Howard Lutnick And The Transcript From His Epstein Related Congressional Hearing (Part 9) (5/16/26)

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Epstein Chronicles

Episode: Howard Lutnick And The Transcript From His Epstein Related Congressional Hearing (Part 9) (5/16/26)
Host: Bobby Capucci
Date: May 17, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this episode, host Bobby Capucci delves into Congressional deposition transcripts of Howard Lutnick, CEO of Cantor Fitzgerald, exploring his connections—direct and indirect—with Jeffrey Epstein and several related figures. The episode is part 9 of an ongoing series unpacking Lutnick’s testimony in relation to Epstein’s criminal network, focusing here on Lutnick’s responses to questions about Epstein’s social engagements, political events, and possible knowledge of criminal activity.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Lutnick’s Associations with the Dubins and Epstein

• Eva & Glenn Dubin’s Relationship: Lutnick clarifies he met the Dubins through charity events ([00:55]), contributed financially to their breast cancer center, but was not part of specific event invitations.

  • “Did you understand the Dubins to have a relationship with Mr. Epstein?”
  • Lutnick: “I learned that later. After 2019. … Ms. Dubin had her prior existing relationship with Mr.” ([01:13])

• Events and Invitations: Lutnick does not recall attending specific events or knowing if Epstein was present ([01:34]).

2. Political and Charity Events

• Fundraiser with Secretary Clinton: Lutnick confirms his involvement in political fundraising after 9/11, asserts no knowledge or interaction between Secretary Clinton and Epstein at those events ([02:10]).

  • “What was your relationship with Secretary Clinton at the time?”
  • Lutnick: “We had a historical relationship. She was very helpful to New York and my company. After 9/11.” ([02:28])
  • “Did you understand Secretary Clinton have a relationship with Mr. Epstein? No.”

• UJA Wall Street Dinner: Epstein donated to a UJA dinner honoring Lutnick (email from John Paulson to Epstein); Lutnick neither solicited nor thanked Epstein for the donation, nor recalled interacting with him at the event ([03:12]).

3. Employment Connections

• Nanny’s Resume Incident: It surfaced that a Lutnick-employed nanny sent her resume to Epstein, but Lutnick denies any knowledge or involvement and asserts no encouragement was given ([03:42]).

  • “Never encouraged any of the nannies that were under your employment to reach out for Mr. Epstein in any respect?”
  • Lutnick: “That's correct. None.” ([03:49])

• Employment Crossover: Lutnick says, to his knowledge, no employees moved between his and Epstein’s staff. He later amends, acknowledging he "wouldn't possibly know" about contractors like gardeners ([04:10]).

4. Clarity on Meetings & Alleged Social Interactions

• 2011 Meeting Date Error: Lutnick refutes an implication he had drinks at a meeting related to scaffolding, clarifying the event listed was incorrect ([05:00]).

• Testimony Fatigue: Reiterates he’s provided exhaustive answers about his interactions with Epstein/Maxwell in multiple Congressional settings ([05:15]).

  • “Is there anything that hasn't been asked of you that you think that we should know as part of the investigation?”
  • Lutnick: “No.” ([05:22])

5. Detailed Recollections of Epstein’s Townhouse Tour (2005)

• Lutnick confirms he did tour Epstein’s New York residence ([06:00]) but:

  • Saw no women except his wife

  • Noticed no sexually suggestive material, cameras, or suspicious items (other than a massage table and candles—remarked as not unusual for a billionaire)

  • No items related to President Trump

  • Host jibes: “Always about Trump. Buff Ungool Trump. Okay, enough already.” ([06:34])

6. Speculation Regarding Epstein’s Wealth and Blackmail

• Lutnick admits previous blackmail comments ("that's how Epstein had money") were mere speculation, not based on fact ([06:42]).

  • “Did you have any direct or indirect knowledge of Epstein making any kind of money through blackmail?”
  • Lutnick: “No, I was just speculating.” ([07:00])

• On Epstein’s Relationships with Powerful Men:

  • Les Wexner: Lutnick knew they were friends, heard their relationship ended badly, but has no personal knowledge of blackmail allegations ([10:59]).

  • Leon Black: Acknowledges an awareness of some relationship, but with no direct or detailed knowledge ([11:32]).

  • “Have you ever heard, directly or indirectly, that blackmail may have had any role in the relationship between Epstein and Leon Black?”

  • Lutnick: “No particular knowledge? No.” ([11:44])

7. Knowledge of Compromising Videos and Deals

• Lutnick previously speculated (on the “Pod Force One” podcast) about possible existence of videos and whether they were exchanged for Epstein’s lenient plea deal, but emphasizes it was theoretical, not based on personal knowledge ([12:10]).

  • “I was just speculating for the podcast. This guy's a Cabinet member and he's out here speculating on a podcast. Okay.” (Host’s commentary, [12:40])

8. Explicit Denials of Sexual or Inappropriate Activity

• Lutnick states he never witnessed, knew of, or engaged in sexual activity or massages with anyone introduced by Epstein or Maxwell; had no prior knowledge of abuse before it became public ([13:10]).

9. Epstein’s Properties and Guests

• Lutnick never visited Epstein’s homes in New Albany, Ohio, or any of his London apartments ([13:45]).
• Denies any knowledge—other than public reporting—of minors, large numbers of women, or prominent figures visiting Epstein’s homes, or of parties being held ([14:25]-[15:10]).
• No awareness of prominent individuals flying on Epstein’s planes aside from what was later reported in the media ([15:15]).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On speculation:

  • “No, I was just speculating.” (Lutnick on blackmail rumors, [07:00])
  • “I was just speculating for the podcast. This guy's a Cabinet member and he's out here speculating on a podcast. Okay.” (Host’s commentary, [12:40])

• On event invitations and donations:

  • “Did you direct Mr. Paulson to invite Jeffrey Epstein? No.” ([03:17])
  • “Did you thank Mr. Epstein for that donation…? No.” ([03:27])

• On observed content at Epstein’s townhouse:

  • “Did you see any photos or other images that were sexual or sexually suggestive? No.” (Lutnick, [06:17])
  • “Did you see any cameras or other recording device? No.” (Lutnick, [06:23])

• On knowledge of abuse:

  • “Prior to becoming public knowledge, did you ever have direct or indirect knowledge of the sexual abuse that Jeffrey Epstein was committing against minors and young women? No.” (Lutnick, [13:10])

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Timestamps for Important Segments

| Timestamp | Segment | |-----------|---------------------------------------------------------------| | 00:55 | Lutnick on Dubins and Epstein’s connections | | 02:10 | Fundraiser with Secretary Clinton | | 03:12 | UJA Wall Street Dinner donation and no interaction with Epstein| | 03:42 | Nanny resume sent to Epstein, Lutnick’s denial | | 05:00 | Correction of 2011 meeting records | | 06:00 | Recollection of Epstein townhouse tour | | 06:42 | Speculation on Epstein’s blackmail and wealth | | 10:59 | Details on knowledge of Les Wexner relationship | | 12:10 | Speculation about existence of videos and deals | | 13:10 | Explicit denials of sexual activity or knowledge of abuse | | 13:45 | Visits to Epstein properties | | 14:25 | Knowledge of house guests, parties, and prominent figures | | 15:15 | Knowledge of people flying on Epstein’s planes |

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Episode Tone and Takeaway

The tone is persistent, at times skeptical, but focused on factual clarity. Lutnick often responds in clipped denials, with the host adding commentary that highlights the limits of Lutnick’s testimony and the broader challenge of extracting true accountability from Epstein’s circle.

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For further information and referenced documents, see the episode description.

Transcript

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I met them through the hospital. Did you understand the Dubins to have a relationship with Mr. Epstein? I learned that later. After 2019. What did you learn as far as a relationship that Ms. Dubin had her prior existing relationship with Mr. This individual? Question Were you involved with selecting individuals that would be invited to this event? No question. And for the record, did you attend this event? I don't remember. So you would not know if Jeffrey Epstein attended the event as well or if Jeffrey Epstein attended this specific event? I have told I have been here and answered every question of every interaction I've had. So I do not recall any other interaction. Emmer at this time, I'd like to introduce what will be marked as majority exhibit number 10. And this is Batesmarked EFTA 2671545. This email is dated November 11, 2015 and was released by the Department of Justice as part of the Epstein Files Transparency Act. Secretary Lutnick, we discussed your emails in the previous hour. Did you send this email? I did not. It was sent on your behalf, is that right? It was sent by Matthew Gilbert. Do you recall this event taking place with Secretary Clinton? Yes. What do you recall about the event? A classic fundraising political event. And what was your relationship with Secretary Clinton at the time? We had a historical relationship. She was very helpful to New York and my company. After 9 11. Did you understand Secretary Clinton have a relationship with Mr. Epstein? No. And as far as the event, for the record, do you have any recollection of interacting with Jeffrey Epstein at this event? I did not. And he wasn't there. Okay. In January of 2017, there was a Brioni flagship store opening that Mr. Epstein was invited to. Do you recall this event? No. Mr. Emmer, at this time I would like to enter what will be marked as Majority Exhibit 11. And. And this is Batesmarked EFTA 222-9721. I'll direct your attention to page two. This is an invitation from John Paulson sent to Leslie Groff, who then forwarded it to Mr. Epstein. The subject line of the email reads, UJA Wall Street Dinner honoring Howard Lutnick. Secretary Lutnick, do you recall this event taking place? Yeah. And why did this event take place? Answer. It was a record setting FundRaiser event for Uja and the email is from John Paulson. Did you direct Mr. Paulson to invite Jeffrey Epstein? No question. And it appears as though Mr. Epstein did in fact donate. Did you solicit that donation? Answer no question. Did you thank Mr. Epstein for that donation for the event? No question. And as far as the event itself, presumably you attended the event. Did you see Mr. Epstein or interact with Mr. Epstein at this event? Answer no question. Secretary Lutnick, you mentioned traveling with your kids in a previous hour. Did you have a private nanny? Answer. Sure. Question. And as we've seen from the Epstein files that have been released, it appears that a nanny that was in your employee had sent her resume to Mr. Epstein. Do you know anything about that? I have no knowledge about it at all. And for the record, never encouraged any of the nannies that were under your employment to reach out for Mr. Epstein in any respect? That's correct. None. Mr. Are you aware of any employee of yours later working for Jeffrey Epstein? No. No employee of mine. I, I don't think ever worked for Jeffrey Epstein. Are you aware of any employee of Jeffrey Epstein ever later working for you? Answer. No. Mr. Emmer, I now would like to introduce what will be marked as Exhibit 12 and 13. And as they're being handed out, Exhibit 12 is Bates marked EFTA 1868626. Exhibit 13 is Batesmart EFTA 218429. And I'll give you a chance to review the exhibits and notes that it appears as though you were not a recipient of those emails. Ter Wulger, the lawyer for Lutnick, jumps in. Are we done with the prior exhibit, Mr. Emmer? Emmer. Yes, sir. Secretary Lutnick. Oh, I should just make clear, I don't know if, like, some gardener ever worked for, you know, like, I wouldn't possibly know that one way or the other. We're only asking you to testify to the best of your knowledge and recollection. Lutnick. Okay, I know. Well, you had a preamble in the beginning, and I'm just trying to be responsive. Emer question. Thank you. So, during the previous hour, we talked about interactions that you had in April of 2011. I just want to clarify for the record, these two exhibits imply that there is a meeting on May 1. Look, would it be your impression that is the meeting related to the scaffolding? Answer. It is. So. This. This is incorrect. I did not have drinks. Question. Okay. Thank you, Mr. Grant. Secretary Lutnick, you've answered questions regarding Mr. Epstein and Ms. Maxwell a numerous amount of times at this point across different hearings around Congress and here today. Is there anything that hasn't been asked of you that you think that we should know as. As part of the investigation? Lutnick know. Emmer. Thank you. Will go off record. Redacted. We can go back on record. Question. Secretary Lutnick. A few more questions. Like I said earlier, if it's repetitive or it's been asked and answered, I'm going to try to avoid it. I can't promise I'm going to succeed in every case, but I'm going to try. With respect to the tour of the home that we discussed, just a few general questions about what you recall. Did you see any women in Epstein's home on that tour other than your wife? You are talking about which 2005 Lutnick. You are talking about his townhouse in New York. Yeah. The tour of Epstein's house in New York that you received in 2005. So his residence. Okay, so what's the question you'd like? Did you see any woman or women in the home other than your wife? No. Did you see any photos or other images that were sexual or sexually suggestive? No. Did you see any cameras or other recording device? No. Apart from the massage table and candles, did you see anything that raised a concern on your part about Mr. Epstein? No. Question. Did you see anything in the home that was related to President Trump? No. Always about Trump. Buff Ungool Trump. Okay, enough already. Question at some point in that New York Post when you were discussing the concept of blackmail, you add something to the effect of that's how Epstein had money. Just wanted to ask, did you have any direct or indirect knowledge of Epstein making any kind of money through blackmail? Answer no, I was just speculating. Question did you then or now have any knowledge regarding the relationship between Epstein and Less Wexner? Answer what's the question again? Sorry. Well, maybe if the Republicans went and talked to Wexner when they had him on the dock, they would have found out. But they didn't do that, did they? Oh, that's right.

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Question did you either back then or sitting here now have. Have any knowledge of that relationship between Epstein and Wexner? Answer at some point, I came to learn that they were friends. Question did you ever hear directly or indirectly, that blackmail may have had any component of their relationship? Answer I can't remember one way or the other. I remember something about their relationship ended badly, but I don't have any particular relation, particular knowledge. Question. Do you recall any more detail other than that? No. Do you have any knowledge regarding the relationship between Jeffrey Epstein and Leon Black? What's the question again? Question do you have either back then or sitting here today, any knowledge regarding the relationship between Jeffrey Epstein and Leon Black? No, other than I think they had a relationship of some form. Question. Is that based on public reporting as far as you know, or any kind of personal knowledge? I don't have any personal knowledge. Have you ever heard, directly or indirectly, that Black male may have had any role in the relationship between Epstein and Leon Black? No particular knowledge? No. Question. Okay. The part of the New York Post interview, there was a part that was related to the existence of videos and videos possibly being traded in exchange for Mr. Epstein's plea deal. I just wanted to clarify. Did you have any knowledge of such a trade occurring? The lawyer telwager jumps in. Mr. Adapted, can I just ask a question? You say the New York Post interview. You mean the Pod Force One podcast, correct? I do indeed. Lutnick, would you mind repeating the question? Question. Sure. Of course. There was a part towards the back of the end of the podcast, a discussion about Epstein. There was a discussion about the possible existence of videos of powerful men getting massages, and there might be something compromising on those videos. I think you had discussed the possibility that if those videos existed, maybe Mr. Epstein had traded them to the Department of Justice in exchange for a lenient plea deal. I just wanted to ask whether you thought that was based on any personal knowledge of yours, or was that just a theoretical thought? I was just speculating for the podcast. This guy's a Cabinet member and he's out here speculating on a podcast. Okay. Question. A few general questions. They're similar to some that you've answered, but I think phrase slightly differently. Prior to becoming or it becoming public knowledge, did you ever have direct or indirect knowledge of the sexual abuse that Jeffrey Epstein was committing against minors and young women? Answer no. Question. Prior to becoming public knowledge, did you ever have direct or indirect knowledge of the sexual abuse that Ghislaine Maxwell was committing and facilitating against minors and young women? No. Question. Have you ever engaged in sexual activity with A person introduced to you by Jeffrey Epstein or Ghislaine Maxwell? No question. Have you ever received a massage from a person introduced to you by Jeffrey Epstein or. Or Ghislaine Maxwell? Answer no question okay, my colleague has a few questions related to Epstein's various properties. Question so, Secretary Lutnick, you answered questions previously about a number of Epstein's properties, but we wanted to cover a few that had not been raised yet specifically. So did you ever visit Epstein's home in New Albany, Ohio? Answer no question. And what about any of the apartments that he rented in London? Answer no question okay, and then a few general questions about his properties in general, whether or not they're the ones that you personally visited. Did you ever hear any rumors or allegations of minors visiting Epstein at any of his properties before they became public reporting? Answer no Question okay. Did you ever see or hear of large numbers of women visiting Epstein's New York home? Answer no question. Or any other property? Answer no question okay, and do you recall hearing about any other prominent figure include individuals visiting any of Epstein's home? Terwalger, could you be a little more specific about which homes, time frame, what you mean by prominent figure? Sure. I think prominent figure can include politician, well known, wealthy individual, celebrities generally. And other than that, what you have read through public reporting since did you have any personal knowledge of Epstein hosting? We can go property by property. That's easier. Hosting any such individuals at his New York home? Answer no. Palm Beach? Answer no question New Mexico? Answer no question. Paris? Answer no question Any other property? Answer no question okay. Or flying on his planes. Any of those plant people flying on his planes are taking other of his the modes of transportation that he owned? Answer no question okay, Answer nothing then whatever's public. Question and other than public reporting, do you recall hearing anything about Epstein throwing parties at any of his homes? Answer no question okay, thank you. All right, we're going to wrap up right here and in the next episode, we're going to pick up where we left off. All the information that goes with this episode can be found in in the description box.

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