← The Epstein Chronicles
The Epstein Chronicles
Mega Edition: Howard Lutnick And His Trip To Congress (Part 1-3) (7/10/26)
00:42:04
The transcripts from Howard Lutnick’s closed-door appearance before Congress painted a picture of a witness trying to minimize both the depth and duration of his relationship with Jeffrey Epstein while lawmakers confronted him with records suggesting...
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Refreshers contain caffeine. What's up, everyone? And welcome to another episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're going to begin taking a look at the Howard Lutnick transcripts from the deposition in front of Congress. Mr. Emmer will go on the record. This is a transcribed interview of Secretary Howard W. Lutnick conducted by the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform under the authority granted to it pursuant to House Rule 10. Accordingly, House Rule 10 grants the Committee Board jurisdiction for the committee to conduct investigations of any matter at any time. This interview is requested by Chairman James Comer as part of the committee's investigation into the circumstances and subsequent investigation into the circumstances and subsequent investigations and the crimes of Jeffrey Epstein and Glenn Maxwell. The operation of the sex trafficking rings and ways for the government to effectively combat them. The ways in which Mr. Epstein and Ms. Maxwell sought to curry favor and exercise influence to protect their illegal activities and potential violations of ethic rules related to elected officials. Can the witness please state his name and spell his last name for the record? Secretary Lutnick. Howard Lutnick. L U T N I C K. Mr. Emmer. Thank you. I want to thank Secretary Lutnick for appearing voluntarily here today. My name is Jack Emmer, and I'm the chief counsel for investigations for Chairman James Comer. Under the Committee on Oversight and Government Reform rules, you're allowed to have counsel present to advise you during the interview. Do you have counsel representing you present with you today? Lutnick? Yeah. Emmer. Will counsel please identify themselves for the record? Mr. Telweger, who is the lawyer for Lutnick? Zach Terwilger, a partner at Vinson and Elkins, law firm. Another Lawyer pops up. Mr. Crowley. Michael Crowley, Associate. Vincent and Elkins. Another lawyer. Mr. Mehron. Austin Mayeron, Department of Commerce. This dude needs three lawyers to do a deposition about somebody he only met three times, according to him. Okay, Mr. Emmer, thank you. For the record, starting with the majority staff, can the additional staff members please introduce themselves with their name, title and affiliation? Mr. Grant. Billy Grant, Deputy Chief Counsel for Investigations. Chairman Comer. Peter Spector, Director of Oversight for Chairman Comer. Ellison Tolan, Council Chairman Comer. Hannah Cathy, professional staff member, Chairman Comer. Emily Firebend, Council for Chairman Comer. Brittany Brignack, Senior counsel, chairman comer. Mr. Ashworth. Daniel Ashworth, General Counsel for Chairman Comer. Will harness professional staff member for Chairman Comer.
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Chairman.
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Ashley Vineyard, Deputy staff Director for Chairman Comer. Jessica Collins, Communications Director for Comer. And then the next names were redacted. Mr. Emmer. Thank you. We have members of Congress present today, starting with the chairman. Can the majority members intro and then the minority members. James Comer, Kentucky. William Timmons, South Carolina. Emmer. Thank you. Secretary Lutnick. Before we weigh in, I would like to go over the ground rules for this interview. The questioning will proceed in rounds. The majority will ask questions for up to an hour, and then the minority will have an opportunity to ask questions for up to an hour if they choose. To the extent members have questions for the witness, they will be propounded during their sides respective rounds. The clock will stop before you need to confer with your counsel, your your council speaking. And when members are speaking during the opposing side's rounds of questions, we will alternate back and forth until there are no more questions. Do you understand, Secretary Lutnick? I do. Emmer. There is a court reporter taking down everything I say and everything you say to make a written record of the interview for the record. To be clear, please wait until the staffer questioning you finishes at each question, please, before you begin your answer. And the staffer will wait until you finish your response before proceeding to the next round. Further, to ensure that the court reporter can properly record the interview, please speak clearly, concisely, and slowly. Also, the court reporter cannot record nonverbal answers such as nodding or shaking your head. So it's important that you answer each question with an audible verbal answer. Exhibits may be entered into the record. Majority exhibits will be identified numerically. Minority exhibits will be identified alphabetically. Do you understand, Lutnick? I do. Emmer. We want you to answer our questions in the most complete and truthful manner possible. So we'll take our time. If you have any questions or you don't fully understand the question, please let us know. We will attempt to clarify, add context or or rephrase our questions. If we ask about specific conversations or events in the past and you are unable to recall the exact words or details, you should testify to the substance of those conversations or events to the best of your recollection. If you recall only part of a conversation or event, you should give us your best recollection of those events or parts of conversations that you do recall. Do you understand? LUTNICK I do. Emmer Although you're here voluntarily and you'll not be sworn in, you're required by law pursuant to title 18 of the United States Code, section 1001, to answer questions from Congress truthfully. Not even sworn in. You guys catching on yet? It's all a big fucking joke. That's all it is to these people, but not to us and not to the vast majority of people out there are paying attention. And this also applies to questions posed by congressional staff in the interview. Do you understand? LUTNICK I do. Emmer if at any time you knowingly make false statements, you could be subject to criminal prosecution. Do you understand? Lutnick I do. EMER this includes both knowingly providing false testimony, but also stating that you do not recall or remember something when in fact you do. Do you understand? LUTNICK I do. EMER Furthermore, you cannot tell half truths or exclude information necessary to make statements accurate. You're required to provide all information that would make your response truthful. A deliberate failure to disclose information can constitute a false statement. Do you understand? LUTNICK I do. Emmer Is there any reason that you're unable to provide truthful testimony in today's interview? WHATNIK no. EMMER Please note that if you wish to assert a privilege over any statement today, that assertion must comply with the rules of the Committee on Oversight and Government Reform. Pursuant to that committee, Rule 16c1 states for the Chair to consider assertions of privilege over testimony or statements, witnesses or entities must clearly state the specific privilege being asserted and the reason for the assertion on or before the scheduled date of testimony or appearance. Do you understand? Secretary Lutnick I do. Emmer Ordinarily, we take a five minute break at the end of each hour of questioning. But if you need a longer break or a break before that, please let us know and we'll be happy to accommodate. However, to the extent that there is a pending question, we would ask you to finish answering the question. Before we take a break, do you understand? Lutnick I do. Emmer do you have any other questions before we begin? Lutnick no. Emmer do you have an opening statement that you would like to read? LUTNICK I do. Emmer. You may proceed. Lutnick. Chairman Comer, Members of the committee and committee staff, I unequivocally condemn the conduct attributed to Jeffrey Epstein and everyone who who participated in his illegal activities. The survivors of his crimes deserve our respect and support. I voluntarily agreed to appear and answer questions in connection with this committee's investigation. I would like to begin by briefly describing my virtually non existent interactions with this individual who lived adjacent to my New York city home. In 1997, I purchased an unfinished townhouse as my family home in New York City. Renovations took several more years than expected due to the events of September 11th terrorist attacks and their impact on me, my family and all my co workers in the World trade Center. Approximately eight years after our purchase in 2005, my family and I finally moved into our new home which happened to be adjacent to his residence. Shortly thereafter, my wife and and I were invited by that individual to his residence for coffee. During this brief interaction that included my wife, me and this individual, he made a crude and gross remark in my wife's presence which caused us to cut the visit short and leave Immediately following that brief initial meeting. As we walked back to our home, my wife and I discussed the encounter and that given his clear lack of boundaries, I would never establish a personal or professional relationship with them. And that is exactly what I did following this 2005 interaction. My only other two interactions with Epstein over the ensuring ensuing 14 years were both meaningless and inconsequential. My second interaction occurred six years later in 2011 when his staff initiated contact with my office, suggesting he had a reason get in touch with me. Our offices attempted to connect us by phone over the course of several weeks, but we were unable to do so. Ultimately, to the best of my recollection, his staff indicated he would be in his residence on a particular weekend afternoon and my staff arranged for me to ring his bell during my and my wife's typical Sunday walk around the block with our dogs to hear what he had to say. My best recollection is I. I rang the bell, sat in his foyer with my dog, waited for him to come down, heard what he had to say and I left. As far as I recall, it was about scaffolding. It was meaningless and inconsequential. Next, some 18 months later, in late 2012, his staff inexplicably contacted my office unprompted regarding my family's planned holiday travel to the Caribbean. Unbeknownst to me, his staff somehow had had become aware that my family and I would be near his island over the holidays, although they were apparently unsure whether that meant during the Thanksgiving or Christmas holiday. I still have no idea how his staff discovered my family's vacation plans or why they pursued arranging a visit with me. From what I have since learned, it appears he was initially seeking a meeting with just me. My wife made clear, however, that we had a large traveling party of approximately 12 plus people, and if we were to come, it would be with everyone. My family of six and another family of six had a brief, meaningless and inconsequential lunch and then left. To the best of my recollection, those were the only three occasions in which I interacted with Epstein in person. Each and every one of those was meaningless and inconsequential. To put this in perspective, Epstein lived in the house next door to my family for 14 years, and in that time, I interacted with him in person only three times. Again, each meaningless and inconsequential. I had no personal or professional relationship with this individual, despite the proximity of our addresses. Further, at no time during these limited interactions did I witness any conduct, let alone any type of illegal conduct of which we have since become aware. In closing, after our first interaction, my wife and I discussed that I would not establish a personal or professional relationship with that individual. On a podcast on October 2025, I informally recounted that conversation. What I said on that podcast regarding my conversation with my wife was correct. I did not establish a personal or or professional relationship with that individual. The documents in my prior testimony confirm that I am here to answer your questions. All right, folks, we're going to wrap up right here, and in the next episode, we're going to pick up where we left off. All the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box.
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and welcome to another episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're getting right back to the Howard Lutnick transcripts from the deposition in front of Congress. Mr. Emmer Question Secretary Lutnick, I understand you've had a long career, but can we just start by can you briefly walk us through your professional career up until now? By Lutnick Sure. I graduated from Haverford College in Pennsylvania and my first job was with Canor Fitzgerald and I never had another job, so I stayed at the same firm my entire career. And if you had asked me or my family two years ago, would that be true? I would have assumed it would have been for the full amount of my career. And then I left counter Fitzgerald to join the Trump administration as the Secretary of Commerce. So it's rather a simple career, one job since college and then a second job working for the administration. Question thank you. And again, we appreciate your public service and agreeing to testify voluntarily. Let's talk about your contact with Epstein and we appreciate the personal or the statement that you made. But let's start from the beginning. When did you first meet Jeffrey Epstein? I first met Jeffrey Epstein when his staff knocked on our door and invited my wife and I to come next door for coffee. He lived in the townhouse adjacent to ours and then sometimes later my wife and I went over to his house for coffee. It was literally eight or ten steps next door. Question and who was the staffer that knocked on your door? Answer well, I don't know and I didn't answer the door. I have someone who works for me who answers the door. Imagine that shit. All of these out of touch people. I have someone that answers the door for me. Does he scratch your nuts too? Question so you were invited. What happened when you showed up at Mr. Epstein's residence? Answer. My best recollection is we walked next door. Someone answered the door. We went through his foyer, up a big flight of stairs to his living room and sat in his living room and had coffee. Mr. Grant, another investigator pipes in. Excuse me. What year was that roughly, Lutnick? This was 2005, Grant. Thank you. Back to Mr. Emmer. Question. And you said that you had coffee with him. What was the nature of your conversation with him during this coffee? Answer. I don't recall. Question. And approximately how long did this coffee last? Answer. Short. A reasonably short amount of time, maybe 10, 15 minutes. And then he offered us a tour of his house. Question. And I recognize that you touched on this in your opening statement, but again, when did you purchase your property? So I purchased the property in 97. And then. But it was an unfinished property, meaning the residents were pigeons and mice. I mean, literally unfinished. I mean, pigeons flying around. So it required extensive building. I wouldn't even say renovations. It didn't have heating or an air conditioning system. It was a raw structure. And you said you didn't move into the property until 2005, correct? That's right. And in between the purchase and the renovations you made, you had no contact with Mr. Epstein whatsoever? Zero. What did you know about Mr. Epstein's priority to this interaction? Answer. I didn't know of him. I don't recall knowing anything about him. Question. You had no understanding of what his job was when you initially met him? Answer. I did not. Not that I recall. Everything I say would be what I recall today. So. Question. And again, you brought this up in your opening statement. But this first interaction, you going to his home for coffee, that's the interaction you described on the Pod Force One podcast, is that right? Answer. Yeah. And I went with my wife next door. He invited my wife and I over to welcome us to the neighborhood, is what my recollection is. Emmer. And for the record, I'm referring to the October 1, 2025, Pod Force 1 podcast that you appeared on as a guest with Miranda Devine, which we'll discuss in more detail shortly. So you have this coffee. What happened next? Answer. He offered, would you like a tour of the house? And we said, sure. And then we had a tour and we went across the hall, where, you know, across from the living room is generally the dining room. And he opened the door and there was a massage table, and I saw his massage table, and that ended the tour. Question. So you did not see the rest of the house. One room is what you're saying, answer one room. That's my recollection. Another investigator jumps in. Mr. Spector, Secretary Lutnick, you mentioned in your opening statement that he demonstrated that Mr. Epstein demonstrated a clear lack of boundaries. I think that was the word that you used. Are you referring to the massage table in that. Lutnick. So we were in the living room. So I saw the living room, and then we went and he opened the door to the room across the hall, which was what I assume would be the dining room, but he opened it and there was a massage table. And his lack of boundaries was what he said. Spectre. What did he say? Lutnik? I asked him why he had a massage table in the middle of his house. This is the best of my recollection. It's not like precisely what he said. This is my general recollection of something that's 21 years ago. So. And I said, how often do you have a massage? And he said, my best recollection is he said, every day and the right kind of massage. And he said it to me and my wife standing next to me, and we looked at each other and we left. Mr. Emmer, for the record, what did you interpret Mr. Epstein to mean when he said the right kind of massage? Answer. That it would become some form of sexual nature. And that's. That's what I assumed it meant. Question. And at this point, did you ask to end the tour or you just said, we're going to leave? I don't remember precisely what we said, but we basically excused ourselves and departed. Question. Did your wife ask Mr. Epstein any questions related to the massage table? I don't recall her speaking. No question. So on the podcast, you said, after seeing the massage table in Mr. Epstein's house and the six, eight steps it took for you and your wife to get back to your house, you decided, and I'm quoting, that I will never be in the room with that disgusting person ever again. Is that an accurate characterization of the statements that you made on the podcast? Answer by Lutnick. That is informal, incomplete discussion that my wife and I had as we walk back, the point of which was when I discussed it with my wife, that I, Howard Ludnick, would not have personal or professional relationship with this person because he obviously doesn't have boundaries. So just avoid him. I should avoid him. And that's what we discussed. It's not verbatim what we said, because this is 21 years ago, but it's. And it's what I did. I avoided that person, and I Believe my colleague may have been asking a similar question. But that feeling that he was disgusting, that was based solely on interaction with Epstein after you saw the massage table and asked him about it, is that right? It was based on the comment that was inappropriate and gross to me and my wife. It was just off putting and we left. It's been reported and we've seen by the files released by the Department of justice that Mr. Epstein decorated his home with creepy and disturbing artwork. Did you notice any unusual artwork at his residence when you visited? The living room, Which I saw did not have anything creepy or unusual in it. You didn't notice any paintings or photos of nude women or girls on it when you visited the property? No, I would have noticed them. So, no. So I want to talk more about your appearance on the Pod Force One podcast and the statements you made. But first, generally, how did this appearance come about? I don't know offhand. You know, it comes from your communications director. They set it up. I don't know. And the topic of Jeffrey Epstein was the first topic during this appearance. Did you know that you would be discussing Jeffrey Epstein when you agreed to go on the podcast? No, I thought I was going to talk about September 11th. So we talked about the statements that you made after seeing the massage table. That guy's gross, disgusting, you'll never be in the room with him again. And you said it was just a one and done. Is that a fair characterization of your statements? No, I think the right way to think about it is, is my wife and I discussed that I would not be in the room with him for professional, philanthropic or social reasons. Meaning don't form the simplest way to say it. Don't form a personal or professional relationship with him. Avoid establishing one because he has no boundaries. Right. He said something inappropriate. Just avoid him. And I did. So that was the discussion with my wife. It was informal. I wasn't trying to be precise. I was trying to have people understand that I. That my wife and I discussed that I would not establish a personal or professional relationship with him and that I did not. Thereafter, I did not question. During the podcast, you dispute any characterization that you implied that after the initial interaction that you would interact with Mr. Epstein. Again, enter. I would the characterization suggesting that I couldn't be in the room that personally, it was a discussion with my wife. That I as a man should avoid being with him because he has no boundaries. And that won't work well for me in my life if I'm with someone with no boundaries. So avoid him. That was the discussion I had with my wife. And I did avoid him. So it was true what I said. It wasn't that I couldn't be if he as the members know often people come to up to you and you know, say hello to you in a big crowd. I wasn't saying that couldn't occur. It didn't occur. But the point I was making is I would not have a personal or professional relationship with him. I would avoid it. And I did avoid it. Question did you interact with Epstein after the initial interaction that you described on the podcast? Answer I said my opening statement. I had two in person interactions with him thereafter over the next 14 years, even though I lived adjacent to him. Two interactions over the next 14 years, both meaningless and inconsequential. You ain't heard about Moto Casino.
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Casino America Social casino Question and we will get into more specifics, but did you visit Epstein's private island? Is that right? Answer I did visit Epstein's private island with my wife and children and another couple and their four children and staff. Yes. Question I want to briefly talk about statements that you made related to and I'm going to your statement was that Epstein had an MO to give massages to influential individuals and that he used blackmail. For the record, that was based not on first hand knowledge. Is that right? Correct. I'm sorry, counsel, would you mind just letting us know where that statement's coming from, Emmer, during the podcast? Thank you, Emer, and I'll be happy to pull out the transcript. Terwalger. No, just curious. Just wanted to make sure that we're tracking where you're pulling the statement from. Thank you. Redacted. We can't hear back here. Lutnick. I was just speculating for a podcast. I had no personal information. I was just speculating for a podcast. Emmer. So for the record, sir, did Jeffrey Epstein ever inform or represent to you that he was part of any intelligence service of any nation, including the United States? No. So how would you characterize your relationship with Mr. Epstein? I had no personal or professional relationship with him. I had two interactions in person that were meaningless and inconsequential. I would say I had no relationship with him. How often did you interact with Epstein in a personal capacity? I met him once in 2005. I had two meaningless and inconsequential other personal interactions. And I tried to think about this as many times as I can, and I cannot think of any others, nor do the documents show any others. Question. Besides the in person interaction, which again, we'll talk about more specifically later, did you email, have phone calls with Mr. Epstein? I don't recall ever having a phone call with Mr. Epstein, and I think I had one set of email interactions with Mr. Epstein personally that went meaning four were written by me to him. But in one effectively one conversation, I mean, I said A, he responded B, I wrote C, he responded D. And I think that there were a total of four in one day, once. Question for the record, you've mentioned the visit to the island, the tour of the town, home. Did you ever visit Epstein's Palm beach home? Answer no. Did you ever visit Epstein's New Mexico ranch? Answer no. Question. His Paris apartment? Answer no. Question. Did you ever visit any property owned or leased by Mr. Epstein? Answer no. Question. Did Mr. Epstein ever invite you to any of his properties? Answer no. Question. Did you ever fly on any of Mr. Epstein's private planes? Answer no. Spectre. And just for clarity on the record, you, you had, besides the two interactions you discussed at Epstein's New York home, did you ever visit that home at any other time that he was not present? Lutnick? No. All right, folks, we're gonna wrap up right here. And in the next episode dealing with the topic, we're gonna pick up where we left off. All the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box. What's up, everyone? And welcome to another episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're getting right back to the Howard Lutnick transcripts from his interview with Congress. Mr. Emmer, question. Did Mr. Epstein ever fly on one of our of one of your private planes? Answer no. Question. Did you ever fly with Mr. Epstein on any aircraft? Answer no. I had no other personal interaction with him, just the three. So I'm happy to say no. But they're by definition no, since I had no personal interaction with them. To the best of your recollection, when was the last time you communicated with Mr. Epstein? It's the one email exchange in 2018. And that's the only one that I know of, actually. Question thank you, Secretary. The committee is also investigating Maxwell. Do you know Ghislaine Maxwell? Answer from the newspapers. Question have you ever met Ghislaine Maxwell? Answer I met her once. Question can you explain to me and the committee when you met her? Answer to the best of my recollection, I met her once. It was at a Rockefeller Institute fundraiser in New York City. Question and what was the nature of your conversation with Ms. Maxwell to the best of your recollection? Enter. Meaningless, inconsequential. Mr. Grant pops in. Do you know roughly what year this meeting would have occurred? LUTNICK I do not. SPECTRE asks a question now, did you know her to be affiliated with Jeffrey Epstein when you met her? LUTNICK no. Question by Mr. Emmer. Who else was present when you met her? Answer well, it was a charity fundraiser for Rockefeller Institute, which is the premier medical research institute and in New York, which is adjacent to New York Hospital. Question thank you, secretary Lutnick. In 2005, police in Palm Beach, Florida began investigating Epstein. In July of 2006, Epstein was arrested for the first time for soliciting prostitution for minors. When did you first learn of Jeffrey Epstein's 2006 arrest? Answer I don't recall whether, when or whether I knew that. So I just had no recollection whether I knew that or not. Spectre Mr. Epstein reportedly had to register as a sex offender after he was convicted of that 2006 offense. Were you ever notified by way of him being your neighbor? Were you ever notified about his status? Secretary Lutnick no. Spectre did you have children under the age of 18 during that time? LUTNICK yeah. EMMER and to be clear, did you ever have any reason to suspect Mr. Epstein was was sexually abusing young women and girls? No. Did anyone around you ever discuss Mr. Epstein's arrest in Florida? Not that I can remember. Secretary Lutnick, you touched on this in your opening statement, but to be clear, you visited Little St. James Epstein's island in December of 2012, is that right? In around, just before Christmas 2012, I visited the island for lunch with my wife, my children, my friends, my friend, his wife, their children and my staff for an hour. I did. I'm not sure I knew the name of it either. Question if I said that your Visit was on December 23rd of 2012, would you dispute that statement? Answer I would not. EMMER at this time, I would like to introduce as Majority Exhibit 1, this is EFTA 2151530 and I'll give you a moment to review question so I'll read it into the record. This is an email from Tuesday, November 20th of 2012 sent by Leslie Groff. The subject line reads Jeffrey Epstein. The email reads, hello, Mr. Lutnick, Jeffrey Epstein understands that you'll be down in St. Thomas over the holidays. Jeffrey requested I please pass along so some phone numbers to you so the two of you could possibly get together. Any numbers you wanted to pass along to Jeffrey would be great as well. I will say it appears that you were the recipient of this email. Do you recall receiving May be helpful for you to understand that if the email says Howard Lutnick or Lutnick Howard, those went to Matthew Gilbert. They didn't go to me. They were not. Meaning I would not, I would never see them. They went to Matthew Gilbert, you know, if they went to me, if they're listed as HWL and because I received hundreds of emails, sometimes thousands, and they went to Matthew Gilbert and I would not see them. So these would have gone to him and I would not have seen them. Question I understand and for the record, that's why Matthew Gilbert would have been the individual who responded to this email. Is that right? Answer. I mean, he would respond sometimes in his name, but he would also respond sometimes to the same email in my name. Question. And you discussed the invite in your opening statement. But I'm going to ask you again, how did your Visit to Little St. James come about? Who coordinated it? What I still cannot Understand is this, November 20th, how or why without any communication for years, would he inexplicably know where I'm going? It's unsettling, actually. But this is how it happened. You know, I don't know why it happened, but what this is, you're actually literally seeing it, how it happened. But it's inexplicable that he would and his staff would know where I was going to be. I had no interactions with them. Question. So to be clear, you didn't reach out yourself to tell Mr. Epstein that you were going to be in the U. S. Virgin Islands over Christmas, Is that right? Answer yes yes, that is correct. I did not in any way contact or have any connection to him. And it would be safe to say that the invite surprised you? I find it unsettling and inexplicable. Who else was involved in coordinating the trip to the island? I have no recollection, so I can't give you more information. I just have no recollection of it. During our review of the documents that have been released, it appeared that your wife may have been in contact with Mr. Epstein's team. Did she ever say anything to you about the island visit? Answer not that I can recall now, no. SPECTRE do you know if anyone on your staff or anyone else close to you had a connection with Mr. Epstein or his staff? I'm just trying to understand how he may have been aware of your travels. LUTNICK Me too. I find it inexplicable and unsettling, and just reading this sort of, it's bothersome. So, no, I don't know. EMMER so you arrive on the island on December 23rd to the best of your recollection. Can you describe the events, what happened when you arrived on the island? LUTNICK sure. So it's 14 years ago. I went for lunch with my wife, my four children, my friends, a couple with their four children and staff and boat staff. So it was probably 15 or 16 people went for lunch. We sat outside, had lunch. It was boring. We left. SPECTRE did this friend and their family that was with you have any prior connection with Mr. Epstein or are they there as your guests and for your visit to your neighbor? LUTNICK they were there as my guests, but I don't know. And I never heard that they had any contact with them whatsoever. SPECTRE Prior or subsequent to the visit? LUTNICK Prior, prior and subsequent. SPECTRE thank you. Question by Emmer Mr. Epstein didn't offer you a tour of the island while you were there? Answer no, other than we walked, I think, like from where we had lunch. There was like this, to the best of my recollection, it was like a cliff. So we went to sort of look at the water. Question what was the nature of your conversation with Mr. Epstein during the visit? Answer, Meaningless and inconsequential. I was with my wife and my children and my friends, another couple and their children. It was a big crowd, and we had lunch and we left. Question Besides the group that you arrive with, who else was present on the island? Answer, Just staff, you know, we were outside under sort of a cover, outside area. That was it.
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10 hours on my feet, traffic noise, everybody needing something from me.
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My head is spinning.
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Question. Did you see any young women or girls on the island? Answer no. Question. And I asked this in the context of the New York townhome, but did you notice any weird or unusual artwork when you visited the island? No, I wasn't inside any building. I don't recall being inside any building. And you never visited the island again, is that right? That's correct. Never. Did you ever hear rumors about the island? Obviously now it has the nickname Pedophile Island. Nothing of that sort prior to or around the time you visited? No, of course not. In 2019 we all learned lots of information, but nothing before then. There's a photo that was released, I believe, in the Epstein file Transparency act and has been reported. Are you aware of the photo of you on the island? Answer yes. And that was. Or what you were describing of looking over the cliff, would it be safe to assume that was when the photo was taken? Yes. It's entirely confirmatory. That photo, had you seen that photo before it was released by the Department of Justice? Lutnick? No question. By Spectre. Did you know it existed? Lutnick? No. Mr. Emmer, at this time I would like to introduce majority exhibit. And these are photos that were released by the Department of Justice as part of the Epstein Files Transparency Act. Lutnick. Majority exhibit number two was marked for identification. Emmer. Question. And for the record, these are images showing multiple mass of different male faces hanging on the walls of a room at Mr. Epstein's island with a dentist chair in the middle of the room. Secretary Lutnick, when you visited Epstein's island, did you see or enter this room? No. Have you seen pictures of the mask before? No. Question. The reason that we introduced this is many people online have speculated that one of the masks resembles you. Specifically the one on the first page in the middle. What's your response to these claims? You gotta be kidding me. That's the most ridiculous and absurd thing I've ever heard. What a bald man. I have hair. Look. I mean, I don't have many, but at least I have some. That is not remotely me. That's nonsense. Thank you. During your visit to the island, did you discuss the company admin solutions with Mr. Epstein? No question. What was Adfin Solutions? It was a company that attempted to create an exchange for online ads. They went out of business. What? You personally an investor in Admin Solutions? Answer, no question. Was Cantor Fitzgerald an investor in Admin Solutions? Answer yes to this. Mr. Twirlinger jumps in. Mr. Emmer, just so the record's clear, I believe there's different redacted. We can't hear over here. Kwilger. Sure. Just so the record's clear, Mr. Emmer, I think you may want to ask which part of counter Fitzgerald. There's multiple subsidiaries. Or the secretary could offer a little bit more information. Which part of Cantor was an investor? Emmer. Which part of Cantor Fitzgerald was an investor? Answer. Cantor Fitzgerald has a subsidiary that did venture capital investing with small investments in many companies in sort of high risk investments. And then those would then have subsidiary companies that might be for each particular investment. It was called Cantor Ventures. And so the company would be called cv. So Cantor Ventures would be cv, but it was a venture capital arm of Cantor Fitzgerald. So sort of multiple layers down the subsidiary chain. Question and the reason that we ask is there was a stock purchase agreement that was released as part of the Epstein File Transparency act that you signed on behalf of C V A, F H and Mr. Epstein signed. Did you know that Mr. Epstein was an investor in this company? Admin Answer no. Question when did you learn that he was an investor? Answer to the best my knowledge, when these documents were released. Best my recollection. Question and would you have been aware of all the investors, whether they were individuals or entities in any of Kenner Fitzgerald's portfolios? Answer no. Of venture capital investments, no. Question. And for the record, had you and Mr. Epstein ever invested in the same company prior to this occurrence? No, not that I know of. Mr. Grant jumps in this signatory page from the investment Advent Solutions. You said you had not seen or I'm sorry, that you. Let me rephrase. It's common for another investor in a VC deal to have the page from another investor. Ludnick know I found it inexplicable and unsettling that he had that it was released that my company signature page would be in someone else's files. It's unsettling, Emmer. And when a stock purchase agreement is executed and the individuals are signing, they're typically not in the same room. Is that right, Lutnick? That is correct, Mr. Grant. And do you have any idea of how Mr. Epstein would have come across that page from Lutnick? No, I find it inexplicable and unsettling. Mr. Emmer, at this time I'd like to introduce Majority Exhibit 3. And this is an email that you are not a recipient of, dated May 4, 2013, from Jeffrey Epstein to David Mitchell discussing ADFIN and a potential meeting between you and Mr. Epstein. Mr. Secretary, do you know who David Mitchell is? Yes. How do you know him? He was the husband of one of my wife's friends. Were you in contact with him during this period of spring 2013? I may have been. When did you understand his relationship to be with Jeffrey Epstein? I don't recall knowing that he had any relationship with Jeffrey Epstein. And what we're specifically interested in here, one, it says, one of the lines says, I think I'm seeing H. Lutnick later. Cool restaurant in Williamsburg. Do you recall meeting Epstein at a restaurant in Williamsburg in May of 2013? Answer, I did not. I mean, this seems to think that David Mitchell was planning on seeing me, not Mr. Epstein. But as I testified, the only times that I recall ever seeing him are the ones that we've gone through already. Mr. Emmer, at this time, I'd like to introduce Majority Exhibit 4. And this is an email chain dated May 28, 2018, between Jeffrey Epstein and a redacted email labeled HWL. It's Batesmarked EFTA 1050772. Lutnick. Majority Exhibit 4 was marked for identification. All right, we're gonna wrap up right here. And in the next episode dealing with the topic, we're gonna pick up where we left off. All the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box.
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