Summary5 min read

The Epstein Chronicles

Episode: Lesley Groff And The Transcript From Her Epstein Related Trip to Congress (Part 19)

Host: Bobby Capucci
Date: July 14, 2026

Episode Overview

In this episode, Bobby Capucci continues his detailed walkthrough of the congressional interview with Lesley Groff, a longtime secretary and assistant to Jeffrey Epstein. The discussion is centered on Groff’s specific duties in Epstein’s organization, as recorded in her transcript from an interview with Congress and the FBI. Topics include day-to-day responsibilities, her working relationship with Epstein and other associates, and her insights into the office culture and hierarchy. The episode provides valuable context into the mundane yet high-pressure environment of Epstein's operations, and Groff’s claimed lack of involvement or knowledge regarding the illegal activities at the heart of the Epstein scandal.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Lesley Groff’s Role – Duties and Responsibilities (00:30–07:00)

Travel and Transportation Arrangements
- After Sarah Kellen left (circa 2012–2013), Groff handled most of Epstein’s travel bookings, including flights (commercial via Amex Centurion when the private plane was unavailable) for Epstein and occasionally guests and associates.
  - "Did you often book travel or transportation?
    Answer: I did after Sarah Kellen left... Prior to that it was more Sarah or other people in the office." [00:33]
- Did not recall booking flights for Ghislaine Maxwell, who typically used Epstein’s private plane.
Appointment and Communication Coordination
- Managed daily call lists, scheduled all appointments, and acted as the primary point of contact between Epstein and employees such as the chef, drivers, and pilots.
  - "I was responsible for making all phone calls, including calling the chef and the driver." [02:00]
- Daily communication was necessary to coordinate meals, pickups, and Epstein’s exacting schedule.
Coordinating with Architects, Designers, and Other Staff
- Scheduled meetings for business associates, architects, designers, and sometimes arranged air travel for them.
- Claimed to have no direct knowledge of the purposes of these meetings.
  - "My role was merely to schedule. Correct." [05:08]

2. Perceptions of the Job and Working Environment (07:00–08:59)

Excitement vs. Exclusion from Inner Circle
- Found the job “exciting” due to interactions with influential people across business, entertainment, and government, though notes being kept at “arm’s length” socially and professionally.
  - “It was exciting just to know you’re talking to these people’s offices. Not friends, but more exciting than just speaking to the regular businessman.” [06:45]
Atmosphere and Pressure
- The workload was high-pressure, constantly busy, and unlike a typical assistant position, involving “hair on fire, lots of commotion.”
  - "It was exciting. It was challenging. Super, super busy. Not like a regular job as an assistant." [08:39]

3. Relationships within the Epstein Office (09:31–14:00)

Dynamic With Epstein
- Epstein was described as strictly professional, demanding, and kept personal boundaries with staff.
  - “He did not get close to me... We were not friends. We did not socialize. It was all on purpose.” [09:42]
- Mistakes could result in “probation”—periods of scrutiny with the threat of termination.
  - “If I made any other errors, I would get fired. It was very scary. He was very powerful. He had this aura around him.” [10:34]
Relationship With Ghislaine Maxwell
- Maxwell was seen as an office manager, not a supervisor to Groff. Interactions were “cordial, professional,” but limited.
- Maxwell’s assistants changed over time (names redacted in transcript).
Downsizing and Other Staff
- Staff reductions occurred around Epstein's 2008 jail term; multiple assistants and support staff were let go due to lower workload.
Interactions With Epstein’s Attorneys
- Groff assisted attorney Darren Indyk during Epstein's incarceration in 2009—described as “not nearly as exciting.”
Office Culture and Awareness
- Claims to have never heard gossip or speculation among staff about Epstein's criminal behavior or preference for young women.
  - “No, I never heard any gossip about him going to jail or his affinity for young women or girls.” [13:52]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On the Pressures of Working for Epstein:
- “It was hair on fire, lots of commotion. People own islands and airplanes and homes in other parts of the world. It was exciting, just not like a regular job.” – Lesley Groff [08:45]
On Professional Boundaries:
- “We were not friends. We did not socialize. I did not see him outside of work. And it was all on purpose.” – Lesley Groff [09:50]
On the Culture of Secrecy and Fear:
- “It was more than just a reprimand. It was very scary. He was very powerful. You sat up straight whenever he would talk or walk into the office.” – Lesley Groff [10:30]
On Making a Critical Mistake:
- “I didn’t get invited to a party and I went with my husband. And he found out the next day... That was more than just a reprimand.” [10:15]
Direct Denial of Knowledge about Criminal Activities:
- "My role was merely to schedule. Correct." – Lesley Groff [05:08]
- "No, I never heard any gossip about him going to jail or his affinity for young women or girls.” – Lesley Groff [13:52]

Timestamps for Key Segments

00:30–03:00: Discussion of Groff taking over travel duties post-Sarah Kellen.
03:00–05:10: Daily responsibilities with calls, chef, driver, pilots, and appointment scheduling.
05:10–06:30: Coordination with architects/designers; no knowledge of meetings' purposes.
06:30–07:30: Discussing the “excitement” of the job versus being kept at arm’s length.
07:30–08:59: Groff expands on office dynamics, pressure, and lack of personal ties.
09:31–11:00: Relationship with Epstein; description of “probation” following a social mistake.
11:00–12:30: Discussion of Maxwell’s role, assistants, and office downsizing post-2008.
12:30–13:52: Working for attorney Darren Indyk; direct denial of knowledge of abuse or gossip.
13:52–14:00: Episode wrap-up and teaser for next installment.

Episode Takeaway

This episode sheds light on how Epstein's organization operated on a day-to-day basis, emphasizing high structure, secrecy, and the intense expectations placed on staff. Lesley Groff presents herself as a cog in a fast-moving but tightly managed machine, responsible for logistics and communication but, by her account, insulated from the wider criminal conduct. Her testimony reinforces the compartmentalization and strict control Epstein maintained over both his employees and information, as well as the culture of fear and professional distance within his orbit.

For further details and the next segment of the transcript, check the episode description box.

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Transcript8 lines

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Interviewer/Attorney
up everyone and welcome to another episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode we're going to pick up where we left off with Leslie Groff and our interview with Congress. Question and then just some brief questions I know you were asked in the last hour, but some brief questions about your role in booking travel transportation. In your role as Mr. Epstein secretary, did you often book travel or transportation? Answer I did after Sarah Kellen left. Prior to that it was more Sarah or other people in the office. Question do you know what year that was? Answer I want to say 2013, 2012, something like that. When she was Brigniak. Why did Sarah leave Ms. Groff? She got married. Question did you book flights as part of your job? Answer yes. Question for Mr. Epstein? Answer there was a time when his plane wasn't working, so yes, I would book flights for him commercial through Amex Centurion. Question did you book flights for any of his guests? Answer yes. Question Any of his friends? Answer it's possible. Question do you recall any specific instances where you did? Answer not offhand. Question did you book flights for Ms. Maxwell? Answer I don't believe so. I think she always flew on his airplane. Question did you book flights for any other assistant of Mr. Epstein? Answer traveling assistance? Yes. Question did you plan travel for Mr. Epstein as well? Answer Would I schedule his gets cut off? Question Any itineraries, book any activities, book appointments in a location he'd be traveling to? Answer yes. Question and now we've already discussed how a majority of your tasks involved making calls, taking messages, communicating back and forth with Mr. Epstein scheduling appointments. Is that all a fair characterization? Yes. I would now like to introduce what will be marked as majority exhibit 10. This is FBI note from the sworn statement that you gave to the FBI on September 24, 2021. It's Bates marked EFTA 01246216. She's going to get that passed out and will give you some time to Review. In the meantime, I'm just going to ask you some general questions about the interview, if that's okay. Answer. Sure. Question. So you were interviewed by The FBI on September 24, 2021, related to the investigation into Mr. Epstein. Is that correct? Correct. Why did you provide this testimony? I did so voluntarily. Were you interviewed by the FBI or any other law enforcement agency on any other occasion? No. Question. Did you provide any evidence, documents or other material to the FBI? Answer. No. Just so. Yeah, it's not a sworn statement. But it's her statement. Tolan. It's notes from her statement. But not sworn. Yeah, it's just not sworn, Ms. Tolan. Okay, thank you. Question. And then we'll give you a second to review. Answer. Okay. You want me to read the whole entire thing? Question. You don't have to read it. If you remember, I have some specific questions that I can point you to. Answer questions that you can guide me. Question. Yeah. If you would like me to begin. Answer. Huh? Question. So, on page two, you state that Mr. Epstein would give you a call list of who you were supposed to or of who he wanted to see and have appointments with. I think we've already discussed that in length. But you would receive that daily, is that correct, and then make appointments accordingly? Yes. Question on page two, you mentioned that you were responsible for making all phone calls, including calling the chef and the driver. Is that accurate? Answer. Yes. Question. What would you coordinate with each of them about? Answer. The driver for when Mr. Epstein wanted to be picked up and where he was supposed to be picked up. Give the driver an address for when he wanted to leave the house and be sure to be outside and ready to go, that type of thing. The chef would be. If he wanted his chef to bring lunch over to the office. Or it could be that he, you know, whatever he wanted for breakfast, lunch or dinner, and just coordinate that with the chef to make sure that he's ready at the right time with whatever it is Mr. Epstein wanted to eat. Question. And were those conversations happening daily? Answer. Oh, yes. Question. And on page three, you mentioned that you would coordinate with the pilots of Mr. Epstein's plane. Is that correct? Answer. Yes. Question. What would you coordinate with the pilots about? Answer. The time that he wanted to leave, the day he wanted to leave. Usually that would be. That would be it. Would you inform the pilots about guests Mr. Epstein was bringing on his plane? Yes. That could be possible, too. About who was going to be traveling on the flight and were those frequent communications as well, with the pilots? I mean. Yes. It would be whenever he was going to be traveling. Question. And then on page three, you also mentioned you'd coordinate or you would schedule business meetings, architects and designers. Is that also correct? Yes. What would you coordinate with each of them about? Answer. Well, the business meetings, it was just all his associates that I would coordinate meetings with be at his office or at his home. Architects, I recall buying tickets for them to fly in. They would provide architectural plans. Mr. Epstein never seemed to be satisfied with any of the architects and the designers. They would come and visit him. I would make appointments with them, possibly buy them air travel as well, and just coordinate phone calls with all these people as well. Question. And just again, so the record's clear, we've talked about your role in scheduling business meetings a lot of different times. Today is your testimony that you did not have any knowledge about the purpose of what went on in each of those meetings. Answer. That is correct. Question. You just scheduled. Answer. Merely scheduled. Correct. Brignac, in your opening statement, I believe you said something to the effect of. Of you were thrust into the lives of the rich and famous. But your testimony has sounded like you were kept at an arm's length and that this was very humdrum work, not as exciting as you said it was. Can you help Clarify my confusion, Ms. Grof? Sure. It was exciting just to know that you're talking to these people's offices. I was not friends, but it's more exciting than just speaking to, you know, the neighbor or the regular businessman. They were all very important people, you know. It was exciting. Even though I had no real relationship with these people, it was still. It was better than just working at your average accounting office and speaking to, you know, a bunch of accountants. Nothing wrong with accountants. I just mean these were movie producers, you know, record producers, businessmen, Wall street businessmen, government people, you know, it was not normal. Ton. Question. And you mentioned on page eight that Mr. Epstein would tell you to find a traitor on a few occasions. Is that correct? I'm sorry, page eight. Yeah. Question or. Okay, where are you? It should be near the top of the page. You mentioned Epstein asking you to find a trader. Oh, I think this is about a certain incident. Just bear with me one second. Yeah, I RECALL One time Mr. Epstein wanted to make a trade, and it was something if you know about trading things. Stocks move and every second matters. And I believe that. I recall him calling and telling me to get this person on the phone in my head. I was like, why is he not just calling the person if it's so important that it gets Done. You know, right away the stock's going to move. And I felt. I remember I had to find the phone number for the trader. And you know, that was. Was just one of those incidents. Yeah, that was nerve wracking for me. Question Just a one time occurrence. Answer. I definitely remember that one occurrence. I'm not saying I didn't connect them to a trader. Another time question and then a few quick questions. You mentioned it briefly about how exciting the work was. Did you enjoy working as an assistant or secretary? Apologies for Mr. Epstein. I did at the time. Ms. Brignac, can you elaborate? Grof. It was exciting. It was challenging. It was super, super busy. It was not like a regular irregular job as an assistant. It was just hair on fire, lots of commotion. People own islands and airplanes and homes in other parts of the world. It was exciting, just not like a regular job.
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Interviewer/Attorney
question and how did Mr. Epstein treat you? Or how did he treat you as a boss? Answer as my boss, he was professional. He did not get close to me. If you asked him, I bet he would say that he didn't even know my husband's name or my son's name. It was not that kind of relationship. He would demand no mistakes. But I like the challenge. I did get in trouble at times, but I also felt like I was good at coordinating and managing his phones and. And calling people and organizing his day. And I felt value from that. But we were not friends. We did not socialize. I did not see him outside of work. And it was all on purpose. Question. And you mentioned it just then and in your opening statement as well. An instance where a mistake was made and he put you on probation, I believe you termed it. Can you explain what that was? Answer. So yeah, they had told me that I should not socialize with anybody that he spoke to. Their friends were not my friends. I didn't get invited to a party and I went with my husband. And he found out the next Day. And I definitely was more than just a reprimand. It was very scary. He was very powerful. He had this aura around him. You sat up straight whenever he would talk or walk into the office. Ms. Brignac, what did it mean if you were put on probation? Grof. On probation? I think it was for a month. And, you know, if I made any other errors, I would get fired. Were you not working for the month that you were put on probation? No, I was there. I was working, yeah. And being very careful. What did probation mean then? I think he was just watching for if I made errors, I would get fired. And during your time working for Mr. Epstein, was Ms. Maxwell, was she ever in a supervisory role to you? Did you ever work under her? I did not work under her. Question what did you understand her role to be? Answer I thought she was the office manager. Question and how did she act towards you and the other staff? Answer she was cordial. She was professional. We really didn't interact much. When she would come into the office, she would sweep through, sit at her desk. She had an assistant. I didn't report to her. Ms. Brignac. Question who? Answer to Ms. Maxwell. Question O. Who was Ms. Maxwell's assistant? Oh, sorry. It changed over time. It was first redacted and then it was. I'm sorry. Redacted. No. Was it redacted? I'm sorry, I'm drawing a blank. After redacted? Yes. Redacted. Moved back to be her assistant, and we hired a new receptionist. Question how long did you work with Redacted. Answer she was let go when he went to jail. So in 2009. Why? Answer we had to downsize the office. Others were also let go. Question who else? Answer Redacted. Who was the attorney's assistant at the time? I believe it was redacted. Who was a receptionist? And that might have been. That might have been it. Question did you hear why they were let go? Specifically? It was just that they were downsizing the office and it wasn't going to be that busy. Question in your role as secretary for Mr. Epstein, did you ever work alongside Richard Kahn? Answer no. Did you ever conduct work or assist Richard Kahn with his accounting operations? No. Question. Did you ever work alongside Darren Indyk? I did a short period of time when he was in jail. Yes. Question what was your position working for him? Answer Assistant. Question and what were you helping him with? Answer. Filing calls, making his calls, connecting him to people. It was not nearly as exciting. Question and what time period was that? Answer that was about 2009. It was when he went to jail. And then after he was released, I was still working a little bit for Mr. Indyke, but then he did get an assistant himself. Question and you mentioned traveling assistance of Mr. Epstein throughout the course of today's interview. Do you know who those traveling assistants were? Answer yes. Do you want me to tell you their names? Question if you know them, please answer. Sure. When I first started, it was redacted, and then it was Sarah and she stayed for a long time. Then there was redacted, redacted, redacted, redacted, and redacted. Those are the ones that come to my mind. Question okay, thank you. And out of all those employees, was there any office gossip about him going to jail or any speculation about his affinity for young women or girls? Ms. Groff? No. All right, folks, we're going to wrap up right here. And in the next episode dealing with the topic, we're going to pick up where we left off. All the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box.
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