Mega Edition: Johanna Sjoberg's Deposition In The Maxwell/Virginia Roberts Suit (Part 7-10) (5/24/26)

Summary

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The Epstein Chronicles:

Mega Edition – Johanna Sjoberg’s Deposition in the Maxwell/Virginia Roberts Suit

Parts 7–10 (5/24/26)

Released: May 25, 2026 • Host: Bobby Capucci

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Episode Overview

This extended episode of The Epstein Chronicles continues the detailed reading and commentary on Johanna Sjoberg’s full deposition in the civil lawsuit of Virginia Roberts Giuffre vs. Ghislaine Maxwell—one of the central legal battles in the Epstein case. Spanning several hours and broken into numerous sessions, Sjoberg’s deposition provides key firsthand testimony about the inner workings of Epstein's world, her own experiences, and her knowledge of allegations against both Epstein and Maxwell.

Host Bobby Capucci frames this as part of the podcast’s ongoing commitment to transparency and understanding of the case, methodically unpacking the dense legal and personal material for listeners.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Johanna Sjoberg’s Interactions with Epstein and Maxwell

• Sjoberg confirms giving massages to both Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell, with Maxwell paying her what was considered the “going rate” at the time ($200 for Ghislaine, comparable for Epstein).
  “Did Ghislaine pay you when she got a massage from you? Yes. Do you know how much she paid you? …It was the going rate.” (03:03)

• Details about how Epstein became more sexually aggressive over time, and how the escalation caused her discomfort, particularly when he implicitly or explicitly expected sex acts during massage sessions. “He was pressuring me to do more than I was comfortable with doing.” (03:23)

• She clarifies that the things that happened between her and Epstein were when she was a consenting adult and does not have first-hand knowledge of what happened with other women.
  “The things that took place with you and Jeffrey behind closed doors were when you were a consenting adult, correct? Yes.” (04:04)

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2. Observations Around Epstein’s Households & Alleged Crimes

• Sjoberg did not witness sex acts or orgies with underage girls in open areas or in front of her.
  “I did not see anything out in the open sexually. Me, personally, did not see orgies happening in the pool, for example? No.” (05:09)

• Explicitly denies seeing or knowing about child pornography, nude or sexualized photos of minors in any of Epstein’s properties. “Did you see any nude or semi clad photos of young girls? No. Pre teens, for example? No. Something you would consider a child pornography? Never.” (07:10)

• She states most photos she saw were staged or topless, and any photos of herself were taken with her knowledge and consent.

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3. Epstein’s Connections and Social Circle (and Media Name-Dropping)

• Sjoberg recounts famous names that Epstein would mention during sessions—Cate Blanchett, Leonardo DiCaprio, Bruce Willis—but clarifies that she did not meet these people. “He would be on the phone a lot of that time, and one time he said, oh, that was Leonardo. Oh, that was Cate Blanchett or Bruce Willis, that kind of thing. So name dropping? Yes.” (09:30)

• She specifically denies meeting or witnessing Bill Clinton or other high-profile guests on Epstein’s island or in his company.

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4. Recruitment and Expectations

• Sjoberg testifies Ghislaine Maxwell occasionally asked her if she knew any girls to “bring over,” but in Sjoberg’s account, she only ever brought other adults and no sexual acts were involved.
  “Did Maxwell ever ask you to bring other girls over for Jeffrey? Yes. …I brought this one girl that I had worked with at a restaurant... She was an adult.” (44:55)

• She details an incident where Maxwell implied that Sjoberg didn’t “finish her job” during a massage—meaning not bringing Epstein to orgasm—relating this to expectations for sexual acts. “She implied that I had not brought him the orgasm. So is it fair to say that Maxwell expected you to perform sexual acts when you were massaging Jeffrey? …I took that conversation to mean that it was expected of me.” (47:10)

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5. Johanna’s Knowledge of Other Victims and Events

• Sjoberg’s knowledge of Virginia Roberts’ (now Giuffre) allegations stems only from media and after-the-fact conversation, not direct observation. “Do you know whether Virginia has lied about any of her experience… As far as I know, she has [told the truth].” (32:25)

• She expressly states that she never observed Virginia being trafficked, forced, or acting traumatized; everything she believes about Virginia's claims is based on her own experiences and what she read later. “Did you see anything in your interactions with Virginia that led you to believe she was a sex slave? …No.” (20:30)

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6. Famous Guests and Massages

• Although Sjoberg met Michael Jackson in Palm Beach, she did not massage him, and she denies ever massaging Donald Trump, Alan Dershowitz, or other famous guests.
• She explains that Epstein would shift her to massaging guests as she became less amenable to his sexual advances.

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7. Photos, Cameras, and Gifts

• Maxwell gave Sjoberg a camera for a photography class, but made a pointed reference to “not finishing the job,” linking gifts to sexual performance.
• Maxwell asked Sjoberg to take nude photos of herself for Epstein, although Sjoberg never followed through.
  “She asked me to take photos of myself for Jeffrey, yes. And did you do that? I did not.” (48:55)

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8. Media Coverage and Personal Impact

• Sjoberg discusses her experiences with press interviews and misquoting, naming specific reporters and clarifying which stories attributed to her were accurate or exaggerated.
• She was paid $1,500 for her Daily Mail interview, and describes being offered significant money by another unidentified reporter—which she refused.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On Epstein’s expectations:
  “He was always trying to recruit me almost in any way he could so that I could be one of them and…live this life of luxury if I only…did this.” (22:40)
• On not seeing criminal behavior first-hand:
  “I did not see anything out in the open sexually. Me, personally, did not see orgies happening in the pool, for example? No.” (05:09)
• The camera incident:
  “I got a phone call from her and she told me she had a camera for me, for my photography class. But yet she couldn’t give it to me yet because during the massage I didn’t finish my job and she had to finish it for me.” (34:10)
• On Maxwell’s rationale for bringing other women:
  “She said she doesn’t have the time or the desire to pleasure him as much as he needs and that’s why there were other girls around.” (50:25)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Timestamp | Segment | |---|---| | 01:00 | Start of Sjoberg’s deposition recap | | 03:03–07:10 | Payment for massages, escalating sexual expectations, departure from working with Epstein | | 09:30 | Name-dropping of celebrities | | 12:39 | Beginning of discussion around bringing other women and guests | | 20:30 | Sjoberg’s firsthand knowledge and perceptions of Virginia Roberts | | 22:40 | Sjoberg’s view on how Epstein approached her and other girls for sexual acts | | 34:10 | The camera incident and its significance | | 44:55 | Clarification on bringing other women/girls for Epstein or Maxwell | | 47:10–48:55 | Implied expectation for sexual acts and nudity in photographs | | 50:25 | Maxwell’s reasoning for involving other women | | 54:32–56:04 | Sjoberg’s lack of direct knowledge of Virginia Roberts’ abuse claims |

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Tone & Style

• Sjoberg’s tone is matter-of-fact, careful, occasionally reflective, and sometimes self-deprecating about her memory.
• The attorneys’ language is legalistic, with frequent clarifications, objections, and requests for specificity.
• Host Bobby Capucci provides connecting commentary and context, emphasizing transparency and his “leave no stone unturned” approach.

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Conclusion

This extended episode gives listeners a granular look at Johanna Sjoberg’s testimony, exploring what she did and didn’t see in Epstein’s world and exposing the mechanisms of recruitment, expectation, and manipulation that underpinned his criminal enterprise. Sjoberg’s deposition clarifies what she personally witnessed and sets important boundaries about hearsay and rumor within the sprawling Epstein narrative.

To hear next: The podcast will continue with further document analysis, staying true to Capucci’s mission of building a public archive and record of events for the sake of accountability and historical clarity.

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All associated court documents and references are linked in the episode description.

Transcript

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[Johanna Schoberg]

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[Johanna Schoberg]

What's up everyone and welcome back to the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode we're gonna pick up where we left off with the Johannes deposition. So let's get right back to it, shall we? Do you recall meeting with her in about 2006 when she was in town for some helicopter training? I do recall that. Do you recall giving her some massages during that period? Yes. Do you remember going out to dinner with her and to a movie? I remember to a movie. I don't remember if we went to dinner. I remember her cooking dinner. That was another way she impressed me. She knew how to cook like a chef. She had done some culinary training. And you guys had a normal type conversation? Yes. It was very fun. Objection. I would like to take about a 5 to 10 minute break if that's okay. They go to a break and then they're back at 11:25. Right back at it. Hi. I believe when we left off, I was asking you about massages that you gave to Ghislaine. Did Ghislaine pay you when she got a massage from you? Yes. Do you know how much she paid you? I believe it was 200. It was the going rate the same. You were getting paid by Jeffrey, correct? Yes. Ghislaine was not present when you were giving massages to Jeffrey, correct. McCauley? Objection. Correct. some point Jeffrey became more aggressive with you, correct? Correct. Objection. And what does that mean to you become more aggressive? He was pressuring me to do more than I was comfortable with doing. Is that what ultimately caused you to leave working for Jeffrey? What caused me to leave was when it was made public what I was doing. What do you mean by that? Well, after I had spoken with the police report, the police, and there was a police report, I did not realize that was public knowledge journalists would get a hold of. So at one point, The News Channel 12 showed up at my door asking me questions. When Jeffrey was pressuring you to do more than you felt comfortable with, did you observe him being more aggressive in general, outside of the massage context, Macaulay? Objection. No. Do you know whether he was taking any type of steroids? No. Did you ever see him wearing a patch or something like that? I don't recall. Did you tell anyone that Jeffrey was becoming more aggressive with you contemporaneous with when it was happening, McCauley? Objection. No. When Jeffrey asked you to do other things besides a normal massage, did. Did he offer to pay you additionally? Yes. How much? $100 extra. Can I clarify? Absolutely. He didn't ever say he would pay me more, but when the massage was more than just a massage and it was sexual, then he would pay me more. It wasn't a discussion. It's just what happened. Correct. Thank you for clarifying. The things that took place with you and Jeffrey behind closed doors were when you were a consenting adult, correct? Yes. Macaulay. Objection. Correct. And you did not have knowledge of what took place with other women behind closed doors and Jeffrey, correct? Objection. Correct. Do you recall ever giving an interview to a reporter from the Mail on Sunday? Yes. You told that reporter, I believe, that the police report painted a picture that it was a big orgy all the time. But it wasn't what I saw. I did not see anything out in the open sexually. Me, personally, did not see orgies happening in the pool, for example? No. You did not see people engaging in sexual conduct in the open areas of the home, correct? Right. McCauley. Objection. When you became aware of the allegations against Jeffrey, those came as a surprise to you, correct? Objection. Correct. And the surprise was that it involved underage girls making that allegation, correct? Objection. Correct. You were asked some questions with Ms. McCauley about nude photographs that were present in the home or the homes? Yeah. In Palm Beach, I believe you said there were some in the room where the massage table was? Yes. Can you tell me what you recall seeing? It wasn't candid photos. They were all, like, staged. Like a model? Yes. And my I don't recall necessarily knowing any of the people in those photos. I remember at one point there was a photo of myself. But were they fully frontally nude or were they staged, like with, you know, parts of the body showing? I really only remember topless photos. I don't remember full frontal photos. Meninger. So exposing the breasts but not the genitals? Not that I recall. In Ghislaine's bathroom, I believe there was a photo of her topless or a painting. A painting? Uh huh. Did you see any nude or semi clad photos of young girls? No. Pre teens, for example? No. Something you would consider a child pornography? Never. Other than in the bathroom or the massage room at the Palm beach home. Do you recall any other place in the Palm beach home where you saw any of these topless photos of women? I remember there being photos everywhere and the ones that stick out in my memory are the ones there was a photo of Ghislaine with the Pope. It would not surprise me if there were naked photos around. I just didn't retain them in my memory. So when you say there are photos everywhere, you, you mean just photos in general? Yes. They had a lot of photos around the house. Objection. Menninger. And Ghislaine was not topless in a photo with the Pope. Just so I'm clear. Correct. I just want to make sure that we get that record really clear. So you recall there being photos everywhere, you just remember a couple sticking out in your brain as being topless? Yes. And the walls on the staircase to the upstairs were not just covered with nude photographs to your recollection? To my recollection, I just don't remember. Did you observe what you would consider to be child pornography on any computer in the home? No. Did you observe anyone taking photographs of young girls in the home? No. The photograph of yourself that you saw, was that something that you had posed for? Not like professionally, but I was just sitting and I believe Jeffrey took the photo. I was just sitting on a couch upstairs in the bathroom. It wasn't taken by a hidden camera? No, no. I was smiling in the picture. And likewise in the New York home, did you see anything you described as a large painting or a photograph that was in the massage room? Yes. Do you recall any other pictures of semi clad or naked females? I don't recall. Anything that you would consider to be child pornography that you saw in the New York home? No. And likewise in New Mexico? I don't recall. Do you recall seeing any semi clad photos in New Mexico at all? I do not recall. Menninger and the Virgin Islands? Yes. In his bathroom. Master bathroom. And what do you recall, if anything, about that photo? There was a photo of me in there. And again, was that something that you were okay with? Yes. Jeffrey Epstein never told you that he knowingly had sexual contact with an underage girl, correct, McCauley? Objection. When I asked him if the accusations were true, after I spoke with the police, he said yes, but they lied about their age. How did that conversation come about? He asked me if the police had ever spoken to me, and I asked him if it was true. And you were talking about underage girls? Correct. And he said that he had been lied to by those girls? Yes. Did he say anything else to you about it? No. Did you ask him anything else about it? No. Did you attempt to have any conversation like that with Ghislaine Maxwell? No. I saw one press report that said you had met Cate Blanchett or Leonardo DiCaprio. I did not meet them, though when I spoke about them, it was when I was massaging him. And he would get off. He would be on the phone a lot of that time, and one time he said, oh, that was Leonardo. Oh, that was Cate Blanchett or Bruce Willis, that kind of thing. So name dropping? Yes. So you had not met Cate Blanchett or Leonardo DiCaprio? I have not. Would you remember if you had? I would hope I would remember. Did you meet Cameron Diaz? No. Bill Clinton? No. Did you see Bill Clinton on the island? No. Did you see Bill Clinton in a helicopter being flown by Ghislaine Maxwell? No. Did Ghislaine Maxwell ever tell you that she had flown Bill Clinton in her helicopter? Objection. I don't recall her saying that. Did you ever meet Senator. I don't know what he looks like. I might have. If I told you that he was from Maine, would that stick out in your mind? And just to add here, they're obviously talking about George Mitchell. It should, but I don't recall meeting him. Do you ever remember meeting Prime Minister Ehud Barak from Israel? No. Do you recall meeting the Prime Minister or any prime ministers? No. Any foreign presidents? No. Nobel Prize winners? Not to my knowledge. Naomi Campbell? No. Al Gore? No. Alan Dershowitz? No. Les Wexner? No. Tom Pritzker? No. Kevin Spacey? I may have already asked you, but have you met Kevin Spacey? No. Did you meet Governor Bill Richardson of New Mexico? Hmm. I want to say that he was supposed to come to the dinner when we were in New Mexico. I don't know if I met him. I believe that he and Ghislaine had dinner separate from myself. Jean Luc Brunel? Yes. You did meet him? Yes. Tell me about it. He was just in the house at one time in Palm Beach. Socializing? Yes. Did you observe him to be with underage girls? I don't recall. Did you give him a massage? I don't think that I did. I gave a lot of guest massages. I don't remember any of their names, so it could have been any of those people. But besides the movie stars.

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[Johanna Schoberg]

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[Johanna Schoberg]

Visit your nearby Lowes manager. You would know exactly. Manager. And did you engage in sexual contact with any of the guests for whom you gave a massage? No. That's why he would call me for his guests because I was not comfortable with the sexual contact. So he still wanted to employ me as a massage therapist. But it was all normal. Gotta have a little bit of truth sprinkled in with your lie. Right. So this was just an actual conversation that you had? No. But I noticed. I noticed that I wasn't. I wasn't massaging him less and less and massaging his guests more. So there was a change in the Frequency with which you were giving Jeffrey Epstein massages? Right. And an increase corresponding to massages you were giving to guests, Correct? Yes. Did any of the guests for whom you gave a massage mention that they expected something sexual? No. Did they ask you to engage in sexual contact and you refused? Objection. The witness answers no. Back to how about Marvin Minsky? I don't know. George Lucas? No. Donald Trump? No. Did you ever massage Donald Trump? No. Sorry, I have to ask, but did you ever have sex with Alan Dershowitz in the back of a limousine with Virginia and Jeffrey present? Objection. The absolutely not. Do you know who Alan Dershowitz is? Answer. I do. Manager. You would remember. Answer. I would remember that. Manager. Did you ever see Virginia Roberts with any of the people that I just asked you about? No. Did Virginia ever talk to you about having been with any of those people, Ms. McCauley? Objection. No. Menninger, did she tell you that she had met any of those people? No. Alright folks, we're gonna wrap up right there and in the next episode we'll pick up where we left off. All the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box. What's up everyone? And welcome back to the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode we're gonna dive right back into the Johannes deposition and pick up where we left off. I believe you saw in the police report a reference to a friend of Jeffrey named Glenn and his wife. Uh huh. Do you remember them? Vaguely. Tell me what you remember. I remember they had an apartment in on Breakers Row. I went up there and massaged. It may have been more than once, but I only really remember one time. But there was nothing sexual, neither with the wife nor with Glen. Right. Do you remember the apartment? I only remember that I had to carry my massage table up some stairs. So you actually gave the massage on a massage table? Yes. Does that help you place it in time as to when that might have occurred? Did you get your massage license at some point and a massage table? Objection. Back to yes. He bought me my massage table a around the time that I went to massage school. So it could have been anytime after that. If I thought really hard, I could remember when I went to school. But I want to say it's around 2003. Nothing sexual happened with Glenn? No. Did Glenn ask you to give him a massage on the floor of the home? I don't recall. Did you ever discuss Glenn with Virginia? Not to my recollection. Did you ever go to Virginia's home? No. Do you know where she lived? No. Did she talk about it? Not that I remember. Did you see anything in your interactions with Virginia that led you to believe that she was a sex slave? McCauley? Objection. No. Did you see anyone forcing her to remain in the home? No. Did you see her look traumatized at some point? Objection. No. Did you see anything that led you to believe Virginia Roberts had been trafficked, sexually trafficked to a third party? McCauley? Objection. No. Did Virginia ever tell you that she had been trafficked? No. Objection. Did you hear anyone direct Virginia Roberts to go have sex with someone? No. Did Jeffrey ever ask you to go have sex with another person? No. Did Glenn Maxwell ever ask you to go have sex with another person? No. Did Glenn Maxwell ever ask you to give a massage to someone else? No. Did Ghislaine Maxwell ever ask you to dress up in any outfits? No. Did she ever buy you an outfit for you to wear in terms of a sexual profile? No. Did she tell you what kind of clothes you should buy? No. Did she direct you to go get Brazilian bikini waxes? No. Did she direct you to go get your teeth whitened? No. I would like to mark as an exhibit, I have no recollection what number we're on. Exhibit 5. The referred to document was marked by the court reporter for identification as Schoberg Exhibit 5. Have you seen this article before? It has followed me everywhere. McCauley. I'm sorry. Can I just ask you to put the Bates number on the record? Sure. It's Bates marked Roberts 1131 3. What do you mean that it has followed you everywhere? Well, if you Google me, it comes up. I wanted to just ask you a couple of questions. On the third page, towards the bottom, there is a photograph that begins, we had a picture taken. And just to orient you, this is in the discussion around the Prince Andrew meeting you had. Did Prince Andrew at any other time besides the time you already described in your testimony? No. Menninger, if you want to take a look at the paragraph before I ask you a question. Ok. Menninger. In that paragraph, it describes that Andrew sat on the chair and then Andrew sat on another chair and you sat on his lap. McCaulay. Objection. Is that what it says? That's what it says. Do you recall telling that to the reporter? Yes. And this was back in 2007 or so? Yes. As you sit here today, does that make it. Does that refresh your recollection that Virginia was sitting in one chair and you were sitting in another with Andrew? Yeah. If I said that, then I remember it that way. I'm Just trying to remember whether we were on a couch or on a chair. I just remember the boobs part, the hand on the boobs. I understand that that part stands out. And I also completely understand if you don't remember things that happened a long time ago. Right. I'm just wondering if, having looked at this news article, it refreshes your memory that Virginia was sitting in a different place in a different chair. Does. Does say that. Does it refresh my memory? Ok, that's fine. Yeah, sure. If it doesn't, it doesn't. I'm just asking. Did Virginia say anything to you about having met Prince Andrew before this time in New York? She did not say. Did Prince Andrew say or do anything that led you to believe that he had met Virginia prior to that time? I don't recall. Did you ever see Al Gore on the island? No. Did you ever see his wife, Tipper Gore, on the island? No. What is your understanding of what the lawsuit we are here today is about? I understand that Ghislaine is calling Virginia a liar, and so Ghislaine is suing Virginia. I'm sorry, strike that. Reverse it. Right. Virginia is suing Ghislaine for defamation. And do you know what Virginia said about Ghislaine? That Ghislaine recruited her. Do you know anything else that Virginia said about Ghislaine? Only what was spoken to me. And I should clarify. Don't tell me anything your lawyer has conveyed to you. Exactly. That's all I know. I've met with Virginia once last summer. Ok, tell me about that. She. There was a moderator between us, like an investigator, and she was in Palm beach, and it was about Jeffrey. It was less about Ghislaine. I don't remember specifically about Ghislaine at all. So you met with Virginia and an investigator at the same time? Yes. And they were, what, talking to you about Jeffrey in context, McCauley. Objection. Basically, they were trying to find people that would help her get her story out, because this is when Dershowitz. Dershowitz was saying nothing was happening and he was calling her a liar, and she was just trying to find people to back up her story. And what did you understand her story to be? Did she tell you that she was recruited to give massages, sexual massages, and have sex with people such as Dershowitz and Andrew? But I knew none of that at the time. Did you tell them anything? Did you tell them during that meeting that you knew of anything about her being recruited to give sex to either Jeffrey or other people? McCauley Objection. Can you rephrase? Yes. That wasn't a very good question. What did you say during this meeting with Virginia and her investigator? Basically, that I believed her, even though I. She never spoke to me specifically about what was going on. That once I learned everything that had happened based on reading the police report, I believed her side of the story. And did she tell you what her side of the story was? You know, it's just that she wasn't a liar. That, you know, she was there to have sex with men that Jeffrey wanted her to sleep with. Did she tell you in that meeting who she had sex with? No. Did she name any of the famous people? Only Dershowitz came up. Did you two talk about the incident in New York with the puppet? I don't recall. And you formed this opinion about whether she was a liar based on things that you've read and the police report? McCauley. Objection. I form my opinion based on my experience in the house. Okay. And what experience in the house helped you form your opinion that what Virginia is saying is true? You know, Jeffrey being open with me about what other girls did for him and that I was not one of those girls. He was always trying to recruit me almost in any way he could so that I could be one of them and. And travel with them and live this life of luxury if I only. If I only did this. So after five years of learning what was happening, I can look back, knowing I only know Virginia for a very short time. Looking back, I can make assumptions about what was required of her. Did she tell you how old she was when she started working with Jeffrey? She didn't. Did she tell you how long she had worked with Jeffrey? No. Have you read all the things that have been attributed to her in the press? Many of them. Objection. I don't know what. I've read all of them, but I've read some. In this meeting with Virginia and the investigator, you said Ghislaine Maxwell did not come up. Not that. Not that I recall.

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[Johanna Schoberg]

Visit your nearby Lowe's. Manager do you know the name of the investigator? Answer. Valerie Rivera. Have you read the statement that Ghislaine Maxwell issued to the press? No. Do you know what it says? No. You said you have read some of Virginia's statements to the press, but not all of them. I don't know how many there are. I know I read something. I don't know if I read them all. Have you read her book manuscript? No. Objection. Did she tell you she was writing a book? No. Did she tell you she was trying to get a book deal? Objection. No. Did she tell you that she hired a ghostwriter? No. Did she tell you she hired a literary agent? McCauley? Objection. No. Did you speak with John Connolly? Yes. When did you speak with John Connolly? He was first calling me around the time that everything was coming out in 2006. I didn't say a lot to him, but I did say a few things and I asked him not to use my name and he used my name and then he quoted me as saying things that I never said. And do you know who he quoted things that you have never said to? I don't remember the news outlet? No. So it was published somewhere? Somewhere on the Internet. Something that you said to John Connolly got twisted? Yes. He put words in my mouth and it was misreported and published. McCauley? Correct. Have you spoken to him lately? No. He called me again at the beginning of last year, around New Year's last year, but I did not return his call. Do you recall what it is he attributed to you falsely? It was mostly about how I felt about certain things. I don't remember specifically what he said, but he was Giving an opinion for me that I never spoke to him about. And you did not hold? Well, I can't remember what it was. Yeah. Okay. Do you know whether Virginia has lied about any of her experience, McCauley? Objection. I don't know that she has lied. Do you know that she has told the truth? As far as I know, she has. Do you know whether the press has accurately reported everything that Virginia has said? I don't know. Other than John Connolly and the police, who else have you spoken to about your experience? Well, the woman from the Daily Mail. Her name is Wendy Lee. And that's Defendants Exhibit five. Not Defendants Exhibit, just Exhibit five. Correct? Correct. Did Wendy Lee accurately report your statements? She did. A little bit of embellishment as well, but the facts are all true. And what parts do you believe are embellished? Near the end, when she was doing a summary, when she wrote, sure, I had a good time, but I also think it damaged me a bit. I don't recall saying that. And there's another part in there where she said, I said that I made a deal with the devil, which I never would have said that the word she used, manager. On page two of eight. It's about. It's about. Even with the hem of your skirt. I made a pact with the devil in exchange for excitement and glamour. I was only a college student. I was hard up and foolish that I never said any of that. I was a college student. That's true. Hard up and foolish. I would never have called myself foolish. Were you paid for this? I was paid $1,500. And how long did the interview last? A couple of hours. Where did it take place? At Cafe Boulod in the Brazilian Court Hotel in Palm Beach. Who else besides Wendy Lee and John Connolly and the police? Objection. And Virginia and the investigator, McCauley? Objection. Did you talk to about your experiences, family and friends? Did you speak to any other reporters? I had other reporters calling me. I avoided most of all their calls. I had someone coming at me, stalking me. I don't know who he was. He offered me $25,000 to give a story.

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And?

[Johanna Schoberg]

And I turned him down. Who? He showed up at my work multiple times. There were other stories printed in the Daily Mail, but not by Wendy Leigh later. Did you see any of those stories? I'm sorry, let me be a little clearer. They attributed comments to you. I don't recall specifically, but I feel like I stayed on top of it and I wasn't surprised when my name was brought up. Do you recall giving another interview no, never. Do you recall saying anything that was printed other than John Connolly thing that you believe to be inaccurate? No. Was there anybody else present when you were interviewing with Wendy? No. Was she recording it on a recorder? Yes. Have you ever heard that recording? No. Do you know whether the police were recording their interview with you? Yes. Have you heard that recording? No. Alright, we're gonna wrap this episode up right here. And in the next episode we'll pick up where we left off. All of the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box. What's up, everyone? And welcome back to the Epstein Chronicles. We left off with Menninger asking questions about the interview with Wendy Lee. So we're gonna pick up right there. Do you know whether the police were recording their interview with you? Yes. Have you ever heard the recording? No. Did you ever receive notification that you were named as a victim in any of Jeffrey Epstein's criminal cases? No. Other than the $1,500 from Wendy Lee, did you receive any other money for making any statements? No. Did you give an interview to Virginia's attorneys? Yes. You can say yes. When was that? Two weeks ago. Roughly. And who was present during that meeting? My lawyers and several others. Several other what? Lawyers. I don't know. I don't know who they all are. So, McCauley, you recall being there? Yes. Manager. Ms. Schultz, you recall being there? No, I didn't learn it. No. You weren't there. Brad Edwards? Yes. Next one. Paul Cassell? Maybe. I don't remember. And was that interview recorded? I don't know. It may have been. I don't remember. Did anyone ask your permission to record it? Maybe. I don't recall. Were you shown any documents during that meeting? Flight logs, any other documents? No. What did Ms. McCauley or Mr. Edwards or any of the other lawyers say to you about Ghislaine Maxwell? They just asked. They never said anything about her. Were you shown a copy of any report that came out of the interview? Which interview, Manager? The one with Virginia's attorneys. No. You testified earlier about an incident with a camera that Ghislaine Maxwell had given you. I want to ask you some questions about that. Sure. Do you know when that was? That was? In 2002. And why does that date stick out? Because I was living where I was living specifically and where I had the phone call. Tell me what you remember about the conversation. I had been over to the house prior messaging Jeffrey, and I got a phone call from her and she told me she had a camera for me, for my Photography class. But yet she couldn't give it to me yet because during the massage I didn't finish my job and she had to finish it for me. Did she say what she meant? No, but I knew. Was there any other time that you had discussed with her finishing your job? Not that I recall. Any other time you just recall discussing with her anything about your sexual contact with Jeffrey? Objection. No. Did she give you the camera? I did get the camera. Okay. When did she give you the camera? I guess the next time I went to the house. And what was said at that time? I honestly don't know that she handed it to me. I remember it being there for me. What kind of camera was it? A Canon Rebel 35mm. Do you still have it? I do not. No one uses 35mm anymore. What's that? No one uses 35mm anymore. Back to the cell phone conversation and. Right. Was it your birthday? It was just. I was taking a photography class and I needed a camera. Do you know her to be a photographer? Not a professional, but I knew she was interested in photography. Did you see her with a camera? Yes. Did you see her taking photographs of nude people? No. Did she ever ask you to take a photograph of a semi clad or naked? Did she ever ask to take a photo of me semi clad or naked? No. Did she ever ask to take a photograph of you at any point? I don't remember. Did you tell anyone else about this conversation? You couldn't give it to me now because I hadn't finished my job? No. I think I'm going to reserve the rest of my time for recross. So you all, I guess, can take a break. Mr. Lewis, can I have one second? Sure. We can go off the record. Off the record. At 12:09 after the recess they come back and it looks like Menninger has some more questions. Sorry, just a couple more questions. It sounds like there may have been an additional telephone conference that one might construe as a meeting with attorneys. Is that true? Correct. Alright, tell me about that. They just wanted to. We had met prior and they just wanted to clarify a few things and ask a few more questions. Okay, what did they clarify? Any other specific times that I had, you know, seen Ghislaine naked or if I had, you know, had any sexual massages with her, Any type of questions like that? Okay. And what did you tell them about having any sexual massages with Ghislaine? That I was not asked to do. To perform anything with her. And you did not? Correct. And what did you Tell them about specific times of seeing Ghislaine naked. Only when she would swim or get a massage. And that swimming you mentioned earlier. Skinny dipping. Correct. And I think you said perhaps some other time that you saw her jump off a dock and swim. Correct? Yes. In the nude? Yes. And then you saw her under a towel during massages? Yes. Is there any other time you recall seeing Ghislaine Maxwell naked? No. Is there anything else about that telephone conference with the attorneys to clarify that you recall the topics? No. Alright, thank you. I think we can go off the record now. And when they come back, it's Sigrid McCauley now recrossing Joana Schoberg. So let's get right to it. Macaulay. Johanna, I'm going to ask you a couple of questions and their follow up questions. When Laura was talking to you, she mentioned some names of famous people that you most of which you had not met. Did you ever meet anybody famous when you were with Jeffrey Epstein? Michael Jackson. Oh, really? And where was that? At his house in Palm Beach. At Jeffrey's house in Palm Beach. Did you massage him? I did not. Anybody else you remember? I know you mentioned David Copperfield earlier. Anybody else? No, I remember that. I believe you also testified that you had never had a massage before you started working with Jeffrey and Ghislaine. Is that correct? I don't recall having a massage before then. And I think you said on the first day when you were doing the clerical work, Maxwell mentioned that you might be able to get a massage. Is that correct?

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[Johanna Schoberg]

Visit your nearby Lowe's.

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[Johanna Schoberg]

Visit your nearby Lowe's. Yes. Did you tell Maxwell that you had never had a massage at that point? I don't remember. Did you remember telling Jeffrey that you had never had a massage? No. And then when you were talking about the massage, the first massage, when you were being in the room with Geoffrey and Emmy. Uh huh. And I know you said that Emmy was naked or took off her clothes at some point. Uh huh. And then you laid on the table and then you changed positions with her. Is that what happened? Yes. I don't remember the sequence, but at one point she was, I was, and Jeffrey was. And in the. In the time when there was a changeover, for example, when you're on the table and Emmy is not on the table and Jeffrey is not on the table, did Emmy at that point remain naked or did she actually stop and get dressed and continue massaging? I don't recall her getting dressed, but I would probably remember if she massaged naked. Do you know if Jeffrey remained naked during his massage? He was never like, naked standing up. He always covered himself with a towel. I believe I asked this, but I just want to clarify to make sure that I did. Did Maxwell ever ask you to bring other girls over to or for Jeffrey? Yes. Yes. Yes. And what. Did you. Did you do anything in response to that? I did bring one girl named. No, Redacted. It was some girl named Redacted that I had worked with at a restaurant. And I recall Ghislaine giving me money to bring her over. However, they never called her to come. And then I believe you mentioned that one of your physical fitness instructors. You brought a physical fitness instructor, Was that correct? Correct. And what did she do? She gave him like a training session. Twice. McCauley. Twice. Did anything sexual in nature happen during the session? At one point, he lifted up her shirt and exposed her bra, and she grabbed it and pulled it down. Macaulay. Anything else? That was the conversation that he had told her that he had taken this girl's virginity. The girl by the pool. Okay. Did Maxwell ever say to you that it takes the pressure off of her to have other girls around? She implied that, yes. Macaulay. In what way? Sexually. And earlier, Laura asked you, I believe, if Maxwell ever asked you to perform any sexual acts. And I believe your testimony was no. But then you also previously stated that during the camera incident that Maxwell had talked to you about not finishing the job. Did you understand not finishing the job and meaning bringing Jeffrey to orgasm? Objection. Leading in. I'm sorry, Johanna, let me correct that question. What did you understand Maxwell to mean when she said you hadn't finished the job with respect to the camera? Objection. Leading in form. She implied that I had not brought him the orgasm. So is it fair to say that Maxwell expected you to perform sexual acts when you were massaging Jeffrey? Objection. Leading form and foundation. Johanna, I can. Yes. I took that conversation to mean that it was expected of me. And then you mentioned, I believe, when you were testifying earlier, that Jeffrey told you a story about sex on the plane. What was that about? Objection. Hearsay. He told me one time, Emmy was sleeping on the plane and they were getting ready to land and he went up and woke her up. And she thought that he meant he wanted a blowjob. So she started to unzip his pants and he said, no, no, no, no, no. You just have to be awake for the landing. Do you recall witnessing any sexual acts on the plane? No. Did Emmy ever talk to you about performing sexual acts on the plane? No. We looked earlier at the police report and I just want to clarify. You identified some areas where there were discrepancies in that report, and you can take another look at it if you want. But other than the discrepancies you pointed out, is that a recollection of what you remember telling the detective? Yes. Objection. Outside the scope of cross mentioned that there was a time when you noticed that Maxwell was around a little bit less. Uh huh. And I believe you said that was during the middle of the time you were with Jeffrey. Do you remember approximately when that was? Year wise? I don't. I would say it was probably sometime between 2003 and 2004. And what made you think that? I just saw her less and less at the house. Were you there more at the house during that time period? No, not necessarily. It's just at the beginning she was around a lot and then I would see her occasionally without him. The one time we spent a few days together in 2006, she wasn't there at all. So you saw her in the. Is it fair to say that you saw her in the 2005, 2006 time frame? Yes. Then we were talking about the Photography. Earlier, about the photographs, did Maxwell ever ask you to take nude photos of yourself for Jeffrey? She asked me to take photos of myself for Jeffrey, yes. And did you do that? I did not. And the photos that were around that were in the bathroom that you mentioned a couple of times, places that were photos of you. Who took those? He did. Macaulay. And you were talking about the Palm beach house and describing an area where there were just a lot of photographs. Is it fair to say that there could have been nude photographs amongst those photos that you saw? Answer yes. Alright, folks, we're going to wrap this one up right here. And in the next episode, we'll pick up where we left off. All of the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box. What's up, everyone? And welcome back to the Epstein Chronicles. We're going to pick up where we left off with the Johannes Sjoberg deposition. So let's just get right back to it, Macaulay. And earlier you testified that you don't have any knowledge of what happened behind closed doors. But you also said that Jeffrey had told you what other girls did for him and that he wanted you to do those things for him. Is it fair to say that you knew that other girls were performing sexual acts? Yes. Menninger. Objection. Foundation form. And I know you mentioned previously that your relationship and interaction with them progressed over time. Did there come a time when you were expected to have sexual intercourse with Jeffrey? Yes. And when was that? 2005. That's it. I just do want to also put on the record that we're designating the testimony as confidential under the protective order, further examination by Ms. Menninger. Meninger. Okay. You just testified that you have knowledge. You had knowledge that of what Jeffrey was doing behind closed doors with other girls. Was that your testimony? Answer Based on what he had told me. Okay. So Jeffrey told you things that he had done with other girls? Answer yes. You did not observe any of those things? Answer no. Did not talk to any of those girls about what they had done with Jeffrey behind closed doors. Objection. Manager. Correct. Correct. The only source of knowledge you have is based on what Jeffrey told you he had done with other girls. Correct. To this, McCauley objects, you said that there were possibly nude photos amongst the other photos that you saw on various walls at the Palm beach house, correct? Correct. None of them appeared pornographic? No. You didn't see any fully frontally nude photographs, correct? No, not that I recall. And you don't recall seeing any girls that appeared to be underage, correct? No. You said Ghislaine asked you to take photos of yourself for Jeffrey, correct? Correct. Did she ask you to take any nude photographs for yourself or just a photograph of yourself? A nude photograph of myself. What exactly did she say to you? I don't remember exactly. But I know that I never felt comfortable. I would have felt fine taking photos of myself, my face. But I knew I was never comfortable with it because I had to take photos of my body. And I also didn't know how to take a photo from standing behind. You have to have someone else involved. That's my question. How would you take a nude photograph of yourself? Exactly. Someone else would have to do it. Do you recall any of the particulars of what she said to you that led you to believe she wanted you to do that? No, just asking for the photos. Do you know when in your time there? It was near the beginning because that's when I was interested in the photography. Was it in the context of your discussion of your photography class? No. Was it in the context of anything about the camera she had bought for me? What did she say in relationship to the camera that she bought for you and taking photographs of you? Just that Jeffrey would like to have some photos of me and she asked me to take photos of myself. What did you say? I don't remember saying no. But I never ended up following through. I think I tried once. This was the pre selfie era, correct? Exactly. I want to go back to this. You testified to two things just now with Sigrid that you said were implied to you. Okay. The first one was it would take pressure off of Maxwell to have more girls around, Right. What exactly did Maxwell say to you that led you to believe that was her implication? She said she doesn't have the time or the desire to pleasure him as much as he needs and that's why there were other girls around. And did she refer specifically to any of the other girls? No. Did she talk about underage girls? No. Was she talking about massage therapists? Not specifically. Okay. There were other girls in the house that were not massage therapists, correct? Yes. Nadia is another person that was around, correct? Yes. There were other people she traveled with? Uh huh. McCauley? Objection. Manager. Correct. Correct. Other girls? Yes. Adult yes. When I say girl, I really mean woman, correct? Correct. There were other women around who hung out with Jeffrey and you don't know what they did behind closed doors, correct? Correct. So when you heard the implications that she wanted other girls around to take the pressure off of her sexually, in your mind, that meant other adult women that she had in her life, correct. McCauley? Objection. Correct. Doing what I was expected to do in a massage, you know. And Ghislaine didn't have anything to do with you bringing this woman over for a physical workout with Jeffrey, Correct? Correct. She asked you to bring another girl to be to perform massages at the home? Yes. Well, she was always asking if I knew anyone else, and so I brought this one girl that I didn't even know. I worked with her at a restaurant, so I didn't care what she thought of me if anything happened. And so. But it never turned into anything. She was an adult. She was an adult working at a restaurant with you? Yes. What restaurant was that? It's a restaurant that's closed. It's called redacted. Were asked about the famous people you said you met? Michael Jackson? Yes. But you did not give him a massage? No. There were other famous people perhaps who were around Jeffrey's home that you didn't meet, Correct? Correct.

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[Johanna Schoberg]

Menninger do you know Whether Virginia Roberts has told the truth about the age she was when she met Ghislaine Maxwell. McCauley exceeds scope of the cross. I don't have any idea what she told them in terms of her age. Do you know if Virginia Roberts is telling the truth about whether she spent her sweet 16th birthday with Jeffrey and Ghislaine Maxwell? Objection. I don't know anything about that. Do you know whether Virginia Roberts is telling the truth about whether Ghislaine Maxwell sexually assaulted her on her first day on the job? McCauley? Objection. I have no knowledge of that. Do you have any knowledge of whether Virginia is telling the truth about Virginia. Excuse me, about Ghislaine Maxwell forcing Virginia Roberts to go down on her? McCauley. Objection. No knowledge. Do you have any knowledge about whether Virginia Roberts is telling the truth about whether Ghislaine Maxwell forced her to participate in orgies with other women? Ms. Objection. No. Do you have any knowledge about whether Virginia Roberts is telling the truth about whether Ghislaine Maxwell directed her to have sex with Prince Andrew? Ms. McCauley. Objection. No. Only based on what I've read in the media. Menninger and Alan Dershowitz. McCauley. Objection. Witness the same Menninger prime ministers. McCauley. Objection. Schoberg? No. Do you have any knowledge about whether Virginia Roberts is telling the truth about foreign presidents? Ms. McAuley. Objection. The no knowledge. Do you know whether Virginia Roberts is telling the truth about Ghislaine Maxwell forcing her to participate in an orgy with Prince Andrew and other underage girls on the island? Objection. No knowledge. Did Ghislaine Maxwell ever ask you to have her baby? Macaulay? Objection. Schoberg. No. Menninger. No further questions. McCauley, thank you for your time. We are done. McCauley. We are off the record. Videographer. The time is 1:11. This concludes the video deposition. Off the record. Alright, folks, so that's going to conclude our look at the Johanna Schoberg deposition. And obviously with all the documents that are dumping and have been dumped, we have our work cut out for us. So, like when you're eating any elephant, you just got to eat it one bite at a time. And that's what we're going to continue to do. We'll continue to add these documents to the catalog so that they're available to you all and so that all of you have the context that's necessary to understand what in the hell happened here and what in the hell is still happening here. All right, folks, that's going to do it for this one. All of the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box.

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I drive my bus in a busy city. That's why road safety is so important to me. I know that I must slow down and be extra careful when I make a wide turn. Buses need more room than cars. Everyone can help keep our roads safe. Next time you're driving, remember to give buses plenty of time and space to finish turning before driving ahead. Let's all plan to share the road safely. Learn how at www.sharetherodesafely.gov.