My Wife Had an Affair Because She Doesn’t Find Me Attractive

Summary

Episode Summary: "My Wife Had an Affair Because She Doesn’t Find Me Attractive"
The Dr. John Delony Show | Released March 5, 2025

In this emotionally charged episode of The Dr. John Delony Show, host Dr. John Delony delves deep into the intricate dynamics of relationships strained by infidelity, self-worth issues, and the complexities of forming new connections amidst grief. Through heartfelt listener calls, Dr. Delony offers compassionate advice, practical strategies, and profound insights aimed at helping individuals navigate their most challenging relationship hurdles.

---

1. Ryan’s Struggle with Infidelity and Self-Attractiveness [02:33 – 15:28]

Caller: Ryan from Jackson, Wyoming
Issue: Ryan seeks guidance after discovering his wife’s three-month affair with her boss, attributing the infidelity to her perceived lack of attraction toward him.

Key Points:

• Understanding Infidelity: Dr. Delony emphasizes that infidelity often stems from deeper relational issues rather than being solely the fault of the person who was cheated on. He advises Ryan to focus on his own actions and well-being without internalizing all the blame.

• Self-Worth and Identity: Ryan grapples with feelings of inadequacy and fears that his identity is tied to his wife’s perception of him. Dr. Delony encourages him to rebuild his self-esteem by affirming his value independently of the marriage's outcome.

• Therapeutic Steps: Both Ryan and his wife are attending therapy. Dr. Delony recommends that Ryan continue seeking professional help to navigate his emotions and make informed decisions about the future of his marriage.

Notable Quotes:

• Ryan: "I am trying to save my marriage after finding out that my wife had a three-month affair with her boss." [00:05]
• Dr. Delony: "You can only save your part of it. And she might not want to save it." [04:10]
• Ryan: "We both love each other deeply. I want to save this marriage. I love her more than I've loved anyone else in my life." [08:34]
• Dr. Delony: "The marriage you had is officially 1000% over." [13:25]

---

2. Stephanie’s New Relationship with Her Best Friend’s Husband [20:46 – 36:23]

Caller: Stephanie from Franklin, Tennessee
Issue: After the loss of her best friend to cancer and a subsequent divorce, Stephanie finds herself developing feelings for her late friend's husband. She seeks advice on how to navigate this new relationship while managing existing family dynamics.

Key Points:

• Navigating New Relationships: Dr. Delony advises Stephanie to define what "going slow" means for both parties to ensure they are on the same page regarding the pace and nature of their relationship.

• Blended Families: With both Stephanie and her new partner having multiple children, Dr. Delony highlights the importance of intentional time together to build a strong foundation without overwhelming their respective families.

• Emotional Preparedness: Acknowledging the complexities and potential emotional triggers, Dr. Delony encourages Stephanie to embrace the excitement while remaining cautious and clear about their intentions and boundaries.

Notable Quotes:

• Dr. Delony: "Enjoy the pitter patter, enjoy seeing his text pop up and you getting excited like you're 15 again." [32:52]
• Stephanie: "I told him that last week. Awesome. And, yeah, I guess I just want to know the steps that we do need to take." [27:35]
• Dr. Delony: "Let that aliveness just course through you. Make good grown-up choices." [32:52]

---

3. Stephanie’s Dilemma with Her Estranged Ex-Wife’s Sudden Appeal [39:50 – 50:45]

Caller: Stephanie from San Diego, California
Issue: Stephanie faces a moral and emotional dilemma when her estranged ex-wife, who has a history of deceit and abuse, reaches out claiming to have stage four pancreatic cancer and desires to reconnect with their five-year-old son.

Key Points:

• Verifying Intentions: Dr. Delony stresses the importance of verifying the ex-wife’s claims before taking any action, especially given her past behavior characterized by manipulation and false accusations.

• Prioritizing the Child’s Well-Being: Emphasizing the son’s best interests, Dr. Delony advises Stephanie to carefully consider the potential impact on her child and to protect him from possible emotional harm stemming from past conflicts.

• Setting Boundaries: He encourages Stephanie to establish clear boundaries and possibly involve legal avenues to ensure that any reconnection serves the child’s well-being and is not a backdoor into rekindling a toxic relationship.

Notable Quotes:

• Stephanie: "She has a stage four cancer and she would like to reconnect with me and my son." [39:51]
• Dr. Delony: "If someone had a six-month diagnosis... Any self-respecting dad would get in a car and drive across the country and let his young son see mom before she dies." [41:30]
• Dr. Delony: "You're a good man. You're a good dad. And that little one's lucky to have you." [50:45]

---

4. Money and Marriage Question: Navigating Decision-Making Differences in a Wealthy Marriage

Caller: Anonymous millionaire couple
Issue: The couple struggles to agree on the timeline for relocating to a different city/state due to contrasting personalities—one being methodical and the other spontaneous.

Key Points:

• Understanding Underlying Motives: Dr. Delony encourages the couple to explore the deeper reasons behind their differing approaches to decision-making, such as seeking safety through planning or adventure through spontaneity.

• Aligning Values and Goals: He advises them to discuss their core values and what they ultimately want for their household, which can help reconcile their differences and establish a mutually agreeable timeline.

• Practical Strategies: By defining how they envision their home and life post-move, the couple can reverse-engineer their plans to align both partners’ expectations, ensuring that the timeline supports their shared vision.

Notable Quotes:

• Listener: "My husband and I are millionaires. We can't seem to agree on a timeline of moving to a different city or a different state. He's more methodical and I am more spontaneous." [39:50]
• Dr. Delony: "Always get to the question behind the question. If you're procrastinating, what is not doing the thing? How's that keeping you safe?" [Throughout the segment]
• Dr. Delony: "How do we want the house to feel when we walk in every day?" [General advice segment]

---

Conclusion

Throughout this episode, Dr. John Delony provides a compassionate ear and nuanced advice to listeners grappling with betrayal, the fear of inadequacy, new romantic entanglements, and the complexities of decision-making within prosperous marriages. By addressing each caller’s unique circumstances with empathy and practical wisdom, Dr. Delony reinforces the importance of self-awareness, clear communication, and prioritizing one's well-being and that of loved ones in the face of relational turmoil.

---

Note: This summary excludes promotional segments and advertisements to focus solely on the core content and listener interactions of the episode.

Transcript

[Ryan]

I am trying to save my marriage after finding out that my wife had a three month affair with her boss.

[John Deloney]

Oh, man. And I'm sorry.

[Ryan]

I, I don't know what to do. My wife has been dealing with a lack of attraction towards me. She says that I am overwhelming in my desire.

[John Deloney]

Why do you want to see this marriage? What in the world's going on? This is Jon with the doct John Deloney show talking to you about your mental and emotional health and your relationships and your marriage and your kids, whatever you got going on in your life. And you tried to Google it and you tried to chat GPT it and you just went, what? Just need someone to sit down with me and listen to me. And that's the promise on the show. I'll sit with you and we'll figure out what's your next right step. All of us have chaotic lives. Not everybody's got somebody they can just sit down with. And that's what this show's all about. You want to be on the show? Give me a buzz at 1844-693 291 or go to john deloney.com ask and check this out. This upcoming fall, my favorite event I'm a part of, we just did the, the Valentine's Day weekend and it was off the hook. It's my favorite event that I'm a part of. It's called the Money and Marriage getaway. It's a weekend retreat here in Nashville, Tennessee. It's a marriage retreat. Y'all get on the planes, on the buses, on the, on the planes, trains and automobiles. Get to Nashville. It's a weekend with me and my buddy Rachel Cruz and a couple of special guests that we bring in. Nashville is kind of a rad city for that. And listen, three days of laughter, hard conversations, often some tears, intentional time together, lots of practical teaching. And the best part about it is if you leave the money marriage retreat without your question answered, we, we cap it to just 600 couples or so. If you leave without your question answered, that's on you. The whole purpose is getting access. You can, you can listen to the show, you can read blog articles, you can read my books. This event is about being able to look me in the eye and say, okay, but yeah, but what about my situation? And we're gonna get your questions answered. Join us November 6th through 8th, 2025. You can go to ramseysolutions.com events. Get them quick. It sells out all the time. We've already sold a huge chunk of tickets for Next fall. Get on it, get on it, get on it. All right, let's go out to Jackson, Wyoming, one of my favorite places in the world, and talk to Ryan. Hey, Ryan. What's up?

[Ryan]

Hey, John. How are you doing?

[John Deloney]

All right, brother. How about you?

[Ryan]

I've been a lot better.

[John Deloney]

Let me know what's up.

[Ryan]

Oh, I. I'm trying to save my marriage after finding out that my wife had a three month affair with her boss.

[John Deloney]

Oh, man. And I'm sorry.

[Ryan]

I. I don't know what to do.

[John Deloney]

I'm sorry that happened, man.

[Ryan]

Me too.

[John Deloney]

Have you said that out loud before?

[Ryan]

Yeah, I've told a couple close friends.

[John Deloney]

How'd that go?

[Ryan]

It went well. They're supportive. I don't think they fully understand why I want to try to save it.

[John Deloney]

So I want to start the conversation this way and then we'll dig into what happened.

[Ryan]

Sure.

[John Deloney]

You can only save your part of it.

[Ryan]

I know.

[John Deloney]

And she might not want to save it. And I think sometimes after somebody cheats on us, we think that we. It's all our fault. And so we need to do a bunch of stuff differently. Infidelity almost never happens in a vacuum. Right. I don't like to use the word fault, but there's usually a world that's created between two people. Not always, but often. So you can quote, unquote, try to work on your part, but I don't want you to think you're a personal failure if this thing doesn't get held together because you don't want to hold it together.

[Ryan]

I've. I've been more okay with that lately.

[John Deloney]

Good.

[Ryan]

I've gotten to the point where I am. I know I'm gonna be okay if this ends well.

[John Deloney]

It's okay to not be okay, right?

[Ryan]

Well, yeah, that would take time. There you go.

[John Deloney]

There you go. All right. So what happened to me.

[Ryan]

Over the past year or so? We've been married about three years now, and this last year has been really hard dealing with. My wife has been dealing with a lack of attraction towards me over the last year. She says that I am overwhelming in my desire. She says that I. I give her too much and that she instinctively pulls back. We've been dealing with that for the last year. And honestly, we got to the point where we were wondering if. We were wondering if she was asexual or trying to figure that out. And at work she.

[John Deloney]

Asexual? What? She just lacked desire.

[Ryan]

She lacked desire. And I was trying everything to reboot it and nothing was working. And then at work, she Felt attraction towards this other man and she explored it and turned into a three month affair.

[John Deloney]

How long did the, did the emotional affair begin? Because here's what I, I'm hearing happened for a year. She told you, I'm not attracted to you. I don't feel this about you. You're overwhelming me. All you want to do is have sex with me. I just want to lay here and cuddle. I don't. I just want to go to my own thing. You're bothering me. You're smothering me. And so this whole year you've been trying to figure out what you were doing wrong. And what she was telling you is she's uncomfortable in her own skin, in her own house, and she's found it elsewhere. She's. That she's found that aliveness that starts with a spark, that starts with a, oh, this one's safe because this guy's married. This guy's my boss, and I don't have to go home and actually look in the mirror and deal with me.

[Ryan]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

And so it's fun to have a conversation. It's fun to be a little extra flirty. It's fun to make little funny notes, you know, because she has access to his calendar and all kind of stuff that turns into, hey, you want to meet for a drink? That sounds like, does that sound familiar?

[Ryan]

Yeah, I mean, they were friends for a while at work, but. And I found out in stages. She. She lied to me about pretty severely right before Christmas. She told me that she had feelings for him. And she basically told me that it was an emotional affair. And then I found notes that they'd written back and forth that were pretty explicit. And then I found more details and eventually it all came out. And at this point, I am confident that I know everything, but it was a battle to drag it out. I think that it was genuinely that they were good friends. They were working together really closely. And then right around August of last year, I think she found out that he found her attractive, she felt something and she pursued it. That continued until early November. And then I found out about it around Christmas. And we've been really struggling. We're basically taking our marriage a week at a time right now.

[John Deloney]

Okay.

[Ryan]

She's therapy. She's gone to two appointments, has a third appointment today. I just got my insurance back and I am about to start looking for a good therapist.

[John Deloney]

Why do, why do you want to save this marriage? Or. Let me, let me ask you, how can I help?

[Ryan]

So I, both of us love each other a Lot. There's a lot of love between us. We care about each other deeply, but we're dealing with the lack of attraction on her side. We're dealing with the fact that I want more than she does. We're dealing with the fact that, I don't know, it seems like we want different things, but we both love each other deeply. And I want to save this marriage. I love her more than I've loved anyone else in my life. But I don't know if those differences and things that we are dealing with can be overcome or if it's worth fighting for. So I need someone to tell me if it's worth fighting for or if I should try to find happiness elsewhere.

[John Deloney]

Well, I mean, I think happiness is inside your guts right now.

[Ryan]

Can you help me find it?

[John Deloney]

Well, I mean, there's, there's, there's so many layers here. You have bought into a story about how she suddenly found you unattractive. You've bought into a story about your marriage is full of love and you're crazy about each other. You've bought into a story that she was just good buddies with somebody who found her attractive and she just kind of goofed up. All those stories are creating this context where you're suffocating and you're, you're. It's, it's, it's tough to hear.

[Ryan]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

And I, I, I, again, you and I could talk for five hours on this deal, probably for five different weeks in many of the situations when I've had a very similar conversation with somebody. When you dig down to the root of it, you're a good man, and she finds safety in you. And she has a really good man. She has absolutely no idea how to practice or create desire and novelty and romance and Eros. And so what she does is she doesn't chase joy. She doesn't taste, Chase stability. She chases excitement.

[Ryan]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

Aliveness. And that is a fire that can never. It's all consuming. That's how you end up doing something. And that's like, you know, let's just go read the, the YouTube headings on this show. That's how you end up in crazy situations when you're always chasing unbounded and what I'm like. And, and I'll come back to what that means. Unbounded excitement. Aliveness. Seeking aliveness is amazing. It's the same as spending money. Spending money can be fun. You can. Money gives you options. It gives you resources. It gives you access to really cool shiny things. But just unbounded spending creates Huge deficits that ultimately end you. Right. And so what she's. It sounds like you are floating in the ocean, and she just keeps saying, I gotta swim over here. Because it's all you. It's all because of you. It's all because of you. And you're such a good man. You keep going back to the mirror saying, okay, what can I do? What can I do? What can I do? And I'm afraid if this marriage ends with what she has told you about you, about how your lack of attractiveness, about your lack of desire, your. Your essence is too much, that part of the reason you want to hang on to this thing so bad is because what she has said about you is so personal.

[Ryan]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

And what I'll tell you is on the head, she's. She has put you in a very unfair position because if this thing goes south, your identity is in ash.

[Ryan]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

Because your wife has said, no, no, it's absolutely you. It's the way you look. It's the way you are. It's the way you try to love me. Dude, nobody can come back. Nobody can hold that weight. That's too heavy. Do you get what I'm saying?

[Ryan]

So what do I do?

[John Deloney]

I think you got to call somebody today. And here's the deal. I'll. I'm going to hook you up with three months with better help right now, so you can at least talk to somebody today. Okay? And I think you need to see somebody in person in your local area. But I'll get you hooked up today, okay? And if you haven't wept, let me put this way. The marriage you had is officially 1000% over. Okay? It's over. There was too much line.

[Ryan]

Enough to know that.

[John Deloney]

Okay, good. The question is, do you and her want to sit down and make it work? Now, here's what love sounds like. Love looks. Sounds like. Love looks like your partner gains £20 or £50. And I still love you deeply. And I'm still attracted to you as a person. And I love you enough to say I'm worried about your health. Or, hey, don't wear those jeans anymore. Or as my wife told me the other night, I look like a Backstreet Boy. Because my jeans were real. Were real tight. And I tried to blame the jeans. It was not the jeans fault. It was me. It was me. Right? Or love looks like. Do people get zits? People get bad haircuts and people get skin cancer and have to have big chunks of their nose taken. Like love looks like those things in attractiveness. For sure matters. Anyone who says it doesn't is lying. But this idea that somebody is going to. You see, I hope you hear what. What. What those feelings you have are right. She has blamed your entire essence.

[Stephanie]

On.

[John Deloney]

The falling out with part of this marriage. And. And I want you to let that go. She made choices, ma'am. You're a good man. Is that right?

[Ryan]

I'm a great man.

[John Deloney]

Okay, I want you to exhale in that. I want you to go to the mirror when we get off the phone in your bathroom. Once you close the door, I don't want you to put your fist in your chest. I want you to look yourself in the eyes and say the words, I love this man. Okay? I don't want you to feel it. I want you to drop your shoulders. I want you to say, I love this man. Now, do you have crap you need to work on?

[Ryan]

Of course.

[John Deloney]

Okay. What is it she finds unattractive about you?

[Ryan]

I'm. I'm a little bit on the messy side. I. I am extremely empathetic. And that, I think, causes me to appear unconfident a lot. I also have been through three job losses in the last year.

[John Deloney]

So this is about. This is about response.

[Ryan]

I quit a bad job. I got laid off. I. She doesn't respect my confidences, but she doesn't respect me.

[John Deloney]

That's it. And I don't mean that in the, like, traditional macho. That's not what I mean. Yeah, we got to start there because you can't. You can't stay married. You can't stay connected and love someone who just thinks you're a loser. And maybe the word she's using, I'm unattracted to you. Maybe that's the essence she's talking about. Let's get to the bottom of that. You're a good man. Do you have things to work on? Sure. Can you get less messy? Yes, of course. Geez Louise. Does it suck getting laid off, quitting a job, and then finding yourself? Yes, it does. Does that make it hard on a household? Yes, it does. She only need to sit down and decide if we're gonna. We're gonna stay together. And right now you got some healing to do because you have some scars on your heart. And the woman you wanna reconnect with and rebuild with is the one who put them there. Sorry, my brother. Sorry. Have her call the show. I'd love to talk to her. I have a feeling she's got a story to tell, too. We'll be right back. This show is sponsored by Better Help. You've probably heard people talk about different kinds of flags and friendships and romantic relationships. You got red flags and green flags and beige flags. Listen. Yes, it can be helpful to look for relationship patterns or unsafe behaviors, but if you ask me, all these flag labels can distract from what's really important when you're trying to find a lasting relationship. What's really important are your values and your potential romantic partner's values, and whether both of you are willing to wake up every day and choose to honor each other's values. But when you grow up in challenging environments, or given how we are all bombarded with everyone else's values all day, every day, it can be tough to even know what are my values, what is important to me in a relationship, and how will I show up to honor myself and love my partner? Forget all the different flags on someone else. Instead, ask yourself, how can I learn what I value? Therapy can help you figure out your values, help you learn for what you're looking for in relationships, and then help you decide your boundaries and non negotiables if you're thinking about starting therapy, try BetterHelp. BetterHelp is 100% online therapy that works with your schedule. To get started, you just fill out a short online survey to get matched with a licensed therapist, and if it's not the right fit, you can switch therapists at any time for no extra cost. So whether you're dating, you're married, or you're building a friendship, or you're just working on yourself, give it a shot with better help. Visit betterhelp.com DeLoney to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp. H E L p.com DeLoney all right, I've got to tell you, I love organifi. I love them. But I also get that some folks are skeptical about organifi and their whole food powders. Are they worth it? Listen, I get it. If any of you are still on the fence about green juice and red juice powders or organifi in general, or you just want a simple way to try organifi out, I've got the perfect solution. The Organifi Starter Kit. It's like if organifi released a greatest hits album, but without the obligatory lame live tracks. In the Organifi Starter kit, you get seven green juice travel packs, which include your daily dose of detoxifying superfoods to boost your immune system, reduce stress, and feel good from the inside out. You also get seven red juice travel packs loaded with whole Food, goodness and antioxidants. It's an early morning and an afternoon pick me up without the jitters of caffeine for a natural energy boost that keeps you focused and feeling great. But that's not all. You also get a full month supply of essential magnesium capsules. Great for muscle recovery, promoting relaxation, and supporting heart health. And to make mixing your juices even easier, the starter kit comes with an organifi shaker bottle. When I started using organifi, I noticed a difference within the first week, and I think you will, too. Right now, you can save 20% on the starter kit at organifi.com deloney with promo code Deloney. This kit is the best way to enjoy three organifi products on the go, whether you're at the office running errands or hitting the gym. Go to O R G a n I f I organifi.com DeLoney and use code DeLoney for 20% off their starter kit and everything else on their site today. All right, let's go literally, like five blocks over, right down the street in Franklin, Tennessee, and talk to Stephanie. Hey, Stephanie. What's up?

[Kevin]

Hey, Dr. John. How are you?

[John Deloney]

I'm so good. How are you?

[Kevin]

I'm doing well, thank you. I mean, I'm calling you, but I'm doing good.

[John Deloney]

Excellent. What's up?

[Kevin]

All right, well, first, I want to say thank you to you and George for the public service that you guys did at Zany's a few weeks ago. That was incredible.

[John Deloney]

You came.

[Kevin]

I was there.

[John Deloney]

No way.

[Kevin]

I was there and it was awesome.

[John Deloney]

Y'all were amazing, dude, that. You have no idea how that makes my soul feel. Good. Thank you so much. That's the most nervous I have been. For those of y'all listening, me and my buddy George Campbell, we. We co host another radio show together, but we both called each other's bluff. We speak for a living, but we went to a tiny little comedy club here in Nashville and just did a comedy set. It's the most nervous I've been maybe ever, ever. And, dude, I can't believe you came. Thank you for coming, Stephanie. That means the world to me. We're going to run it back in March, so I can't wait.

[Kevin]

Oh, good. Good to know. I'll try to be there.

[John Deloney]

All right, fantastic. All right, so how can I help you? You've made my whole day, so now I owe you one. What's up?

[Kevin]

Okay, good deal. So I'm going to give you a little bit of a backstory. I'll try to make it quick. And then if you need more, just let me know.

[John Deloney]

You got it.

[Kevin]

Okay, good deal. So about 10 years ago, currently, I'm not married. I am divorced. But 10 years ago, I had. I was a homeschooling military wife, and I had five kids at the time, and we had moved to a new station. I had signed up at a homeschool co op and very quickly made one of the dearest friends I've ever had in my entire life. And she was my ride or die call at 2am type friend. We did everything together. Sometimes the dads would join in, but usually the stuff we did was during the day, so it was usually us and the kids. And because we were military, we quickly moved, but she and I would keep in touch. And fast forward to about four years ago, she got a cancer diagnosis. And then shortly after that, I actually filed for divorce. It was a very abusive marriage. And so our grief journeys kind of overlapped a little bit. And early last summer, um, actually the day after my divorce was finalized, she lost her battle with cancer.

[John Deloney]

Golly, dude.

[Kevin]

So talk about a range of emotions there telling you.

[John Deloney]

Well, it just seems like there was one big emotion. My God.

[Kevin]

Yeah. Yeah, it was. It was a hard 24 hours.

[John Deloney]

24 hours.

[Kevin]

Well, shock, I guess.

[John Deloney]

Okay, There you go. I was gonna say. Jeez.

[Kevin]

No, it was a lot more than 24 hours.

[John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Kevin]

Okay, so fast forward to a few weeks ago. I was. I got a friend, a Facebook friend request from her husband who had recently gotten on Facebook. And so I accepted it, we started talking and.

[John Deloney]

Oh, yeah.

[Kevin]

Oh, no, you already know where I'm going.

[John Deloney]

Brady Bunch action. Yes.

[Kevin]

Okay. So it started out as he just wanted someone to kind of sit with him in his grief. And I was like, yes, I'm all in, 100%. So then it kind of shifted to. I started thinking, okay, is. Is he interested in something more than just talking? Like, what. What's going on? So instead of mulling over it in my head, I thought, you know what? I'm just going to ask him and dive right in. So.

[John Deloney]

Hey, hold on, Stephanie. Can I just applaud you for that?

[Kevin]

Oh, thank you.

[John Deloney]

Good God almighty. Listen, if. If everybody's listening to the show for five years, we just. Or for four years, we'll just take that away. Like, I'm an adult. I don't want to sit here and make up stories for the next seven months. But I'm just gonna ask you, do you like me? God, Stephanie, dude, the world would change with that. But so high Five to you. So you just asked him, and of course he was like, oh, yeah. Is that right?

[Kevin]

Yeah, actually.

[John Deloney]

Sweet.

[Kevin]

Yes. Oh, gosh. Okay.

[John Deloney]

So did your heart start beating fast?

[Stephanie]

Did you.

[John Deloney]

Did you yell out. Me too. Oh, me too.

[Kevin]

My heart did start beating fast, but I was also freaking out, like, oh, crap. Me too. Oh, no.

[John Deloney]

How many kids does he have?

[Kevin]

He has four, and I have six.

[John Deloney]

Oh, you're like Brady Bunch. Hold my beer. Dude, we got exactly a dozen. Sheesh.

[Kevin]

Okay, so here's my question. Obviously, like, if we continue on, I don't want to officially do anything till we've passed the year mark of my divorce and his wife's passing, especially for the kids sakes. Like, I don't want to mention anything to them.

[John Deloney]

Okay, can I just tell you one thing right now?

[Kevin]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

Take a huge deep breath. Exhale.

[Kevin]

Okay.

[Ryan]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

Listen to these two words and imprint them on your soul. Okay.

[Kevin]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

Slow down.

[Kevin]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

And listen. We thought we're. You thought you were past this. When you're not 17 anymore, it all comes back when you start dating again. Just slow down. This is an amazing, awesome, cool moment. And my guess is because you're a great mom and because you're just. You. You went all the way to the end. And how are we going to explain our wedding? And what's our wedding going to look like? And how are we going to put 10 beds in this house? Right.

[Kevin]

Yeah, actually.

[John Deloney]

Yeah, exactly. So this is a rad, cool, scary, exciting turn of events. Let it be that.

[Kevin]

How do we purposefully walk through that? Because I am about going through it slow, actually. And I told him that last week. Awesome. And, yeah, I guess I just want to know the steps that we do need to take. And we're actually meeting. I haven't seen them in, like, 10 years. And we're going to meet halfway in a few days and just be around each other.

[John Deloney]

I bet you are. That was awesome. That was a great joke. Yeah.

[Kevin]

Yeah, no, that was good. Just have intentional time together. And so I would just. Yeah, I would love some. Some advice from you on that.

[John Deloney]

Awesome. Okay, so I want you to spend some time by yourself defining what go slow means.

[Kevin]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

Just go slow. Mean, physical. We're gonna get together, but I'm not gonna kiss you yet. Too soon? Or is it mean, like. Oh, yeah, like, you decide. What does go slow mean when it comes to physical intimacy? What does go slow mean when it comes to being seen in public? What does it. What does go slow mean when it. When it turns. Like, phone calls, writing Text messages, letter writing, telling the kids, considering, like. Like, what is. I want you to define go slow. Because if you don't, you're gonna have this idea of go slow, and he's gonna have a picture of go slow, and your pictures are not gonna match. And so what you're gonna do is you're gonna feel this weird angst and frustration and annoyance with each other. And really, you both want the same thing. You just didn't align your pictures up.

[Kevin]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

Because he might say, yeah, I want to go slow. I want to make out, but I want to go slow when it comes to, like, are we going to get married? And you might think, no, I want to go slow. Like, you can hold my hand. Like, right? So you end up wanting the same thing, sort of, but you end up just flying by each other in the night, and it's just about being clear on that. Okay? So that's number one, the second thing, and this is me being a bubble burster. Is that okay?

[Kevin]

Yes.

[John Deloney]

Just because it's familiar doesn't mean it's right.

[Kevin]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

And this might be the safest, most familiar step into a terrifying new world of dating with six kids. Okay? And that doesn't make it wrong, that doesn't make it bad. That doesn't mean y'all can't have a great few months of just hanging out and dating each other. Right? And this is. You're his first safest wandering out into the world as a single dad with four kids. Right?

[Kevin]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

So just remember, familiar is gonna feel safe, but that doesn't mean it's right long term, because in addition to familiar, you're going to want novelty and you're going to want new, you're going to want adventure. And if you try to bridge houses, you're going to get plenty of that stuff. Right? But don't mistake comfort for. Or as. As the old cadence call line says, don't mistake happiness for blessings. Just because it's happy and it all feels good doesn't mean like, dude, we're not going to get married. All right, here is. Let me try to say it. I'm trying to think of the right way to say this in a non clinical, nerd way. Oh, man. How old are your kids?

[Kevin]

They range from 7 to 18.

[John Deloney]

Oh, geez Louise on a stick.

[Kevin]

Yeah. For real.

[John Deloney]

Okay, so your kids are gonna have all, like, all kinds, six different thoughts about this. That's not true. They're gonna have a thousand different thoughts about this. Okay. And anything for. Especially a teenager. If you got kids from 12 to 18. 12, 25. Really? Yeah, it's very, it's, it's age appropriate. It's developmentally appropriate that they can't hold ideological discomfort without put giving it to somebody else to hold their kids. Okay, what does that mean? That means an 18 year old is going to see you potentially six months from now holding hands with another person, maybe somebody that they've met peripherally, and they're going to feel all kind of weird about it and they're going to have to blame you for that discomfort because they can't hold the tension of oh, my dad is really gone, or mom and dad the fantasy, they're really, really not getting back together or in this other guy's like, oh, mom. So just be prepared for if you have an angry 14 year old. That doesn't mean that y'all are doing anything wrong. That means they're 14 and there's a ton of feelings and they can't hold them. That goes back to that word sturdy that I talk about all the time that I got from Becky Kennedy. Like, is, we're gonna, we're gonna, we're gonna make our decisions and we're gonna move forward. So what does that mean? There's not a, there's not a stress free way of introducing all this to your kids. If it ends up getting there, it's just going to be uncomfortable and weird and discombobulated and you two are going to have to continue to work on your relationship and work on it and work on it and work on it and work on. And you're going to have 10 different kids who are blending. It's just going to be chaos and just expect it. So I guess that'd be the last thing is if you all pursue this right now, y'all feel like teenagers again. And that's a fun, exciting feeling, especially after all the hurt y'all both endured. So I'm gonna tell you something crazy. Enjoy it. Enjoy the pitter patter. Enjoy seeing his text pop up and you getting excited like you're 15 again. Enjoy all of that stuff. It's exciting. It feels alive again. Right? And you felt dead in your own skin for a while. Fair.

[Kevin]

Very fair.

[John Deloney]

Okay. Let that aliveness just course through you. Make good grown up choices. Right? But enjoy it.

[Kevin]

And okay.

[John Deloney]

Understand y'all are signing up for the craziest roller coaster at the park.

[Kevin]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

All right. And so just, just know that going into it. And last little thing, keep some space for being sad in ways that you didn't imagine. And There. There are little things that will hit you. Like, if you hold hands with him this weekend, you'll look down and really quick, in a blink, it won't be your husband's hand. Your ex husbands, he'll look down and it will have different. Your fingers will look different than his ex wife's fingers. It's little bitty things that are both exciting and also catch you off guard. And it just has a little. It's like a. It's like a. A grief dart that you don't expect. Does that make sense?

[Kevin]

Absolutely.

[John Deloney]

Cool. All right, so I threw a ton at you. I'm just rattling stuff off here. What? How's it hitting you? Exciting. Cool. That I just douse cold water on you. Like, tell me what you're feeling.

[Kevin]

No, not at all. Because the last week or so, I've actually been like, oh, no, I don't know if this is right. But yet, you know, is it my alarms and bells going off because I'm used to so much pain and, you know, so I've been kind of going back and forth with that. And he's actually been very gracious, and he's backed off a little bit, but we still think it's fair to move. Not move forward, but just hang out, continue talking.

[John Deloney]

Yeah, yeah.

[Kevin]

And just see. And just have fun and just see what it's. What it's like, because it is brand new and it is scary in a lot of ways, but, you know, I just. I don't know what's going to happen. And so I'm trying to tell myself to just relax. I'm not committing to anything just by seeing him. It may work out and it may not, and that's okay. So everything you said is exactly what I needed to hear, so thank you.

[John Deloney]

Well, if you just go have a great time with your best friend's husband, which sounded awesome. I hope they clipped just that and put that in the teaser. Going to make this call do really well on YouTube. If y'all choose to just go have a blast. That's a weekend well spent. If y'all go laugh, tell old stories, he's like, I knew your husband sucked. And you were like, this is super weird that I'm holding hands with my best friend who passed away. His, like, just put all the weird on the table. There's no reason to hide it. And you are one God, you're so far ahead of the curve, Stephanie. You're like a hero. There's going to be the weird part because you know him and there's going to be the weird part that, you know, I don't know how to say this without just being crass, that he partied with your best friend. Right. You'll know all that, right? And there's going to be those safety alarm bells in your body that says, hey, if I let another military man get close to me, he's going to hurt me like the other guy did.

[Kevin]

Well, thankfully, he's not military.

[John Deloney]

Oh, he's not. Okay.

[Kevin]

No, that is a plus right there.

[John Deloney]

Oh, sweet. Okay. All right, so we're getting out. But. But expect those Alar bells to go off and vice versa. He's going to have that. That GPS pin in his. In his soul that says she may get sick and pass away. Right? So one of my closest, closest buddies and mentors, his. His wife lost her first husband with. With just an out of. Out of the blue health experience. And I just remember him when they were newlyweds. She was extra attentive. As she should be. Right? And so just. Just expect that weirdness and that awkwardness. And I think what I love about you, Stephanie, is you're so far ahead of the curve. You just put on table, hey, do you like me? Is that why you're Facebooking me, you old man, with a bunch of kids like. And so you just putting it on the table. I feel weird. Or my ex husband used to do that right before he would scream and yell and punch a hole through the sheetrock. And. And I'm just putting on the table. And so maybe that's part of the deal. Y'all agree early on, we're going to have as much fun as we can. We're going to align our pictures and words about what going slow looks like, what physical intimacy looks like, what being weird looks like. And we're going to put all the awkward on the table all the time. We're just going to. We're going to make a commitment to that and then, man, listen, if y'all get married in Franklin, Tennessee, I will go to that wedding. I'll go to that one. So thank you so much for the call, Stephanie. You call anytime and swing on down the road one day, and we got free coffee and cookies out here in the lobby, and I'd love to come out there and give you a high five. Blessings to you on this new adventure. I wish you guys the absolute best and make good choices. Stephanie, that was awesome. We'll be right back. I want to tell you about Cozy Earth, makers of incredible sheets, bedding, and bath linens. It's almost time. The sun will come out tomorrow so soon. Spring is almost here. And Cozy Earth has a Spring into Comfort sale going on right now. It's a great time to buy their bamboo sheet sets and their bath sheets. I love their bed sheets and their towels. They're giant and soft and they don't get all thin and crusty after going through the laundry. They are their best. And their sheet sets are soft and breathable and they keep me and my family cool and comfortable all night. And like I said, you're going to feel the quality of their bath sheets right away. They're so huge. Don't even call them towels, they call them bath sheets. They're actually more like a bath comforter. Listen, it doesn't matter what they're called. They're just amazing. And I also got a huge Cozy Earth weighted blanket that my whole family piles under. It's bye bye for my anxiety. Cozy Earth is my go to. And it can be your go to for building a sanctuary in your home so you can feel safe, relaxed and ready to take on whatever comes next for you and your family. Remember, Cozy Earth Spring into Comfort sales happening right now with exclusive savings. For you watching or listening to this show, 40% off everything. That's 40% off. Visit cozyearth.com DeLoney and use code DeLoney that's C O Z Y cozyearth.com DeLONEY for 40% off. Go check it out. All right, let's go out to San Diego, California and talk to Kevin. Hey, Kevin. What's up, man?

[Stephanie]

Hi, how are you?

[John Deloney]

I'm doing all right, brother. What's going on?

[Stephanie]

Yeah, so, okay, so I have. Okay, so I have this dilemma that I have. So my ex wife, whom I've been estranged for for about four years, she like, she has reached out through her cousins that she's. She has stage four cancer and she would like to reconnect with me and my son.

[John Deloney]

Does she have visitation with you? Is the son a kid y'all share together?

[Stephanie]

Yeah, I have. We have one son.

[John Deloney]

Okay.

[Stephanie]

I have primary custody. In fact, she has. She does have supervision, supervised visitation rights, but she hasn't used that in quite a while. In fact, she and I live on the opposite sides of the country and all of a sudden I hear from one of her cousins, whom I still talk to this day, that she's really sick and she would like to reconnect. To be honest.

[John Deloney]

You don't believe her, do you? You don't believe him.

[Stephanie]

Well, I mean, she said she did and she Said and did a lot of things like which made me divorce her.

[John Deloney]

Hold on, forget all that for a second right this sec. Because here's the deal. If your ex. Let me say it this way. If your son's mom is going to be dead in three months from state, what kind of cancer is it? Are they telling you?

[Stephanie]

Pancreatic.

[John Deloney]

Yeah, Stage four pancreatic cancer. She's got less than six months. If she truly has stage four pancreatic cancer and she will not be with us anymore after six months from now. Any, any man I'm get myself in trouble here. I. Almost any self respecting dad would get in a car and drive across the country and let his young son see mom before she dies. The other side of that is I don't think you believe her.

[Stephanie]

Yeah, I don't.

[John Deloney]

Okay.

[Stephanie]

Yeah, I don't.

[John Deloney]

So just, just own that. She deceptive.

[Ryan]

Yeah.

[Stephanie]

Yes.

[John Deloney]

Okay. She have. Does she struggle with substance abuse?

[Stephanie]

Not substance, but she's done a lot of, she's done a lot of things recently.

[John Deloney]

Okay, so what's your question for me?

[Stephanie]

So my son, he's five, he was about one, he was like physically, physically speaking, like he was only one and a half when he last saw her.

[John Deloney]

Okay.

[Stephanie]

The thing is like after that like we split off like she didn't even, she didn't even do the visitations anymore. She moved to another state and we just didn't get in touch ever since.

[John Deloney]

Okay, so what is your son, is your son asking to see her again?

[Stephanie]

No, like my son doesn't even remember her.

[John Deloney]

Okay.

[Stephanie]

Like he kind of says like I mean there are situations like do. I mean where's my mom? And I'm like, and I, and I tell her well, she's away or. Yeah, I mean that's the rule. I mean I can't tell her tell. I can't tell him right now she's dead, you know, because that's not true.

[John Deloney]

No, but what you can't tell her is your mom's very, very sick and she, she needed to, she decided to step away or she needed to step away. But I want to see her. She's very, very sick and, and, and can't be seen right now. Yeah, that's what we tell a five year old.

[Stephanie]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

Because by the way, in any mom who doesn't want to see her five year old son is, is struggling with something. Right?

[Stephanie]

Yeah. The thing is she wasn't, she didn't have any drug or substance like the last time I met her. The thing is like we had a Very acrimonious split where basically like. And this is back. And this is in California where I got everything.

[John Deloney]

Okay, but listen, I. This is five years ago. I don't. I mean, four years ago. I mean, you had a split. You had a split. I guess. Let me. Let me say it this way. I don't know. I still don't really fully understand what you're asking, but let me just say this. If you find out. And by the way, I would not take a comment from a cousin. Right. I would. If she wants to reach out and you have ways of confirming it, or if her attorney or your attorney wants to be notified that she's about to pass away and wants to change the agreement so y'all can go see each other.

[Stephanie]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

Then don't be the dad that doesn't let his young son have a photo with his dying mother. Okay? And you're gonna have to put back the crap she did to you four years ago. Get over yourself. If this is another move in a long line of deceptive things and dishonest things and shady things, then you need to go do your due diligence and find out if this is actually real, if this is true, etc. And I don't know a way to do that without being awkward or asking.

[Stephanie]

Hard questions like, you mean to contact her directly or like. Or I don't know, because she had. She has, like, you said, hit stuff, shades shady stuff and. And lied.

[John Deloney]

Sure.

[Stephanie]

Like, she has a history of that. So. But for me. Yeah, go ahead.

[John Deloney]

For you what?

[Stephanie]

For me, like, I don't know how to, like, I don't know how to like, validate or verify, you know?

[John Deloney]

She hasn't even contacted you, dude.

[Stephanie]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

So let me put it this way. If I was. If I got a six month diagnosis. You're gonna be dead in six months, John. And me and my wife didn't live together. The last thing I would do on the planet Earth would be to find a way that I see my kids, period. I wouldn't call a cousin who called to somebody.

[Ryan]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

Do you know what I'm saying?

[Stephanie]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

Now, maybe she's not well. She doesn't feel welcome. It feels awkward. Maybe you tell the cousins you have her reach out to me. If she wants to see her son, she needs to reach out to me. This is. This, we're talking adult stuff now.

[Stephanie]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

Okay. And if she can't tell, she can't see. I. You know, then you. You can. You can manage that here. But I'm telling you, you don't Want to be on the other side of this thing where I thought she was lying. And then she passes away. And your son, you have to have that conversation with him. Yeah. Yeah. She let me know she was dying, wanted to see you, but, nah, I didn't do it.

[Stephanie]

Is there a way that I can. I don't know, like, hire a PI to kind of, like, verify?

[John Deloney]

I wouldn't. But you can. You can do whatever you want, man.

[Stephanie]

Yeah, because, like, you can ask to.

[John Deloney]

See her medical records. You can ask to go to a doctor's visit with her.

[Stephanie]

Man, I haven't seen her. I haven't seen her in years. And there's a reason. Where. There's a reason why I left her and I ghosted her and gray stoned or whatever that's called.

[John Deloney]

I don't know any of those newfangled jin y words. Whatever you're saying, what did she do that was so bad?

[Stephanie]

She cheated on me with her ex.

[John Deloney]

Okay.

[Stephanie]

And.

[John Deloney]

And that's the reason to keep a. A little boy from her mom.

[Stephanie]

She. Well, after that, like, she made up. Like, she became very vicious. She became a very toxic. She. She tried to do everything in her power to try to get the primary custody. You know, basically sue me for abuse, both emotional. Physical. Emotional and physical.

[John Deloney]

Was it all lies?

[Stephanie]

Yeah. Yeah.

[John Deloney]

All right, so she's proven unsafe, and she's proven to be a person who will go to the ends of the earth to get what she wants, even if it means lying and cheating and ruin some else. Somebody else's life.

[Stephanie]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

Okay. I have no. If somebody cheats on you, yes, we gotta deal with that relationally, but that's still the mother of your kid. If somebody tries to go to the ends of the earth to get primary custody, fine. I. Unless they use the kid as a. As a bargaining chip, and then that's when. I rarely get mad, but I get mad when couples do that. But I don't get mad that couples are about to get divorced and they both are terrified to not see their kid very much. I get that. Totally. Now we're getting into different layers where, in order to see her kid more, she looks at you and makes up lies about you. They're going to get you in jail, get you fired, get you all those kind of things and make it to where you can't put food on your table. Yeah. Then we got a problem. The relationship is over. She.

[Stephanie]

Between my son and his mom.

[John Deloney]

Correct. It's over.

[Stephanie]

Okay. Okay.

[John Deloney]

Like a caretaker relationship, a friend relationship, a loving, interconnected, intimate relationship. It's over. She ended it. And okay, she's made choices repeatedly over the years to not have a relationship with her son, period. End of story. This isn't about her at this moment. This is about when your son's 19 and he's trying to figure out who he is. Half of him will be you. A good man who worked from home, probably made less money than he was worth because he was working from home, got him through special needs, like got him the resources that he needed, was really an attentive, caring father. Half of him will be that good man. And he'll always know that half of him was this other person.

[Stephanie]

Okay?

[John Deloney]

And that's the world he's going to have to inhabit. When I'm thinking ahead to that 14 year old, to that 17 year old, to that 25 year old, I'd rather him have a picture with him smiling next to this woman who he does not know, who's wearing a bandana because her hair's fallen out from her chemo treatments as she's trying to hang on the last few months of her life. I'd rather that than him look at you from across the table and say, I could have seen her. And you kept me from it because you were too dramatic and saying she did shady things because you couldn't get over her cheating on you five years ago. Do you know what I'm saying?

[Stephanie]

Yes.

[John Deloney]

Both of these paths are messy. Both of these paths are gnarly. That's what happened when y'all made a kid. That's what happened when she cheated on you. The whole thing blew up. Right? So there's not, there's not a stress free path forward. Every time somebody gets divorced and there's a kid involved, I always tell them, you're playing a 20 year game now, you're paying a 15 year game now. And so yes, I would it. This is me personal now. I don't know her, I don't know her backstory. I don't know any of the stuff that she's done to you personally. You do. So you take this with a grain of salt. If somebody had accused me of, of physical abuse and emotional abuse and tried to call the police and I had to go do, I probably would not enter their orbit again because I would be terrified for not being able to provide for my kid in case they made some more crazy stories up. But if four and a half or five years ago somebody did something stupid and they cheated on me with their ex and then yada yada and partition a Pear tree. And it got nasty for a bit, but here we are. Calls and says, I'm dying. I'm gonna be dead soon. Can I see my son? I would make that happen. And it would be awkward and it would be awful. It is not a rekindling. It is not a reintroduction into our lives. It's not renewing relationships. She burnt it. It's over. But it would be a gift to this young boy as he becomes an adolescent and becomes an adult and tries to figure out, who am I now? If this mom is unsafe, then absolutely not. If this mom is unhinged and untethered and she's wanting to go to the ends of the earth to burn you alive, then, no, I would not put myself in harm's way that way. So you're going to have to make your decision there. You're a good man. You're a good dad. And that little one's lucky to have you. We'll be right back. Let's talk about Hallow, the number one prayer and meditation app in the world. It's officially lint. And lent is the 40 days leading up to Good Friday and Easter. And Lent is when Christians all over the world commit to a season of fasting from all sorts of things, and they commit themselves to reconnection and remembering, prayer and even meditation. And right now, Hallow has a challenge going on called the Way. It's meant to reflect living the way of Jesus. And that means doing hard things that lead to peace, joy, and healing. And throughout Hallows the Way, you'll get to hear some incredible stories from people like Jonathan Roumie of the Chosen, Chris Pratt and Mark Wahlberg. You'll get to participate in experiencing life change yourself. And this is just a tiny bit of what Hallow offers. Hallow has a huge catalog of music, guided prayers, meditations, and more. And when you sign [e-mail] Deloney right now, you'll get three free months. So you're covered all through Lent and beyond. Go check them [e-mail] DeLoney for three free months. That's Hallow. H a l l o w.com DeLoney all right, we are back, and it's time for a money and marriage question. This is a live question that somebody asked at the Money Marriage conference, and I thought it was a good question and wanted to bring it to everybody. So here's the question. My husband and I are millionaires. Oh. Oh. This is a common question I get. Just kidding. I don't get this question almost ever But I do think it's important, so hang with us. My husband and I are millionaires. We can't seem to agree on a timeline of moving to a different city or a different state. He's more methodical and I am more spontaneous. How do we move forward? So, yes, very, very, very few of you listening to this are millionaires, right? Very, very few of you are in this place where we can kind of do whatever we want whenever we want. And we're fighting on how to do that slow or fast. Right? But almost everybody listening here has. They want to get a new car, they want to move schools. They want. One wants their kid to go to a state school and wants her kid to go to a fancy private school, trying to figure out, do we just make the two boys share a room or do we go get another whole nother house or do we. Do we should we take out a HELOC and build a garage apartment? Right? And one wants to move fast, one must move slow. Whatever. By the way, don't take out HELOCs. It's so stupid to leverage your home for a credit card anyway. That's never. That's another conversation, different show. He's more methodical and I'm more spontaneous. Here's what I always want to get. When people say, I am this way and you're that way, you're identifying with a way of solving problems that your body feels keeps you safe. Some people feel that they can best solve problems when they go very, very slow and they think it through. And sometimes that thinking it through and going slow becomes a way to procrastinate, to not make the final decision. Others, this is more like me, are like hyper spontaneous. And it's their way of not having to think things through. We're just going to go. We're going to figure it out when we get there. And both of those are ways that we keep ourselves safe. And so I want to get to the underlying question beneath the I just need some more time, I need some more data. Or let's just go, let's just pack up and move. What's beneath that? I'm bored here. I need some adventure in my life and I want you to come with me. Yes, I know we have a whole bunch of money, but I worked really hard and I kind of love this house and I love our little neighborhood church and I love being able to ride my bike to the grocery store Even though I'm 62, I don't know that I want to move. And I know that we had Dreams of moving to the mountains or moving to the beach. But I kind of like our just Midwest town. What if now that we're millionaires, what if now that we paid off our last credit card, what if now that our marriage is on a good. In good footing, we decided to get real, real fancy vacations, do fancy vacations a couple times a year. What would life look like if we didn't have to move? Those are deeper than. We can't agree on a timeline. I want to get to those questions because then we get into the grief. I don't want to move. And I told you I did, but I don't. Oh, my gosh, I hate this town. I wanted to move. I've always wanted to move. I want some adventure. I want some. So then you can start solving the actual problem. All right, if we're not going to move, what would not moving look like and what would adventure look like? Or okay, we are going to move, but I got to stay connected to some of my close friends here. Making friends in your 50s or 40s or 60s is the worst thing on the planet. And I want to stay connected here. So I'm going to put some money in our account. So here's for instance, when we moved to Tennessee, my wife and I set up a fund for plane tickets to go visit family. Because both of us are pretty close to our family, we set up plane tickets, like just a small fund. It's not huge or anything, but a small fund that if somebody's parent passed away, I'm going to go to those funerals. Some of my closest friends in Texas, I'm going to go to those funerals. I'm going to have an account for that. So we just built in travel as a part of. We want to stay connected to those folks, but we both think it's right to move. And so I want to get to the. The beneath the timeline question and get to the. How's your body trying to keep you safe during this period of transition and in our lives. And here's the final question that I want every couple to ask all the time. How do we want the house to feel when we walk in every day? Don't feel like I don't know what town I'm in. I don't know anybody here. I'm nervous. I want to feel like I know everybody here and I'm just comfortable. How do you want this house to feel like? And then you can build a timeline reverse engineering from that. How do we want this thing to feel? Let's go make that happen. Thanks for the question. There's not a name on here. Oh, yeah, they were. That was part of an anonymous question. Drop in. So there you go. Hope that helps. Hope that helps. Always get to the question behind the question. If you're procrastinating, what is not doing the thing. How's that keeping you safe? Love you guys. Bye.