Summary5 min read

The Epstein Chronicles

Episode: Inside The OIG Interview: The Testimony Of An Unnamed R&D Officer From MCC (Part 9)

Host: Bobby Capucci
Date: May 12, 2026

Episode Overview

This episode continues the deep dive into the Office of Inspector General (OIG) interview with an unnamed Receiving & Discharge (R&D) officer from the Metropolitan Correctional Center (MCC), focusing on the days surrounding Jeffrey Epstein’s death. Host Bobby Capucci walks listeners through the testimony, exposing the inner workings of MCC’s operations, chain of command, record-keeping, and issues with institutional cameras the night Epstein died. This is Part 9 of the series and seeks to meticulously piece together inconsistencies and overlooked facts in the official narrative.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Removal and Documentation of Inmate Reyes ([00:10]–[03:20])

The officer had limited knowledge on why inmate Reyes was removed, only knowing he "went out to court."
Logbook and Form Confusion: The investigators question the officer about the "PP38" form, which tracks inmate movement. The officer clarifies it logs departures but not reasons behind them.
- "You just know that he's gone. You don't know why he's gone." [01:48]
Inmate returns are tracked via dispositions from the marshals, which can be delayed or immediate.
Marshals’ disposition forms are kept in the inmate’s folder, not routinely shared with control.

2. Communication Procedures When Inmates Do Not Return ([03:20]–[07:50])

Control and R&D rely on a checks-and-balances system via data entry/alerts in the computer.
Occasionally the unit is personally notified if property remains to be secured.
There is no policy to proactively call units unless circumstances require it (e.g., securing the property).

3. Counts and Shift Details Surrounding August 9–10 ([07:50]–[13:30])

The interviewed officer was in the control center and not directly involved in counting inmates during the relevant nights.
Recollection gaps are significant: the officer could not confirm who took or called in specific counts but asserted, “They have to do the count...you’re counting for living, breathing bodies.” [12:12]
Count slips/records are standard operating procedure.
Access to E1 Document: Control center officers and lieutenants had access. R&D had access at the time, but this changed later.
- "If you had access to it, you just had access to it. [13:22]"

4. State of Security Cameras at MCC ([13:30]–[20:42])

Cameras’ quality and visibility: The control center could not clearly see into the SHU (Special Housing Unit).
"No, it's not clear. You might have seen a body move here and there, but you can't really tell." [15:13]
Camera functionality was an ongoing issue, with failures being reported but rarely fixed promptly: “No, things weren't getting fixed immediately.” [16:29]
The officer confirmed staff would contact a technician, but repairs lagged.
Investigators asked if anyone could have intentionally knocked cameras offline. The officer did not believe so: “No, I don't believe that.” [27:45]

5. Access to the SHU and Handling of Keys ([20:42]–[27:00])

Entrances to the SHU are controlled by the control center; staff must be buzzed in, and keys are closely tracked.
The officer described the "chit" accountability system for issuing keys: personnel must exchange a chit (with their name) to borrow keys.
- "To get the chit back, you gotta give them the key back." [25:20]
No one recalled anyone taking out keys for the SHU on the night in question, but records are unclear.
Only the necessary staff had access; emergency keys are not distributed except for emergencies.

6. Epstein’s Death – Officer Opinions and Institutional Culture ([27:00]–[29:00])

The officer personally believes Epstein took his own life and had no reason to suspect otherwise.
- "I believe so. I believe he had a lot on his plate and this environment has a culture shock to him. I think that he took his own life." [28:35]
When probed about missing camera footage, the officer denied knowledge of intentional sabotage: “No, I don't believe that. No.” [27:45]
The decrepit state of the facility was mentioned as an ongoing issue: "This building is still deteriorating as we speak, so it's just a lot of repairs and maintenance that needs to be done in this institution." [28:59]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

"You're counting for living, breathing bodies." – R&D Officer, emphasizing the importance and seriousness of the inmate count process. [12:12]
"No, things weren't getting fixed immediately." – On the frequent issues with the MCC's security camera system. [16:29]
"To get the chit back, you gotta give them the key back." – Explaining the internal key and accountability system. [25:20]
"I believe he had a lot on his plate and this environment has a culture shock to him. I think that he took his own life." – The officer’s personal opinion on Epstein’s death. [28:35]
"This building is still deteriorating as we speak..." – On MCC's infrastructure problems, contributing to the lapses and chaos. [28:59]

Timestamps for Key Segments

00:10 – Why was Reyes removed? R&D officer discusses documentation procedures.
03:20 – Marshals’ notification and disposition forms explained.
07:50 – Count assignments and unclear recollection of night-shift events.
12:12 – Importance of physically counting inmates.
13:30 – Camera views and limitations in the control center.
16:29 – Maintenance lag on camera repairs.
20:42 – Security protocols for accessing the SHU; chit system for keys.
27:00 – Direct questions about Epstein’s death, officer affirms suicide as the most plausible explanation.
28:59 – Critique of MCC facility’s state; interview concludes.

Episode Tone and Style

Bobby Capucci maintains a probing, investigative tone, highlighting bureaucratic confusion, institutional complacency, and the many procedural cracks at the MCC. The R&D officer's answers are matter-of-fact, sometimes hesitant, with a focus on routine and policy rather than speculation. The mood vacillates between frustration at the system and straightforward practicality.

Listen for Next Steps

Capucci closes by assuring listeners that this deposition is just one piece of a much larger puzzle, promising further interviews and detailed breakdowns as the series continues to peel back the layers on the Epstein case.

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Transcript1 lines

[00:00]
A
What's up, everyone? And welcome to another episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're going to dive right back in to the interview with the R D officer from MCC with the OIG inspectors. Question. I have a few more questions. A few more, but we can come back. Some of the questions are going to be redundant because we asked the questions, so I just gotta cover it. So. Do you know why Reyes was removed from the mcc? Is that the guy that went out to court? Question. Yeah. Answer. I would only know that because he went to court, but looking at the document off the top of my head, I wouldn't be able to recall off the top of my head why he was removed, but I just know that he went out to court. Question. Were you ever instructed on what actions to take? The other investigator jumps in. Well, let's follow up with that. Looking at the lieutenant's log, does that tell you something different with the lieutenant's log and the BP 38? You mean the PP 38. Is it PP? Uh huh. All right. I thought it was like the Bureau of prisons, like BP. So it's PP, PP38. What does the PP stand for? It's a sentry function. I don't know. Can you repeat your question again? So looking at it, where it says that Mr. Reyes left at 8:38 and then as well as with the document the RD uses to keep people out, the PP38, does that tell you why he would have left? No, because this does not necessarily tell you. It just tells you that he was removed out of the institution. Okay. So I mean, you just know that he's gone. You don't know why he's gone. You just know that he left. And the same thing with that, you just, you don't know why. You just know he left. Question. Okay, you're talking about the PP38, right? Answer yeah. Question how would the institution know if Reyes was coming back from court? Answer. R D would know because he would come back with the marshals and we would key him back in and we would send them back to his unit. Question. Now, if he wasn't. Now that he wasn't coming back and is there any other notification that comes up throughout the day through R and D that he's not coming back? It would be just whatever dispositions that the marshals give us, provide us with. Question. When does that disposition come? That just depends. Sometimes we get it right away. Sometimes they forget and we got to pre remove the inmate out because we don't have nothing and we know that he went with the marshals. But sometimes we get it as soon as possible, and sometimes we don't get it until the next day. Question so there is a disposition form that comes in afterward, huh? Question what is it? What does the form look like? What does it state on it? It's just the United States Marshals form. And it'll say disposition of. It'll be time served. Maybe the judge released somebody on recognizance. Just whatever. The judge just might. The judge might have dismissed the case. Just whatever happened at court is what will be it might be a bail bond, might be a release to probation. And where's that form kept? It would be in the inmate's folder. Do you recall seeing any forms for disposition forms for inmate Reyes? I don't remember. And what's done with that information once it's received? Answer we retain it in the inmates folder and we key the inmate out. She gets cut off by the investigator or is the information disseminated throughout or no. Answer do we give control those? No, we don't give control a copy. I don't think we give control a copy of the disposition form because we don't give them a copy of it. Question so this circles back to what we talked about before. So once you find out an inmate is definitively not coming back, you do not contact anyone to say, this guy didn't come back. We key them out. And normally the control officer, if you have a good count and assignment officer and he's paying attention, he'll say, oh, you guys keyed one out. We'll say, yeah, he's not coming back. He got time served. Or the marshals took him and he's not coming back. The RD doesn't proactively provide that information? Answer no, because they're supposed to automatically be checking the computer like a checks and balance. So it's something that's automatic. When we have inmates going out to court, we have a receipt that we give to the marshal, and a copy also goes downstairs to the control center as well. So the control has a copy of every move we do in R D. So they got a copy of that. Question can you recall any situation where an inmate leaves for court and R D is notified, hey, listen, the inmate's not coming back. Where R D actually called the unit to let them know, hey, he's not coming back? Answer yeah, we have. We have. Question Is that because they requested to be notified or is it because that's something that R D normally does? Answer no, we might have. It might have Been the inmate had property upstairs and we might need him to secure the inmate's property and bring it down. So that's normally sometimes why we might notify the unit officer because sometimes the inmate they'll call back to the jail and say oh they release me, I got my property upstairs. And we'll call upstairs to the unit officer and say, hey, inmate, so and so is not coming back. Can you secure his property? Question okay, before he left for the day on August 9, do you recall talking to any COs about Reyes leaving? I don't recall that, no. Question I know we covered this as part of previous conversation, so I'm going to go through it quick. On August 10th when you came on shift, which counts were you involved in? I didn't take the counts. I was number one in control center. So my number two person takes the counts. Question two, who was the number two? Do you recall? Was it redacted? You can just look at the form for the daily assignment. Just look at the 10th, it's going to be the 10th redacted. Answer he was in control center with me. Question okay, and do you recall redacted taking the midnight count? Answer I believe she came and took the midnight count. Question Were you present for it? Answer I was in control center but I wasn't focused on them taking the count. I was focused on getting my equipment account for my equipment. Question do you recall any issues with the count? Answer not that I know of. Not that I recall. Question and do you recall who called in the count from the shoe? Answer not that I recall. Question what about the 3am and the 5am? Answer I know one of them called the count in because that's the only way we can clear account. Question okay. Answer so I don't remember who called but I know somebody did call and in the count. Question do you recall during the middle of the count redacted calling the shoe, having conversations with the CO in there? Answer I don't know because a lot of times they'll call downstairs when they're calling in the count and she'll have a short conversation with the officers. So I can't say whether she called them or they called her. I don't know. Question do you recall if there was a second count slip sent up for the shoe for the midnight count? Answer no, I can't recall. I I don't know. Question can cos just call in the previous number or do they have to physically do the count? They have to do the count. Question why you're counting for living Breathing bodies. Question Once the counts are done, do the COs have to notify you? Answer. They're supposed to call the control center and call in their count. They call the Control 2, which is 6468, and they call in their count. Did the COs fill out any paperwork for the count? Account slip. A count slip? I think we pretty much covered a lot of the other questions. Do you have anything on that topic? The other investigator jumps in. Hual has access to the update the E1 document. Who all has access to update it? The control center officers. Question when you say officer, just the control center officers is what you mean. Answer Whoever works in control. But a lot of the time, most of the officers were shifted around work in control. So primarily if you work the control center as counts and assignments officer, you had access to printing out the E1. All the lieutenants have access. R D have access, but we don't have access to that. No more. Question but at that point, did you guys have access? Answer yeah, because you have to prepare this for the count. So. Yeah, but we don't have access anymore. So control officers, lieutenants, anyone else, RD and that anyone who has worked in control at that time at least they maintained the access for a certain amount of period afterward. Yeah. Do you know how long that period of time was at that point? I don't think if you had access to it, you just had access to it. Question so given access once you got it until they revoke it? Answer Right. Question okay, I don't think it was. Yeah, it was no time frame that I know of. Question you have any other questions on that? When you were in Are you aware that there were cameras inside the MCC on August 9th and 10th? Uh huh. Question when you were in control, did you have access to see the cameras? Answer yeah, the camera in the. It's like a little TV screen with little individual boxes of different areas of the institution. Question could you see the shoe in there? Answer no, you could only see over a balcony looking down to the MP and it was like far off. So it's like the camera is up on a balcony and just looking all the way down over there. You don't really, you can't really see nothing. Question Was it clear? Answer no. It's like if you see, you might have seen a body move here and there, but you can't really tell. You couldn't really tell. It wasn't clear. No. Question did you ever hear that the cameras are not working offline or not recording? Answer all the time. Question Was there complaints filed, told to anybody specific? The captain, the lieutenant? Answer. I believe notifications were made. Like especially if we're in the control center, we would call the com tech and say hey, this camera might have went out. So yeah, notifications were made. And did they fix it immediately at this time? No, things weren't getting fixed immediately. Do you recall seeing Michael Thomas indiscernible on camera on the night on the morning watch of August 10th? You can't really see from the camera that I had access to. You can't really see. You barely could see because it's like I don't know if you've ever seen or been in our shoe. Have you ever been in the shoe? Question no, we have pictures, but no, we have never been there. Answer so you can't really see. Question I'm showing you a picture. Is this a view? Answer yeah, that's exactly, yeah, that's it. So like if there were in a black hoodie or something, you can't see nobody over there. If their back is turned and the chairs are. You can't really see. You might see a body walk across or you might see a body walk down, but you can't really see. It's not a real good copy. But yeah, that's exactly what I'm talking about. Do you have anything else on the cameras, the other investigator? No, just when you're in the control center, does it. Is there any indication saying that if a camera is working but not recording. No. There's no way for you to know if a camera is recording or not? Yeah, just if it was actually live or not. Uh huh. You would just know that the camera's up, you know, I wouldn't have been able to tell you that. I don't know. Okay. And did you see prior to 6:33 when a body alarm was set off, did you notice anything unusual happening in the institution on any camera specifically? I guess the shoe one that you couldn't see that well anyway. No. Question. No. Okay. There was no other angle from the shoe you could see? Answer no, this is all, that's all you could see. Question. Anything else on that? The other investigator? No question. Now just a few other questions. Do you recall anyone going into the chew that night on August 10th? Answer. August 10th, that's the Saturday question. That Saturday overnight, the morning that Epstein was found dead? Going in the morning he was found or the night prior to him being found? Both is fine. Well, I know the lieutenant made rounds. Lieutenant who? She made the rounds because they have to call the door. So we have to pop her in. So when he says night, he's talking about midnight at 6:30. So, Lieutenant, she made rounds on the unit because the shoe staff called the door for her to pop. For us to pop her into the shoe. And when they call the door, when you hit the door, a visual of the door, who's standing in front of the door pops up in the control center. So you know who's going into the shoe during the body alarm. Our usual staff just responds to a body alarm. So, you know, they say, hey, we have a medical emergency in shu or whoever they call. You got the shoe crew calling the door. So staff can run and assist. So whoever ran in, I couldn't tell you, but whoever was on shift at that time responded. Question. So the only one overnight would be at that before his body was found would be. Lieutenant. Redacted. Answer Lieutenant. Redacted. Internal. If he had, she gets cut off by the investigator who's internal. Answer. Redacted. Question do you recall redacted requesting to go into the shoe? Answer he would. He don't really. He wouldn't have any reason to go into the shoe. Not unless they're calling for you to come in and do something or he's going in, you know, because normally the two officers will count. They'll put their count slip on the door and the internal officer, he'll pick up the count slip on his rounds while he's counting the other units. So if he doesn't have a reason to go in the shoe, he won't go in the shoe. Okay. Do you know if there's any other way that anyone can get through that outer door of the shoe without control buzzing them in? No. Question is the he gets cut off by the guard. You would need an emergency key that you would have to get from control center. But no one gets those keys. And especially on a morning watch when there is no need for us to give out those keys, staff are calling the door. So no, there's no other way to get in the unit. Question. Are those kept open or is it just. It's locked up. It's behind the door in the bathroom in the control center. Question. And that would get you through the first door. Do you know that there's a second set of keys for the internal door for the shoe kept in the control center? Answer. We have keys for most of the doors. Yeah, but those doors, the inner door, the unit officer would have the inner door. He has access to that. So the unit officers have those keys. Question. So we're just asking you to clarify if you do know if anyone checked out the keys for the inner door or the outer door out of the control center that night. The outer door of those keys never get checked out. But the inner door, that key is pretty much like you can have put a chit on the control center question. Put a what? Answer A chit question. What's that Answer. So it's like a chit system. I have a pair of keys. In order for me to get these keys from control, I have to turn in a chit. Question. So it's basically he gets cut off by the guard with my name. Yeah, you have to turn in a chit. Question. A keychain with your name on it. Answer. Yeah, it's a chit. Huh. And it's like, what is it? What would you call it? Accountability question. Okay, so you put the chit on it, you give the person a key. In order to get the chit back, you got to give them the key back, then you get the chit back. Do you recall if anyone did that for the shoe that night? I don't recall. But. I don't recall that. No question. Okay. I've got nothing else. Is there any question that you think that we didn't ask you about that you feel that we should have asked you about? No question. In regards to the Epstein investigation? No question. Do you believe Epstein took his own life? I believe so. Do you have any reason to believe that anyone took Epstein's life aside from him? No. Do you have any knowledge of anyone assisting Epstein with taking his life? No. Okay. I believe he had a lot on his plate and this environment has a culture shock to him. I think that he took his own life. Question. Now, the fact that we don't have the camera from that tier, I wanted to circle back with you. So our understanding from that camera technician and everyone else is that there was actually at that time, cameras down each range. They just weren't recording. Do you know anything about that? Answer. No. Question. Do you have any reason to believe that someone knocked those cameras offline intentionally so that they stop recording? No, I don't believe that. No. No question. Alright. And you don't know anything about that? No. That's a good one. Question. Well, it's just there's a lot of coincidences in this one. Answer. Yeah, it's unfortunate. You know, this building is still deteriorating as we speak, so it's just a lot of repairs and maintenance that needs to be done in this institution. Question. Well, thank you for taking the time to talk to us. Answer. You're welcome. You're welcome. Question. This is Special Agent Redacted. The time is 6:12pm on Thursday, July 15, 2021. We're ending the interview and turning off the recorder. And that, of course, means we've come to the end of the deposition. But have no fear, there's plenty more where this came from. And you already know we're going to get them added to the catalog. All the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box.