Mega Edition: The Testimony Of The Electrical Engineer From MCC (5-8) (7/25/26)

Summary

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The Epstein Chronicles – Mega Edition: The Testimony of the Electrical Engineer from MCC (5-8)

Podcast: The Epstein Chronicles
Host: Bobby Capucci
Episode Date: July 25, 2026
Episode Focus: In-depth breakdown of the interview/testimony given by the MCC (Metropolitan Correctional Center) electrical engineer to Office of Inspector General (OIG) investigators regarding prison infrastructure, surveillance failures, and events surrounding Jeffrey Epstein’s death.

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Episode Overview

In this extended episode, Bobby Capucci continues his thorough investigation into the circumstances surrounding Jeffrey Epstein’s death at MCC. The central focus is the testimony of the prison’s electrical engineer, who was responsible for surveillance cameras and security system maintenance. The engineer’s interview with OIG reveals in detail the technical failures, vulnerabilities, and staff access related to the surveillance infrastructure on the night Epstein died. The episode also delves into reactions and actions taken by staff and inmates in the immediate aftermath.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Camera & Surveillance System Failures

• FBI Video Recovery Efforts:

  • The FBI attempted to recover footage but, according to the engineer, took all hard drives and recording hardware (00:50).
  • Despite these efforts, they found files labeled as "corrupt"—meaning the files existed but could not be opened or viewed (01:27).
  • Quote: “So if they say it was corrupt and it was unable to be retrieved, what does that mean in layman's terms? … There’s no video. It’s probably garbage.” (01:10)

• Explanation of ‘Corrupt’ Video Data:

  • The engineer explained that sometimes systems appear to record when they’re not functioning, and "corrupt" simply means non-usable files—could appear as recorded files but are empty/garbled (01:50).

• Access to Surveillance System:

  • System access required a password. Most lieutenants, the warden, SIS (Special Investigative Services), and the electrical engineer had access. Central office or external access was denied; the system was on a closed network (02:28).

• Manipulation of Video:

  • The newer system could not simply be manipulated remotely; manual intervention was required for older hardware (02:55).

• Camera Functionality on August 9-10:

  • When the engineer left on August 9, specific cameras were down. Upon return on August 10, the same cameras remained inactive—no new failures observed (03:20).
  • Quote: “It’s the same area cameras that went down. It’s the same recorder.” (03:40)

• Preservation of Evidence:

  • After the incident, the engineer was the first back into the evidence room; he observed no signs of tampering (04:16).

2. Phone System & Call Logs

• Engineer’s Role in Phone System:

  • Maintained the phone switch (PBX) and checked logs after the incident at the warden's request (05:18).

• Finding Relevant Call Logs:

  • Confirmed a phone call was made on the tier where Epstein was housed, believed during a shower period (05:39).
    • Only a log (not a recording) existed, as legal calls are not recorded for privacy reasons (06:10).
    • Inmate calls are recorded; staff-to-staff or administrative calls are not (06:40).
    • Retention of these logs lasted “probably like a month” (07:00).

3. The Morning of Epstein's Death: Scene Response

• Timeline of Engineer’s Movements:

  • Left shift on August 9 at ~2-3pm, returned at 6am on August 10 (13:50).
  • Upon arrival, heard a body alarm on 9 South and proceeded upstairs (13:45).

• Scene Description:

  • Arrived as one of the first responders, witnessing Officer Thomas and others moving Epstein to a stretcher (14:30).
  • Began chest compressions once Epstein was on the stretcher; AED was used but reportedly did not help (15:13).
  • Epstein described as wearing orange boxers and t-shirt with visible bruising around the neck (16:05).
    • Quote: “I did see his neck was a little bit bruised, though.” (16:35)

• Inmate Reactions:

  • Inmates accused officers of failing to make rounds and hence being responsible for Epstein’s death (voice in cell: “You killed him. You weren’t making rounds!”) (18:40).

• Scene Security and Evidence Collection:

  • Initially, the cell was not secured; by the time the engineer returned post-medical, it was locked and treated as a crime scene (40:15).

4. Technical & Administrative Follow-Up

• Work Orders & Camera Upgrades:

  • Chronic camera/recorder issues were documented over the year preceding Epstein’s death (45:00).
  • Upgraded system hardware had arrived at the jail, but installation had not occurred prior to the incident; new redundant drives installed immediately after (47:50).

• Internal Communication:

  • Problems with hardware were well-known within the institution; notifications of failures were routinely passed to facilities management (48:40).

• No Signs of Outside Tampering:

  • Engineer believed no unauthorized individuals accessed the surveillance or went near evidence files (41:35).

• Investigator’s Final Questions:

  • The episode ends with a reflective commentary on the need for improved maintenance and training at BOP facilities.
    • Quote: “I just wish the Bureau would be more proactive as far as maintenance and buying new stuff… train the staff.” (54:35)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the lack of footage:

  • “There’s no video. It’s probably garbage.” – Electrical Engineer (01:10)

• On inmates’ accusations toward guards:

  • “You killed him. You weren’t making rounds. You guys got to get a new job. You guys are done.” – Reporting what inmates yelled at COs (18:45)

• On the state of Epstein upon discovery:

  • “He had his orange boxers and an orange T-shirt... his neck was a little bit bruised.” – Engineer (16:15)

• On institutional failures:

  • “There was only one camera in a housing unit… I just kept saying, hey, you guys gotta do something. This is the problem. God forbid this is what happened.” (54:10)

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Important Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment | |-----------|---------| | 00:50 | FBI attempts to recover video/hard drives taken | | 01:27 | Explanation on corrupt files/no retrievable video | | 02:28 | Breakdown of network access to cameras | | 05:18 | Phone system and discovery of phone call logs | | 13:45 | Engineer returns to work & body alarm triggered | | 14:30 | Engineer one of first at Epstein’s cell | | 16:05 | Description of Epstein’s condition and bruising | | 18:40 | Inmate accusations toward officers (“You killed him…”) | | 40:15 | Securing the crime scene/cell post-incident | | 45:00 | Work orders and chronic camera/recorder issues documented | | 54:10 | Criticism of BOP maintenance/training | | 54:35 | “I just wish the Bureau would be more proactive…” | | 56:13 | Interview concludes; host’s wrap-up |

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The Episode in Context

This "Mega Edition" offers a rare technical and procedural window into the infamous night of Epstein’s death. The engineer’s grounded responses illuminate not just the mechanical failures, but also the bureaucratic inertia and infrastructural chaos surrounding the tragedy. The insights reinforce both suspicions of systemic incompetence and dispel conspiracy regarding external tampering by underlining routine, chronic issues with prison equipment and staff training. Throughout, the tone maintains the show's “no punches pulled” ethos—methodical, skeptical, yet rooted in testimony and hard evidence.

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For listeners seeking even greater detail, consult the episode description for referenced documents and additional context.

Transcript

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Question but there's no way it was recorded. So if they say it was corrupt and it was unable to be retrieved, what does that mean in layman's terms? Answer there's no video. It's probably garbage. Question but there's nothing. Does that just mean that there's no recording? Why would they use the word corrupt? Answer because it's pretty much, you know, a computer is like 1 to 0. So probably when they finally get to that they couldn't retrieve anything. Nothing like you could see or make tangible, like no real video. Questions so that's two different things, right? It's not like they didn't retrieve anything. It just means they found the file, they couldn't open it. Answer they couldn't see it. Yes. Question that means something recorded. Answer not necessarily. It could be garbage. Garbage can record and you think that's a good thing, but it's not a good thing. It says it was recording. That's why I say that when a camera is good or bad, like I can have a camera that just looking at this and you're saying okay, it's good, but it's not looking at the whole room. This is nothing. This is garbage. It doesn't. The camera just knows it's working until I fix it and then it records the whole room. Then you know it's working. Question when you went in on the 10th to take a look at the video, did you actually see the recording files or did you not see any files at all? Question I just know the drives were bad and I think I tried to. Yeah, because they were like X'd out when they're not working. So you're not going to see any recording files. You'll see live video but you won't see anything recording. Question so you use the software Answer yeah. Question to try to open the files? Answer yeah. Question but you didn't actually go in and try to find the actual base files for the recording from that night? Answer no. Question okay, so was the camera connected to a network? Answer yeah. Question who had access to that network? Answer Mainly whoever had password to look at the nice vision. Usually I give out the password or a computer service. Question at that point, who had access? Answer I think most of the lieutenants had access, the warden had access, SIS had access, I had access and I believe computer services and maybe a few staff members here and there, but they just looked at live video. Nothing recorded or indiscernible video. Question so that was my next question. Could they have done anything when they logged in to manipulate the video? Answer no, you can't stop the newer system. You can the old system. You pretty much have to go in there and manually do it. Like you can't just, you would have to go on the recorders. I don't think anybody here knew or knows how to do that. Question did anyone outside the institution have access? Like because it was on the network, does like someone at the central office, anyone have access to it? Answer from what they told me there's no back doors to it. So. Question so it was a closed network? Answer Closed? Yeah. Closed, yeah. In house thing. Question do you know if any situation about came up in the past where it required that someone in the central office needed to log in and see the video and they were able to do it remotely? No, I don't know if the old System, the new system. You can do that, the old system? I'm not sure. I don't believe anybody from the region or anybody saw video on the old system. Question as far as when you left on August 9, you knew that a number of the cameras were down. When you came back on August 10th, do you know if it was the same cameras that were down? Yes, it was the same area cameras that went down. It's the same recorder. He gets cut off by the investigator. So there weren't additional cameras that were down? Answer no, they would go down and come back up? No. Question alright, so when you left on August 9, it stopped recording, no additional cameras went down? Answer no. Question between August 9th and August 10th when you returned? Answer yes. Question all right, and did you, do you know if anyone had access to those cameras from 6:00am to let's say 10:00am on August 10th? Answer well, I left probably to that afternoon. I don't believe that there's anybody that would have to go into that room to do anything. Question Were you in that room almost the whole time? Answer yeah. Question do you know of anybody else that went into that room? Answer Just the SIS tech that was there, but he doesn't go in the back room. He usually goes in the front room. Question okay. Answer and when he leaves, that's pretty much it. There's no reason for anybody to go in the back room. It's their evidence room too. So they kind of don't let just anybody, you know, just walk back there. Question after the incident, were you the first person back there? Question yeah, I believe so. And nothing looked tampered with. It all looked like the day when I left it. It looked the same way. Question and, and it's SIS tech that was back there. His name is redacted? Answer yeah, I believe so. Question can you spell it? Answer Redacted. He's retired now. Question the only camera that you said was over that door in the shoe, when you viewed it, was it granny or was it a good view? Answer Eh, I look at the cameras enough, I can make out something. Most people would say it was grainy, but you can make out enough if you see anything that was going on. Question okay, I've got nothing more on that line. Question okay, now on July 23rd. July 23rd, that's before. Question no, sorry, I take it back. Talk about the phones now. Answer okay, as part of your job, right, do you maintain the phones in the system? Answer yeah, I do. The phone switch or the pbx, I maintain that. Question as Part do you recall after this incident, what was the preservation done of the phone recordings? Answer I believe my warden at the time asked me to look up to see who was making phone calls or who possibly in the shoe, was getting phone calls that night. And I did find something. Question this is warden redacted. Answer yes. Question and you did find something? Answer yes. Question what did you find? Answer There was a phone call on the tier that they believe Epstein was taking a shower because I guess he got a shower and somebody gave him a phone call. I believe they found the phone call. That's what I believe. I'm not too sure who did that, but there was a phone call made. Question did you provide a copy of that? Over Answer Yes. Question to the DOJ and answer no, I gave it to my actual supervisor, to the warden. Question Was that a recorded call? Answer no, it was just a log to see how long the call was. Like when the call starts and when it ends, there's no recording. It's a legal call. So legal calls are protected. You can't give, you know, out the legal call information. Question okay, answer or question again by another investigator, but you see who dialed it and how long it was on. Question now, is every phone in the facility recorded other than the legal calls? Answer the inmate phones are recorded? Yes. Question what about from CO to co? Answer no, that was not recorded. Question none of the. Let's just say an inmate has access, can get to the CO phone. If they make a phone call, will you try not to give them access to it? But they're never recorded for any reason. Nah. Question so when the shoe is talking with Control, or Control is talking with R and D, those calls aren't recorded? No, there's just a log to see how long the call was, the duration, but that's pretty much it. What phone picked up and what phone hung up? Question Are those logs maintained? Yes. Question for how long? Answer I just had this a little while ago, probably like a month. Question that's all it is. Answer that's all it is. Yeah. Question do you recall if that was ever a copy of all that log for the day? Answer yeah, I believe I gave a copy to somebody, somebody with access. So I'm pretty sure I gave them call logs with everything. Question so this is back then? Answer yeah, I. I gave logs, call logs. Question do you recall if it was all of August 9th or 10th, or was it just 4? He gets cut off by the engineer. It was probably a few days. Question do you still maintain those since you Gave them? Answer no. I just gave them no reason for me to hold on to them. Question so you physically gave it to them as opposed to via email or anything? Answer Nah. Did I scan them? I might have emailed them. I'm not too sure. Question can you do us a favor when you're done, can you just check your outbox around those dates and see if you have those logged? Answer okay. Question. You don't recall who provided it to you, right? Answer sis. Whoever is in charge of sis. They were asking me for the phone logs. Question all right, so SIS would give them, then? Answer yes. Okay. Answer if you want. It's on that line. Question no, that's so. No. So only inmate calls are recorded. No staff member calls? Answer no staff member calls are recorded. Question and that's throughout the institution? Answer yes. Okay, what about coming in and out of the institution? Are those recorded? What? What do you mean? Question so if, like, R D is speaking with the court or the marshals, would they be recording? Answer no, that's not recorded? No. Question so nothing coming in and out? Answer no, I just. When the inmates are talking on the phone, their phone calls were recorded because they get that little warning to say, you know, you're being recorded, but that's about it. Question and I thought when I called BOP facilities that it did say that this line's being recorded. Is that not the case? Answer no. Question. Okay. Answer yeah, sometimes, but they throw it in there, but it's not the case. Question okay, anything else on that topic? I'm gonna move on. Answer no. All right, folks, we're gonna wrap up right here, too. And in the next episode dealing with the topic, we're gonna pick up where we left off. All the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box. What's up, everyone? And welcome to another episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're picking up where we left off with the electrical engineer and his interview with the OIG investigators. Question so that was August 9th. You left that day. What time? Answer on maybe the end of my shift. 2pm or maybe like an hour later. Question 2pm Answer yeah, 2pm or maybe 3. Question when did you come back on shift? 6am in the morning. Question on August 10th. And. Answer yes. Question and what do you recall happened on August 10?

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BGW we're prohibited by law. See terms and conditions 21/ as I came to the front door, I heard a body alarm on 10 South. And then I ran up to the body alarm on 10 South. I mean 9 South. Question and who hit the body alarm? Answer I don't know. I guess the officer, whoever's on 10 and 9 South. Question and when you got up there, what did you see? Answer I don't know, I saw. What did you see? We were all just, I don't know. What did I see? I got up there. Question let's start off then. Who was up there and when you got up there? Okay, when I got up there, I got on the elevator with who did I get on the elevator with? I think it was redacted from food services. Was there redacted? Was there and redacted And I think Lieutenant at the time was lieutenant redacted. When I got upstairs. Those are the officers that I remember. And then the officers that were on the unit were were Officers Thomas and Officer Noel. And then I just remember us saying we needed to get the stretcher from the hallway and an ad machine and then they took him and put him on the stretcher. And I think after a little while the medical PA came upstairs and then started working on them and then me and redacted were still doing chest compressions. We took him to the second floor until the ambulance came. Question okay, I'm going to step back a little bit. So when the body alarm went off, right, and you were in the elevator with Redacted and redacted. When you got up there, who was up there? Answer I think lieutenant redacted. I think was upstairs already. Maybe not. And then I know Ms. Noel was there. Question Noel. Is that Noel? Answer I don't know how to say the name right. Question Tova Noel. Answer Tova Noel. She was there and Thomas was there. Question okay, is that Michael Thomas? Answer yeah, Michael Thomas. Question so you were one of the very first people on the scene? Answer yeah. Question Possibly the first. Maybe Lieutenant Redacted. Answer yeah, they probably. I think they might have got up there before we did. I'm not too sure. Question when you say they, was there someone other than that? Answer There was everybody in the elevator, and it was just like a malaise or he gets cut off. But you said you were one of the first. So when you arrived to the cell, what did you see? Answer I saw Thomas picking him up, and people were helping him put him on the stretcher. Question okay, so when did you start doing the chest compressions? Answer like right away on the stretcher, though? Yeah. Question okay, but not on the floor. No, I don't believe on the floor. Well, that's a lie from Michael Thomas then, right? Remember what he said and remember what Tova said. They were lying. Question Sorry, I'll turn it back over to you, the other investigator. No, it's the same. Question so when you walk in, let's say you walk into the shoe. Was the gates open already? Answered the tier where he was on was open. And I don't remember if the sally port door was open because the inner door, I think somebody had to open that door. Question okay, so you walk in and you head right up to the tier. Answer yeah, because we know that was the tier. Something was happening on. Question who was standing there? Answer I believe Thomas. Question Thomas was inside or was outside? Answer I think he was inside the tier. Question Was anybody outside the tier? Answer I think Noel was outside the tier because usually the way SHU works is one officer is in the tier and one officer is outside of the tier with a key. Question and out of the few people that came up in the elevator, were you the first one in the room or was there somebody else? Answer I think Lieutenant redacted was there. He was pretty much directing everybody what to do. Question and you come in, you walk up the stairs from L tier. Answer mtr. He was on mtr, I think. Which is the top? No, it's ltr. Yes. Question and do you recall which cell it was? Answer the first one as soon as you go into the tier. Question. So you go up there, you look in, and what is it that you see? Answer what do I see, Epstein? Like, not tangible, like, not moving, not doing anything. And then everybody's, like, gathered around them. And when we tried to move them to the stretcher and then we started working on them on the stretcher. Question Was anyone performing CPR when You walked in? Answer no, I don't believe so, because I think they were trying to cut them down before I got up there. I'm not saying I know exactly what happened, but I'm pretty sure that they were cutting him down because he did have some stuff wrapped around him. So I think that's what happened. Question so describe it. What was he wearing? Answer Question I know it's kind of tough, but. Answer he had his orange boxers and an orange T shirt. I don't know if he had socks on or not. Question so he had orange boxers and he had an orange T shirt on? Answer yes. Question and what else did he have on him? Answer I think whatever he wrapped around them, they were trying to cut that off and move that out of the way. Question so was it around his neck? Answer When I got there, I didn't see. I can't tell you what was wrapped around them, but when I did see him, I did see his neck was a little bit bruised, though. Question did he have anything on his headphones, anything like that? Do you recall? Answer not that I recall, no. Question and then where was he laying when you walked in? Answer I think it was by the time I got in there, they were moving them and it was just get the stretcher and the aed. Question okay, and CPR was done and then he was taken out? Answer we were working on him and then medical came up and kept working on him and then we took him downstairs. Question do you recall how many mattresses were on the floor? Is there were any? Answer I don't recall. Question okay, Is there anything about when you walked in that stood out to you about that cell? Answer no, nothing really distinctive, just a shoe. Cell. Question and you mentioned you saw bruising. Where did you see the bruising? Answer around his neck? Question on all sides or just one side? Answer I think around all sides. Question okay, and after they took him to Medical, did you follow them down? Answer yeah, it was me. And redacted. We were doing chest compressions on him until the second floor and then we were in medical and Redacted was making his phone calls and notifications and I don't know if redacted gave him a shot, but we had to keep working on him. Question Redacted is in Medical. Answer and the medical guy and then they tried to give him an AED machine upstairs and it didn't work. And I think the AED machine was still working on him when we took him downstairs, we were still pumping his chest. Question and after the medical office Was he brought to the hospital? That part I don't know about. After all that happened, I just knew that everything was short staffed and since I came in to do my job, there was nobody in custody. So after all that I went up to special housing unit and I worked there for about an hour. Question so you went back to the shoe? Answer yeah. Question what did you do? Answer Settled inmate population down. They get a little rowdy when they see stuff happen and don't know what's going on. So you've got to just kind of do custody work. Question who was in the shoe when you were up there? Answer it was me. Lieutenant Redacted I believe she came up from somewhere. Lieutenant Redacted was there and Officer Noel was there. Question she was still there? Answer yes. Question what was she doing? Answer she just looked a little disheveled, like she didn't know what was going on. Just stressed because that was her first suicide. So when you see something like that you kind of don't know how you would react. Question did you talk to her about it? Answer I don't believe so. I just kind of let her do her thing and I just had to get to because they were feeding in the morning time. So you have to, you know, try to settle everything down. Question when you got up there and initially do you recall if Officer Michael Thomas or Noel Tova Noel made any statements, any comments to the lieutenant? Answer I don't really recall. It was like a mess. I don't really know what was said. Question did you assist redacted in giving out food? Answer yes. Question Were you in the same tier with them when she handed out the food? Answer yes. Question do you recall any interaction between her and the inmates? Answer There was a lot of things saying inmates said that were heard not right. Question so what kind of stuff did the inmates say? Answer you killed them. What? They said you killed them. You weren't making rounds. You killed them. You weren't making rounds. You guys got to get a new job. You guys are done. A lot of you this your mother that, you know, it was just gets cut off by the investigator. Did redacted say anything back to them? Answer I don't believe so. I don't know what she said to the inmates. Like, like I said it was just I don't know what was said back and forth. Question do you recall if any comments were made about providing an alibi for the COs? Answer no, I don't believe so. Question Anything else on that? The other investigator a lot. So we'll just go in reverse order. So when you said you killed them, who killed them? Answer they, like the officers killed Epstein. Question did they, Were they referring to any specific officer? Answer the officers that were up there, Thomas and Noel. Question so they were saying that they killed them? Answer yeah, you guys killed them. Question and did they say anything specifically about that? Answer no. They was just. They were upset, so they were just saying it, but they didn't say how? Question did anyone say he gets cut off? They didn't say that they went in the cells to try to kill him or open the grill. They just said you guys killed him. Question and what was did you ask any follow up questions with regard to that? Answer I just know not to say anything. So I just do what I have to do and I don't get involved in that. Question did they provide any other information with. With regard to you when they were saying someone killed them? Answer Just that they didn't do rounds. That was pretty much about it. Question did they say anything more about not doing rounds or just said that they didn't do any rounds or what did they say about that? Answer they didn't do any rounds. They were sitting there all night. I don't think they came over here once. Question they said they came over once. Answer they never came. They never did any rounds. They said they never did one. Answer no. Question O so they never did one? Answer yeah. Is that what you mean? Yeah. Okay. Did they mention when the round stopped? No. Question no. All right. You said that when you came back, it was Tova, Noel, and yourself. Just the three of you? Yes, I believe so. Question was Thomas already gone then? Yes. All right, folks, we're gonna wrap this bad boy up right here. And in the next episode, we're gonna pick up where we left off. All the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box. What's up, everyone? And welcome to another episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're gonna pick up where we left off with the electrical engineer from the MCC giving his statement to the OIG investigators this weekend.

[Narrator/Host]

Someone is walking their dog. Someone is crossing the street to their car. Someone's kid is riding a bike home, and they're counting on you to drive the speed limit. Speeding accounts for nearly 30% of traffic fatalities. And most of those crashes don't happen on the interstate. They happen on the streets where people live. Slow down. It's an act of care for the people around you. So remember, speeding catches up with, you know the road and respect Its limits presented by nhtsa. Now back to your news podcast.

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CTs and Cs 21 plus sponsored by Chumba Casino. Question all right, did you see anyone near the officer station at that time? Answer no, I don't believe so. Question do you know if anybody he gets cut off by the engineer, the round slips. I don't know if anybody started to write stuff down or anything. Question what about with regards to Epstein's file? Do you know if anyone went into Epstein's file at that time? Answer I don't even know if he had. He had a shoe file, but I don't know who would have had access to that. Question Wouldn't the shoe file be right there in the shoe? Answer yeah, but it's usually the OIC would know where that file is. Question okay, did you see redacted at all around the desk area? Answer no, I don't know what they were doing as far as the file or anything. Question Were you with redacted the whole time that she was there? Answer I was feeding, so I was kind of like by myself. Let me down the tier and I'll feed. Question okay, so you thought you said that you were feeding with redacted at the same time. Answer no, no, she would do something else and I take this tear and she was doing something else. Question all right, so you would each be in your own individual tier. Answer Feeding yeah. Question and feeding. Answer because there were only two people to feed. Question all right, and was Noel also feeding? Answer no, I think she was opening the grill. Question she was opening the grill and she was standing on the outside. Answer yeah. Question and how does that work? Are you allowed to be going and feeding by yourself and redacted also going down? Answer to feed yes, because you're not opening. You're just opening the slide. You're not opening the door for the inmates. So that's okay. Question okay, so that's all right. Now, did you notice anything else taking place in there Aside from feeding, when you were in there? Answer no. Question around what time were you in there? Answer Probably a little bit after 6am Question if the body alarm gets activated at 6:33, about what time did you come back after you did the life saving measures? Answer I probably went downstairs, put my stuff away and then I had two TDY staff with me. They stayed in the basement. Question when you say the basement, what does that mean? Answer in my office. They were in my office because I didn't know anything would happen and they just didn't need to be a part of anything that was transpired. So. Question but they weren't in the shoe? Answer no, they never went to the shoe. They never responded to the body alarm. Question so do you think you were back in the shoe by about 7am? Answer before 7am? Question so prior to 7am you stayed in there until almost 8am? Answer I don't know. I stayed in there for quite a while. I'm not too sure. Question While you were in there, did SIS or anyone else come in and start preserving evidence? Answer I don't believe anybody was here to start doing any of that. Question okay, so by the time you left, you left. When you left there, who was still there? Answer I don't even know who came up to relieve me, honestly. Question no, but someone did relieve you? Answer yeah, somebody did relieve me. Then I got asked about camera and phone calls. He gets cut off by the investigator. Right. So it's just been a whirlwind. Answer yeah. Question and when you saw Epstein, are you sure that he had a shirt on? Answer Pretty sure. Did he have a shirt on? I'm not for sure. Honestly, I don't really remember that. Question can you remember yourself actually doing those chest compressions? Answer I was doing chest compressions. Question do you remember he gets cut off by the engineer. We had to take his shirt off. Okay. Yeah, we had to take a shirt off. Question so you actually took it off? Answer yeah. Question do you remember taking it off? Answer yeah, because that's how you got to put on the aed. So the shirt came off. Question do you remember it actually taking it off or that it was off already? Answer maybe it was off already. Question but you can't recall? Answer no. Question and when you said when you arrived you're not there was no one doing chest compressions at the time that you arrived? Answer they were, I think they were trying to cut them down and we, and I think I went to get the stretcher and the AED by this Time. And I came back. Whatever they were doing to try to move him, by the time we got the stretcher, that's when we started working on him. Because you obviously can't work on him because he's hanging up. He gets cut off by the investigator. So you believe he was actually hanging by the time when you got there? Answer. They were moving him down, he was in an up position and they were lowering him down to whatever position. Question. All right, so he may not have been actually hanging, but he was like sitting up? Answer. I'm not too sure. Question. You don't know? Answer. Yeah, Question. Okay. Answer. Somebody was holding him, so I don't know if he was. If they were like trying to. He gets cut off by the investigator. So just walk me through that. What exactly did you see when you say someone was holding him? What do you mean by holding them? Answer okay, so you get in the shoe. There's a lot of space in the shoe. So if an inmate is hanging, usually you try to hold them and make sure, you know, you can cut them down. And with all that going on, I think I went to get the AED because there was enough staff there I didn't need to go in the cell. There's no space. So I just got the AED or the stretcher and I bring it back. Question but you believe there. Are you confident that there were actually he was like in the upright position when you first saw him? Answer yeah, I'm pretty sure he wasn't laying down. It was indiscernible. Question so he was not laying down yet and they weren't already working on him? Answer I don't really know. I remember him being moved. I don't remember if he was laying down when I first got there. I don't really. That I can't say for sure. I know he was being moved when I initially got there and when I went down, I can't say he was laying down because I didn't. He gets cut off by the investigator. All right, but you do know he was being moved? Answer yes. Question. You just don't. And you believe he was in an upright, like seated type position? Answer. Or whatever position he was thinking were trying to move him out of that position. Question okay. Answer. To administer the first aid or whatever. Question. So when's the first time that you know he was actually receiving chest compressions? Answer. As soon as we put him on the stretcher. Question. Did anyone check for a pulse? Answer. The duty PA all redacted. And then he put the AED on the AED tells you if there's a pulse or anything and stay clear so they could do the shock. Question all right, so prior, that's the first, you know, chest compressions that were done on him. Answer yeah. Question okay, now the other investigator jumps in and says that he has a follow up. Question. When you walked in and when they started doing the chest, where was his body? Being like you walk in, his bunk is there and we know there's a corner right which way is his head facing and where were his legs? Answer he was kind of like somebody was just holding him. So I can't really tell if he was going this way or that, but somebody was behind him physically holding him, like he was trying to move him. Question Were they trying to get him out of the corner and bring him out? Answer yeah, I believe that's what was going on. But there was no way to put him there because you can't put him on the ground to do anything. So that's when we free to get the stretcher then and AED Question why couldn't they put them on the ground? Answer I usually put them down on the ground, but usually it's just second nature. You always get a stretcher because you don't want none of the inmates seeing you work on an inmate. It never looks good. So you kind of, you know, just everything is just so fast. Like it just moves. Just like it's not like you wait or hesitate, but you just like kind of know what to do. There's no hesitation, but you just know what's going to happen. And you never really want to work in front of the inmates or the inmates behind the door. Like that's not a good idea. So you try to move them as much as you can so you can really start working on them. Questions so you don't think anyone did CPR on him until he was moved over? Answer no, we did CPR on him. I'm pretty sure somebody did. But it was just a process of everything was. So everything just happened like this where it just didn't seem like it seemed like it took minutes, but it probably just took a few seconds the way everything was going. Question so I guess is there any reason for you to believe that Epstein didn't take his own life? Answer no. Question do you believe that Epstein took his own life? Answer Yes, I believe so. Question Were the inmates saying anything about anyone going into Epstein's cell? Answer no. Question so all they said was that they didn't check, that they didn't do the rounds. Answer the rounds. They didn't do anything all night. Question so do you believe that's what they meant by you killed them? Answer yeah, they didn't do their job. Question so they didn't do their job. He gets cut off by the engineer and with them. Yeah, they didn't. By them not doing their rounds, they can't check to see if he was breathing or. Or what's going on. And that's how they killed him? Yeah, that's how they killed him. Question alright, as far as when you were back in there after you came back up to the shu, after you

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But he gets cut off by the investigator. Question and where do you write statements from? Answer My computer. I just go to my desk and he gets cut off again. Okay. And would have redacted. Also written one though. Like did she, was she one of the responding officers or did she just come and help feed? Answer I don't know if she came up with the body alarm. It was. I don't think she was there initially when everything happened, so I don't think. Yeah. Question she wouldn't have written a statement then, correct? Answer no. Question so do you recall at that time that you left the shoe? Do you know if she was still in there? Answer I don't know. Question you're not sure? Answer I don't know. Yeah. Question and again, did you see anyone that was in there around that officer station? Answer I was just there working on tier, making sure I do rounds and try to talk to the inmates to settle them down as much as I could. Question okay, but you didn't notice any files being manipulated? Answer no, nobody was going to the desk or doing anything like that. Like, I didn't see anybody trying to go and grab stuff or move stuff around. Like, I didn't see any of that. Question okay, okay. And you didn't see anybody actually take papers or Answer yeah, I'm pretty sure if somebody did, it would have probably been on camera too, because that camera was working. Question well, that camera that you're talking about, that was working, you can't make anything out on it? Answer yeah, yeah, you can't really make anything out. Question so even if someone's near there, you can't really see what they're doing. Answer really see what they're doing. Yeah, but I don't think anybody was going there to do anything because I don't even think anybody knew, like, what the hell was going on, to be honest with you. It was just like, what the hell just happened? All right, folks, we're going to wrap up right here. And in the next episode dealing with the topic, we're going to pick up where we left off. All the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box. What's up everyone? And welcome to another episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're going to pick up where we left off with the interview given by the electrical engineer to the OIG investigators. Question okay, and as far as that, that is the one and only camera. That one that was up by 10 south. That was working? Answer yes, that was working. Question all right, then. Nothing else. Nothing else that was ever working. Answer There were other ones in the sally port, but nothing as far as the shoe. That was the only one in the shoe. Question all right, so as far as that camera though, that was showing people who was going in and out of the shoe, was that working? Answer on the 9 Sally I'm not too sure. Question okay. Answer that I'm not too sure about. Question you just said it was working. Answer I'm not. I'm not too sure if it was working or recording. The Sally camera was recording. Question yeah, that's what I was saying. The difference between working and recording to him is if it's actually a live feed. Answer yeah, I can't tell you that. It gets confusing. Question but all right, and again, you believe that. Sorry, start over. You believe that Epstein took his own life? Answer yes, based on the agent's Question you said you were doing feeding. Did you do feeding on ltier after the tier that Epstein was found in? Answer I probably did, yeah. Because I don't really. I probably did. Question how long were you up there for? Answer I don't know. Question do you recall if his cell was secured or if it was left open? Answer Initially it was probably left open. Question for how long? Answer I don't know. I'm not too sure. But then I think when I came back to feed, because we lock all the cells, it's probably locked when I started doing the feeding. Question but there were cos going in and out of there. Answer no, there is no reason to go inside of a cell. And everybody knows like after a suicide it's a crime scene, so usually you just stay away from the cell. Question do you recall approximately when you came and they secured it as a crime scene? Answer I'm not too sure when that happened. Question but it wasn't secured when you left? Answer When? When I went down there for the body alarm, it wasn't secure. I mean, when I took him down to medical doing chest compressions, it wasn't secured. But when I came back upstairs, it was secured. The door was locked, I believe. Question and I know that I was honing in on redacted, but what about Noel? Did you see Noel near the officer's station at all? Answer I believe she received a phone call or somebody wanted to see what was going on. Asked them like what happened or he gets cut off by the investigator. Did you see her manipulating any files or dealing with any paperwork? Answer I don't believe so.

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Question no. All right, and then going back to our initial conversation, you said that you put in a work order for Signet. Was that on the 9th? Answer probably before, yeah. Question no. That would have been August 9, the day before Epstein was found. Answer yeah, I was just troubleshooting with them. I was on the phone with them. It's not really a work order. Just, you know, call them up, hey, this is what's going on. What should we do? Question okay, so there would be no paperwork showing Answer from signet. They would have the paperwork. Question so they would show that you called. Answer yes. And that you said that these things were down. Answer yes. And I was having problems. Question and do you have any of those files? Answer no. They have their own files that they keep. Question Just, they would be able to, like, he gets cut off. Yeah. And I was on since that happened. I was pretty much on the phone with them for like a week after that. So they would have the records of when I called or whatever happened. Question all right. And then as far as you know, we're going way to the beginning. You said that you were. Did you. You were interviewed by the FBI, you said on the 10th, you were also interviewed by them after the 10th of August. Answer because I was a subject matter expert as far as the cameras go. So they want to know, like, how can you find video? If you could find video, what can I do? And then they came in the next day and they tried to. As soon as I found the video, that's the real video they wanted because they wanted to make sure they had something in it because they were pretty mad that there was no video at all. And I found that video because I wasn't sure that was on the recorders or what wasn't on the recorders at that point. Question and that's the 10South video? Answer yes. Question and do you know if that video ever was enhanced to be able to see it more clearly? Answer I have no idea if they did or did not. Question but you did not. Answer no, I did not do that. Question do you even have that ability to do that? Answer not without software. We have no. Not gonna happen. Question you mentioned that maybe I'm mistaken. You mentioned that there was a work order created prior to the 9th for the camera. Answer yeah, there were a few work orders that the recorders were going down or failing. We have problems. Question when were those created? Answer maybe a year before or six months before. It was just a constant thing as far as the cameras not working because we was trying to get upgraded, we were trying to get money spent. So we have to create anytime there's a problem, I have to create a work order to tell like the regional office like there's a problem. But it's a work order over 10,000, so they have to put money aside to do the work. Like it's not a quick fix to fix the recorders. Question and these recorders were maintained in house or only by signet? Answer the work order we have or maintained here in house. Question who would have access to that? Answer the facility manager. Anybody in facilities pretty much would have access to it. But really, facility Manager. Question on August 9th, when you saw that the system was down, has it gone down just like that before? Answer yeah. Question how long did it take you to fix it? Answer Sometimes maybe a day, maybe two days, maybe a couple of days. And the thing, and I have to stress this also is just because I saw it down, because I don't check it every day. I don't know if it was down for a week, a month. You know, it's not one of those things that you check all the time, but I would, since we're having problems more readily, I would always check like once a week to make sure that it was working. But before it was not, like, okay, I've got to get up there and check it out because it was happening. Question that was my next question. Did you just happen to walk in there one day? Answer I already knew we were having issues and I think I got the hard drives out because I was going to take them up there and see what was going on. Question now, based on the fact that this happened before, right? Was that same exact situation, the same exact drives. Answer I think it switched. It could have been recorder one and then recorder two. I don't think it was just the same recorder all the time because one recorder was actually the whole motherboard have to get replaced. And that was again, I think that was recorder two. And before drives would go out on one or two. So it was just random. They were old, they just needed to get replaced. Question Ask. And at that point you knew that the drives were not recording? Answer yeah. Question Were any actions taken to make sure that this does not happen in the future, that at least something would be recorded? Answer yes, exactly that. Question what actions were taken? Answer now we have redundant drives. So if one drive fails you always have a backup. No, no, I'm talking about prior to the ninth. Oh, prior to the ninth. No, there was really nothing. They just knew we had problems. We had ordered the new system, we were online to get it installed, but we were just not lucky to get it installed. Question and the record would show that there was an order. Answer yeah. And that we have the shipping stuff for the system. Actually it was here, it was in the building. Question. You just didn't get it installed yet? Answer didn't get it installed. It got installed a couple. What happened on the 9th, 10th or 11th? That's when the new system got installed. Question yeah, the other thing we've already asked you this, but I just want to make sure. So the title of your supervisor. Did you say facilities manager? Answer yeah. Question and how would we again figure out who that was at the time? Answer I don't know. You would just have to ask. I'm not too sure who the facility managers was. But you don't even know how indiscernible. I think it was redacted, but I'm not too sure because he was maybe acting at the time, but I don't think that he had the position yet. Is he facilities manager now? Answer Now. Yes, he is. Question and again, you know who notified whoever was the facilities manager at the time? Answer or my general foreman. Usually it's one of the two. I usually notify them both. Question so the general manager or general foreman? Answer and general foreman. Yeah, I have to notify somebody. I can't just walk out of the building and not say anything. Question and you said you're positive you definitely made those notifications? Answer yeah, I had to because I was coming back the next day to work. Question you said it was the general foreman? Answer yes. Question and you know he gets cut off by the engineer, but I don't even think we had a general foreman? I'm not too sure. It was two years ago. I'm not even sure if we had a general foreman. Question and being though that this was such a big deal and that these cameras were such a big part of it, did you ever learn if either of those people ever passed the information up? Answer no. Question so no, that was never spoken of. Answer no. Question and you guys didn't you never had the conversation with those supervisors after the fact? Answer did we have a conversation after? I never really asked if, if it got. I'm pretty sure everybody knew it wasn't working because I came back the next day. Question so did they ever. Did anyone ever say anything to you about like hey, why didn't you tell me? Answer no, I don't get that. No. Question no Answer no, I'm not going to get that Question all right? Answer Because I would have told somebody I'm not going to leave because I came from another jail. I can't just leave and not say anything. Question so like SIS or the captain never came up to you and said hey, what happened? Why didn't you let anybody know? No Question so okay. Answer because it was a known problem that the recorders were going down so I'd have to say hey, this is what's going on. Question Gotcha. Answer I'm trying to fix it. I'll be back tomorrow. Question okay, I think that's all I've got. The other investigator, that's all I have. Is there anything else you think that we should have asked you that we didn't ask? Answer it's an investigation. I just hope this never happens again. I mean I was comfortable because I came from another institution. I knew what I was doing as far as the cameras and recorders and I know that all the stuff works, but I just with the bureau would be more proactive as far as maintenance and buying new stuff. Like I know now that they are like more on top of everything, but it's not really, it's not good. Question alright. Answer that's just my only thing. Question so still to date Answer yeah, they still got to do a lot of improvements. Question okay, so you don't believe it's actually been rectified there still needs a lot of work. Answer oh yeah, I've been to other institutions. There's a lot of camera work that needs to get done. Question so just to keep up to date with other institutions. Answer no, this institution's fine. I've done a lot of overtime here. Question oh oh, sure. I thought that's what you were saying. I thought you meant MCC is not up to speed. Answer. No, we're up to speed. We're ahead of the curve. We got IP cameras pretty much everywhere. But I'm just saying, overall, I just wish the Bureau was more proactive. And like, when I came to this institution, for instance, like, there was only one camera in a housing unit. When I came in Brooklyn, I was custody. It was cameras all over the place. I went to Indiana, and I was a contact at a complex, which was a high, medium, low. There's a camp, there's a death row, there's cameras everywhere. I come to this jail in New York City and I'm expecting cameras everywhere. And one of the first things was like, oh, we don't have the money for that. We don't have the money for this. We don't have the money for that. And I just kept saying, hey, you guys gotta do something. This is the problem. God forbid this is what happened. But I just wish there was more proactivity. Like, he gets cut off. But right now, MCC is up to speed. Answer. We're good. Yeah, we're good. We don't have any issues. Question. So when you made that statement, you're talking about other facilities. Answer. Yeah, other facilities in general, I wish the Bureau would invest more money. Question. Okay, answer. And training, too. Like just getting new equipment. That's not it. Also train the staff. Because even, like, when I learned how to do the camera stuff, it was just me over the phone with Signet. I never really went to physical training. Hey, Redacted. This is the system that you have. Take this drive out, do X, Y and Z. I'm just like. I'm on the phone, I'm looking at it. Okay. The light is this color. This is. I'm a smart guy. I could figure it out. But at the same time, somebody that's not really savvy. Yeah, they're going to be lost. Question. All right, thank you so much for taking your time. I know you just had to leave training, so I really appreciate that. Thank you, Mr. Redacted again. So if there's nothing else. This is Special Agent Redacted. The time is 3:44pm on Thursday, July 15, 2021. I'm turning off the recorder. Ending the interview.

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End.

[Interviewee/Officer]

And turning off the recorder. All right, so there is the deposition given by the electrical engineer to go along with the other depositions that we've heard. And folks, we're just getting started. We have a lot of files to get through and a lot of ground to cover. And to do that, we're going to keep eating this elephant one bite at a time. All the information that goes with this episode can be found in the description box this weekend.

[Narrator/Host]

Someone is walking their dog. Someone is crossing the street to their car. Someone's kid is riding a bike home. And they're counting on you to drive the speed limit. Speeding accounts for nearly 30% of traffic fatalities. And most of those crashes don't happen on the interstate. They happen on the streets where people live. Slow down. It's an act of care for the people around you. So remember, speeding catches up with you. Know the road and respect its limits. Presented by nhtsa. Now back to your news podcast.

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