family. But if something ever happened to me unexpectedly, I want them protected financially while they're navigating my loss. It's a big loss to me, baby. But sincerely, that's why I appreciate companies like Fabric by Gerber Life. Fabric by Gerber Life is term life insurance you can get done today. It's made for busy parents just like you, all online, on your schedule, right from your couch. You can be covered in under 10 minutes with no health exam required. And here's the reality. If you're young and you're healthy, now is usually the best time to lock in lower rates. A lot of people assume life insurance is expensive, but Fabric offers flexible policies that fit different budgets. In some cases, you get a million dollars of coverage for less than a dollar a day. Also, they partner with Gerber Life, which is a company trusted by families for over 50 years.
- [17:30]
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- [17:31]
Lecrae
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Judah Smith
Yeah. Yeah. Okay.
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Lecrae
But one thing I think about. I'm ner. I don't. I'mma say it. We can edit it if we need to.
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Judah Smith
Okay.
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Lecrae
But there was a season in both of our lives where Mark Driscoll was kind of putting his arm around us and saying, hey, if you need something, I got something for you. Whatever. Blah, blah, blah, blah. I feel like I didn't feel. It was, like, disingenuous, but I think I learned a lot, good and bad, from his whole circumstance. I mean, y', all, you are actually a pastor, and he's a pastor, and he's like, hey, we're both in the same city. We. You know, you got. You need something. I got you. And then you watch him and then you see, like, the whole rise and fall of Mars Hill. And, like, his way of leading you kind of went a complete opposite direction of leadership style. Right? Like, and I'm. I'm curious, as does that. Did. Was it influenced by seeing that or was it not? Or did you take away some good things or was there some stuff that you're like, okay, now I'm learning some stuff. Like, how did you walk in that?
- [19:53]
Judah Smith
I've had so many good moments with Mark, and that stemmed from when my dad was still alive. My dad wanted to bless Mark and encourage him, and that created a little bit of friction, like, well, why? And then we ended up connecting. And it was so meaningful. When my dad sent me in as the pastor, Mark came and just blew the place up in the best way. Just support for me meant the world. And the thing about this life is we all continue to grow and change in the ways that we do. I think ultimately, and I only have love for people, I think there's this fine line of which I'm really passionate about. And I hope this isn't too nuanced to bring this up, but I'm going to say it. And that is that there are these precedences that we give in the realm of the sacred space of the church and faith. And that is we see letters written by Paul to Christians living in Ephesus or Rome or wherever, Philippi. And we see these letters and we hear him talk about very specific circumstances within the church in which he has personal relationship. And some would argue he's going to read some of these letters to the whole church. Some. Okay, hold on a second. But one Scripture says in the message Bible, the way it's said and to whom it's said is as important as what is said. So the way and to whom is as important as what. And my issue with some of that style of leadership, and Mark knows this, and this is not a shade as much as it's a difference of leadership. I think there is precedence for the Bible to say, this is a relational, contextual statement in Scripture made not for public pulpit preaching, but for personal, relational correction.
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Lecrae
That's good.
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Judah Smith
And I think this idea that all scripture is God breathed, of course, all scripture is inspired. Yes. All scriptures can approve and correct and challenge and inspire. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. But I do not believe that the Bible gives us precedence to call other ministries out by name in our sermons. I don't. I don't see that in the test in the New Testament. I just don't. And so I have issue where. Because I think Paul will write and be like, yo, look out for so and so. He did me dirty. He did me wrong.
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Ashley
Yeah.
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Judah Smith
But if you look at the, at the letter, you could argue even in the public reading of it, it's an intro and a close and it's very personal and direct. And if we do good exegesis, you have to conclude that it's like, if I'm writing you a letter and I'm like, yo, read this for your grandmother's funeral. The last part, when I'm like, yo, bro, when you're back in la, can you hit me up, by the way? So. And so it's kind of gone sideways on me. And I'm just saying, like, can. Can we talk about that? Because that was crazy. You're not going to read that at your grandma's funeral. And again, is this a poor assessment of these letters? I don't know. But I think sometimes we take our thinking off when we read these sacred texts and we say, oh, well, look, he calls out. You know, Alexander, he calls out. What? So that means I get to call out. Well, does that produce righteousness, peace and joy? And so there was a moment where I felt the calling out of preachers by name. I was like, oh, I got it. This is where I get off. Like, this is where I get off. I can't do that. I do not believe that that is the way of Jesus. And I don't. I'm trying to think. I don't think I see any precedents where in the ministry of Jesus, he will point at a group of people and be like, y' all messed this up and you are the reason, you know, and usually it was to their face. So I just. That's where things got a little wonky with. With me. And I don't want to be. I don't want my edge to be. The edge that I get is that energy from division.
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Ashley
Yeah.
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Judah Smith
I wanted my edge to be that somebody who risks everything to bring people together.
- [23:37]
Lecrae
Yeah.
- [23:38]
Judah Smith
You know what I mean?
- [23:39]
Lecrae
There's so many things you said. So one thing in what you just said is one. I think you're an amazing translator because you're a thinker and, like, you grasp complicated things, but you make it so accessible for people. But because of that, you're misunderstood, right? Because of that, it's like, why are you doing this? And if anybody relates to this, I relate, because I'm trying to translate and I've seen some things and I'm like, oh, this is gonna cause more division than it's gonna cause unity. And so I don't wanna go down. What's the point of us going, what's this conversation about? Cause are you just trying to catch me in a gotcha moment, or are you really looking for clarity? And I feel like I've seen that happen with you around LGBTQ issues. I've Seen it happen around abortion. And I. And I don't think. And again, I'm assuming. But I know you. But I don't think it's you saying, I don't have a perspective or stance on this. I think it's you saying, what's the point of this question? Like, what is your goal?
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Judah Smith
End goal.
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Lecrae
Right. Am I right?
- [24:51]
Judah Smith
With all my heart, yes.
- [24:52]
Lecrae
Okay.
- [24:53]
Judah Smith
Yeah.
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Lecrae
So how do you feel about being misunderstood then? When you know you have a van, you have a deep well, you probably have a long document of thoughts about issues, but then you're like, I'm here to translate for people who don't see all of this, and then you get misunderstood.
- [25:13]
Judah Smith
I mean, that question means the world to me. It really does. I could just stop there, just say thank you. Because it's not so much just like, oh, I feel so misunderstood. I just feel like by my friends sometimes, and that's what matters. The people that I love look at me sideways sometimes, and I'm like, yo, bro, I'm me. It's me. Like, come look at my marriage, come look at my kids. Like the stuff we all said we cared about. Yeah, I don't pastor that church anymore, but I wait. That we weren't friends because of. I thought you love my wife, my kids. I thought we were. This was like, no, no, bro, hold on a second. Like, you know me. Like, the things we said we cared about in the green rooms and at dinner at night after these services is we said we cared about taking care of our lady, taking care of our wife, taking care of our kids, praying, reading our Bible, talking to Jesus, loving our neighbors, being somebody who's for righteousness, peace and joy, for equity and equality and justice and the kingdom of God, concepts that we gave our soul for. And it's like, just because I changed my occupation or platform I preach from, bro, it's me. You can still cut me open. I'm the same dude. Furthermore, Paul, who I would argue can run circles around anybody and everybody when it comes to New Testament, New Covenant, Old Covenant, Torah, all. This guy writes more than maybe half of the New Testament inspired by the Holy Spirit. He says, I have determined, I've made a decision. I have a conviction I'm gonna know nothing except Jesus Christ and him crucified. Paul's not saying, I don't know nothing. He's saying, you'd be blown away by what I know. But I've got to be the king's fool. I've got to be the guy that says, Jesus Christ and him Crucified translation. What that means to me is I'm a root guy. And what that means to me is I'm a keep the main thing, the main thing guy. And here's my issue. I believe gospel presenters, which is what God has called me to. I'm a storyteller. I'm a presenter of the greatest story ever told, the story of God, whose main character is Jesus, and he's the fullness of the Godhead in bodily form. And I believe that if I can keep the main thing, the main thing, the root will take care of the leaves and the stuff. But, but, but if you. If I'm a root guy and you call me out to the limbs and the leaves and you say, well, what do you think about this social. And what do you think about this social construct? And I just want to say, everybody, stop the tape for a moment and say something. If we think our current social, economical, moral dilemmas are bigger than ancient Rome or ancient Greece, we are arrogant and fools. We're talking about people that were having orgies out on the stages of their platforms. And you mean to tell me that our Jesus never speaks to the White House having an orgy on the lawn? But he doesn't. He never talks about it. And so my issue is, everybody's like, how can you not talk about what happened with the president? How can you not talk about this? Because I'm a root guy. I'm a big picture guy. I'm a main story guy. I'm a Jesus guy. That is just who I am. So my job is, I cannot get distracted talking about these current modern moral issues. Do they matter? Do I have a perspective? Yes, of course. I get it. But in the grand scheme of things, if you can get connected to the life source, the vine, Jesus himself, bro, all of this will. God will meet you there. And the truth is, Lecrae, you and I both know, we know bishops and pastors and leaders that we respect equally that fall on both different sides of the issues. And I sat with them and I go, I believe that now. And then with the other guy. Oh, I believe that now. You know, like, so. So that's why to me, it's Jesus, Jesus, Jesus. I want to be a root guy. I'm a Jesus guy. I'm a storyteller. If you need somebody to give you answers, I don't even know who to vote for. And I'm not even being silly. I'm not even being dumb. I. I told my mom yesterday the presidency is the worst job in the Whole world to me now. And so I have to have respect even for a man or a woman who would want to be president, because this is wild to me and complex. I'm a Jesus guy. I believe he's the hope. I believe he's the source of all life. And so you cut me open. That's what I'm gonna bleed. And I felt like my friends knew that. And now when they question that, I'm like, like, I, like, I, like, I, like I changed my theology. And I feel like I haven't changed nothing. I've only doubled down on what we said. We always believed.
- [29:40]
Lecrae
Yeah, I often think. I mean, I. I love how you articulated the root versus all the external stuff. Often the way I try to express it is like, let's imagine that this is someone who lives in your house. Like you have someone who's on the other side of the political aisle that lives in your home with you. Are you always trying to correct their political ideologies? Or are you trying to show them a picture of Jesus so that they respect and love you? And they're like, well, what do you think about this?
- [30:16]
Judah Smith
Or what is.
- [30:17]
Lecrae
You know what I mean? Like, how would you navigate that? That's kind of the way my brain.
- [30:22]
Judah Smith
But I want to move.
- [30:23]
Lecrae
Yeah. I don't think we have enough relationship or proximity to people who have different views than we do or have views that we haven't been challenged with yet to even be able to say. But I get it. It's going to sound. There is absolutely someone who heard everything you said and says. Compromiser.
- [30:41]
Judah Smith
Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally.
- [30:42]
Lecrae
Sell out. Sell out. Cheap. Cheap way to go out.
- [30:46]
Judah Smith
Yeah.
- [30:46]
Lecrae
You know who to vote for.
- [30:47]
Judah Smith
Yeah, that's right.
- [30:48]
Lecrae
What are you saying, bro? And, and, and I guess, do you just have to. Does that bother you or do you just close friends? Obviously it bothers you. Outside world. Does it bother you?
- [31:02]
Judah Smith
Yeah, and I think choosing who you win with and choosing who you lose with. And my passion is I want to win with people who feel far from God. And I'm willing to lose with people who feel real close to God. God has told me to give the rest of my life and whatever talent I have left in this body to people who feel far from God. And he told me to tell them. They feel it, but I'm as near as their next breath. And so the rest of my career is dedicated to people who feel far from God. So if you think anything about me, just know I'm leveraging everything to talk to people in this country. And abroad who feel far from God. That's my target. Those are my people. I want to spend time with them. I love them. I want to learn. I want to listen. What do you feel? Why do you feel far from God? 50% of Americans in my last research are telling us, over my dead body will I ever step foot in church. And all I'm asking for my preacher friends is give me a shot at the other 50%. Just give me a shot. That's what I want. Me and my friends, we got a whole crew. We just want to go after the other 50% and let them know you don't got to step foot in church and you're not far from God and He loves you and he's proud of you and he named you and he called you, and he thinks you're amazing and he forgives you. He's already forgiven you. Like, this story is too good. It's so good we don't let it be so good. It's so good we've dumbed it down because it must be too good, too easy, too free. And so we have made it way more complex than it is. And I think it's scandalously free and available to everyone. So much so it makes preachers like me uncomfortable. And we don't want it to let it be what it is. It's just what it is. And I'm thinking of all kind of movie scenes that would describe what I'm talking about. But anyways, I. I just love. I love that. And that's what my kids are dedicated to. That's what my wife is dedicated to. The Smith family. You'll find us with people who feel far from God. That is our mission. That's our passion. And those are my people. And I'm not saying I love church. I grew up. I am the church. I grew up like I. I am a part of the church is what I mean. And I grew up in church, and I love church people, and that's who I am, but who I'm called to, which I feel a bond with. And it feels very sacred to me. And I'm willing to back up whoever I need to back up so that we can go support people who feel far from God, so they know he's near.
- [33:23]
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- [34:33]
Ashley
this is Ashley AI from the Almost Famous podcast. Can I be honest for a second? Some mornings I look in the mirror and I think, why do I look this tired? Puffiness around the eyes, Dullness? Because sometimes stress starts showing up on your face before you even realize it. And that's why I've been loving this holistic goddess organic castor oil roll on with frankincense. No crazy chemicals, no expensive treatments. It's just organic castor oil, frankincense and this rose quartz roller that feels so good on tired stressed skin. I look for anything that can de puff me and this really did my under eyes look brighter. My face looked way more refreshed. It's almost like my face just exhaled. So try the holistic goddess organic castor oil roll on with sense yourself. Use my promo code ashley@tryhg.com ashley for 15 off promo code ashley@try hg.com ashley
- [35:33]
Lecrae
I think that's what I, I love that. I think that's why I feel I, I just, I, I champion you in some of these areas because I, I resonate with that. You're a, that's a real missionary, you know what I'm saying? And I resonate with that. And you move in spaces and places that the outside world can't quite comprehend sometimes. So it's hard to explain, it's hard to articulate. And all they know is they put themselves in your shoes and they project how they would navigate it and how it would affect them. I deal with this a lot.
- [36:11]
Judah Smith
Yes, you do.
- [36:12]
Lecrae
I deal with it a lot. So I have, I.
- [36:14]
Judah Smith
That's an understatement.
- [36:16]
Lecrae
So let's talk a little bit about the celebrity pastor type of, type of thing, right? So from my vantage point, and I know there's people watching. So I try not to be too candid, but, like, from my vantage point, from my vantage point, it was like you were on the Mount Rushmore of, like, current celebrity pastors, you know, it was like, oh, these are the guys. Like, the freaking. I don't know, the one direction of pastors.
- [36:48]
Judah Smith
You know what I'm saying? That's the funniest thing I've heard in a while.
- [36:53]
Lecrae
But it was like, this season of, like. I don't think it was intentional. I don't think you all were like, hey, you get the NBA player, I'll get the pop star. You know, I don't think that was intentional. It was just. It was happening, you know what I mean? And then it was, like, highlighted, and it was a thing.
- [37:13]
Judah Smith
It was a thing.
- [37:14]
Lecrae
And the assumption is like, y' all are lost in the sauce, you know, like, you're lost in the sauce. These guys. Oh, my gosh. And it can't be that you genuinely like art and fashion. It can't be that you actually see these people as human beings and you want to be a light in their lives. It can't be that you're dynamic at what you do, and you just like excellence. And it just so happens that this event is excellent. It can't be. It has to be that you're vain, that you want the accolades and the acclaim of others. It has to be those things. That's the only explanation. And then if someone like you is transparent enough to say, I had a vain moment, you just justified everything they say. Walk me through this, brother.
- [38:14]
Judah Smith
Well, I backed into all of it, first of all, because growing up, like, we grew up, and I'm, like, bringing you in to how I grew up. But, like, in church, it was like, you know, when you started to. I don't know your experience specifically, but in the church, when people identified you in the church as talented and gifted, it was like, man, get out there and do your thing. Like, we're going to support you, whatever. And so I started using my gift and then started meeting people in the process of using that gift. And then when someone resonates with you that has a talent that also is giving them a stage in the world, it kind of gets exciting. And in my line of work, if you youth pastor, like, I had dudes in high school that are now in the NBA. So, you know, you know, deal with that. Sorry. I've known them since they were in high school. What do you want me to do? Like, I've known their family. It's like a church thing. It happens, you know, so there's also that. And then in the case of Justin and his mother, Patty, Justin bieber, he was 8 years old and Patty brought him to this thing I was speaking at when I was like 19 or 20 and I met him and don't even remember when I first met him. They did carry him around. I remember this at 8 years old and they were people prophesying, saying that he's going to be a king in his generation. That will give you chills. But Patty retells the whole story when he gets on Ellen, she calls me and says he remembers you. Listens to your tapes at night to fall asleep. Will you come meet him and come see him? Absolutely. It was just as natural as natural can be. It's just as normal as normal can be. And then, since then, and you know this Lecrae, once you become a trusted person in circles of influence and you start getting co signs saying there's only a few people you can trust. But call my guy because you can trust him. And that's all that it is. And that's true of anything. You work at a tire shop, you work at Les Schwab and you find out there's a guy you can trust with tires because he does good work. Well, it gets around. Yeah, give him more tires. So it's just what it is. It's as natural as that. It's like other people co signing. And obviously when Justin co signs you and says you can trust this guy, there's a lot of people that are like, can we talk? Can I trust you? And I'm like, oh, God, I hope you can trust me. Like, I don't. And you know, and then I'm. I'm in meetings all the time with like, what do you think? And I'm like, like, guys, I should not be talking right now. It doesn't matter what I think. I don't know what to think. Like, this is far, far exceeds me. But I think what's difficult is running into people sometimes at cafes and coffee shops and they say I'm called to celebrities like you too. And I just. I stopped dead in my tracks first time I heard. It really, really threw me off. Now it's. It's happened a few more times. And I. I want to say. I usually say something like, okay, you know, bless you, you know, because I just want to be moving on, whatever. But it hurts my heart because I don't know if I believe in that at all. I don't think I Don't see that in the Bible at all. I'm only called to a specific echelon because how do I say this and be honest? When we say we're called to celebrities, I don't know if it's like, I feel people. I feel called to people that feel far from God. But when you delineate celebrity, and maybe this is my judgment, and I think in real time, I'm finding out my own pain. But I judge people when they say that because I feel like, are you in it to get something from the people you say you called to? Because I'm there to serve, hopefully. But I want to say this. I am as guilty as charged. I am as vain as the next man. I am as selfish as the next man. I got in a fight with my wife last night. She's literally raising her voice, trying to get my attention. You're so selfish. You only think about your feelings. And I woke up this morning talking about, I'm that guy. Like, I am selfish. I got a problem. I went on chat GPT asking about my selfishness. Is there something wrong with me? Should I get medication? Like, am I crazy? Have I screwed up my whole life? Should I just step. Kept pastoring the church, guys. Yeah, that's. That's just a morning for me in the bathtub before my podcast with Lecrae. So, like, for me, I don't got no defense other than, like, if people could influence the people I've been able to meet with, I think they would.
- [42:23]
Lecrae
Yeah.
- [42:23]
Judah Smith
I feel like it's one of the most providential parts of my life, which is so ironic. As if I crafted this and made this happen. You know better than I know. You don't get into those rooms because you tried.
- [42:36]
Lecrae
That's right.
- [42:36]
Judah Smith
You get into those rooms because you're invited. And I just have been invited, and it's been a thrill. And. And I want to say this. I have learned more about Jesus and more about God from Justin Bieber than I've ever taught him. And the reason for that is because Platform has an acute pressure and pain. So much so that if you're going to breathe and live and not be Michael Jackson and not be Elvis and not be Prince and not be. I'm being dead serious. If you're going to breathe at that altitude, the willingness you have to own your brokenness and face your stuff every day is so compounded and accentuated. I don't think we can fathom that level of fandom and celebrity and global iconic experience is not meant for A man. David struggled with it. Solomon struggled with it. It makes a man go crazy. It feels like he could take anything he wants from anybody at any time. And Justin's willingness to be a broken man. I was telling somebody yesterday, I was like, I was so pissed off. Somebody stole money from me recently, another person, whatever. And I just thought, it's another day for Justin. And he hit me yesterday with, what can I do for you? I want to be here for you. I love you, man. And for everybody and what they say. I'll just say this. A lot of dudes who question my motives. And Justin, when he got up at Coachella, everybody called me. It was weird. I got hit by all the pastors and the preachers talking about, how was Coachella look? Sick. And I was like, man, we've been missing that text for a long time, but it is everything. Hallelujah came out, and now everything's okay. But when I saw him get on that stage, I just got to say, man, I just got to say, he wouldn't let me know. I didn't know we were going to go back in time and go on the Internet and whatever. And I just love him. He means the world to me. It can sound like I'm just trying to talk about the most famous person I know, but he's one of the best men I know. And at. At one point in my life, God, I told God, I said, if this doesn't work for Justin Bieber, this gospel, then I'm. Then it doesn't work. Because if this is just something that works for aspirational kids who need something to believe in and buy into to get through another day from the. The broken neighborhood I was from, with bars on our windows, with, like, I mean, we. No money. And my dad started making money because he traveled and preached, which wasn't much like, you know, Christianity can be a way to kind of believe for more. But when you have it all, either Jesus is beautiful and wonderful and gorgeous and meaningful, or he's not. And. And that's what I mean when I say that, so I could go on and on how much I respect that man and love that man and. And feel like I'm just grateful a camera hasn't followed me around since I was 14, my God, that'd be a nightmare.
- [45:32]
Lecrae
I mean, even the sliver of having to grow in the public eye that I've experienced, I can't even imagine on his level. And shout out to Patty, too, because, my goodness.
- [45:45]
Judah Smith
That's right.
- [45:47]
Lecrae
My goodness. I've had My own experiences with her. And I'm like, salute to you, madam. Salute to you.
- [45:55]
Judah Smith
You're the man. Thank you for this. I think this is, by the way, this is therapy for me. So this just turned into therapy, Public therapy. I needed this today.
- [46:02]
Lecrae
Nah, bro, I, I, I mean, I think that there's not a lot of places and, and spaces where people can be authentic and not it be a gotcha moment or like a. And I just, I crave it, right? I craved those spaces and places, and there was only like. It was like, it's an air I'm trying to breathe. And it's like, you're like, can I be real here? Is it okay if I'm real?
- [46:29]
Judah Smith
And then like, yeah.
- [46:31]
Lecrae
And it's like, yeah, yeah, be safe, be safe, be safe, be safe, be safe. You know what I mean? And so I love to create that opportunity where it's like, hey, I don't want you to. I don't want you to have to snake your way through this and feel like. Cause I hate those where it's like, what you're really asking me is my stance on this thing.
- [46:54]
Judah Smith
That's it, that's it. That's it.
- [46:55]
Lecrae
Just say that, bro. You know what I mean?
- [46:57]
Judah Smith
Can I ask you a question that I'm sincerely curious about?
- [47:00]
Lecrae
Yeah, by all means.
- [47:02]
Judah Smith
So in the process of becoming more vulnerable, which is a weird way to assess kind of the journey you've been through, but your willingness to be more of your full self on the platform that God's given you, which I only applaud and believe that that's part of everyone's calling, to be more of themselves on the platform God's given them, whatever that might be. When you have those nights where you feel exposed and you start to feel regret, like, did I over share? Did I overdo it? Now I look like an idiot. Where do you go from there? And, yeah, just from that point, what are some of the things you've either done right or wrong?
- [47:47]
Lecrae
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I've dropped that ball a million times that I can think of. And I think what I found is that there are certain people in our lives that are willing to say, yeah, you may feel this way to this whole big world out here, but I never saw you as anything other than an imperfect person. I wanted to love, right? And having those people around me, whoa, kind of, it almost was like. It was almost like their care in that community were like wings of a bird that covered my eyes to everything that was going on outside. And so it's like, oh, Lecrae was at this party. And you know what happens at those parties? And that's the whole talk of the town. It's like their arms cover me and say, quit looking at that. You know, look in here at this community and at this space. This is who you are.
- [48:56]
Ashley
This is.
- [48:57]
Lecrae
And we've never seen you as anything more than an imperfect person that we love to death. And Cool. Yeah, maybe you overshared. I did, too. I just didn't do it in front of that camera. I did it in this meeting over here. I mean, it's a human thing, but they don't love you like we do, and we got you. And therapeutically, what it's done for me is, is help me take God out of the box even more. Because I think we all have God in this box.
- [49:27]
Ashley
We do.
- [49:27]
Judah Smith
We do.
- [49:28]
Lecrae
In this box that says, I'm judging you, I'm critiquing you. I'm side eyeing you. And I think the more honest and vulnerable I've been, the more personal God has become. And so I just. I'm like, yo, he's rolling with me right now. Like, he's. I'm just like, oh, that's okay. The prostitute over there who just was about to get stoned, he's like, yeah, I know exactly what happened, why you're about to get stoned. You know what I mean? And I'm rolling with you. So that's my. It doesn't hurt any less. It doesn't feel less embarrassing for me, but it definitely. Those wings, man, cover me.
- [50:13]
Judah Smith
And I think that wing metaphor is so perfect and beautiful and personal to me. And I think at times I have felt almost guilty when I have felt such great friends say, bro, don't even look at it. Like, am I. Am I responsible to look at it in some way? And, God, am I ignoring some introspection you want me to make and am I not? You know, because sometimes I get the feeling, like, when I'm like, oh, I didn't even. I started a podcast recently, and the host said, you know, people want me to just devastate you. You got a lot of people that don't like you. And I felt like it was news to me. I was like, oh, man, I really. I felt really liked recently. Okay, you know what? I was like, oh, you know, but. But I say that to say, like, I really want to accept that. I feel like God gives your friends healing wings, you know, to protect you. And of course, I want to always do that for my friends. For sure. But sometimes accepting that from your friends can feel like it's a cop out or I'm not facing the music and I'm not really dealing with my stuff. But I'm going to take that and accept that. And I, I feel more given to that than I don't. I just sometimes feel guilty. Like, should I be more aware of whatever it might be? So it means a lot to me.
- [51:33]
Ashley
This is Ashley I from the Almost Famous podcast. Can I be honest for a second? Some mornings I look in the mirror and I think, why do I look this? Just tired puffiness around the eyes, dullness. Because sometimes stress starts showing up on your face before you even realize it. And that's why I've been loving this Holistic Goddess Organic Castor Oil roll on with frankincense. No crazy chemicals, no expensive treatments. It's just organic castor oil, frankincense and this rose quartz roller that feels so good on tired stressed skin. I look for anything that can depuff me. And this really did my under eyes look brighter? My face looked way more refreshed. It's almost like my face just exhaled. So try the holistic Goddess organic castor Oil roll on with frankincense yourself. Use my promo code ashley@tryhg.com ashley for 15 off promo code ashley@tryhg.Com ashley most
- [52:34]
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Judah Smith
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- [53:04]
Lecrae
If I could just say this just for you. My thought as I'm listening to you is you're such a thinker that I think you will try to process logistically, like, okay, wait a minute, what about this and this and this and just trying to connect these dots and because I relate to that a thousand percent. Just like, okay, wait a minute, what about this? And how does this fit in this? And okay, well I am. Do I incur stricter judgment or what is. You know, you're thinking about all these things and I think, man, I think, look at how much we wrestle with the things that Paul has said. Like, look. And it's just like, I don't think Paul's like, ah, shoot, I probably shouldn't have. He's like, look, bro, I'm the chief of sinners. Like, I don't even judge myself. You know what I'm saying? Listen, I get it. And I think as we get older, it's just like, bro, it is what it is, man. Like, I'm not trying. It's not a scapegoat.
- [54:11]
Judah Smith
Right, Right. No, no, no, no. Yeah, Ownership.
- [54:14]
Lecrae
It's ownership. And it's like. And it's like, man, you can love me where I'm at or you can tell on me when you get to heaven, however you want to run it. You know what I'm saying?
- [54:24]
Judah Smith
And don't you think that's the path to. I feel like it's the path to tenderness, which is what I always want to do. I want to get better with age, like a fine wine. And I just want to be the old guy that's like. Like, so proud of younger people and a listening ear and an attentive eye and just believe in you and love you and you need anything. I'm good. Yeah. I'm just happy to. To have encouraged you. And you have a lot of teachers, but few fathers, and I just want to be one of those guys who's a father. Because I've had a hard time finding spiritual fathers. I really have. It's been. It's been a difficult thing, and I don't know exactly, specifically your standpoint on that journey, but, yeah, it's just been hard.
- [55:05]
Lecrae
Same.
- [55:05]
Judah Smith
Just somebody that won't compete and compare, but just listen and share or take
- [55:10]
Lecrae
advantage, you know, because it's like, yeah. Leverage, which is that. That's what messed me up, is feeling like I thought I had a spiritual father, and then it was like I let him into every detail. Every. I've never even shared this publicly, but I'm not going to get too deep into it. But I let him into every detail.
- [55:28]
Judah Smith
Yeah.
- [55:31]
Lecrae
Every dollar amount that I saw. Everything. And then he was like, I can do this longer if you put me on payroll. And I was like, I don't think he meant harm, but it damaged me.
- [55:45]
Judah Smith
It changes.
- [55:46]
Lecrae
Yeah. And was like, all right, this is going to be different moving forward.
- [55:50]
Judah Smith
Yep.
- [55:53]
Lecrae
For you as a spiritual father figure to people, like, it feels like you want to leave a legacy of love. Right. Like, and who wouldn't want to get older and just be more loving? I don't want to be the old, bitter guy.
- [56:08]
Judah Smith
Right.
- [56:09]
Lecrae
See, that's what I'm saying. You know, I want to be like, man, what a loving old dude.
- [56:14]
Ashley
You know,
- [56:18]
Lecrae
but for like, you talk a lot about grace and love and wanting to be known for love. It sounds like, I mean, you're willing to process criticisms and think about what other people are saying. How often are you wrestling with grace and truth, love and truth and oh man, honestly, let's, I mean, maybe we can kill it here. What do you think the critics have right about you? That you're like, shoot, I gotta work on that,
- [56:56]
Judah Smith
That I don't have it figured out? That I don't think for a moment I have a corner on the market, that yeah, maybe, maybe I miss my calling and I'm an evangelist, you know, at heart. And maybe the pastor thing, although I loved pastoring, it was so fun that I'm broken and selfish and self serving and I really, really feel like a nightmare. Thing about my theology is you're not allowed to wear nightmare as a badge, but you're not allowed to shake it either. My theology informs me when I'm weak, then I'm strong. I'm the, the, I'm the theology guy that believes in the moment. Paul says, you gotta take this thing from me. And God says, by the way, we don't have a lot of these passages in the New Testament where a New Testament writer says, and then God spoke to me verbatim. There's not very many, by the way, just for what it's worth. And he said, God said to me, no, my grace is sufficient for you, for when you're weak, then you are strong and my power rests upon you. That is so much of what I believe about the gospel. And so I'm drawn to vulnerable, broken people. I believe grace is the greatest truth in the world. I believe that grace and truth are embodied in one person. They're not the tension and opposites of truths. They're embodied in a man. If you struggle with the difference between sovereignty and free will, look at Jesus. If you look at the struggle with the difference between grace and truth, look at Jesus. If you want to know the difference between mercy and grace and compassion and empathy and justice and righteousness and indignation and righteousness, look at Jesus. Look at his life. Follow Jesus. This is not what I think we make it out to be. We tried to decipher and discern and distinguish between Hebrew words and Greek words and we forgot that we have a walking to talking thesaurus. He is the fullness of the Godhead in bodily form. I am a firm believer that Jesus is the answer to all of my theological Questions. I really believe that that's how I move. That's how I. He is the zenith, he is the peak. He's the point, he's the process, he's the purpose, he's the promise. He's all these things. And so when I'm like, how do we detention of grace and truth, that to me is seen in Jesus. So I get back with him, I follow him around for three and a half years. I sense his spirit. I believe the Holy Spirit gives us the to and the mood of Jesus too, if I'm really honest. And I can get real weird about it. But I believe the essence of Jesus, the spirit of Jesus. People argue that I shouldn't call the Holy Spirit the Spirit of Jesus, but I think I'm on safe ground to call him the Spirit of Jesus. So the spirit of Jesus, which, by the way, the Bible says the Holy Spirit's job, you'll know he's working in your life because he will reveal the beauty and majesty of Jesus and He will remind you all the things he thought and sorry. All the things he said and taught and did. So you'll know the Holy Spirit's working in your life. Not just because you fall over and I fell over. Not just because you sing song songs and preach into the night, which we did all those things. Or speak in tongues. We did all those things. But you'll know the Holy Spirit's at work in you when the, When Jesus is being magnified and glorified. And so to me, the litmus test is him and the spiritual test is Him. And if. And I felt like it provokes me, that passage says. And they'll say to themselves, they've been with Jesus. And I just, just, I just want that, man. I mean, to me, if, to not want that, I'm such an idiot because I get my whole life to it. My whole adult life has been about this man. And so if I don't know him, what a fool I've been for giving my life to someone I don't know. So I want to know him, I want to look like him, I want to be about him. And, and my confession is I'm trying to shed a little bit of. A little bit of the hurt and the pain. Cause I don't want to be the guy who's hurt. I want to be the guy who's helpful. And so I'm moving towards that.
- [61:13]
Lecrae
I think that's really good, bro. Like, not trying to be the guy who's hurt. I actually steer clear of a lot of the questions around areas
- [61:24]
Judah Smith
like when
- [61:25]
Lecrae
people expect me to be mad still. And I'm just like, I'm not. And I steer away from. Cause I. Because I'm walking in healing. And I don't want to be known as the angry person or the bitter or hurt person because it's like I'm not there. And I know you want me to be mad at this. I'm not. And I'm sorry.
- [61:51]
Judah Smith
I love that.
- [61:52]
Lecrae
And I'm sitting across from people and it's like. And I don't agree with them. Why didn't you shake your finger? And I love him. Right? Like, yeah, I don't. We didn't. That doesn't mean I'm gonna be mad at him. Cause he said something I disagree with. It means cool. You know, maybe we'll. I might agree with him tomorrow, though. I don't know. You know what I'm saying? Like, yeah, we're in this journey.
- [62:14]
Judah Smith
I disagree with myself, by the way. You ever done that? Watched yourself in some other scene? You're like, I don't believe that anymore. That's crazy.
- [62:25]
Lecrae
Try all of the 2000 and tens.
- [62:27]
Judah Smith
All of the 2000 and tens is crazy.
- [62:29]
Lecrae
All of the 2000 and tens.
- [62:30]
Judah Smith
You're putting out some good art in the 2010s.
- [62:34]
Lecrae
But I know the motive. I know the behind the scenes.
- [62:36]
Judah Smith
But we enjoyed the art.
- [62:37]
Lecrae
That's right. God saved me. He helped me navigate that.
- [62:40]
Judah Smith
All the 2010s. Breaking news. Lecrae says all 2010s.
- [62:45]
Lecrae
2010s was rough, bro. What is. What are you doing today? What are you. What. What is occupying your time? What are you passionate about? What are your dreams? What are your visions?
- [62:56]
Judah Smith
What do you see, man? Thank you for asking. I'm. I'm giving the rest of my life to the story of God. So the story of God for us is the story that we all live in. It's the world. It's the planet, it's the. It's the. The universe, the solar system. It is the story of God. He's the main character. It's his story. It's being played out. And so the Bible for me is the story of God. It's the beginning of the story of God. So we are re. I'm going through the whole book, and I'm being honest about how I hear the book, which is all in first person narrative. I've been preaching kind of this way for so, so long, where Adam and Eve will tell you their story from first person, whatever. So we're Doing these little clips on the Internet, we're letting people know. But eventually we will have a book called the Story of God. And it will be a little cute, little adorable partner to the Bible for your friends who have no idea what it means and can't make sense of it. And it's going to be this book and we're going to give it to. To hopefully give a lot away. And we'll raise money so we can publish it and certainly sell it, but also give it away all over the world because it's going to be kind of a little partner to the most magical, mystical, sacred, wonderful, transcendent book that's ever written that has no peer and has no compare. And by the way, I think our holy book is a big part of the future because I think AI is going to start to reveal some of the nuances and the errors in some of our practices and traditions and going to call foul, but it can't call foul on our sacred men mystical, magical book which transcends all other mystical, magical books. And nobody even compares. They're all written by one guy. Ours is right. 44 authors, 66 books, 1600 general. Like, nobody compares to our book. So I was just in Morocco and I have Muslim friends and whatever, we start talking about the Quran and I'm like, no disrespect, like, you got one author, we got like 44. So like, this is just my book. And it's like, this is my book. And so I'm committed to my generation before I call it quits to make more of a of his story as a way for people to not miss the forest, for the trees. Not like the Sadducees and the Pharisees. He says, you know the Torah, but you can't see the fulfillment of the Torah standing in front of you. So I want my friends to know Jesus. I feel called to people who feel far from God. So the story of God exists. We have a story of God gathering on Wednesday nights at the Savant Theater in la. It's some Wednesdays, most Wednesdays, the Wednesdays you hear about, whatever. We're just letting people know. A lot of that is just leveraged around our friends that feel far from God. We're inviting them to what really is more of an experience than it is even a church service. Now a lot of my friends call to show I present for about 60 minutes and then one of my friends will get up and. And do music. We had this comedian open a few weeks ago called Chad Goes Deep. He's wild and he used the word ass, I think, and boner. So that sucked. But. Because that really hurt some people's hearts. But so we're kind of like, changing a little bit of the approach and just having some fun with just. Just giving people the chance who. Who, like, going in church is a little overwhelming. And. And I love church, and I'm for church, and I sit on boards for churches, by the way. I really mean that. So. But that's our. That's our calling. And so we are church, home, presenting the story of God. The story of God's going to be what we do going forward. Justin outed me. He put it on swag. Our. Our. Our written part of the garden, and it's pretty compelling and fun. And so the cat's out the bag. This is what we're doing. We're gonna go after it. We got theologians and philosophers and historians helping us, trying to be as accurate as we can, but it's also a little bit of fun. We're not taking it too seriously, because if Noah's going to tell you about his boat and what happened, it's going to be kind of wild. But I'm hoping for our kids, their kids, it's going to be a gift that you don't have to turn your brain off. It's going to be intellectually informed, but it's going to be a way to go, oh, wow. Maybe. So this is the big picture of the book, how it pertains and reveals the majesty and beauty of insufficiency of Jesus. So that's. That's my life's work. That's where I'm headed. Pray for us. We're. I just signed a deal with Netflix. We're going to do a Story of God podcast for Netflix. So we're going to start having incredible people like you on. So we're going to reverse this role. And. Because I just want people to know the story of God is. Is the story, and it's awesome. And we're all damaged or broken and hurting, but we're loved and forgiven and. And let's just go for it. So I. I just. I. I think you don't know the half of what I think about you and believe in you and love you and admire you, and there are so many things I could very specifically say, but thank you for. For all of it. Thank you for the dad you are, the husband you are, the artist you are. Thank you for not settling for what is convenient or in some cases, more lucrative. Thank you for only settling for what is God's plan for your life, and I've. I've loved it, man.
- [67:27]
Lecrae
Man. Vice versa, bro. You are. You are a phenomenal translator.
- [67:32]
Judah Smith
Thank you.
- [67:32]
Lecrae
I think that. And that is to. For me, one of the highest compliments I can give, because that. That means the world. Translation means the world to me, especially as somebody who was unchurched and walked into a church and a woman asked me, was I saved? And I was like, what the hell? I don't even know what that means. What does that even mean? And so, man, you do such an amazing job of taking rich, deep, thoughtful things and making them so accessible for anybody. And that's a gift. A gift that will make you very misunderstood. And I just want to, man, be encouraged. Like, do not stop. Do not stop. You know what I mean? Do not stop. I'll be praying for you, and I'll be supporting you. I'll be cheering you on, man. I'll be, you know, anything I can do, you know, let me know, bro.
- [68:16]
Judah Smith
You know, I got an album coming out.
- [68:20]
Lecrae
Definitely not doing that.
- [68:21]
Judah Smith
Oh, okay.
- [68:22]
Lecrae
Yeah.
- [68:22]
Ashley
All right.
- [68:23]
Lecrae
Anything else I got?
- [68:27]
Judah Smith
That's it right there was good. That was my favorite part, baby. Nope, nope, nope. Not doing that.
- [68:33]
Lecrae
Nah, man. I love you, bro. Thank you, man.
- [68:35]
Judah Smith
Thank you for this.
- [68:36]
Lecrae
Yeah.