I Can’t Stop Obsessing Over My Husband’s Ex

Summary

The Dr. John Delony Show

Episode: I Can’t Stop Obsessing Over My Husband’s Ex
Date: May 27, 2026
Host: Dr. John Delony (Ramsey Network)

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Episode Overview

This energetic, candid episode centers around three compelling listener calls, each addressing personal and relational struggles: obsessive thoughts about a spouse’s ex, discomfort with marital intimacy, and navigating tricky parenting boundaries around sleepovers. Dr. John Delony brings empathy, humor, and direct advice to each caller, breaking down the emotional and psychological roots of their concerns. The episode especially highlights struggles with self-worth, comparison, managing intrusive thoughts, and the complexity of modern parenting.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Obsessing Over a Husband’s Ex-Wife

(Starts ~02:00, Main Discussion 02:00–19:30)

• Caller context:

  • “Olivia,” recently married (1.5 years; together 4 years), struggles with obsessive thoughts about her husband’s ex-wife despite no ongoing contact, no kids with the ex, and a trusting relationship.
  • Olivia compares herself constantly, fears the ex’s return, and wonders why these thoughts persist.

• Root exploration:

  • Dr. Delony helps Olivia examine her patterns of comparison, low self-worth, and history of unhealthy relationships (“I just maybe have never felt like I deserved somebody as good as him.” [07:48]).
  • He links her insecurity back to childhood experiences—being a twin and feeling less valued than her more athletic sister, despite generally supportive parents.
  • Her previous partners were unfaithful or abusive, which deepened her sense of unworthiness and vigilance.

• Notable moment & direct challenge:

  • Dr. Delony asks Olivia to verbalize her self-doubt:
    “I want you to say it out loud and take her off the table for a minute. Where do you think you're letting him down?” [07:32]

• Tools & Homework:

  • Practice rejecting negative mental comparisons and actively replace them with positive, accurate stories about herself:
    “Every time that woman pops in your head and you start up a story, you say out loud, no, not doing it. And I can do that and immediately replace it with a positive story about you that's true.” [13:25]
  • Quirky visualization exercise suggested by therapist Terry Real:
    “Print off a picture of her from Facebook and put it in a frame… every time you start to feel anxious, pull out that picture… and say, you know what? I'm going to ruin tonight for you. I'm going to invite you into our house to ruin tonight for us. It’ll stop it almost immediately.” [14:11–15:11]
  • Recognize her body’s anxiety as self-protective, not silly or broken:
    “Your body's not being silly. It's not broken. It's just trying to protect you because it's been on this road before.” [16:58]
  • The importance of embodying self-worth through small, repeated choices over time.

• Memorable Quotes:

  • “You're not crazy.” (Dr. Delony, [02:48])
  • “This guy that you love, he picked you.” (Dr. Delony, [12:08])
  • “There’s not a thing he can do to prove it to you.” (Dr. Delony, [12:37])
  • “I'm not going to carry old baggage, and I'm not going to go sift through the dumpster of his old baggage and try to find new things to carry into our future.” (Dr. Delony, [19:04])
  • “All this is doing is dragging down the building project that is our marriage moving forward.” (Dr. Delony, [18:38])

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2. Discomfort with Marital Intimacy

(Starts ~21:15, Main Discussion 21:15–37:00)

• Caller context:

  • “Crystal,” is uncomfortable with her husband seeing her naked—a change from earlier in their marriage. She’s seeking perspective on why this shift occurred.
  • Relationship dynamics include feeling invalidated, “triangulated” with his sister, experiences of gaslighting, and a lack of emotional acknowledgment. Husband has admitted to certain negative behaviors, including addiction issues and a pornography problem.

• Root exploration:

  • Dr. Delony explores whether Crystal feels emotionally or physically unsafe, or if personal insecurities (body image, aging, perimenopause) are at play.
  • He encourages identifying what her body is trying to protect her from when the discomfort arises:
    “When you feel insecure about him seeing you, what's your body trying to protect you from in that moment?” [29:29]
  • He highlights the role of “triggers” not as threats to avoid, but as doorways to healing and self-exploration:
    “A trigger is a doorway. It's not something to be avoided. A trigger just says your body is overwhelmed with something and it's a path to healing.” [32:42]

• Actionable advice:

  • Write down personal triggers and bodily responses for exploration with a therapist:
    “Write out three or four of your triggers... My body responds in shutdown, fight or flight when these things happen. And I want to explore why, because I want to be able to stand firm in my own skin.” [37:05]
  • Normalize seeking therapy (BetterHelp offered to Crystal)
  • Discern between stories she might be telling herself vs. legitimate concerns about safety.

• Memorable Quotes:

  • “He may be a total scumbag jerk… your body is sounding every alarm you got.” (Dr. Delony, [36:10])
  • “If your body gets triggered at the thought or the experience of … standing in front of your husband naked, that is a path for exploration.” (Dr. Delony, [36:44])
  • “I want to be rooted in my own skin, in my own body, so that my body doesn't take off and try to fight for me. And I don't know why.” (Dr. Delony, [37:05])

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3. Parenting, Boundaries, and Sleepovers

(Starts ~39:11, Main Discussion 39:11–52:38)

• Caller context:

  • “K” moved with family to Boise, leaving behind a familiar community. Struggling to explain to her 10-year-old daughter why sleepovers aren’t allowed with new friends, despite peer pressure and disappointment.

• Dr. Delony’s stance:

  • Sleepovers aren't inherently safe; boundaries are a parent’s job:
    “Some of the craziest nights of my life were sleepovers.” (Dr. Delony, [41:39]) “Parents get to decide what is safe for them.” (Dr. Delony, [43:15])
  • Normalize the child’s anger and sadness and emphasize unconditional love/adult responsibility:
    “I cannot expect my daughter to understand things. She's 10… What I can offer her is I know you're sad and I know you're disappointed… And I can handle you being mad at me and not liking me. That won't change how much I love you.” (Dr. Delony, [42:14–42:39])

• Parenting advice:

  • Stand firm in boundaries, weathering the emotional storm of a child’s disappointment.
  • Offer alternatives (friend over until late, special time with parents) and give the child choices to foster autonomy:
    “Can I invite those friends over to my house and just let them have a wild time?... I'm going to give opportunities for ownership on little things for a 10 year old so they can begin to feel the ground underneath their feet.” (Dr. Delony, [50:30–52:10])

• Notable teaching reference:

  • “Being liked is not the measure of a good parent. Being sturdy… is the measure. Can I stand firm and let you know, despite your big feelings, I'm always going to be right here and I’m gonna do my one job and that's to keep you safe.” (Dr. Delony, [47:36–47:48], referencing Becky Kennedy)

• Memorable Quotes:

  • “You're a good mom. You're setting boundaries for your kid. You're a good mom. You're keeping your kids safe.” (Dr. Delony, [47:20])
  • “Being liked is not the measure of a good parent.” (Dr. Delony, [47:30])
  • “It's the worst thing. It's the best worst thing ever.” (Dr. Delony, on parenting, [47:21–47:25])

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Notable Quotes & Moments (Chronological Reference with Timestamps)

• Dr. Delony to Olivia:

  • “There's no reason to have any continued contact at all. None.” [05:23]
  • “What is it about you that you don't think measures up?” [07:25]
  • “Your body's just trying to protect you because it's been on this road before.” [16:45–16:58]

• Dr. Delony to Crystal:

  • “A trigger is a doorway. It's not something to be avoided… it's a path to healing.” [32:42]
  • “If your body gets triggered… that's a path for exploration.” [36:44]

• Dr. Delony on parenting:

  • “You can hurt my feelings, but I get to choose how I respond.” [46:41]
  • “Being liked is not the measure of a good parent. Being sturdy… is the measure.” [47:30]
  • “Can I put my stupid phone down or forgo the episode I wanted to watch and we go do something?” [50:05]

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Important Segment Timestamps

• Obsessing over husband’s ex: 02:00–19:30
• Discomfort with intimacy: 21:15–37:00
• Parenting, sleepovers: 39:11–52:38

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Tone, Language, & Style

The show maintains Dr. Delony’s signature mix of humor, real talk, and heartfelt encouragement. He’s direct, sometimes playfully irreverent (“You can tell him if you ever text her again, I'm going to kill you in your sleep. Right?” [18:30]), and compassionately challenges callers’ assumptions and stories. He references clinical concepts in approachable language and repeatedly affirms the courage and significance of the callers’ struggles.

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Summary Takeaways

• Obsessive comparisons and intrusive relationship anxiety have deeper roots—usually in self-worth and attachment wounds.
• Our bodies and minds are often trying to protect us, not sabotage us, even when their methods (rumination, withdrawal, shut-down) are unhelpful.
• Healing is a long-term, practice-based endeavor: repeated, conscious choices to redirect thoughts and be compassionate to oneself.
• Parenting requires sturdy boundaries, not fear of a child’s disapproval—and meeting disappointment with empathy and creative connection.
• Therapy and neutral, supportive conversations are vital for navigating triggers and transforming old patterns.

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For listeners seeking concrete tools, normalcy in their struggles, and direct, compassionate coaching—this episode delivers.

Transcript

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Foreign.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

This is an ad for better help. If you've ever said, I'm not in a crisis, I don't need therapy, I want you to reconsider. The time to take care of your mental health is before things fall apart. Talking to someone can help. Get [e-mail] deloney and save 10%.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

I cannot stop obsessing about my husband's ex wife. I am just constantly thinking about what their relationship was, comparing myself to her, worried about whether she's gonna come back

[Dr. John DeLoney]

around and do they still communicate? Are they still talking? Well,

[John (Host)]

What up?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What up?

[John (Host)]

This is John with the Dr. John DeLoney Show. Thanks for joining us.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Talking about your mental health and your emotional health and your kids and your marriage, everything you got going on in your life. Pull up a seat and we'll figure

[John (Host)]

out what's the next right move you

[Dr. John DeLoney]

want to be on this show? I'd love to have you click the link in the show notes. And if you don't know what show notes are, sin Kelly a letter via mail.

[John (Host)]

I will leave her address at the end of the show. Her personal home address, preferably.

[Emily (Producer/Assistant)]

Maybe, like, smoke signals. Carrier pigeon.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Nope.

[John (Host)]

Letter.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

She. Actually, I heard you bought the unit

[John (Host)]

in the trailer park next to you, which is awesome. Now you have, like, an extra like lot, which is cool.

[Emily (Producer/Assistant)]

Yeah, it's for, like, a office space.

[John (Host)]

Just an outdoor office space under a tarp. You keep working hard, Keller, you're going to get there.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm.

[John (Host)]

I'm proud of you.

[Emily (Producer/Assistant)]

Well, if you keep working hard, I have a better chance of getting this.

[John (Host)]

That's.

[Emily (Producer/Assistant)]

That's.

[John (Host)]

That's probably fair. And on that front, not looking great. Not looking great. We are slowly ticking back down to our original 17 listeners and. All right, let's go to Salt Lake City and talk to Olivia. Hey, Olivia.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What's up?

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Hey.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

How's it going?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Doing all right. How are you?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

I'm good. I'm good.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So what's going on?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah, I was just calling because I, for some reason, cannot stop obsessing about my ex husband, my husband's ex wife, and their relationship.

[John (Host)]

Tell me about it.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

I am just constantly thinking about what their relationship was like and her and, you know, comparing myself to her, worried about whether she's going to come back around and all of that. So it's. It's kind of embarrassing.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But listen, set that stuff down.

[John (Host)]

None of this is embarrassing. None of it. Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You're good.

[John (Host)]

You're not crazy.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

How long have you been married?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

So we got married a year and A half ago or almost two years ago.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

We've been together for four years altogether.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Does your husband and his ex have kids together?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

No. Part of the reason why I feel so crazy, you know, like, I don't even.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Do they still communicate? Are they still talking?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Well, they aren't anymore. When we first started dating, they were friends. He told me, and I thought, that's okay. You know, nowadays people have.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

No, not okay. Keep going, Keep going.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Oh. You know, and then I got a little insecure when we were having our first Christmas together and I snooped on his phone and. And I found a text message exchange from them where he said that he was getting her a Christmas present. And he said they exchanged I love yous. And so that was obviously shocking and was kind of our big first fight and we resolved it, but I feel like ever since then, I've just kind of been nervous that she's going to come back around and cause problems.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah. So they got divorced six years ago.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Something tells me you're quick to look in the mirror and blame yourself for things in your life. Am I right on that?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Probably. Okay. Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Would you classify yourself as a people pleaser? You don't like it when people are mad at you. You don't like it when people don't like you.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

For sure. Yeah, absolutely.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So anytime I'm talking to somebody who struggles with people pleasing, I want to always hit the other side of the scale just to see if there's anything there.

[John (Host)]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so if your husband of two years and your romantic partner of almost six years is still talking with his ex wife that he has no kids with, there's no reason to continue this relationship. They got divorced and then he said

[John (Host)]

with to you till death do us part, Right?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

There's no reason to have any continued contact at all. None.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so you're not crazy. I want you to test your gut

[John (Host)]

with me, your gut feeling.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Does he hide things from you?

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

No.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Does he flip his phone over when you walk in? Does he delete things? Are y' all aligned, like, on money? Are you aligned on, like, your future together?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah. That's the thing is, like, our relationship's great.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

We.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

He never hides anything. He tells me all the time, like, you're welcome to look at my phone. He hasn't changed his passcode or anything. I have all of his passwords to everything. Like, financially we're aligned. That's why it's so ridiculous to me that I'm still so obsessed about it because, like, there's no Proof, you know, it's just my. My mind can't stop. I don't know.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Have you struggled with anxiety in the past?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

No, not really. I mean, there's moments in my life where I have something big going on where I have a little anxiety about it.

[John (Host)]

Of course. That's good. That's healthy, right?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah, that's good for us. I feel like part of. The. Part of the problem is that I knew her before. I knew both of them before they got married. And so that's kind of part of the comparison is like, I wish I didn't know her at all and it wasn't, you know, the thing.

[John (Host)]

Sure,

[Dr. John DeLoney]

this may be a dangerous track to take, but give me some places that the stories you've told you tell yourself, right? Give me some places where you don't believe you measure up to her. Oh, I'll get really crass and direct. Is she prettier than you? Do you think?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah, she's more successful. I feel like maybe they had a better sex life. Maybe. You know, I'm like always asking him questions, like, did you guys ever go here? Did you. You know, I'm asking him like, specific questions about their sex, and it's just too much, you know, like. Yeah. I mean, everything.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What is it about you that you don't think measures up?

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

I don't know.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I mean, you know, like, you know, because it haunts you. I want to get it out of your body, and I wanted to. I want you to say it out loud and take her off the table for a minute. Where do you think you're letting him down?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

I. I just maybe have never felt like I deserved somebody as good as him. And so every. I feel like I'm feeling him in every way.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So who taught you that you weren't worthy of guys like him?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Well, I don't know if I've thought about this before. I don't know if I've been taught it or just. I don't know. I feel like my parents did a great job of raising us, but I have had a terrible ex husband and a terrible baby daddy. And all my exes were not great. So now I finally hit the jackpot, you know, and that's.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Tell me. Tell me what not great means. Tell me what not great means. Did they cheat on you?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah, my. The father of my son cheated on me when I was pregnant. And then my ex husband was an alcoholic. It was borderline domestic abuse situation. And then other guys that I dated were just not good enough. Yeah, they treated me okay. But just how did your.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

How did your mom celebrate you as a kid? Like, when did. When did she look at you and

[John (Host)]

say, my God, I'm glad you're my daughter?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

I feel like they did a good job of praising us, but I'm a twin, and I feel like I was always being compared to my twin sister. And she. We really didn't have much growing up, and she was better at sports, and that was what they focused on because they knew they couldn't afford to send us to college without sports scholarships. And so she got. My sister got a lot of the attention, and I just kind of got put on the back burner.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. How'd your dad tell you that he was so grateful that he got you as his daughter?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Oh, he was amazing. He always praised us and told us how.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I didn't say us. I didn't say y'.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

All.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I said you.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah. I don't remember specifics, but I feel like he did a good job.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, so. Let me say this. Your parents probably did the best job they could.

[John (Host)]

A great job.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[John (Host)]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And as an adult, how old are you?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

32.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. They don't need you to defend them anymore.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. The. Your husband sounds pretty amazing. Like, he's a great guy and he's not perfect.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so you're creating these pictures of these other people that aren't real, and you're burying some truths about them, like, just in it. Just. Just go with me on the track. You just painted me.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

From. From a little girl. You had a twin sister who looked just like you, who slept in the same room as you, but she was faster. And you knew then. Oh, there's a hierarchy here.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And then you meet men who treated you like crap. And as a people pleaser, you did everything you could to try to love them the way they wanted to be loved. And they still drank, they still cheated on you, they still scared you to death for your physical safety. Then you met a new guy, you married him, and you're looking at old Facebook photos of his ex, and you're lining up next to her like you're next to your twin sister again, watching her get the snow cone after the big soccer game.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah, exactly.

[John (Host)]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so what I'm trying to do is I want you to solve for reality here. The reality is these folks were. Were good. They weren't the best ever of all time. Perfect. And you're not perfect either. But this guy that you love, he picked you.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And did he not untangle himself from his Ex. The way I would have hoped he would. Yeah. Of course. Right. Early on in my marriage, I was guilty of that, too. I was still friends with all my old exes.

[John (Host)]

Right.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I didn't, I mean, I was an idiot. Right. So the challenge you have before you is twofold. Number one, you have to decide that you're worth this guy's love. There's not a thing he can do

[John (Host)]

to prove it to you.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Right. And you have to prove. You have to decide I was not worth what those other men did to me.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And the, the, the hard part is this is not an intellectual exercise as much as it's a spiritual exercise and a body exercise. I got to do different things. Okay. And that leads to number two. If you will make a concerted effort. And you're going to hate that I'm saying this over the next year or two to. Every time that woman pops in your head and you start up a story, you say out loud, no, not doing it.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And I can do that and immediately replace it with a positive story about you that's true. Not one that you've made up. Right. Because maybe she's a size 2 and you're a size 8. So you're not going to say I'm thin and be like, maybe, I don't know, maybe. But you're going to make up a story. I mean, you're going to tell yourself a story that's true.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah. Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And we're going to let our default setting over the next year shift to, I'm worth being in this house. I'm worth being this guy. This guy picked me, and I picked him. And here's another exercise you can do. I don't know if it would, if, if it's too soon for you right now, but I think it would be worthy of trying to.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Okay.

[John (Host)]

You're gonna think I'm nuts.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Print off a picture of her from

[John (Host)]

Facebook and put it in a frame.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And. Or put it in your back pocket.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And every time y' all are about to go on a date, every time you're waiting for him to come home, every time you think, oh, tonight he's gonna get lucky. I'm gonna get lucky.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And you start to feel anxious, I want you to pull out that picture and look at it and say, you know what? I'm going to ruin tonight for you.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm going to invite you into our

[John (Host)]

house to ruin tonight for us. It's an exercise I, I, I picked

[Dr. John DeLoney]

up from Terry Real who.

[John (Host)]

When somebody's mother is over invasive. Right. And they're always lecturing.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

He said, take a picture of your mom. And right before you're about to yell at your wife, pull that picture out

[John (Host)]

and say, mom, I'm gonna. I'm gonna berate my wife for you. This one's for you. And it'll stop it almost immediately.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But here's what I want you to

[John (Host)]

wrap your head around.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You can practice taking control of not the feeling and not the.

[John (Host)]

The lightning bolt. Because you have lightning bolts of them in bed together.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[John (Host)]

Right. You can't stop that lightning bolt that happens.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What you can stop is going down

[John (Host)]

the rabbit hole to fantasy, replaying an imaginary movie in your mind. You can choose to not focus on that.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And over time, those lightning bolts will

[John (Host)]

get less and less and less.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Okay.

[John (Host)]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So you don't have to watch the movie when you see the commercial.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You know what I'm saying? And this is.

[John (Host)]

It's going to take practice, and it's

[Dr. John DeLoney]

going to take work.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Have you gained anything insightful by being extra inquisitive about your husband's sex life with his ex?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

No. Absolutely not.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, then it's like me picking up a. Like a calculus four textbook, me reading. That will do me no good, right?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So decide. No, it's not silly. It's. It's protective.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Right.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Because you still blame yourself for some of the things that happen with your exes, and it's madness.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That's the silly part. But your body's trying to protect you from that ever happening again. So what do I got to do? What do I got to do? What positions do I got to be? What size do I have to be? Do I look good enough to make good enough money? Like, your body's just trying to protect you.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so your body's not being silly. It's not broken. It's just trying to protect you because it's been on this road before.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And you have to teach your body through action

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

that it's safe.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm driving now. I'm. I'm okay.

[John (Host)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I wasn't safe then. I'm safe now.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Okay, Makes sense.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Does your husband want to dig into your sexual history?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

No. Okay, he can, but we're very open about stuff. But, yeah, he's not. It's not reciprocated, usually.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Probably because he's like, yeah, I'm good.

[John (Host)]

I mean, what good is that going

[Dr. John DeLoney]

to do us moving forward?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah, exactly. And I asked him the other day, like, do you ever think about my exes. And he's like, no, of course not.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

By the way. He does. And, I mean, he does, but the same extent, but. But my guess is the lightning bolt

[John (Host)]

pops in and he's like, yeah. Nope.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Right?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And. And, yeah. But it comes down to a choice of this woman doesn't get a seat at my table.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[John (Host)]

In my home with my new husband.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Right. Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And I want you to stop going to war with your body. It's just trying to protect you. It's been. Do. It's been fighting this fight your whole life.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[John (Host)]

It's just trying to help out.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

The more you fight your body, the more it's going to be like, she's. She doesn't get it. Sound the alarms louder. Right. But by giving your body a seat

[John (Host)]

at the table, being like, ah, I got you. You're trying to protect me. I'm good. I love him and he loves me.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Yeah.

[John (Host)]

He picked me and I picked him.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And you can tell him if you ever text her again, I'm going to

[John (Host)]

kill you in your sleep. Right?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Oh, he knows.

[John (Host)]

Awesome.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So, yeah, I think you're. I'm trying to put myself in your seat. I think I would be anxious, too. I think I'd be uncomfortable, too. I think I want to know, do I measure up to. I mean, I think I would be in the exact same spot a year and a half or two and a half years in. And I have to. I would have to look in the mirror and say, all this is doing is dragging down the building project that is our marriage moving forward. And I'm not going to carry old baggage, and I'm not going to go sift through the dumpster of his old baggage and try to find new things to carry into our future.

[John (Host)]

I'm not going to do that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And it just takes intentionality and practice and taking capture of your thoughts. And if you need to print out a picture of her and be like, you know what? I'm inviting you to destroy our evening. You'll.

[John (Host)]

You'll crumple the paper up and throw it away. I mean, you'll be like, you don't get a seat here. This is my house. This is our house, and you're not welcome.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's just gonna take some practice. Thank you so much for the call.

[John (Host)]

It was a brave call that you made, and I'm really glad that you were here.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

We come back, a woman asks how to figure out why she doesn't want

[John (Host)]

her husband to see her naked. We'll be right back. This Weekend is awesome because I spent

[Dr. John DeLoney]

time outside, I spent time in the kitchen cooking stuff with my family. And all across the board, we were using Montana Knife Company Knives. In fact, I got a new shipment of Montana Knife Company knives to my house this weekend. Many of them are gifts, but a

[John (Host)]

couple of them are for me and my family.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I love Montana Knife Company Knives. My wife loves them, and even my kids who are getting more involved in the kitchen, they love them, too. Why? Because Montana Knife Company Knives are the best. Montana Knife Company just built this new facility in Montana, and they manufacture everything

[John (Host)]

inhouse made in the usa.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

When you pick up one of their knives, you will immediately understand. If you're looking for something that's just going to sit on a shelf, Montana Knife Company Knives are not for you. But if you want a knife that you're going to reach for every day, whether you're outside on the ranch, hunting or fishing, or doing some cooking in the house, and. And if you're looking for a knife you can pass on someday to your grandkids, check out Montana Knife Company knives right now. Go to montanaknifecompany.com and see what's in stock. That's montanaknifecompaly.com. all right, Grand Rapids, Michigan.

[John (Host)]

Let's talk to Crystal with a K. What's up, Crystal?

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Yo. How's it going, dude?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

We are rocking on to the break of dawn. How about you?

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Oh, about the same.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Excellent for the weather to warm up, so.

[John (Host)]

Yeah, it's a thousand degrees in Nashville, so.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Actually it was nice today.

[John (Host)]

It was hot yesterday, but doing great.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Pretty jealous.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So what's up?

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Well, I'm. I wrote in because I have an issue that I have not heard you talk about before. And I am uncomfortable and I don't want my husband to see me naked.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

I've been trying to figure out why because it wasn't always this way. And I. I think I need a different perspective.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Well, I'm glad you're here.

[John (Host)]

So.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So tell me more about it.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

It's really difficult.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

I don't want to, like, talk too bad about him, but it's. It's been rough.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Just tell me the truth. That's it.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

He sucks in a lot of ways.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

All right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Tell me about that.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Well, I've been triangulated against. With his sister. I was. During some of our not getting along times, I was told I'm not a part of his family. He's hoping that we would move back to that. And that was jaw dropping because I. I assumed I was.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Who told you you weren't part of the family?

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

He did.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[John (Host)]

Why'd he tell you that?

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

He wasn't happy with, I guess, where our relationship was at the moment.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You're married. I know you're a part of his family.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

I've never been gaslit before until I met him.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, hold on. You're using so many counselory Internet words.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

I'm sorry.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Triangulation and Gaslight and NPD. Like, just talk to me like I'm. I'm 14.

[John (Host)]

Like, what?

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

He doesn't listen to me. I'll be talking, and he won't hear anything I say. He doesn't take things that I say as, like, knowledge. For example, we were planting seeds, and I've had many successful gardens, and I was just giving him some insight about the peppers and when to start. Him. I. I honestly don't think he was listening to me at all. Because then about a week later, he watched some YouTube videos, and he started basically reciting the exact same information I told him, but it came from somebody else. I have asked him about that, and he said that, yeah, he does do that.

[John (Host)]

Okay.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

And he's trying to not to. Just like, I asked him this one. I think there's so many. So I guess one of the things was we were working on trying to get back together and just talking about our marriage, and I just. You know, things like socks on the floor. He's not overly messy, but they don't really bother me that much because I know he works hard. And I said something to that effect. I said, I. It doesn't bother me. You know, that's fine. I said, I'm pretty easy to please. And his comment was, no, you're not, because I can't seem to do anything right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, okay, let me stop right there.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You've told me several things that would validate what he said.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so if you're being honest just with yourself, like, if I'm sitting here holding up a mirror, are you hard to please? That doesn't make you a bad person.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

No.

[John (Host)]

So why.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Why would he say that other than he's just a complete jerk and he's trying to rub your nose in it?

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

That's exactly why. Because he does a game. And I have. I called him out recently on this. I got triggered by something he said about my daughter's boyfriend. And I got up and I just said, I feel like I'm in a really hard place here. I'm gonna go take a little drive and take the recycling bag. So he got up and he said, no. He got all mad. He's very. And he's like, I'll leave. I'll leave. And I said, listen, I'm gonna leave. I need a few minutes. So I did, and I came back and I just. I just called him out on it. I asked him, I said, did you do that because you wanted me to beg you to stay? So that. And we're flipping it around and I'm chasing you now because this has been a pattern for many years. And he said, yeah. So I know he's trying to, but I don't know, it's tough. I don't get any recognition for things. And I think the most recent one is we just took a trip to Florida. And I don't know, I'm 45, I am in perimenopause. I've gained some weight. I know I still look good, but I was complimenting someone else's proportions. And I'm like, you know that she looks good, and I wish I had that, and I had nothing. So anytime I ever talk about things that are below surface level, which I try not to do very much because he's never responsive, but I'm trying so hard to open up and feel comfortable in that area again. And he said nothing. So I asked him about it this morning, and he's like, I just didn't know what to say. But, but, but as a.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

As a guy who's married to a woman in perimenopause,

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

I'm sure you get what I'm saying.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Like, here's. Here's a couple of things. Number one, I trust you that he's

[John (Host)]

a jerk to you.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah, thanks.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And I also want to challenge you. Like, mind reading is not real. And you telling him, hey, when I say this, I. I want you to say this. That doesn't make it any less sexy. That doesn't make it any less loving. It gives him a clear path for how he can love you.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

I have done that many times.

[John (Host)]

Okay?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And if he chooses not to take that path, right, then you can tell him, hey, the story I'm choosing to make up is I gave you a path, and you don't want to take it because you want to hurt me. And that makes me feel small, and that makes me feel sad. But you instantly make up a story as to why he didn't do what, right? What you think. You were very clear in telling him. By the way, Stan Tacton is one

[John (Host)]

of the godfathers of relational research, and

[Dr. John DeLoney]

he says two things are True people think they're great communicators and most people are terrible communicators.

[John (Host)]

And it's like, oh, that's, that's helpful, right? And so if I know going in,

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I think I'm being. Here's a good example. I was in a, I'm in the

[John (Host)]

final edits of a book I'm writing and the, the guy who's over publishing

[Dr. John DeLoney]

it was pretty funny. He had, he had a big paragraph

[John (Host)]

and he had highlighted a big chunk of it.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And he said, I know that, you know, you think you are clear here.

[John (Host)]

You were very not.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And I was like, what are you talking about? That the pathological socialization of young boys is super clear.

[John (Host)]

And he started laughing. He goes, not to me it's not.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

All right? So in all to say is if I know I'm think I'm being a good communicator, but I'm probably struggling with it, then it's going to give me some compassion and I'm not going to be afraid to go again. Right? Over and over again. All that to say is, here's what I'm hearing and I'm trying to say this as compassion as I can. I want to be on your side here, okay. Because you, you, you, you came in. I feel like you're chasing a feeling that should come from the inside out and you are desperately wanting it to come from the outside in.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And every time, I, I bet he's not the only relationship where you've got challenges. Is that fair? Or tell me I'm wrong.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

You're wrong.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. He's the only one.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. So for whatever reason, it's, it's gotten sideways. The, the fact that you used to like him to see you naked and now you don't. I would listen to your body and ask, do I not feel safe with him anymore? Does he not say the things I wish he said? Or is. Am I suddenly feeling less than because I'm in perimenopause and I've gained some weight and I know I still look good, but now the, the old stories are starting to spin up in my head again. It's like get, ask yourself, when you feel insecure about him seeing you, what's your body trying to protect you from in that moment?

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Right. I did write down how it makes me feel.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Let's get past, let's get past the feeling for just for a second. That's important data. But I want you to. This is a more clinical question or a more fact finding question. What is Your body trying to protect you from. Like, the feeling is your body's attempt to protect you. What is that feeling protecting you from?

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

I'm afraid it's from getting hurt, because I definitely know. I've thrown up other walls with him lately, too, and I have told him that in.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What is the hurt you're afraid of experiencing?

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

I'm not really sure. I mean, it's tough because I've been left before, so I don't even think it's that. I think it might just be he has a little bit of a porn problem, which we've discussed, and I've thought maybe that has something to do with it, which it might. Okay, there's a lot. So that's the part I've been. I've been spending a lot of time trying to figure this out.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But he's got a pornography problem, which may. And this is always shocking to wives, May or may not be about you at all.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

I don't think it's about me. He has a lot of other addictions too.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, so it could be that your body is saying, hey, this guy's not safe for 500 different reasons.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It could be. I am letting stories creep into my mind that I don't like. And by the way, pornography, like, devastates relationships. I hear it all the time. Okay, I know that. But own the stories about the pornography that you're telling yourself. You get what I'm saying?

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

I think so. I tried to read Dopamine Nation, but I definitely got triggered. And then I got mad and decided, I'm done trying to.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, hold on, hold on.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

About him, but hold on.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But you're finding out about yourself, self. A trigger is a doorway. It's not something to be avoided. A trigger just says your body is overwhelmed with something and it's a path to healing. Very few of us can go deal with, quote, unquote, triggers on our own. We got to go see a counselor. We got to go talk to a professional, myself included. But if you keep avoiding triggers. Here's the. Here's the damning part about that. Your body gets what it wants, which is to avoid that thing, and it reinforces the trigger and makes it more volatile and louder. And so if I feel triggered when

[John (Host)]

somebody says something that's offensive? The work is a,

[Dr. John DeLoney]

what is it about that person's words that just sent my body into a total panic and felt like, I need to protect myself? I don't want to give that guy that kind of power over my body. And then, B, maybe I Don't want to hang out with that guy anymore. My rule of thumb for folks that I work with and for myself is I get two triggers. I get to be triggered twice on a thing. The first one catches me way off guard. The second one confirms it. And then I'm going to go on an exploration. What is it about this thing that, quote, unquote, is triggering me? Otherwise, your. Your world will get smaller and smaller and smaller because your body will think it's keeping you safer and safer and safer you get. What does that. Is what I'm saying make sense?

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Oh, yeah, 100%.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so when I have something that triggers me, I literally write it down. And. And of course, I got 10 years

[John (Host)]

ahead of you on this deal, but

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm like, all right, game on. What is so scary about that thing that my body just reacted as though somebody ran through the front door with

[John (Host)]

a hatchet coming right at me?

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Yeah, it's.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It. It triggers a doorway.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Okay, so I'll probably have to go talk to somebody. Since I can't seem to figure it out myself.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I.

[John (Host)]

It's exactly what I do. But.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But here's the thing. When I go talk to somebody, I say my body responds to this thing as though it's a life or death emergency. I need a neutral third party on here, and I need a path through it. I'm not going to go spend five sessions talking about the trigger over and

[John (Host)]

over and over and over again.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Get what I'm saying?

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

I do. That's a tall order.

[John (Host)]

It is.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

It is lacking of good therapists around here.

[John (Host)]

So I. I totally get that. Totally get that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And I'll. I'll connect you with my friends at Better Help for three months for free, and I'll. That'll be on us. And we'll get you hooked up here. Here. The bigger picture is I. I can't. I can't peel it all apart. It sounds like y' all just are in this big mess. And he may be a total scumbag jerk. He may be up in arms. It may be a mixture of both. Your body may be a hundred percent right. This guy is struggling with addictions of all kinds. This guy is a gaslighter. This guy is narcissistic. This guy is an ass. This. Like, I'm not safe here. And in your most vulnerable moment, standing before somebody with no clothes on, your body is sounding every alarm you got. Or it might be the stories are getting so loud about I'm not. My body's not what it used to Be he's probably going to leave me like the other guys did when I was 12. Somebody told me I looked. Didn't look good in this shirt. Like, who knows the. The combination? But if your body gets triggered at the thought or the experience of doing anything, in your case, standing in front of your husband naked, that is a. That's a path for exploration. What is it about this situation that my body shuts down? What is it about this situation that my body says, run, get out of here now. A homework assignment for you would be to write out three or four of your triggers. Three or four things that when somebody says it, when he does it, your

[John (Host)]

body's like, I gotta get out of

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

here

[Dr. John DeLoney]

and take those things. You can use my friends at BetterHelp. You can go find a counselor in your local area and say, my body responds in shutdown, fight or flight when these things happen. And I want to explore why, because I want to be able to stand firm in my own skin. That doesn't mean he ever has to see you naked again, doesn't mean he can ever talk negatively about you or your daughter again. But I want to be rooted in my own skin, in my own body, so that my body doesn't take off and try to fight for me. And I don't know why. Thank you so much for the call, sister. I'm glad you called. Hang on the line here. We'll get you hooked up. We come back, a woman asks how to talk to her daughter and explain why she can't attend sleepovers. When a family loses someone they depend on, the weight they carry is not only the grief of the loss, it's also the pressure of bills, the mortgage, groceries, putting gas in the car. The weight of the big decisions as the world outside keeps on spinning. And I know thinking about scary things like who's going to take care of your family if something ever happened to you is not fun. But there's 100% chance that you're going to die someday, so you've got to plan for it. And that's what term life insurance is. It's a clear plan for taking care of those who depend on you. And if the worst thing ever happens, I trust Xander Insurance. Xander makes buying term life simple. And because they're an independent broker, they work for you, not the insurance companies. They shop across top companies to find the right policy at a price that fits your life. By the way, I recommend getting coverage that's 10 to 12 times your income. So if something happens to you, your family can have Peace. Term life insurance is a way of saying I love you when you can no longer say it yourself. Go to xander.com or call 1-800-356-4282 to get term life insurance the right way. That's Xander with a z. Xander.com. all right, let's go out to Boise, Idaho, and talk to K. Hey, K. What's up?

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Hi. How are you?

[John (Host)]

I'm doing all right. Running a scam called a podcast. It's awesome. What are you doing?

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

It's a great podcast. I am waiting to be on your podcast, I guess.

[John (Host)]

Hey, you're here.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That's awesome.

[John (Host)]

Glad you're here.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What's up?

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Yeah, well, so we just moved to Boise from Nebraska. So our second cross country move in, like, I don't know less, I think six years. So. But in Nebraska, we had a great community, like, awesome community. And I. We were homeschooled in Nebraska, and I

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

think that's sort of important.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

So I knew a lot of the people that she knew, and she went for sleepovers with a few people that I had picked out. And I was, like, open to that idea because I knew their parents and knew their environments. But here, it's just different. They go to a charter school here and a lot, and we're not as plugged into our church yet, and we just haven't found, like, our people. You know what I mean?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yep.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

And so

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

this sleepover situation is different. Well, she has this friend that she goes to school with, and I like her parents. I've met. I've met her mom and her stepmom, and this is just, like, one situation. She's asked me a few times why she can't do this, but I don't really know these people. And so she's gone to stay late a couple of days. And that's just. She's not having it right. She just doesn't.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

How old is she?

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Why, it's.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

She's 10. So she doesn't get why it's different now than it used to be. And as much as I try and explain that to her, I just. I don't know how I'm not getting through to her. I'm not, like, angry about it. In her parent, she tells me that her friend's parents even have, like, the same rule. I have to know her parents for a year before you go over. So what I don't understand is how to explain to her and get her to, like, really hear me. I just want her to hear my heart. Like, I just want you I just want to know the situation you're in before I give somebody full access to you without traumatizing her. Because I don't need to tell her everything that can go wrong in the world. You know what I mean? Are sleepovers even a thing that people do anymore?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Oh, yeah. All the time. All the time.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Yeah. I don't think they're inherently unsafe. I think.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Oh, I do.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

They can be.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I do. Yeah.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Do you think sleepovers are inherently unsafe?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah. Some of the craziest nights of my life were sleepover.

[John (Host)]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Like, and. Yeah. Here's the deal. Here's again the universe. There's been a series of the last like month or two where callers are

[John (Host)]

dealing with something that I deal with in my house.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I have a 10 year old daughter.

[John (Host)]

We literally just had this conversation.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so I'm going to talk to you as a nerd, but also as

[John (Host)]

a guy who's dealing with this same thing.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Yeah.

[John (Host)]

I cannot expect my daughter to understand things.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

She's 10.

[John (Host)]

She's 10.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I can't expect her to hear me. She's 10. What I can offer her is I know you're sad and I know you're disappointed and I know you have huge feelings about this. And I can handle you being mad at me and not liking me. That won't change how much I love you.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

I actually said that to her.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That's it.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

And she gets angrier.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Good. Like she's 10. She's 10. She. And she's getting angry because she's not getting her way. She's getting angry because she's trying to make connections in a new place. She's a raw, exposed, untethered 10 year old. And I say untethered.

[John (Host)]

She's tethered to you guys, but she's

[Dr. John DeLoney]

untethered to friend, community.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

She wants to fit in. She wants to be like everybody else. That's every bit of that is normal. And it's a parent's job to keep her, keep them safe. And parents get to decide what is safe for them.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so you're, you're playing a. My daughter went to a public school. We moved her to a new school. We moved houses, we moved about 45 minutes away. We're in the same city, but 45 minutes away from the old house. And the school situation she's in now is unbelievable.

[John (Host)]

How awesome it is.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And for the first 18 months, all she talked about was, I can't wait till I move out so I can go back. And I know objectively in no way was that correct. But that was her feelings. And so I was able to say, yeah man, when you're 18, you're, you're

[John (Host)]

able to do a lot of stuff.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And now she would set the house on fire if I took her out of the school she's in now. Right. And so part of, part of being parent is just weathering these storms. It's uncomfortable and stinks. But letting your kid know I still

[John (Host)]

love you and I still like you.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm going to keep doing my job, which is to keep you safe. And, and by the way, it's going to happen next year when everybody gets a phone and she doesn't have one.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's gonna happen the year after that when everybody starts dating at 14 and

[John (Host)]

you say no or, and I'm just

[Dr. John DeLoney]

making stuff up here. Right. But this is going to be forever.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

You're not making stuff up.

[John (Host)]

Right.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's me forever. And so teaching her now, I can weather you not liking me. I can whether you're angry. Totally get that you're angry. Of course you want to go spend the night with your friends. It's awesome.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

I, I want to, I want her to have fun. And that's what I keep telling her. I'll let you can go and I'll pick you up at 10:30. Like I'll pick you up at 10:30, 11:00'. Clock. Like go spend all day with your friends. That's plenty. Sleep in your own bed.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yep. And, and be confident in your answer.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And I'll say it this way, and I don't think you are. But I'll just say it for everybody listening. Don't outsource your sense of relationship or self worth on whether a 10 year old likes you or not.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Right.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Oh my gosh.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You're a good mom. You're send boundaries for your kid. You're a good mom. You're keeping your kids safe. And for whatever it's worth, I am pathological about sleepovers.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

I am too actually.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's all good.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Like I, I am.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And here's the thing, here's the thing. You, you can tell your, your daughter at 10 and I don't think this is too much, you can say I trust your friend and I trust your friend's parents. But I don't know what friend her brother or her sister is going to bring over. I don't know what might you might actually see accidentally see on TV.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And that's my job. And she's 10. She's going to be like it's nothing. It will never. I, I hear that. I know it's disappointing, but this just is. And then she gets to weather it. And in the morning you're down there with eggs and pancakes. Good morning. And we're back at it. And 10 year olds can say awful, wild things. And then it's my job as a parent to show up the next morning having wiped the slate clean. If my wife says awful, mean things to me and then goes to bed the next morning, we're going to talk about it. 10 year old. I'm mostly going to wipe the slate clean.

[John (Host)]

They're 10.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And they're going to find out. You, you, you can't. You can hurt my feelings. You can, but I get to choose how I respond. And by the way, it doesn't mean that your kid has, gets to run roughshod and say mean things.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And there are times when I've tell my.

[John (Host)]

Told both my kids.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You're allowed to be angry. You're allowed to be really upset with me.

[John (Host)]

You can't say that. That's disrespectful.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And we are respectful even if we're angry.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And if you choose to say that,

[John (Host)]

then you're making this choice about consequences.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

I wish parenting was easier.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's not. It's the worst. It's the worst thing. It's the best worst thing ever.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

It is the best. And it is so hard.

[John (Host)]

It's hard. Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But. But being liked is not the measure

[John (Host)]

of a good parent.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

That's true.

[John (Host)]

Being sturdy as, as Becky Kennedy says, is the measure. Can I stand firm and let you know, despite your big feelings, I'm always

[Dr. John DeLoney]

going to be right here and I'm gonna do my one job and that's

[John (Host)]

to keep you safe.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And you're not going to agree with me.

[John (Host)]

And I'm completely okay with that. Totally okay with that.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Because I know I'm making the right choice.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And if I'm not making the right choice, I'll say I'm sorry.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

That's true.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

We'll shake it off. We'll move on.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm not afraid to say I'm sorry either.

[John (Host)]

I say it to my kids all the time. Mess that one up. It is hard, though.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Is your husband with you on this?

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Oh, yeah, he. We were on the same page. I just, I was hoping for more language because I just, I don't think I have it at the moment.

[John (Host)]

I think you do.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I think it's, I think it's weathering

[John (Host)]

the, The Emotional hurricane that is a

[Dr. John DeLoney]

10 year old,

[John (Host)]

you know.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Is she your oldest?

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

No, she's my youngest.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Oh, your youngest.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

The oldest. They sort of understand.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

And they sort of accept it. It's just her, she's just having the hardest time.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

How old are your older kids?

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

17 and 12.

[John (Host)]

Okay. So this is especially hard.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And I'm going through this. I have a 16 year old and a 10 year old. I got a 10 year old who's watching her brother drive. He can go wherever he wants. He's driving himself to school stuff. He's going. Driving himself to games. He's. And she feels trapped.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And a 10 year old is going to say the words it's not fair over and over and. Because it's not.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Yeah.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

I think trapped is a good word.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And if a parent says life's not fair, then the parent should punch himself

[John (Host)]

in the eyeball for saying that. Right. But we all say it.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But like, like the, the only way I've seen in every kid is different. The way I have seen things. The, the extra burden of energy that has fallen on me that I didn't anticipate is a sense of

[John (Host)]

I grew

[Dr. John DeLoney]

up in a house where my dad

[John (Host)]

would say I said no because I said it right. Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I want her to say. And he did his best to explain

[John (Host)]

it, but there was a sense of I'm the dad. I kind of get to do what I want here.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I want my daughter to know, here's why I'm making this decision and I don't expect you to understand it. And it's okay if you're mad at me and I'll still be here. And here's the extra energy expenditure. Can I put my stupid phone down or forgo the episode I wanted to watch and we go do something. Can I invite those friends over to my house and just let them have a wild time?

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Can I turn all the lights off and get, get flashlights and play hide and seek with mom and dad? You know what I mean? Like, can I get involved in this thing and backfill some of that sense of I'm just stuck here by myself?

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

We're not my 16 year old.

[John (Host)]

I'm not.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'll never be as cool as his friends. I get that 10 year old. I kind of still think you're cool.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

She does.

[John (Host)]

Yeah.

[Caller 3 (Uncomfortable Wife)]

Most of the time.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Unless I'm telling her no.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

There you go.

[John (Host)]

That's right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That's right.

[John (Host)]

And that, that's, that's the job. That's the job. That's the job. That's the job. And I'll tell you, it sounds like

[Dr. John DeLoney]

you and your husband are doing really great work.

[John (Host)]

It's awesome.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And it's hard.

[John (Host)]

It.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Youngest kids are often scrambling for ownership

[John (Host)]

of something,

[Dr. John DeLoney]

and so maybe there's some opportunities for you to say, this is off the table. Do you want to go with me to a movie or do you want

[John (Host)]

to go with me to get ice cream? You get to pick.

[Caller 1 (Parent)]

Neither.

[John (Host)]

Okay, I'd love to go get ice cream with you or go to a movie with you.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm gonna be downstairs.

[John (Host)]

You come tell me, because I'd love to do it.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Then the next day, if your daughter says no, be like, man, I wanted to go to a movie and get

[John (Host)]

ice cream with you.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Eventually they'll say, movie.

[John (Host)]

And then we're gonna go have a movie and we're either gonna pay $108

[Dr. John DeLoney]

for a box of Milk Duds or

[John (Host)]

we're gonna go to the gas station

[Dr. John DeLoney]

and sneak them in. But we're, we're. I'm going to give opportunities for ownership

[John (Host)]

on little things for a 10 year

[Dr. John DeLoney]

old so they can begin to feel the ground underneath their feet.

[John (Host)]

I've got some little bits of autonomy in my life, but you're.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You and your husband sound like you're

[John (Host)]

doing a great job.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Not a fan of sleepovers. My wife and I are pathological about

[John (Host)]

the few, if any, that we allow and pretty militant about it.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Just the risk and reward isn't worth it, especially when you're. You feel safe enough to let your

[John (Host)]

kids stay till 10 or let, like, dude, come home and get some sleep.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's.

[John (Host)]

It's all good. It's all good.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Thanks for the call, sister.

[John (Host)]

We'll be right back.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

This show is sponsored by Better Help. May is mental health awareness Month. Listen, millions of people are experiencing mental and emotional distress right now. I'm talking about our friends, our neighbors. I'm talking about you. I'm talking about me. We're communicating with everyone, all over the place with our phones, with our laptops, but we're not connecting with anyone. We're more anxious, lonely and overwhelmed than ever. Listen, talking to someone can help. I have seen a therapist. And having a good therapist makes a huge difference. My wife has seen a therapist. My friends and family, I recommend that they see therapist. It's important when you need someone to talk to. And for you, this is where BetterHelp comes in. BetterHelp is an online therapy platform that matches you with the licensed therapist based on your goals and preferences. Their therapists are fully licensed in the United States and they follow a strict code of conduct. You can message your therapist and schedule sessions right in the platform. If it's not the right fit, you can switch anytime at no additional cost. You're worth it. Talk to someone. Go to betterhelp.com DeLoney to get 10% off. That's better. Help. H E L p.com DeLoney

[John (Host)]

all right, we're back. All right, Kelly, listen, this is awesome.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay?

[John (Host)]

So I cannot. I can't stop watching chiropractic videos on Instagram. That's basically the only reason I turn it on anymore is it's why.

[Caller 2 (Obsessed Wife)]

Why?

[John (Host)]

I don't know. I. Hey, I. I have a love affair with the chiropractor's office. And I go probably twice a year. I used to go all the time. I go about twice a year when I get all bunched up, and they just are like, so what's going. And it's the best. It's the best. And. But on Instagram, they have. They put these microphones on their necks and on their backs, and they've. I'm sure they juice the sound like crazy. But anyway, just a minute ago, I was. Had the video on, and somebody walked behind me, and all they could hear

[Emily (Producer/Assistant)]

was somebody being our sweet Emily down here.

[John (Host)]

I didn't want to throw under the

[Emily (Producer/Assistant)]

bus, but no, that's not her under the bus. You're under the bus.

[John (Host)]

But from behind. From, like, she was standing behind me. And I'm just watching this video and all. All the. The audio is, ooh, lean in. Get close.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah, just like that. Okay.

[John (Host)]

And then she's like, that's it. And Emily was like, not gonna say anything. I just happened to be like, I love these chiropractor videos. And she was like, oh, thank God. So good, dude, I love them. I love them.

[Emily (Producer/Assistant)]

I think on that note, we just end the show.

[John (Host)]

Everybody a get off social media, unless you're following me. Only me. And if you're on, just put in some chiropractic videos. It'll make your whole life better. Love you guys. Bye.