DTN Podcast | Jim Alstott Ep. 55 From Near-Death to Trauma Mastery with Matan Cohen-Citron

Summary

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The Drop the Needle Podcast

Episode 55: “From Near-Death to Trauma Mastery” with Matan Kohen Citron

Date: March 12, 2026
Host: Jim Alstatt
Guest: Matan Kohen Citron

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Episode Theme Overview

In this transformative episode, “From Near-Death to Trauma Mastery,” host Jim Alstatt sits down with trauma expert and healer Matan Kohen Citron. The episode explores Matan’s deeply personal journey from burnout in finance and a near-death experience (NDE) through recovery from PTSD, to his life’s work helping thousands release trauma stored in the body. They discuss the universality of pain, the power of self-abandonment, how our culture shapes our healing, and the integration of modalities like hypnotherapy, qigong, yoga, shadow work, and, as always, the unifying energy of music.
The conversation is candid, vulnerable, and rich with perspective, offering relatable insight for anyone seeking integration, healing, or inspiration.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Matan’s Origin Story and Early Awakening

• [02:59] Matan shares how at age 21 he began his healing journey with yoga, but emphasizes that “every story has a beginning, but the beginning is way before… it's childhood, it's perception, it's drama, it's family, it's all of that.”
• Meeting his “first real teacher” was life-changing: “It was such a big shift in my life. All of a sudden my heart started to open. I was able to fall in love, to stay longer with a partner.”

2. Manifesting Crisis and Wake-Up Calls

• [05:03] Jim asks about Matan’s fantasy of getting hit by a truck to escape his finance job—then actually having a near-death experience.
• Matan [05:20]: “I think I was manifesting my own wake up call... I did a part in fantasizing about this happening to me and really wanting to claim my life.”
• Discussion centers on how suffering can precede transformation:
  • Matan [06:16]: “We change by pain more than we change by thinking positive.”

3. The Universal Trauma:

• [07:38] What trauma pattern does everyone carry?
• Matan: “Self-abandonment. We all have the version of our three-year-old that runs careless... then at one point we get a cue from life… and we are leaving ourselves...shifting to a different way of existence. This can show up later as weight issues, anxiety, depression... But I think this is part of the journey that we all have to experience.”
• He emphasizes helping people reconnect with "the energy of your self"—what yoga calls “the self.”

4. How Trauma Lives in the Body

• [11:56] Jim revisits Matan’s struggle post-NDE: unable to be alone with his daughters due to PTSD.
• Matan [12:07]: “My nervous system was completely out of alignment… I wasn't feeling safe in my body. I got the belief unconsciously that I'm not safe and my body reacted accordingly. It was a complete state of misalignment.”
• Temporary loss of his professional capacity:
  • [14:26]: “I went down to 15 [session hours per week]… needed to spend more time in the wood, more time with myself to take care of my own energy.”

5. Work, Burnout, and Denial

• [15:58] Discussion of overwork and its hidden costs.
• “When you think everything's okay, you don't notice how things are crumbling around you.” — Jim [16:48]
• Matan [18:27]: Workaholism grows out of self-preservation and safety, not just habit: “A person is not becoming workaholic overnight… In most cases, it's back to safety. ‘I'm better off working right now than being with my family.’ And that pattern... comes after years of behavior.”
• Practice of meditation as an antidote to denial:
  • “It's not about those high experiences… It's like our mind is going all the time and we are masters of denial. And how just by being with that creates magic in people’s lives.” — Matan [20:32]

6. Toxic Masculinity and the Body

• [21:02] Matan describes how toxic masculinity manifests as stored tension:
  • “I think that it's the heart. But every person holds tension different in their body… Some people in their lower back, neck, throat, gut, diaphragm…”
• Releasing it means reclaiming vulnerability and emotional range:
  • “For me... the ability to be vulnerable, to listen to my heart, to cry, to experience all of this range of emotions my unconscious mind was not allowing before.” — Matan [22:15]

7. Emotion, Suppression, and Physical Health

• [24:06] Jim vulnerably shares his own journey with nearly 400 lbs, numbing pain with food/alcohol/painkillers, and only healing through authenticity and movement.
• Matan: Suppressing emotions takes tremendous unconscious energy:
  • [26:26]: “We think we gain energy from [repression] but actually…there is so much unconscious energy going into that repression. That’s why when people are releasing that, all of a sudden energy starts to flow… Being healthy is our natural state.”
• Trauma release is visible, sometimes dramatically:
  • [28:09]: “You see people who don’t carry that weight anymore… Their whole face is lighting up… I always prefer to let people do the work by themselves so it happens naturally in their life.”

8. East vs West: Healing Wisdoms and Their Blindspots

• Eastern Limit:
  • [30:22]: “I don’t think [Eastern masters] understand the complex of life that we have… We get more stimulation in an hour than a monk in the Himalaya gets in a year.”
• Western Limit:
  • [34:18]: “We consider things too mental. Talk therapy...completely ignores the body, the feelings, the emotions. They want a full book of clients, not necessarily to help the client as quickly as possible.”
• Holistic health requires attending to body, food, movement, sleep, and community, not just talk.

9. Hypnotherapy & Lasting Change

• [35:34] Matan explains hypnotherapy as “a tool” — not the solution, but a path to access and shift deep-seated beliefs that shape suffering.
• Matan: “Every form of hypnosis is self-hypnosis. I can help [someone] hypnotize himself… Hypnotherapy works because it focuses on the belief, the behavior people have. If it’s pain, trauma, anxiety—it’s a result of something else, a belief.”
• The real problem often isn’t what people first present:
  • “There’s five to seven degrees of separation between the stated issue and the real issue… Once you realize the problem isn’t what you thought, the solution is different.”
• True transformation is empowering, anchored in self-ownership and solution-oriented change.

10. The Ultimate Healing Modality

• [50:53] If you had to delete all but one healing modality?
  • Matan: “Love. That’s the beginning and end of it… The idea is to connect to our heart and work from there.”

11. Music as Medicine & Personal Soundtracks

• [52:10] – [61:08]
  • Early musical influences: not many childhood memories of music, but Israeli 90s rock and reggae (Bob Marley) after the Army.
  • Transformative power of EDM and communal dance for spiritual connection: “A thousand people dancing together in a sunrise—it’s as close to God as it gets for me.” [54:09]
  • “A body in motion stays in motion. That’s for sure.” — Jim [52:29]
  • Empowering songs: “My Way” (Frank Sinatra), “What a Wonderful World” (Louis Armstrong), Bob Marley’s “Cornerstone.”
  • On the song that could change the world:
    • “Cornerstone by Bob Marley... It’s about the aversion that we have, to the world, to ourselves. If we’re able to pay more attention to that instead of rejecting it, that’s where the power is...” — Matan [59:04]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On pain as a motivator:
  • “We change by pain more than we change by thinking positive.” — Matan [06:16]
• On healing and self-abandonment:
  • “Self-abandonment. That’s the trauma pattern no one ever talks about… we leave our hearts, we shift to a different way of existence…” — Matan [07:38]
• On suppressed emotion:
  • “There is so much unconscious energy going into that repression… Being healthy is our natural state.” — Matan [26:26]
• On men and emotions:
  • “You realize it’s just a different way of communicating… A lot of men, they know how to repress it… for a lot of people, language is the way to release energy, through conversation.” — Matan [23:20]
• On integration over ego:
  • “Do the work so it serves people in their life—not just for the session.” — Matan [28:17]
• On the best healing modality:
  • “Love. That’s the beginning and the end of it.” — Matan [50:53]
• On the power of music:
  • “A thousand people dancing in a sunrise—it’s as close to God as it gets for me.” — Matan [54:09]
  • “Music is the tie that binds us all together.” — Jim [54:35]
• On realizing the real problem:
  • “Their mind is in a broken record trying to understand ‘what’s wrong with me.’ What exists other than the problem? Everything.” — Matan [48:49]

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Important Timestamps

• [01:05 – 02:45]: Introduction and Matan’s background
• [05:03 – 06:53]: Fantasizing about escape, pain as a catalyst
• [07:38 – 09:35]: Ubiquitous trauma patterns and self-abandonment
• [11:56 – 13:36]: PTSD post-near-death experience, nervous system misalignment
• [15:06 – 17:22]: Workaholism, stress, and their unnoticed impacts
• [21:02 – 23:40]: Toxic masculinity, emotional suppression, and release
• [26:02 – 27:43]: Emotional suppression, weight, health, and energy flow
• [28:09 – 29:44]: Seeing trauma leave the body in real time
• [30:04 – 35:15]: East vs West: strengths and weaknesses of each in trauma care
• [35:34 – 50:53]: Hypnotherapy explained, belief work, practical healing steps
• [52:10 – 61:08]: Music and healing; lightning round playlist and insights
• [61:46 – 62:07]: Closing, guest contact info

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Summary Takeaways

• Personal transformation is often prompted by deep pain or crisis, but integrating that pain into wisdom is possible with the right support.
• Every person carries trauma—self-abandonment is perhaps the most silent but universal wound.
• Healing requires attention not only to thoughts, but also to how trauma lives in the body—and true recovery happens when self-ownership and love are restored.
• The fastest, deepest changes happen when the real problem is unearthed (beyond surface symptoms) and a new belief is anchored.
• The most powerful modality? Love—“the beginning and the end of it.”
• Music is interwoven with healing, community, and even spirituality.
• Whether you struggle with burnout, numbness, or a history of trauma—there’s a path to integration and wholeness. Healing is natural, and possible.

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Guest Links

• Website: matansmovement.com
• Instagram: @matansmovement

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This summary captures the heart, wisdom, and practical insights of Jim Alstatt’s conversation with Matan Kohen Citron—a masterclass in healing, self-discovery, and the redemptive power of connecting to our bodies…and each other. For anyone on the journey back to themselves, this episode is a powerful listen—or reference guide.

Transcript

[Commercial Narrator]

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[Jim Alstatt]

Welcome to the Drop the Needle Podcast, your backstage pass to the mystical realm. I'm your host, Jim Alstatt, and here gifted souls step up to the mic sharing their spiritual journey. We're hitting the high notes and the low notes of their awakening, creating a symphony of enlightenment. This isn't just another interview show. This is where divine insights are channeled and universal truths are revealed. So crank up your stereo and sit back because who knows, this just might help you compose the next transformative chapter of your soul's purpose. Are you ready? Let's go. Hi everyone and welcome back to the Drop the Needle Podcast. I'm your host, Jim Alstott, and I'm so happy you all decided to join us. Today's guest used to fantasize about getting hit by a truck on his way to his finance job. Then he had an actual near death experience that left him with ptsd, panic attacks, and unable to be alone with his own daughters for nine months. But that trauma became his training ground. Now, 20,000 sessions later, Matan Kohen Citron has become a master at helping people release trauma stored in the body, combining hypnosis, qigong, movement and shadow work into something that actually works. He went from following everyone else's formula to discovering that sometimes your old ways have to die in order to find out who you really are. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome Matan Kohen Citron. Welcome.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Thank you. Very happy to be here.

[Jim Alstatt]

Happy to have you on. Thank you for making the time for this. Why don't we take a moment and Let everyone know a little bit about yourself.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

So formally, you know, formally, I got into training. I was 21 years old and I knew that I'm going to try your best, I'm going to give you a guy a chance. And that was my, you know, like every story has to have a beginning, but the beginning is way before, is childhood, it's perception, it's drama, it's family, it's all of that. However, when I was 21 years old, I knew that I'm going to try yoga and I traveled around the world and I started practicing with different teachers until I met, two years into that journey, I met my first teacher. So he obviously, two years into the journey, he wasn't my actual first teacher, but it was the first time that I got a system. A medicine that worked me means it served me to where I was at that moment in time. It was such a big shift in my life. All of a sudden my heart started to open. I was able to fall in love, to stay longer with a partner. And I said that if there is a practice like that that can support me in that way, I'm gonna do it every day. And about 25 years later, I'm still doing something every day to take care of my body, my mind, my psychic, my spirituality.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's wonderful. So where were you born?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

I was born in Israel.

[Jim Alstatt]

Okay, okay. Because obviously there's an accent and I wanted to make sure that everybody was aware where you came from. So thank you for sharing that and that's a great story and it's a great point too, that every story has a beginning, it's got to start somewhere. Right. So if you don't mind, let's jump into some questions.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yeah.

[Jim Alstatt]

Okay. So you fantasized about getting hit by a truck to escape your job, then had an actual near death experience. Did the universe have a sixth sense of humor or were you literally manifesting your own wake up call?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

I think I was manifesting my own wake up call at some moment. It was years later, you know, like between winning finance and having that near death experience. It was I think about eight, nine years. Yes. But I do have part, you know, like I, you know, I think we asking if we have a part or we don't have a part. I did a part in fantasizing about this happened to me and really wanting to claim my life.

[Jim Alstatt]

So it's, it's one of those things, it's where your focus goes, your energy flows and that from, from the universe picking up on that and fantasizing about it. It must have been. It must have been a pretty rough time for you to think that that was the only way out of your situation.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yes. You know, I guess the. The one thing that is common for most people is that we an estimate our own power and we live in a place that we. We change by pain more than we change by thinking positive.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yes.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

I think people will make a. I call it like it's easier in our culture to move from 1 to 3 or from 2 to 4 instead of taking your life and your life is 8 or 7 and to a 9. So I think this is something that we live in right now.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yeah. I also think a lot of that has to do with the instant gratification that we, as humanity looks for, especially right now. You know that I want this now. I want it now. I want it now. And you bypass some of the educational moments, if you will, because pain is the greatest motivator for sure. So after 20,000 sessions, what's the one trauma pattern you see stored in everyone's body that nobody talks about? You know, the thing that we're all carrying around but pretending we're not?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

There are few. But if I have to pick one is self abandonment. Because then I will explain it. Because we all have the version of our three years old that run careless without clothes and, you know, like whatever. Dance in front of ourselves, in front of others. And then at one point we get a cue from life that we're very cute or that we're not cute. And whatever happens to us, trauma, not trauma. And we are. We are living ourselves. No, it's like we're living our heart. We're living and. And we're shifting to a different way of existence. And this might. Can be expressed in, you know, later in life, in. In whatever, in weight issues and anxiety and depression.

[Jim Alstatt]

Right.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Mandarin issue. But I think this is part of the journey that we all have to experience. Maybe, you know, from a spiritual point of view, it's a. This is life. This is why we here. Like, because as kids, most people, most kids are very connected to themselves. Like, I look at my girls, my Girls are now 13 and 16, when they were. When they were like 2, 3 years old. It's like pure life. No, no. You know, no friction or anything like that. And as we grow older, we have that friction that moves us away from being ourselves. So I think this is. Personally what I really enjoy doing is having people helping people get to that they're having that. They're appreciating themselves. They feel yourself Energy. In yoga we call it the self.

[Jim Alstatt]

You call it the what? I'm sorry?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

We call it the self. Like what you want.

[Jim Alstatt]

Oh, yes, okay.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

You want to experience self. The energy of yourself.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yes.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Instead of the mind of. You know, I have that conditioning of the ego.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's interesting that you say that because as you were discussing the free flow of childhood, you know, when you're just in the flow all the time in the, in that bliss state, it seems to me that a lot of the friction that we cause ourselves is self induced. As we go along, we add those layers of whatever to our soul, to our purpose, to whatever and it causes that friction and it starts to build and grow.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

So it's very interesting, I think about it, it's a double edged sword because it's based on certain, on survival, it's based on safety. The reason that I become anxious or that I, that a person become anxious or, or doesn't care or hurt too much or whatever the behavior is, it's an old pattern and it's usually at some point we try to change it and it comes with a lot of shame and a lot of judgment around it. So, so a lot of times that that was my experience and using another person and another nervous system and that's through many different healing modalities, that there is a neutral nervous system that is not going into that fight and fight or freeze or fond or whatever nervous system response. It's super helpful in healing that. And that wound, that little trauma that carry.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's very, very good and it's very insightful. I agree with that. So I want to go back then and talk about this because this is something that you mentioned on your website and through our conversation and I've mentioned it before on the show that we have pre show calls just to get to know each other and have some convers. And you had said that you couldn't be alone with your daughters for nine months after your nde.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yeah.

[Jim Alstatt]

As a trauma expert now, what was happening in your body that all your yoga and qigong training couldn't touch?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

At that time I was in, I was in ptsd. Like my, my, my nervous system was completely out of alignment. Going through cycles that used to take me three weeks, used to take me three hours. So it was just out of alignment. I wasn't feeling safe in my body. I got, I got the belief unconsciously that I'm not safe and my body reacted accordingly. And there was a big energy in the body that I had that I had to release it and There are different kinds of trauma. For me, it wasn't something that it took a week or a month to let go. It took me a year until I started feeling more comfortable. It was a complete state of misalignment. It's like you have your mind, but you cannot trust your mind because a lot of the time your mind is telling you things.

[Jim Alstatt]

Lies to you. Right?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yeah. You know, and I think that our mind lies to us a lot of. A lot of the time. But there is a different. There is a different angle of flying. Like, you know, like that was way bigger than that. That's like a lie, you know, like a panic attack. Like those that are going in the mind are a little bit different than being nervous to take a test or to.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yeah, there's a different level of nervousness or anxiety associated with those things. You're right. And thank you for. For being vulnerable and talking about that. I. I think it's important for people to hear that and to know that there is a light at the end of the tunnel. And it. It may not be easy to get there. It may take some work and some effort, but you can get there. And that's. Thank you so much for sharing that.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yes, we. It's definitely. We can get there. I think the challenge that we have is that for most people, like, they have a life like they have. They have a job, they have kids, they.

[Jim Alstatt]

Right.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

They have all of these to do lists. And sometimes healing. They say it. It's like the nervous system is not functioning well. So for example, I use. I was able to do. Before that, I was able to work 30, 35 hours a week of contact work, like doing session. After that, I went down to 15. Like, that was my max. If I was really 15, I started getting too stressed. I needed to spend more time in the wood, more time with myself to take care of my own energy.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's a big difference.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

It was a huge difference. However, it's true to everyone. Because let's say about. Let's talk about functioning adults. Let's pretend that there is a term like. Right, okay, so let's say you work 40 hours a week. That's the average time that you work. If you're going to work. Let's say for me, if I'm going to work less than that, I'm going to be a little bit happier. Now if I'm going to work over that. If I'm going to work 50, 60 hours a week, somebody's going to pay the price. Yes, it's going to be Myself, however, it's going to be my family. As a result, I'm not going to be the same person that I am if I, you know, if I'm overusing the resources that I have.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's an interesting point because I think that there are those that are out there listening that could be considered workaholics, let's just call it that. And that's a patterning. But you're right, because I don't think, well, I know a lot of times you think it's fine, nothing's changing me. I love what I do. I thrive in this. And, but there's only so much of that. And let's, let's just say that you're in a stressful 9 to 5 job which isn't 9 to 5. Then it becomes 9 to 9 or 4.30am till 9 o' clock at night. And you're right. When you think everything's okay, you don't notice how things are crumbling around you. Like you had mentioned family. What a toll that it takes on a family. Because there is frustration that comes out, there is anxiety. There is a lot of emotion that comes out that you may not even know comes out.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yes.

[Jim Alstatt]

Right. Because you're unaware. You're just because you're focused so intently on that work or that project or what have you. And that's.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yeah, that's interesting that you're, you know, like LinkedIn.

[Commercial Narrator]

Hiring Pro can't predict the future, but it can help you feel confident about future hires. Because Hiring Pro combines real time insights and candidate Data from the LinkedIn network with the criteria you've set for your role. To deliver you a list of top fit candidates, businesses who use LinkedIn are 24% less likely to reopen a role in the next 12 months. Hire right the first time with LinkedIn hiring pro post a free job [e-mail] Pandora Wsecu isn't just one of Washington's best credit unions. We're a Forbes Best in State five years running. Why? Because we put you first. Lower fees, early paydays, financial guidance and service second to none. As a member owned cooperative, we love Washington as much as you do. From the Olympic mountains to the rolling Palouse. Join us and discover how much we care about your financial well being. Because what we really do best is invest in you. Visit wsecu.org today to learn more. Washington let's Credit union if I'll take

[Matan Kohen Citron]

back a little bit what you're saying, a person is not becoming workaholic overnight. True. Okay. It's like there are cases like that they call traumas. All right. Like for example, somebody passes away and then the person take that belief that let's say if my partner passes away, I have to do whatever I have to do in order to support my family and I'm just going to be obsessed with work. This is like an example of an overnight. However, in most cases it's again, it's back to safety. It's like I am a person is saying I'm better off working right now than being with my family. And that pattern, okay. It comes a pattern after years of behavior. The person doesn't know how. It's how, it's how it, how, how you. He experiences, she experiences when he's not obsessed with work. Okay. Like for example, a person who is never exercised, never been to the gym or went for a walk or did anything for their mental health. Their mind doesn't even know how to think about it. There is, you know, in yoga we call it aversion. Like we have a ver. We don't know what it is so we reject it automatically.

[Jim Alstatt]

Wow. Okay.

[Commercial Narrator]

Yeah.

[Jim Alstatt]

It seems like it is something that's developed much like a muscle I suppose, but it is out of self preservation almost of doing that. Yeah.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

And that's, that's, you know, we, we touch upon it before. That's why I think meditation as a practice is so important because it's not the focus or the fairies or the butterfly that you, you might watch. It's not about those high experiences. It's like our mind is going all the time when we are masters of denial.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yes.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

And how just by being with that creates magic in people's life. I've seen it over and over again.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's great. And another great response. Thank you. So you had mentioned toxic masculinity before and you say toxic masculinity was part of your shadow work.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yes.

[Jim Alstatt]

What specific body part holds toxic masculinity? And how do men literally feel it leaving when they release it?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

I think that it's the heart. But with that being said, every person holds tension different in their body. Some people have hold it in the lower back, some people in their neck, in the throat, in their head, in their, in their eyes. Some people in their gut, in their, in the diaphragm area. And so I, I from working with people, I don't assume that for example, if I'm going to work with somebody holding toxic masculinity, it's one specific area. The what? The second part that you asked me I think was what happened when they released that. Yes, they're able to, you know, it's. It's a shadow, so they're able to experience themselves. So for me, for example, I grew up in the Middle east, so it's kind of. It's a more macho and more like strong masculinity. Like, don't show. Don't show weaknesses.

[Jim Alstatt]

Weakness. Right.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

For me, it's the. The ape. The ability to. To be vulnerable in situations, to listen to my heart, to cry, to. To experience all of this range of emotions that my unconscious mind was not. Was not allowing me to experience before. Like, I don't know.

[Jim Alstatt]

Right. That's a big one too. Where we're. I think we as men oftentimes take it upon ourselves to fix something. You know what I mean? Where you just go, oh, I gotta. I gotta fix that. When somebody's talking to you about something and they may just want to vent, you're. And I'll speak for myself. My mind typically goes, well, how can I. How can I fix this? How can I solve this problem?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yeah.

[Jim Alstatt]

And it's not.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

It's not broken.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yeah, right.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

You know, it's not broken. That's the beauty of when you open, you realize it's just a different way of communicating. You know, like, for a man, we're a lot. A lot of men, they know how to repress it. So they still. In the kinesthetic.

[Jim Alstatt]

Right.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Of their existence, that they're suppressing it. Okay. Language is a great way to communicate, and people are, you know, for a lot of people, this is the way of releasing energy through conversation.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's an interesting perspective.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Same way that some people are visual.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yes. I can speak again for myself that when you mentioned repression of emotions and things like that, a lot of people may think that when you repress certain emotions, it's just an emotion. It's. It's nothing physical. Well, it becomes physical because I. I got to the point where I was nearly £400 now. Sure, there were poor eating habits, and I was trying to do like, make the pain go away type of thing. And whether it be from food or alcohol or painkillers, because I was in a lot of pain at that time too. But it does, it. It just. It does impact your body, stress and emotions and not being vulnerable or your authentic self does take a toll on you. And it wasn't until I got to the point where meditation was such a huge part of that, by the way. But it wasn't until I was able to be my Authentic self and speak my truth and, and I was doing all of the things, I started to be more involved with movement, with physicality, working out and things like that. So mind, body, spirit really did kick in to help with that, that loss. The weight loss of 150 some odd pounds. And since I've kept that practice, I've kept the weight off. I don't think it's by mistake that that's, that's happened. I think that it's due to these, the, the new way of life. That was probably, you know, a very old way of life when you think about those things.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yes. You know, I think, I think, go ahead. What you're saying, it's. There is so much power in the emotion. It's like there is so much communication that happens with emotions, with the body that when we're suppressing them, we're thinking that we're not aware of them or that they're not happening. We just

[Jim Alstatt]

ignore.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

My client on me a week ago that I worked with her like few months ago that that old way of not going to the gym and not eating healthy and, and talking shit to herself was actually taking way more energy than right now that she's not doing that. So we think we gaining energy from that or from repressing it. But actually there is so much energy, unconscious energy going into that progression. That's why when people are releasing that all of a sudden energy starts to flow. So, and then they're getting, you know, like the energy is flowing so the body starts working. Their, their body starts becoming healthy. Because being in stress, nothing good is happening to the body. The body, the body is stuck, the energy is stuck and we have to release that and let the energy flow and then the body starts healing itself. Because being healthy is our natural state. And I think people should remember that. Being sick is not natural. Being healthy is natural. We're here to be healthy.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's very good. So I have a question for you as it relates to that release and I would imagine over 20,000 plus sessions you've probably seen this. When somebody releases that trauma, can you actually see or feel when it leaves them?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Absolutely.

[Jim Alstatt]

What does that look like or where can you, I mean can you see something like physically in their body or what is that?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Everybody will be different. There are people that, you know, experience the breakthrough right in the session. You know, I, you know, like one of my mentor, Jeff, Jack Kornfield, he calls it a vipassana facelift to that experience that people come and they meditate for a few days and after that, you know, like their whole face is lighting up and they let go all of that tension. So it's the same thing. I see people that are just. They don't carry that weight anymore. Now, from my perspective, to do it in a session or to do it over a few sessions and let it happen in a life, I think it's a choice. And I prefer to. Generally, I prefer to let people do the work by themselves so it happens naturally in their life. Because as practitioners and any kind of practitioner, any person who holds session, you can do the session for the sake of the session. That's a lot of like motivational speaking. Sure. Or you can do the session to. With the intention for the person's life. And I will always prefer to do something that will serve people in their life versus in the whatever 90 minutes, two hours, an hour they have with me, they will say, wow, this is amazing. I always. Look how you integrate it.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yeah. I think the one that you're. The other one is more ego for you than it is for. Absolutely helping somebody get through something. So I know that you've trained with masters in the east and the West.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yeah.

[Jim Alstatt]

What's the one thing Eastern wisdom gets wrong about trauma? And what's the one thing Western therapy, we'll use the term therapy, Mrs. Completely.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

It's been many years since I practiced with Eastern master, you know, like 20 plus years ago and also later. But I don't think they understand the complex of life that we have. You know, like when I was in the mountains of the Himalayas, they, you know, they didn't have social media and phone.

[Jim Alstatt]

Right.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

And the ones I think, you know, from a point of history, we're really in a place that we've never been with the amount of stimulation that we have. But if I compare myself for you, our listeners, it's like we get more stimulation in an hour than a monk in the Himalaya get in a year. It's. Right. You. You can compare that.

[Jim Alstatt]

No, that's. That's fascinating to me that you, you mentioned that. Because I've had conversations with people. Let's. Let's talk about children, for example. The. I can't imagine the pressures and the stress that kids today have that we didn't have to contend with because of what you mentioned, social media, overstimulated minds. Because there's always something new, something immediate. And that's the thing about news, too. You talk about diet. Right. And diet isn't just consumption of food. It's what you consume around you. And if you have almost instantaneous access to information, news, and let's be honest, most news we get to make it newsworthy is negative because they're looking for, for that attention, those clicks or what have you. It's. It's got to be tough. I mean, it's got to be really difficult. What's some advice you might give someone as it relates to that, you know, when you get frustrated with your kids or you know that they're not paying attention, a lot of times it's because their brains are reprogrammed to be, you know, always scrolling down or what do they call it? Doom Scrolling. Yeah. I think what, what might be some advice you have.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Big picture. I think it's the most important thing. Perspective. Like for, for me as a parent, the question that changed, that changed my mind is like, how do I want my relationship to be and what I want my relationship to be based on? And it depends on the child. However, there are times that I see my kid is doing a behavior that is not serving them. We also have to remember that the world that they live and the world that we live, they're two different worlds.

[Jim Alstatt]

Absolutely. I'm going to bounce back because I. When you were talking about that, it just. I have an ADHD mind, so if there's a shiny object, I'm all over the place and that happens. So sorry.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

And Western, by the way. That's not a, that's not a weakness.

[Jim Alstatt]

No, I don't view it as that. You know, sometimes people around me, they may, but I don't.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

You know, we, we live with the, with the school system that is based about teaching our kids how to obey instead of how to engage.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's very true. I mean, that's very true. So Western therapy, What is Western therapy? Whiff on completely.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Now we're catching up. But it's the body. We consider things to be too mental. Like talk therapy, for example, is one of these things that we completely ignore the body. We completely ignore the feeling, the emotions. Also from a business point of view, I think it's about maintaining the client practitioner. This is their business. They want to have a full book. And in order to have a full book, they. Maintaining their clients. It's not about necessarily about helping clients because it's ignore all of these different things. Don't get me wrong, I love therapy, but it's important that the person is eating healthy, that he's sleeping, that he's exercising, that he has community, that you have friends and he has other places to do to go to.

[Jim Alstatt]

Right.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Nourish himself.

[Jim Alstatt]

So this is where I think the hypnotherapy really comes in to play. Let's, let's take a moment and talk about that and how you integrate that into your practice for your clients.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yeah,

[Jim Alstatt]

how does that, how do you determine that that's the best course of action for one of your clients?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

So basically, I have two kind of businesses that I run. I have a movement practice and I have a hypnotherapy line. So people that come to me to hypnotherapy, they're ready to work on it, about it from their friends who work with me, or they find me online or something like that. So they're coming and they're ready. They have a hint. It's not, I think with hypnotherapy it's very hard to market it as something, but every form of hypnotherapy is different. And so we start with the client, we start with the problem that they're having and we start with the context of the client because they're great, you know, they're great. Hypnotherapy tracks on YouTube that you can find to sleep, to eat healthy, to do whatever you want to do, to perform. What I do is more a one on one custom work that the context is designed. So I ask my client question, this is how I determine what they want. And this is something that a lot of people don't. They take it for granted that they have to because we live in a society and they think like, all right, so I'm going to fit into a salsa dancing class. I'm going to do Zumba, go to the gym, or I'm going to go to Asian restaurant or do whatever. Like people like to think where they are in the menu of life. And it's more like one on one. What do you want? What the context? Why are you here? What you here to overcome, how the problem that you have is problem for you and where? How do you want to move through that?

[Jim Alstatt]

So I mentioned to you that we've had hypnotherapists on the the show before. And one of the common themes or threads that comes through in conversations with hypnotherapists is how fast the results surface versus standard forms of therapy and talk therapy. And you know, I'm not well versed because number one, I'm not a therapist, but I am curious about this because if someone's experiencing a tremendous amount of pain and could be ptsd, could be a number of different things that Is the, the trigger or the cause? They want to get to that relief point faster. Right. Why isn't, why isn't that. Well, I, I guess you answered that, that book of business type of thing. I was, I was thinking, why, why are people going for that? Yeah. You know, I, I started to make it personal for me and maybe I shouldn't have. So I lost the, the, the frame of that question because all of a sudden I started thinking, okay, well, how could that benefit me by doing hypnotherapy? You know, so that's, I was, I'm

[Matan Kohen Citron]

just,

[Jim Alstatt]

I'm intrigued by it because I think there's a big value to it. But I think there's more to it than just the hypnotherapy. There's got to be something more that makes it so successful.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Hypnotherapy is a tool. I'll start with that. Hypnotherapy is a tool that first. And I believe in that every form of hypnosis is self hypnosis. I cannot hypnotize a person. I can help him hypnotize himself. I created, I'm guiding them. I. Creating the environment they're going and putting these ideas to the mind. If I'm going to say to you, Jim, eat more greens. It's a general statement and you have a choice. If you want to accept, accept that I gave you something that is silly, stupid as an example. Okay. The idea of hypnotherapy and why it works is because it focused on the belief, the behavior that people have. If it's a. If it's pain, if it's trauma, if it's anxiety is a result of something else, it's a result of a belief. If I, for example, for myself, I was feeling anxious, that wasn't, that was the behavior that I was suffering from. It was sitting in the belief that the bad, that the world is not safe, that I am not safe.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yeah.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

And that's true for everything. That's true for self expression. If I, if I believe that I can be myself and thrive in the world for being myself and doing well in the world for being myself, even making money for the world for being myself. That's a different story.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yes, entirely different story. So then how do you go about helping someone get from point A to point F, then?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

First I get to what point A? Because the problem that people have and the problem that they think that they're having is a little bit different problem. As we discuss, discussed before, we have a mind that is a Master of denial and doesn't really want to show us problem. A lot of time I get to people to what the problem is. And I call it. It's usually like a 5 to 7 degrees of separation of questions of seeing what the issue is, to what. What the people think the issue is to what they really the issue is about. And then when you get that a their nervous system is able to process that stress response because it say like, wow, I've been just lying to myself, for example. Right. It's like instead of trying to hide that for so many years. Well, I can. That's true, you know, or to say something, I've been, you know, I've been not nice to my partner this morning. Like to take ownership of that. And I think that, you know, a lot of therapy there isn't. There isn't ownership of the situation. And that's why I love what I do because it's so empowering. Because people want to feel empowered. People don't want the work to be done for themselves. That's why they go to, you know, the user kind of material.

[Jim Alstatt]

Sure.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

There is nothing wrong with that. I don't judge it, you know, in many situations I think it helps people to deal with life better. So this is the first step that we get to what the problem is, really what's the problem is. And then from understanding what the problem is, we are able to make the connection to what the person wants. You know, like let's say if you had the magic want and this is the problem, what did you want? So, you know, it's like all of this, you know, there is the triangle of where the person is, where the problem, where the real problem is and where the solution. Once the person realize that the. The problem that he has is not really what he thought, the solution is different. The person is able to see that what he was looking for, whatever it is, I looking for $10 million that I will not have to suffer.

[Jim Alstatt]

Right.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

For one more hour of my life. Okay. Once you realize that that work is not the problem. Like for example, using that as an example, the solution is different. People want something different that say I want to avoid that. But in reality, people looking for a way to deal with life, they're not looking for a way not to deal with life. And once you realize that what's in front of them. So, and then there is. Okay. And then there is the. So there is a. There is the real problem and there is the real solution. And then there is a dance that we're going with. And what the, what a hypnotist does is helping you to take the critical thinking down in a very light way. Okay? It doesn't have to be big. It doesn't have to be like an ayahuasca or something.

[Jim Alstatt]

Right. Monumental shift, right?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yeah. It's something that happens, you know, it's a dance. Okay? So we take the critical thinking down because when we're kids, before the age of 9, 10, our critical thinking down. If you will say to a kid, look outside, the sky is green. He will look outside, it will believe you. I said that to you. You see, your eyes didn't even. I don't know if you have windows where you are, but they didn't even you. So know that the sky cannot be great. Okay? So what we do by using metaphor, using stories, endless, you know, the toolbag box is huge. Is we helping people take that critical thinking down. And then what we do, we are pretty much disassociating from the problem that this is what they, you know, if they went, most of my clients, they went for over 10 years of therapy and they have a PhD and knowing what their problem is. So we disassociate from them. And what we do, we anchoring the solution that they want to have, okay? And it's their solution. You see, the point is it's not eat healthy. I'm asking my clients to know what, what they want, okay? Like the mind work in a problem state and a solution state. And I'm in that session, I'm anchoring the solution of how they want, how they see the world. So one side of it is letting go of the trauma, letting go of whatever the belief that is not serving.

[Jim Alstatt]

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[Jim Alstatt]

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[Commercial Narrator]

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[Jim Alstatt]

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[Matan Kohen Citron]

Anchoring a belief that is going to answer work out. You know, serve the individual. It's not right or wrong. It is serving you or not serving or not.

[Jim Alstatt]

Right, right, right. So when you were talking about or describing point a being find essentially what that lie is. What are you lying to yourself about or hiding what the. Maybe I might be saying that incorrectly, but what you're. It's not the real problem. You're hiding your. You're telling yourself something else to avoid what the real problem is.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

In many situation it is in some situation people know what they. What they do know what the problem is.

[Jim Alstatt]

Okay. So I'm wondering what it looks like or what the response is when people come to that realization that. Or they go that aha moment for them when they realize that, you know, I've been telling myself this story that it's this when it's. It's really not.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yeah. I think there is a. I think there is peace in that.

[Jim Alstatt]

I would think there would be just. Just thinking about it that there would be some sort of relief that you go, oh, I don't have to do this anymore.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yeah. Because their mind is in a broken record trying to understand what's wrong with me. And that's like one of my mentor, he says when we have a problem, the only thing that we focus on is on the problem. What exists other than the problem? Nothing for the person who is in the problem. So let's say the problem is I don't like myself. All right, this is an example.

[Jim Alstatt]

Okay.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

What exists other than I don't like myself? Everything.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yeah.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

I love myself. The sun, the moon, the person that is with me in the room right now. So you know, when, when people go to that, to that, that's what stuck with them. What's wrong with them. That's the real thing that we're unlocking in hypnotherapy. Because a lot of time, you know, like for practice and to play around with hypnotherapy, a lot of time I did sessions with people that I asked them specifically. I don't want to know the problem. You can know it in your mind and they. The same amount of success without having,

[Jim Alstatt]

without verbalizing it or what have you. Yeah.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Like, you know, the person go. A person who has the weight issues or anxiety or. Or whatever they go with that. They're focusing on the problem all the time.

[Jim Alstatt]

Right. Consciously or unconsciously.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Exactly.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So in Your toolbox. You have a lot of different healing modalities, like 10 different healing modalities. If you had to delete all but one from existence, which one would you keep to help humanity heal? And why would you do that?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Love. That's the beginning and the end of it. The intention of, yeah, that's a good blanket with each other. You know, all that is great, but love is, you know, it's what, you know, we, in hypnotherapy we call it H plus. In, you know, in yoga we have a different name for it. In Reiki, they call it Reiki. But basically the idea to connect to our heart and to work from there.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's a great place to start and it's a great place to end, isn't it? Yeah, it covers a lot of ground with that four letter word. That's, that's one of the good four letter words, I think, you know, as far as I'm concerned. Well, why don't we do this? I, I know that I had mentioned to you the possibility of doing the body scan. I don't want to put you on the spot with that. I think we've covered. Unless you want to. Unless you want to. That's entirely up.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Or any other thing that you think people will benefit with. You know, we can do a game of words, of associations, of, of whatever, of whatever it is. We can keep it open.

[Jim Alstatt]

We're going to jump into the musical questions. Are you okay with that?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Absolutely. Looking forward to that.

[Jim Alstatt]

Excellent, excellent.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Kind of big movement fan. And music. And movement. And this is my way of releasing stress and connecting with myself is movement.

[Jim Alstatt]

I, I'll tell you what. I think a body emotion stays in motion. That's, that's for sure. Okay, so here's question number one. What was the first song that you fell in love with that you can remember saying? I, I, I can't wait to hear that song again.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

I don't have a song like that. I don't have much memory of music before the age of 20 or something like that. I grew up really.

[Jim Alstatt]

Oh wow.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Liking Israeli rock of the 90s and I really started listening to music after the Army. So that's it.

[Jim Alstatt]

Okay.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yeah.

[Jim Alstatt]

So then let's, let's do that way. What was one of the songs that you remember after getting out of the Army?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

One of the songs, a. I guess Bob Marley was one of my favorite. Oh yeah, absolutely. It's really the Birds. I think it's one of my favorite natural music. Natural Mystic. Always put in that vibe. Yeah.

[Jim Alstatt]

Yeah, I'm a big reggae guy. I'm a big fan of Marley. Yeah, Big fan of his. That's fantastic. That's a good one. That's a real good one. I'm not sure you said so growing up, the family, singing songs probably wouldn't hold true to you.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

No, not so much.

[Jim Alstatt]

What about now?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Now? So I had a phase. Like what? I really, you know, talking about spirituality, I got into EDM music.

[Jim Alstatt]

Oh, okay.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

France. Music I used to love, you know, in my, you know, in my early 20s. I used to love going to nature parties and raves and that. All experience of, I don't know, hundred people, thousand people, 2000 people dancing together in a sunrise samurai. That's, you know, that as close to God as it gets for me.

[Jim Alstatt]

So that's interesting that you say that because I mention in it regularly that I think music is the tie that binds us all together. And sometimes people will go, eh, I don't know about that. But the example that you just gave is the best example of that. Or it could be a concert where all of a sudden you may not be somebody that outwardly will start dancing or something, but you tap your toe or tap your, you know, your finger on your, your knee. There's something about that, there's something about music that connects everyone in that moment. And I think it's so inspiring and it's bigger than, than we realize.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Absolutely.

[Jim Alstatt]

So I think one of the, the questions that will make some sense to you is what's the song that gets the positive juices flowing?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Positive juice, I guess I Love My Way. Frank Sinatra.

[Jim Alstatt]

Ah, okay.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Positive. You know, I listened this morning before what a Wonderful World. That's definitely on a positive.

[Jim Alstatt]

Oh, Louis Armstrong. Yep.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yes. But for kind of my way give me that self empowering and kind of like that feeling of putting it all out, you know, like being committed. Committed to. To myself.

[Jim Alstatt]

Being your authentic self. Yeah. Yeah, That's a good one. I like that.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Thanks. You know, and I like, I really like reggae, I like hip hop and I love jazz. And I can listen to, you know, jazz. I would prefer without words usually.

[Jim Alstatt]

Okay.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Because I think people are very different. For me, for example, I don't really listen to the words so much when I'm listening to the music. Like I remember sentences and I have, for example, part of my life, I really get to listen to music with people. And I have people who understand, they know every word of the song. And my mind doesn't remember, doesn't work that way. Like I'm Not a verbal. I'm more of kinesthetic person. The way I perceive the world. So that's explaining.

[Jim Alstatt]

I have a friend that's like that. My friend Carrie is more emotes through dance than singing. And. Yeah, so, yeah, I understand exactly what you're talking about. Where each person reacts to a song differently. And you know what's very interesting? The Foo Fighters. Dave Grohl talks about the perfect rhythm to get people moving. And it's bump, bump, bump, bump, bump, bump, bump, bump, bump. And it's where people can jump up and down for their songs. And he just said it's just right. And he said when we want to have those. Most of their songs are like that because they. He wants everybody in motion and feeling and being a part of it. So, yeah, it's. That's very interesting. Do you have a Guilty Pleasure song?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Not right now. Right now.

[Jim Alstatt]

So you're not a Taylor Swift, A closet Swifty?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

I'm not a closet Swifty. I can. Ed Sheeran, you know, I maybe that live in the shape of you or

[Jim Alstatt]

I. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Sometimes I. You know, I like one of these songs.

[Jim Alstatt]

So this one might be a tough one for you.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yeah.

[Jim Alstatt]

But what's a song you believe could change the way people think or feel about the world around them if they just listen to the song's lyrics?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

The message. We spoke about it earlier, like half an hour ago in the conversation. Cornerstone by Bob Marley.

[Jim Alstatt]

Oh, yeah.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Well, it's exactly this. The things people. Doesn't come the word. The thing people refuse are the thing they should choose. And it's basically about the aversion that we have, you know, to the world, to ourselves, if we're able to pay more attention to that instead of rejecting it. And I think, you know, there isn't something that. That is more present to our future, especially that we live in a culture, in this cancel culture that you don't like one person. That a person say, and you just cancel that person. I think. And it's something that, as a parent, I'm working with my kids. Like, listen deeper, be present. See what there is other than the one thing that you don't like. Because I work with people who did crazy amount crazy things with their life and positive and negative, but there is something positive behind it. Like the intention is. The intention is to look for lab. It's just like the wrong strategy that we get from the world. And I think that's. That's where the power is in stepping into our aversion.

[Jim Alstatt]

That's very cool and very insightful. Okay, this will be my last question for you as it relates to music, but I will ask you to send me your your playlist. Sometimes there are songs you hear that ring so true that they can stop you in your tracks. And the song's lyrics sound like they were either written specifically for you or by you. What's that song?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

I think Back to my Way. Frank Sinatra.

[Jim Alstatt]

Okay.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Yeah. I think about self belief in our own path and of being true to our own path.

[Jim Alstatt]

I like that. That's, that's a strong choice. And thank you. Thank you for sharing. I appreciate that. Well, it's just about time to cue the music for today's episode, but don't forget to like comment and subscribe to the Drop the Needle podcast to stay up to date on our latest episodes. I would also like to take a moment moment to thank everyone again for tuning in today. And I hope you enjoyed this episode of the Drop the Needle podcast. And I would also like to thank our special guest, Mr. Matan Cohen Citron for being on our show today. Matan, can you tell our listeners how they can get in touch with you?

[Matan Kohen Citron]

Thank you. First, it's been a pleasure being here with you.

[Jim Alstatt]

This was great. I really enjoyed it.

[Matan Kohen Citron]

This, I guess best place is my website, Matan Smovement. So M a T a N S movement dot com. I also have the same thing on Instagram. I'm sure whoever wants to find me

[Jim Alstatt]

will find excellent and I'll make sure that I put those handles in the show notes. Speaking of, I invite you to head on over to our show notes where you'll find a link to today's play playlist as well as the things that we just mentioned. How to get in touch with Matan. All right, my drop the Needle posse. Like Billy Joel says, from the highs to the lows to the end of our show, this is the end of our show. Until next time, this is Jim Allstot wishing you infinite health, happiness, and the perfect playlist for your life. Thank you again for being the best part of us. Catch you next time.

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