In Part 2 of this masterclass conversation, former Navy SEAL and leadership architect Rich Diviney returns to go deeper into the strategies behind his new book The Masters of Uncertainty—and delivers real, actionable frameworks for leaders who want to scale, perform, and lead better under pressure.

Dwayne and Rich explore how to literally reduce fear using a neuroscience-backed process called Moving Horizons, how to train your brain to handle chaos like a SEAL, and how to architect team trust with the 4 C’s of Trust framework. From building high-performance cultures to instilling behavior-based identity in teams, this episode is packed with takeaways for any business owner, leader, or parent navigating complexity.

Timestamps:

00:00 – Intro to Moving Horizons: Why the brain craves certainty

02:00 – The DPO framework: Duration, Pathway, Outcome

05:30 – Real-world example: SEAL training and horizon-setting

07:00 – Using cold plunges to practice focus under stress

09:00 – Coaching children using horizon-picking

11:30 – The neuroscience of dopamine, motivation, and why we quit

13:00 – How to shift your horizon in real time

15:30 – Eliminating fear by narrowing focus

18:00 – Learning to appreciate the moment without losing performance

21:00 – Can Moving Horizons help with mental health?

24:00 – Fear as a risk assessment tool (not something to eliminate)

26:00 – Why Part 3 of the book is a surprise gift for entrepreneurs

27:30 – Dynamic Subordination: The new leadership model

29:30 – Creating trust: The 4 Cs (Competence, Consistency, Character, Compassion)

34:00 – How most companies fall short on trust

37:30 – Building character and compassion in your culture

40:00 – Behavior = the bridge to trust

42:30 – Culture values vs. culture behaviors

44:30 – How to rewrite company values using “I Am” statements

48:00 – Mapping core attributes to job behaviors

50:00 – Redefining success as the exploration of human potential

53:00 – Final thoughts: You're not too busy, you’re stuck in certainty

Notable Quotes:

“Fear is not the enemy. It’s a risk assessment tool. The goal is not to eliminate fear—but to work with it.” – Rich Diviney

“If you’re too busy, it’s probably because you’re hiding in certainty. That’s the enemy of scale.” – Dwayne Kerrigan

“Our goal in life is to use life to explore our potential. That’s the real definition of success.” – Rich Diviney

“You can’t make anyone trust you. All you can do is behave in a way that earns it.” – Rich Diviney

Tools & Resources:

Rich Diviney’s assessment & attributes work: www.theattributes.com
Assessment tool use promo code KERRIGAN15: https://hub.theattributes.com/
The Masters of Uncertainty – https://learn.theattributes.com/mastering-uncertainty
The Attributes Book (2021) – foundational read on human performance
“Moving Horizons” method – how to reduce fear through micro-goals
The 4 Cs of Trust Framework: Competence, Consistency, Character, Compassion
Culture Architecture with “I Am” Statements
Dopamine and Motivation: How to manage goal-setting energy

Actionable Takeaways:

Use “Moving Horizons” to reduce overwhelm → Set micro-goals with a defined Duration, Pathway, and Outcome (DPO).
Teach your team how to lead themselves → Empower them to focus, shift responsibility fluidly, and trust each other.
Map values to behaviors, not buzzwords → Example: “Show others you care” = specific behaviors like thank-yous and peer recognition.
Run a Trust Audit using the 4 Cs → Where is your team strong—and where are you under-investing?
Culture is a team identity → If you don’t define your culture, your team will do it for you—and you may not like the result.

Connect with Dwayne Kerrigan

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Website: http://www.dwaynekerrigan.com

Disclaimer The views, information, or opinions expressed by guests during The Dwayne Kerrigan Podcast are solely those of the individuals involved and do not necessarily represent those of Dwayne Kerrigan and his affiliates. Dwayne Kerrigan or The Dwayne Kerrigan Podcast is not responsible for and does not verify the accuracy of any of the information contained in the podcast series. The primary purpose of this podcast is to educate and inform. Listeners are advised to consult with a qualified professional or specialist before making any decisions based on the content of this podcast.

94. Moving Horizons: How to Lead with Trust, Build Resilient Teams with Rich Diviney

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