Should I Tell My Teen Daughter I’m Not Her Father?

Summary

Podcast Information

• Title: The Dr. John Delony Show
• Host/Author: Ramsey Network
• Description: The Dr. John Delony Show is a caller-driven show that provides real talk on relationships and mental health challenges. Listeners are encouraged to send questions via voicemail or email.
• Episode: Should I Tell My Teen Daughter I’m Not Her Father?
• Release Date: May 12, 2025

---

Introduction

In this emotionally charged episode of The Dr. John Delony Show, host John Deloney addresses a deeply personal and complex issue brought forward by a caller named Dennis. The central question revolves around Dennis's struggle with revealing to his 16-year-old daughter that he is not her biological father, despite having raised her and signed her birth certificate.

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Caller’s Dilemma: Dennis's Story [00:05 - 02:17]

Dennis, a 35-year-old father of two daughters, shares his predicament:

• Background: At 19, Dennis met the mother of his older daughter. Before they met, she became pregnant, leading Dennis to sign the birth certificate and raise their daughter as his own.
• Current Situation: As his daughter approaches her 16th birthday, Dennis and her mother had initially planned to disclose the truth about her biological father. However, his ex-partner has since retracted from this plan, fearing it might cause their daughter to harbor resentment.

Dennis’s Words:

“I took responsibility because I'm the kind of guy that if you can do something right, you should do it.”
[02:07]

---

Host’s Initial Reaction and Advice [02:17 - 05:24]

John Deloney responds with a sense of urgency and concern, emphasizing the gravity of delaying the truth:

• Emotional Consequences: John warns that withholding such significant information can lead to compounded distrust and emotional turmoil for the daughter.

John’s Insight:

“Every minute you wait is like a 401k. It's like the compound interest on her disdain for you two will grow with every minute.”
[02:07]

• Impact on Values and Trust: Revealing the truth can shake the foundation of values and trust that the daughter has built over the years.

John’s Statement:

“What else are they lying about? If they lied about something this big, is God real? Is sleeping around really that bad?... They'll question everything you've ever taught her.”
[04:36]

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Consequences of Delaying the Truth [05:24 - 10:08]

John Deloney delves deeper into the repercussions of postponing the disclosure:

• Psychological Impact: Discovering the truth at 16 can be psychologically destabilizing, leading to confusion and a sense of betrayal.
• Inevitability of Discovery: John asserts that the truth will eventually surface through DNA tests or curiosity about health histories.

John’s Assertion:

“There's no way to hide this indefinitely. That tells me she's willing to not tell the truth about anything that might make anybody else uncomfortable.”
[07:26]

• Legal and Moral Responsibilities: While Dennis fulfilled his responsibilities legally and morally by signing the birth certificate and raising his daughter, the deceit risks tarnishing their integrity.

John’s Advice:

“The best possible scenario for your daughter is you and her mother tell her together... I am your dad and you're my daughter.”
[08:31]

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Managing the Emotional Fallout [10:08 - 16:05]

John offers strategies for handling the difficult conversation and its aftermath:

• Unified Approach: Encourages Dennis and his ex-partner to present a united front, expressing remorse and reaffirming their love and commitment.
• Supporting the Daughter: Emphasizes the importance of being present and supportive as she processes the new information.

John’s Guidance:

“I'll be a part of helping you find him... You will be a part of helping her find out who she truly is, genetically.”
[09:53]

• Future Steps: Advises on navigating potential legal actions if the biological father becomes involved and stresses the importance of transparency moving forward.

John’s Conclusion:

“If you’re choosing between one discomfort or another, let's choose the discomfort that is short term, that will get us to where we want to go.”
[29:20]

---

Key Insights and Takeaways

1. Timely Honesty is Crucial:

   • Delaying the truth can exacerbate feelings of betrayal and distrust.
   • Transparency strengthens the parent-child relationship despite the initial shock.

2. Unified Parental Front:

   • Both parents should collaborate in the disclosure to provide consistent support.
   • A united approach helps mitigate confusion and emotional distress for the child.

3. Long-Term Emotional Impact:

   • Knowing the truth can empower the daughter to understand her identity and make informed decisions about her heritage.
   • Proper handling of the revelation can prevent long-term psychological harm.

4. Support Systems:

   • Engaging with mental health professionals can assist both the parents and the daughter in navigating the emotional complexities of the situation.
   • Open communication channels post-disclosure are essential for healing and rebuilding trust.

---

Notable Quotes with Attribution and Timestamps

• John Deloney on Immediate Disclosure:

  “She's gonna hate y'all so every minute you wait is like a 401k.”
  [02:07]

• On the Foundation of Trust:

  “She's built a foundation her whole world rests on. I'm half this guy Dennis and half my mom.”
  [04:04]

• On the Inevitability of the Truth:

  “There's no way to hide this indefinitely. That tells me she's willing to not tell the truth about anything that might make anybody else uncomfortable.”
  [07:26]

• On Emotional Support:

  “Kids can go through... All of us can go through tons of stuff. We just can't go through it alone.”
  [10:08]

• On Choosing the Right Path:

  “If you’re choosing between one discomfort or another, let's choose the discomfort that is short term, that will get us to where we want to go.”
  [29:20]

---

Conclusion

In this poignant episode, The Dr. John Delony Show tackles the sensitive topic of parental honesty and its profound impact on familial relationships. Through Dennis's story, the show highlights the importance of transparency, the challenges of confronting difficult truths, and the necessity of providing unwavering support to navigate emotional upheaval. John Deloney’s compassionate and insightful guidance offers valuable lessons on fostering trust and maintaining strong, healthy relationships even in the face of heartbreaking revelations.

Listeners grappling with similar issues are encouraged to embrace honesty, seek professional assistance, and prioritize the emotional well-being of their loved ones.

Transcript

[Dennis]

When I was 19, I met the mother of my older daughter. I have two daughters. Long story short, she ended up being pregnant before I had met her.

[John Deloney]

Oh, so your 16 year old daughter is a adopted daughter.

[Dennis]

I don't know if you'd call it adopted. I signed the birth certificate. I was there when she was born and everything, so.

[John Deloney]

Oh, homie, man, yike. What's going on? What's going on? This is John with adoptive John Deloney show, taking your calls about your marriage, your relationships, your mental and emotional health, your kids, whatever you got going on in your life. I'd love, love to have you on the show. This is real. People all over the globe going through all kinds of challenges in their houses, in their own hearts and minds, in their relationships at work, wherever you got stuff going on, here's my promise. I'll sit with you and we will figure out what's the next right move. So go to John Deloney D E L o n y, johndelony.com. ask and fill out the form and will hollaback girl at you and get you on the show. All right, let's go out to my hometown H town and talk to Dennis. What's up, Dennis?

[Dennis]

Hey, John, how you doing?

[John Deloney]

I'm good, brother. What's up, man?

[Dennis]

All right, so I'm 35. When, when I was 19, I met the mother of my older daughter. I have two daughters. One's about to turn 16, the other one's 13. So I met, I met my older daughter's mother. She, long story short, she ended up being pregnant before I had met her.

[John Deloney]

Okay.

[Dennis]

And.

[John Deloney]

Oh, so your 16 year old daughters is a adopted daughter.

[Dennis]

I signed, I don't know if you'd call it adopted. I signed the birth certificate. I was there when she was born and everything. So she doesn't know that I'm not her biological father.

[John Deloney]

She's 16.

[Dennis]

Yes, she's gonna be 16 next month.

[John Deloney]

Oh, homie, man, yikes.

[Dennis]

So I'm the kind of guy, I took, I took responsibility because I'm the kind of guy that if, if you can do something right, you should do it. All right?

[John Deloney]

Okay.

[Dennis]

But me and her mother aren't together anymore. We did have a plan, like from the beginning to tell my daughter that, that I'm not her biological father when she turns 16, which is happening next month. Since then, her mother backed out for selfish reasons. She, she doesn't want our daughter to hate her or have any animosity towards her or anything like that.

[John Deloney]

She's gonna hate y' all so every minute you wait is like an. It's like a 401k. It's like the. The compound interest on her disdain for you two will grow with every minute. You should have told her way before now. Way before now.

[Dennis]

I real. I've come to realize that.

[John Deloney]

Yeah. Not. Not another minute.

[Dennis]

I just wait. I just. I've been weighing everything. You know. I don't want to hurt her.

[John Deloney]

You. You already have. You already have. And so I. I like this is now. Because here's what's happened is. And bro, listen, like, I'm not. I don't want to badmouth you anything like that. I'm. I'm speaking emphatically just because I've sat with the other side of this. When a kid finds out they're 21 or they're 20 or they're 17, and it melts every thing in their world. And it's not because they found out that you were an amazing dad that stood by her was you signed her birth certificate, which, by the way, I don't even know if that's legal or not, but you did. And all throughout her life you've been there. And then you and mom broke up and you've stayed. I'm assuming you continue to see her. You have custody rights and all that kind of stuff.

[Dennis]

Yeah, she lives with me and everything.

[John Deloney]

Okay.

[Dennis]

So.

[John Deloney]

So that's not the issue. The issue for a 16 year old finding this out will be now and forever. What else are they lying about? If they lied about something this big. Is God real? Is sleeping around really that bad? Is. You know what I'm saying? Like it. They'll question everything you've ever taught her. Values wise. This is a big one.

[Dennis]

That's.

[John Deloney]

This is a big one.

[Dennis]

That's. I didn't think about any of that.

[John Deloney]

So it's less about. I mean, it is a big deal. She's going to want to know who am I? Who's my real dad. But you have to understand, she's built a foundation her whole world rests on. I'm half this guy Dennis and half my mom. And when she finds out that she's half of a mystery person at 16. Dude, that is psychologically unmooring. You get what I'm saying?

[Dennis]

Yeah, I get that. I just worry about like her future, man. Like. Like, what's this gonna do to school? Like, is our grades gonna drop or is our future probably gonna be ruined?

[John Deloney]

I. I don't say. I don't say ruin. No, what. What will ruin it is if she find out her parents lied. Life, that's the trauma here, is the dishonesty. Not that you stepped up.

[Dennis]

Yeah. And then that's, that's a big thing with me too. I don't want to lie to her.

[John Deloney]

Right. And so I like it. Yeah, dude, this. Because here's the thing. She's gonna find out. She's gonna do a DNA test. She's gonna have to fill out questionnaires about health history. She's. I mean. And by the way, does her bio dad know she exists?

[Dennis]

Yes. From what her mom tells me. I'm not entirely sure how truthful she's been.

[John Deloney]

But bro, I would find that out because if I had a daughter that some other dude swooped in and signed the birth certificate and mom didn't tell me, I would sue you guys to the moon and back. I would sue everybody to the moon and back.

[Dennis]

I don't know if this guy's like that. Because she, she has.

[John Deloney]

Bro, you tell me. I. I find out I have a 16 year old daughter that I didn't know and that you'll hit it from me. I will become a very different person very quickly. Maybe not. Maybe he's a total. Just a bum and whatever. Yeah, exactly. I mean imagine if your. Your ex wife was pregnant with your kid and you didn't know it and you have some son out there and she meets some other guy. She has him sign the birth certificate. Imagine. Dude.

[Dennis]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

And I. I don't want to. I don't want to jump to too many conclusions, but I always want to look at. I guess the best evidence I have is the evidence right in front of me. And if a mom would try to convince you that we need to keep this from our daughter. A thing that will 100% be found out.

[Dennis]

Yes.

[John Deloney]

There is no way to hide this indefinitely. That tells me she's willing to not tell the truth about anything that might make anybody else uncomfortable. And so what I would look at is if she's capable of this, then she might be capable of not have ever told. Telling that other guy. Guy that she was pregnant.

[Dennis]

Yeah. She's always had narcissistic tendencies.

[John Deloney]

I don't care about the diagnostic term. Is she somebody who doesn't tell the truth?

[Dennis]

Lately, no. I mean, yes. Lately, yes. But in the past, no.

[John Deloney]

Okay.

[Dennis]

Is she has lied.

[John Deloney]

Okay.

[Dennis]

Throughout our relationship, she's lied.

[John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Dennis]

To me before.

[John Deloney]

So. Dude. Okay, so I'm jumping in here. Sorry, what's your question? Are you asking, should you tell her?

[Dennis]

I guess if the question is should I Tell her sooner rather than later.

[John Deloney]

Yes, I would tell your ex this is happening, period.

[Dennis]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

The best possible scenario for your daughter is you and her mother. Tell her. Tell her together.

[Dennis]

If she has to be on board.

[John Deloney]

No, she doesn't have to be on board.

[Dennis]

You tell her, I'm gonna do it by myself.

[John Deloney]

That's exactly right. The best possible outcome for your daughter is that y' all get in a room and say, we held this for. From you, we did the best we could with what we thought was right, and now we've learned that we were wrong and we are sorry and we mess this thing up. And you be very clear, I wasn't involved in making you. But I got here as soon as I could, and I. I didn't tell you early, but please, the best you can, let my actions speak louder than my words. I am your dad and you're my daughter.

[Dennis]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

But if I'm her, the very first thing I'm going to say is, y' all lied to me. The very next thing I'm going to ask is, does he even know I exist? And then if I'm her, I'm going to do everything I can now, but probably her mom's going to force her to wait till she's 18. I'm going to find that guy and find out if he knows, period. I mean, who. Who wouldn't want to? And no. Right?

[Dennis]

Yeah. It's understandable. I wouldn't fault her for the. I'd do the same thing.

[John Deloney]

Yeah, that's it. And so at some point, you're going to be a part of helping her find out, quote, unquote, who she truly is, genetically. Right. You're going to be a part of that, or you're going to send her out on her own.

[Dennis]

And, yeah, it's important to know that.

[John Deloney]

Right. And kids can go through. All of us can go through tons of stuff. We just can't go through it alone. And so if you really want to be. Really want to provide, like, basically you are pulling out the rug under your daughter. If you want to try to put another rug underneath her, is to say, I'll be a part of helping you find him. If you're interested in that. One day, I like that I'll walk alongside you. But you look at her and you say, I will always be your dad, period. I will always love you. You've seen me show up for you for 16 years. I showed up for you before I even met you. And my truest hope for you, and especially for her, is that her bio dad. And this is going to sound awful for me to say that her bio dad knew your ex was pregnant and he bailed on her and ran off and said I don't want anything to do with this kid. I don't want you to abort this kid. I don't want to. I don't want anything to do with this kid. And then you stepped in. That would be best case scenario for this 16 year old.

[Dennis]

Yeah, it would be, but I think it's somewhere in between because I think he does know.

[John Deloney]

What makes you think that?

[Dennis]

Her mom told me that he, she had ran into him in a bar one day and he asked about her, so I guess he even knew before then.

[John Deloney]

But do you know who this guy is?

[Dennis]

I've never met the guy.

[John Deloney]

Do you know who he is?

[Dennis]

I've heard names here and there, but she's changed the name I think to get her way from me. Like she had a, she had a boyfriend and she lied and said that was. He was the father when I know he wasn't because she had said a different name before and I would think that was just trying to get me out of the picture and I wasn't having that.

[John Deloney]

It may be worth you telling wife, I'm gonna do a DNA test on this, on my daughter and we're gonna find out who the dad is. You're gonna tell me who the dad is.

[Dennis]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

And I, I guess what I want you to, to hear me saying is in every way possible, I want this sweet 16 year old girl whose world is about to get turned upside down, that when she feels like she is in a free fall, that at the very worst you are free falling with her. At the very best you're going to be free falling. But don't ever forget, I've got you. You're anchored in. You know what I'm saying? So in a perfect world, this starts at like 4 or 5.

[Dennis]

Okay?

[John Deloney]

With age 4 or 5 with the, that, that sentiment. I wasn't there when, when you were made, but I got here as soon as I, I could. And from the age 3, 4, 5 or 6, like whatever age those conversations start coming up. She always knows I picked you. Remember when she was 4 or 5 and trying to fight you on everything and trying to establish boundaries and all that like all 4, 5 and 9, 10 and 13 year olds do, the common refrain is I picked you. Right?

[Dennis]

I wish I'd. I wish I'd known all that.

[John Deloney]

I know, I know. And that's why I'm not Beating you up. But it's that old Maya Angelou quote, like, do the best you can. And then when you find out different, you do better. Right? And so here you are, you're faced with a really tough situation. From the few things you've told me about your ex, I am doubling and tripling down on my relationship with this young little girl. And you can tell your ex, you can be with us, but we're going forward this way because this little girl deserves to know the truth about her life. The truth about how loved she is, the truth about truth. She, she deserves to know all that. And that conversation for a 16 year old. 16 year olds are smart. They get it. They're aware they're not emotionally mature, but they get stuff in. In really big ways, often underestimated by adults. But you sit down and the first thing you say is, I'm about to dump your world upside down. And I thought I was doing right and I'm so, so sorry, but today starts me doing right.

[Dennis]

That's. It's scary.

[John Deloney]

It's terrifying. Yeah. And expect her to lose her mind. Expect your, your ex to say all the right things and your 16 year old will say, screw you, dad. I want to go live with her. Expect all that. It's going to be a ping pong match of emotions for her because her whole world's getting dumped upside down. I mean, just think for a second, like, her dad's not her dad. I mean, I'm sorry, her dad is not her father.

[Dennis]

Right.

[John Deloney]

It's just tough. Just tough. But yeah, your ex is out to lunch on. Let's just don't tell her. That's. That's madness. That is a way to get that kid to cut y' all off forever and rightfully so. You've probably, I mean, you can go back and listen to some of my shows. I've had people call in when they say, like, hey, I found out somebody gave me 23andMe when I was 25 or 21. I found out my dad's not my dad. And it just ripples through their entire life, through their marriages, through their kids. It just, it's just becomes one of those things. It sets the family tree on fire.

[Dennis]

Yeah, I can't do that to her.

[John Deloney]

There you go, man. It sounds like you're a good man. Dude. What about your 13 year old? Are y' all. Is, is she a bio daughter?

[Dennis]

Yeah, she's. She's mine. With a different woman.

[John Deloney]

Okay.

[Dennis]

Actually, me and her have had a conversation similar and she said she Wouldn't have seeped out her father if she, if I wasn't.

[John Deloney]

I know, dude. Just a gauge. She's 13. Yeah, she's 13, dude. You get what I'm saying? Like, like she's 13. Like, I, I, I don't. 13s are just a ball of emotions and hormones and energy and data and facts flying at them a thousand miles an hour. They're still, there's still a human being trying to sense the world in the dark. And so I don't. I never would have gone looking. 100%. You would go looking, even if it's just to find out your cancer risk, for crying out loud. Right? She would. And so, yeah, I, I, man, I'm so grateful that you called, and I would love to know what happens and, and, dude, I have a rule. I don't usually talk to kids under 18, but if y' all too, wanted to call, I'd talk to you both at the same time. I'd be happy to do that. And if you and your ex want to call in and how to navigate that conversation together, y' all being adults. So we say, hey, we're not together anymore. There's been, there's been animosity between us, but this is best for our daughter. Absolutely. But, yeah, game on. Game on. This. Go, go. Make it happen, my brother. Thanks for the call, Dennis. Hey, next up, we're going to talk to a woman who just moved to the States from Canada, and she is overwhelmed with the state of politics in the United States. This will be a doozy. We'll be right back. All right, so Easter has come and gone again. And just like there's no finish line for your physical health or your mental and emotional well being, there's no finish line for being still and intentional about gratitude, about growing in your faith, and about building a relationship with God. And this is good news. Intentionality about spiritual matters is a practice, and any time can be a new starting point. So if you're committed to consistent practice of gratitude, prayer, or reflection during Lent, I want to encourage you to keep going. The small daily habits add up to a transformed life. For my daily practice, I personally use Hallow, the number one prayer app in the world. It's a great tool to help me stay connected, to help me slow down, and to help me be grateful. Whether it's a guided meditation, there are tons of music or scripture readings. Hallow helps me stay mindful even when life feels like it's falling apart. So set reminders, carve out time, and keep leaving space for God with Hallow plus, when you sign [e-mail] Deloney, you'll get three months for free. So even if you missed out on lint, it's still a great time to start. Go to Hallow H A L l o w hallow.com DeLoney for three months for free. This show is sponsored by Better Help. More and more people are becoming aware of the need for mental and emotional and physical health resources, whether it's finally taking action with their physical health, finally getting some friends to do life with, or finally getting the courage to seek professional mental health support. But when it comes to seeing a therapist, over a quarter of the people surveyed say they avoid getting therapy due to fear of judgment. I understand this. I felt the same judgment before I finally got the courage to go get help. When people won't get help, it doesn't just affect them, it affects their families, their workplaces and their entire communities. The world is better when people are healthy and whole. And if I can be selfish for a moment, the world is better when you are healthy and whole. So if you're thinking about trying therapy, contact my friends at BetterHelp. BetterHelp is 100% online therapy, so it's affordable and convenient for your schedule. They have a network of more than 30,000 licensed therapists with a wide range of specialties. BetterHelp has over 10 years of experience matching people with just the right therapist for them. So to get started, fill out a short online survey to get matched with a licensed therapist. If it's not the right fit, you can switch therapists at any time for no extra cost. And it's really easy to switch. We're all better with help. Visit betterhelp.com DeLoney to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp. H-E-L-P.com DeLoney all right, we're back. Hey. Please take two seconds, two seconds and hit the subscribe button. If you're watching this on YouTube or if you're listening on Spotify or Apple Podcast or wherever you get this show, the network app, Please, please take a second and subscribe to the show. And if you even have 10 seconds, leave a 5 star review real quick. It makes such a huge difference. He puts us up in the algorithm and it gets the show in front of more people so that more people can start taking these teeny tiny little steps towards being a better parent, a better lover, a better friend, a better neighborhood. God help us. That's what our country needs right now. Let's Go out to Cincinnati, Ohio, and talk to the great Lauren. Hey, Lauren. What's up?

[Lauren]

It's going.

[John Deloney]

It is going. What's up, my sister? How we doing?

[Lauren]

I'm okay. Just trying to figure out how to deal with everything.

[John Deloney]

If you figure that out, write that book. You'll be a jillionaire. So what's going on?

[Lauren]

I'm just really overwhelmed and anxious with moving here and all the politics that come along with moving here that I guess I wasn't really prepared for. It's very, very different from how I grew up. I grew up in a household that we didn't even talk about politics. I don't even know what my parents politics necessarily are. It's a weird conversation in Canada, I guess.

[John Deloney]

Well, Canada has a culture of nice.

[Dennis]

Yeah, that's in America.

[John Deloney]

Has a culture of drinking light beer on the lawn in lawn chairs and yelling at the neighbors, I guess.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

But you also know that if it goes down on this street, we're all banded together. Right. So it's, it's a. Yeah, the thing. Everything's open, but in general, I guess we're kind of in a cold civil war right now, but between each side. But on the whole, I know that my neighbors are different than me. And I was. Let me put it this way. My greatest friend on the. On planet earth is a guy named Todd. He's a banker. What does that mean? I co host the Ramsey show where we teach people to get out of debt. That means my whole job is dedicated to making sure he doesn't have business. And his whole job is making sure that people think I'm dumb. Right. I mean, at the end of the day. And he's the executor of my will. He's my closest friend in the world. I love his kids and his family and vice versa. It's just a. It's a very American. Like, we disagree on, like, on principles, but man, our values are iron clad. I trust that guy with my life. Right. And so, yeah, it's just a very different cultural thing. So tell me how, how you're experiencing it here. Is it with family? Is it with friends? Is it. Where's it coming?

[Lauren]

It's. It's coming from both sides. I'd say I'm kind of in the middle because I live in a rural part of Ohio. I live in Cincinnati. So as you can imagine, most people around me are Republican. And then my parents and the rest of my family live in Canada and they're not the biggest fan of the current president. Right. Now because of tariffs and everything. So every conversation I have is one side of the aisle, the next side of the aisle, the one side of the aisle, the next side of the aisle. And it's a little bit much.

[John Deloney]

So let's take politics off the table, cuz that's a tough, that's just a third rail conversation. Especially when you're stuck in the middle. Right?

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

If somebody, I don't know, like one of my co workers is pathologically addicted to murder podcasts, her name may be Kelly. Right. Just, just, I'm just throwing that out there. What would it be like if somebody always wanted to talk about the last murder show on 60 Minutes? They watched and they wanted to tell you graphic details about all the murder and the death? Now Kelly's like, oh, my gosh, that'd be my best friend. But for you, how would you respond to that?

[Lauren]

I guess I would do what I'm doing in this situation. It's just, I get quiet.

[John Deloney]

Okay, so tell me about that. What does getting quiet get you?

[Lauren]

I don't see any reason to be in the conversation. I don't really have an opinion when it comes to it. I don't really feel like I should in some ways, back and forth. And I just want, like, I just wanted them to feel heard. But then I'm, I, I'm kind of sick of hearing it, I guess, and is an easy way to put it.

[John Deloney]

So where, where did you learn, and I think you may have already alluded to it, where did you learn that making them feel heard and okay was more important than how you felt in an, in any given environment?

[Lauren]

Not exactly sure. Maybe my childhood. Okay. I'm not exactly sure if, if you.

[John Deloney]

Grew up in a culture. And I don't want to blame Canada because America's got plenty of this too, especially in the south, where we just don't talk about it and we're going to pretend it's not there, and then every few months or years, somebody just explodes because they can't hold it in any longer, or they die of some, some illness or they get some sort of chronic somatic, you know, pain disorder because their body's trying to just hold all this stuff in. What if I told you the greatest gift you could give to yourself and the people that you're around, family members and friends, new friends in a new culture, in a new country, is boundaries? And I'll echo Dr. Becky here. Boundaries require nothing of somebody else. It's just you stating. Here's what I'm going to Do. And so here's an example. Tell me what this does inside your chest. If it makes you feel a little nervous or if it makes you be like, oh, that'd be so awesome. You're sitting in rural Ohio at a gas station, and somebody is just, well, a gas station is too easy at. I don't know if you have. You have friends there in Ohio?

[Lauren]

Yeah, I do.

[John Deloney]

Okay. So they just start going in. Canada's the worst. I hate that place. They are. Fill in the blank. Fill in the blank. And we should tariff them. Whatever. Right? Lauren, what if you looked and said, hey, I. I just don't talk politics. I'm just. I. That's not some. I can't affect the tariff policy. And so I just. I don't get into it. But I really would be interested in how your kids are doing.

[Lauren]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

Tell me what that feels like in your chest as I'm saying that. Imagine yourself going through that exercise.

[Lauren]

That's not a good feeling. I'll put it that way. That's not so very out of my comfort zone.

[John Deloney]

Okay, tell me about it.

[Lauren]

It's just because, I don't know, I guess I'm a bit of a people pleaser.

[John Deloney]

Yep. Peacemaker, definitely.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

Yeah.

[Lauren]

I don't like to make conflict. I like to keep everything at bay.

[John Deloney]

Yes.

[Lauren]

But this, it's just. It's constant. It's all the time. It's in my face. I don't even feel like I can go on my phone anymore.

[John Deloney]

That's right.

[Lauren]

Because I don't even see a single thing about politics. Doesn't matter what side is on.

[John Deloney]

I love it. I love it. Because, see, here's what I want you to hear. You are not in your comfort zone on a minute by minute basis already. So the choice you have in front of you is not one thing I'm comfortable and one thing I'm not comfortable. You're choosing from two forms of discomfort.

[Lauren]

Okay?

[John Deloney]

Either your mom and dad are going to electrify the right side of your body and your friends are going to electrify the left side of your body. That was pretty good. You see what I did there? Or you're going to choose to not be electrocuted and you're going to have to stand there in the discomfort of, I spoke my mind finally, and not even I spoke my mind. Like, I took a stand and I'm like, your politics are wrong. I think tariffs are ridiculous. Not that it's simply. Yeah, dude, I only talk about things that I can directly impact or that I can, I can intercede on in a minute by minute basis, like your kids, like our local schools, like our family, like my husband, my friends. I can impact that. I just don't get into the other mess.

[Lauren]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

Because what I'm trying to get you to see is you are radically uncomfortable right now already.

[Lauren]

Yes.

[John Deloney]

And you can't talk to your friends.

[Dennis]

You.

[John Deloney]

Yeah. You can't talk to your friends. You can't talk to your family. And let, if we have to do some choose between one discomfort or another, let's choose the discomfort that is short term, that will get us to what we want. And in your case, you want peace.

[Lauren]

Yes.

[John Deloney]

Okay.

[Lauren]

Even in my house, my husband talks about it all the time.

[John Deloney]

So let's practice with him. Let's practice with him. And do you want me to give you a tip that my wife did to me? Because I was the same way?

[Lauren]

Sure.

[John Deloney]

I politicized every thing, Everything. Yeah. And my wife gave me the gift of saying, I can't bear the weight when you come home and dump all of your philosophical stuff, all the articles you've read, all the conversations, all your pontificating about the end of the world, I can't carry that. And so if you need to talk about that, I'm not a good person for you, but I am interested in talking about things that we can do together that our family can be involved with that like, helps us lean towards the world that we want.

[Lauren]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

So I can't come home. I can, I can. You know, it's my house and my wife's house and she wouldn't like, say, shut up. But I don't come home talking about all the research about loneliness and how we're all dying and it's not helpful. I can come home and say, hey, I really want us to be known as a lighthouse of hospitality. Everybody's welcome at our house. Everybody. I don't care who you vote for. I don't care who you love. I don't care anything. You're always welcome at my house. Can we invite somebody over once a week and she's like, done. How about twice? You get what I'm see? You get. You see the difference there?

[Lauren]

Yes, I do.

[John Deloney]

Okay, so practice with me real quick. I'll be your husband. Okay.

[Lauren]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

I think. I don't know. I'm just making something up. I don't want someone to clip it. They're going to clip what I'm about to say and then they're going to put it out on the Internet. I think that American politics are the best thing ever, and I think Canadian politics are the worst and blah, blah, blah. And. And we're sitting down for dinner. You now go.

[Lauren]

See, this is where I struggle. I feel like freezing and just not saying anything.

[John Deloney]

Okay, do me a favor. Exhale. And I want you to take your thumb and your forefinger or your thumb and your middle finger, whichever one's more comfortable for your hand. And I want you just to squeeze them together. And all we're doing is recognizing. I feel a thing and I'm on it.

[Lauren]

Okay?

[John Deloney]

And let's go one step further. I'll even say it's unfair for your husband who doesn't know how uncomfortable he's making you, or he actually knows you're uncomfortable. He doesn't know why. And maybe in his weird way, he's trying to connect with you.

[Lauren]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

And so a gift you can give him is, hey, this is. This actually doesn't connect us together. This pushes me away. I can't. I can't hold it all. And so I intentionally don't watch the news. I intentionally don't scroll social media. I intentionally don't do these things so that I can show up for my neighbors, so I can show up for my friends. I can actually affect something locally, which is all I can do right now. There's not a single thing I can do about executive orders until the next election. Period.

[Lauren]

Exactly. That's my mindset.

[John Deloney]

I can't do anything about it. I can call my congressman. Right. I can do that. I don't even think you're allowed to call our congressman, are you? I guess you can.

[Lauren]

They don't probably could, but I don't think it would matter.

[John Deloney]

I mean, it does if enough people call it, for sure does, but usually that's pretty coordinated efforts. Right. And you can go thumbs down everything on social media. That doesn't do anything. It just makes you mad.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

Right. And so it's just opting out and saying, I'm going to control what I can control. I'm going to become the person I want to see in the world, period.

[Lauren]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

So I think politics are. Blah, blah, blah. What do you think, Lauren?

[Lauren]

I don't really want to talk about politics.

[John Deloney]

And. Okay, so you drew the boundary and you drew the disconnection. You highlighted the disconnection. Now one more statement is, how are we going to connect?

[Lauren]

Okay, let's talk about what we're going to do. This mark or something along those lines, I guess.

[John Deloney]

So I would say I am interested. Always use I statements.

[Lauren]

Okay.

[John Deloney]

I get overwhelmed by all the politic talk. I am super interested and planning what you and I are going to do this summer. Could we talk about that and maybe if you're. And again, I don't know your husband, if he is always, always, always politic and politic and politicking. It may be that. Let's don't do that little exercise we practiced first. Let's sit down and you tell him, hey, since I've been here, I'm overwhelmed and I can't hold it all. And I need our house to be politics free. I need our home to be a safe place where I can drop my shoulders and the world is chaotic. My home is still chaotic. I mean, childhood home in another country is chaotic. Here is chaotic. And especially in the U.S. chaos sells. It's intentional. All the media companies are publicly traded. The big, the big three or the big four, they're publicly traded. That means they have a vested interest in not giving you truth, but in selling you ads. That's it. Their job is to make a profit. And how do you make a profit? You tell somebody the end of the world is coming and I have a solution. I have your escape pod. That's it. And so telling your husband, I need our place to be a place of safety, not of, not free of conflict and not free of discussion. Man, me and my wife argue and disagree on stuff all the time. But it's not yelling matches. It's her saying, I think that's completely off. Or she says something, I'm like, I don't agree with that at all. And we go back and forth and I may send her an article and she'll get halfway through it and say, I just disagree with the premise of this. But then she honors me by saying, and here's why. And then I get a choice of to opt in or opt out. But I know we're always on the same team. So sitting down and saying, I can't do politics with you anymore. I am interested in talking with you. I'm till death do us part interested in talking with you about things that we can build together to create the world in our tiny little sphere that we want to see. We're going to learn how to love local and be a part of our rural community here in Ohio. And we're going to impact change. There's with who cares how people vote? We're going to impact change because we're going to become those people and start there. And if he says forget you, then you'll have a bigger problem. In your marriage, but it sounds like he would honor you and say you're exactly right. I'm sorry, I'm getting worked up on this end too. Seat connection there. Thank you so much for the call, Lauren. By the way, Lauren, whether you're from Canada, just moving to the States, it's probably more acute. But this conversation is happening in home, millions of homes across the country. I'm really grateful that you reached out and had the conversation with me because I think it's going to give a lot of peace to a lot of people. When we come back, a woman's facing challenges in navigating boundaries with her in laws and that applies to all of you listening. Stay tuned. We'll be right back. Good folks, a strong body supports a healthy mind. And too often we overlook how connected the two really are. Neglecting our bodies like not moving, not lifting weights and not getting more flexible can lead to increased mental and emotional stress. I often tell folks I have never felt worse emotionally after a good workout, only better. And this is where TrainWell comes in. TrainWell offers tailored workouts with step by step guidance from real people. And that means it's not just an app and it's not just a personal trainer. It's the best of both. To get started, you just answer a few questions about your fitness journey, hop on a chat with an expert trainer to talk about your goals and make a personalized plan. And then it's time for you to get to work. As you complete workouts, your trainer will keep changing them to help you get even better. My wife and I use it. Some of our friends use it. Even extended family is getting in on it. We've all been doing these workouts with Train well because Train well takes away our excuses and makes working out easy. If you're ready to start taking control of your health, take the quiz to find your perfect trainer today. And right now they have a special offer for my audience. Just $89 a month when you lock in your plan, plus 14 days of free one on one personal training. Go to trainwell.net deloney right now. That's T R A I n w l l.net DeLoney all right, let's go to Memphis, Tennessee. Hey, what is up? An hi, how are you?

[Ann]

How are you?

[John Deloney]

I'm great.

[Ann]

I'm good.

[John Deloney]

What's up?

[Ann]

How do I set boundaries with my in laws?

[John Deloney]

I don't know if you can figure that out. You should write that book. You'll sell a trillion copies of Planet Wide. What's up with your in laws.

[Ann]

Well, they all work at the same family business.

[John Deloney]

Oh, gross. You're doomed. You're doomed. In.

[Ann]

And they all live on the same piece of land.

[John Deloney]

Oh, Lord.

[Ann]

And we just moved to the same city as them, so it's a. A newer issue that has kind of popped up. And we also just had a baby.

[John Deloney]

Are you the first one to have a baby in that family?

[Ann]

Yes. And also the first one to be married.

[John Deloney]

Nice. So the whole cult rests on you.

[Ann]

Pretty much.

[John Deloney]

There you go. All right, so what's going on? How are they. How are they making you uncomfortable? Or probably a better way to say that is how are your in laws taking peace from your brand new family in your. Your developing and growing home?

[Ann]

Yeah. So my mother in law wanted to watch our baby. We have daycare typically, but she wanted to watch the baby for the day, and I agreed. And she texted me that morning and said, hey, I'm gonna be an hour late. So I said, no worries, Just come a different day. And she went and checked my baby out of daycare so that she could. Oh, time with her.

[John Deloney]

Hell to the no, no, no. Yeah, that's. Yeah, that's no bueno, right? I wish you'd seen the whole booth. The whole booth was just like, whoa, yikes. Okay, so what else?

[Ann]

They want to spend, like, three weeks of our time off from work together. And so when I push back on, hey, my husband and I are gonna spend vacation together. They kind of send messages in a way that, this is what we do for the holidays. You need to spend it with us. This is how we celebrate.

[John Deloney]

So. So my big question is, where is your husband on in all this?

[Ann]

So his method is to ignore and kind of tell them that we might show up, but we might not show up.

[John Deloney]

So he's a coward.

[Ann]

He likes to keep all the peace.

[John Deloney]

Yeah. And then he married you. Yeah. And so I get, man, peacekeeping keeps you safe when you're a kid, 100%. And if you grow up in a family business, in a family compound and a family farm and a family everything, and this is what we do, and this is how we do it. Peacekeeping is a survival mechanism. So I honor your husband. Good for him. He did what he had to do. But then he looked at you and held both your hands and looked in your eyes and said, till death do us part. And that was the day he broke away from having to prop up emotionally immature parents. And he said, I choose you. And that means the peacekeeping days are over. Now it's honoring your wife and honoring your Wife is not sending vague gray messages to in laws because now they have another avenue and it's you.

[Ann]

Right.

[John Deloney]

And you're having to carry all this stuff now. And so here, I mean, it's as simple as this. It's as simple as your husband telling his parents. Does he work at this family compound, too?

[Ann]

No, he. He will finish his training and then has the option to.

[John Deloney]

Is he going to.

[Ann]

I think we've decided. No.

[John Deloney]

We have. Has he?

[Ann]

Yeah. Yeah.

[John Deloney]

Because if he's a person that does gray with them, he probably does gray with you, too.

[Ann]

Oh, yeah.

[John Deloney]

And I say this all the time on the show. This is a real life example. The things you did as a kid to keep you safe will destroy your marriages. And so he probably tells you pretty often. Yeah. Like, you're like, hey, I really want to go to the beach. And he's like, yeah, let's. Let's check that out. He's not going to the beach. And he just buys himself some time and it kind of slowly fades away. And you're like, well, he's not really interested, and I'm probably pushing too much. We may not have the money this time. And so you live in a perpetual state of disappointment. And then here's what I don't like about that kind of gray just is you think something's wrong with you, and then somebody comes along and says, you will be here for Christmas. You're like, yes, ma' am, even though you hate it. Does that sound familiar? Or. Tell me if I'm wrong.

[Ann]

I think you're spot on.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Ann]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

So I guess it's very similar to a previous caller we just had. You're in a state of discomfort. And if you ask your husband, if you tell him that you need him to be more decisive and more instructive with his family and more importantly, that you want to get away with him and decide together the kind of life y' all want to build. And you need him to take the lead with his family when it comes to boundaries. And no more wishy wash and no more gray. And by the way, you're doing it to me, too. That's going to be uncomfortable also. Fair.

[Ann]

Yeah. Okay.

[John Deloney]

So you're choosing e to either a discomfort over here or discomfort over here. But most of the time when we don't have these hard conversations in our marriage, we think it's because we don't want to become uncomfortable. And I always want to point out, with a couple, you're uncomfortable now.

[Ann]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

Let's choose the discomfort. That's going to get us to the place where we want to be. And also, he needs the freedom to say, I want to be with my family every holiday, every Christmas. And you can say that I'm going to murder you to death. Right? Don't do that. Don't kill him. Do you think he actually wants to be there and he's kind of just quietly gaslighting you a little bit, or is he just sick of the whole thing?

[Ann]

He would love to join the family business, but I think he knows that our marriage can't handle it.

[John Deloney]

Okay, so that's. That's what I was getting at, because here's where the trend. Tell me if the trend is wrong. All my family is there. Let's just move to this town. It'll be fine. We'll have our own place. I'm not even done training yet. I'm not going to work there, but let's just move here so we can kind of be in the vicinity. It's the first kid and all that. And you're like, okay. And then it's. This is crazy. They said that I could just come. I could join the business, and they're going to pay me X. I'm not going to do that. But, man. And then it's this slow. It's almost like he knows where he's going to end up.

[Ann]

Right.

[John Deloney]

And he's just trying to slowly wear the edge off of you so he can ultimately get where he wants to be. And who does that? His mom. Right. He's just running the script that he knows.

[Ann]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

And so how long y have y' all been married?

[Ann]

Four years.

[John Deloney]

Okay. Can I tell you, this isn't crazy for marriages. This is pretty normal where two people get together, you have a kid, and then you both start running the scripts that you know. Or in my language, you start living into the pictures you just anticipated for your life. And he probably has a picture of his parents are loving grandparents and that he works at the family business, and he takes it over one day, and he's a bajillionaire, and you get to live the life that his mom lives, lived and on and on. And you have another picture of what you want this thing to look like.

[Ann]

Yeah, I do.

[John Deloney]

And so what y' all need to do is sit down and be very honest with each other about the pictures of what you want your life to look like. And that usually is a challenging conversation, but, man, it can be the most awesome gift to your family, to you and to him. So as I'm talking Tell me where you have a. You have a point of pause. Tell me what it is. What are you worried about?

[Ann]

Well, in a couple of months, once the training is done, we do have the option to move away, which would kind of give us more distance and would go kind of back to our. How our marriage was before we were around them. But I don't want to, like, crush my husband's dreams.

[John Deloney]

So you're just going to crush yours.

[Ann]

When you say it like that, Yeah. I don't. I don't want to do that either.

[John Deloney]

Because I think the real magic here is figuring out, is there a way you can have the peace in your home and the laughter and the joy in your home without worrying that your mother in law is going to come take your kid out of school without you knowing? Or can he have the life he wants and have two or three really uncomfortable years learning that it was never his job to prop up his mother and her emotional dysregulation? That was not his job. It is his job to fully and wholly love his wife and his kids. And that's going to be a tough shift for him. That's hard. I mean, and I wouldn't. It's not a. It's not an Instagram post. That's not a switch you flip. That's something you practice. It's very hard because his mom will text him and say, like, you're breaking my heart. You're taking my grandbaby away. This Christmas feels useless that you. Since you walked out, she'll do stuff like that, right?

[Ann]

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

[John Deloney]

Okay. So he's gonna have to learn that that's not his job. And most people in that level of dysfunction need a professional. And so here's a. The easiest way to enter into this conversation. And I kind of love it when you don't know what to do next. I'm a big believer in getting somebody you trust and somebody you care about who will be honest with you and still love you, and dumping the whole box on the table. What does that mean? Honey, how old your little baby?

[Ann]

Four months.

[John Deloney]

Okay, honey, we have a four month old. In four months, you're about to be done. And I'm counting down the days because I'm terrified of what comes next. What do you mean? Because I feel like I cannot. I. I don't want to build a life where you're a part of this family culture. Because the next step, by the way, Ann, is y' all are moving onto that property. You know that. And I do, too.

[Ann]

You do Right.

[John Deloney]

And he already has the plot picked out. His mom's already said, well, this is going to be for y' all if you ever want to come. And Dad's like, we'll give you a great deal on it. I'll even get the down payment. That's already in the works.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

And so you can say, I feel like this is the future, and I'm already grieving that that's going to be my life and all things on the table. We have an opportunity to move. And you are so invested in propping up your mom, not honoring and loving her, but being her therapist, being her. Her support pet, that I feel like I'm going to break your heart by wanting us to move away. And I feel st. So instead of talking about family business and moving into the family compound and moving away, what if we first cleared the deck and said, what do we want our house to look like and feel like financially, emotionally, romantically? How many kids if we could do it, like, shake one of those eight balls, how many kids we want to have? What do we want it to feel like when you walk home every. Walk in every day, and then let's go from there. Do you get what I'm saying?

[Ann]

Yeah, that makes perfect sense.

[John Deloney]

And if he looks at you and says, all right, all cards on the table, I'm moving onto that property. This is what we do, then you an have to deal in that reality, because right now you're kind of avoiding reality a little bit, and he's kind of avoiding reality a little bit. Everybody's playing the gray game because he doesn't want to hurt your feelings, but he's going to work at the family business and move y' all onto the plot. And you don't want to hurt his feelings, but you're moving away, back to where y' all were. And that's when you get a car wreck down the road.

[Ann]

Yeah.

[John Deloney]

So step one, write down where you feel trapped. And what I've heard you say is, I feel trapped that this is going to be our end result. And I've told you since I have married you, I didn't want this to be our end result. And I feel trapped that your mother in law is dictating my life, our life, and that we're just property in her little chess game. And I feel trapped that if I move us away, you're going to be so devastated that you're going to resent me forever. That's. That's one of the traps I heard and just go down a list Write these traps out and then honor him. And by sitting down and loving him enough to be honest and say, I see a train wreck coming for us, and I want to slow the whole train down so that we don't crash. And that, to me, I think, is the scariest, most vulnerable, but most honest and loving thing partners can do for each other. I see a train wreck coming. And the thing you do with your parents, you're. I feel like you're doing with me. And by the way, I'm participating, too. I married you, not your mom. Go make it happen, Ann. I know it's a scary, scary conversation. Again, I always offer this. I'm happy to talk to both of you. If y' all want to do a session with me by together, I'll do a session with you guys for an hour. If y' all want to do that, we'll record it. That'd be fun. Or if he wants to call. How do you do this? He wants to choose you over mom. He doesn't know how. I'm happy to talk to him there, but I'd love to hear how this conversation wins. Holler back went. How this conversation went. Holler back at us and let me know, because, by the way, millions and millions of people are going through this exact thing right now. And so your vulnerability and bravery is going to help a whole bunch of people. And thank you so much for the call. Hey, gang, we'll be right back. All right, it's time for a quick word about Delete Me. Does anyone else feel like our digital footprints are starting to feel more like digital trails leading a whole bunch of creepy people back to us? And now scammers are using phishing attacks. That's phishing with a ph, where they try to trick you into giving them something by pretending to know you. Have you ever got an email or a text or a phone call and the person or the AI bot on the other end sounds like someone who's really looking out for you. With the new technological advancements, really, no one is safe anymore. So what are we supposed to do? Start controlling what you can. First, you learn about how to be careful online and offline with your digital footprint and sign up with Delete Me. I use and recommend Deleteme because they work in the background to reduce my online presence. That way I don't have to worry about creepy data brokers having my data and then selling it to other people that I don't even know about. Delete Me has reviewed over tens of thousands of sites for me and They've removed my data from hundreds of them, which has saved me countless hours and a ton of stress. Stop the phishing attacks, the harassment, and the other online threats before they even start. And take control of your digital privacy with Delete me. Go to joindeleteme.com deloney for 20% off their annual plan that comes out to less than nine bucks a month. Go to join J-O-I-N joindeleteme.com DeLoney all right, we're back. All right, Kelly, something rad happened. What is it?

[Christina]

All right, this is a bit of a follow up. So this is from Christina from Missouri.

[John Deloney]

Okay, pause real quick. This weekend I was did an event with Stephen Bargazi, Nate's dad, the magician. By the way, if you ever have a chance to see Stephen Bargazi in your town, you have to go. He is next level magician. I haven't laughed that hard. He's so. It was just amazing. But he was making fun of me from stage and he was like, ooh, a grown man that says rad. You think that makes your you cool? It doesn't. It's embarrassing. Like, man, he let me have it for saying rad. And just when I said rad just now, I was like, all right, I'm too old to say rad. I love him so. Oh, dude. It was even more now ruthless. All right, so Kelly, something neat is going on. I don't know what to say.

[Christina]

Neato.

[John Deloney]

Something really remarkable, really swell. Trying to say an old, middle aged thing to say.

[Christina]

It's the bee's knees or what. All right, so this is from Christina two years ago. She called in and you talked to her about how to support her sister who had a terminal diagnosis. All right, so she says here, I took your advice by the way. The sister was ignoring it. Wouldn't plan a funeral stuff, wouldn't talk about it with her husband.

[John Deloney]

I do remember this call.

[Christina]

Yeah, she wouldn't. Wouldn't face reality, basically. All right, she said, I took your advice and we had hard conversations about funeral. And we said everything that we wanted to say. We laughed and cried. We drove down to the lake to watch the sunset. I sat with her many times, just holding her hands while we cried. It was beautiful and sad. I had the privilege of being next to her as she left this world. I found out later that she was unable to have those hard conversations with her husband and son. But because we had had those conversations, I was able to help guide them through the process and tell them her wish to your advice. I have no regrets. I miss her terribly. But our last words to each other in this world where I love you. Thank you for all that you do.

[John Deloney]

Oh, my gosh. Oh. Caught me on the wrong day. I'm about to get choked up.

[Christina]

What was her name says Christina from St. Louis.

[John Deloney]

Christina from St. Louis. I'm not even going to say anything else other than that's amazing. And you've created a legacy for a grieving husband and a grieving kid and for you and your family because you entered into that hard conversation. Amazing. Amazing. Yeah. That was a blessing, man. I appreciate that one. That was a really great letter. Thank you so much for that. Kind of like the theme of the show today is head into the hard conversation. If you're not having a hard conversation, you're already miserable. If you have a hard conversation, that's miserable, it's hard. So you're just choosing your hard. You're choosing which misery you path you want to take. And I'm always going to take the one that's going to be short term, that is going to get me to where I want to go and not just stay in the dance forever. So thank you all so much for checking out the show. Love you guys. Stay in school, don't do drugs, and I'll see you next time. Peace.