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Daniel, previously the editor-at-large at The American Conservative, is currently the editor of Modern Age, a conservative academic quarterly journal. He’s also a Distinguished Fellow in Conservative Thought at the Heritage Foundation and a columnist for The Spectator — and one of the few Trump supporters allowed to write op-eds for the NYT. I wanted to engage the most intelligent defense of Trump I could find. And Dan did not disappoint. But you be the judge.

For two clips of the episode — on Trump as a corrective to the liberal establishment, and questioning how revolutionary the American Revolution really was — head to our YouTube page.

Other topics: born into a Navy family in Missouri; going to UK grammar school in the Thatcher years; George III; Locke and self-government; the French Revolution and Jefferson; Washington and US neutrality; Jackson and populism; the Spanish-American War; Burke and Oakeshott; paleoconservatism and Pat Buchanan; the rise of China’s economy; the managerial elite; mass migration; multiculturalism; Obama the deporter-in-chief; nuke proliferation and the JCPOA; Trump as disruptor; Hazony’s The Virtue of Nationalism; January 6; Biden betraying his moderation; the woke youth vs weak liberals; lawfare against Trump; shutting down the border; ICE in Minneapolis; evangelical fervor over Israel; the antisemite card; the Iran War; ethnic cleansing in Palestine; Ukraine’s drones; NATO finally stepping up; the Trump cult and AWOL Congress; caving to China over rare earths; Bezos and the WaPo; the ballroom; crime down in DC and better parks; and Trump purging dissenters.

Browse the Dishcast archive for an episode you might enjoy. Coming up: Tiffany Jenkins on privacy in a liberal democracy, John Gray on Trump’s new world, Bob Wright on the evolutionary force of AI, Stephen Grosz on the struggles of love, David Thomson on cinema history, James Verini on Ukraine, John O’Sullivan on Hungary, and Robby George on all our disagreements. Please send any guest recs, dissents, and other comments to dish@andrewsullivan.com.