← The Epstein Chronicles
The Epstein Chronicles
Inside The OIG Interview: The Warden's Statement Detailing The Death Of Jeffrey Epstein (Part 6) (4/10/26)
00:12:54
Lamine N'Diaye, in his interview with the Office of the Inspector General, essentially tried to turn the Metropolitan Correctional Center into a scapegoat while positioning himself as a bystander to its failures. He leaned heavily on the narrative...
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what's up, everyone? And welcome to another episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're going to pick up where we left off with the warden and his interview with the OIG inspectors. Question. So in that interview with that individual, they said the decision was discussed with AW redacted, and that individual concurred with the decision. If they didn't concur, though, would that matter to them? Answer. What do you mean if the AW didn't concur with it? I don't want to use the word courtesy as a telling, but they're keeping, they're keeping us informed, saying, okay, we need to take them off suicide watch. Now, let's say I come in and I interject and say, no, I want them on there. What is my reasoning for putting them on there? What medical degree do I have to justify keeping an individual on suicide watch? Because now it could go the other way. I decide to turn around and do something like that, I would be having a conversation with you about something else. Question. Sure. So it's more to keep you apprised if anything else. Answer, you know, and saying, hey, this is the way that we're removing an individual and we move forward. I mean, obviously we'll have questions, you know, if we had questions. HAYES interjects Guys, I want to go for a second. All right? Answer. Okay, Hayes, I gotta go to the bathroom. Question. Do you want us to continue or wait? Hayes? No, just stay by me. Don't continue. I'll be right back. So he goes for the bathroom break, comes back, and the next question is. All right, so the last that we discussed was that psychology said that Mr. Epstein needed to have a cellmate. And this is where we talked a little bit about sounded like the decision to have Efren Reyes placed as Epstein's cellmate was actually made at a higher level than yourself. Answer yes. Question okay, and who made that decision? Answer I don't know. Listen, I know I sent it to my supervisor. Actually, the two inmates that would kind of figured out there might be a cellmate, we sent those names to the director's office. Question. Okay. Answer. And it was redacted. Was the chief of staff. And because, see, my boss told me that they had to run it up the department, so I don't know who was spoken to in that department. And I got back and my boss said that too, you know, that's a good choice. Question. Okay, and that's Mr. Redacted again. Answer yeah, Question okay, great. But it was based upon a list that you provided. Yeah, there were some names because I fast forward, I got a call and we were gearing towards getting them out of general population. Oh, so you wanted Epstein to actually be in general population. I didn't want. That's what typically happens, you know, you don't want an inmate in segregation. Most of them. We've had a lot of high profile individuals that come in the institution. You know, we. We do our intelligence gathering to see, okay, what would be an appropriate unit for them to be in. And we place them and then we monitor them if you know, and that is how we move them into general population. I get a call saying, hold up on that. He needs to stay where he is. Question and who called you? Hayes. Did he qualify as a pedophile? Answer I don't. I didn't read. But that's. We didn't. He gets cut off again by Hayes. You know, that's not feasible. Why we were able to keep him in. So get a call and they said, hold up on that. He needs to stay where he's at. Okay. And I'm sorry, who was it that called you to tell you that he had to stay Mr. And then that's when I had to send up the names. I guess he had gotten some from the department. I don't know who he talked to in the department. Question. Oh, so coming out of the psych observation, you are looking to send him back to general pop no question or not back into answer when he first came in. The whole process was to get him out of general population. Question I gotcha. So back you're talking about July 6th through July 8th, that time frame. Answer the whole thing. And then even, you know, coming out of psych observation. When he got in, the plan was still to get him into general population. Question uh huh. Answer I mean we had the attorneys contacting our legal why can't he be in general population? So, and then that's when I got the call from my boss saying, and I don't know who he talked to in the department, but he was like, hold on. Questioned. And on that note, I guess this would be a good time to talk about this. Being that it was ultimately decided that he go into nine south or the Special Housing Unit, was it discussed at all that he be placed on the 10 south for the high, you know, SAM inmates? Answer so here's the problem with 10 South. It's the terrorist unit and there's Sam's things in there. The amount of attorneys he had coming in there, we couldn't have those attorneys coming up to that unit every day, breaching the security of it and then trying up the movement and in there. Because when an attorney comes in there, now those guys get attorneys, but it's planned and they're in there. Epstein's attorneys were coming in early in the morning and weren't leaving until late at night. And it was about four or five of them. Hayes interjects and guess who kept paying his bill? Answer by the warden Right. That's not an appropriate unit. And, and that's not what the unit's for. Question now, what about like if you know an El Chapo or someone of the other high levels that weren't terrorists, how did you deal with them? Did they have attorneys visiting them or no? Answer they did, but it wasn't to that extent. Like he, El Chapo would have his attorneys come in, but they came in for a couple hours. They left as it got close to trial. Then they would, you would see them more frequently. But Mr. Epstein, day one attorneys, they were there from the beginning to the end. We even had complaints from the local attorneys that they were taking up the rooms. Question so the primary reason he was placed in nine south was because of attorney visits? Answer well, not the attorney visits, but it's the same in the SAM's unit and that's not a SAM's inmate. Mr. Hayes interjects what's a SAM's unit? Question Special administrative measures. That means, you know, strict communication and there's a lot that goes on with that unit. So he wasn't appropriate to be up there. Question now were some of those other high profile inmates though, such as El Chapo, and who were some of the other people in that unit? Answer yeah, the terrorists up there. Question but the non terrorists, meaning the people that there was a few. Well you add Schulte, whoever that is. But he was in for espionage and he had Sam's on him. Question now, did El Chapo have a Sam's on him? Answer he had no. His status was based on, and I know there was indiscernible, his escape status and stuff. So he was a high profile person that had escaped from another prison before. So that was an appropriate place to place him. Schulte was in general population and Sam's was placed on him by his attorney. Hayes jumps in. Can I ask a totally irrelevant question? Investigator huh? Hayes, what was El Chapo like? Answer from the warden Just like any other inmate Hayes Is that right? Answer yeah, just like any other inmate Hayes. Polite answer. Polite, you know, no problems. But that wasn't the appropriate unit to be housing inmate Epstein. The investigator pipes back in with another question. Now did you even have the authority to place him in 10 South? If you wanted to? Answer I mean I could have, but I would have had to have, you know, some justification as to why I'm putting him up there and there would have been push back from his attorneys. Question okay, because some people had mentioned that saying the warden the doesn't even have the ability to do that. That comes from a higher level. I mean. Answer I mean in essence, in essence it does because it would have had to explain and justify why you, you know, certain inmates with certain crimes are placed up there. Why am I placing him? And then the fact that, you know, he is pre trial individual, he needs access to his attorneys. That unit is just too restrictive for that. Question now. And this is a total Monday morning quarterback, do you stand by the decision that he would be a nine south or do you think that he should have been in 10 South? Or what are your thoughts on that? Answer I think he was appropriately placed. Question okay, so nine south was the appropriate place for him. Answer yes.
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Quick question by another investigator. Do you recall if there were inmates in 10 south during that time? Yes, there were. Yeah. Do you know who those inmates were? El Chapo had left. I got the one that ran the call with people in Brooklyn. He was there. Mr. Hayes pipes in. What was his name? I forgot. Hayes. What did he do? What was he in there for? That's the one that killed the pedestrians in lower Manhattan and ran the vehicle into them. Hayes. Yeah. And then the guy kicked the gun out of his hand. Right? Answer. Yeah, he was there. I remember. Schulte was another guy that was there. It was something to do with Osama bin Laden. The warden, who else? We had a younger terrorist that was in there, so we had it. It was. They had terrorists in there on espionage charges. Question. All right, so this is along what we were just discussing. It says that this is from redacted, who's just a supervisory staff attorney. Answer. Right. Question what does this CLC stand for? Answer it's the combined. He's the supervisory attorney for Brooklyn and New York. So he's kind of like the general counsel for Brooklyn and New York. Yeah, he was a supervisory attorney. Okay. All right, so this was to you. And it was on Saturday, August 10, 2019. It says, Warden, per our conversation, I spoke to two of his attorneys yesterday, August 9, 2019, primarily in relation to his request for access to water and attorney conference. Attorney Mariel Cologne. Next word. Cologne, with whom I spoke in person in the late morning, had asked, as an aside, whether we would consider housing him in the Cadre. What is the Cadre? Cadre is the camp. Question is at low level. It's like our lower security inmates. Yeah. Question so you have an actual camp at mcc. It's low security inmates. But remember, they are designated. So we couldn't put him in that unit because he's pre trial. We can't mix designated and pre trial inmates together. Question. Okay, it says I advised we could not since he was a pre trial inmate later that day. But prior to one closeout meeting, I spoke to attorney Michael Miller on the phone. He had asked whether we could house Mr. Epstein alone in the shoe. To which I replied that we could not based on his prior suicide attempt or gesture Hayes pipes in. It's just I've never heard of his lawyers. You would think that his lawyers would be somebody that I was familiar with. Hayes, since they're probably charging him 2,000 an hour. Back to the questioning by the investigator. He acknowledged that he understood, to my recollection, neither attorney reference consideration for suicide watch or psychological observation during yesterday's conversation. Please let me know if you need any further information. Now, was this just a request to any contact that he had with his attorneys? Answer. He just keeping me informed because the attorneys were calling every day with different types of requests. Question. But this was the day obviously of when he was found. So this he would be talking about context, just literally the previous day that he was looking for different housing type arrangements. But all right, he gets cut off by Hayes. That was a thousand dollar phone call. Question. Excuse me, Mr. Hayes. That was a thousand dollar phone call. Indiscernible charging. All right folks, we're gonna wrap up right there. And in the next episode dealing with the topic, we're gonna pick up where we left off. All the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box.