← The Epstein Chronicles
The Epstein Chronicles
Inside The OIG Interview: The Testimony Of An Unnamed CO/Lieutenant (Part 1) (5/13/26)
00:12:26
In a sworn interview with DOJ Office of Inspector General investigators conducted on June 14, 2021, an unnamed lieutenant and former correctional officer from MCC New York was questioned as part of the investigation into Jeffrey Epstein’s death and...
Loading summary
Transcript1 lines
- [00:00]
A
What's up, everyone? And welcome to another episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're diving into another transcript from an interview given by a correctional officer at MCC to the OIG about the death of Jeffrey Epstein. And once again, when I say question, that is the investigator asking the question. When I say answer, that's the response of the corrections officer. Okay. Before starting the interview, I would like to place you under oath. Redacted. Can you please raise your right hand? Do you swear to tell the truth and nothing but the truth during the interview? Yeah. Please let me know if you don't understand any question and I'll repeat it or try to rephrase it for you. What's your current home address? He goes through all of that and the Social Security and all of that. Then he gets to college. What's your highest level of education? A bachelor's degree. Which college? Redacted. And what was the bachelor degree in? Forensic psychology and counseling. You said forensic psychology. Forensic psychology and counseling. In what year did you graduate? 2007. And that's in New York City, correct? Yeah. Okay. What did you do prior to working for the bop? I was a New York City probation officer. For how long? Three years. Did you have any military service? No. How long have you served with the Federal Bureau of Prisons? A little over 10 years. 10 years and 5 months. Do you recall your entry and duty date? Yeah, two hours. 11. Question. And prior to that, you said you were with New York City Probation's office. And that was for how many years? Three years. Yeah. What did you do prior to that? New York State Correction Officer, New York State. How long did you do that for? About seven or eight months. And prior to that? I was a full time student at Redacted. The short period with New York State. Did you resign from that position? Yeah, I resigned to go to probation. Okay. When did you graduate from BOP training? April 2013. When and where was your first office assignment with the BOP? Allenwood, Pennsylvania. Question. Okay, and what year was that? 2011. When I started. What was your position? Correctional officer. Did you stay there or did you move on as a correctional officer? I was there from February, my EOD date, until October 2013. That's why I transferred to MCC New York. October 6, 2013 was my first day at MCC New York. Did you transfer as he gets cut off by the guard? Lateral transfer. Lateral transfer. So you were still a correctional officer? Yes. Okay. How does it work in Allenwood? Are you assigned to one of the facilities or were you rotated throughout? 95% of the time I was at the medium, but when we were short staffed, then I would go to the pen on the low. But they tried their best to keep you at one institution, but. But you were hired for the entire complex so you could bounce around. Okay. When did you get promoted? October 1, 2020 was the day I got selected for lieutenant. But I started here. January 3, 2021. Okay, did you hold any other position between correctional officer and lieutenant? Correctional officer was entry level, then automatic senior officer. Then I was promoted to senior officer specialist, which is up under a GS11. I'm sorry, a GS9 lieutenant. And then I'm now promoted to lieutenant. So the promotions were the senior office specialist and the lieutenant. Question, when did you get promoted to senior officer specialist? August, October. No, I'm sorry. August of 14 or 15. I can't really remember which year. But Senior officer specialist, that's a lieutenant position. No, O. It's just the same grade. No, Senior officer specialist is an eight. Question. O. And lieutenant is a nine. Lieutenant is a nine and eleven. I just can't remember what year I got promoted. I can't remember if it was 14 or 15. On August 9th and 10th of 2019, what was your position? Senior officer Specialist. What shift did you work? Do you recall on August 9 and 10? I don't remember what shift. Okay, I'm going to provide you with it. I'm going to provide you with two documents. It states MCC, New York DLE assignment roster. One is for August 9th and one is for August 10th. Can you just take a look at it? Answer. Yeah. Question, let me know if you recall. Answer. Yep, we got the ninth here. Okay. Yep. I was attorney conference for day watch eight to four. That's my regular shift. Question, which day was that? August 9th. Answer, this is August 9th. Yep. And then. Wait, hold on a second. Right here. Yep, I did overtime from activities. Lieutenant is usually 2 to 10, but I overlap because my regular hours are 8 to 4. So usually when they have the senior specialist eights do activities, we have to wait until 4 to actually start the roll because we're still doing our regular time. So I did activities from 4 to 10 that night. Now, we've talked to other lieutenants and they said that they actually start the lieutenant position two hours earlier. Is that the case with this case as well? Did you start at 4 or did you start at 2? I started at 4 because I was attorney conference for my straight time. Okay, so because you did that, then you actually did start at four. That's correct. So from four until did you say you actually end with that time? It says on that as well, yeah. 4, 10 and for August 10th he gets cut off by the investigator. So you didn't go and until 12am Answer that's correct. Question okay. Yep. Yeah, because okay, that makes sense. Answer yeah. All right. And then I'm Looking at the 10th, August 10th, I was SHU too. I was supposed to be attorney conference. That was my post. But because what happened with Epstein attorney conference, all social visits was canceled. So when I came in that day, I remember the lieutenant telling me to go to SHU to help out be extra bodies in SHU that day. They put a bunch of us in Chu to just be there and help out. Question so when you were in the shoe on August 10th? Answer yeah. Question no. What time? Answer 8 to 4. Question so 8 to 4pm yeah, that's it. And I did overtime. Question on August 10th. Yep. From internal we were. It was terrible with emdations and just being short staffed, whatever that means. So we all, everybody that was there for the day, we just pretty much stayed for evening watch as well. Question okay, so primarily what we're going to be talking about is your on August 9, the shift from 4 to 10. And then we'll probably ask you some questions at 8am to 4pm in the shoe the following day. And then they give her a bunch of paperwork to sign like usual initials. She can keep that in front of her so that if we ask you about other people you can kind of just refer to it. Who was your supervisor when you worked at MCC on August 9 and 10? He is a GS9 lieutenant. Is that redacted? Yeah. Okay. As a senior officer specialist, what's your daily duty on that specific post? Because it varies day to day. Question I was going to try to differentiate between what you do before as a senior officer specialist to when you do activities. Lt. So on that post you said that you were attorney conference, right? Answer yeah. Question what are your duties? Answer so this post entails pre trial inmates meeting with their legal team. Question okay. Lawyers, probation, whoever comes through on a legal matter. That's where inmates meet with them on that floor for whatever reason. Question okay, and what about an activity Lieutenant? Answer Activities Lieutenant that night. Question yeah, that night. Answer so I'm required to do rounds, make sure that the staff are alive and well. Rounds of them doing their duties, conducting their rounds, doing shakedowns. You? No, making sure that they're doing the count, things like that. So, so basically just supervising staff. Question okay. Answer on accounts and rounds. Question yeah. On that note, counts and rounds, do you assist with doing the counts and rounds? Answer. Negative. Question. So you said, though, that they make sure that they do them. How does the lieutenant actually ensure that the employees are doing their counts and rounds? Answer. Yep. So, for instance, if. If it's a certain day, we all have the operations lieutenant will say, hey, I want you to observe a count in unit 7 north. 9 north is doing a bed count. Go observe that count. So we ensure that those things are being done, basically. But when we make our specific round and we're speaking with the officers saying, hey, is everything good? You know, make sure you do your rounds, basically reinforcing and reiterating because, you know, at the end of the day, we're all adults, so, like, you have a job to do, and we're just making sure and, you know, making sure that you're doing it. We're not like, babysitting and like, hey, you know, do a round. Question. Do the officers, though, ever actually participate in the rounds and the counts? Are they supposed to do that at all? Answer. Say that again. I'm sorry. Question. So are the lieutenants, are they supposed to participate in any of the counts and. And rounds done on the inmates so when the COs are doing counts and rounds, he gets cut off by the officer? Yes. Yes. Question. Is that, like, you're supposed to do that, like, once a shift? Answer no. So once a shift, we're taking the count. So we're the ones in the control center where the officers are actually calling their counts in. So, like, observing counts is something that we do irregularly, if you understand what I'm trying to say. So, like, say, for instance, if I'm activities today, I want to observe 7 North and conduct a count. I want to go up to 9 north today and do a shakedown with them. It's just something that, as a lieutenant, you take the initiative, and when you go to the unit, you say, hey, let's do a shakedown. Let's do a round on this tell. Let's do a round on this tell. You have any issues with any inmates? Oh, yeah, I had an issue with inmate Smith. I. All right, let's go talk to inmate Smith over there. Question. So it's your discretion. Answer. Yes. Question. Okay, so it's not like you just need to do this or that. It's just that you want to take the initiative to make sure that they know where they're going and they're doing. Answer. It should be done, but it's not like, hey, Monday, it has to be done. Tuesday. It has to be done. You know, as a lieutenant, you should be a lot. You should be speaking with the officers and in the mix and handling with them. But it's not like Tuesday you do it, Wednesday you do this, Thursday you do that. Okay, question. And in special housing unit, we should be walking every single tier, speaking with every single inmate as a lieutenant, making rounds in a special housing unit. Alright, folks, we're gonna wrap up right here. And in the next episode, dealing with the topic, we're gonna pick up where we left off. All the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description.