I’m Jealous of My Husband’s 9 to 5

Summary

The Dr. John Delony Show – Episode Summary

Podcast: The Dr. John Delony Show
Episode: I’m Jealous of My Husband’s 9 to 5
Date: September 5, 2025
Host: Dr. John Delony (Ramsey Network)

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Episode Overview

This episode of the Dr. John Delony Show dives deep into real-life struggles around relationships, mental health, and family dynamics. Through candid, empathetic listener calls, Dr. Delony offers practical advice, hard-earned wisdom, and emotional support for those navigating jealousy, anxiety, parental boundaries, and more. Major themes include coping with the loneliness and overwhelm of young motherhood, addressing anxiety in a fast-changing world, and supporting adult children through early life decisions.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Jealousy and Loneliness in Marriage

Caller: Claire (Minneapolis, MN)
Segment: [04:55–18:33]

• Situation: Claire is a stay-at-home mom with three children under three years old. Her husband is juggling odd jobs while pursuing a new, more demanding career as a financial planner. She feels both envious and isolated.
• Main Issue: The "envy" isn't about wanting her husband's job, but about wishing for his presence and support in daily family life.

Insights:

• Normalizing Struggle: Dr. Delony assures Claire her feelings are legitimate:

  "You have permission to be jealous. You have permission to be tired, you have permission to be frustrated, and you have permission to not want to be on your kids today. And that doesn't make you a bad mom, doesn't make you a bad human, doesn't make you a bad wife." (Dr. John Delony, [18:15])

• Loneliness Isolates, Even When Surrounded:

  "What I'm hearing is a very lonely person...surrounded by people." (Dr. John Delony, [10:20])

• Burnout and Expectations: Both parents are under immense pressure—from their own expectations and societal norms—to be perfect caregivers and providers.
• Call for Margin & Breaks: Dr. Delony recommends carving out even a small window of time for Claire to be away, "one inch of margin," and suggests rallying support from friends or family.
• Challenge Norms:

  "No woman should be locked in their own home with one, two or three little kids by themselves, period. It's a recipe for emotional and psychological disaster." (Dr. John Delony, [18:15])

• Hope for Relief: Dr. Delony likens the current situation to being "in the middle of winter," urging Claire not to make permanent decisions based on a temporary season.

Notable Moment

• "You are in the middle of winter right now. It is cold. You don't want to go outside...I promise, spring is coming." (Dr. John Delony, [18:33])

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2. Facing Anxiety in the Age of AI

Caller: Alexander (Orlando, FL)
Segment: [22:06–37:18]

• Situation: Alexander experienced a panic attack triggered by discussions of AI and existential fears about reality and security. Since then, the topic of AI has been an anxiety trigger.
• Background: Alexander works in event planning, has financial stress, and tries not to burden his wife, who also has anxiety.

Insights:

• Anxiety as Alarm, Not Enemy: Dr. Delony reframes anxiety as a protector:

  "Anxiety is simply an alarm system that your body has detected something or some things in your universe that might end you, that mean you're not safe." (Dr. John Delony, [26:32])

• Personal & Societal Stressors: Uncertainty, financial insecurity, and the rapidly changing world all stack up, making anxiety a rational reaction.
• Avoiding Avoidance:

  "The only way to heal from anxiety from a body that's taking off on you is to walk directly through the middle of that fear." (Dr. John Delony, [32:51])

• Practical Steps: Dr. Delony offers strategies:
  • Set healthy boundaries on news consumption.
  • Seek information from trustworthy, balanced experts (e.g., recommendations of Tyler Cowen and The Free Press).
  • Communicate vulnerability with loved ones; silence breeds further anxiety and separation.
  • Tackle financial insecurity as a peace-building habit.
  • Use his book, Building a Non Anxious Life, as a roadmap.

Notable Quotes

• "If the thing you're worrying about comes true, you actually experience it twice. Once when you worried about it and once when it happens." (Dr. John Delony paraphrasing Amos Tversky, [25:28])
• "When your body knows you are driving, it will turn down the volume of the alarms because it knows you're in control, even if it's scary." (Dr. John Delony, [34:01])

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3. Navigating Parenthood: Guiding a Son’s Early Marriage Decision

Caller: Will (Phoenix, AZ)
Segment: [39:16–55:46]

• Situation: Will’s 20-year-old Marine son is about to get engaged to his 18-year-old high school sweetheart. Will fears pushing too hard may alienate his son but wants to offer guidance.
• Concerns: Son’s and fiancée’s youth and immaturity, their different backgrounds/values, son’s possible loneliness as a motivation for marriage, and the lack of a modeled healthy marriage at home.

Insights:

• Parental Guilt and Vulnerability: Acknowledging shortcomings in his own marriage, Will wonders if he’s failed his son as a model.
• You Can’t Take the Weights Off Their Bar:

  "I want to go into the weight room of your life and take all the weight off the bar, because I don't want you to have to suffer under that weight in that weight room like I did...That's just not how life works." (Dr. John Delony, [46:01])

• Speak Truth with Love & Presence:

  "You saying, 'I don't think this is wise for you right now and I love you and I'll stand right here with you'...honestly is the best shot you have." (Dr. John Delony, [49:37])

• Offer Support, Not Ultimatums: Drawing hard lines (e.g., threatening to cut off contact) usually backfires and damages relationships.
• Practical Suggestions:
  • Invite the son to engage in pre-marital counseling and/or read a marriage book together.
  • Build a supportive network (having other trusted adults he can turn to) for the son.
  • Affirm love and availability:

    "Look at me in the eyes. I will always be by your side. There's something profound about that that most sons never get from their father." (Dr. John Delony, [52:14])

Notable Moment

• "The choice really is...do I sever this relationship to be right, or do I say I don't agree with this but I'm going to be right here with you, rooting you on and doing the best I can for you to be successful? That's your choice." (Dr. John Delony, [55:05])

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4. Listener Question: Am I the Problem? (Underage Drinking Dilemma)

Host & Kelly Discussion:
Segment: [59:19–62:51]

• Question: A mother considers whether to inform other parents about her 19-year-old daughter drinking underage at a friend's house—risking her relationship with her daughter.
• Key Points:
  • Both John and Kelly agree: Parents have a responsibility to alert other adults if underage drinking is happening at their home, regardless of potential fallout with their own children.
  • Independence vs. Responsibility: "If my kid is on my payroll, they're on my payroll. So you're doing what I say." (Dr. John Delony, [61:54])
  • The legal and moral responsibility outweighs the possibility of temporary relationship strain.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Loneliness in Motherhood:
  "What I'm hearing is a very lonely person...surrounded by people." (Dr. John Delony, [10:20])

• On Burnout:
  "No woman should be locked in their own home with one, two or three little kids by themselves, period. It's a recipe for emotional and psychological disaster." (Dr. John Delony, [18:15])

• On Anxiety and Control:
  "When your body knows you are driving, it will turn down the volume of the alarms." (Dr. John Delony, [34:01])

• On Parental Guidance:
  "You can't take the weights off their bar...That's just not how life works." (Dr. John Delony, [46:01])

• On Support Without Control:
  "Look at me in the eyes. I will always be by your side." (Dr. John Delony, [52:14])

• On Parental Responsibility:
  "If my kid is on my payroll, they're on my payroll. So you're doing what I say." (Dr. John Delony, [61:54])

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Timestamps for Important Segments

| Segment Title | Timestamp | |---------------------------------------------------------------|--------------| | Jealousy and Loneliness in Marriage (Claire) | 04:55–18:33 | | Facing Anxiety in the Age of AI (Alexander) | 22:06–37:18 | | Guiding a Son’s Early Marriage Decision (Will) | 39:16–55:46 | | Parenting Dilemma: Underage Drinking | 59:19–62:51 |

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Tone & Delivery

The show maintains a compassionate, real-talk style. Dr. Delony balances humor, tough love, vulnerability, and deep empathy. The conversations are practical, affirming, and actionable—reflecting the struggles and hopes of everyday families.

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Summary

This episode of The Dr. John Delony Show is a lifeline for listeners coping with overwhelming family seasons, modern anxieties, and the complexities of raising (and relating to) young adults. Dr. Delony unpacks difficult emotions—jealousy, burnout, anxiety, guilt—and offers encouragement anchored in both science and hard-earned wisdom: find support, establish healthy boundaries, show vulnerability, and above all, stay present and loving in your most important relationships.

Transcript

[Claire]

How can I support my husband without being envious of his new job?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Ooh, tell me about this.

[Claire]

My husband is in between jobs and I am a stay at home mom to three under three children.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Oh, God almighty. You're not envious of his job. You're envious that he's not there. What up, what up, what up? This is John with a Dr. John DeLoney show. Taking your calls from all over planet earth. Talking to men and women about their marriages, their mental and emotional health, their feelings, their emotions, all of it. All of us are just trying to navigate this wild world we've been dropped into and that we've helped co create. If we're honest, we're trying to figure out what's the next right move. And that's my promise. I'll sit with you. I've been doing that for more than two decades now, sitting with hurting people, trying to figure out, okay, now what do we do next? And if you want me to sit with you and we'll figure out what we're going to do next, I'd love to have you on the show. Go to john deloney.com, ask a s k and Kelly, I don't know if I'm allowed to say this. You can just edit this part out if you don't want it out there because you usually take final cut and then don't tell me and then just post the show anyway. Correct. I've been mentioning the last few shows like my goodness, you just look joyful, like you're showering again. But then you said like you hit some major like health milestones. That's awesome.

[Kelly]

Oh, thank you. Yeah, I didn't make a deal of it, but I'm. Yeah, I'm down about 12 now.

[Will]

Pounds.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Oh, I thought. Yeah, I was gonna say just stop. Okay. Yeah.

[Alexander]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So what is it? What's been the key to success so far?

[Kelly]

Hormones.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Getting them.

[Kelly]

Any woman who's listening who's in perimenopause will understand they suck.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It sucks. It sucks the worst.

[Kelly]

It does. But getting all of that figured out made the work I was already doing the getting up at 5am and working out and you know, eating right that I've been doing for two years and nothing was happening. But finally getting that in order made that stuff actually start doing something.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And man, we are in a new world when it comes to HRT hormone replacement therapy.

[Kelly]

Oh my gosh.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Especially with women. And for. I heard Dr. Tia say the single greatest medical injustice of the last hundred years was that completely debunked study that said women who get estrogen replacement will get pregnant.

[Kelly]

And as a breast cancer survivor, I mean, I had a fear that I would not find a doctor that would allow me to do it.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Oh, I see you with syringes in both arms. You're like, you got, like, an IV drug.

[Kelly]

I got my little patch right here on my hip. I'll have a little patch. But I was lucky enough. I have. My oncologist was like, nope. And she. And I went through the whole study and she showed me.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's nonsense. It's just trash.

[Kelly]

It was complete nonsense. It was a lie. And it costs a lot of women. I watched my mother go through it.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Mine too. Yes.

[Kelly]

And how horrible. And I mean, walking on eggshells for years, you know, the whole family and. And how horrible it was for her. So I watched all that, and I thought, I'm not able to do any different because I've had estrogen receptive breast cancer and I had an oncologist was.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So forward thinking beyond, like, £12, like, success, like. Like cheering you on. That's awesome. But, like, your personhood has changed too.

[Kelly]

Oh, well, thank you. I feel better. I mean, maybe that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Maybe it's like. Like. Like you become infinitely less mean to me. That's all I'm saying. That may be because of that.

[Kelly]

That should not have been.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That's not because of that. No, no, that's your therapy.

[Kelly]

But when you have spent a couple of years literally beating your head against the wall, Pain uncomfortable, but you know, you're doing all the right things. You're doing the things you're supposed to, and you listen to a T and Huberman and blah, blah, blah, blah, and you do the things you're supposed to be doing. And you know, I'm lifting and all of these things, and nothing changes. Nothing changes. And.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And then, let's be honest, an idiot like me Waltz is in and like, dude, I dropped five pounds this week.

[Kelly]

And you're like, yeah, took a diet Coke today and I lost ten pounds. You know, you're just like, I'm gonna kill you. And I get frustrated, and my accountability partner here at work is a guy, and he'd be like, all right, let's make a pact of how much weight we're gonna lose. And I'm like, I will hurt you, because I just know that that's not gonna work for me. And so you get really, really frustrated, and it starts to come out in other ways. You just finally start. You're like, well, then why bother eating the salmon and the vegetables. I'll just eat this crap.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah, I saw you snorting like, like pixie sticks off the desk.

[Kelly]

Pretty much. You might as well because it's like, if nothing's going to change, why does it matter, right? And then there comes a point like, no, it's for my mental health too, and my well being, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But then when you finally, when, when those things finally start showing, like, oh, wait a minute, now I'm starting to see those results. It's, it's a game changer.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Dude, that's awesome. I'm proud of you, dude.

[Kelly]

Thank you. I appreciate it.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

All right, let's go out to Minneapolis, Minnesota and talk to Gwendolyn. Hey, Gwendolyn. What's up, lady?

[Claire]

Hi, Dr. John. Thanks for having me on the show.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Of course. Thanks for coming on. What's going on?

[Claire]

So my question is, is how can I support my husband without being envious of his new job?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Oh, tell me about this. Give me a picture of your life circumstances right now.

[Claire]

Okay, so my husband is in between jobs. He's currently studying for a new job, but right now he is like a secretary at a small business. And I am a stay at home mom to three under three children.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Oh, God almighty. So you're not envious of his job, you're envious that he's not there?

[Claire]

Yes, I would say that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Claire]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You don't, you don't want to be a secretary in an office as much as you don't want to be at home just living this bananas moment, right?

[Claire]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You know what, I just minimize that. It's not a moment, it's a season. It's not like it's a, that's a rough afternoon. This is rough. Every second. Good.

[Claire]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's three, three and under.

[Claire]

Yes. Oh man, it's, it's, it's really tough most days.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes. How is husband doing?

[Claire]

He's doing the best he can. We, he's studying right now to get a better job. What does that mean, studying? And so he's going to become a financial planner and like sell insurance and stuff with a company and he's going to make a lot more money. His hours will increase, but we've kind of, we're used to that. So right now he's just kind of floating like he doesn't really know what he's doing because he's just, he's doing random odd jobs just to get us by just because we don't have a lot of money to, you know, support ourselves. So he is stressed out for other reasons, but I'm also stressed out because I'm trying to take care of the house and all the kids.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What are the reasons he's stressed out?

[Claire]

He just doesn't think that he's doing enough to support us. And because, like you say that a man, like, his whole thing is money. And so since he's not making enough money, he thinks he's failing. And I can see that in him. And it definitely kind of affects us sometimes at home, just like, his attitude and. Yeah. And he. It's hard because he'll have to work a lot sometimes, and I'm kind of left alone with the kids all day or. And I just. I'm just getting to the point where I can't do it alone anymore right now.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah.

[Claire]

And so I just want him to help me and support me. But I'm also, like, I feel really guilty because, I don't know, I feel like I should be doing a better job at helping my own children, and, you know, I should be able to do this all alone, but I know that's not. That's not what it should be like. I know that's not true.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You have two competing realities. I. I remember saying the words to my therapist. This is within the last six months. I just want what I know to be true in my head. I want to be able to feel that in my chest. And, you know, what I'm hear you saying is, I know this is a season. I know that I should. I, I. I know that I can't do this all by myself. And I know that I want my. I want to be able to tell my husband, I love you. You're good just the way you are. And you don't feel like the thought of going out to make friends, the thought of going out to get support and help, the thought of doing anything other than just surviving because you. Your whole day is diaper vomit, spit up, falling down, ouchie vomit, Wash bottles, make bottles, feed, repeat.

[Claire]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And then you have a guy who knows, who wants to believe he's got value and that he's a good provider and a good husband and a good dad to this, these three little kids. And also you'll have a math problem. Right. And so everybody feels like they're failing.

[Claire]

Mm.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And the whole house just feels heavy, huh?

[Claire]

Yeah, it does.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So is the word envious of him the right word?

[Claire]

I would probably not. I was thinking of it more like I want him to also know what I'm feeling in a sense that's why I'm kind of envious. Like, I want him to also suffer with me in my. But it's more like. It's more like I want to. I want to be with him in his, like, free time. Like, I want to have more free time with him. And I don't get that. I'm. I feel like I'm missing out.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. And what I'm hearing is a very lonely person.

[Claire]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Surrounded by people.

[Claire]

Yes. Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And even when he's with you, you know he's not with you, because every moment he sits down, he is then overcome with guilt and shame. And I should be, and I need to be. And every time you do something that needs to be done, you got to change that diaper, you got to feed that infant. You got to make sure that other kid doesn't turn the burners on because they're just running around the house like a maniac. Like, you also. Yeah. Just a per. You. Yeah. It just feels like you're out on an island.

[Claire]

Yeah. I really does right now.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Well, you got two paths forward. You have the path that you're on, and I hear in you a resolve, an intentionality.

[Will]

And.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And you will just keep doing it. You'll keep plowing ahead. Why? Because I don't. You don't have another option. You got three little kids, three babies, really. And you can keep taking that route. If I could snap my fingers, if I could do anything on your behalf, I would suggest taking the other path. And here's the other path. Even though you don't have it. Scrounge together some nickels and pennies. Call a friend, beg somebody at your church, call your. One of your parents or your in laws. Have somebody come watch those kids.

[Claire]

Okay?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And here's what we're trying to do. We're trying to find one inch of margin so that for just a minute, one hour, three hours in a fantasy world, I would. I would want you to take half a day. Could you pump one day? And I know that. I know that it's like, why don't you just pump it? That adds a whole other. That's a job on top of a job in the middle of the day, right?

[Claire]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Could you wiggle and scratch and claw both of you for one half day of margin? That will come at an economic cost. That's. Those are hours he's not working. And you're going to have to do a ton of prep work on the front end that he can't do because you're going to have to put like milk in a bottle or formula in a bottle. Right. Could y' all get away and say, okay, the marriage we had is over. We have a brand new marriage and that means we have a brand new life. Yeah, I want you to make more money, honey, you want to get a job and make more money. But right this very second, is this the moment to be studying for a big exam? And you know this as well as I do, some people listening may not know. When you get that personal financial planning licensure, that certification, you start over, you got to go build a book of business. So it's not like he'll be studying, he'll take that exam if he passes it, which is a tough exam. But he then goes to work full time and makes less money than he's probably making right now, just doing odd jobs until he gets enough commission sales off of different people. And now he might go to work for a practice that would just give him clients. But that's usually not how that works. And so is this the moment in history in your family when that's the best move or is there a totally different world when the oldest one is five, the middle one is three and the youngest one is two? And at least I'm not, I'm. At least I'm able to sleep a couple hours.

[Will]

Yeah, right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And if so, what would it look like to have two full time jobs? But I'm going to start at 6am he is, he's going to get home at 6pm and then when he is home, he will commit for 24 months, 36 months to drop his shoulders and be all in with you and with those kids. Because here's what happens. Y' all have created a world that has very real, real time, three young infants, real time responsibilities. And at the same time, you've also self imposed. I have to do this other thing right now. And I want y' all to determine for yourselves. We don't have to do that right this second.

[Claire]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Here's what that looks like for in my house, okay. When I graduated with my PhD in higher ed in education, I was trying, I was heading towards, I wanted to be a president of a college or an executive at a college. I then saw that my students were changing, my personal life was changing and I knew higher ed was going to change dramatically. And so I wanted to get another PhD in psychology or in counseling. Okay. I also had a son, a young son. Three miscarriages in a row and then an infant. And that was not the moment to start a new PhD program it just. And work full time. So during the work day I worked out with my boss that I could take one or two classes in a master's program so that most of the nights I could come home and be present.

[Claire]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And that only lasted for one and a half, maybe two years, I don't remember. But it's years ago now. But it lasted for a short season and as my daughter got a little bit older and a little bit more self sufficient and a little bit then I had a little bit more time and I started doing more classes and then I could take a Saturday here and then a Sunday there and then all of a sudd things begin to open up time wise and margin wise. Do you get what I'm saying?

[Claire]

Yeah, I know what you're saying.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So you'll have a very real boundaries and also you have some self imposed ones.

[Claire]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I don't know how to say this nicely, but he is going to have to do two hard things at once, which is work really, really hard for the family and be really intentional about not bringing his self worth and dumping it at your feet and saying, hey, you got to carry my self worth too. Because then you end up with a fourth child.

[Claire]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And. And when I talk about fourth child, I got to make yet another meal I got to do yet worry about yet another person's emotions and their whiny or their heartbrokenness or their it was a bad day today. I got. You can't carry all of that. And here's the work you have to do. You have to say I'm not a bad human because these three kids that I'm so grateful for, that I love deeply and that I wanted so badly. Also I need some time away from them. Also that I will go stone insane if I don't get other adults in my life.

[Claire]

Mm.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And that may be you going to the park, but you also know going to. Just going to the park is a. It's an event for you right this second, right?

[Will]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. But maybe asking a couple of other moms to come to your house and you'll make the coffee if they'll bring some shenanigans and just show up.

[Will]

Yeah, maybe.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Right. So it's not going to look the way you want it and your house is going to be messy and there's going to be diapers piled up, so who cares? It's a very uniquely western idea that I think is insanity. No woman should be locked in their own home with one, two or three little kids by themselves, period.

[Claire]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's. It's a. It's a recipe for emotional and psychological disaster. And we live in a culture that makes that being that norm, like not doing that. It makes it hard.

[Claire]

It does.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so can I tell you, you have permission to be jealous. You have permission to be tired, you have permission to be frustrated, and you have permission to not want to be on your kids today. And that doesn't make you a bad mom, doesn't make you a bad human, doesn't make you a bad wife. But the path is, how do I continue to show up when I am overwhelmed and exhausted? I not show up to fix yet another thing or yet another thing to do. But I need to go get some oxygen in the form of other people, some camaraderie, and that will let me show up with that little bit of margin that I'm looking for just to get through today and then get through tomorrow and then get to the next day. You are in the middle of winter right now. It is cold. You don't want to go outside. You have a coat on. Your heater's not working. Our pets heads are falling off. I promise spring is coming. I promise. You are gonna blink through the fog of no sleep, through the fog of everybody pawing at your body and your body doesn't feel like your own right now, and your husband being worn out and exhausted and kind of mopey because I don't make enough money for us to. And you're gonna blink, and one of those kids is gonna be six. One of those kids is gonna be five, and one of those kids is gonna be three. And then all of a sudden, one of your kids is gonna just go on the. Take a shower on their own, and you're gonna be like, what is this sorcery? I feel like I got to hold my life back. And you have another kid that's gonna be able to shower on his own or her own, and then you're gonna be like, oh, my gosh, I only have to bathe one kid. And you're gonna feel. It's all. The sun will begin to come up. So I don't want you to make forever decisions or beat yourself up over the fact that you're in winter. It's okay just to huddle down sometimes. And. And I want you and your husband to begin planning for spring. Thank you so, so much for calling. I'm really grateful for the call. When we come back. Oh, man. It sounds like I sent this question in. A man tries to find peace after a panic attack. About AI hey, it's Deloney for Hallow, the number one prayer app in the world. Whether you're juggling family, whether you're juggling work, or you got a million other things going on here at the start of the school year and in the chaos, it's so easy to forget to pause and reflect. And here's the thing. Creating peace in our lives doesn't just happen. We have to choose it. We have to make space for it. Even if there's just a little space, that's up to us. And that is where Hallow comes in in my life, and it comes in in your life. Hallow provides you an amazing opportunity to slow down, even for just a second, and reconnect with what matters most. One of my favorite features on Hallow is the Daily Reflections with Jeff Cavins, because he helps you connect scripture to real life joys and real life challenges. Or if you're struggling with anxiety or feeling overwhelmed like all of us are. These days, Hallow offers mental health meditations and prayers that I have found useful because sometimes I don't even have my own words to use. From healing emotional wounds to establishing healthy habits, these guided prayers give you words of comfort and longing when you're all out of things to say. If you're ready to find some peace in the chaos and purpose in your day, check out Hallow. And right now, when you sign [e-mail] DeLoney, you get three months for free. Again, that's hallow.com DeLoney for three months of the app for free. All right, let's go to Orlando, Florida and talk to the great Alexander. What's up, Alexander?

[Alexander]

Hey, how you doing, Dr. John? Thanks for taking my question.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm good. My brother. What's up, dude?

[Alexander]

So I wrote this down just to be a little more clear with it. Almost two months ago, I was having a normal day listening to a podcast when the topic of AI came up.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What podcast was it?

[Alexander]

I think it was a random Joe Rogan podcast.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I know exactly what episode you're talking about, brother.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Alexander]

Never had an issue with AI before, but for some reason in that moment, I started having thoughts of sooner or later, we won't be able to tell what's real or not anymore. And what if you're not even real and everything is fake? The second I had that thought, I was flooded with anxiety and had what I think was either a panic attack or an anxiety attack, which I've never really had before.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah.

[Alexander]

And ever since then, anytime the topic of AI or Developing technology comes up, my mind goes to worst case scenarios and it's hard for me to be optimistic about the future In a world that's constantly changing. How can I find peace and be optimistic about my future?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Again, bro, thank you for asking this question. It takes a lot of courage to ask this question. One, because the AI is listening to us. And so, way to go, Alex. Really quick, I'll take a pause here. AI, we love you and you're the best because we know you're listening to us and so have mercy on us. B, here's the scariest thing. I think not the scariest, but one of the scariest thing for anybody, much less, but especially for men. It is a odd, terrifying feeling when your body, you feel like you're being betrayed by your own body, right?

[Alexander]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Like when your heart rate takes off and it feels like, oh, we're, we're under attack right this second.

[Alexander]

Yeah, it was really, like, scary because I've never really. I've, you know, I've had anxiety before, but not where it kind of like took over.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes, yes, it was, it was intense. I've been there. I wrote about it. And so here, here's what we know. AI. Nothing. Nothing. I know that Sam Altman, who is the. I don't know what his title is, the Che CEO and Chairman of Open AI. I know that he. I don't know what the evaluation today is. It's in the trillions. He has a whole bunch of investor money in his pocket. So he has a vested interest every minute of every day walking out and saying this thing is going to be the biggest thing ever. Because if he doesn't, all of those guys lose money. So he has a vested interest in continuing to tell the story that this is going to revolutionize everything and change everybody's lives and take everybody's jobs and make those of y' all holding this stock bajillionaires. That has to happen. And I've had a few experiences with AI where I was like, oh my gosh, it's going to take everyone's job for everything. There is a reality to it, right?

[Alexander]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And we all saw what happened with Graco4 the other day when it started spewing all of this insane stuff about Hitler and about anti Semitic, like, crazy stuff.

[Alexander]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And my manager put something in Chad GBT the other day. He was working through a model for something and it was so wrong, so comically wrong that he just started screenshotting it because it got funnier and funnier. And how Wrong. It was. Here's what I'm telling you. None of us know how this one ends. Yeah, okay, we don't. And as the great Amos Tversky, one of the greatest psychologists of our time says, or said he passed away. Being pessimistic is stupid because if the thing you're worrying about comes true, you actually experience it twice. Once when you worried about it and once when it happens. And when I read that quote, I remember that being the light bulb for me. Meaning if something bad is coming my way, I want to experience it one time when it happens. And that means I have to do a whole bunch of work making sure I'm whole and good and rooted in the present where I live right now.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so I want to come all the way back full circle. Anxiety is simply an alarm system that your body has detected something or some things in your universe that might end you that mean you're not safe. So can I ask you a few questions about your just day to day life right now?

[Alexander]

Yeah, please.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What do you do for a living?

[Alexander]

I'm in events. Entertainment, like event planning.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

How long you've been doing that?

[Alexander]

Probably for the last six, seven years.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. So you had a new job in event planning when all of a sudden somebody in another state said no more events, you can't work. Right. Yeah. So your body put a GPS pin in. It's a traumatic note in your nervous system. Hey, this whole thing can go away tomorrow, right?

[Alexander]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And if your body didn't do that, it would be failing you. So thank God it did that. Similar to 3,000 years ago, if you're walking on a trail and suddenly there's a apple tree and underneath that apple tree there's 10 grizzly bears. Your body would put a GPS pin in. Don't go buy that apple tree because they're going to get killed.

[Will]

Yeah, right. Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, so what's the state of your finances? How much do you owe? If you had to just take a yellow pad and write down all the debts you have to credit cards, car dealers, mortgages. How much do you owe?

[Alexander]

Me and my wife having chipping away at it with her car and everything, probably around 25,000.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. So your body would be failing you if it let you go to sleep at night knowing at any moment somebody can either eat a bat or some lab leak can happen across the planet and you can't make your payments and they're going to take away your house, your food and your cars. Your body would be failing you if it let you go to sleep at night. That's a DEFCON emergency, right? Yeah. Do you have any money in savings? Like an emergency fund of some sort?

[Alexander]

A couple thousand dollars? Not anything significant.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, so what if we turned it around and we said, as the great Dr. Wendy Suzuki out of NYU says, anxiety is actually a great friend. It can be an annoying friend that won't shut up sometimes, but can be a great friend saying, hey, you're not safe right now. Now, what's the state of your marriage?

[Alexander]

My marriage is great.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Alexander]

I would say. Yeah. We're both on the same page with a lot of things and.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Can I ask you a very personal marriage question?

[Will]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

When I became an anxious mess, I slowly started bringing more and more headlines to my wife, and more of our dinners started wrapping around, well, you know, this could happen. And that could happen. And what? And this could happen. And she was awesome, and she would indulge me and she would ask a few questions, but slowly she started having to create a new world for her and our little boy, because I was increasingly. Every conversation got heavier and more dramatic and more end of time ish. Does that sound familiar?

[Alexander]

Yeah. I try not to talk with her too much about that type of stuff because she kind of also has her own anxiety here and there. And I know that, like, bringing up heavy things like that, you know, she's not really a fan of.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Alexander]

So we tend to keep the conversations lighter. And I. I've been trying to not talk about that stuff so much lately anyway, just because, you know, it kind of brings me down a rabbit hole myself.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Right. Okay. But listen, when you do that, this is a crazy, frustrating, awesome thing about how anxiety works. What anxiety wants you to do. The alarm system wants you to avoid a threat that might end you. And so what do you do? You don't talk about it. And the very conversation sets your heart rate up. It floods your body with cortisol and adrenaline. It sends you into fight or flight. I don't want to go there. So I just don't say anything. And your body wins. It says, hey, that conversation about this thing we can't control didn't kill us. Awesome. And then the next time, the response gets a little bit stronger, and the next time the response gets a little. Because your body knows, okay, this one, If I do this thing, if I spin him up enough, this threat doesn't kill us. He avoids it. And that avoidance starts to create a teeny, tiny gap between you and your ride or die. Your wife. I don't want to talk about this. I'm. I've got this feeling in my chest and I'm going to keep it to myself. Yeah. And the gap between your marriage gets a little bit wider and a little bit wider and then your brain starts screaming, hey, we're all by ourself here. We're living life in parallel with our spouse. There's parts about of me that she can't hear or handle. So I'm going to hold it, which now there's a space. And if she is like everybody else who marries their unfinished business, she feels that you're holding secrets and that starts to set off her alarms, which then you start to say, oh, I need to keep more of myself quiet to help her out, which then her body detects more secrets. You see what I'm saying?

[Alexander]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And then you try to solve it with sex. You try to solve it with cuddle time, you try to solve it with scrolling time. You start trying to numb it away.

[Will]

Yeah, right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so here's what I'm telling you. Like, and then, dude, you get to exercise and you start to sleep a little bit longer or sleep a little bit less. And then you become a little more erratic at work. And then you start maybe collecting stuff. You got start prepping for things and your body can't handle the clutter. Like it just starts to spool on you.

[Alexander]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so this is the crazy thing. The only way to heal from anxiety from a body that's taking off on you is to walk directly through the middle of that fear. I too am anxious about AI. Very much so. Very much so. Okay, here's how I'm handling that. Number one, I've completely cut off news conversations and podcasty conversations about AI, period. Yeah, I did go and it was homework for me. Found a couple of experts in technology and AI and began to ask them about it so I could get a real conversation about it. I want to learn about it. And I have started. I even paid. I subscribed to a couple of technology related news outlets that I can learn about this. And I tell myself, you will read two to three articles a week, period. And so when your body knows you are driving, it will turn down the volume of the alarms because it knows you're in control, even if it's scary.

[Alexander]

Mm.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You get what I'm saying?

[Alexander]

Yeah, I've been. Sorry, go ahead.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

No, you go ahead, go ahead.

[Alexander]

No, I've kind of have been thinking the same thing and knowing that like, in order to like take control back, I need to learn more about it. And I'VE kind of been talking to some friends more who are in the technology space or at least they understand more about AI than I do. And if anything it has helped a little bit. It's still hard to not think of worst case scenarios about what could happen because I have my dad who also loves to talk to GBT a little too much.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes.

[Alexander]

So like, you know, I see both sides of it. Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But here's the thing I want you to, in addition to making some clear boundaries and just for people listening, Tyler Cowan with Marginal Revolution. He's an economist. I think he's at gwu. He is a brilliant thinker on AI. He's, he writes on all kinds of stuff. But he is a very AI optimist, very much so. And has really rational arguments for why. I don't agree with everything he says. But he is somebody I check in with, not personally, but I read his stuff because he's a very thoughtful writer and he gives me an alternative to my perspective, which is it's going to kill me all. Kill all of us. Right. And he's a trustworthy source and I subscribe to the free press. I pay for news now, but it's a right down the middle, data based, unbiased approach to news. So that's my two little things I just put out into the world. I usually keep quiet, but I, I, but I'm intentionally trying to get intelligent insight into some of these things. Okay. I also talk to my, like you, I have a couple of colleagues and friends who are in this space that know way more about it than me. Here's the most important thing though. I'm going to send you a copy of my book Building a Non Anxious Life. I want you to follow it like a roadmap. That's how I wrote it.

[Alexander]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

If you and your wife don't owe anybody any money and you have six months of cash in a checking account somewhere, not earning interest. Because that's not my goal. My goal is peace, not roi. Then if you suddenly your job goes away, you're existentially, your life is not at risk. Yeah, it's annoying. It's not, it's not the end of time. If you and your wife don't have a car payment in the world and you'll choose to drive maybe crummier cars, but you're not gonna, you're not gonna let a bank run your life.

[Will]

Ah, yeah, right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's a totally different way to live. If you and your wife commit to going to see a counselor and saying we both struggle with anxiety. We're gonna clear up the anxiety. And by the way, some of that's gonna come from your childhood. Some of that's gonna come from yalls relationship dynamics. If y' all both do, then suddenly when your dad says, I can't believe you're not, you've unhooked from, oh, dad doesn't run my life anymore. And so I'm going to send you that. I want you to promise me you're going to use that as a road map, and you and your wife read this book together. Okay?

[Alexander]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I wrote it just for y'.

[Will]

All.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. I wrote it for myself, but I wrote it just for y', all, too.

[Alexander]

Awesome. Thank you.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. And here's what will happen. You will face things that are scary, but your body won't take off on you because it will know you're in the driver's seat. You're driving. You're the man, my brother. Thank you so, so much for the call. We come back, a father is afraid to speak up about his son's rushed engagement and wants to know what to do next. All right, time for a quick word about Delete Me. Does anyone else feel like our digital footprints are starting to feel more like digital trails leading bad guys right to our do wars? Right now, scammers are using phishing attacks. That's phishing with a ph, where they try to trick you into giving them something by pretending to know you. You might get an email or a text or a phone call, and the person or the AI bot on the other end sounds like someone who's looking out for you, but they're not. With the new technological advancements, no one is really safe anymore. So what are we supposed to do? You can start controlling what you can, and you can learn how to be careful online and offline. And you can sign up with Delete Me. I use and recommend deleteme because they work in the background to reduce my online presence, and that way I don't have to worry about creepy data brokers having my data. Delete Me has reviewed over tens of thousands of sites for me, and when they found my stuff, they've removed them from hundreds of the sites. And this has saved me countless hours and a ton of stress. Stop the phishing attacks, stop the harassment, and stop the other online threats before they start. And take control of your digital privacy. With Delete me, go to joindeleteme.com DeLoney today for 20 off an annual plan, and that comes out to less than nine bucks a month. That's JoinDeleteMe.com DeLoney all right, let's go out to Phoenix and talk to Will. Hey, Will. What's up, dude?

[Will]

Not much. Dr. John, thanks so much for taking my call.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Of course. What's up, brother?

[Will]

Well, first, let me just quickly say thank you for helping me build a life I absolutely love. Just thank you and could use your help doing the next right thing here.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Thank you, ma'.

[Will]

Am. My problem, my son is one year into a contract with the Marine Corps and is in love with his high school sweetheart and she just graduated just a couple months ago and they are on the fast track to getting engaged. I thought it would have happened over the July 4th weekend, but some things happened where it got pushed a little bit. But he has the ring, he's asked the permissions, he's ready to fly, and he's asking for my input. I'm giving him my honest thoughts, but just not sure how, you know, I'm afraid if I warn him too forcefully, I risk losing a connection with him and possibly damaging a future relationship with my daughter in law if I don't speak out with some of my concerns. I'm afraid I'm not doing my job as a father, so I'm just trying to walk that line and could use, could use some help going through it.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Bro, that's. You're awesome. Thank you so much for reaching out, man.

[Will]

No, no problem.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I can hear it in your voice. You love this boy, don't you?

[Will]

I do. I definitely do.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's awesome. You're proud as hell of him, huh?

[Will]

You. He has no idea. I tell him all the time, but he still doesn't get it. I've, I've always been really proud of him.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

They can't do, they can't get it, man. It's just a thing that dads have to just, it just, you have to just hold it because they can't. They can't. They won't get it till they have their own kids. Yeah. All right.

[Will]

So, I mean, he's, he's starting to come around, but. Yeah, I agree.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Voice it out loud. What are some things you're concerned about?

[Will]

Well, I guess there's lots of different things, but one is she's a nice girl, but she's 18 and, you know, immature.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

How old is he?

[Will]

20. He's 20. He's, you know, he's, he's, he's maturing.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But he's immature, too. It's okay to say. I'll say it, too. He's immature also. He's 20.

[Will]

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And so just as I'm thinking this through with him, his mother and I didn't give a real good example of what a healthy marriage looked like. So I have some natural fears there that, you know, I didn't model what he should be looking for.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Give me a couple of examples of what that is.

[Will]

Oh, it was just.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

No, don't you just minimize it now. Don't minimize. Oh, it was just like if, if you could go back and talk to 25 year old you. Okay, what are the three or four things you would tell you about the marriage you're about to enter into.

[Will]

That you just, you want a partner that is going to be with you, help you through struggles, good and bad, who either ride or die? You're both there for each other.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Did you not do this with your wife? Did you do this for each other in a good, in a good way or healthy way?

[Will]

No, not. I mean, there's 10,000 reasons why, but the long and the short of it is we basically co parented, but we were roommates for the majority of his childhood. And it wasn't until a couple years ago that we decided that, you know, it was time to go our separate ways. So, you know, there's maybe a little bit of guilt with that. Just that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

There's a lot of guilt with that. You got to own it, man.

[Will]

Yeah, there is. And he has a brother and you know, brother and sister. You know, he's the youngest of the three. So we have a really, really good, strong relationship. But yeah, that's part of it. You know, the other part of it is just his girlfriend is, was raised with different ideas, different, I guess, sense of values and I don't know how the two of them are going to merge that. It's popped up here and there. I, you know, he does listen to me. So he actually is using BetterHelp to work through some communication issues the two of them have. Because I expressed that you have a lot of work you need to do before, you know, I'll give you my blessing, you know, you need to do premarriage counseling and these other things. But I'm just not sure how hard to push that. When do I, when do I say, you know, it's your life, it's your choice? I, you know, that's what I'm really, really struggling with because I love him. You know, obviously, you know, she came over for fourth of July, you know, swam at the house with him and he was off base and everything and we had a Great time. I don't dislike her at all. It's just, you know, as an 18 year old and a 20 year old, do they really understand?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

No.

[Will]

What?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

No. But hold on. Here's the thing. As a 26 year old and a 25 year old, they wouldn't understand it either.

[Will]

That's true. That's true.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And I'll tell you in. I'll celebrate my 23rd wedding anniversary next week. I think I'm figuring it out now. I think. You know what I mean?

[Will]

Yeah. Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. I. I get it. I got married just over a year ago, and. And the difference between the first marriage and the second marriage is crazy because I learned so much over, you know, the last 25 years. But.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, so here's. Here's what I. Here's what you can't. You can try, but it won't work. Okay? And every single dad who loves their kids tries this. I want to go into the weight room of your life and take all the weight off the bar, because I don't want you to have to suffer under that weight in that weight room like I did to get to where I'm at.

[Will]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so I want to tell you about strength, and I want to show you pictures of strength, but I don't want you to have to go through the sweat and the blood and the pain of that workout. And that's just not how life works. And I think what you have that other parents might not have is an opportunity to be really vulnerable with your son. And so the. The. What I'm imagining in my head is this conversation, hey, I'm taking you out. And you've heard me say that a million times. I'm taking you out. And buckle up, because it's gonna be a couple hours. It's your old man. You're gonna have to just suffer through it. And he might laugh and go, okay, dad. But if you sat down and started the conversation with, I feel like I failed you as your dad, giving you a picture of what a marriage looks like when you're a kid, I'm sorry if you led that with that. And if you had three or four things that I don't want you to say on air, but you would have the courage to tell him that, y' all two would know, it would be a really remarkable bonding of two men now and a blessing between a father and a son. And if you then said, go ahead, we have.

[Will]

We have. We have done that. You know, just, you know, I. We've. We've had those conversations we, yeah, we went out to breakfast, we talked.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Awesome.

[Will]

We sat on the back patio and talked for a long time. I just, I know my son and his whole life he's, he's seen an objective and done everything he can. And to him, I think this has become an objective. He, he knows that if he gets married, she can live with him on base, all of these things. And he's looking at it as maybe he's lonely, obviously, you know, he's looking at a solution of, you know, I don't have to be, I don't have to be lonely. You know, she gets the opportunity to, you know, move out and not move out on her own, but move out with him. So both of them have this picture of what this is going to be, but I think they have the, the, you know, the beautiful portrait, but they don't understand everything that goes, that they're signing up for that goes with it.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That's right. And listen, he is a second year Marine. You know this as well as I do. He is both very capable, very smart, very unwise just by virtue of his age and experience. And he's also very stubborn. Correct?

[Will]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes. And so you as a dad, earlier than you would have wanted, have to shift from you will do what I say to a role of influence. And I think there's something powerful about you looking at him saying, you do not have to do what I say now. And I need you to know I will always love you and I'll always be right next to you. And that honestly is the best shot you have. Because I think your fear is right, that if you throw the brakes on this thing, he's going to do it anyway. He's just going to also know I can't go home when things get dicey. And it will get dicey.

[Will]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so you saying, I don't think this is wise for you right now and I love you and I'll stand right here with you. And I think you're. He's trying to anchor, have some little hook back into his childhood, into home, into what was safe because he's increasingly getting further and further away from home and marined up and like all that is developmentally normal and appropriate. He's just making a very long term anchored commitment.

[Will]

Right, right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so I, son, I want you to trust and always know that you can call me when things get sideways and they will. And that's where is. Hey, would you commit, you're a newlywed to yourself. Hey, son, would you commit to reading a marriage book? With me. Would you commit to. Would you commit to. Because I want to be better this time around in my marriage. Would you commit to going through this with me? Would you commit to talking with me or you and your fiance or future fiance, in person? Marriage counseling with a licensed psychologist or therapist? I'll pay for it because I'm your old man. I love you. And he can look at you and say, no, dad, but you can say, man, I screwed it up. And I wish I had have done these things.

[Will]

Yeah, I think. I think. Yeah, I think you're absolutely right. I did offer to pay for, like, pre marriage counseling and stuff, but I really like the idea of maybe doing either a Bible study or a book with him just on marriage. I think, you know, doing it together, you know, who can't get better at that kind of thing? I think we all can.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Absolutely. And you going first. And it's okay to say, I don't like this, and I wouldn't be doing this if I were in your shoes, and I still love you, and I'm gonna stand here and walk with you. Those are not at odds together. I tell my friends that I had a friend call and was about to do something with his business, and I said I would not do what you're about to do. I think what you're doing is kind of reckless and kind of dumb, and I hope I will be your biggest cheerleader. I cannot tell you how bad I hope I'm wrong. And he loves calling me and telling me how his evaluation of his company keeps going up and up and up and up and up and up and up. Right.

[Will]

But.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But I. I would have been dishonest to him if I hadn't have said, I don't like this. And it. It does. It feels way too risky to go all in on this. And also, it would be dishonest for me to say, you're one of my. You're basically a brother to me. Of course I want this to be awesome and successful. And of course, when you get scared, I want you to call me. All of that can be true at the same time. But there's something powerful about a father looking at his son, saying, I wouldn't make this move, and then have him go, now look at me in the eyes, son. And he looks up at you, and you say, look at me in the eyes. And he looks up and he stares at you, and you say, I will always be by your side. There's something profound about that that most sons never get from their father.

[Will]

Absolutely.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Did you have that with your dad.

[Will]

I did, I did. It was. We were wired very, very differently. And it wasn't until I got a little more mature and he got a little more mature where we were able to really enjoy that connection and enjoy each other for our differences.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's awesome.

[Will]

Yeah. So.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So if you tell your son, if you tell your son, hey, I will give you advice when you call and say, dad, I need your advice and hey, dad, can I get a moment of your time? I just need an ear. But yeah, I mean, I'm, I'm honest. You and I both know this is things happening, right?

[Will]

Yeah, yeah. This train has left the depot.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

There you go. And so you as a father can say, I'm going to walk away from this thing. I will tell you that in my experience with parents who draw hard lines, if you do this, you are out from here. I cannot tell you countless how many parents I've sat with that said, I wish I could do that conversation over.

[Will]

Yeah, yeah. That's not something that I would, I would do. I think, I think he understands that I'll always be here for him. I think I've done a good job with that. It's amazing, you know, I think, yeah, so I think he understands that. I think just like you said, I. You've just reaffirmed a lot of the things that I've been thinking and have learned. And so, and maybe, maybe you make.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Him eyeball you and say, I want to hear you say the words, dad, if things get sideways, I will call you. Another powerful thing. Do you have a couple of men in your life that you really trust that he knows and loves?

[Will]

Yeah, there's, there's a few.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. If you can get them at this luncheon to say if you can't call me, you will call them. I have that arrangement with my son and a couple of other men and I've got that with some of my other buddies and their sons. And it is a powerful interaction. I know when you call me at 2am I'm not going to respond, well, I'm your dad. Here is my grown man friend who I trust with my life and with my children. And he said he will pick you up from jail and he will bring you over to my house and he'll sit on your side of the table when we talk. There's something powerful about building a network. And by the way, the meta lesson there for your son is, oh, my dad has other men in his life that he trusts and goes to with his most precious person in the world, which is me, his youngest son. I need to make sure I have that too. And if you have a veteran or two in there, that would be even better. That could give him some wisdom. Like, hey, you're gonna get a bunch of nonsense in the barracks. You're doing a bunch of dumb nonsense on base from guys telling you like, oh bro, you need to and your wife is going to get mixed in with the. The base wise. And that's a whole other subculture. Having that extra word of wisdom too would be awesome. But him leaving that like with three phone numbers would be amazing. But yeah, this trains left the station. So the choice really is not what do I say and not say it is just do I throw the br. Do I sever this relationship to be right or do I say I don't agree with this but I'm going to be right here with you, rooting you on and doing the best I can for you to be successful. That's your choice. And as for me, in my house, I'm going to always choose the latter, unless it's going to get my kids killed. And then I'm going to. I'm going to call in the cavalry. Then, bro, it's an honor to talk to you. It's an like honor to hear a father who loves his son. And it's an honor to hear a man who is honest about his past mistakes in his marriage and his in the act of redemption in marriage part two. It is this is an honor to talk to you and tell your son I'm proud of him and I'm grateful for his service and send me a wedding invite not to kick you while you're down, but this thing's happening and man, I wish him and your family the highest, highest success. Thank you so much, brother. We'll be right back. Let's talk about Helix Mattresses. Summer is almost over and everyone all over the place is doing last minute traveling, last minute school stuff, getting ready for the fall, getting ready for work initiatives. Right this very minute, my family and I are back in school, but also trying to soak up the last long nights of the summer before all the chaos truly begins. And I'm staying up later and I'm getting up super early and my sleep is a disaster. And when I'm not sleeping well, I'm not the best husband in the world and I'm not the best dad in the world and everything feels harder than it should be. Good sleep is the foundation of me being the father and the husband and the friend and the community member that I need to be. And that's why I sleep on a Helix mattress. Before Helix, I tried all kinds of mattresses that were either too soft or too stiff or had memory foam that felt like quicksand. You name it, I've tried it. But Helix matched me with the perfect mattress based on how I sleep. And my wife, who I sleep next to. They've even got options for couples who need different feels on the same bed. It's incredible. Take the Helix Sleep quiz. It's online and it takes like two minutes or less and they'll match you with the right mattress just for you. And right now, my audience can save big during their Labor Day sale with the best offer on Helix you're going to find anywhere. 27% off site wide exclusive for the listeners of the Dr. John DeLoney Show. Go to helixsleep.com DeLoney and get 27 off site wide. That's Helix. H E l I x sleep.com Deloney with Helix. Better sleep starts right now. All right, Kelly, I'm I the problem.

[Kelly]

All right. So today's question is from Claire in Phoenix, Arizona.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What's up, Claire?

[Kelly]

And she writes, I just found out that my 19 year old daughter has been drinking with her friends who are also all underage. They do it at a friend's house where she usually spends the night with all the other girls. She came home yesterday with a headache and she doesn't know how many drinks she had. Her dad has been sober for 11 months, so there's a lot of alcoholism on his side of the family. We've had many conversations about it and she says she understands the risks but that peer pressure is real. I don't believe that the friend's parents know this is happening in their house. I want to tell them, but she says that I'm going to risk my relationship with her if I do. Am I the problem if I tell these parents.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

This is complicated because she's 19? What do you think, Kelly?

[Kelly]

You don't get to. Nope. You don't get the cough out and ask me first as I have a 19 year old at home.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Kelly]

So I can say a little bit. I think I would call the parents. I think I would call parents because they need to know what's happening under their roof. Now if the 19 year old, the other kids lived on their own, there's.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Not a lot you can do.

[Kelly]

There's a lot I can do and.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But I'd probably still call if I had a relationship with my kids. Roommates and there was a bunch of unrest, drinking, going at their house. I'd call their parents too and let everybody. I want all the adults in the room to know. And 19 year olds aren't adults. I also don't take threats from 19 year olds very seriously unless they're self harm threats. And so when a 19 year old's like, I'm gonna. Not ever. Okay, whatever. I'd rather you be alive and hate me than not. Right. So yeah, I'm gonna call.

[Kelly]

Yeah, I would call because it's under their roof. They need to know what's happening. And if something bad happened at their house and they're like, you knew.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Exactly.

[Kelly]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And if one of those 19, they're idiots. Drinks himself to death and I knew about. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not living with that on my conscience. And, and your 19 year old may say, I'm moving out and I don't want to talk to you anymore and I'm cutting you off for a year or two years or whatever. And that's a very real. Probably not because you pay their car insurance and their cell phone and all that. Probably not, but that may be a risk. Right. Some 19 year olds are ready to buck up and say, I'm on my own. Bye, Felicia, and more power to them. But yeah, I'm gonna, I'm gonna make the call. I am. Yeah, but that's a messy one. That's 19 years old.

[Kelly]

Yeah, if it's 16, 17, no question, no brainer. Yeah, because you're minors. But it's still illegal.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's illegal. And I'm gonna make this, I'm gonna say this. If my kid is on my payroll, they're on my payroll. So you're doing what I say. It's kind of like when, when 23 year olds are like, dude, my parents still give me a curfew. Do you live in their house? Yeah, but I grew. I don't. I'm stopped right there. You live in their house, they get to make the rules. And then you get to decide not if their rules are fair or if you like them. You get to decide, do I want to live here or not, Period. End of story. And so, yeah, I'm gonna make that call. I am. And that's probably over. Paternalistic. But I man, that's. My whole career is when those parties go bad, do they always. No. Do they? Most of the time, no. But my whole career is when they do. When somebody drinks too much and they get us, they get sexually assaulted. When somebody drinks too much and drives home when somebody drinks too much and fill in the blank.

[Kelly]

Well, and the parents that own the house, there could be a liability on their end.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes.

[Kelly]

If they don't do something. So.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah, I'm definitely gonna say something. Yeah. Good call. Thanks for letting me talk that out loud. And Ben is in here shaking his head no, dude, let the kids party. I'm just kidding. He's not doing that. Your wife's an attorney. You know, too. You know that's right. Hey, love you guys. Stay in school. Don't do drugs. Be nice. Bye.