My Husband Spanks Our Kids (I Don’t Like It)

Summary

The Dr. John Delony Show

Episode: My Husband Spanks Our Kids (I Don’t Like It)
Date: March 13, 2026 (Ramsey Network)

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Overview

This episode features Dr. John Delony fielding tough, emotionally charged questions from callers about parenting differences, relationship trauma, weight loss, and “Am I the Problem?” family finance topics. The episode is marked by deeply empathetic, candid advice rooted in Dr. Delony’s blend of practicality, emotional insight, and respect for lived experience. Three main calls are addressed in the episode:

1. Paige (Dallas, TX): Struggles with her husband’s disciplinary methods toward their children, especially spanking.
2. Katie: Asks for guidance on how to handle discovering she was sexually assaulted by her fiancé while unconscious.
3. Lauren (Phoenix, AZ): Wants advice on discussing her significant weight loss journey with her kids in a healthy way.
4. Sarah (Wisconsin): Questions if she’s wrong for wanting her adult son to pay his own insurance.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

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1. Paige – Parenting Conflict: Spanking and Breaking the Cycle

[00:05 – 13:44]

• Paige’s Background (00:05–03:50):
  • Paige is the primary caregiver for three young children.
  • Her husband comes home from work and quickly resorts to spanking for minor misbehaviors.
  • Paige feels physically triggered by her husband’s actions due to her own childhood spent in abusive environments.
  • She struggles not to project her own trauma but recognizes her husband’s anger, which he doesn’t seem aware of.
• Delony’s Response (03:50–13:44):
  • “If a five-year-old can emotionally dysregulate an adult, you’re not okay.” (Dr. John Delony, 07:04)
  • Focus less on ‘spanking vs. not spanking,’ and more on the underlying anger and emotional immaturity.
  • Discipline should be about fostering behavior change, not dispensing punishment from a place of anger.
  • Dr. Delony notes the cyclical nature of generational trauma: people who grew up being hit are often quick to become reactive as parents.
  • Advises Paige to have an open, connected conversation with her husband expressing that his frustration scares her and is harmful.
  • Emphasizes: “Kids need emotionally regulated adults in their house. Never, never hit a kid when you’re angry or mad—ever, ever, ever, ever, ever.” (13:37)
  • Suggests clear boundaries: “I can’t have that because that’s not about discipline—it’s about you being pissed off.” (13:22)

Memorable Moment:

• Paige’s honest reflection on how baby triggers bring back her childhood:
  • Paige: “It throws me back to when I was a kid… just triggers. I know those are my triggers. I don’t need to put them on my husband.” (04:08)

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2. Katie – Trauma & Relationship Betrayal: Sexual Assault by Fiance

[18:07 – 32:35]

• Katie’s Story (18:07–21:24):
  • Recently had outpatient surgery, was unconscious due to double pain medication.
  • Woke up to her fiancé performing a sexual act on her, which she had no memory or capacity to consent to.
  • Partner justified by saying “your body seemed to be… you seemed like you were enjoying it.”
• Delony’s Immediate, Uncompromising Response:
  • “That’s rape. That’s what that is.” (20:16)
  • Katie shares her confusion, anger, guilt, and sense of devastation—“He’s destroyed our entire life.” (23:46)
  • Dr. Delony reassures her that her feelings are justified, she’s not crazy, and there’s no ambiguity—her relationship is over.
  • Outlines first steps: prioritize safety; “He needs to go,” or she must leave immediately if not safe.
  • Affirms the trauma’s complexity and the waves of emotions that follow such betrayal: “It’s like being in an ocean, and it just waves and waves and waves.” (25:47)
  • Candor about the implication: “Everything in your relationship is over now. It’s not different now, it’s over now.” (24:12)
  • Insists Katie connect with in-person support; “You cannot navigate this by yourself. It’s too big.” (30:14)
  • Reminds her (and listeners): guilt belongs nowhere near the survivor.

Memorable Quotes:

• Dr. John Delony: “You deciding to seek safety does not make you a bad person. He blew this thing up.” (29:23)
• Dr. John Delony: “Staying will kill you from the inside out.” (31:58)
• Katie: “I just want to walk away. Like, I don’t even want to tell him. Like, I just want to be done with the situation.” (32:02)

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3. Lauren – Talking to Kids About Weight Loss & Modeling Healthy Change

[35:38 – 48:18]

• Lauren’s Journey (35:38–36:36):
  • Decided to lose over 130 lbs for health, not aesthetic reasons.
  • Wants to model positivity without causing her children to develop body image issues.
• Delony’s Advice (36:36–48:18):
  • Commends Lauren's intentionality, noting, “The greatest gift you can give your kids… is to let them see their mom celebrate wins, be sad, and keep going.” (37:33)
  • Focus on modeling healthy behaviors: eating well, exercising, and letting go of the “shoulds” around body size.
  • Avoid obsessing over scale numbers with children; instead, highlight actions—“I’m exercising and eating really healthy foods. I’m taking care of myself. Period.” (43:31)
  • Cautions against demonizing foods; teach kids moderation and agency: “There’s no bad foods, there’s unhealthy amounts.” (41:22)
  • Acknowledge that significant weight loss will unearth emotions—grief, shame, pride.
  • Encourages frequent check-ins and measuring success by function (e.g., doing a push-up) vs. weight.
  • Praises Lauren’s approach: “If you wake up every day and say, ‘I’m worth an hour. I want to feel the best I possibly can…’ then you’ll do that the rest of your life.” (48:51)
• Quote:
  • Lauren: “My five-year-old is so intuitive… I want to talk to him plainly and also not make it a big deal.” (43:26)
  • Dr. John Delony: “Just know, with every 10 to 25 pounds you lose, you’ll unearth things.” (44:11)

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4. Sarah – “Am I the Problem?”: Financial Boundaries with Launching Kids

[51:17 – 53:30]

• Sarah’s Dilemma:
  • Her 21-year-old son, about to be married and buy a house, is still on her insurance; she thinks he should pay his own way.
  • Her husband disagrees, not wanting confrontation.
• Delony’s Position:
  • No, Sarah’s not too harsh; financial independence is part of adulthood.
  • “If you’re old enough to get married, buy a house, you’re for sure old enough to pay your own insurance.” (53:22)
  • Clear, direct family conversations recommended; “Clarity is kindness here.”
  • If parents financially support adult children, they get to set terms/rules; entitlement to both autonomy and parental financial support doesn’t work.

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Notable Quotes & Timestamps

• “If a five-year-old can emotionally dysregulate an adult, you’re not okay.”
   —Dr. John Delony (07:04)
• “Kids need emotionally regulated adults in their house. Never, never hit a kid when you’re angry or mad—ever, ever, ever, ever, ever.”
   —Dr. John Delony (13:44)
• “That’s rape. That’s what that is.”
   —Dr. John Delony (20:16)
• “Everything in your relationship is over now. … It’s over now.”
   —Dr. John Delony (24:12)
• “Clarity is kindness here.”
   —Dr. John Delony (53:00)
• Lauren: “My five-year-old… notices everything. I want to be able to talk to him plainly and also not make it a big deal.” (43:26)

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Memorable Moments

• Dr. Delony’s refusal to rationalize or soft-pedal sexual assault, offering immediate, clear validation and steps for Katie.
• His call to break the intergenerational cycle of physical discipline by focusing on the anger beneath the behavior, not just the method.
• Empathetic, practical tips for parents wanting to break cycles around food, weight, and body image for their kids.
• Strong boundaries advocated in family finances—parents can set rules if they’re financially supporting adult children.

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Timestamps for Major Segments

| Segment | Time | Topic | |---------|----------|-----------------------------------------------| | 1 | 00:05 | Paige – Parenting & Spanking | | 2 | 18:07 | Katie – Assault by Fiance | | 3 | 35:38 | Lauren – Weight Loss & Parenting Discussion | | 4 | 51:17 | Sarah – “Am I the Problem?” (Finances) |

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Summary Takeaways

• Parenting disagreements, especially tied to childhood trauma, require empathy, clarity, and an insistence on emotional regulation over reactive discipline.
• Sexual assault in a relationship is non-negotiable: Safety and support come first, and the relationship is fundamentally ruptured by such a violation.
• Modeling health for kids is best done through positive actions, not numbers or shame; celebrate capability, consistency, and honesty.
• Parents have the right to establish financial boundaries and expectations with adult children launching into the world. Clarity prevents entitlement and resentment.

Dr. John Delony offers compassionate, unwaveringly direct advice, focusing on safety, self-worth, and honest relationships at all levels.

Transcript

[Paige]

I'm home alone with the kids all day long and he's at work and then he comes in and then something tiny goes on and he's like, okay, it just goes out to the wind.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

How do I get to the thing beneath the thing? And that is I've got an angry husband who is taking it out on a five year old. Hey, what's going on? This is Josh with the Dr. John DeLoney Show. Taking your calls from all over the planet about whatever you're going through, your mental and emotional health, your, your relationships, your kids, your marriages, whatever you got, your in laws for the last 20 plus years now been sitting with hurting people trying to figure out what's the next right move in their lives, in the lives of those they love and what can they control, what can they cannot control. And where do we go from here? So glad that you're with us. If you want to be on the show, go to john deloney.com, ask a s k, fill out the form and we'll get you hooked up. Let's go to Dallas, Texas and talk to Paige. What's up, Paige?

[Paige]

Hi, Dr. John.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

How are you?

[Paige]

I'm okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. Okay. What's going on?

[Paige]

So how do I tell my husband that I don't want to raise our kids the same way he was raised?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Husband? I don't want to raise our kids the same way you raised. I'm sure that that, like that that probably hasn't worked. Tell me what's going on.

[Paige]

So we have three kids ranging from five to almost nine months. And I was raised. It was a new year. I was kind of reflecting on how I wanted to parent and what I wanted to change and everything. And I was raised in a split household. Both of them were abusive in their own ways. And my husband was raised in a single household. But there was some things that I see as abusive, but he is just oblivious.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, tell me about him. Well, let me start it this way. If you start, if you head into this challenge as I have a better view than he does, or my view is right and his is wrong, or I've got clarity and he's oblivious, he'll feel that.

[Katie]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And then the conversation won't be about kids, it'll be about right and wrong, who's winning and who's losing.

[Paige]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You get what I'm saying? And so there's, there's something about, I want to be, enter into something unless it's just outright, you know, like over the top abusive. Right. Or even under, under the, like Any, any sort of abuse, obviously I'm not going to be curious. I'm going to walk right in there and try to be like, stop it. Right. But if it comes to, I want to do this, but he wants to do this, or he values that, or I value this walking into it, like, well, he's clearly oblivious to X, Y or Z is, it's not a way to solve a problem. And so get me, get underneath it with me. What are some things that you, your body says, whoa, I don't like this. That he says, this is the way I want to do it.

[Paige]

The main one is anytime that my kids like or that our kids do something that's like, okay, well let's redirect them, he just automatically goes to thinking, ah, okay. And that's the big one. And I'm home alone with the kids all day long and he's at work. So it's kind of like I've managed the kids the way that I have all day. And then he comes in and then something tiny goes on and he's like, okay, it just goes out to the wind.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Gotcha. And so you have a physical reaction when you see your husband hit your kids.

[Paige]

I tell him to stop, but he does not.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

No, but tell me about what's going on inside your chest.

[Paige]

Oh, like it just, it throws me back to whenever I was a kid and both, both of my dads were just one less than the other. But like, it just throws me back to that. And I thought I had managed it, but there's like triggers. And I know those are my triggers. I don't need to put them on my husband.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But yeah, but, but they're, but you also have a lived experience too. That's real. And you can also, you have a radar for swatting a kid and you have a radar for a frustrated, angry, just coming home from work dad who's taking it out on a five year old.

[Paige]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Get what I'm saying?

[Paige]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And that's a very, those are two very different things. And so I, I, I've got my own very entrenched, firm positions on spanking. I won't talk about those here. What I want to talk about with you is how do I get to the thing beneath the thing? And that is I've got an angry husband who is taking it out on a five year old on a three year old. And that can't happen.

[Paige]

Yeah.

[Katie]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so it's less about this big, the third rail issue here is I'm gonna spank my kids Whatever. Or no one's ever gonna correct my children. Whatever. Right. The bigger issue here is, I'm guessing you can tell me if I'm wrong, is you see a guy that's taking stuff out on children and that's not right.

[Paige]

Yes.

[Katie]

Okay.

[Paige]

And my husband, when we were dating, because we had talked a little bit, I had my daughter, we started dating when she was about eight months. So I had my daughter before we had gotten together and we had talked like a little bit about parenting, but. And like at that time we were on the same page. But like with every single kid, it's kind of changed.

[Katie]

Yeah. And.

[Paige]

But his view on it hasn't changed. And whenever we talked about it when we were dating, I thought he was over exaggerating and he was like, well, my dad drop kicked me and I'm fine. And I was like, I reacted to it. I was like, that's not okay. But all right,

[Dr. John DeLoney]

here's how I know he's not fine. He allows a five year old to enrage him to the point of. Of hitting. Right. That tells me he's not okay. That if a 5 year old can emotionally dysregulate an adult, you're not okay.

[Paige]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

If a 5 year old can. A 5 year olds will annoy you for the end of. Till the end of time. That's what five year olds do. And three year olds and eight months old cr. Eight month olds scream and cry like that's, that's being their children. And drop kicking a kid because I got drop kicked is, is. It's unacceptable. It's madness.

[Paige]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Right.

[Paige]

And I mean, at that point I would have drawn the line and something would have had to happen.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Of course I get that. I get that. But here's the. The deeper issue is you drawing a line and saying the point of any sort of discipline, or I would say correction, is a behavior change. And adults navigate what is the best path for behavior change. Right.

[Katie]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

We don't go into every situation with our hammer because every situation's a nail and that's emotional maturity. So let me ask you this. Does he have anger issues in other places?

[Paige]

Sometimes, yes, whenever he's frustrated. But he's not like, it doesn't really get aggressive in that way. It just goes towards like cussing and verbal.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Paige]

But it's never towards me. It hasn't ever been towards me.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But does your body begin to withdraw or shut down? Because it remembers

[Paige]

sometimes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. That's what I want to work through. I want y' all to work through okay. Okay. Almost without fail. And I'm going to use his words. Kids that were drop kicked and then also patted on the head and told they were loved and this is for you. And this is what you get. They grow up with a sense of inner rage and anger that is hard to describe. You get what I'm saying?

[Katie]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so it doesn't surprise me that your body feels. Goes, whoa. And it backs out. Okay.

[Katie]

Okay.

[Paige]

And I usually just shut down because

[Dr. John DeLoney]

of course that's what kept you safe growing up. And so the hardest thing for you is to enter into this conversation. Of course I'm trusting you that he's safe and he's not abusive and he's not knocking holes in the sheetrock and stuff like that.

[Paige]

No.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But if you sit down and tell him, hey, I love you and I sense inside of you an anger and a rage. It's coming out on our kids and I can't have that.

[Katie]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And I honor that. You don't. I mean, honestly, I honor you because nobody, I mean, it's, it's kind of like, like that you're like, you're not supposed to hit things. Right. So I'm not going to like celebrate you for not hitting things. Right. But I think him not having peace in his own chest inside of his own house is going to recreate the dynamic he grew up with. It's going to recreate the dynamic you grew up with. Just, it's going to look a little bit different.

[Katie]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Is that fair?

[Paige]

Yes, that's fair.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. So the, the approach though is how can we connect here? And if his response is, I'm not mad, I'm not angry about anything, then you can like just, I mean, smile and say, there it is. Right. If you sat down and, and looked him in the eye and held his hand and said, I need you to hear me say this, I love you. And when your frustration builds, it scares me. What would he say?

[Paige]

I honestly have no idea.

[Katie]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

A, that's telling to me, That's either telling that you've kept parts of yourself from him just to stay safe. And either because you have to. I love that. I love that noise. Either because you have to or because you haven't opened up yet.

[Paige]

I think some of it is that I don't remember it as well. There have, like, my past was. I've experienced probably almost every form of abuse in my childhood between my two households. And like just a few years ago, one of the really big things just came up and I just remembered it. And so I think it might be that I don't remember everything that I've been through, so I can't. He knows what I, what I remember and what I remember telling him. But, like, every once in a while something will happen and I'm like, oh, my gosh, I can't believe I forgot about that happening. And then I would tell him, yeah, but he's actually the first one that I told.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, well. And that's, that's awesome. That's amazing. I, I, I, I deeply care. Okay? So I'm saying, I'm hear me say that I deeply, deeply care. But also in the present, what matters most to me is your body is going into fight or flight or shutdown. And so something that's happening in your present is signaling your body. Oh, here we go again. And so the specific details of what happened in the past between, like, those will emerge. Your body actually, like, does a good job of, like, hey, we don't need to rethink all that stuff because we got to get up and go get on with our day. Right. And so, like, sometimes forgetting is like the body keeps the score, as Vander Kolk says. But if your mind thought about that 24, 7, 365, all of those scary, terrifying, awful memories, it would be incapacitating. Right?

[Paige]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What matters is, hey, when you come in the door and you're in a bad mood, and our five year old, he says, pick that up. And our five year old goes, no, Daddy. And you just walk up and wallop him. I can't have that because that's not about discipline. It's not about correction. It's about you're pissed off.

[Katie]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's not about you redirecting behavior. And I can't have that. And my hope is, my deep, deep hope is he hears that. And if you say, I've been through this in my home, I can't have it again. I won't recreate it. I won't let it be recreated. My hope is my God, dude. My deepest hope and prayer is that he goes, oh, God, I don't want to be like that. And if there's some way that he will hear you, not, not over him, not I see something you don't. But, hey, I want. I love you so much. I need you to see this. You say that the way you were beat up as a kid didn't affect you. I'm telling you, I feel it. It did. It did. Kids need emotionally regulated adults in their house. Never, never, never hit a kid when you're angry or mad ever, ever, ever, ever, ever. I would say don't hit kids. That's a different conversation. If you're frustrated, walk away. If you're mad, walk away. If you're angry, heartbroken. If you're embarrassed, if you're humiliated, walk away. When we come back, a woman asks if her fiance sexually assaulted her while she was unconscious. My God. We'll be right back. All right. Over the last week I went to church. I did a set at a comedy club, I spoke at a corporate live event, I recorded some shows, and I even worked out in my yard in all of these different places. I was wearing poncho shirts. Why? Because poncho shirts are amazing. And I know that you know this because I'm starting to see you all wearing poncho shirts too. I'm seeing you in the audiences. I'm seeing you sit by me at church. I'm even seeing poncho shirts on my co workers and and everybody's hitting me up for poncho. That's because they're the best men's performance shirts anywhere. Head to ponchooutdoors.com Deloney and get yours. Right now. I want to talk about a few of my favorites. Poncho denim has that soft broken in feel. It's got a little bit of stretch. It's like you've worn it a million times but it still rules. And poncho flannels, like the one I'm wearing right now, they come in original or western styles, slim or regular fit. They are the softest shirts you will ever own and they're super tough yet also comfortable. I love poncho shirts. I wear them everywhere. You should too. Head to poncho outdoors.com deloney and get 10 bucks off your first order when you sign up with your email. Again, that's poncho outdoors.com DeLoney for 10 bucks off. Two things my listeners care about deeply are raising great healthy kids and sleeping well. And this is why for both of those things, I trust Beam. It's why I used Beam products in my own home. When I need a great night's sleep, I drink Beam's Dream powder. It takes like 30 seconds to mix. It helps me fall asleep faster, sleep deeper and wake up clear. No grogginess, no weird chemicals, just science backed ingredients that work with your body, not against it. Things like magnesium, L theanine, melatonin and reishi and more. Comes in great flavors like sea salt, caramel and cinnamon cocoa. It is delicious. And for my kids, my Wife and I give them Beam's kids super powder. It's packed with vitamins, and my kids love drinking it, which, if you're a parent, you know that matters. Right now, BEAM is giving my listeners a great deal. Go to shop beam.com DeLoney and use code DeLoney to get $20 all Beam products that shop S H O P. Shop beam.com DeLoney and use Code DeLoney to get 20 bucks off all Beam products. All right, let's go out to Orlando and talk to Katie. Hey, Katie, what's going on?

[Katie]

Hey there.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What's happening?

[Katie]

So I. A situation happened a couple months ago that I haven't told anyone about, and I don't know how to feel about it or how to proceed or. Or. I. I just don't know. But.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Hold on, hold on. Am I the right person to. To be the first person you tell?

[Katie]

I would love the most unbiased of perspectives. Absolutely.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. Do you have a safe person that you, like a friend, a counselor, or something in your area that you. That you can talk to also?

[Katie]

Yeah, absolutely. I just really don't understand, like, how to confront the situation with my partner or even how to feel about it.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

What happened.

[Katie]

I don't. I don't feel unsafe in this situation. I just. I just don't know what to do or don't have to think about it, but. So I had an outpatient surgery, and upon leaving, a fancy picked me up from the surgery center. We go home. He gives me medication that was prescribed. I was very out of it from the anesthesia, but there, I guess he had misread what medicine was supposed to go first. So I ended up taking, like, a double dose of pain medication. And so I was out of it, like, I have no recollection completely asleep. And I woke up to my fiance performing, like, a sexual act on me.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And I'm so sorry.

[Katie]

I, like, immediately, like, like, like, jump back. I'm like, what are you doing? And he just was like. I was, you know, trying to. I'm trying to think of the best ways to phrase this right now, but, you know, trying to. I was trying to, you know, pleasure you right now. And I'm like, what? I'm like, I was, like, unconscious. Like, I have no recollection of how that even occurred. And his response was, well, you know, your body seemed to be. You seemed like you were enjoying it. And I'm like, oh, God.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay, here's the deal. That's rape.

[Katie]

Agreed.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That's what that is. Okay.

[Katie]

I. I tried to explain to Him.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm like, stop, stop. I'm done talking about him. Okay. For now. I'm sorry that happened.

[Paige]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And I know that he has blown up your entire world.

[Katie]

He's changed everything, everything

[Dr. John DeLoney]

from the inside out.

[Katie]

I'm. I'm so mad at him.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah. Yes.

[Katie]

I don't. I don't know. Like, what do I even do? What do I even say? Like. Like, I don't even know the person. I don't even know him. Like, who are you?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes, yes. Yes. Katie, I'm so sorry.

[Katie]

I don't know, like, how to. What to even do. Like,

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I. There's. There's just an order of things here, and order. Step number one is get to a place where you're safe. Y' all share. Do y' all live together?

[Katie]

Oh, yeah. Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That he needs to go. And if you're economically unstable, if it's his place, then priority number one is you need to find a safe place to go asap. Because you might think in your mind, I'm safe. I'm safe, I'm safe. I'm not scared of him or whatever. But your body knows I can't even sleep.

[Katie]

Like, everything has just been so wrong since then.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And yes, yes, and yes, your body would be failing you if it let you go to sleep at night.

[Katie]

It's like I'm living with a stranger. It's like, who even I. And it's been a few weeks now, so you. Like, I feel like I. I.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Is this. Is this the first time this has happened to you?

[Katie]

It is.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. I need you to hear me say these words, and I want you to metabolize them as best you can. Okay? You're not crazy. And if you start saying things like I should by now, and I have to, and it's all. I want you to catch yourself in those moments. Okay?

[Paige]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And this is. This is huge. Huge. Huge. On 50 different levels. And that. That's why it feels so overwhelming and so big.

[Katie]

It's more like I feel just incredibly angry that I. He's just destroyed our entire life.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes. He's destroyed yours.

[Paige]

And I'm.

[Katie]

I'm mad that I feel guilty. I'm mad that I'm questioning, like, yes, anything. I didn't do anything wrong. And I. I just.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes.

[Katie]

This is not fair. And I just don't know.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes. So I'll say this as boldly as I can. Everything in your relationship is over now.

[Katie]

You're right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

It's not that. It's different now. It's over now. And I'll run through some of the layers. If we were sitting together, I would do this way, way slower. Okay. But I'm. I'm going to run through some of the layers here. Layer number one, the. The disbelief and the. You. You call it guilt. I. I have a different word for it, but that I. I get the. The sentiment that you feel. How in the world did I get to a place where I would share. Consider sharing my life with a guy like that?

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And it makes you feel crazy. You're not crazy. How in the world does a person do this to somebody else? What else do I not know about him?

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

There's no way that person. I'm going to anchor into that person for the rest of our life and marry them. They're a rapist. I both want to call the cops and have this guy go to jail. And I also want to hug him and say, what's the matter with you? And I also want to hit him as hard as I can, all at the same time.

[Katie]

Me too.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm saying I'm pretending I'm you right now. Right. Like, all of it. Right. And so it. And I could go on and on and on. It's all of these layers, and it will come over you and over you and over you. It's like. It's like being in an ocean, and it just waves and waves and waves.

[Katie]

I.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But, yeah, you're. You're not crazy. Here's where you would be crazy if you haven't had the thought, what else has happened that I didn't know about?

[Katie]

Constantly. That's.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes.

[Katie]

Constantly.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah. How would this even enter a person's head?

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Right. And so I, I. If you've listened to my show ever, you know, you will know how rare this is. But I would say you need to get out.

[Katie]

Yeah, I think that's what I've been telling myself. But I'm also like, you know, I. You lose. I don't know why I feel this way, but it's almost like I'm telling myself that you lose, like, a certain level of autonomy when you're in, you know, a committed relationship. And then I'm also like, that's absolutely nuts. Like, to even think that way.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You explain that to me.

[Katie]

Like, I. In a. Like, in a marriage, we're. We're living together, we're sleeping together every day. Like, you know, maybe that's just okay in a relationship. Like, but then I'm also like, that's absolutely insane, too.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Even yeah. Giving up autonomy is not rape. Co creating a world together with somebody, choosing to put both feet in the boat is trust. This is in my opinion the grossest violation of trust there is. So yeah, I give up autonomy. You're right. Like when I chose to get married, I chose to say I'm not just going to make every decision in my life for the rest of my life. I am going to share that decision making and co create a world together with somebody. You're right. But the only way that works is if I implicitly, with everything I am, trust that person. Not just with my physical body, but with my mind, with my spirit, with my dreams, with my values, with my when I fail. And that's why this is such a mind altering, like a life altering event is it takes all of that away at the same time. It just severs the cord.

[Katie]

I'm pretty sure I've felt that way since then. And it's like our relationship has not been the same since.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

No, because he blew it to smithereens. Every decision you make from this point forward will be because he did what he did.

[Katie]

You're right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You deciding to seek safety does not make you a bad person. I can't believe you. Give me another. You blew this thing up. And let me, let me say this. This is critically, critically important that you get some people in your corner. You cannot navigate this by yourself. It's too big. Okay. Do you have a couple of friends you can call today?

[Katie]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I sit with them in person, not text.

[Katie]

Yeah. I need to do that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm asking you, will you?

[Katie]

I'm going to do it.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Thank you.

[Katie]

I need to do that. I've been just like holding on to this for so long, like just alone.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I know you don't want it to be true.

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm so disgusted. On the, on, on behalf of husbands and fiances and men who love the women in their lives. Just know I'm disgusted and I'm heartbroken and I'm sick and I'm pissed off. On your behalf,

[Katie]

I appreciate that. I thank you. Thank you for taking my call. I. Like I said, I've just been holding on to this alone for so long.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah. And it. There will be times when it feels like a dam has broken and you can't hold it all back. And that's why you got to have other people with you because you can't hold it all back.

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Paige]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I hate this for you.

[Katie]

Me too.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You have an, an army of people with you. Okay.

[Katie]

I appreciate that. A Lot.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And make no mistake, your steps forward are very, very hard. Finding a place to live, finding bills, moving the couch out, taking your clothes, all of that stuff. There's a reality to that that people don't think through sometimes. And it's all hard. All of it. Okay.

[Katie]

You're right. And I'm. And I'm ready to do that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And staying will kill. Staying will kill you from the inside out.

[Katie]

You're right about that. Been horrible few weeks and I. Yeah, I think I've been ready to make that decision. I just needed validation in that regard. Yeah, I just want to walk away. Like I don't even want to tell him. Like, I just want to be done with the situation.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. Today. And that's good. Do what's right for today.

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And then tomorrow you'll do what's right tomorrow and the day after that and the day after that.

[Katie]

That's good advice.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And there'll be days you don't want to get out of bed. And there's going to be days that you feel great. There's going to be days that you are so overwhelmed with rage and anger. There's going to days be days that you second guess yourself and you're like, I'm crazy. It wasn't that big. All of that is completely normal. You're going to feel nuts. And that's why I'm telling you you're not crazy. And for those moments when your body's just ping ponging all over the place trying to make sense of a new world that you now live in where somebody you were going to marry would hurt you and take advantage of you in that way and in such an amazingly vulnerable moment. That's why you got to have other people with you so they can see clearly when you can't. Okay. With all my heart and all my spirit and all my guts, I hate this happen to you. You call anytime. Thanks for trusting me. Today's day one. We come back a woman asks how to talk to her kids about her weight loss journey in a healthy way. Love this question. Be right back. Hey, I want to take a second and talk to you about love. Not the Titanic, I'll never let go kind of nonsense love. I'm talking about a love that moves you to take care of the people closest to you. I'm talking about term life insurance from Xander. Insurance. If you have anyone depending on you, spouses, kids or anyone you need term life insurance. My wife and I trust Xander for our term life insurance to take care of our loved ones. If Something happens. I've used Xander for years, long before I started this show. Because I trust them when it comes to term life. Here's the deal. You should get coverage of 10 to 12 times your income because that gives your family real protection so that if the unthinkable happens, your family can spend their time grieving and not worrying about where their next meal will come from. Zander makes buying term life insurance simple with clear guidance and honest support. They help you figure out the right amount of coverage for you and your family. Then they shop all the top companies to find the best price. Getting term life insurance is a way of saying I love you, especially when you can no longer say it yourself. Go to Xander.com or call 1-800-356-4282 and get term life insurance the right way. That's Xander.com. all right, let's go out to Phoenix, Arizona and talk to Lauren. What's up, Lauren?

[Katie]

Hey, Dr. John. I am so excited to be here talking to you today. Thanks for taking the call.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Oh, thank you. I'm excited to be talking to you. What's going on?

[Katie]

So I am currently on a health journey and a byproduct of that health journey is going to be a pretty significant amount of weight loss, plus or minus like 130 pounds.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah, dude. Okay, so what sparked this? What sparked this journey?

[Katie]

I'm just done. I. I need longevity in my life. I have lots of genetic risk factors for diabetes, heart conditions, cancers. And the path on my now is just won't get me to that goal.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Can I tell you, like, I'm so proud of you.

[Katie]

Thanks. It's been a long time coming, but

[Dr. John DeLoney]

you get to that sick and tired of being sick and tired moment, right?

[Katie]

Yeah. It has to happen. And I've worked through a lot of stuff that has brought the fear of losing it up. And I'm just ready to, like, get past those feelings and take them head on and, you know.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes. I'm so proud of you. All right, so how can I help?

[Katie]

So my question today is how do I talk to my kids about the impending body changes in a way that's positive and constructive but doesn't make them feel like they have to change anything about themselves?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Gotcha. So, man, that's such a great question. Thanks a good. And good on you for asking that question. That's amazing.

[Katie]

I'm so worried that I'm going to screw them up, John.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Oh, we're all going to screw up our kids. It's all good. It's all good. As long as they know that we love them for all the. And who they are is. Is. Is awesome. All right. So are your kids overweight?

[Katie]

Well, I guess they're not. No. My kids are very healthy. My son has a higher B, but he is. He's kind of on the shorter side, but he's really stocky. His dad is six foot six.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay.

[Katie]

They have tall jeans in them. Yeah. Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Okay. So. And BMI is great at the epidemiological level, at the society level, but there's so much nuance. My BMI is technically puts me in the not ideal category, but I'm a muscular guy, I'm a big guy. And so. But over. But people who throw it out and like, it's stupid. It's not if you look at like a population level and it doesn't tell a full story. So all I say is, here's the. The. The. The greatest gift you can give your kids right now is to let their mom see their mom celebrate, wins, see their mom be sad and see their mom keep going. Where this could get sideways is, is if you pledge your allegiance to the number on a scale.

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

If you pledge your allegiance to address size. Now, you and I, I am working towards a target number right now for weight. Okay?

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I'm not losing any. I don't near anywhere the courage you have right now. Okay. I don't. Right. But you and I both know it would be unreasonable for us to not say, hey, there's a number we'd like to hit.

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I don't announce that number to my kids.

[Katie]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I do make sure. Well, I mean, we have a gym in our garage, so I make sure that I'm working out. Both of my kids, as they walked out the door today to go to school, saw their dad lifting weights.

[Katie]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That's what's important. Both of my kids see me eat relatively healthy. And last night I took my daughter on a date and we got a milkshake and she saw that too. What she didn't know is it was I was keeping a ballpark of my caloric intake for the day. She didn't know that.

[Katie]

Right, Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But she saw her dad smiling, we laughed, and then we went. Tried on dress. I didn't try on dresses, but she did. All right, so. But like. So it's. It's seeing a healthy picture of what life looks like.

[Katie]

Okay. So I have a lot of cognitive dissonance around this because I have felt the need to be smaller like the. The should haves I should. Since I was in sixth grade. I can remember the first time I became aware of my body and I've always been told I should be smaller. And so for a majority of my life, a lot of it was internalized because of the ways that other people talked about their own bodies and their own weight. And there were some things specifically. Like in eighth grade, I went on weight Weight Watchers. When I was 16, I went to the pediatrician for a sports physical and was told that I was obese and I was full time sports. So I've always known that. I've cut, I've, I've kind of always been quote unquote bigger.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Sure.

[Katie]

But I did a lot of untangling, worked with somebody and peeled back the layers of that and then went, oh, I don't have to listen to anything. I can do whatever I want. I. And I did do whatever I want for a couple of years. And now I'm in this position control. I had no, I had no moderation. I didn't have any of that and went off the wagon. And you know, this is the stupid tax for it. Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

So I have a couple of buddies that helped me with a couple of phrases. Can I, can I pop them in there for you?

[Katie]

Absolutely.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And these are world renowned health and fitness guys and little sayings that I've caught myself saying over the last few years and that have, I mean, my whole life that have, I've changed over the last few years. There's no bad foods, there's unhealthy amounts.

[Katie]

Right, Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so I don't ever want to demonize something with my kids like that. Like, this is bad for you. Like we, we call, like I, if you listen to the show, you know, I love gummy candies. Like, I call them garbage. Like, like, like, dad, are you gonna get some garbage tonight at the movies? I'm like, yep, I'm eating garbage. Right. I want them to know that's not good. But I'm making a choice too. Right. And what I'm teaching them in the moment is I'm in control of what I'm doing next, even if I'm making a bad decision.

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I don't ever want them to feel powerless to food. Like I have for, for a lot of my life.

[Katie]

Yes.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Right. And so we're never going to say like, we don't eat cake in this house. We might say, we're gonna make, I'm gonna make a smaller birthday cake and we're just gonna have one. One. We're gonna have it tonight and I have a small piece and they don't need to know that that hit your, your calorie goal and you had to. And you didn't eat X, Y or Z for breakfast or what. Like, they don't need to know all the details of that kind of stuff.

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

They're gonna watch what you do.

[Katie]

And so when, when my body is changing because 130 pounds is losing like an entire person. Right, so exactly. It's going. And also on this journey with me, he's, he started a few months prior to me and I talked to him about my fears and he was the one who really grounded me in. Like you're letting your, your fear of your kids feeling possibly feeling a certain way about themselves.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Amen.

[Katie]

He, you know, my feelings were being my barometer. My husband talked to me clearly and kindly and said this is, this is not a good excuse. And so I said, you're right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

He's exactly right.

[Katie]

He's a wonderful man. He's really led the charge on this. And doing it together helps. But like, how do I talk? Like if they ask a question like, mom, why is your belly getting smaller? Mom. What? Like, how do I say that plainly and factually without. I don't, I don't want it to be a big deal, but they're going, my five year old son is so intuitive, notices everything. I want to be able to talk to him plainly and also not make it a big deal.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You know, it is, is very important that you never lie to him. So.

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Mommy, why is your belly get. Why is your belly getting so much smaller? Because I'm exercising and I'm eating really healthy foods. I'm taking care of myself, period.

[Katie]

And he'll go, oh, okay, yeah, you

[Dr. John DeLoney]

know what I mean? Like, and he'll go on about his day.

[Katie]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And, and it will. This, like your marriage will change. Your sense of yourself in the world will change. And I don't know how to say this in a Right as I was about to say it, I was like, that's probably not the best way to say that.

[Katie]

Cannonball.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah. Thank you. Using my words against me, there is a. Just know for. I'm making up a number here, totally making this up. But for every 10 to 25 pounds you lose, you'll unearth things.

[Katie]

Yeah, right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And you'll feel empowered. Some days you'll feel shameful, some days you'll feel embarrassed, some days you'll feel frustrated, some days just part of it. And so it's, it's less about. I want to Avoid all that stuff. And there's just power in knowing it's coming.

[Katie]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Right. And then you're going to start sleeping so much better.

[Katie]

I already have.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yeah. And your knees aren't going to hurt as much, and your back won't hurt as much. And then you'll start to say things like, I can't believe I. And then you're gonna really grieve the last few years.

[Katie]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And then you'll look at your husband, who, by the way, he will lose weight a hundred x faster than you.

[Katie]

Oh, yeah, I already know that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And it will make you hate everything. And that's normal. Right. And then he'll start saying things like, why don't you just. And you'd be like, why don't you just. Right. All that's coming. And so it's, it's. It's less about trying to avoid all that and having a good model, a good system for when it does.

[Katie]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And so here's what I'd recommend. You and him have a 5 minute check in every week.

[Katie]

Like, okay, all right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

How we feeling? What were your wins this week? What? Your losses this week?

[Katie]

Yeah.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Right. And hopefully people have told you this, and if you haven't, this can be nightmarish. Your. Your weight loss journey will be like a stock market ticker just the wrong way. And what I mean by that is there will be weeks that you do everything perfectly, and for some unknown reason, your body will hang on to it, will retain fluid or what, and your weight will go up one week and you'll be like, oh, that sucks. And you're right to go. All that sucks. And you're right to go. That's disappointing. And then you have a choice. Are you going to go bury that in old habits or are you gonna be like, all right, I'm gonna stay on the path.

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

My buddy Jordan Syat calls it the whoosh, which is staying the same on the scale. Stay in the same, stay in the same. Goes up two pounds, staying the same, and then boom, down seven. And so it's just, it's hanging in there for that.

[Katie]

I'm trying really hard not to focus as much on the weight because I know when I'm making the right choices, my body's going to do what it needs to do.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

There you go.

[Katie]

So I've made some, like, really explicit goals that don't have with weight, like getting my A1C lower or getting, like, I want to be able to do. I've been working out consistently. My body feels good. I Want to be able to do a push up again?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes.

[Katie]

You know?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes.

[Katie]

Like, there's certain things like that that I'm like, these are markers of success that have nothing to do with the scale.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes.

[Katie]

But I also, but I also want to celebrate like the scale number. So I appreciate the advice to not talk to them about the number and that, that, that's nothing that then needs to be their concern. Because when I was little a lot of that was stuff that I internalized. My, somebody would say, oh, you know, if I could just lose the last £10 and then I'd see that I was £30 more than them. So I said, oh, I probably should lose £40.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Exactly.

[Katie]

Right. It was a lot of those shoulds.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Yes.

[Katie]

So I've been trying really hard to use markers like that as like my goal for the year is to be able to do full push ups again or sit ups or stuff like that.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

That, I mean, you are so far ahead. Amazing. And I don't want to put my bricks in your backpack, but that number will be back there in the back

[Katie]

of your mind, of course. And it, there's a piece of it that it, it is a marker. Right. It's just like BMI where it's, but

[Dr. John DeLoney]

it's not as nearly as the full

[Katie]

picture or, or Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

You've got, you've got your head screwed on straight. God, in a way I wish I had of a long time ago, which is if I can run a mile, if I can do three push ups, if I can do these things, the weight will take care of itself.

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

And that's awesome.

[Katie]

Okay.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Amazing.

[Paige]

Thanks.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

But yeah, I, I, the Sal, the Stefano with the mind pump. Guys, I, I've talked about this a lot on the show, but when he told me, if you're doing this stuff, if you're trying to change your body composition, if you're trying to lose weight, you're trying to get bigger, if you're trying to get muscles, whatever. If you're doing this because you think you're gross or you're doing this because you don't want to die, you'll quit every time.

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

If you wake up every day and say I'm worth an hour.

[Katie]

Right.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

If you wake up every day and say, I want to feel the best I possibly can today and so I'm asleep tonight, which means I got to turn YouTube off. I'm going to eat right. I'm gonna eat healthy, like, and I want to feel good. Then you'll do that the rest of your life. Because It. It's about it. Just. Even the habits are the same, but it changes your motivation. So when your kids ask, mommy, why is your tummy getting smaller? Cause I want to feel great. And I've been exercising. I've been taking care of eating really delicious, healthy foods. Oh, okay. On to the next. And that's amazing. And, yeah, I'll leave it at that. I'm proud of you, Lauren. Hey, do me a favor and keep us up to date with your journey. We'd love to celebrate you as you hit your. Your milestones. And when you hit that first push up, send us a note. We'll cheer for you. And when you get that. That magic number that you want, we'll. We'll celebrate you too. Grateful for you. We'll be right back. I just got back home from an amazing elk hunting trip in the mountains of New Mexico. I was with my son and some other men and their sons, and all of us were using Montana Knife Company knives for the duration of our trip. Why? Because Montana Knife Company knives rule. They are designed and tested and built right here in the USA by real hunters. And when we got back to our hunting camp and we got back home, we used Montana Knife Company kitchen knives to cook and eat and prepare our meals. Why? Because they're also amazing. They're razor sharp right out of the box. They're tough enough to be used every day, and they're amazing. But here's what really sells me. They stand behind their work for life. When your knives need sharpening or if they ever need to be repaired, you just send them back to Montana Knife Company and they will take care of the repairs. These are the kind of knives your grandkids will fight over someday. If you're looking for knives that are built to work and built to last, go to montanaknifecompany.com and see what's available. Right now, that's montanaknifecompanya.com all right, Kelly, what do we got?

[Sarah]

All right, we have an Am I the problem? From Sarah in Fond du Lac, Wisconsin. Sounds fancy.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Fondue. I wonder if they eat lots of.

[Sarah]

I like fondue.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

Potted cheese. Is that how you say that?

[Sarah]

I don't think potted cheese is a thing.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

I think fondue is French for potted cheese.

[Sarah]

No, it's when you take the cheese and you put it in the oil or the. The cheese or the chocolate.

[Dr. John DeLoney]

All right. Fancy, sophisticated. Can't hide money. Can we kill?

[Sarah]

Whatever. Anywho. All right. Sarah writes our son, who's almost 21 is getting married to his fiance next year. They've been together for a bit more than a year and have been living together for at least the last 8 months. I hate it, but it's his choice to make. They also have a new house or they're house hunting with no down payment. Both employed full time. He has a very good job and an apprenticeship. So I believe that our son should be paying his own insurance. The plan is the same coverage as it would be under us. And since they are now grown enough to have to marry, buy a house, and to live together, he's grown enough to pay all of his own expenses, especially by the time they get married. My husband disagrees. He thinks it's not worth the quote unquote confrontation and that we should just let it go because he's a good kid. Am I being unrealistic or too harsh?

[Dr. John DeLoney]

No, she's. You're being exactly realistic. Good for you. Awesome. So there's two things at play here. One, yes, when your kid becomes an adult, they need to pay for adult things. It blows my mind to this day when I have a buddy who's 30 and he's still on his family cell phone plan. Like, that's madness to me. But that's the world we're in right now. Or that your dad still pays your. Your mom still pays your car insurance and you're 29 years old. Like that's nuts to me. And here's the bigger picture. Moms and dads get to have their values. They do. And if you raise your kids to be independent thinkers and contributors and questioners and doers and they have permission to fail and succeed, they're going to end up with values that are different than you years. And if you're funding any part of their life, you get to make whatever rules you want to make because it's your money. And I don't know how this got controversial, but there's a whole swath of the world that's like, hey, I want to do whatever I want to do, but you still need to pay for this. And so I reject that wholeheartedly. If mom. And by. By the way, if your husband says, hey, this is a good kid, I remember struggling super, super hard. I want him launch out. Then let's sit down and have that direct conversation. We're going to pay this much for this long to help you get started. And then this is over. Otherwise it becomes this just kind of entitlement drip forever. And then it just gets gross and weird and all the lines get blurry. But also you get to say, here's what we're going to do and here's how we're going to help you. And here's my rules. And you can make up whatever rules you want, and they can be outlandish and crazy. It's your money. And then the person receiving the money gets to make a choice. Don't live by those rules and accept this gift or don't want to walk away from this gift. And there's times in my life. And by the way, this works with employers, too. Like, there's times in my life when I have said, I don't like this, but I want that money or I want that gas card or I want the whatever. And so I'll live by this. Here we go. And I was begrudging. All I did was made myself miserable. And so here's the key here. Clarity. Clarity is kindness here. So you and your husband sit down and say, okay, how long are we going to support him? And in what ways? And he can be a good kid, a great kid, an awesome young man, and still have different values at us that we don't want to support. Both things are true. And so if you're thinking, I don't want to pay for anything because I want to punish him because he's doing things I don't agree with, have that conversation with your husband. And if your husband is having flashbacks to being broke when y' all first got married and he doesn't want his son to go through that stuff, I get that. Have that conversation. But let's get to the thing beneath the thing. Beneath the thing. But no, I think if you're old enough to get married by a house, you're old. You're for sure old enough to pay for your own insurance. Jesus. Love you guys. Bye.